DECEPTION: The Hustle That Didn't Hustle Back: Jen Shah

Hi everyone, before today's episode, we want to tell you about What the Fact. It's a new show from Conor Tomlinson, who you know from Netflix's Love on the Spectrum, and Carter Roy from Murder, True Crime Stories. Every week they take three unbelievable true facts from history and tell you the full story behind them. Conor's infectious energy will make you realize history is the most fascinating thing on Earth. Follow What the Fact, wherever you listen, or subscribe on YouTube at What the Fact is. This is a story made for reality TV. In fact, it actually played out on reality TV on real housewives of Salt Lake City. It's about an over-the-top glamorous housewife named Jen Shaw. She was larger than life, big hair, dramatic designer outfits, and she was also surrounded with assistance, she called the Shaw Squad. She was the kind of person who could go from laughing to screaming within seconds. Her temper was so explosive that even her fellow housewives seemed afraid of her. And they had every reason to be, because behind all the fancy clothes and the nice cars, play something more sinister and a truth no one was prepared for. Welcome to Crimes of Deception. I'm Sabrina Deanna Broga, I'm Corinne Vien, and this season we are diving into stories where ambition, ego, and a little bit of delusion turn everyday schemes into headlines. And in this case, one of the most shaw-mazing crimes ever committed, shaw-mazing, subscribe now and step inside the world of crimes of. The case of Jen Shaw starts now. Welcome to Crimes of Deception, a crime house original powered by paved studios, where your hosts Sabrina Deanna Broga and Corinne Vien. Every Tuesday, we're exploring a different corner of the true crime universe, examining cases that left a permanent impact on society. This season, we're stepping into some of the boldest and most unbelievable crimes ever committed. The kinds of crimes where reality is stranger than fiction. If you're loving Crimes of, please follow, rate, and review us wherever you listen. It helps us build this community and we love hearing from you. To get early access and ad-free listening, subscribe to the Crime House Plus community on Apple Podcasts, and you can also catch us on YouTube where we include visuals that bring every case to life. Today, we're diving into the bravo verse to bring you the case of Jen Shaw, one of the real housewives of Salt Lake City. Jen was obsessed with being fabulous, but in order to afford her lifestyle, she spent decades lying, scheming, and swindling thousands of victims as a part of a massive telemarketing scam. Eventually, the real world came calling and no one was changing the channel. I cannot wait to paint the picture for you, Corinne, and for all of you jury members out there. So, your judges officially call court in session. I really wish we had a gable. What are we judging today? Are we judging if we're going to become bravo fans if we're not already or Jen Shaw, both, both? Okay. Picture this. In 2021, and you are a housewife, but not just any housewife. You are one of real housewives of Salt Lake City. For months at a time, you have a camera crew following you and your life of luxury. And speaking of luxury, you and your castmates are about to go on a trip to Vale, Colorado. Tensions have been a little high lately. There are rumors that keep spreading about you and your castmates online, and lately, it feels like they're coming from within. This trip is supposed to be a healing journey. That's a little nod to all of you who do watch the show. It's a time to get away and remind yourselves that above it all, you're best friends. That just already feels like a lie. It's time to put an end to the petty fights and bond. And what better way to do that than a girl's trip with lots of wine? What could go wrong? The trip has been planned for weeks and production has organized a ride for all of you and the housewives to road trip the five plus hours together. And by one, the housewives arrive to a parking lot outside of Beauty Lab, where a fancy sprinter van awaits. Production mics everyone up, and housewives all find a seat inside. You've got Heather, Jenny, Whitney, Lisa, and Jen. There's no sign of Meredith, though, and right away, the women are annoyed. Did Meredith tell anyone that she wasn't taking the van? She's distancing herself from the group, and this was supposed to be a trip about bonding and this feels really personal. So much for avoiding drama. But at least no one's fighting amongst themselves on the bus, right? So now they have something to gossip about, Meredith. The cameras start rolling. But as this is happening, Jen gets a phone call. Immediately, the group can tell something is wrong, especially when Jen turns to Whitney and asks her to turn her mic off. Whatever this is about, she does not want cameras to know. But obviously, that makes the housewives want to know even more. Plus, Jen is their friend, so they're concerned. Finally, Jen tells them that her husband, Coach Shaw, as she calls him, is in the hospital with internal bleeding and she has to go. Before anyone can really process that information, Jen climbs into a pickup truck and takes off. These women are all horrified. Is he going to be okay? Should they wait for Jen? She said she might still join them for the trip if Coach Shaw doesn't need surgery. Should they go on the trip at all? This is so strange, but it's only about to get stranger. Just minutes after Jen pulled away, a swarm of police officers flock the parking lot. I'm talking Homeland Security, FBI, police, and they have handcuffs, and they're looking for Jen Shaw. How did she know? How did she know to get away? Someone gave her a tip to her off. Oh my god. This is captured. Wait, I do need to watch it. I'm watching. I'm watching. You need to at least watch that scene because we can find it and we'll play it for you, because reality TV gold. You would think it was fake. Exactly. But it wasn't. Even producers were shocked. You see the producers. They break the fourth wall and producers are like, wait, are you guys really considering not going? What's happening? I'm so confused. Yeah. Everyone cast crew. Housewives confused. Given how much I'm on TikTok, I'm actually shocked that I never saw anything about this because this feels like one of the biggest moments in reality TV. I think it might be in the top, like, 10 of all time, but it was what, 2021, were you on TikTok back then? Yeah. We were like, basically still in the pandemic. It was definitely on TikTok all the time. I didn't start scrolling on TikTok until, like, last year, so it was new to me. Despite my constant encouragement. You were my TikTok. You were my news report. Yeah. I just showed you what you needed to know. Yeah. But yeah, this is one of the most infamous moments in the real Housewives franchise. And we're all quite desperate. I guess if we haven't watched, like, I haven't, to know why the feds were looking for Gen Shaw, but Sabrina, what is Real Housewives? That's a good question for people who don't know. I will be your Real Housewives assault like city expert, and you'll be the true crime expert for this episode. And even if you're not into it, I feel like most people have heard of the Real Housewives franchise in some way. It's the crown jewel of Bravoverse, but here's a quick rundown. So this show and the franchise was indirectly inspired by the fictional and very successful show, desperate Housewives. Like even the intro videos have like the same homage where they're holding the apples. Reality TV producers wanted to show the real life version of the fictional show. And it started with Real Housewives of Orange County in that premiered in 2006. It was such a hit that Bravo has released spin-offs in major cities like New York, Atlanta, Beverly Hills, Salt Lake City, Utah, and even like, in Dubai too. New Jersey? Oh, there's New Jersey too. There's so many. The point being, there's plenty. Yeah. I actually don't know the exact number. I've only watched parts of New York City and Salt Lake City because I want to start the Real Housewives, but I don't know where to start. It feels overwhelming because there's so many options. Every single person says you have to start with Salt Lake City. Oh my gosh. And that's a newer one too. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, none, but I will say, I feel like I see clips and just like stills a lot from the New Jersey Real Housewives. And when you know this, that when I met my now husband and like went to his house for the first time in New Jersey, we were driving around the town and I was like, God, this looks so much like Real Housewives of New Jersey. He's like, it literally is. This is their town. This is where they live. It was filmed here. That's wild. But going and picking up takeout at like a restaurant that one of them owns, like, this is so bizarre. Yeah. Yeah. This is it. This just just just just. It's produced in. It's produced in. It's produced in. It's produced in. There are 11 total US shows, 12 if you include Dubai. That's wild. And on the surface, it shows a life of luxury designer clothes, lavish parties, expensive homes. The real heart of the show is a relationship between the women. The alliances, the conflicts, the secrets and the inevitable arguments that follow when those secrets come out. And I do have a love hate relationship with it because on one side, I'm upset that it's portraying women as these constantly fighting and bickering human beings. But then they also are really like successful women. Yeah. And I guess that's the question of reality TV, too, where it's like how much of this is authentically them and how much of this is them playing into a character to make more money. Yeah. Well, we know, for a fact, the Jen's crimes were real. Yeah, to your point, like, so many people watch it, it's definitely guilty pleasure sort of TV. I picture as like the beach read of totally TV. Yeah. But point being is like, it's taken a life of its own. It's like this huge franchise, even if you don't know what it's about, like, everyone's heard real housewives in some sort of form or another. I also read that when they first announced the Salt Lake City spinoff, people kind of like what I was saying before, they're like, wait, why? What's happening in Salt Lake City? Because you think of Salt Lake City, you think of Utah, you think of Mormonism, and you think of just like some stricter rule following. And I think of half the people I follow on Instagram, which are all Mormon influencers, because they have great taste in home furniture. Well, also now, I mean, when people questioned it, sure, I understand people questioning it, but nowadays we have like secret lives of Mormon wives. Like, these are some of the most like iconic reality TV shows. There's so much more drama. Yeah. There's so much underneath it all from an outside state. Not being in Utah, having never been in Utah. Yeah. Like, you only know what you know. And so, yeah, it aired, and everyone was like, oh, we take that statement back. And basically the show cemented itself as one of the best shows on Bravo. Even celebrities love it. So I read that Rihanna has slid into cast members DMs. Yeah. Chrissy Teigen, Sarah Paulson, Jennifer Lawrence. That doesn't surprise me at all. No. And so many more. So it's a cool phenomenon. Literally went to the trial, because she happened to be a New York. Well, she was friends with Jennifer Lawrence. So, of course, there's a lot of stuff about it. Yeah. That is so funny. Okay. So with this context, we can now talk about Jen Shaw and why the hell the police were looking for her. After Jen left the Springer van in a rush to get to her husband, who was in the hospital, quote, unquote, police were able to track her down and arrest her on the side of the road. So much drama. And within hours of that, the story was leaked online and reported that Jen Shaw and her associate Stuart Smith had been arrested for their roles in a nationwide telemarketing fraud scheme. So keep in mind the rest of the girls, the rest of the housewives did go on this trip. The six-hour bus ride to Veil. So they're reading these articles on the bus? Getting the live updates. Like, they're being posted on TMZ and tabloids and stuff. And so they're all freaking out on the bus. Season is this. It's season two. See, maybe I just need to watch season two in there. Yeah. I mean, it's great to have the context, but you can just watch that. Also, when you were listening off the names of everyone, I was like, this feels like a book that I would read in middle school. Like, the names feel like made up. Yeah. Everyone's going on a girls trip. Just some drama. Like, it doesn't feel real. It's amazing. And also as they're reading it, everyone starts making it about themselves in some way. And they're like freaking out. Lisa Barlow is like calling her eight lawyers and is like, what do I do? And it's like, this has nothing to do with you, Lisa. Oh my god. I have some suggestions for some people. I know that could probably be great on the show. So Jen Shaw, she was arrested and indicted on two federal charges. The first being conspiracy to commit wire fraud. And the second being conspiracy to commit money laundering. And the drama that would unfold is juicy. We're going to hear a lot of it from Sabrina. I don't know a lot of it. But Jen Shaw over the next year swore that she was innocent, but it was only a matter of time before the truth came out. But before we get to that, let's back up a little bit and introduce you to Jen Shaw, the way that she was introduced to the world in season one of Real Housewives of Salt Lake City. Yeah. Real Housewives of Salt Lake City premiered in November of 2020. And the show introduced viewers to the cast members, which I had to like restrain so much while prepping for this episode to not introduce you to everyone. Because I like, I really want you to watch it. And I also just love it so much. And it's so fresh on my mind. So I like want to like tell the tea of everyone else, but this episode is Jen Shaw. I'm talking so fast, because I'm excited. We're seeing you so animated. Also, it's been weeks of you telling me that you can't wait to record this episode and research this episode and do this episode in specific. I hope you can feel my excitement. No, you did not accidentally press two times speed. So the point was in the show to get to know each of the women and get a glimpse into the world, their house, their lifestyle and personality. And of course, the drama. We are introduced to 46-year-old Jen Shaw. And pretty much right away, she is a star. She is loud and energetic. She wear five-inch heels in the snow while going over to a friend's for casual drinks. Yeah, no, I get it, because I feel like college age, you do that in the winter, no matter what. But then my mind went, she's 46 years old. But also, like, managers wear thongs anymore after giving birth. I'm wearing full lined. You can see everything underneath my leggings. We've had any panties. Conversation before about who wears G-thongs. I have a friend who wears or G-thrings. She confessed to me, she wears street strings, and I never wore the same. I dress the pain. Anyway, so respect to those of you who wear heels. Don't know how those two got there. And G-thrinks. And G-thrinks snaps for you. Not us. So we met Jen and her husband, Sharif Shaw, who she lovingly calls coach Shaw. He is a football coach at University of Utah. And she opens up kind of immediately how difficult her life was growing up as a woman of color in Utah. Like, we know Utah is a very white Mormon state. The names you were listing in the beginning. White girls. Yeah. White girls. Jen is Tongan and Hawaiian. And Utah is, like I said, overwhelmingly white. She grew up in the Mormon church, which did help her like acclimate a little bit. But a few years into her marriage to coach Shaw, who is black, expressed that he had concern about the Mormon church because up until like a few years ago, like they weren't including black members. And they have a history of excluding them. So they ended up converting to his religion, which is Islam and then raised their kids in that religion too. And right away, you really do develop the sense of empathy for Jen because you see her plate and you see what she went through. You hear it and you empathize with that totally. My name is Jack Wagner, host of Other World, a podcast featuring real people who experience something paranormal, supernatural, or unexplained. I have no idea how I got there. I don't think I've ever seen anything that looks like this. It felt like electric stars on fire. I started Otherworld to take a grounded approach to the paranormal, help people tell their own stories and encourage more to come forward. I certainly don't have the answers, but maybe one day we will. Join me as we explore our world's greatest mysteries. Listen to Otherworld now for free wherever you get your podcasts. You also see her love for luxury right away. She calls her house, Jen's chalet. And it is stunning. She tells viewers that she has built a professional empire in marketing. And that is how she's able to afford her very glamorous life. But she's vague about her marketing empire. But she is not shy about showing off all of her like luxury. In Episode 1, she actually throws this elaborate expensive birthday party for one of the fellow housewives Meredith. Keep in mind, it's a birthday party for Meredith. But Jen spends hours getting ready with her glam squad. Everyone's arriving to the party, taking pictures in front of this massive flower wall that literally says Jen's chalet. Or Shaw's chalet. Then she makes this grand entrance, wearing bright pink into the party. So that's just the type of person she is. She's very generous. I think she's like 100K on this party. Oh my god. But she's also going to be like, I spent the money. I'm going to make it about me. It feels a little Kardashian. It very much looked like it was more about Jen than it was Meredith's birthday. Dang. That's wild. I do feel for her, obviously like knowing now what she went through, growing up and just feeling like an outcast, and then like again going against the norm, which is being a part of the Mormon church. Probably incredibly difficult. And I know that you're going to go more in depth into like her childhood. Because that stuff you don't get on the show. But yeah, you do see how it was difficult. And knowing the true crime of this makes me question a lot right away because all the money she's just spent on this party, the giant house she has, the amount of money she's just spending all the time. And also her glam squad is very expensive. It does make you wonder what sort of marketing is she actually doing. And how can she afford this giant glam squad? Well, let's talk about the glam squad first because they're very important to Jen's life. They are called the Shaw Squad. We're talking assistance, stylist, makeup artist, a full glam squad that's like it's basically her entourage that she pays for. They follow her around. They wear coordinated outfits. What was the job description posted for this? I have no idea. I probably like assistance and then she hired like makeup people and they're just like on staff all the time. It seems fun. Yes. And it's very over the top. But in the beginning, I also had a lot of empathy for her because her husband, who's a football coach, is traveling a lot. So you see how she's like building this friendship with people like unfortunately she's paying for it. But you can tell she's doing it slightly because she feels alone. Yeah. Looking for a community. Yeah. One member of her entourage really stands out and he will come back as a very large part of the story. His name is Stuart Smith and Jen calls him Stu Chains. And he's a very white man. He is introduced on the show as Jen's assistant and she frames him as someone who helps run her business. But again, she's vague. And as far as the show goes, he seems to be by Jen's side all the time. Like he drives her around. He holds her purse. Also, he's like a middle-aged white man, which it's kind of like an interesting job for the this man. But he's really sweet. He's very awkward. And he gives off loyal, puppy energy. Someone who would be willing to do anything for Jen. There's even a scene where Jen is feeding Stuart a banana while he's typing away on a computer. And Jen's like, I'll feed you while you make me money. Well, now seeing that and knowing the context of all of the crimes has that changed how you view what Stuart was doing in that scene. I know for a fact, Stuart was way more than just an assistant. Yeah, he was not an assistant. Well, he, I mean, maybe he was in a way, in a way, an assistant in time. Yes, but he's a very big important part of this case. But again, the question is, how is Jen Shaw affording all of this? Because her husband's a football coach, which yes, can be a high-paying job depending on what school you're at, where you live. But even if it was the most successful school, it would not be funding Jen Shaw's life in the lifestyle that she's living. Right. I think that job pay is like anywhere from like 400 to 500 K a year, which is a massive salary. But if she spent $100,000 on one night for a party. Yeah. But Jen tells everyone it's coming from her successful marketing business. Like she implies and portrays herself to the world as the breadwinner, meaning that she's making more than 400 to 500 K a year. But she's very big. But she's not shy about how much money she spends. She admits to spending $50,000 a month on clothing and jewelry a month. And she also takes care of her family and friends. Like she's very, very generous and appears very family oriented. She even cares for her nephew who was living in like a bad area. And so she offered to like take him in and like pay for a better life for him. So again, you have this like duality to Jen Shaw, where she is over the top and loud and can like snap, but she's very loyal and generous. But also like it's tough because when you watch all of her episodes, like in the first episode, you don't see how bad it is. Yeah. But I would say she borders on emotionally abusive. Oh, really? It's that bad. She's often offended by her cast mate's actions. But the second they try to call her out for something, she like becomes a victim. She cries. She's like, how could you do this to me? And I'm such an amazing friend. You're such a terrible friend. How could you do this to me? And it gets so bad that you literally see the other woman, not even realizing that they're in this cycle of abuse, go through the cycle of abuse. You see them start to get confused and question yourselves. And they see someone who's bawling their eyes out and they're like, oh my gosh, I didn't mean to hurt you. And then they start to feel bad and apologize to her about something. Like am I a good person? Like what did I do? Am I not seeing things clearly? I'm so clearly hurting this person. When you were giving those examples, it reminded me of, I think, a book that a lot of people have read, like Children of Emotionally Imature Parents. Great book. Because I was like, oh, well, if there's children here, then maybe that book could be good to read. I know. For all the real housewives, children, the whole Bravo fandom. And also probably for them because, you know, a generational trauma. But yeah, like by the end of these cycles, you would see all the other housewives going to her to apologize, even though it started out with them going to her to bring up an issue they had with her. It is hard to watch at some points, especially if you've endured any type of emotional abuse or immature parents in your life, but it also meant she was a producer's dream. And when the show aired in the fall of 2020, Jen Shaw became a pop culture lightning rod. Whether you loved her or hated her, her antics got people to tune in. But one question that has always remained and you have asked it multiple times already to the audience and also to her fellow housewives is, how exactly did she make her money? Yeah. What kind of marketing are you doing? And can you teach me? You don't want to do the marketing she's doing. Now I know we don't, but there's a lot of people in marketing that are not living this lavish lifestyle. Yes. So I may have not watched the show, but I did want to know more about Jen Shaw and the stuff that you don't get to see when watching TV. So Sabrina is the TV expert here. And then I tried to go just into the crime. Jen Shaw was always a bit of a mystery, even to those who were closest to her, maybe especially to those who were closest to her who seemed pretty blindsided by everything that happened. Yeah. But the truth was, who was Jen? And what was she doing to afford this lavish lifestyle? Well, her story starts before she became a reality TV star, before she was a real housewife of Salt Lake City. So we're going to go into her background and learn a little bit about how she grew up and became a woman who is a woman who clearly has a ton of ambition and a deep desire for status. And maybe also understand why she's a little bit, a little bit might not be the right word. Why she is so volatile. Yeah. Incredibly volatile. Yeah. Jen was born Jennifer Louis on October 1973 in Salt Lake City. She was a part of a large tight-knit Hawaiian and Tongan family. And according to Jen, when she was just a baby, her maternal grandparents actually took her to Hawaii to live with them, which apparently is like a normal thing within this culture. So she moved back there. But by the time she was around six or seven, her grandma starts to get sick and she's in the hospital for about a month. And it just must have been too hard on her grandparents to care for Jen because they had to send her back to Salt Lake City. Which must have been like difficult as a child to like change who's like kind of your parental care. Yeah, I've been shuffled around because it's also not like you're just being shuffled around to like a different area of your town or like the same state. It is just like landscape, people, culture, everything is so different. Yeah. And as the oldest daughter of six children, Jen was also expected to do a lot. So a lot of the housekeeping, taking care of her other siblings. And on top of that, she also was expected to get good grades and follow all of her family's rules. And there were a lot of rules. But Jen, she as a kid, as most kids want to do, they want to make their family and their parents proud, right? So she pushed herself to exceed their expectations. And that was definitely a lot of pressure on her. And what made it more difficult was seeing back in Utah meant that she wasn't only receiving pressure from her family. In Hawaii, Jen looks like everyone else, but in Utah, the exact opposite. So now there's a lot of pressure on like how to act, how to look, how to fit in. Utah is still one of the least racially diverse states in the United States today. It is about 75 to 80 percent white. And it's culturally dominated by the LDS. Jen, like I said, she talked about this a lot in the show, but she there was one like story. She shared on the show about how mean the kids and her classes were growing up. Kids used to call her dirty because of her stuff. Oh, God. Yeah. It's so sad. It's so sad. It's so terrible. You can see how like in this moment of like childhood, she chose that instead of withdrawing like because I was a type person where if I was bullied, I would become a shell of myself. Jen did the opposite where she was like, okay, well, I'm going to prove you wrong. And I'm going to make you notice me for the reasons I want you to notice me for. Get louder. Yeah. And so these are the experiences that she was having as a child to shape who she would become as a person, as a woman. And so she decided to do things to get noticed, things that she enjoyed doing like dancing. So Jen was a really good dancer. So she joined the high schools cheer and dance teams and everyone started to recognize how good she was a dancing and she became like the girl who can dance, which is awesome. I'm sure she got a lot of like popularity and attention for that. But this kind of established this mentality of performing to make people like her. And she even does admit on the show that she felt like she needed to be bigger and louder to be taken seriously. And she, she succeeded. Yeah. And that started in school. Eventually after graduating high school in 1991, Jen decided to go to University of Utah for college. And that is where she met her husband, Sharif, Shaw, or Coach Shaw, because she calls him in the show. According to Jen, she saw Sharif for the first time in class. And she knew who he was because he was on the University football team. He was a defensive player who had what I played when we did a flag football in college. Did yeah, I was corner back. I don't know. We didn't win. Just the slowest member on the team probably. He was tall. He was handsome. And Jen was like, Oh my God. I am cute. And with this guy, Sharif felt the same way about Jen. He walked over to Jen, asked to sit next to her. And then this is where their relationship started. And it very quickly built. It got very serious, very fast. Sharif was very open about wanting to marry Jen. And about a year after they started dating, Jen found out that she was pregnant. Kind of a mixed bag of emotions here because obviously she loves Sharif. She does want to marry him. But now she's pregnant. And her parents are really strict. And so this is not something that she thinks they will just openly accept with loving arms. Especially with a Mormon background, the Mormon rules and views on like all of that. Everything is yeah. So yeah, it's a different world than what we experience. So she's pregnant. I don't think she told people for a while, but pregnancy gets to a certain point where you cannot hide it. So when Jen came home for Christmas break in 1993, she was about six months along and she was definitely showing. As expected, her parents were not happy. But they didn't stay mad for long. Jen and Sharif were committed to being together in an August of 1994, five months after welcoming their son Shereef Jr., Jen and Shereef got married. They both completed their degrees, Jen graduated with a degree in communications and marketing, and Shereef graduated with a bachelor's degree in political science. And then after graduating, Shereef decided to pursue a career in law, which meant more school and obviously law school's very expensive, definitely not cheap. So together, they decided that Jen would financially support the family while Shereef went to law school. Jen was more than happy to do that, following in the path of marketing and telemarketing sales, and she was really good at it too. So this made sense for their family. Yeah. And one thing I will say about Coach Shaw, he is granted, you don't get to spend as much time with the husbands of the show because it's real housewives, but he from what I have seen on the show is the most like pure, patient, man, that despite Jen's antics is always like there to help calm her down. Wow. And it's like I could see how like he's very healing for her, but unfortunately, you got to do your own work too. Someone else can't heal you. Okay, but before we go into the specifics of what her job was, I feel like we should talk about telemarketing for a second. I know, brilliant, exciting, but not that inherently telemarketing has a reputation of being full of scams and annoying, like, you know, sitting around the dinner table and the 90s and my mom like continuously being like, take me off this list. They get a call again. My grandpa starts speaking Japanese. He can speak Japanese. Not a lot, but he lives in Japan for a little bit. So he knows a little. Just enough that he, they don't call back. Well, telemarketing became popular in the 1970s when businesses realize they could sell their products directly by phone. So instead of going door to door knocking, which is time consuming, they could just pick up the landline, call you and sell you something over the phone. And by the 90s, it received a negative reputation and became more fraudulent where companies would use those same tactics, cold calling, high-pressure sales, targeting vulnerable people for their scams. They would promise sweepstakes, pretended to be charities, tech support, and so many other things. And these fraudulent companies weren't just making money from the scams and selling these fake products. They were also making money by selling their leads list to other scammers. So basically, if someone successfully bought, they would write that down. They would like give all the information about this person, their phone number, their email, contact information, and then sell that to another company who could then do, which is just a list of here's the most vulnerable people to scam. Yes. Point being, telemarketing isn't inherently an illegal business and it didn't start as such. And selling leads is not, that's used by so many different companies. Right. But the way that they were operating and who they were targeting. But you can also see how clearly it can be illegal. Yes. And how it can pray on vulnerable people. And especially in this case, the elderly, or not even just in this case, generally. Yes. But that will come back in the story again. Ghosts aren't real. At least, that's what journalist Tristan Redman always believed. Sure, odd things happen in his childhood bedroom, but ultimately he shrugged them off. Until he discovered that he wasn't alone, that everyone who lived there after him also had bizarre experiences they couldn't explain. And it gets even weirder. It just so happens that his wife's great-grandmother was murdered in the house next door. Is this ghost somehow connected to her murder? He decides to go where no son-in-law should, digging up a cold case and asking questions that nobody wants answered. Like, could his wife's great-grandfather have gotten away with the perfect crime? This is a podcast about family secrets, overwhelming coincidence, and the things that come back to haunt us. For the best bingeful series, like Ghost Story, listen to the audible true crime podcast wherever you get your podcasts. Audible subscribers can get all episodes early and add free right now. Join Audible, a new audible app or by subscribing on Apple Podcasts. But from what I could see, Jen was working above board for a lot of this. So on the legal side of telemarketing for some years, she climbed the ranks. And in 2001, Sharif graduated law school, started working in commercial litigation and personal injury to of the highest paying gigs out there for attorneys. So he's bringing a ton of money to, which meant the Jen didn't have to work anymore. She had been the breadwinner, but now she gets a break, right? So if she wanted to settle down and be a housewife, a real housewife, she could. And this was something that I think was a thought in this family, because in 2003, she had their second son. So now there's two kids at home. But Jen was thinking bigger. She loved working. She loved making her own money. She didn't want to be a stay-at-home real housewife in this situation, because she had some other ideas. By 2006, Jen was the director of business development at a telemarketing company called Proper Incorporated. I also love like, what an inspiration. There's like mother, I mean, I don't know, I feel like there's, oh, society, there's such a stigma on like women like working, being a mom, whatever. But she's like, I could stay at home. We have all the money in the world, especially with like, co-trauz income. But no, I am a badass boss bitch and I like bringing in money. I like having my own career and she could do both. It's inspirational. Yeah. I like also do it. I think the opposite too, where I'm like, there is something so wonderful about having the support and like working so hard to be able to be at a point that you like aren't able to be at home with your kids when they're young, but she didn't both. Both parts are very hard. Yeah. So for Jen, she obviously wanted to be a mom, but she also had some work aspirations that were not going to lead her to taking a few years off of work. So when she worked for Proper Incorporated, the business sold executive business coaching courses, which basically was like self-help for business people. So again, it's a book court. It's a legal company. They're selling a real product. It's not a scam. Although they did get sued in 2007 by a former employee who alleged that he had been water-boarded as a motivational exercise. You know, the typical corporate bonding, please meet me in conference room B. Well, okay, I mean, 11.44. Well, I'm glad he's okay, but it does mean that like the only trouble that company got in was for something torture. Yes, but it's not like a scam. I'm relating to Jen Asha's journey in her story abuse, human torture. She's not participating from the early days of her career in scams as far as we know. Yes. She's just observing business models and how they work and what to do. In 2011, Jen left the company to work for Thrive Corporate, which was another telemarketing company that sold businesses coaching and work from home opportunities. And again, Jen climbed the ranks. She worked her way up to be VP of business development alongside no other than her assistant, Stuart Smith. That's where she met him. The two of the origin stories. You don't know that origin story when you watch the show. No, because he's just being fed a banana and wandering around holding her purse. How would you know? Oh, the scenes with him are so delightful though. They really are. They're such a joy. So I need to look him up. I don't know any of these characters. I don't know what they look like. Stuart Smith. I'll compile a list of like YouTube clips that just perfectly encompass all of these. Wow. The juxtaposition of the two of them together. She is a full glam, not a hair out of place, and he looks like does it an everyday. You just, yeah, a white man. You just could have walked into a dick sporting goods and plucked him out and put him in the car with that person in the car with that, like, so different fitting your shoes. Okay. So he's not an assistant. He is her co-worker. So Jens is like badass, high powered female. She earns a seat on the board. And when it comes time for her first port meeting, she's told she didn't have to come. And she's like, okay, well, that makes no sense because every other VP has to go to this meeting. So like, why wouldn't I have to go that, that makes no sense? And then it hits her. There are two differences between her and all the other VP's. One, they're all white. She's not. Two, they're all men, and she's not. My eyes twitching. Right. But this is so, like, eff you. Yeah. So this was a massive turning point for her. And she decided screw these assholes. I don't need to work for them. I can work for myself, which feels like a direct echo of something that you were sharing when she grew up where it was like all these people making fun of her or like trying to like put her in a box. And she was like, no, I am the narrator of my own story. Right. And I'm going to take matters into my hands. Yeah, try to do this to me. I'm going to do something that is going to make you regret that totally. So I couldn't find any report of this, but I imagine that she didn't leave very quietly given she doesn't do anything quietly about her. Anyway, she did leave. And in 2011, when Jen was 38, she decided to leave Thrive corporate to start her own telemarketing company. And also as a side note, a couple years later, Thrive got in trouble for deceptive sales practices. And Jen was actually questioned about her time working there. So there's already some like little bread crumbs. So like, and she might not have been the one like leading the charge there, but she for sure would probably was a way of it. That's probably where she learned some of her times. Right. Did she even know that she was doing something wrong either is like another question. It was believed that she wasn't involved if she was questioned. So she goes off on her own in 2011. And around this time in 2012, Sharif decided that he would have his own career pivot. He was offered a coaching position at the University of Utah, his alma mater, and he took it. And that is where at this specific -- when you're coaching at like a certain university of this level, those coaches can make about like 400 to 500K a year, which is where the number came from. I will say a lot of college football coaches do not make that. Unless you're like the like top tier. Right, yeah. Like a huge football team like this. But again, not Jen Shaw money. And no, that definitely does not support that. Correct. So Jen Shaw money came from her own business and businesses. Again, like everyone on the show, the businesses are kind of unclear. I haven't watched it, but I've watched some other reality TV where you're always like, wait, what does that person do? Right. Yeah. Oh, you have that house and your, it's just like social media intern has your job. Like how does that work? Yeah. But anyway, she had businesses and business money. And prosecutors said that she began operating her own lead generation and telemarketing network, essentially finding and generating leads and then selling those leads that contained people's names and phone numbers and financial information and spending history. Sounds a lot like the shadier side of telemarketing. Right. Yeah. I don't know about the sharing like financial information and spending history. Very personal data. Yeah. I'm not sure if that's the illegal part of lead generation. I don't know. I've worked for plenty of companies that have had like buy leads and do that sort of thing. But it's usually like, here's a name and here's the phone number and here's the email address and the person selected that they wanted. It can definitely sound shady and I think that there is a fine line between what is legit and what becomes a scam. So she brought on as a business partner. Her good friend Stu Chains, Stuart Smith, not as an assistant like he's portrayed in the show, but as a partner. Stuart organized the leads list and he would distribute them to other telemarketing sales teams who would track which leads were actually profitable and their operation used a lot of shell companies sometimes overseas. So this is like red flag, red flag, red flag. Yeah, just like try to find us. You're going to find this company owns this company owns this company. It's all overseas and then like here's who purchases and gives money. Yikes. Definitely shadier. Yeah. Correct. Red flag. For years this operation continued unchecked unknown by the public, which is why she was so flashy and had so much money. And while the public did not know how much money she made, it's estimated that her businesses generated some tens of millions of dollars over a decade, which like I feel like that sentence doesn't do enough given what the crime is. Her businesses didn't generate her businesses manipulated and stole tens of millions of dollars over a decade from scam victims. And I feel like this also points to the fact that one this case never went to trial. So like we don't know all of the details. And then two, because they had so many like offshore accounts, like the amount of money probably isn't even accurate. There probably is more. So yeah, it was only a matter of time before someone noticed and someone said something. And her downfall would begin in January of 2016. And not really in the way they would expect. So in January 2016, officials arrested a guy in New York City for selling drugs. What? Not telemarketing related at all, right? Okay. He's selling drugs. Except when the police investigate him, they realized that he wasn't just a drug dealer. He was actually involved in an elaborate network of telemarketing scams. How their line of questioning ended up getting there. I have no idea. But the police are now digging into these details. And they realize like, oh, God, he's a part of something that's that's like big. So they accidentally stumbled upon it. Yeah, he was just drug dealer. Which makes you think like how much longer Jen could have gotten away with it. Had they not made that arrest? Right. It's hard because she probably was trying to hire people who were just as motivated. And this guy has, he's trying to side hustle at the same time to sell drugs. Like he's got the business mindset totally ends up in the in the downfall. And also like it works in her favor to hire someone who's already willing to do something a little bit seedier. Oh, absolutely. Like that's strategy on her end. Totally. Federal investigators started uncovering the layers and made multiple arrests. The more arrests they made, the deeper it went and soon it was spanning multiple states. And when you cross multiple states, it's not a state offense. It's federal. Like the FBI is going to be involved. And they do become involved here. Yeah. Each arrest seemed to lead to another operation. And a lot of suspects were more than happy to say who they were working for in order to save their own skins. So a lot of people were given up in these arrests. Investigators followed financial records, interviewed cooperating witnesses. And over time, those leads started to come back to the same names. Gen Shaw in Stuart Smith. But because Gen had been building her international celebrity status, the investigators knew that in order to successfully build a case against her, they would have to do it very quiet. That is crazy. I mean, the first arrest happened in 2016. And then you said it was what 2021 is when the arrest happens on the show. So they were building a case for years. But I guess it's since it's so deep and there's so many offshore accounts and so many different. It's not just one business. It's like multiple. It's the classic. Like you hide a business within a business, within a business. And it's like it you make it hard to track down. There's like a big web. Well, okay. What did they find though? So Jen and Stuart created fake companies based in the country of Kosovo, which kept them away from the reach of the IRS. So already they're coming in being like, how do we hide ourselves from the get go? Those sham companies then blasted ads all over the internet, mostly in the US and also a little bit in Canada too. And they were targeting people who were trying to start a business from home. So they were selling a kind of product or like program to get you started, which I feel like those programs are like so many people have like learned how to do this or whatever, right? And you can sell them legally for a course or whatever. But basically they would sell these things for hundreds of bucks, which was high enough to show that this was like a serious course, a serious thing that they were selling. But it was still affordable enough for people who don't have a big budget who were trying to start businesses to potentially buy it. Like it does seem like a very above board product that people could use. Right. Okay. So we're going to get into why it's not about why and how it didn't stay above board. So right when you clicked on an ad and bought the service, your name and information was added to a lead list. These lists then got sold to other sham companies with teams of salespeople. And before you knew it, people were being flooded with these spam calls all from clicking this one singular ad. These salespeople would put pressure to purchase this on the business owner or like hopeful business owner saying things like, sure, this was a package cost $1,000. But you need to establish yourself online. You need to have a better presence. High pressure sales tax. Exactly. Yeah. They're like really encouraging people to spend thousands of dollars upfront. And then weeks and months go by and these people are not seeing any profits or reaping any of like what was promised to them by signing up for all of these things. So they would call to complain. And then they're like, okay, well, then you just need the next package. Like, oh, that did everything that it could. But clearly, you need premium coaching programs, right? So sure, just buy another thing. And suddenly people are like spending and spending and spending on something that just isn't really real. Like the websites are busted. The courses are total nonsense. The coaches don't exist. But by the time the victims realize it, they have spent tons of money. And these are people who are like trying to start businesses. It's not like they have a ton to just like keep reef planning. Right. So Jen scheme in particular was pretty diabolical. Her target audience was elderly retirees. So sad. These retirees were looking for a way to supplement their fixed income. And so she would go after people who were unemployed or disabled. Folks who were isolated and vulnerable, maybe excited and hopeful or desperate and uninformed. Yeah. People who like didn't really understand how the internet worked, what they were clicking on, what they were buying. Yeah. Just trying to like see the good in people too. Right. Like you don't want to just assume everyone's out to get your money and get you. Yeah. So unfortunately for a lot of people, and I guess fortunately for her and her endeavors, it worked. Pretty soon, Jen was making more than enough to support her family. Plus her husband, Sharif was making a solid six figure salary. So they were making a ton of money. And her husband was making it legally. So there was lots of money happening. Lots of money happening. Yeah. She was living a life of luxury, but she also got to play the part of the powerful business woman. All while ruining the lives of many innocent people. So you can see how Jen became obsessed with being rich. It's no surprise that when the opportunity to be on real housewives of Salt Lake City came across her desk. She was like, hell yeah, I want to be on that show. And it was so successful in season one that season two became like a no brainer. And this also just so happened to overlap perfectly timing wise with the federal investigation into Jen and her scam, which brings us back to how we open to this episode season two episode nine where agents arrived to the parking lot moments after Jen had received a phone call that her husband was in the hospital with internal bleeding and she fled. So we still don't know who called her, but she for sure. - Sure, with Tiptoe chains. - Or was he with her? - Well, that's the drama too, because I don't know timeline-wise, when Stu flipped on her, 'cause he was also arrested. She gave very far agents were able to track her down and arrest her, and fact it all happened so fast that she was still fully glammed up. - Great, for her mug shot. - Right, can you imagine if she wasn't? - Also, some people-- - Also some people-- - Their eyes that she knew, the arrest was coming, and that's why she had glammed up so much, but also, they were filming the show. She was always glammed up. On March 30th, 2021, Jen and Stuart both were indicted on charges of conspiracy to commit wire fraud and money laundering. And despite facing multiple charges in up to 50 years in prison, Jen Shaw, this is not the end of her real housewives of Salt Lake City career. No, she decides, "I'm gonna go back on the show." How can you do that? 'Cause she has a waiting trial. She's not in prison, she paid bail, she's a waiting trial, and season three, her slogan for the season in the intro montage is, "The only thing I'm guilty of is being shamazing." - I have seen that clip on TikTok, but I had no context behind it. - You had no context. - Yeah. So, she spends the entirety of season three defending her innocence. Like, she never lets down. She is so confident and persistent that she is innocent. To the point where other housewives, any of audience members do get divided and question like, "Is she actually innocent?" She even starts selling merch that says free Jen Shaw and justice for Jen. She's always looking for a business opportunity. - Right. - Code Shaw and Jen's mother and family all stay by her side. They're praying constantly. Jen swears she's innocent. And there are moments like when you're watching you're like, "Is she?" Because I think it's almost like she believes she's innocent or she's so good at lying that she's convinced herself of it. But it's not enough. When you're watching it and you're like, "She's guilty." - Right. And like, how can she defend herself? She owned the company. Is she did the offshore accounts? - Yeah. - Like how do you convince yourself when you're taking so many steps to cover and hide? - Collision. (laughs) - Collision. - When she was arrested, federal agents did show up to her house with a search warrant, but they didn't know what they were coming into. So they showed up with guns. Her son, who was sleeping and was woken up by agents with a gun, basically on his face. And she talks about this and you see her cry. As a mother, she's devastated about the trauma that he went through. - Right. - And then she's like a crime ring. So they have no idea if they're gonna just bust into this house. - They have no idea. - They have no idea. And there's also cocaine business on the dining room table or whatever. - You have no idea. - Yeah. - And then she also talks a lot about how like, she really doesn't make it about herself. She's really so scared that she will be leaving her son and that he would be growing up without a mother. Like you empathize with those moments and they're really, really human. - Yeah. This is also just making me wonder to what it's like to be the child of an adult who is on a reality television show doing this. Like what is your life like going through like middle school and high school and trying to have friends and then you're like, oh, my mom is the one that's like acting crazy every episode and super drunk and throwing her wine on TV. - Well, some of the kids are featured in like the Real Housewives shows. And there's actually a new bravo show called Next Gen. And it has some of like the kids who grew up with parents as not all of them, but some of them and they're all in New York City. So some of them go into reality TV. She keeps defending, keeps saying that she's innocent, but it's like everything you've just proved, like and said that the FBI and like the government had found on her, like it feels really hard to defend. - Right. - But she basically told everyone that she had no idea that her employees were running the schemes under her nose that it was all a misunderstanding and she often blamed no other than her former assistant, Stu Chains, claiming that he misled her and that he was the one running the operation, which is interesting 'cause based on the way that you do see the show in that moment of like her feeding him the banana and it's like you make me money and I'll feed you. It does look like Jen's just like living in luxury and making everyone else do the work for her. That it's like okay, could people have been doing these illegal things without her knowing? But the answer's no and they find evidence of that. - Well, Jen didn't know at the time. It was that Stuart Smith had actually already taken a plea deal and he admitted his guilt but cooperated with officials for a lesser sentencing and in fact multiple employees did the exact same thing. So basically all of them are turning on Jen but Jen didn't know it yet. - Damn. And I feel like you can see her in season three really feel the pressure. Like she and coach Shaw decided to downsize like they can't afford their Shaw Shalee anymore. Their assets are partially frozen and so like that glamorous life that Jen had just been living up and showing off in seasons one and two is definitely a little less glittery and glitzy. But her toxic behaviors were very much the same. So all of season three, as it plays out, there's this like push and pull over everyone wondering and thinking is Jen innocent or is she guilty? Jen is over the top emotional. She tells her classmates she just thought about dying and like this is sad, like she talks about wanting to die because this is like such a hard thing for her to be dealing with. But then she also like milks it a little bit. Like anytime they go on a trip, the other housewives are so sweet to her and they're like Jen gets the master, she gets the primary bedroom like with the biggest bed because who knows, maybe she'll be in a jail cell and like we want to give her up, like yeah. And she for sure like milks that. But as the season comes to an end. - I think I still can't believe that this is being filmed and they're like going on trips and doing all of this with the knowledge that she very well maybe in jail soon. Like that just seems like so bizarre. I think of when people, I know this isn't the way that it works, but I think of when people commit a crime or like our under investigation that they're just immediately in jail, which totally is. - Some people are, but some people are, yeah. - And they can't afford to pay bail, but these wealthy people can. And I do think like from a legal standpoint, Jen and her team decided that maybe this would actually help her case because if the public sees her completely like defending her innocence over and over, like maybe that will sway public opinion, it did not work. - But yeah, opinion is different than yeah. Facts presented in the court of law. - Agreed. But now here's one of the most dramatic things that ever happened on real housewives of Salt Lake City. - More dramatic than her getting arrested? - It's pretty dramatic. I would say like in terms of Jen being arrested, probably highest, but this is like the next highest. Okay, so as the season three is coming to an end and everyone's aware that Jen's trials imminent, they decide to go on a big girl's trip to San Diego. They can't leave the country because of her legal issues. So they go to San Diego and they get drunk. But they're having a blast. This is the first trip where sure there's some drama, but there's like a moment where you're like, oh, these girls actually do get along and can get along. They seem like they're having a blast. Until the next morning, one of the other housewives, Heather Gay wakes up with a black eye and scratches all over her body. It looks like she like full-on punched like in a bra. But here's the thing, production had left. And however, whenever it happened, was not captured by cameras. And Heather, you can tell she knows what happened, but she claims she has no idea how she got it, that she blacked out and has no recollection. None of the other girls now is she's just suddenly alone and got drunk. Well, it was like late at night. So based on the timeline that they talk about on the show, I think they had been up drinking and like parting until like three, four and everyone started going to bed. But like, you can see like a couple of stragglers. So naturally, everyone's concerned, cast and production included, Heather seems to confide in only two castmates, Meredith and Jen. And she continues to say like she has no idea how she got it, that she's embarrassed, that she blacked out, she sticks to this story. But everyone, I'm sure even if you're hearing this, is sus. Unfortunately, for over a year, despite like theories, this doesn't get answered. They try to put it in the back of their mind because there's a more pressing issue, Jen's trial. And season three ends with a shocking adendum. Jen's trial. It's July 2022, just days before Jen's trial sets up again, and Meredith and Heather are the only two castmates who have decided to be in New York to support their friend. You see them with Jen and Coach Shaw. And again, Jen insists that she is innocent. Days before her trial. The next morning, Heather and Meredith wake up to the news that Jen Shaw pleaded guilty. Just one day after Jen proclaimed her innocence to their faces, just right before the trial's post to begin, Jen had changed her plea and pleaded guilty. - Which I could obviously know that she's guilty 'cause I know the true crime piece of this. I've never watched the show, but like I said, this is how we're researching this one. So I can imagine how shocking it was to everyone. Do you get to see, like, does it capture everyone's reaction on the show to this news? - Mostly just in this moment, Heather and Meredith, but then at the reunion, they talk about it a lot more. - My God. - I'd be so confused. And I feel like I'd be like torn between being like, oh my gosh, what happened to my friend to make her feel like she had no choice, but to plead guilty. Or I'd be questioning every interview. her action I ever had. It seems like overall they're like, oh my God, she lied to us for so long. She must have seen how much evidence they had. That proved she was guilty. That it was way more in her favor. Oh my God. To plead guilty. Yeah. Geez. Well, yeah, ultimately on July 11th, 2022, Jen Japlie did guilty in federal court. She admitted to conspiracy to commit wire fraud, admitted that she ran a telemarketing fraud scheme, acknowledged that she targeted vulnerable victims and that she knew that what she was doing was wrong. In exchange for her guilty plea, the government agreed to drop the money laundering charge. And because of the plea deal, there was no trial which meant that we don't know all of the evidence that the prosecution had on Jen Ja, we can assume that given that she changed her deal or what she was pleading and that she would have been found guilty and sentenced and probably served much more had she not pled guilty and taken this plea deal. Totally. Once the trial was canceled, the case moved to sentencing preparation where the prosecutors called for a long prison sentence and the defense argued leniency. Many of the victims of the scans have admitted letters describing how the fraud impacted them, which I can only imagine didn't. And I read that Jen basically said she changed her plea to guilty after reading the victim statements. But then there was a comment basically being like, no, she changed it because she saw the damning evidence of the prosecution. She was trying to be like, I had such that when you have a change of heart, only when you're in trouble. I'm not so sure. Yeah, so the truth is Jen fully knew what was going on and at the sentencing which took place on January 6, 2023, the judge spoke about text messages between Jen and her employees that proved that she knew and this part like really made me angry because it was almost like they're laughing in their victim's faces, which they're literally they're making fun of them for falling for these schemes, texting things like, oh my god, stop. You're making her fall in love with you and other texts said suckers or reload, which basically meant that Jen was going to go back to the same people over and over and over because yes, and like they could milk them for all that they had. I did really like there were people who had like gone bankrupt. Literally all their life savings had so much credit card debt all because of for like taking advantage of them. Yeah, you know what this kind of reminded me of was the movie and I can't remember the name of it, but it's the movie about care exactly in care or whatever it's called care. We're like care a lot. I care a lot. Where you basically like become like healthcare proxy and like in charge of all the money. So sad. I say you like the person that yeah in the movie and then takes advantage of elderly people are yeah and still so there are many. Unfortunately because there was not a trial, we don't really know the truth or the extent of all these operations, but clearly there were a lot of people coming forward. There was a lot of condemning evidence. I mean the FBI was investigating it for years before anything happened. Like you can imagine how much came out there in court at her sentencing. Jen apologized for her actions claimed that the person that she was on reality TV was fake that she bought into the persona and she just got really lost in it all. She did also talk a lot about mental health and like claimed that she was like mentally ill which caused her like get lost in this, which I do believe to some extent. And then she was like really laying on the like emotions and being like I'm on medicine now and I see the error of my ways. And it's like well you were caught. Yes. And you're sad you're caught. So now you're pretending you're a marshal but had you not been caught you would have kept doing it. And like mental illness doesn't lead to a structured and well thought out con lasting multiple years. Yeah. I think it's an issue that she definitely like got caught up in it and was like wow this is so great. I love all this money coming in. I will keep doing whatever it takes to keep my lifestyle going. Yes. Unfortunately some people have success by stepping on others. The judge overseeing the case said that Jen and her schemes were callous and brazen and emphasize that the victims were vulnerable people who trusted that the promises that they her company was making to them were real. So the judge imposed a six and a half year sentence in prison, 78 months, 6.6 million dollars in restitution and 6.5 million dollars for future. Before ending the sentence the judge made sure to make one final sentencing. The Jen was not allowed to profit off of or any of her free Jen Shaw or justice for Jen merchandise. The judge literally asked are those still being sold and Jen's lawyer was like they have been taken off the website. Jenna agreed so that the money would go directly towards the restitution that she owed for all of her victims or the victims that came out in the investigation. And then in February of 2023 Jen Shaw reported to prison to serve her sentence. But the story is not over yet. So season three ended with Heather getting a black eye like I said and then Jen is found or pleads guilty and at the season reunion everyone is asking about the black eye. Heather continues with the same story that she got too drunk. She didn't know how it happened. She sticks with the story for an entire year. It is not until the season four reunion that Heather finally confessed. And can you guess how she got that black eye? I mean my guess is that she said something to Jen and Jen. So we don't know the specifics but yes Jen Shaw punched her. And Heather finally admitted that she lied because at the time she was simultaneously like stuck in this like cycle of abuse with Jen so she was like scared of her but also like loved her and was so worried about her and was worried that on top of everything that Jen was going through this would like make her case so much harder so she wanted to protect Jen. I do understand that because we had a friend who did something quite terrible to me instead of being like very upset I was like are you okay? How did that concern for them? What is going on that led you to do this? Like I'm truly concerned about you. But the truth was that Jen was like very emotionally and physically abusive and they were kind of like caught in her web of lies and they believed her. They were so in it that they couldn't see the reality of it until so far afterwards and if you do decide to watch the show which I highly recommend it is sad watching because it's so clear as an outside viewer of that cycle of abuse but to them who are in it they don't see it until it's too late almost and you do see how people empathize with Jen she's loud she wears her emotions on her sleeves she's loyal or make does a really good job making you believe she's loyal but in truth she was violent and she made herself a victim but her true colors could not remain hidden forever she was ultimately caught for her fraudulent schemes. Jen Shaw was serving her time at federal prison camp Brian a minimum security federal prison located a hundred miles north west of Houston it houses female federal inmates. Inmates like Jen Shaw and Elizabeth Holmes who who there's like Jen and Elizabeth Holmes became best friends in prison there's like literally video footage of them the two of them like exercising outside together. I feel like that shouldn't be allowed. You shouldn't put two schemers together who like get too lost in the sauce with their own faith business of prison and jail is supposed to be reform we know that that's not what actually happened. Not finding your next business partner yeah two of them coming out together. Even crazier despite being sentenced to serve six and a half years Jen Shaw was released on December 10th 2025 and for privacy reasons authorities have only said that she's either in a group home or in home confinement but even if she is back at home I imagine her life is quite different and probably nowhere near as a shum as it was before. So now you're getting it yeah you're hooked. I do I want to watch the season. You have to. You have to watch seasons one and two to lead up to it and then you're going to be hooked and you're going to keep watching emotionally it's hard for me to watch people lose themselves but it's also so entertaining. Unfortunately half the world agrees with you despite a lot of bravo what is it bravo heads I think that's the term but yeah despite this being such an incredible show people were hurt by Jen's actions but then going back to how great the school the show is it's amazing you can see how the other housewives who are still on the show have been shaped by Jen's actions and even though they still fight like no other in a weird way everything that happened with Jen kind of like trauma bonded them together and brought them a lot closer which I'll just say this I have never seen real housewives any of the franchises but I also know that she's not the only housewife to ever be arrested no but just not on the actual show as they're filming but anyhow there's so much more I would love to talk about when it comes to my ladies on real housewives of Salt Lake City but now you just have to go watch the show if you don't already and DM us and we'll talk about it. DM Sabrina I don't know anything thank you so much for listening we're your host Sabrina Deanna Roja and Karin Vienn during this next Tuesday for another peek inside another crimes of deception and if there are any cases that you would like us to cover please let us know in the comments here at Crime House we want to thank each and every one of you for your support if you like what you heard today reach out on all social media at Crime House and don't forget to rate interview and follow CrimesUp wherever you get your podcasts, your feedback truly makes a difference. And with that, another trial is dismissed. Dismissed. Did you know Penicillin, the drug that has saved more lives than any other in history, was discovered because a scientist forgot to clean a petri dish before going on vacation? I'm Connor Tomlinson, and history is my thing, has been my whole life. And I'm Carter Roy, and this is what the fact. The history lesson you actually wished you had in high school with everything they cut for being too interesting put back in. Every week we take the wildest true things that ever happened and tell you the whole story behind them. I bring the history, I bring the facts, the tangents, and the occasional British accent. The wildest stuff is real, and the real stuff is wilder than you think. New episodes every Wednesday, follow what the fact on Apple podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or subscribe on YouTube at what the fact pod. Crime House 24/7 for Crime House of Horrors. Where I dive into four stories behind some of our favorite scary movies. From Abigail, the autopsy of Jane Doe, Sinister, and the taking of Deborah Logan, you'll find one thing in common. The truth is scarier than fiction. Listen every Sunday on Crime House 24/7, or join Crime House Plus for all four right now, add free, subscribe on Apple podcasts, Spotify, or at Crime House Plus dot com. [BLANK_AUDIO]