Debating Dynasty TE Tiers for 2026 - Dynasty Fantasy Football

[music] Welcome to the Fantasy Footballer's Dynasty Podcast with Borg Betts in the Baller. [music] Welcome back! [music] It's Wednesday, July 29th here. In his footballer's Dynasty Podcast with Borg Betts in the end, Jason. Something looks a little different today, Kyle. I can't wait. Place my finger on what that is. So a lot of times when there is something visual, we say, "Hey, go check us out on YouTube." You're probably listening most of the time, but when there's something special, we say, "You're gonna want to go to YouTube." And this one is the exact opposite. Please only listen. Do not go to YouTube. You will never tune in again. Because we are here, or should I say, we're back here, because back, street, back. Alright! Kyle went to see the Backstreet Boys in the sphere. And if I may quote, "Kyle," he said, "If I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna go all the way." And that's who you are, Kyle. You do things all the way. So you bleached your tips, most of your hair. And you look, "I love making fun of it, but it doesn't look bad. It just looks wrong." It's kind of a new look for Kyle. That's where I ended, too, where I go, "Okay, I'm gonna do this because the concert I bought tickets for my wife, and I got to go." But it's a lot of millennials. Everyone's kind of dressing in that era. And I said, "If I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna do this. Let me just give you a spoiler." I think I was the only one who did that with the hair. I was like looking around like, "Oh, it's just me." But then I, like, the next day, was at the pool, the day after, still in Vegas. I was like, "This doesn't look terrible." And so my kids wanted me to keep it going. So I'm gonna see how it goes for a week. And then I'll probably just buzz it and be done. But it was a fun little life experiment to say, "Hey, I'm about to be 40." And this is where I want to be now. Do that picture that your wife sent of you with the towel draped around your shoulders with your Starbucks cup. You just like, "You're at the salon for the day. You know, ready to have the best of your life." So glad you had fun, buddy. What's amazing though about the trip is that, in hindsight, it sounds so funny because you bought these tickets months and months in advance. Yes, or your wife. Back in March. Correct. But the actual concert was on your real birthday, wasn't it? Correct. So to everybody in the outside looking in, like, it looked like Kyle. This was purchase tickets for himself for the back of your wife's desk view. But it's also not like when you were buying them for your wife on that day that it was in that, like you didn't know. Oh, that day is also my birthday. This was for Kyle. Hey, teach yourself. I did. And Vegas was very kind to us. Vegas was great. Eight tons of good food. And I know Jason likes Vegas a lot. I do, but it's not usually kind to me. That's the phrase I took over. Oh, Vegas was kind to you. Amazing. I had a good time. So anyway, this, this will be it. We'll see. Next week, if I'm back and bleach tips. I didn't think that would be part of my 2026 bingo card, but here's where I'm at now on this episode. We are going to finish our series on tears. We're going to talk about dynasty tight ends. And I really was going through the process of going through our rankings and asking myself a question. Does it really matter after I get to like tear? I don't know four or five. Like, like, is there a discussion to say like, man, here's the Titans and tear six that you really need to think about. And at the end of the day, it's like, well, we know that there's about seven or eight tight ends that matter. It was funny. I was going through the show doc and each tear slowly got bigger and bigger and bigger. And then you could tell Kyle. It's got the point where he was like, these guys are all the same. You know, T.J. Hawkinson, Hunter Henry, T.J. Hawkinson didn't even make it in the tears. Cause I don't even know if he is technically in tear seven. Does he even have the mighty hole? Does he care anymore? Does he care about football? How old is he 29? I want to say 29 going on 38. He's one of those. There's always these players that just they're not act their number isn't that crazy, but they just feel so old. They're body aged quickly. I don't know if it's the hair, the beard or just the injuries. Usually it's part and parcel to guys that have spent a lot of time in their career being injured later in their career. But yeah, he feels done. I feel like all he has to do since he has that luscious hair. If he just bleached it, he could go back turn back the clock. You look so young, you look so young and stupid like young people look stupid. So you look so young and stupid. Would you have said this looks stupid, you know, 25 years ago? No, because you would have been appropriately aged. There you go. That's what matters. So we'll talk about all through those dinosaur tight in tears. If you don't have an elite, what should you do? Can you even trade up for some of the elites? We'll talk about those in just a second, and give a reminder, coming up in exactly a month, Jason, is the live show, the Megalus show, at the Vamburian infinux a month. That's crazy. It's going to be a really cool special time. We've got plenty of fun things planned for it. If you haven't got seats, I was just checking. Yeah, there's still, oh, they open up the side meds seats. So there's a few more seats available. Yeah. All right. Well, so you can, you can check it out, ballerslive.com. Hopefully you already got your seats or if not, get them now is sometimes soon in August. Probably another two weeks. We'll make a big hit on the show for whatever remaining tickets are there. So you know, get them before then. Yeah. You come there, have a drink with like, I bet, I bet last time I know somebody bought me a drink at the live show. I was like, sweet. If you want to just buy me a drink, I'm down with that. I thought my wife would drink. It was great. I'll spend people to come to the show to buy them drinks. To buy them drinks. Please come to the show for my benefit. Yeah. This is the ballers series section presents the fantasy footballers. Megalus show presented by PetSmart and GMZ hashtag get Kyle drunk. That is, that is the whole point of this show. I'm also going to be working that night. Come on. Yeah. So actually the whole crew will be there. I mean, most everybody who's a part of this, Borg and Betts will be in Arizona for that. We've got all the doosters, Papa Josh, Al Borland, the Falcon, baby Josh. Everybody's going to be there. So come on out and meet the crew. Before we get in the tears, I had a quick question. I'm seeing. Oh my gosh. What? I'm seeing verified resale tickets available. People are scalping now. No. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. If you want some tickets in the front section, I see four available at a higher rate. So where's that point? There's some people like, I'm going to make some money out those suckers off those ballers. I'm just going to get them. We had this internal question the other day. And I thought it would be worth bringing up a discussion here on the podcast about the 2027 draft. I think we checked in about a month ago. And I wanted to do it again because we heard the refrain that 2027 picks in your dynasty league are super valuable. But part of our conversation has been there's kind of varying opinions about which players are valuable, which positions are deep. I know Mike Rinner, who is somebody that we all over the years have really respect a lot, especially when it comes to draft stuff, he brought up some stuff about how we're going to see maybe a resurgence of first round running backs where I believe a couple of weeks ago, I was like, man, I'm not seeing any in the mock draft. So I wanted to just give people kind of a high level what to do and what to not do at this point in the process. Before college football season starts, before you know what happens in your dynasty league, what are just some do's and don'ts or takeaways that you have about how you should approach 2027 draft picks? I'll let you go first bets. Yeah, I think just to kind of hammer home what you're talking about the running backs on the show that we did the running back tears I think was two weeks ago Jason was on we were talking about like there's not a gentie or a Jeremiah love projection right now. And people came back and were like, whoa, you guys are saying the class is weak. That's not necessarily the take home for sure. We were saying there's no like top 10 NFL draft pick that it looks like right now. And Mike Rinner was coming out and saying like the class looks pretty good. And guys that I think could sneak into the first round. And so that is a good way to kind of frame what happens in the NFL draft cycles where it's like you have your initial take on the class. And I think from a top level view, most draft analysts are pretty good at kind of giving us a general idea of like here's where the strengths are, here's where the weaknesses are. But you need to leave your mind open to what is going to change over the next four to six months. As you get more information as players play their final season and either a send up draft boards and we're like the Joe Barrow year. His final season LSU skyrocketed from an in the friend of Mendoza two years ago was not even thought up as a first round NFL draft. Daniels. Daniels like these guys come out of nowhere and drew out there and whoever else from years ago were supposed to be the next guys. And they fell drafts drastically. So you just need to keep your mind open to. to what is going to change? Because a lot is going to change in the next three to four months. And then when the NFL teams really dive into these guys, that's when we get more information. Yeah, I mean, it's the best thing you should do is keep your eyes on it and the movement. Because as you want to make, if you're going to make a decision now, whenever it's time, whenever the now is, whether that's today or it's six months from now, before you make your decision, go and check in again, and like, what is the current projection? Because as time goes on, we're going to have more and more clarity to how strong or weak the draft is. You always have to make the decision to pull the trigger on a trade today. That's always the case. So whenever you, wherever you are in that point in time, do a double check. Don't just be like, well, I heard six months ago it was going to be this. So, you know, I pick six is so much less valuable. It changes even after the draft, obviously changes after the, the NFL season. However, overall viewpoint is that the 2027 draft class is very good. That is, it is a, is not a down draft year. And I think that's the thing that probably won't change by, by next year, especially with all the quarterbacks. Yeah, you think about what your 108 was, 109 in your draft this past year. It's like, it started to run dry with offensive skill position players. You're just looking up and you're like, I, I don't feel confident. Am I taking, I don't know, Jonah Coleman here at the back of the first round. And I think part of the process, honestly, after the top four or five, if you were in a superplex. Yeah. I, you were early in drafts going, okay, all right. Let's, let's take the guy that the Browns took. Yeah. And superflex the order of quarterbacks. Like right now, it has shifted so much already. And we haven't even started the college football season. We think about the end of the college football season where Trinidad, Chameless, the Ole Miss quarterback was and then he had his legal battles. And now he's kind of slowly dropped to like, yeah, he's a top 10 quarterback, but he's not a first round pick by most people's accounts. Here's the variables. Okay. So right now it's the end of July NFL teams. We don't know who has those picks. And so who will be picking those players? That's going to be something that's up in the air. College teams, right? Are they going to perform or are these players going to like take a step back? I know that that Penn State team, I hate bring this up, but it was a disappointing year. It was terrible. It was like, I would, I would have been sad to spend money to go to Penn State games this past year. Well, good thing the in-laws have the season tickets. I mean, come on. But it was like, it was such a step back from what the preseason expectations were. There's injuries. And then the one that I was looking out the running backs, the three top running backs are K1 Lacey with Ole Miss Jaden ball out of Florida and a mod hearty out of Missouri who was recently shot. And he's recovered from that. The three top running backs all have three brand new systems this year. Like brand new play callers, the offense is going to change. And maybe that's a good thing. I don't know. But like that's a variable that when you look at their film from this past year, we would do the same thing in the NFL. It's like, this is a different system. How are you going to adjust? Like the college teams are doing that too, especially with the transfer portals and coaches flying all over the place. So those are the things that each position, but especially the running back position. Like, I just don't know what I don't know a year from now. What's going to happen? For sure. And I mean, I don't even want to put this out there, but we need to assume health on these guys too, right? Which unfortunately is part of the game. Yeah. And you're dying to stay pick, right? Like you don't know what you don't know about your team and what pick you're going to have. And you hope you have a top three pick. But let's say you end up with a 105 or 106. Like, those are the things that change. So I'm not saying to be paralyzed by this. I'm just saying, let's not make dogmatic and blanket statements of things we just don't know. Like the Alabama wide receiver that we've talked up a lot, Ryan, the artist formerly known as Ryan Williams, but now he's Ryan Coleman Williams. He's right now in the latest mock drafts. It's a consensus. 30 second overall player on the board. Like it's been a slow decline over the last year for a player that after a freshman year, it's like this dude is going to be one of the dudes. And we'll see he could he could rebound be totally fine. But just if you would have made up your mind about Ryan Williams a year ago, then you wouldn't have been open to things changing. That's all I want to say. So if you're rebuilding, you should be happy. And we will have all the players highlighted. We personally do not start the scouting process. So Jason is not going to go in and watch every single person's film because we got the NFL. We got a lot of other things. And I will, but not until the NFL seasons over. I already did it this year. Yeah. And I think it's fine. Like I think some people like beg us to do both at the same time. But I don't think there's like a giant rush. And on this show, we turn the page when we get to January, we talk about prospects, get to do all that. But we'll check in a couple of times. I know we'll probably do a quick question or so where we get to talk about our favorite players. Anybody's willing? Anybody we like? So Dante Moore at Oregon, spoiler. I like him. Early Micah. Sure. In 2029. That's what it's going to end up being there. Anyway, let's take a quick break. And we'll talk about some Titans. I did do a little bit of a look ahead at the 2027 Titan class. And I don't know if you came across this Jason when you're doing Kenyan's to the film. But the other Titan on the Oregon team, Jamari Johnson, there's a couple of times I remember watching Sadeek film like, I think I like him just as much. And I wasn't trying to be hot. Take you like I liked him. Yeah. I mean, that is the forgiveness to Sadeek's poor profile like the counter argument to why he didn't have a thousand yards. And you know, his his counting stats weren't that high for such a talented such a highly drafted player. You compare him to, you know, what Bowers did. And you're like, it's not remotely close. Well, you the argument is that he played with another stud tied in on the same roster that might be the better tight in. So yeah, I did, I did see some of that. It actually ironically reminds me of Lad McConkey, who his numbers weren't nearly as good as his talent. And you needed to forgive it because he played with Brock Bowers. Yeah. That's that's such a funny part of us like doing evaluation for players is like for some players, I'll forgive them because I can see the path and other players. I'm like, I don't get it. And I don't understand and I don't see what the NFL sees, but there's some nuance to all this stuff. But we're going to talk tears with tight ends. Let's go for it. Dynasty rankings. So I got to ask you guys on your main dynasty teams. Are you blessed with having a top tier tied in? Just think about your main two of them. Yes. Let me ask you a follow up question. Who is a top tier about Kyle Pits? Is he a top tier dynasty tight end bets? No, no, I know because when Kyle asked the question, I thought of obviously Bowers, Trimic Bride, and then last year's big two, which I mean, Fanon hadn't asked me, but most people will still put Mr. Loveland, except for Kyle. He would never do this. But we would put Mr. Loveland kind of in that third tier, most likely with Tyler Warren and those two will always be attached at the hip again, Kyle would literally never ever do this. But those two, I think are in that conversation. Hates that, dude. No, so in our main dynasty league, I'm sitting there rocking with Kyle Pits and then I've got Mark Andrews and Isaiah Likley. I do have Trimic Bride in Dino Jr. though, which is really fun. Went from Kelsey to McBride. What's funny, Jason, is you have Pits in that league who used to be on our roster and we made a decision last year. Are we trading away Pits? Are we trading away Tucker Kraft? And it was part of a deal. We didn't feel like we needed it. We had Kelsey at the time. And we went back and forth. I'm the Falcons fan, Owl is the Packers fan. So we're kind of split up. Oh, yeah. What we should do. And I just gave it to Jeremy. I said, what do you want to do? Let's roll with Tucker Kraft and we feel so good about it now. Oh, of course you do. Nice. I will trade you Kyle Pits for Tucker Kraft straight up. And he's, I don't know if you know this Tucker Kraft's injured right now. Really? Do you accept that number run again? And Kyle Pits is still like 21, right? He's actually, is it 25 now? Yeah, he's about to be 26. Yeah. So. So he's just hitting his peak production for Titans. He's going there. We're so back. We're going through these tears and I will give you a couple of stats as we go through each tier about these players. And I focused on what do they do in the red zone? And then what did these Titans do in 11 personnel versus 12 personnel? So there are some offenses that function away. We're two Titan sets is what they do. And it's really, and it works really well. There are other offenses that when they go to 11 personnel, it actually hurts the Titan. But Kyle Pits weirdly enough. Like he has backward splits where when there's three wide receivers on the field, he has a much bigger target share because the team didn't have any other wide receivers last year. So it's like, we think of the Titan position as being kind of like its own thing. But even when you go in 11 personnel, what kind of Titan is this and what kind of pass catchers does this team have? Do they have people that can compete for targets? Or is it nobody like the Falcons? It was, you know, literally nobody else in the Dept chart. And then we're going to see what we're going to do. bought from heaven tier because Clint Kubiak this off season when he was asked about Brock Bauer's the first thing out of his mouth. He said he is a football robot from heaven. It was when I failed and he's not wrong. Does he belong by himself? Yeah, he does belong by himself. If I were, you know, I've got McBride, I would trade McBride plus to go get powers. I think powers one outscores him this year. So already, I think he's a better just redraft tight end. And two, he's three years younger than McBride. So you know, you're talking about we look at dynasty windows usually in three year stretches because we're not the type of show to say I want to build a superpower a decade from now someday because those just never work. You want to build a team that can win a championship now and that you look at these three year windows of players that are going to be great. A three year age gap is massive between those guys considering that the younger one might be the better one. No, you know, no insult to Tremac Bride's talent. But yeah, I mean, for dynasty, Brock Bauer's is absolutely in his own tier. And I don't think you can trade for him. You can't. I tried. I mean, I think it like I'll bet if I traded Tremac Bride in a one someone would take that deal because they'd be like, okay, but I'm funny about that too much. I was going to bring up that example because I have Tremac Bride in a tight and premium league and last year was unbelievable. Like, what a beautiful. And so I tried to capitalize on the end of season run that he had kind of understanding. We might get some regression for Tremac Bride. Like just the number of routes he ran the garbage time with Jacobi, Marvin Harrison, and you're et cetera. Like I want to be in on bours and the manager that had bours was not you're not seeking this by anybody. They wanted a first on top of Tremac Bride. And that was like, yeah, I love bours. Obviously, but I don't know that I've do a first to move up to this tier. What would you guys draw the line a second? Two seconds cost. You're saying what would you do? I was not comfortable doing the first plus Tremac Bride. And I wouldn't be either. I don't want to give up a 27 first to just get younger at a position. And that's really primarily what you're doing. I think I would do a second. I think I would do Tremac Bride in a second for bours. But I don't know that that gets it done. Yeah. I'm going to say like, I think to get it done across the table, if it ends up being the one or nine or one 10, I'm comfortable paying that price. Like I'm fine with that. But with bours, you're also adding in, we haven't really gotten like, there's another level ceiling that he hasn't hit yet. I know he was the tide. I agree. I agree. There's, there's like a, he breaks the position and anything that McBride did last year, which was setting a much records like he goes even further than that with Kubiak, the offense. I mean, there's still the variables of what the quarterback is. But he had a 32% first re target share when there are two or fewer wider receivers on the field. And I feel like that's what we're getting it all this year is 12 personnel, him, Michael mayor, and then who cares who's running around routes at wide receiver. And this like, if Brock Bours, what's the highest ceiling for like his target share this year? Could he hit 35% yes. Yes, he could on that roster with with no really no receiving options. I mean, you're, you're talking about your wide receiver one is Jalen, they look like Jack, Jack, Jack, Jack, for sure. Your wide receiver one is Brock Bours and he's not just a default. He's not Clay Matthew or who was it Clay? Who was Mr. Necessary? I know his name was Clay. Oh Charles Clay. Charles Clay. Mr. Necessary. He was a tight-in-one because they had no one else to throw the ball to, but he wasn't special. This is, this is truly a generational and that that is thrown out a lot, but it's deserved and actually the case for Bours. Yeah, Bours just for, to for context, if people kind of forget his last year, we had all this hype and excitement. And of course, he has the PCL injury in the first game. And in that game, he was going like Berserk against the Patriots. Comes back, it's slow. He's playing with the brace, took a couple weeks off, came back and was good again down the stretch. But just go back to the rookie year here into 153 targets as a 22 year old rookie. This guy is unbelievable. And I think he's going to break fantasy multiple times. Similar to what like Kelsey was doing in his prime, Groanken is prime, those types of seasons where it's like he is separating from the field in a way that it is just so powerful for your roster. And then you can lock that in for the next handful of years plus like this guy is he's the real deal. Through two seasons, he has 12 total touchdowns. Like, we're going to get a double digit touchdown season coming up. And he was much better inside the red zone last year with Gino. So yeah, there's a ceiling that he hasn't hit. And that's so enticing for somebody at this age. We don't need to talk anymore about powers. But man, if you could get him right now, it's only going to go up from here. I just, I just sent the offer out like Brad and the two. We'll see how long before it gets rejected. There you go. Speaking of Tramik, Brad, he's in tier two by himself. Do you think he belongs by himself in his own tier? I do. Yeah, it's tough because he asked me a month into the season. You know, because it, and obviously in Dynastie, you have to project. You've got the love and Warren and even fan and where if a month in you look like, okay, they, they are what we right now, they're hope. They haven't done it. We expect them to do it. And there's a lot of hope in around those guys. If they do it, they're, they usurp him. They, they are better than McBride because they're because they're younger. But right now, right now, it would be, well, put it this way. Here's, here's the best example of knowing if it's true or not. I just literally offered powers in a two for, for the road from heaven. Right. Yeah. I would try to two for, for powers. I would not, in any way, shape or form, offer, Tramock, Bride straight up for Loveland or for Warren today. I mean, that, that could turn out to be a mistake that Loveland could leap up into that tier. But there's just, there's, there's absolutely no guarantee. And Tramock, Bride is a guarantee. And for fantasy, I'm going to stick with the known commodity and not just chase. Oh, what if they, what if they turn into Tramock, Bride, you know, it's like, no, just, just because they're, they're younger alone isn't, isn't good enough. So yes, Tramock, Bride is definitely in a tier of his own. Yeah, I agree. I think like you said, some of those arguments you can make for Loveland and Warren. If it happens, but there is something that's still valuable in proof of concept. Like you've seen it, you'd trust it. You know what you're getting. And if you're talking about like a dynasty startup situation where you can reliably put this guy in your lineup every single week, nothing twice about it, there's so few of those guys in the NFL at Tide and obviously Tramock, Bride is one of those guys we think and we're hoping Loveland and Warren, except for Kyle will be those guys in the near future. But obviously, there's some projection like, like Jason said. So yeah, I do think he deserves to be in a tier of zone. I want to bring up one regression slash quirky stat with McBride just because it was so fluky. Whenever I find stats, we're doing research for the shows on like how normal is this? So he had 11 red zone touchdowns. He was awesome. He had, let's see, like, six coming into this for his whole career. But the weird thing is seven of them occurred between 11 and 20 yards to the end zone. So like not inside the 10 yard line. It's the most of any player since 2012. So like he caught it inside the red zone and then he ran another 10 to 15 yards to get the touchdowns. It's just not normal for people to do that and to continue to do that. Arizona led the NFL and passing touchdowns in this range of the field is just not a repeatable thing year over year for any player. The last time somebody did something like this, it was Eric e-Bron in that really big touchdown year. So his touchdowns will there should there should be regression. But I will say and another thing, you know, we talk about this in redraft. I don't think it's as big a deal in dynasty. The fact that there will be a quarterback change at some point, you will see Carson back on the field. Now we'll be very bad for Tramock, Brian. I was going to bring up the fact that a couple years ago when he was playing with Kyler Kyler doesn't throw many touchdowns. He just doesn't. He's good. He's good for fantasy because he runs. He rushes for touchdowns as well, but he doesn't throw a ton of touchdowns. So McBride always suffered in the pass catching touchdown world. Obviously with the change to percent who can throw touchdowns, it made a, you know, it should meet in the middle. You know, the expectation for McBride should be to get eight touchdowns. Just for context on Kyler's touchdown rate, 4.1% for a career touchdown rate. Not great. Four street seasons below 4% for Kyler. So like you talked about, it kind of held Tramock Bride back from a ceiling perspective. We all talked about, you know, there was the bit running two years ago. I remember it was like week 16 or week 15. He still hadn't caught a touchdown from Kyler. They were trying to force beating him to get it there. And then regression smacks him in the face this year with Jacobi Perset. And now it'll level off somewhere in the middle. But yeah, I mean, obviously from a reliability standpoint, there's not going to be anybody most weeks in weekly rankings. The only guy that'll be above Tramock Bride most weeks will be rock banners. Like just for what you're getting from a projection standpoint, he's, he's so rock solid. And I think sometimes to infanity, we can do the thing where we we like over, project regression. Like we did it with James Cook for a couple years where it's like, well, he's gonna regress, right? And he did, but like, to what degree, right? It was still-- - He saw more carries. - Yeah, he saw more carries. And it was regression did technically happen, but like he was still so awesome. I think the same thing could happen for someone like Tramit Bride, Matthew, staffer this year, like sure. It's such a down rate is coming down, but like maybe he throws 32 touchdowns this year instead of, you know, 40, whatever it was. Like the guy is still gonna be good for fantasy. The same is gonna happen for Tramit Bride. - Let's go to tier three. - Okay, I've got an update on my trade, on my trade offer. - You can tell exactly, there's no chance that somebody wants to do this. - It has not been seen yet. Other than by my co-manager, Mike, the fantasy hitman, right? He says, and I quote, "The hell you doing?" (laughing) He says, he's in a screenshot. It said, "I don't think this makes sense for our old man team, but he's wrong." He just doesn't see the upside and Bowers breaking the position versus just being the number one and three years younger. - When you've been this far with Mick Bride, it's one of those things here, you're like, "Man, this guy's, you've seen him since he was a pup, since he drafted him." - Yeah. - Look at him - Wait behinds efforts. - I mean, there's very little as a Cardinals fan to root for, but he's one. You know, it's like, okay, that's helpful as well. And it was always, they played out so perfect as a general manager of our franchise. We were riding Kelsey forever. And we reached on Mick Bride. We took him in the first round of that year 'cause we really believed in the talent. And we regretted the heck. We took him, it's hard to remember. We disgustingly made the mistake of taking him ahead of Jahan Dotson who went on to a great rookie season. And after the year, we're like, I guess we made a mistake. - I took off. - Yeah, I guess we made a mistake. We shouldn't have taken Mick Bride, but we just loved the town. We loved the film. But then we're back, baby. Zachert's got injured and he was like, "Yeah, that's the dude. That's the dude we knew." - Was he really a first round pick? Should I make a mistake? - No, he was a second round the NFL, but at first round-- - In our dinosaur. - Oh, I thought you were talking about the NFL draft. I was like, really, I don't remember that. - Yeah, second round. - Second round. - We reached, he wasn't a first round pick in Dynastie either. He was usually as a second rounder there. And, but we said, "Nay." What a stoop managers, you know? In the fake game we play, these guys saw. These guys knew. I guess these two are always gonna be intertwined in Tier 3, like Loveland and Warren. And it stinks that people have to take sides. You guys know what I'm talking about, right? Why can't we just-- - How much you hate warren, or Loveland, yeah. - Why can't we just like these players? And who they are, but also, I think it's because I love Tyler Warren so much that it looks like hate for Loveland. - Yeah, that is what it is. - I mean, to be fair, the college prospecting, when we were in that time, pre NFL draft, when for Kyle and I, we were much bigger fans of Tyler Warren than Colson Loveland. Colson Loveland wasn't a tackle breaker, dealt with injuries. Loveland was a dog. I mean, he was just out there. Three guys hanging on his back and getting extra yards. And so we really did prefer warren. Then you go into their rookie seasons and they both showed out. They both were like, they're great. Betts, you were higher on Loveland. And so I think those priors that you carry with you, you root for them to be right. And therefore you hate Colson Loveland. - Spot the line. - You're not? - No. - You know, I do. - I know, you do not hate Loveland. It's a bit on the show. So comparing these two guys, the way that I view them right now is that Loveland's upside is higher than warrens. I think that his talent, the way they use him, it feels more like a wide receiver sometimes, more down the field stuff. And Warren feels more, a little safer. To me, he feels safer because Roma Dunze and Luther Birdon are really, really, really legit target hogs. And I can easily see a world where all three of those players are very good in which case for fantasy, all three are frustrating and are not helping you win championships because they're too volatile. Whereas Warren, I don't, you know, I've got him as the clear leader in targets for this team. I think he will definitely have the most targets on this team. He's competing with Josh Down to I like, who's okay. Alex Pierce, they paid, but he's been there a long time. He's never been a target hog. He's, you know, more of a low volume high yards per catch time player. Maybe that'll change. Warren should be their number one target. Loveland, I believe I do. No, I think I have a room down for more targets, but he's right there with him. But should they both hit? Loveland will move a tear above Warren because he's two years younger than Warren. And if he hits that ceiling, then, you know, again, he'll probably use Sir McBride. I think that's well said. I don't really have too much to add there. I'm glad you pointed out the, the path for Warren because when we talk about these players, I think based off at least like redraft ADP, Loveland goes first. And so like if you are taking somebody in this tier and you're redraft league, like most people think of like Warren as the consolation prize in this tier, but I want to point out for people like, I really think Warren has one of those unbelievable ceilings this year because of the way that Shane psyching schemes for his first read. And you know, Pierce coming off the ankle procedure, we think he might get off to a little bit of a slower start as he ramps up, Josh Downs. Look, I've traded for him this off season. I'm hopeful that he can break out in this, you know, new role. You're doing a lot of projection there. Like to me, it all comes back to Warren and how they scheme him. And I also was kind of thinking about the Dino Jones Achilles thing. Like if he can't push the ball down the field, what is the easy button for him to push for Shane's psyching? Tyler Warren in the intermediate area of the field all day. And so I think Warren has as much ceiling as love in this year, though I think in the general like redraft take for people, they don't view that the same way. So I love love and obviously was my due last year and everything, but I do want to point out, I think Warren is one of those guys that has a real, real ceiling this year. Yeah, I think Jason, I was looking at your projections for Warren. It's like, you have him as the clear target leader for that team. I want to say it was like 130, 140 targets, which is wild to be able to say about a tight end, love, Lynn, I'm not so sure, but in doing a deep dive on the bears, like Ben Johnson for all his brilliance, like he just, I just was so impressed that he didn't want a baby Caleb. He could have done that and come in and be like, okay, well, Caleb has some issues. Let's not do it. They kept targeting the intermediate part of the field, which is what we want in a quarterback and what's we want, what we want for our pass catchers and love, Lynn, if you just look at that back half of the year, he was targeting on 38% of his intermediate routes. It was like the bowers type of usage. So when you set his upside, Jason, like a year or two from now, like I have no idea what loveland could be. And it could be like he sees 150 targets in a season in an offense, which is crazy because we think this offense, I think long term is set up better than what the cults are. The cults are going to have to figure out a year from now. Josh Downs and on the roster figure out with Jonathan Taylor, is Daniel Jones still a thing is striking still the coordinator, the bears. I was going to ask you guys about striking like what's your comfort level there? Because it doesn't feel like the clock is ticking on. They had the success last year, which they obviously had the unfortunate injury with Daniel Jones and it was all just taken from them. But like it kind of feels like at some point they need to see more in the playoffs for striking to keep his job long term. And then you have question marks on play color. So I do think if you're breaking ties here, like just trusting Ben Johnson and Caleb Williams over Daniel Jones and potentially changing staff in a year or two, would be enough for me to break the tie. Stiking will staking eight eight nine and eight nine. And he's been on the hot seat the last two years. And I don't necessarily think that's been fair to him. I believe he's a good coach. I did. If he were to go eight and nine this year, sub 500, and I was the general manager, I'd keep him around and you're going to have to sift through the fan noise because fans will want him gone. But I also think he'll be gone. If they go eight nine, I think I think stikens gone. Yeah. Now, last little question about this tier because we've kind of talked about what would it take to move up a tier? I feel like if I had one of these players, I'm not, I'm just waiting. They're so young. I'm not waiting to try to pay up to get a bowers or McBride. Like I'm ready. I'm just happy. I had a home run with my rookie pick and I'm just going to stay here. If I, if I could move up to Bowers, you know, like Loveland, if I had Loveland, I would offer Loveland and a one for Bowers knowing that it probably costs more. Yeah. I mean, I'm just saying I would offer it and some people are insanely crazy for Loveland. So it's really a person to person. Like if some people think Loveland is just going to be in the same tier with Bowers and then they get the first round or yeah, let me pull the trigger. Maybe you catch them while they're drinking. Who knows what the situation is. But at the left side, if I had Loveland and I'm not a complete rebuild, if those two things are true, I would go, I would go offer Loveland and a first for Bowers. Bowers on a, on a startup brand new dynasty. I mean, you can, you can make the argument that he should be going like pick four pick. I mean, he's a first round pick in your rankings. Yeah. Oh, yeah. He should be because he should be. Yeah. Not for Mike and Andy, but I noticed that in your rankings, Jason and one quarterback startup, like he's a firm first round pick for you. And then super flex. I could see him be at that one to turn. Let's, let's do this to you real quick. Tier four, I'm calling it punchy in the face because I feel like these are the dudes. If I had them on my NFL roster, like these dudes can run over people. It's Harold Fanon Jr., who was like one of our favorite film watches from college, Tucker Kraft, who might be the hardest tight end to tackle in the NFL or at least like he can put people on the ground. And then Sam LaPorta, who has suddenly become a household name, a best buddy. And when you think about all the time, these three together in this tier, how do you guys feel about grouping these guys together? Yeah. I mean, I think it makes sense there, there are different archetypes. You've got the more boring Sam LaPorta, but on the best offense, you know, the highest scoring opportunities offensively. Obviously, the young Harold Fanon, who is on the worst offense imaginable and yet and now has more target competition, but he's very young and all he's done, his entire career playing football is dominate statistically at every level. And so, you know, including the NFL. So why won't it keep happening? And everyone's darling is Tucker Kraft, everyone's. I mean, like I said earlier, I will offer you cow pits for him right now. Official offer? Yeah. No, send it in. Well, we'll talk to just verbal, verbal official offer. No, we need it. I need it on my desk. Yeah. All right. I'll send that in. I think this is appropriate. You know, the next year we'll have pits and I would trade pits for any of those guys. Green. I want to point out one Tucker Kraft statistic when they had three wide receivers on the field, which is one of those Packers conversations we've been having for years, right? Like who's who's the is Jayden read on the field? Is he not in a field? Who's he's on the field? When Tucker Kraft was on the field and three wide receivers on the field, he averaged 2.92 yards per out run. Like he was awesome in arguably, I think they're best pass catcher when everybody was there. Yeah. I knew too. And there's so much argument about the three wide receivers. And are they really good or not? Christian Watson's best case to healthy blah blah blah blah. Seems like your best weapon with the ball on his hands was Tucker Kraft. That's my biggest pushback on the Christian Watson talk from you guys. It's just like when Tucker Kraft was on the field and Christian Watson on the field, like he just didn't dominate the targets. Tucker Kraft was the main guy now. Tucker Kraft has a bunch of touchdowns that like you punch someone, put them in the ground and then you take it to the house. Like he can do that. Those aren't the easiest to project long term. But of this group, like I think he would be my favorite. He needs a contractor's tension though. That's the thing I don't have with him. They've already talked about it. I mean, there's multiple beat reporters saying it's going to get done at some point in training camp. So maybe by the time this comes out, it's already happened. But yeah, I think the thing with Kraft that's so encouraging is like when he is the focal point of the offense, they can use him in like different depths of the field. Like you think about his ability with your ball on his hands on like a screenplay. You might be the best in the league at this. I mean, power is obviously great too. Like he's just so unstoppable with the ball on his hands. And then you think about his ability to run some of those routes in the intermediate area of the field. He can do all that stuff. And so there are very few tight ends in the league that you can actually like build your offensive game plan around. I think the floor knows he can do that with Tucker Kraft. And so maybe for the second year in a row while we're all debating Jane Reed and Christian Watson and all these, you know, question marks at White receiver. It's like, oh, yeah, it was Tucker Kraft the whole time. And he's one of those guys that just kind of vaults up up to here. I wouldn't be surprised by that. If he has another good season. Now the only thing is he is coming off the ACL. So perhaps a little bit slower start. But regardless, I mean, he is a rock solid guy to have in your dice roster. Kraft and LaPorta could easily end up with 10 plus touchdowns. As you start moving down the tiers, you're like, which are the guys that could have the outlier touchdown season? These guys, I did have one quick question about Harold Fanon because the offense that the Browns had last year was not an NFL offense. And therefore, he earned targets at a level that like, it's just not normal, like a normal flowing offense doesn't work that well. So I just asked like what Todd Monk and the way that the offense should function, like, would it shock you if he like dropped in target share? Now there could be some more targets. No, if Fanon, I mean, the scariest thing about Fanon to me is that you just took a first round in a second round, White receiver, the target competition. If you look around at, this has kind of been my argument a little bit against love, and which I don't, I mean, I don't hear what I'm not saying. I'm not arguing against love, but if you look at pretty much every grade, a super, great tight end for fantasy football, they are at worst, the two on their team always. They're at worst, the two, usually the one, but more than that, it's, it like, it's tapped it to, you know, it was, it was Kelsey and Tyreek. And then there wasn't really a third option to go to, you know, when, when, when, when Groanck was Groanck, when, whoever it is, Borders is alone, McBride is alone. You know, when it was, was Andrews, there wasn't a bunch of other White receivers. It's always that way. You are one of only two targets, if not one of only one target to really be a sensational super star in fantasy football. One could still be that because conception and it's all Boston are unproven. But if, but last year was, you know, you're talking about fan and and Jerry Judy, who is proven to not be great. And so, you know, make money, make money doing it. I mean, good, go, go get that money. Man, I loved, I, I really did think Jerry Judy in the college, the college tape of Jerry Judy, where he was drafted. I thought he was going to be a lot better than he is. I think most people in the NFL did too. But yeah, I mean, Harold Fanon benefited from a lack of target competition. And now he could still say, I am the target leader. He could lead the steam in targets, but it will absolutely be more difficult because there is legitimate competition now. For sure. I think there's, there's one counterpoint, I guess two counterpoints on that, but I agree with your point, Jason, just thinking about like Rangie Bocchums. We all approached Fanon last year, whether it was as a rookie prospect in Dynasty or as a redraft like sleeper. A lot of people, including us were like, this is probably going to take a little time, you know, small school, making the leap, all those things. David and Joku is there in like in the first game of the season. They had him and different coaching staff, but they had him in like wild cat formations. And they had him as the target earner and like doing all sorts of stuff out of the backfield, like just get this guy at the ball. That is the game plan. It's happening in week one of his first NFL season. And now you have a play collar in a coach in Todd Munkin who we need to be careful doing this because not these players are not the same. We get in trouble doing this at times. But if you just look at like his tight end usage in recent seasons, obviously with Baltimore, Mark Anderson as they likely go back to when Todd Munkin was at Georgia, he had rock bars. He's not afraid to feature the tight end in his offenses. And so I do think while those those concerns are valid because the wide receivers are better this year, I still think it's potentially likely that Harold Fanon is leading this team in targets. He had a 31% first re target share in 12 personnel, but then just 14% when there are three wider receivers on the field. So it'll be interesting to see how he functions, how the offense functions with Munkin. And the last thing I'll say is I feel like my price for Fanon, if I drafted him last year, is different than where I'd take him in a startup because I can a startup. It kind of feels like no man's land to figure out where he goes. But if you drafted him last year, you're like, sweet, this was freehouse money. He was a third round pick. So that those are the things that I always like go back and forth with like man in a startup. He's our Titan five, but I don't know if I want to draft him as the Titan five. Yeah. So let's hit quick break and then we'll finally finally talk about Kyle Pits. All right. And tier five, I have a bunch of young bucks in here with Kyle Pits. So he's the, he's the old guy of this tier. Kyle Pits, Rana Gadson, Eli Stowers and Kenyan Sedeek. So it's funny to look at Pits as the elder statesman. I think that these guys will not be in this tier next year. They're going to be moving some up, some down, but like this is a volatile group. I'll just say like I would not feel comfortable with any of these guys this year being my one. You just kind of live with the ebbs and flows, but a year from now, I feel like there's going to be a lot of movement in this group. For sure, big time movement because there's so many question marks on. Gadson's role with the new scheme and how many Titans they have and Eli Stowers, you know, is kind of a project at the next level. Like most people are thinking he might for lack of a better term, like kind of red shirt this year for the most part of play limited snaps and be a part time player. And then Kenyan Sedeek, who knows, you know, rookie Titans are kind of a mixed bag. I know historically it's been great for first round. Titans recently, but Sedeek seems like more of one of those guys who could get off to a slower start in the NFL. So, and then there's just the jets on certain tier quarterbacks. back and play collar and head coach. And so there's just so many moving parts of those three. I think including pits in this tier is a little unfair to him if I'm being honest. I don't know, I wouldn't put him with a reporter in those guys, don't come here wrong, but I think he might have his own loans. I'm totally fine. His own mini-tier ahead of this. - His own single tier like, his like, his. - It's not even in a row. It doesn't even like go if we want to. It's just in its own multiverse. - It is also, it is also worth saying, there is a world that exists where Kyle Pits becomes a dominant force in fantasy. I genuinely, I'm not going to rule that out of existence. - I think about it most days. - Yeah, it's a falcon fan, but I'm not a falcon fan. Obviously Kyle Pits was drafted to be great. That's one that it was thrown around as a generational prospect that turned out to not be great. Now obviously, 1000 yards is a rookie. Then dealt with injuries. Really hasn't looked the same since those injuries. Then last year, he finishes what? The Titan 2, Titan 3, something like that. - Titan 2. - A lot of that was injuries to those who were outscoring him on a per game basis. Tons of players, whether it was the injuries to the quarterback in Tyler Lawrence case or the player, Kittle and Tucker Kraft. Then there's the excuse, which is also a fact that Kyle Pits did the vast majority of his work in games that Drake London was not in. But there is also the reality that he did amazing work in the games that Drake London missed. He stepped up and was a dominant force on an NFL field, which was what they drafted him to be. There is very little other target competition here. We talk about for a Titan to succeed, you gotta be at worst the second target. I don't think Zachariah Branch is coming in here as a five pound rookie and dominating targets. Maybe he does, but more than likely, I mean, obviously B-Jones is gonna also dominate targets, but more than likely, you have Kyle Pits as the number two target down the field. And so there's a world where what he did last year, they paid him money. He just ends up being more involved and better. And whether it's physically better removed from the injuries of the past, whether it's mentally better removed from the noise of being a bust, he might just come out this year with a new team, a new regime, Stofanski's used the Titan in the past and establish himself as a weekly consistent player who is still young. He's not like, you know, because of last year because there were really five rookie tight ends that made an impact. It, you know, Gatsden, Fanon, Loveland, warrant. Okay, so four. And, you know, those guys are mostly in, you know, 22. And so 25 sounds old, but 25 is not old. Kyle Pits has still got, you know, that three year window of his prime. So before we move on, I do want to say, if you are a believer in Pits, I don't think it's insane. And I do believe a world exists where he ends up becoming a dynasty, like at the end of this year, you go, oh, he's, you know, he's two tiers higher. - I don't think that's crazy. I think I, it's so hard when I think about what Stofanski's been good at, which is running the ball, 12 personnel. You'd think that Pits would benefit from being in 12 personnel. And yet, like, there's so many things of how they functioned as an offense. And I know I'm super biased, where it's like, he was just erased from the play. He's erased from the conversation, despite like there being fewer white receivers on the field. He's just like a, I don't know how he fits into the NFL at all. - Yeah, and the hope here is that that was coaching and skiing and play design and that the new staff coming in is going to ground up, get him involved. And we'll, we don't get to find out until the season plays out. - Yeah, I don't have too much to add 'cause it's well documented at this point with Kyle Pits that it's been a little bit of a frustrating roller coaster. I do think there is something though to be said about just the, like uncertainty in those first couple seasons where Kyle mentioned it, like the role, like what are you in the NFL? Are you a big slot? Are you kind of a move tied in? Can you play in line or not really? And sometimes it just takes players more than like, a year or two to figure that out. And then you add on the injuries and the scheme that was ever changing with the Falcons because they keep changing play collar and everything. And it takes some time for these guys. And so all in all is to say is I think Kyle Pits is a very wide range of outcomes where I grew a Jason. Like I don't think I would have said this two years ago, like I could see him being a second contract guy that you're like, dude, Kyle Pits is unbelievable in this new scheme. The team is paying him to be a feature part of their offense because that could change any year, right? He's only on the franchise tag. So who knows where he's playing next year? I think he'll make a lot of money for agency assuming he has a good to solid year this year. And so I do think there is ceiling with Kyle Pits, which is crazy to say because we've been so frustrated so long, but like Jason said, you don't just step on a field and yesterday he cleaned him up and do what he did. So like I think Kyle Pits is an interesting trade for target because he's not gonna cost you much. Like people are so annoyed of Kyle Pits and the frustration and all these things. Like I don't know what it would take to get him, but I think that he's at least worth poking around on. Especially if you have like a kind of stable but like boring veteran that you can plug in, you're not gonna win your league with, I don't know, who's your tight in them one? Like Mark Andrews or - James Sulton. - Yeah, like those guys are fine, but you're not gonna win your league. Like there is a world that exists. Perhaps it's a very small possibility, but it exists where Kyle Pits can be that second contract guy that we've seen so many times in the NFL that I'm with Jason. I think he's really interesting. - So Kyle, did I talk up your local guy enough to get Tucker Kraft? - You did. You get a great argument. He is in the second contract. He signed the extension in June after the. - I thought he was on the franchise tag. - He was franchise and then he signed a three year extension. - Okay. - Well, I'm gonna do it. - Well, but I mean, the point is, he's in the second contract. - He's still second contract. He's still be a second contract guy. - No, I know, but I thought he was a free agent next year. - Yeah, funny enough. I mean, we bring up Greg Olson a lot of times, like as a perfect example, there's plenty of others of the show and others, but Greg Olson was the best example of team wasn't using him, right? It switches over to Carolina and then it's like, oh, oh, okay, you are a dominant force. You don't necessarily have to switch teams if the coaching staff and the players around you switch. So he's switched by remaining in Atlanta. - All right, I gotta ask you. We didn't mention really these guys in this tier. Have you heard anything about Arun De Gatson for the last two months in the summer? - No, I haven't heard anything about Arun De Gatson. Gatson is living on film, a short stretch of being dominant, a pedigree of coming from NFL stock, youthful upside, a production profile in college, it was great. Everything pointed towards pure and utter young dominance on a great offense. Arun De Gatson, the second who was last year's rookie for the chargers. However, now it seems like they brought in Nijoku, which temporary blip in the map. - And Kohler, who was a three year deal. - Yeah, three year deal paid him some money. They want to run with Titans, I think, more as well. And so, I don't know. I was hot and bothered for a month of his rookie season and believed the breakout. - It's funny that David and Nijoku really did, it was the ALS Ice Bucket Challenge level of just like, and it's at this point in time, should we really be that afraid of David and Nijoku at this stage of his career in a dynasty league? Like, that shouldn't change our opinion of what we thought of him last year. I don't care about Nijoku. I care about the offense, how it functions, and I hate saying it, but like, charlie Kohler's giving me on the field so much like Will Dizzley was to the point of like, how is this team? And then they go into three wide receiver sets. It's like, he's competing for targets. Like, I have him on a team. I tried to trade in this off season. And at the end of the day, he kind of left in this blobville. We haven't tied in nine. Like, a year from now, he could be tied in 15, sadly. - Yeah, he could also jump up. I mean, what he did show was exceptional ball skills, athleticism as a receiving tight end. He was great. And keep in mind while they did bring in Nijoku because they want to end Kohler, they want to run more two tight end sets. They, as of this moment, did lose Keenan Allen who had 122 targets. And so we've talked a lot about how that affects Lad Mokonky, but targets, you know, targets in the middle of the field, they don't just go to one player. And so, I don't know, maybe I'm talking myself back into the feelings I had watching him break out last year. - Did he just do like a full, like emotional circle of light? Here's where I was. - I saw the whole thing happen right in front of my eyes. - I had a fling and then it came down. But you know what, that was a good little fling we had. We went on a couple of dates. It was nice. - Yeah, I didn't do a 180 or a 360. That was a funny video. I went all the way around and a half again. They said it couldn't be done. Also Eli Stowers, I've only heard negative things, which is he's not ready. That's what I keep hearing. I mean, to play NFL tight end. Yeah, I'll say this. Which makes sense. I was just researching whatever I could find on Eli Stowers earlier today. And the vibe is basically like early, early, early, early. There was kind of the report that he was invisible. That was what the word was being used. That was during the mini camps. Then he got injured. This is nothing yet. People all of a sudden from like the first day of pre-pre-practice is like, oh, he wasn't great. Let's pump the brakes a little bit on the bad news from, I feel like you're looking at a, it feels like I'm looking at smoke in the distance that's too far away to call that a forest fire. That might be someone's backyard barbecue and we're like, there's something man. There's something, just like give it a breath. Obviously his roster spot is completely secure. They spent on him, he's the future. This year's outlook is not secure at all. - Yeah, for sure. This is a guy I wouldn't change my opinion on for Dynasty. I don't wanna say no matter what happens this year, but like your expectation for him on your roster is he's a developmental tight end that will take some time in NFL and you knew that when you drafted him because he just started playing tight end recently at Vanderbilt. And so it's gonna take time for him 'cause he's been kind of a hybrid slot wide receiver type of guy. It takes time with these guys. And so he's in that bucket of like, at the end of the year you looked up and he only had 20 catchers and 200 yards. Nobody should be surprised by that. I will say with Dallas Goddard, it's kind of funny. They've been kind of like trying to move on for a couple of years from him and he keeps taking a pay cut like one year deals to keep coming back. And so I do think like Jason said, Starras is the future Goddard for this year. So don't be surprised if it's a slow start to his NFL career. - It's kind of like Terrence Ferguson last year. You have a couple of deep shot plays. He shows up every once in a while, but he's in a tight end rotation and like, so you don't abandon the long-term outlook, but you could just say for this year, it's probably gonna be a little bit lower down. That's gonna do it for this episode. If you want all of our dynasty rankings, you can find the Dynasty pass. You can find them in the app. And we will be back again next week as we get into August. Talking about preseason, training camps. It's here. Goodbye. (upbeat music) Thanks for listening to the Fantasy Footballers Dynasty podcast. If you wanna take your dynasty skills to the next level, check out the fantasyfootballers.com.