Daryl Palumbo

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How crazy with that behavior, or anything. And it gets real big. And if you sometimes have to play a bunch of shitty bad notes to get it to that, you make it smash, you get it to that. That's cool to hear you talk about it that way. How you doing? What would you say the most significant thing that's happened to you in the past five years? That seems like a good amount of time that you would say an old friend should know about. That's five years. Well, the last two years, the last nine years ago. That's pretty much like that. You have a nine year old. Yeah. That's the biggest thing. How are you enjoying it? Wonderful. Yeah. Yeah. More than anything. I've enjoyed it more than anything I've ever gotten to do. Is it like you thought it would be? Yeah. Yeah. Totally. And like everyone says it is when you're like, when you have kids and then you find out what that means, even though you understand what it means. Oh yeah. You're experiencing it is a different thing. Absolutely. Completely different. That's pretty good. It's so wonderful. You have children, yeah? I have two kids. No, yeah. I'm not kids anymore. How old? They're adults. How old? My daughter, Kate, is 18. She just graduated high school. My son, Sparrow, is 16 and he's still got two years left to school to his dismay. He's like ready to fucking go. I can't even imagine having two children. Yeah. And it's still rocking. Yeah, it's funny, man. I was just just talking to my brother, Josh, like on the way in here. I was listening to your music. It's really good. Oh. It's always been good. But it's not. I revisited it. It's been a while. It was really nice. Listening to it. And then I called my brother, Josh, as I have like a process when I'm on the way in here that like is, is whatever. It's like, I was talking to my brother, Josh. And we were talking about the kids and he was like, I was like, I'm just, I just kind of show up, keep up. Move to the right. Okay. I moved to the right. Move to the left. Okay. I moved to the left. But it feels like, it's funny, man. Yeah. Kids would definitely tell you what the fuck is up. Oh, yeah. Definitely. Every minute my life is thrown by my child. Yeah. I dig it. Yeah. It's humbling. And I'm old. And it makes me realize that I'm not, I'm not the shit. It's good. Yeah. Oh, it's really good. It's humbling. Yeah. It's like the sobering, grounding reality, when we do what we do for a living or whatever we call this. It can be a bit like fantasy sometimes or it's total detachment from society and all capacity. Yeah. Totally. Yeah. That's like the most grounding experience. You come off the roof of five minutes, have a child that's like, I'm an earthling. Yeah. Very much. You remind it of you. Yeah. How tiny you are. It's like you're being torched by nature and you're humbled and calmed down for a second. Like, oh, shit. Is it easy for you to settle back into what would I call it, civilian life? Oh, it's, yeah. I'm not good at anything but that air. You enjoy that? Oh, yeah. I'm a civilian. Yeah. Very much. I'm a total frailie. Yeah. Oh, my god, yeah. Routine. Totally. Kind of an emity, calm routine, school, taking a child to school. It was really nice. Oh, it's so nice. The mornings are really nice like my favorite when they're young. Oh my god. It's our time. Yeah. Oh, it's my favorite. I'll cry right now. Think about it. This is the last day of school yesterday. Yeah. Same. Yeah. My son's high school. That's great. Did you always prefer that? Or was there, I mean, I feel like when you're young, it's just, you don't really, you're like, there's no way that couldn't be more fun just wiling out. But escaping. And then you escape. And you realize you, you're like hiding in that lifestyle and you're like, okay, six years of past, seven years of past, and you're like, shit, they're dirty. I mean, it's easy to like, I don't know, you like it. You start thinking about it after a while, you're like, do I like this? I don't even know. Am I just doing this? Is this getting me, I'm playing every market on the earth repeatedly. Yeah. And like, what is this doing? Like I'm just emerging money, not living at home, learning how to write checks and stuff. You're a rhythm, a daily rhythm in my adult life. Yeah. You know, like, I don't know. Don't know the certain point. I was like, this is not fried. I don't need to do this if I'm not, if it's not guaranteed to work, I'm not doing it. I feel the same way. I feel like, and so this brings me to you. You have to make peace with the idea that, okay, there's going to be groups of people. So I would say you are one of those special artists that, if I said like, your favorite bands, favorite band. Right. And the other type of thing. Yeah. That's funny. Yeah. It's true. Yeah. And not just that, but you get to enjoy that while also having what I would say is like, you have really, really hardcore fans who I would say shaped a bunch of aspects of their taste, their ideas, their relationship with music around and from your art. So not just glass shop, yeah, yeah, right, yeah, head automatica. That's the favorite bands, favorite bands, that's funny. So that can be a really cool thing and can be really, it can feel really great, but I also imagine it can be a bit of a ball and chain in some ways and stuff is, you know, sometimes you're like, better, you better the cross of doing something weird and then you're like, well, well, never succeed. This is not supposed to succeed. And it succeeds just enough that it may affect certain people who are make music. Something's just appeal to people who are like a creative type, more than it might appeal to this mass audience. And I think maybe we just, maybe we just did that to this a bit of, you know, but like before we get to now, because I, because I was, when I, when I thought about, okay, when I talked to Darryl, do I start now or do I go back and here we are? So it doesn't really matter. I guess now. Do you ever feel like constricted by the art you made? Did you know you were doing that or were you just fonding out the art or throwing the paint on the wall and going, I like this. Okay. It was always super uneducated, I think, and as far as me and Justin were a little, it was just like hardcore like, oh man, hardcore is starting to get psychedelic. We want to do that. As soon as hardcore got psychedelic, we just wanted to do it. Psychedelic hardcore. Yeah. Yeah. As soon as shit became like New York City got a little zany, but you guys took it further. Yeah. I mean, yeah. 'Cause I guess so. Yeah. We were show, you know, the sound was a little show weird down there. Yeah. Yeah. It was just still playing songs. It felt like you were punching holes in all of it. Yeah. That shit. Yeah. 'Cause we liked heavier shit. A lot of those guys were just a few years older and maybe they're the heaviest stuff that they were fucking with was like, you know, Jesus loves it and yeah, and rap type stuff. And that's brutality, you know, that's as scary as it gets, but at the same time, you know, it's nice that we also were from a time when like wildly expressive and intense, extreme music exists, you know, that didn't exist in the 80s the same way. Things like crazy blasts, blasting bands and this metal revolution that hit hardcore in the 90s. We had that kind of as a part of our universe too. We just wanted to make it that shit. And we wouldn't have thought that any of that would succeed. I just like New Wave and stuff like Castello, it's like my favorite stuff. I just wanted to sing on it too. I don't know why. I just sang a bunch on it and it was just like, maybe these are catchy, but it sounds like crazy music played by idiots, so I don't know. To me, that's what I heard. I heard like hardcore kids who weren't afraid. I think you're very similar to like a Damon Albarn and I love him so much. Well, that's interesting 'cause I think you are so similar to him. He's one of my biggest heroes. He's a hero. He's not constricted. No. So he's making Brit pop, but you can hear him playing. You can hear him like pulling in shit just if he likes it. And his songwriting is very much ironically to name him. He's very much fueled from a place that I am always fueled from a place of ladish, British pop music, right? Like sort of things that are sort of referential to the British invasion, right? I think at the end of the day, that's everything I do is always informed by this sort of McCartney and sort of ladish thing. Like every, the anti-hero, I keep pointing it to Elvis. It's like I was Castello. Like this sort of, yeah, lad, the anti-hero. Like I'm more of, I always embody that. I embody the concept of like a song that can also, it may be fully fucking off the walls and intense. but there's an idea of a song in it that always stays there. And then Damon Albarn is always inspired directly by bands that are my favorite bands, so. - It's also like, I can't explain it, but I have a few, there's a few singers and songwriters that I would say, I would put Elvis Costello in the same group as you, as Damon Albarn. As my, I have a friend, his name's Matt Koma, he's in a band called Winnecobulling League. He's from New York as well. And his songwriting is very much like, it's like squeeze. - That's my favorite band of all time. - Really? - Ever. - Okay, so, there's nothing I enjoy more than that ever. I hear it all over the place, and it's these little, it's these little choices that are interesting. - You're saying, you know, you understand that. You hear that, that you're very keen to that, 'cause you do that. - You hear those sort of bands, there's similar bands. He's very Paul McCartney, John Lennonese. - Yeah. - And it's really funny, it's like, it's like, these little choices that you hear in the songs that you go, you'd even say that, that's crazy. - And there's a few guys that I go, 'cause you can't try to do it, it just is in you. - You just dig it. - If you dig it, you've soaked it up. - Yeah, that's all I've listened to in my whole life. - I just did love it. - And that's what I hear. And it's so funny, because I hear in my friend Matt's music, and I always, I love his records. And that's what I love about the records. It's the little Easter eggs. - I know that's a surprise. - I know exactly. The other day we played with a band opened the other day on this run, and they were sound checking out as in the restroom, and I was, I heard it, I go, "Dude, that guy is nailing Graham Parker, "Elvis Costello right now." Whatever this tune is, just one dude, and he was playing tracks, and he opened the show, and I was like, "This dude nailed it." It nailed it, immediately he hear that thing. I was like, "Am I here?" That's it, Joe Jackson, Graham Parker, like the walls in the bathroom. I'm like, "I hear him." - Yeah. - That's it. This is my people. I hear my people playing right now. - It's funny, because I felt like I always wondered. So I didn't even know what I was going to talk to you about today, other than I want to talk about, I want to talk about the new stuff. I want to talk about where it's going, because I also think there's a hole in a place for it now, and it's great. - That's good to know. - And a different place. - I do. But I also think that it's interesting, 'cause when I think about you, I'm like, I feel like this artist got dropped in the body of a kid on the East Coast in a hardcore, in a time when hardcore music, and all of that was raising kids there. And I felt like this artist was born into this hardcore world. - The other guy goes, "I wasn't made for this time." - I mean, I really do feel a lot of times like this. - That's what I think. - Maybe I wasn't. I really do relate to so many things. Like I really connected my whole life with the anthrax, the bad brains, so many intense things. It really swept me into a place of fantastical, nothing existed, but single-pointed focus, single-pointed focus, nation of Ulysses, crazy fall on the floor, chain wallet, bands from San Diego in the early '90s. These things blew me over to where I was such a fan, but I do often think as I've gotten older, like I was, man, if I could have been 18 in 1977, I think I really would have. - That would have been interesting. - I feel like there might have been, if that's the way it works. - But it makes for a really, a really interesting body of work that you should be really proud of. - Well, thanks. - I hope you are. - I mean, yeah, I'm honored to ever make music that anybody bought. - I don't know, I don't deserve anything. Like it's like, everybody's good. - Everybody's good, right? Like everybody's good. And the more time goes by, I always said it, and everybody was like, you eat modest. Don't be modest, you're full of shit. Don't take a comp. Like I get it, like I do what I do, but everybody gets good. And then as the internet has happened, like when do we see people that are like, do you ever see anybody that you're like, "Yeah, he's not as good as Steve Vaat." Like it's just fucking 15-year-olds that are just like, through Osmosis or soaking in prodigal channels from a higher power of like insane, next-level talent. I feel like everybody's good. - But, you know? - I don't know. - I feel really lucky. I'm really lucky. - Good is good is good is different than special. - Yeah, no, no, you're right. - And I think you're special. - Oh, that's kind. - And I think that it's probably an odd place to sit. I'm not going to take compliments either. But in some way, shape or form, you hold it because you wouldn't still create if you didn't need to and a special person. - Yeah, like you feel proficient, right? Like you feel like, "Oh, I've done this so goddamn long." That's right, I can walk into a room, make something out of nothing. - And we still get a little like joy out of it. - Yeah. - And when you're done, you're like last night. - Yeah, last night there was moments where I was like, "We sounded great." I think we sounded exceptional, that was wonderful, too. - What was last night? - Like a Sacramento gold. - Are you guys wrong, tour? - Yeah, we're just, yeah, string, I had automatic issues. And then at the end, I have two last issues. I take warp tour or health test, warp tour? - One of the other. - Yeah, one of them. - You're familiar with them. - You've played them a few times. - One of the other, one of the other. - Not the same, but similar. - Similar, they'll be great. Jason, correct? - Yeah, Jason. - Yeah, those, and those shows are great right now. - That shit. - Yeah, they're great. It's like a, it's like a resurgence, right? I do feel like that's happening a bit. - Yeah, I would say beyond a resurgence, I'd say it's a, from my perspective, what's made these shows for us fun, since we've come back. Have you done a bunch of those types of? - We've done a bunch of rock festivals. - Must be huge. We did warp tour together. - Biggest of our life. - Oh, my God. Biggest of our life. - That's amazing. - Biggest shows of our life. - Quite positive. - Yeah. - And it's great. - Generational. There's older people there, and they're, you know, 35, the 45 old kids, with their kids. And it's a really like energetic. It's a cool energy. Different in a way, because when we were all doing it, it was new. It was kind of a new energy. This is different. It's in a great way. It's, it's really big. - That's awesome. - A big rock show. - Oh, that's cool. I mean, like you said, you get to play at this point. It's, it's different than being on the warp tour. You get to make the rules. - Yeah, yeah. - Imagine at this point, and play around with the lights and the fire and the video and all that shit. - Would you say, though, the shows are better? - Yeah, in a lot of ways. - Yeah, definitely. - Yeah, definitely. - It's so much love. - Yeah. - That's a feeling. - But also, are you guys are probably better? - Oh, definitely. - Yeah. - Yeah, we didn't play any notes in the beginning. You know, so many years, you're just on play. And that's just like a given, but you're executing the event. Like the matrix of this event is occurring, and people are soaking it in, and going batch it, and mashing, but like, we don't play a bunch of notes, and I'm sure I didn't sing a lot of notes. - Yeah. - Ever heard. - I wasn't a good singer back then. I've learned a lot, and I think I'm a much better live singer. - You probably hear yourself. - Yeah. - Like the conditions. - I use any ears now. - Yeah, in Glash, most of the times, I'll have any ears, and I'll be like, I have never heard a single thing. - Never heard myself. - 30 years, this is wild. - Yeah. - I have bad hearing because of it. That's why I have to use any ears. - Oh, my God. - I can't hear half the shit. - You never worry about me. - All these years, right? - What are your plugs on stage? - No. - It really does make you feel like it's like, I'm not here. I'm singing and I'm singing in a airplane hangar a mile away. - Yeah. - Yeah, it's sox. Singers, we're our own thing. - Yeah. - I always feel like, I've always like, if I don't have a monitor, I can feel the vibration in my head, and I know that the notes that fucking dead. I haven't heard myself my whole life. I've never heard myself. - I just started using inears on this last two years. - Just started. - Just started. - You just started using inears. At those level, you're at, you were playing, you never heard yourself ever. - No. - Not one fucking night. - Never. - You're playing the rena's not new. - Yeah. - That's like the best thing I've ever heard. - That's me too. I feel like I never knew anyone that was just straight up, like, "No, I don't give a fuck." - No. - No. - Because I feel like there's. - I like to have a crowd. - It sounds like war's every day. - Yeah. - If I'm going to have to get involved in the fuck it, I'll be alright. - I didn't even, I'll figure it out. - I was always like that. Everyone else is sound checking, and I'm like, "What does it fucking matter?" I'm not doing this. I'll be standing here for three more hours talking with you too. - Exactly. 'Cause yeah, everyone's playing a different one. - I want it doesn't matter. - Yeah. - You're like, "Billy's over there." And he's like, "I need more of this, more of that." And I'm like, "Waiting." And then everybody's like, "BOOM." - "Kick, boom." - "Kick, boom." - "Kick, boom." And I'm like, "Can I have a little more?" I'm like, for anybody who ever would be hearing this and doesn't know that, that's, that's not. - I know what kind of, yeah. - I play her in this one, I would do best. - No one ever would know that. - I never met myself. They don't know what it's like. - They never heard myself. I got so used to feeling, if I was in tune. And then I got on in years, this last two years, I got on in in years, took me probably a year to just do a fucking thing back. - And now I will say, I've learned how to use my voice live better. - You don't even have to, it's like-- - 'Cause sometimes I get it in question. Why did I even push so much? I lost my voice every night. - Never had to. - And I never had to. - Because you didn't know you could hear yourself like it was a record. You're like, "I'm tracking the record." - 'Cause you know, when you track a record, you can sing closer to the mic. - No, you can go far away from the mic. - You can go far away from the mic. - I'm a fucking mate, I'm team to turn it. - It's incredible. - It's unbelievable. - And like, so now I can do all the falsetto live. - You do anything. - I can do anything live now. - I know, yeah. - And the feedback we've gotten to on these shows is that we sound better than we ever have. - And we do. - You actually hear myself. - No, you definitely do. - Yeah, of course. - I know that feeling, too, where I'm like, I guess I could have just done the whole time. - Why do you say I could have told me that though? - Crazy. - Yeah, the wireless mic. - I was not even adapting to a wireless mic. I mean, I'm like primitive. - The first time I said, modern technology, and they're like, "Well, this has been around like the whole time." They're like, "Welcome to 1987." - I'm fucking good. - Father. - What a great body of work you got. - Ow. But, um, how do you feel about. The new music I love a bunch of head-automatic songs we have happening glass always has mean just and always have a bunch of ideas Always going around always a bunch of reworks going on of things that when we're playing Lot of a lot of new head-automatic stuff. Yeah, we're playing Two of them trying to get ready another third one to start playing to see how it is really happy Yeah, very happy I mean so many years past that I'm so lucky to even be able to do something with a name of a project From years ago that like to feel I'm blessed enough to be playing and feel progressed a little as far as what I do And I'm playing with guys that are just monsters. Does it satisfy you? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean Realistically, I don't know. I don't know what would satisfy me in life What would you know? I don't even know what the goal was. I don't know who was looking back in the beginning What did I what was the goal play music? I can say I didn't think that far enough in the future and I still I just do it Yeah, you know, hey this comes up. I'm gonna do it. Could I show it always if it comes up me and Justin I like to make sense. We do do you guys make plans or is it really kind of just spontaneous? Oh, no, I mean you felt called like yeah, I do get called upon and then once we're called upon sort of dots connect Themselves that makes it easier. I don't know. Yeah, I do think a lot of you seem like your schedule is always very healthy and you're always having your project and something's occurring then it's this then you have the show that's incredible your infrastructure is very it's so it's amazing Where I feel that I do look at maybe someone like me and I find that like it the moment arises say yes Then that's where my life is going to point for five minutes and then we just kind of fill in the gaps and Justin and I make these get that done and sort of points in other I don't know. I think it was always a little haphazard. I don't know unique case. I just something like what I just called them Yeah, there's a lot of unsuredness in that which I'm sure you relate to, you know, you're your own boss, right? Yeah, I have a I have horrible ADHD can't imagine you never stop you must and I was just thinking about this today. I didn't take my ADHD meds and I don't Always because I don't really like it all the time sometimes I like to be 80 get it going pop Yeah, sometimes it's overwhelming. Yeah, I go through times where I'm like, you know what? I don't want to be I want to be Little irritated right now. I want to be going. I need to be going. This isn't and then a lot of stuff sometimes stuff comes from that like good ideas come from that Yeah, when I need to be assertive. I do find that. Yeah, I don't like being too dial style and like You get there now sometimes I know I have to be a I have to be my least my least attractive self perhaps I think likely part of my ability to pour myself into and and focus on and have success with music was ADHD because when you point it at things And you get hooked in and it's unstoppable. It acts like a medication like it soothes it a little bit. Yeah, because it if there's enough going on There's enough problems to solve all at once that it can occupy you think about that a lot that exact state I mean, I don't I feel like I often go if I was not so unhinged as a younger man I don't think I would have gotten done all the things I don't get done single over the place I was emotionally always Emotional young person definitely and definitely ADHD just like oh would you say like emotional like Did you you had like anxiety or depression or things like that? Yeah, definitely like I get lots of anxiety or quite Bory some and sad or I would love yeah really frustrated when I would love very hard right and be very hurt you go deep Yeah, and you get really hurt yeah like more more deep than being unrealistic or healthy the young age Yeah, just like me too though. Yeah people I find that's a type of guy my my heart was easily broken when I was yeah Yeah, lots of that type of stuff and also Maybe doing that to people when I wouldn't feel it as much as I Should feel it and then it would be done to me and I'd be oh hard broken the world ended You know, I didn't like feeling like that what I found for me on that same for you Because I do think that some of us are wired. Yeah emotionally wired. I am wired and that's why you probably are Such a good poet in that way with your music because that's probably where you express that and felt probably some relief when you did it But I found with me that part of me was just self-esteem Yeah, I needed deeply to be loved because I didn't love myself and then I and then that's like that's part of oh yeah And then and then I kind of worked on it in my 30s and I started getting a more level And I would say I got to a place where I still feel deeply But I feel I feel like I leveled myself out where Okay, if someone doesn't See me a little more okay with it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, but age does that that only came with age from some work does that some growth does that Real growth will age a little bit of a you have a kid you get you know, the kid feels the cup up. Yeah, you know, and then you got to lose a little You also have to feel that that You know, yeah, yeah, you have to feel like you've you've done something to feel like so empty and unloved You'll never make anyone else happy, right? You can't I can't be happy. I can't make you happy Yeah, yeah, and then I'm just like scattered loving feeling up feeling down up and down I feel like evening at all out would have was a healthier thing for me at a certain point. I mean a weed Helps weed helps in some people it does let's say. Yeah, maybe it helped me a little bit. My shirms could help absolutely lots of things It can help in moderation the dissonal done correctly absolutely things can help 100% definitely I found parenting help me It's the hugeest drug of all some bounce beautiful thingable. Yeah, it's the first time I you feel that that you're You almost have this notion of like I could not possibly do good. I could also not possibly do good Without being watched like are you seeing me do good? Well, then I can't even this I don't mean it. It's not Genuine even if I'm being genuine even if it's if it's anything you do good in life if it's being watched like that's for not It's for it's performative parenting is like the one time that nothing is performative. No, I can't be it's the realist It's just this me and my my man. Just like I'm just with him and experiencing this shit with him And it's like the one most genuinely fulfilling non There's nothing outside of that moment and it is magic It is and I don't think I could even love me until I could realize that I'm at least worth I'm here I'm worth this right. I'm doing this for him This is my life's work right here Yeah, like that is actually the for that's how I feel. I feel like yeah like God we have these like I didn't want to say like public lives, but it's more like yeah And how big did that feel until that moment with it? You're just like I gagled at it all. Yeah, I was like It felt so worth it's some the mere aunt in the afterbirth of this event like that all that time All the fights all the craziness all the losing money making money being afraid of what to do with the money fucking This record to good. Did that to record how all of the stress every bit of it and you have a kid Warped one nature in such a way that I was like you have humbled me. I am nothing. You are everything. I bless you. I would say like Even like if you just took that idea and anyone listening because plenty of people either don't have kids don't want to have kids fine If you could find anything you love more than yourself. Yeah. That's the only thing I would manage you will Find peace. Yeah, there's got me there has to be a parallel for people who are like that doesn't interest me I don't find that that's what I'm here for. I don't I don't want a nurture I don't want to protect and I don't want that tied to me and I don't feel that I'm capable There's got to be something that people at one point are like that's it. I think I see it I'm here for that. I see it with some people who dedicate their lives to like being of service to like of service being of service to other people where they go and I'm at some Doctors who spent years in Africa doctors other borders or or doctors like people who have to dedicated their lives To help helping other people legitimately saving people's lives and I think that to me is like a similar like when you have a kid It feels like not only do they love you back. Mm-hmm, which I think could be a similar experience when you're when you're helping people saving their lives But also like you're responsible for their your their lifeline You're totally yeah, that that's I've never also had that makes all this just kind of yeah Like it's the accomplishment also that I'm an only child and uh, and I never really I never had the money really growing up Like I never owned anything nothing was ever mine and the only thing I ever did with my life was Bands, you know for the most part glass show was where she grew up Belmore a long island long island. Yeah. Yeah Oh, I would do was glass show and I shared that you know and we shipped me and Justin share that so nothing was ever Nothing is ever like you don't nail it. It's dead. It dies. It's over. There's all on you at rest on you I was never a prodigy and ever pleats boards and never nothing rested on me in my life Never one hour of my life did anything hinge upon me except delivering the goods in my 50% of glass show I guess at that time. Yeah, but then your child arrives and you're like this is why like it is 100% this is tethered It's existence is tethered to my uh my sensibilities right yeah at every turn and it just totally there's nothing that'll change you like that That is just you you snap into sort of a new character known that responsibility. Or perhaps you raised 10 brothers and sisters of your own because of how your life was and that's just one more of those experiences but it hits you a little different, but for me it was, that was, and I've never had the weight and the honor at the same time of life. How was it like touring? Are you away? Yeah, but we don't go away long amounts of time. Just and then I really hate that. We do shorter trips at automatic. It will do runs but we don't, I try to not do terribly long runs. I kind of just can't, you know, I have my son and I do, I have a lot of things are always happening and like I said you get to an age, it's like I'm not trying to play every market. No, yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's just people at a record store and you know, like how many times we did those things and yeah, yeah, of course, less it doesn't do anything. It only breaks the morale. Yeah, and the morale of the team is like, yeah, we've seen that. Yeah, seems to just be like, it's possible. Yeah, the young man's game doing that. That's a young man's game, when you can meet little guys and they're like, yeah, and tomorrow we're playing in the next day, and you're like, oh, there. Oh, my God. They were playing a phone booth and Kansas. Get it done now. Get it in now. Get it in now because eventually there's going to be a woman or a child that ain't going to let you do that. That's right. That's right. If life will not permit you to do that and I don't think your temperament will want you to do it. Yeah, up the steps. It went to the club. I was going to a club in Philly. I feel like we were carrying fake SVT's up steps and it'd be like at a moment, 20 hour drive. And then tomorrow, he playing seven feet of snow and the Eagles, boy, Eagles club for that. Yeah, it goes all room to Milwaukee. It's like a sleep on a 30. Yeah, that I never even had to drive. I don't even drive. What was your favorite glass draw record? I don't even know. Hey, little bits throughout here throughout time. I like I always like the moments that were really heavy, but not terribly stony, heavy. There's always a lot of stony, stony, mentally breakdowny, heavy things. I always enjoyed the very avant-garde screamy moments the most. I don't know. I like, uh, we had a five song, five song EP before our first real record back in the hardcore show days. And that was my favorite. That was your favorite. Yeah. I mean, I like that style at the time. Sounded like a little kid, little kid quick sand, little kid shift. Yeah. That was like, you know, I like that. That was a good time. It's, um, before we knew just making the music. Yeah. Not really thinking. There's a lot of freedom in the, uh, and also not being looked at by professionals. Like, we're in the secret on, we're in our underground layer. There's no above ground sort of a players that are going to judge us. We can do anything. Let's go batch it. Yeah. Over time, we're like, all right, that sounds a little crazy. Let's not get too crazy. Let's be realistic on the record. There's a certain magic moment of like fearless go for it. I don't even know what, I heard it on a record. I don't even know how to put it into words. Let's try to figure it out. There's an unbridled, youthful adventurousness to that. Then the more you learn, you kind of little self-conscious with your writing. Try not to be, but happens a little bit. I still think you guys always probably always, it always felt like you, um, pushed the half. Well, we, we, I feel, I think Justin and I specifically have to because I think that's a lot of what the, what the band is. It's not, we're not like two Berkeley-type dudes per se. A letter doing that. So like, we always want to execute this sort of or sound, but like, somehow push it in like a, like in a zany way. That's part of it. That's the people silly. It's got to be something silly too. If it's so screaming and absurd, it's got to be a bit of campy, whimsy to this insanity too, right? Yeah. I would say, I wouldn't call it silly, I wouldn't say wacky, maybe avant-garde. Yeah, some moments, I guess. Yeah. Yeah, some moments have to go until the, the, the other world to kind of really back into this little less civilian. Yeah, it's got to go far out to take you back down to something. Yeah, you know, it's always so much, it's so easy to deliver mid-tempo, mash, mania. I feel like it's been 30 years on Earth of we can all do that, right? So how can, what can you do to really highlight that? Well, you always delivered some of the like, to me, what Broadway's brought it back home was like a good chorus. Yeah. You had a lot of like, it'll make me crazy if someone doesn't have songwriting sensibility. And you guys always had really good songwriting sensibility. No, it came just to position. It always landed somewhere, you know, and I always like that. I always enjoyed that. But that's a thing before songiness, song, song is important. Yeah. Even, you know, Justin and I specifically, because that's obviously the more far out of the things that I do, you can play so far out and go so far out and be so noisy. I do find that the best of even that, the sort of some, even if it's sort of the psychosomatic, like it's in the background, like, what it's a, it's an element of song, right? Like, if there is something that reoccurs or if there's something cyclical to it, there's some sort of patterny, something that, even if it's subconsciously, like that, that's a song. And even our heaviest silly moments, they're the ones that mean him a laugh of, like, so ignorantly, like, just do, I'm screaming like a fucking cat. Like, it just sounds so over the top, but you do, we laugh because we will always tie it to some semblance of, there is song, right? And there is rhythm. I do hear him and I happen to love two things that we always love. It's like the idea of a hook somehow and the idea of rhythm, you know, we both love those things. And then individually, I really love a hook and he really loves a good rhythm. And then so we're have that kind of tucked in. You can get us up on credit as you want, I guess at the end. But it's even cooler when you can book end all these pieces with theatrical ape shit. You know, it's all silly. It's silly and fun. It's fun. It's experimental, push the envelope, sound nuts, make it really hit the red on a recording. Like what sound fucking the roof, dynamically, you know, like what's the dichotomy between these parts live on a record, how crazy that behavior, or anything, it gets real big. And if you sometimes have to play a bunch of shitty bad notes to get it to that, make it smash, you get it to that. Yeah, it's a lot of theater and it's too. I think me and him always kind of hurt that. Like we would hum out songs, when we were young, we would always be like, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, like we would hum out, we would have like, I feel like different times when we would have a song done hummed out. And we'd be like, that's like, we'll just, that's done. Like we got that one that we know about. Like, it always was this like hum out this thing churning. Like it goes that, then the second part, cool. As I was going to be a bridge, we'll probably go to a fucking chorus loud. We can make it happen on this spot. It'll also like, you know, somebody as long as the human eye have known each other, it's like we can do the hard thing, like through osmosis, you know? Yeah. But it's always fun. And just sort of having it be one identity all these years, we've gotten a little better maybe, you kind of can just get sillier with it. Let's make this even crazier. Let's make this even quieter. How long have you and Justin been making music together? 92, 93. Wow, like 30, 30, about 30, more than 30, more than 30, 34 years. It was our first summer that we were camp counselors and not campers at the camp. And my grandma, my nanny was the chef at the camp. Wow. What camp was that? Merrick Woods Country Day camp. Where's that? At Long Island, New York. That's amazing. Yeah. It was our first we were working. I think he was the CIT counselor in training. And I don't even remember what the fuck I was doing. I think I was giving back basketballs. I have the little kids shot them back to a counselor. And we met there. And we met like first day. I had an anthrax shirt on and he had a bad brain shirt on. Wow. And we walked right up to each other. I'm pretty sure he had, you know, like cool shirt, immediately. It was like, yeah, nice fucking shirt. That's my fucking favorite band. I was like, fucking, we fucking playing music. He's like, definitely would he play as a guitar? He's like, guitar, I'm like, fuck it. That was literally what happened. You guys. And then I did bad in eighth grade. And my mom was like, Dad, really? You can't be in a band and you can't take a guitar to Justin and Sundays anymore. And I was like, fuck that. And so I'd go to the house and he was like, there's no way you're not going to do it now. And I was like, what am I going to do? He's like, you're a second. And I was like, what the fuck? And then that as your parents said you can't take the guitar. Yeah, they didn't know I was in the band until Pike College till, yeah, long time. Wow. We were doing lots of things and I didn't tell them. Wow. How's it get you? Yeah, you can fuck it. Tell me how you do. Yeah. Yeah, I can't take my guitar to Justin's. I'll show you your ninth grade. That was in Long Island. Yeah. I mean, you guys going to show this and stuff. Yeah. Oh my God. He would do. They were shows. We were a little. I remember one show. My mom, my dad was like, you better get home for dinner. I'm going to fucking kill you. And I remember I was like, I can't go to the show. He was like, what do you mean? We're playing in like two hours. You tell them, you're not going for dinner. I was like, I'm going home for dinner. Oh, my fucking dad's going to kill me. He was like, this is fucking crazy. Like time years ago, and he's like, yeah, definitely. Oh my God. I'm going to fucking have dinner. What was your dad have done? Killed me, even if like, what were you doing? I'd have been like playing hockey up the block. I was lying all the time. I literally think I felt mad. They're science. And my dad was like, yeah, well, you never going to fucking play the band together with that Justin. And I was like, this summer, we were going to make it happen. Yeah. When did glass jaw? When was that born? It was always that. It was just me and him. And then eventually, We just paid the name "Glastio" after a year of knowing each other. What a great name. So stupid. He has a good name. I think it was a bliss. I brought on loose leaf in eighth grade like a list of like 30 I would love to see that dude. We got a we left because the one next to glass joy back is always like told you we Should have used swift kick. Yeah, swift kick. Yeah, that was that was glass jaws baby brother band Swift kick about is like the old man Swift. He's like, I told you should he's swift. He's gonna see this and fucking die He's gonna see me trying not to lapsing swift kick. My dad was a boxer for a little bit So an eighth grade really knows so many odd fun words. Yeah, so we made the list. I was like you choose I don't know with pick one man horrible name and at what point did your dad go? Yeah, okay, it was like 10 years later. It's like what the fuck is it called and I'm like a glacier because you were boxer and shit He was like, oh, that's a nice tribute. Here's like oh was he proud of you? I mean eventually when I was putting out records And it was like everybody with car. Yeah, then it was like I always need you having it. Yeah, yeah, you do Here's a card. Yeah, yeah, yeah, we don't you know what? That's a good song son right there. We always need you. Yeah. That's very New York It's so New York, dude. He's just thinking back. I'm cracking up laughing at all the shit. I don't think about it No, it's good. It's good thing about it. It's beautiful. Yeah, I love thinking about fun times with Justin mean him but left Many fucking times you strike me as You were in your creativity anyways. You were free. Yeah, it felt free. It never felt be holding. Yeah, that's when I hear a glass star record When I hear had a head on a matica. I feel free. I feel I tend to go to Head on a matica more the older we get I find I understand I just like it Really like it scratches an itch. It's still no matter what like from the outside I'm like if that's your version of pop that to me is like a really great and like I'm a song guy So I hear the Castello in it. I hear the squeeze in it I hear I hear the stuff. I always heard in it that I like so I like that stuff, too Feels nice and it feels good. It's not a challenge It's not like reading a book. I was like when you you're trying to like you're breaking apart like I did your mind is like going through things Yeah, I think you know, I think it's a lot to be said in melody. I like positivity. I like melody. I like humming I like those things. It soothes my OCD 80 HD Actually, I'd say glass jaw really does like scratch the ADHD But I don't know there's something about it that is really like comforting in that music but what I hear in all of it is is freedom and Someone who's allowed themselves to be free and express the depth of their when you're punk you get We got lucky we get lucky because I feel like a lot of expectations aren't on punk I like it's kind of like well, he's a punk. I they do what they kind of do their own. They do their own sort of thing Yeah, a lot of leeway with that feel like a bar band you play showcases and you're like, yeah This is these guys at the fucking Google dolls, right? Yeah, Google doll shit, you know, you know, you're expected to be that You know, you don't get to be nuts. Maybe I don't know Do you have like an expectation or like an idea of What you hope or where this goes? I mean, I see that you you you do something that's so substantial and so real and it's this is like It's like I use the word before and that's probably not like infrastructure like there's this is a structure is a real word This is a this spent years building infrastructure. That's impressive. I see it like I see this is it like I My my existence was always a little bit more abstract maybe because I was always tied very, you know, intimately to being You know, maybe 50% of something I always did or the whole thing but I was a singer in it to the publicly and maybe that I was just kind of scattered me where my my place was and how to you know to represent myself if there was some sort of Very real infrastructure like this. I mean, this is amazing But I always feel that I'm just kind of I just float and it kind of like things just happen and then the dots get connected for a season You know a long season. Maybe that'll be like a five-year run maybe like two years of I'm in head-automatic land I'm in glacial land. It just it just does it. I don't know. I never was good seeing the future and I just kind of ride it That's not great. That's maybe it could nearing 50 years old. I don't think that's Maybe the best thing, but I know here's what is I don't know if it's bad. Yeah, I don't know if it's bad Maybe not, but there's a bit of unchirredness, but I mean you've had you've had colossal Success and to see that you maybe can see if Forward with what you do within a bigger whether it's a schedule or your plans like that's really admirable And I was always kind of more you know by the seat of my pants and working phases as it comes and that was always it Yeah, I don't know. I don't know why that is I don't know I don't know if you need to know maybe not sometimes I think there's sitting with you and getting some real time with you I can I can connect that back and go I the records make even more sense to me like a really great way Which makes me like a more you know what I mean because I get a sense of the guy and then I listen to the record I'll go home today and I will listen to a record and I will understand it more because I got To sit with you and and even beyond words. This is why I love doing the show. This is the most at long This is like the longest I've ever talked to somebody probably in on Interview in my life and I've also this is the longest I've ever been filmed in my life I'm honest and I just just want to it this is how nice and casual so you probably you couldn't be getting it anymore But me and the road then that's what I'm saying is that's the but that's the personality of this Show and then so when I go back to the music and I understand it more But what I'm saying is like a Michael Stiper I can name a bunch of other people your favorite bands favorite band I don't throw that away. I mean that as a compliment. I hear that I'm honored I'm honored because everybody I ever enjoyed that was my hero is that yeah, and I'm well aware of that So it ever have been that said when we were younger it's like well usually you have to be really the smart guys that are a little advanced To be doing that and it also means you may not succeed as much but you're like these outside spirit animals that are kind of like a little ahead of the game I guess I got it, but I was like man, we're young to already be that type of band. I am honored I am honored that anybody in any capacity whether it's your favorite bands favorite band or a fucking 10 year-old whatever it is I am so honored to you and you and you do you do sit in the intersection of both you are the fans band and the bands band and I think that's a A unique place, but I also think that you're also you're young enough to be a Creative creating and old enough to be an elder statesman and someone that could that could that's like the nicest thing you could say The last thing head on a madoka working on on releasing a new EP sometimes soon Yeah, I would I would love to yeah, we have a lot of stuff in the work. How far away is it from being done? I mean, it could be done awfully soon. There's a lot of tunes that are pretty pretty ready to go We're playing a play in a bunch playing two right now pretty much a third one is kind of ready to be played We have a bunch definitely a bunch fully tracked and ready with me. I'm saying on them. Oh, yeah. I am too. Yeah, it sounds great A lot of it sounds really great. High energy. Good. Very fun. Well some of it's pretty pop popacular. A lot of it is And you know far out a little more aggressive and I can't wait. Yeah, I love had automatic. I don't think it's anything too strange. Yeah, you might like it Thanks for coming on. Thank you so much for having me. I am honored and you're so nice to talk to you Thank you. Appreciate it Thank you for listening to this episode of artist friendly You can also watch the episodes on Spotify Spotify premium users get no commercial breaks on my show Make sure to follow like and comment because I always read the comments [BLANK_AUDIO]