Creating La Dolce Vita for Animals in Italy

[MUSIC] Welcome to the Unexpected Activist Podcast. Today we have a very special guest, Simone Scompoli, joining us from Santuario, Capra Liberté Tutti, a magical place located in the beautiful hills of Lazio, about an hour's drive from Rome. I first met Simone back in 2021 when I was taking part in outreach events organized by the Plant Based Treaty team at Capra 26 in Glasgow. That event brought together such an impressive group of people from all over the world, and I felt privileged to make the connection. Fast forward to May 2022, I was in Italy working on my book, and I had the immense pleasure of visiting the sanctuary. Simone was kind enough to give me a tour, and to introduce me to the animals in the founder Massimo, even though they were undergoing some transition, and not technically open for public events at that time. What an amazing experience. I'm not going to say too much because I'm sure Simone will do a far better job of telling you about the sanctuary, but I can tell you that it was an unforgettable day, and I have been continuously inspired following their work. La Dolce Vita now has a completely new meaning for me. Let's go chat with Simone. [MUSIC] Ciao, Simone, welcome to the podcast. >> Thank you for inviting me. Very happy to be here. >> It's so, so good to see you and hear you. So I'm going to see if I can get this right when I introduce you. Simone is joining us from the beautiful hills of Lazio, about one hour from Rome at Sant'Oario Capra Liberatuti. How did I do? >> Yes. >> That's perfect. >> Okay, good. So let's start out with something very simple. What does the name of your sanctuary actually mean for people who are listening and don't speak Italian? >> Yes, so basically, Capra means God. Liberat means free. Tutti means all. And this name actually became alive after a Massimo, the founder of this animal sanctuary, a day was with a friend in a nearby farm. And so he got baby goats playing around him. First one goat and then this goat called other friends. And so he was surrounded by baby goats. Massimo didn't have a sanctuary back then. But yeah, he stopped being a farmer as well because this place was a farm before. And so in that moment, playing with those baby goats, he asked the farmer, what are you going to do with those baby goats? And so the farmer said, I'm going to send them to slaughter as soon as it's time to do that. And so Massimo was shocked in a sense that, oh my God, that they are nice with me. They are playful with me. How can that be that they would be slaughtered without thinking that, yes, in every farm, every animal is slaughtered and we shouldn't respect just the one that are nice with us. We should respect all. And so, but yeah, Massimo was not ready for this. He was transitioning this place from a farm and then to a sanctuary. And so in that moment, he decided to ask the farmer to take all those goats. So he took the goats here in this place. And of course, he didn't want to keep them. He wanted to find a better home for them. But at some point, he realized, oh, this is such a perfect place for goats. Why should I send them somewhere else? Maybe I can give a life to them here. And that's how the sanctuary started. So Cabra Liberatootti means a goat that somehow free all the others, free all. So yeah, that's how the name started. And so this also was the beginning of the sanctuary as we know it today. So the goats somehow made this happen. But before they were also sheep, some hands, because Massimo was farming some of those animals, but then, yeah, when he made the connection, so he kept them for a better life. That's beautiful, beautiful. I really, I love that story. And I love the place where you are, where you live. It is magical. It is absolutely magical. And I hope people who are listening here today, one day in their lives get a chance to visit you because it is beautiful. Simone, can you tell us how you got involved with the sanctuary? Because Massimo started in what year did he start the sanctuary? Yes. So Massimo founded the sanctuary on October 26th. The year was 2015. Before that date, there was a transition time from a farm to a sanctuary. And yeah, before, I guess, 15 years of farming animals, yes. Wow. Wow. And then you started to get involved in the sanctuary when and then when did it become your full-time occupation? Love, dedication. Yeah. So I was living in Berlin. And in Berlin, I was volunteering for some animal rights organization. And one of them was animal-save movement. And so they, we actually planned to bring animal-save movement in Italy and so they somehow helped me with some funds to start the chapters in Italy. So in 2019, I came back in Italy. I didn't want to live in Berlin, actually. But because of this opportunity to make my passion, my mission, a job was a reason to live in Berlin and come back to Italy. So I was touring in Italy many cities to do activists, and start chapters and also to motivate new activists. And so when I came in Rome, I immediately messaged Massimo asking to visit the sanctuary because I was following the Santuario Cabrali Baratuti in Berlin on social media. This was the sanctuary for me. It was one of the most beautiful pages to follow and see. And so I immediately asked for a visit. And so I came here. And since then, every time I was coming to Rome to do activists because of my job, I was coming here to relax a little bit, to help with the animals. And so step by step, my involvement was growing. More and more and more. At some point when I was traveling in Europe also for animal-seag movement and at some point when the pandemic started, I couldn't travel anymore as before. So I was in Berlin again. I was supposed to go in Holland and then I had to come back in Italy. So I asked Massimo, can I come to the sanctuary? I supposed to be here for maybe a month or so, but I'm still here because as you know, the world has changed so much after the pandemic started. And so I was here working for two, no profit. So animal-seag movement, but also helping a lot here. And step by step, I decided to leave. Animal-seag movement, sadly of course, but my involvement here was too big. And so I had to decide which one of the two. Well, it's amazing when you, when something resonates so clearly with you and you find your passion and you find your place. I think it's for all of us, it's an amazing, amazing step in our lives. Simone, how would you describe Italy right now as a place for animals? Compared to other places, obviously you've traveled a lot. You've been in the UK, you've been around Europe. How is Italy? Yeah, good question. I'm happy you asked that Italy is a place and I think everybody knows around the world. It's a place where there is a big attachment to our traditions. So the Italian cuisine in the world seems to be the best. I'm not a big fan. I mean, I love Italian cuisine, but I'm not the one saying, oh, it's the best of the world. But this is a problem, so in Italy, because people are very attached to traditions and I think This is a big bite. a big obstacle for big and food because everyone seems to get crazy when you try to let them imagine a different way to eat a different way to create recipes. So I think it's a it's tougher here compared to other countries. I mean it's it's tough in all the world we see the world is still not vegan it's still a speciesist world but I think here we have a bigger barrier because of our traditions but we see little steps we see the supermarkets that are more they have more products they we see more vegan restaurants around the cities I mean there is still a lot to do there is still a lot to do but yeah we we can make it I'm sure about that even though because also the the science is clear and yeah we know that if we don't stop doing this not just for the animals of course which is very important but also for the environment we we must stop so I hope people will open their eyes very soon yeah yeah you you and me both it's interesting I read recently that there was a bill or some sort of resolution in the Italian government to forbid cultivated meat am I getting that right because they say that that's a threat to the traditional food production in Italy and I was very disappointed to see that but not surprised necessarily yeah that's what's happening now and we also we saw in the European Parliament years ago a few years ago they tried to ban the name that for oven burger or milk or yogurt for plum based products and luckily we won so now they are trying again in Italy since there is the right wing parties managing the the government they tried again and so we hope it's not going to happen yeah yeah that's that's tough so so circling back to this the sanctuary and how you as as a an Italian and you and Massimo and what you're trying to achieve there of course you you have 300 animals or you have over 300 animals right yeah more that's yeah almost 350 350 now okay I see you at rescuing all the time so so for those 350 animals obviously you have made their lives much better but how do you see the sanctuary functioning to change the picture on a grander scale what what function does an animal sanctuary particularly a farm animal sanctuary what what does it do to help advance the cause for animal rights and for veganism good question so yeah here we have 350 animals more or less and every week we receive lots of requests for new animals in need and we sadly have to say no to many of them because of many reasons because of the law we are considered a farm so we are an animal sanctuary but for the law for the government we are a farm and we need to follow the same rules and the same procedure that every farm must follow even though the farms are not following the law I'm not saying that if a farm is following the law is a good farm we are against farming animals but still they don't follow the law but we have to do it another reason is because of fund raising so we have to guarantee the life of every animal that is here so introducing new animals can put at risk all the animals that are here so the animals that are here are we say are ambassadors of their own species so by their story that we try to tell everyone through social media but they also tell their stories because when they when people come here to visit and have tours around the sanctuary and can observe the animals in their daily life in their relationships in the way they play they sleep they enjoy their time the sun they can see who they really are and eventually we hope they stop eating all the other animals the billions of animals that every day are kept in cages inside farms in dirty spaces and slaughtered so we hope that by seeing and knowing the animals that live in this sanctuary but in every sanctuary around the world people can make the connection and see that all the others that are not free are actually the same so that's the the role of a sanctuary we dream of a future without animal sanctuary actually because that means that there is no need to save them right but until then we have to right yeah that's that's it's so so important and it's it's much you know of course every one of those lives is important but they they represent you know like you said the the millions and billions of animals that are that are killed every day and people don't necessarily give a second thought to that when you talk about people who come to the sanctuary do you find that you have lots of non-vegans who come visit you and and hear your story and and do people ever come back and say wow this made a difference and I will think maybe more about what I'm eating as a result of coming to visit we are happy to answer yes yeah that's good news we have lots of non-vegans coming to our public events we have lots of non-vegans following on our social medias and we have received lots of messaging telling us thank you because by following you by knowing these animals by listening to this story I finally stopped eating cheese I finally stopped eating meat I finally became vegan so there are people that maybe are transitioning so they start their path by coming here others are already vegan and so for us that's very important and also we are happy we have a non-vegans public that that's the the goal for us yeah yeah I mean it's wonderful building the vegan community and all of us you know getting together but it's so important when we're pulling new people in and they get the education and maybe their their hearts which most people I think have good hearts and if they just think about it and have a little education they won't make that connection and make that change so the work you're doing is so so so important we have vegan food coming here and that's also very nice and great but yeah we we want a non-vegans public of course of course yeah yeah Simone since I started following you I have noticed that you have been very creative you and Massimo in finding ways to do your outreach but also creative ways to support the the work that you're doing the book and I don't know if you finished the second book yet but I bought one of your books that was absolutely beautiful you have your events and you have a billion so maybe maybe actually we can we can talk about all of those things so the book came from telling the stories of individual farm animals right that made their way to the sanctuary yeah so the book that you also booked has 12 stories so basically it's one year in the sanctuary so in that here there were many liberations and so 12 of those stories are in that book and so by buying that book of course you can support the sanctuary but we also published another book which is in Italian is called La Fie Nestra in English would be the window so everybody that follow the sanctuary knows that there is a window a very famous window where the animals of the sanctuary come and come to the window so sometimes they come and just stay there sometimes they come and ask for food and so we took pictures of those animals coming to the window when we made a book about that and that's so nice to that that we the world is very famous because it tells lots of stories every day. But we also have classic merchandise like t-shirts, hoodies and other stuff like knuckles or stickers, many things. But we have other ways to support the sanctuary, like for example adopting an animal from distance. So you follow the sanctuary, you know the stories, you know the animals and you can decide to adopt one animal by giving a donation monthly. And so you receive exclusive emails telling the stories of these animals, what's happening in the sanctuary, you receive pictures and videos, or you can support the sanctuary with a billion. So you mention a billion and that's very revolutionary for us because people can make vegan reviews into this app which is called a billion. And by reviewing vegan products, vegan cosmetics, vegan products to clean the house or vegan clothes, you generate credits. And it's a billion that donate money to the sanctuary. So for example, I make a review, I get 50 cents, I get one dollar. As a credit, I can decide to send it to the capital library sanctuary, but it's a billion that effectively send the money, not the people. So it's very revolutionary because everyone can donate even though maybe they can't afford it. And so that's very impressive because we made big steps. And so people can donate in different ways, but also when they come to the sanctuary and they can visit, they can support with donations here. So that's how the sanctuary goes on actually, yes, by the generosity of people. Well, you've been I think very smart and the way you have developed your programs to support the sanctuary. A billion, it truly is a revolutionary way of supporting nonprofits and you of course are my organization of choice through a billion because you introduced me to that that whole process. So I'm grateful to you for that. And I know that when I talked to the people from a billion, I was at a conference, they cited you as an organization has done a really good job of promoting that. So congratulations on that. It's really nice. Thank you. When I visited Simone, you had just acquired an adjacent piece of land for the sanctuary. Can you tell me a little bit about your future plans and where that stands right now and how you see maybe for the next five years the sanctuary growing and developing? Yeah. So yeah, we have a new piece of land now that is officially part of the sanctuary. It's a beautiful area with lots of trees and plants. And so the animals that actually decided to come into this land because we also did they really want to decide who should have come into this new land. I mean, we really want them to decide that life and it happened naturally that the horses, now there are seven horses, much more than when you came to the visit. And so they decided to live here in this new land. So the new land of the sanctuary, which is really beautiful, is a home for the horses. The old land now is also very different because we have new structures, new bounds. And there is also another big, big land that is not officially of the sanctuary, but is rented to the municipality. So with 1000 euro per year, which is not too much actually, we can have a really big land. It's a kind of field plus forest on top of a mountain. So it's on our backside and the animals can go there. And that's the most beautiful thing we could do because we really gave them freedom and the possibility to rediscover their wildness. And that's happening. And how do I see the sanctuary in five years? Our goal is of course to make it even more welcoming for all the animals that are coming here. So we really want to make bigger barns and better structure for the ones that really need them because some of them love to be on top of the mountain and be wild. So that's good. But others, they need something. So we really want to create a special place for all of them. But we also see a place for gatherings, for conferences, for trainings, for discussions, debates. So we want to have an area dedicated to our events. We already have it, but it's very simple and not super functioning. So we want to make a place for really have an impact when we gather with people to really make a change and go through different topics and yeah, hoping that people can transform here in this place. Yeah. Well, that's that's amazing and sign me up because if I could schedule a meeting there, that would be wonderful. It is such a beautiful place. And as you're talking, it just reminds me, I think one of the very special things about your sanctuary is how the animals have so much autonomy. They live their lives as they want to live their lives. You aren't forcing them into a set parameter of what sanctuary life should look like. And I notice they intermingle too as species so much at your sanctuary. And there's this amazing feeling when you go there of the coexistence of all of these animals. So it's why I call it a magical place because it really, really is. That's lovely. And with this addition of the new land, it gives you even more freedom to let the animals be, you know, as they want to be. So that's great. Yeah. Yeah. It's just beautiful. When we are open to the public and people can go also up in the mountain, for them is really impressive to see them really free. They can observe them in a new perspective. And it's not like going into the Alps and see the cows on the mountains, but they are not free. They're still part of a farm. They can really see them free here. 100 percent in every behavior, in every decision, in every moment. So it's really beautiful. Yeah. I loved it. And I do want to say thank you so much because I think when I came to visit, it was just at the end of COVID and you really were in a transition period and hadn't opened up to the public again. So allowing me to come there and see you and meet Simone, Simone, Massimo, sorry. And the animals was, it was such a privilege. So thank you for sharing that with me. Yeah. So it's time for you to come back. I know. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. So I have two more questions for you. One, are you hopeful? Are you hopeful for the future for animals? And what gives you hope for the future for animals? Good question. I'm hopeful because I think if I'm not hopeful, I wouldn't do what I'm doing. I'm hopeful, but at the same time, I'm also very scared. I mean, if I look at what's happening in the world, if I look at the people in power, the governments and everything that is happening, the no consideration at all of climate change and everything that is needed to do to make this place a better world, to make this world a better place. Sorry. So that's really scary, but I still have hope because here at the sanctuary, I have the opportunity to see people listening to us, to see people curious and people that eventually also consider to change themselves. So that gives me hope. So that's what I found, what I find hope in people that come to us, get to know us and change. Because if I look at the governments, if I look at the people in power, if I look at the most rich people in the world, well, that's not hopeful. That's really scary. But yeah, let's hope that all the people coming together at some point would be stronger. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I do think we have an amazing community. And kind of as a follow-up to your comments, you know, when I moved to to Italy in 2016, I think I moved there with a certain perception of what my life was going to look like in Italy and what I was going to find most enjoyable and transformative about my life in Italy. And I was very surprised that it wasn't at all like I expected. One of the best things that happened to me was my connection with the animal community in Italy. People like you, people I met in Puglia. And it just reminds me that we as a community, even though we might not all speak the same language, our lives may look a little different. When we come together with this one thing in common, there are no barriers. Compassion knows no borders, knows no language. We come together. And I think that's a beautiful thing about traveling. If you open yourself up to meeting people, and that's what happened to me when I lived in Italy. So thank you for everything you do. I'm just such a fan. I'm a big fan of your work and of the place and you a massive own. I would love to share with our listeners how they can find you physically, but also online and how they can support you. And of course, everything you share with me, we will also put in the show notes so that people can look that up afterwards. Yeah, thank you. Thank you for everything you said. Thank you also for all you do. And for people that want to get to know more about the capital liberty sanctuary, you can find us mostly on social media, so Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, Twitter and Abilium of course. And you can find us with the tag capital liberty. But we have also website www.capralibrala2t.org with lots of information. And so by signing up to the newsletter, you can also receive emails of our events so you know when we are open to the public so you can come, visit this place. And also the great thing is that at every event we have guests to go deeper into many topics, not just the animal suffering part and what's happening to them. We also have guests talking about climate change, LGBTQ+ movement, intersectionality, feminism. And we try to intersect all those struggles to better understand that we really need to change the whole system that is oppressing human animals and non-human animals. So our events are really great and they will be even bigger and better in the future because we want to create a better event area. So please come and visit us physically if you can. Otherwise you can find us online. Yeah, we are very active online. Well, thank you so much for that. Now I'm so thankful that we connected at the Plant Based Treaty events in Glasgow. So that was awesome. And even though you filmed me dancing, which is one of the horror stories of my life, to have my dancing on video, I forgive you for that. And I'm very privileged to have met you and to learn about what you're doing. And yes, I will come back very soon as soon as I can. And I look forward to that. It was good to meet you in Glasgow for COP26. Yes, yes. Yeah, it was so good and you were a good dancer. Don't worry. At the moment, we promote Plant Based Treaty. We are a partner. We believe in that campaign. So at every event, we have plant based treaty signs. So people can get to know more about the impact of the animal farming industries. Yeah. Oh, fantastic. That's very, very important. And I'm glad you're still connected with that organization. Yeah. Well, again, Simone, thank you so much. And I just want to share with our listeners that Simone and Massimo and the animals, for me, at least, they are redefining what La Dolce Vita is. And for 350 animals, they really do have La Dolce Vita at Capra Libertor Tuzzi. So thank you, thank you. I will share all your information. And hopefully we will talk again soon. Yes, thank you for inviting us. It was a pleasure. We hope to see you very soon here once again. And yeah, many people as well that are listening to this interview. Okay. Thank you. Take care, Simone. All right. Ciao, ciao. Bye. Ciao. That was so much fun reconnecting with Simone. And I'm ever so grateful to the weather gods that the storms they were having in his part of Italy took a little break so we could conduct our interview. I really do have the fondest memories of visiting the sanctuary. And I hope you will check out the work they're doing and follow their stories. And I'll bet you find it as magical as I do. You can find all of their details in the show notes and you can find them on social media. Thank you again for listening. And I hope you will continue to follow along as we discuss all things vegan, creating your own brand of activism and creating a passion-driven new chapter of your life. You can find links to our latest episodes on my website, the UnexpectedActiveist.com, or find us on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Talk to you soon. Ciao for now. [Music]