Corporate Fundraising in 2026: The Reality Behind the Partnerships

# Conf盗 together # FUN DAISY Everywhere # FUN DAISY Everywhere # FUN DAISY EVERYWHERE #FUN Kun Bigger # # FUN DAISY EVERYWHERE Welcome to the Fundraising Everywhere podcast. You'll go to place for fundraising tips and inspiration. Love what you hear? Get more insights straight to your inbox. Subscribe to our email list for exclusive fundraising resources, early access to training, special discounts and more. Just head on over to fundraisingeverware.com/podcast to subscribe. Now, onto today's episode. Enjoy! # FUN DAISY EVERYWHERE Hello, everyone. And welcome to a special episode of the Fundraising Everywhere podcast. We are recording this live on LinkedIn Live. So you might be watching us live and hello to you if you can see us there. But you might just be listening to us back on the Fundraising Everywhere podcast. Either way, hello, nice to have you here. Please say hello in the chat if you're with us live. And if you're listening on the podcast, say hello to whoever's sat next to you on the bus. My name is Simon Skriver. I am one of the co-founders of Fundraising Everware and your host for today. And this month, a fundraiser in Everware, one of our focuses is corporate fundraising. We have our corporate fundraising, our corporate partnerships conference, happening on the 26th of March. And I've got details of that linked in the description here, but you can find it on our website. So we've been talking to lots of corporate fundraisers. We've been talking to our corporate speakers, who are going to be presenting at the conference. And we've been talking to our members and people who are in the Fundraising Everware universe. About what they want to see. And one of the details that keep coming up, or one of the names that kept coming up, was Rachel Holbre. My wonderful guest today, because really, I see Rachel as someone who has their finger on the pulse when it comes to corporate fundraising. And we're going to unpack some of the research that she's done in the last year. And to see that. So let me welcome my guest today. Hello, Rachel. How are you? I'm good. Thanks for having me. Thank you for making the time. I really appreciate it. I know you've just gone freelance consultant in the last year or so. So I imagine you are swamped. So I feel very blessed that you've made the time for today. Rachel, maybe for people who don't know, maybe you could start off by just telling us who you are. And in particular, this research, this corporate fundraising in 2026, we had behind the partnerships research. Maybe you could just tell us a little bit about what brought you to that. Sure. So I have been in the third sector in fundraising for about 18 years now. The vast majority of that time was spent in corporate partnerships. Before I set up my consultancy, I spent four years in a senior leadership role doing other areas of fundraising and marketing. But really, corporate is where my heart lies. And I wanted to get back to that. So I set up my consultancy last May, June time. And one of the things I wanted, I knew I wanted to do fairly quickly, was some research. And really that was, I think, informed by my 17, 18 years working in corporate fundraising, what I saw in the teams that I was working with over that time. And what I also knew myself about corporate, about fundraising. I think over the last year or two in particular, it's being spoken about as a real growth area. And whilst that is true, I think sometimes the reality on the ground for corporate fundraisers can feel a bit stickier than that. And so I just wanted to really talk to the people doing the job day in, day out, you know, at the call face and find out what it was like for them. And start to gather some trends and themes to really uncover, okay, if we're saying that corporate is this big growth area, what do we need to zone in on to actually accelerate some of that and to do it better. But more than that, I think it's about giving the people doing the role, the support, the backup, the tools, the impact data, the resources, giving them what they need to do it really, really effectively, and to uncover where we're getting stuck and what might help. Speed up some of that progress. So that was really motivation for doing the research. And really to help advocate for fundraisers, I think as well, so that when we do, there are some themes that have come out of the report, they're able to go and have that conversation with senior leadership and advocate for more resource, better impact data, support from SLT and networking, and this journey, whatever it might be, but they've got the thing that they can take with them to say, look, this isn't just my experience. This is what other people are seeing, thinking, experiencing too. Because it does feel like there's that real divide, doesn't it, between the actual people who are doing the corporate fundraisers on the ground and the difficulties and the challenges there? And then that kind of glossy packaged idea of corporate fundraising, which is another shiny golf classic, or these statistics that show how much wealth is out there with the businesses and all this, you know, your CEO and your board coming to you with this kind of this presupposing about corporate fundraising, but actually on the ground, you've lived it as a corporate fundraiser. It's tricky. It's like time consuming. It's tough. It's like there's very little support out there. And very often you're the only person looking after this. You maybe don't have people alongside you to support you. Yeah, exactly that. I think that one of the biggest misconceptions I keep seeing, and I'm seeing this actually a lot in my consultancy, is the length of time it takes to build a good corporate pipeline, is inverting that into meaningful relationships. Like, you know, corporate is being spoken about a lot in the sector at the moment as a growth area, as I said, as a way of diversifying income quite rightly, I think, but not a quick fix, you know, you have to, you have to keep plug in a way of it. It's not something you can pick up and put down. It's got to be day in, day out, weekend, week out month after month after month after month, when it, you know, the boring stuff, the research, the following up, the chasing, the student, you know, identifying stewardship opportunities for people at the right time at the right level. The internal work actually, that it takes to develop really good partnerships, which often I think is even greater than the external stuff, you know, actually influencing and engaging the right people internally within your organisation to get them on board and doing the things you know they need to do, because it is a thing, or you do, you cannot build a good corporate pipeline just by, you know, the single fundraiser, or even the corporate partnerships team, if you have one, it has to be an organisational effort. And that level of consistency and persistence. Rachel, you froze on an absolute cliffhanger there around persistence. I'll just see, Rachel, they're back. Yeah, it's great. You were saying about the whole team, the whole organisation working together persistence. Yes, it takes a lot of consistency and sometimes that's not, that's in conflict to the glossy, as you said, the glossy package, you know, corporate partnerships, this sort of flashy version that we're sometimes sold actually behind the scenes. It's a lot of consistent, sometimes boring work, that's what it takes. So this research, we've linked to it in the description here. If you're watching us on LinkedIn or listening to the podcast, you'll find a link to it. It's Rachel's website, which is RachelHconsulting.com, and it's corporate fundraising in 2026, the reality behind the partnerships. And you've got a wonderful introduction here from FireSide Fundraising, and I do want to give a shout out to Andy King and the wonderful team at FireSide because they've been so supportive of the corporate partnerships conference as well. So, especially nod to Andy there. But just in terms of this report, what surprised you in it Rachel, what was the thing that jumped out of you that maybe you didn't expect going into this as someone who's lived as a corporate fundraising? I think the thing that surprised me the most was the level of alignment in some of the responses that I was seeing. I expected to see more thematic responses in terms of the different size charities and roles, but actually there was a real themes that were coming out regardless of size of charity or seniority level. And these things were like lack of understanding, internal understanding. That was a massive one that came through that fundraisers felt like sometimes they were banging the drum by themselves without that understanding of the whole organisation of the different parts that they needed other people to play in order to make corporate fundraising really successful. Secondly, I think I knew I've just from my own experience, but I didn't expect to see it reflected quite so loudly, I think, because the lack of time and capacity, like people were really quite honest about that in terms of not feeling like they had enough time to do this work in a really meaningful way, and that constant squeezing more and more and more into roles as, you know, we've seen over the past couple of years, the sector is under pressure, you know, there's big organisations that previously we would have considered really stable, making redundancies, report a, you know, one role is suddenly becoming what would have been, you know, two or three squeezed into one, and I think people are really, really feeling that, and that came through really, really loud and clear, and of course, you know, the pressure to deliver income is always. It's always there, and it's part and parcel of any fundraising role, but I think sometimes fundraisers can feel like they're carrying that on their own shoulders, and I heard that quite a lot from the report as well, and you know, ultimately income is something that is, should the responsibility to generate income should be born by the whole organisation, but I think sometimes fundraising feel quite alone in that. Yeah, absolutely unsupported, and I think that's a really interesting point about the lack of understanding, and one of the statistics that I think jumped out at me was 9% of respondents said their organisation fully understands and champions corporate partnerships, and only 9% are in that level supporting the fundraising department and what they're doing there. That's pretty bleak, isn't it? That's probably the biggest surprise from the whole report, yeah, 9%, that's pretty stark, isn't it? I think that speaks a little bit to the level of maturity that we're seeing in terms of corporate partnerships. There's a lot of organisations out there doing corporate fundraising or wanting to do more corporate fundraising, but actually I think partnerships, true partnerships is a level up, you know, and I think that probably speaks to that gap between fundraising and partnerships, and the organisational buy-in you need in order to translate corporate fundraising into meaningful multi-year strategically-lined partnerships. Yeah, it's one of the things that comes up every year in the corporate conference is this disjoint between even financially the 12-month targets and that kind of 18-month pipeline, you know, that 18-month two-year pipeline, the time it takes, you'll talk about multi-year strategies and things like that, but most of the fundraisers who are watching this or who are working in corporate fundraising are working to 12-month targets and it always just seems like a complete disjoint in terms of how we do our jobs. Yeah, it is, and the fundraising teams, the corporate fundraising teams that I've worked in, that's a constant narrative and it will be very familiar to any corporate fundraiser that, you know, delivering in-year income versus building longer-term partnerships, where do I spend my time, where do I focus? And if you're lucky, you've got a senior leadership team that understands that tension and is supportive of giving you a fairly low in-year income target and a much bigger stretch over year two and three so that you've got the time and space to really develop those longer-term higher-value partnerships, but that's not always the case. And I think when that's not the case, inevitably it's the big long-term, strategically aligned partnership building that suffers, you just don't have the time or space to do it because you've got the pressure to deliver in-year. I'm interested, anyone who's watching on LinkedIn, I'm very interested to hear your thoughts in the comments. I know it's a strange one to cut comment on corporate fundraising because you're at risk of anyone on LinkedIn and potential partners seeing your comments, but I'm curious to hear how people have felt supported in the past, how their organization has shown them support, maybe some positive experiences I would very much love to hear. But while we're thinking about that, the other thing that really interested me that you touched on there was about capacity and you talk a lot about fundraiser burnout and this idea that I mean it's a really hot topic in the sector, like every area feels overstretched, everyone feels overworked, everyone's getting the budget, they need no one seems to be getting the support they need. In corporate fundraising in particular, is this something that's getting worse, do you think, or something that's getting better, you touched on it there about consolidating roles into less people? I mean, are we continuing down that path or what can we do to kind of bring us around? Yeah, I think that we are at the moment. I think that unfortunately that's certainly what I heard come through in the report and it was interesting because I think that there are some things that contribute to burnout. One is obviously capacity and resource and if you are having, you know, if you've seen redundancies in the team or reduced budgets and fewer people being asked to do more with less inevitably that has a big impact on well-being and could lead to burnout. But I think that there's some other structural issues. It plays specifically that feed into corporate fundraiser burnout and some of these came through the report or hinted at in the report and it's things like lack of access to clear fundraising propositions, lack of impact data. Those two things in and of themselves impact on a fundraiser's ability to build good fundraising propositions and to report on what you're doing with partners in a meaningful way and to demonstrate the impact you're creating. It practically has an impact on you as an individual and feeling that you can't operate at the level you need to be operating at in order to fulfil your duties in terms of the partnerships that you're creating. And I think that does have a real impact on a fundraiser's ability to deliver at the level they know they can deliver at. And that's sort of lack of access to the right tools. A big one that came out was not having the right systems and processes in place so not having a decent CRM system, not having any prospecting tools, all of these things. And I think to paraphrase quotes that came through the report, it's fundraising with the hands tied behind your back kind of thing. Partnerships without having the tools to do it properly can over time I think where people down. What do you think as a fundraiser maybe listening to this? Where do we influence the change in that? I mean, I think things like your report available on your website, things like your report are so useful in terms of bringing and showing to CEOs and boards and kind of building that case when you're having those internal struggles. But what else could perhaps an individual maybe do in practice to be more, is it about being more vocal about this? What, where does the change start? Is that a question to me or a question to people in the chat? I mean, that's to you Rachel unless you're trying to avoid answering it. No, no, no. I don't know. I don't know. Well, it's difficult, isn't it? Because ultimately it does start with you as an individual in terms of surfacing these issues and feeling like you can be honest around the experiences that you're having and talking to your senior leaders and engaging your senior leaders in that experience. But it's a really difficult one because sometimes there are power relationships at play and lots of levels of hierarchy and bureaucracy to get to decision makers. But ultimately I do think it is about being honest about what you can deliver with the capacity and tools that you're being given. And hopefully gone of the days, I don't think they are entirely, but you get handed a fundraising target without having any say in how that target was landed upon. But one of the things I would strongly encourage any fundraiser to do if they're not already doing it is have a really, really involved say in how budgets are built. If you as a fundraiser are feeding into the budget planning process, you will be able to say an early stage, what is feasible with your time, your capacity, tools you have available to you, the impact data you have available to you, the kind of case for support your organisation is offering you all of those things. So that you're not flagging, you know, through quarters of the way through the year, we're not going to make our target at it. You've been involved right from the word go and actually engaged with senior stakeholders right from the word go to say with what I've got available to me right now, this is what I think is realistic for the next 12 months. That's interesting. I think you're maybe being optimistic by saying those days are gone because I think there are still a lot of fundraisers who have just handed their target or it's just a 20% increase on last year, regardless of what else is happening. That's what you're going to do. Like that, that's what's really ridiculous. Yeah, yeah, it's ridiculous. And I will shout out to our conference again, which is happening at the end of this month. We do have a session in there how to set realistic corporate fundraising targets, which I think will be really relevant to this. We've got some comments on the LinkedIn live chat. Jamie said I think support is also directly related to understanding. Life is always easier as a fundraiser if you have senior staff who have been in a similar role in the past, understand challenges, etc. Yeah, and I think we're seeing more of that as fundraisers moving into CEO roles. Fundraisers, thankfully, taking up more board positions and so having that voice on your side coming down from the top? - Yeah, 100% and interestingly, one of the in-depth conversations I had as part of my research was with a very experienced recruitment consultant in the sector and he was saying that where he sees real disconnect in terms of recruiting successfully is where you don't have fundraisers with a seat at the table or the top table, you know, because it is that lack of understanding in terms of what it takes to recruit the right person to ensure they've got the tools to do the job and they can deliver at the right level. You've got to have fundraising represented at a senior level in an organisation. It's not, you know, and maybe this does still happen. You know, fundraising scene isn't add on, which blows my mind, you know, in impact-led organisations that are dependent on generating income that fundraising can still be seen in some circumstances as a bit of a nice to have rather than into everything that you're doing. - Yeah, a complete side department. I mean, I mean, maybe not so much a necessary evil these days, but seen as an inconvenience sometimes, you know, like I wish we could just get on with the good work instead of asking for money. Shantella said here, "I think the intention to support is very much there for getting other income streams on board to fully understand the role and how they can support is much trickier." Yeah, and I understand that absolutely. I mean, we had our fundraising marketing conference talking a lot about breaking down silos last month, but I think in all of our conferences, there's a theme there where we're talking about how, you keep saying at Rachel, how to get the organisation as a whole to work together, and it's not just about this target and this department and this target and this department. It's all interesting. - I saw something on LinkedIn a while ago, and I think it was Andy actually from first-time fundraising that posted it, and I cannot remember where it came from originally, but it was a really interesting take of why sometimes this happens and a lot of it is the fundamentally very different ways of working that fundraising hats compared to say, a service department that need to be very, very thoughtful, forward planning, impact led, risk adverse, cautious, all of those things that actually, I'm not to say fundraising isn't any of those things, but tend to be faster moving, more open to taking risks. And there's an app-limperage situation, and sometimes that's why there isn't that mutual ground. So organisations need to be more thoughtful in terms of how they proactively tackle the differences in departments and organisations and natural preferences and ways of working and find ways to bring teams and departments together to work and to collaborate and break down silos proactively, rather than thinking it's just going to happen or people will just find a way. I think it has to be an organisational priority in order to make that work. - That's so interesting. I've never really considered those. I've always thought of them as two very separate, almost separate businesses that the programme delivery and the fundraising marketing, but you'll touch on there how they almost have contradictory opposite qualities is so interesting. That speed, they move the risk, like you need it the other way and so trying to run or one organisation to fall in line with both of that. - Exactly. - That echoes back to being on the ground and just that complete disjoint I used to feel. - Yeah, exactly. - That's mean. Kelly has said, that's so interesting. I keep saying, "Preach Rachel to the screen." It's got to point where 12 month, 18 month appearing in strategy now raises a red flag for me as an indicator of lack of understanding somewhere in the, yeah, 100% Kelly. Yes, there are fabulous lucky strikes where a significant donation will come through a short relationship for planning for relying on these is just asking for trouble in the long term. - Yeah. - 100%. Matthew said, "My experience delivering large strategic partnerships is having to do so much internal work just to facilitate having the infrastructure systems and processes to deliver those well and at the level of a big corporate partner needs, often and after thought, yeah, 100%. I mean, so much of fundraising is managing internally. It's like internal marketing to the people around you and the people above you to almost sell fundraising." - Yeah, you do feel like you're doing a continuous sales job internally to try and bring people on, you know, dragging people sometimes along with you rather than them being active partners in what you're trying to achieve. - Absolutely. - It's bleak. But it's not bleak. It's optimistic because every time I talk to a corporate fundraiser, I always feel better about it that we're all pointing in the same direction and it's just part of the work, it's part of the job. Let me take a little side step because we've got a session in the conference talking about the charity of the year programs and I'm really curious, Rachel, about your personal opinion on charity of the year and I guess what you heard people saying, I guess, in the feedback around it. - Yeah, I mean, there's been a lot of talk, hasn't that, about charity of the year over the past couple of years. And I think thankfully there's been a bit more honesty coming out from the people having to go for these processes to say, you know, what this isn't always working for us, quite rightly. I think my personal take on this is that there is still a place for charity of the year that there are some really great charity of the year programs out there. But I think there's some contingencies involved in that and I think this was probably reflected in the report as well. There is some nuance involved. It's not a, you know, charity of the year is amazing or a charity of the year is evil, there is some middle ground here. And I think where organizations, corporate organizations are really thoughtful about who they want to partner with and why and what impact they're trying to create and put together really clear selection process and guidelines ahead of inviting anyone to apply. That's number one. So you're not just opening it up to everyone. There was a lot of chat about staff votes, actually. A people generally don't like staff votes. So it's another way to engage your employees that doesn't essentially involve a big popularity contact. That was one. But I also really think that there's an onus on us as charities as well to say, no, to things that don't work for us. And I know that's hard sometimes. This is what I was hearing through my research that fund raises sometimes feel a pressure to go for everything. But in times where budgets are really squeezed, it's where you've got 10 charity of the year, opportunities coming up this year, I want you to apply to all of them regardless of whether actually we fit the criteria. There's a strong alignment, how much resource and time and capacity it's going to take us to actually do that. And what are we not doing in the meantime? What's we're spending all our time applying for these charity the year is? But I do think that there needs to be an organizational responsibility for charities to say no to the things that don't make sense to them and not to apply to everything. So whilst we can look out at corporates and sometimes point the finger to say, that's a crap process. And it might be a crap process. And absolutely point that out. I'm not saying don't. Also a little look to say, do you know what? Do we have to go for this? Or can we just say no and be more with the time that we are spending? And why are we spending it? That idea of saying no and that idea of pushing back, I mean, that always really interests me because obviously there's so many bad practices in the sector and when you're dealing with the corporate sometimes. But it can be very hard to be vocal about that, especially if you're in a charity, the risk of, I guess we always live that risk of upsetting people or like burning bridges that maybe are going to cost us in the long run. And it sometimes seems like it falls to people like yourself. You know, people like Becky Francis, who's been very vocal about charity of the years. It's often the consultants, I guess, because they, I mean, almost have less to lose or less like skin in the game. Yeah. What can, I mean, can charities push back politely? Can they kind of, can you manage a corporate rather than a corporate managing you? Are you talking specifically on charity the year or just generally? I think in general. Yeah, I think it, I mean, it's almost that imbalance of power. I'm curious about the people with the money can kind of come in and say whatever they want and request whatever they want and it's, you get it or you don't. How much have you found in your decades of experience that you can kind of like push back and shape it a little bit to be more realistic? So I think there's definitely still a power imbalance that exists and I think it's felt more keenly with small to medium-sized organizations compared to the large ones. You know, I spent 10 years working at Mill and Cancer Support and we were really quite good, I would say, it pushed you back and knowing the value of our brand. But we were in a privileged position as a big organisation that had a very, very large brand awareness and knew the power of its brand. And that, the power of the brand was publicly recognised through, you know, awards and various different benchmarks. So we had the confidence to do that. I wouldn't say that's the norm in the sector. Some of the bigger charities are getting pretty good at it and I think there's a responsibility actually on the bigger charities, not just to get good at it, to push back but also perhaps to share some of that expertise with the smaller and medium-sized charities and help them understand and articulate the power of their brand in saying, no, when it's not right for them and having the confidence to do that. But of course, when you're a bigger brand with a much bigger income target, and a larger, more diverse portfolio, the risk of saying no isn't as great, is it? You know, if you're to commit size charity and you're potentially saying no to a really big brand or the impact of that no is going to be felt much more keenly for your organisation. So I do still think it's a big issue and I think we've got some strides to making that. Yeah, and I love that on the sun, on the bigger organisations, you have that brand power to maybe push back on behalf of the ones I think that's a really interesting point. And I think credit to people like yourself who are also very vocal about things like this on social media, I think stuff like that all helps. In terms of people, I'm conscious of time here Rachel, I know you're a busy woman, but looking forward and I guess what's working, you know, what people take away from this. I'm curious to hear what you're seeing in common, you know, with people who are doing it well at the moment or people who have been doing it recently. At our conference, I'm going to mention our conference again, because we've got a good few case studies and people sharing real positive success stories. Rachel, from your point of view, what's working at the moment? So I think, and look, this came through my report as well, I think where it works well, organisations have some things in common. And number one in that is clarity. They're really clear in terms of who they are, what their mission is, the impact they want to create and the kind of partners they want to bring along with them. They're clear on what their propositions are, they're clear on their case to support, they're clear on their organisational priorities, and they have a strategy that supports that. Now, that's all really easy for me to say, I've worked in the sector long enough to know who they're in practice. It's a lot messier than that. And actually, as a fundraiser, my personal experience is that it was one of my biggest frustrations working in fundraising. Like, why can we not just get our strategy right and build some great propositions to support it? Like, it seems simple. And I actually, I honestly don't know why organisations still struggle with it in the way that they do, but they do. So I think the ones that are doing it really well are the ones that have clarity on that, because other things will naturally follow from that. It's easier to build a pipeline that's strategically aligned if you're clear on what your strategy is, and the types of partners you want to align with in order to deliver impact into society, is, you know, these things follow naturally. And the second is capacity, and that's not to say that, you know, you've got to have tons and tons of it in order to be successful. I think it's realism around capacity. What can you do with the capacity that you've got? And are you making, you know, the right choices in terms of where you spend your time, what you're saying yes to and what you're saying no to, and how much you're expecting your people to deliver? And then thirdly, I think it is around courage. It's around having those brave conversations, saying no when it's not right for you, moving away from outdated models, saying no to misaligned opportunities, and investing in areas that need investment and being brave about that and understanding that with that comes measured risk sometimes. I love that clarity, capacity, and courage. That's not you get that on t-shirt. Very, very helpful and very optimistic. You know, you always seem very kind of positive about the future, but very determined in terms of that there are glaring issues. And you know, it sounds like stuff that you've been experiencing in your whole career is still happening. But I think it's really helpful with reports like this where it's almost like bringing everyone's individual voices together to try and kind of focalize it and shape the sector a little bit. So I think I think it's a great report and I'm really appreciative that you put the time into this. Thank you so much. This is something you're going to repeat. Is this like a year to year thing that you're going to gauge how frustrated we get over time or what do you think? Do you know what? I jumped into this report as I do most things, which is at first. Think about the consequences afterwards, but it did as you would expect take an awful lot of my time. So I think annually would be perhaps too much, but it's definitely something I want to commit to doing by annually. Because I think that's where the real value comes is actually being see how things have shifted over time and where things are improving, where we're still getting really stuck with things. So yeah, I would like to do it, but annually would probably be sugar. Take a little break first, but yeah, I would really value that change over time and how things, how things adapt. So very interesting. I'll keep an eye on. But just to remind us to anyone, if you want to read this report corporate fundraising in 2026, the reality behind the partnerships. You can find that out. Rachel H. Consulting.com. Is that the best place to find you for info and see what you're up to and check out some of your resources. Rachel, Rachel, H. Consulting.com. Yeah, I mean, go there, but I'm also linked here and I tend to talk about it on LinkedIn. And you know, you can always get me on my DMs. It's probably a better, better place on LinkedIn, to be honest. And thank you. Like a good corporate fundraiser, very active on LinkedIn. Any, any final words of wisdom, any final messages as people head off what should anyone who's maybe echoing the feelings that came through this report, any final words to those people. I think it's just known that you're not alone, right? That these are experiences that are being felt across the sector and organizations of all different shapes and sizes. And whilst some of it can feel overwhelming sometimes, and this is something that I have actually put in my report in the back of my report, I've got a sort of 90 day plan. I'm trying to boil the ocean because if you do some of these things do feel overwhelming, but take one, take one and see what you can do with it. And then if you've made changes, if you've moved a little bit on that, take another, you know, just breaking it down and trying to make progress over time bit by bit, rather than getting overwhelmed by it. Yeah, I like that. That's realistic. That's manageable. Thank you, Rachel. Thank you so much for your time. It's been lovely to chat to you. And thank you for all the work you put into the sector every day. I'm very appreciative. Thank you so much for having me. Thank you. And thank you all for joining us whether you're watching on LinkedIn Live or listening on the podcast. And if you want to feel less alone in your day to day fundraising, then come across to fundraising everywhere.com. We have our corporate partnerships conference on Thursday, 26th of March. We're running that with our wonderful friends, fireside fundraising. So come across that. We've got two rooms for packed of sessions, talking about charity of the year, talking about using AI and corporate fundraising, how to find warm prospects for free and a discussion, lots of discussion about what's been happening, lots of case studies, all of that. So please check out the link in the description and of course, check out Rachel's report if you haven't already done so again, the link is in the description. My name is Simon from fundraising everywhere, and lovely chat to all. And thank you for joining us. Very grateful to still be here and I will see you again soon. Thanks a lot. Thank you. Thank you so much for listening to the fundraising everywhere podcast. If you're enjoying this podcast, why not share it with a fundraising friend. And if you would like to give us a little like or subscribe, it really helps more fundraisers that you find us. Thank you so much. See you next time. (upbeat music)