Congratulations…Now What?

[MUSIC] Well, girl, it's that time of year again. >> This that time of year. >> This episode goes out to the graduates. Let's get started. I'm Sy Jones. >> And I'm Zach Stafford and you're listening to Vibechak, a special graduation edition. [MUSIC] >> With that graduating, see, I don't even, what are the words? Celebratory, what do we call it? Isn't there a term for graduates? >> There is and I'm missing it. >> I should know this. >> Y'all can tell it's been a minute since we graduated. >> Wait, it's been a minute. >> My God, I have nightmares about that day. >> But with all of that in mind, we thought we would answer some questions from or about new graduates. I mean, it is a wild new world out here as we all know. And so we have some thoughts about the next part of your journey. Because this is an exciting moment in your lives and careers. But understandably, there can be some questions and concerns as well, right? >> Terrifying, terrifying time. It's a moment in which you're looking at the great abyss of your life and expected to have a plan to get you through that abyss. And let me tell you, that plan will be changing a thousand times and you have no idea, but you will get through it, I promise you. And that's the hard thing in this day is that you're looking forward and you're jumping and you will land. >> Somewhere, you just don't know where. >> I feel so humbled because when I graduated from college, I was like, this is wild, this is unprecedented, sweet summer child. I was like, this is crazy, no one. Because I graduated from college in 2008. So we were leading towards the presidential election in 2008. And so I was like, will a black man be elected president? And I was going to school in Kentucky, which is to say, in addition to the hopes and feelings, it was like listening to what people had to say about the election was, it was not for the week. It was really intense. And then soon after, that summer basically, the 2008 recession, all the layoff subprime loans. And so it really, there was a lot of hope, but there was incredible instability when I graduated. And I remember teaching my first class as a graduate student, asking my students to raise their hands if they, or someone they knew had lost their jobs recently because of the recession. And every person raised their hands. That was the brave new world that I was ushered into a student. And now I'm like, well, that was nothing in comparison. >> I know, I know. But it was something at the time. And I think that's the feeling of the show was that every moment in history, it feels bigger than the last. And it's new to you. >> It's new to you. And when we were graduating, we were looking down, like Obama was president when I graduated. I was a few years right after you said, but we were dealing with very similar financial climates. You know, things were horrible. There were no jobs. It was really tough to find anything. War was raging. People, our friends were going to war. You know, right now, I don't hear a lot of college students talking about in listing, but that was my brother in listed. My brother was gone. There's a very common thing to see ROTC drafting people to go to Iraq and Afghanistan. So it was a time in which we felt very little future in front of us. And so I do think you and I have good advice on how to build into the great nothing. When you think nothing is in front of you and that you have to just have hope and your degree and your faith. >> Yeah. And also, I mean, and to your point, I mean, you're right. It's like also, you know, millennials like where we were at that point in terms of graduating. Obviously, social media was around, but it was beginning to take off. And so the impact of social media, the internet technology on our jobs was just beginning to become something that we now take for granted. And so now it feels like somewhat analogous to like, should I be thinking about AI? What does that mean? You know what I mean? Yeah, so, you know, a different context, but hopefully we have something of use to say. >> Yeah, I think we do. So before we jump into this episode, we want to thank all of you who continue to listen to the show. Don't forget you can email us anytime at [email protected]. And of course, a special shout out to those of you who are subscribed to our Patreon. If you want to join the group chat, you can find us at patreon.com/vibecheck. But for now, let's jump into the show, shall we? >> Let's do it. >> All right. So first up, we have some questions around majors. You know, my major, before we jump into this, was women's and gender studies and cultural geography with a minor and queer studies side. What was your undergrad? Because I know you did an MFA. >> Yes, it was writing. It was an English major. They didn't have a creative writing major yet at my school. But it was like English with a concentration in writing as opposed to literature. So I'd had to take classes, you know, in like grammar, which was so difficult. >> Yeah. >> A very tactical class. And when you chose these degrees or these majors, did you have any pushback from people in your life? >> Not really. I think because in my life, the assumption from a lot of family and community members was that, well, obviously, I was going to go to graduate school, probably to go to law school. I didn't want to do that. I never said I wanted to do that. But there were other people around me. And so it was a little bit like college is what you're getting out of your system. Like enjoying it. Like, go off and do this and then you're going to learn how to make money. That was kind of the context. >> That's amazing because I would say mine was probably similar too. It was like go do this thing. I think my family hoped I'd go into higher learning and become a professor. But it was go figure it out undergrad and then you'll get to somewhere. So that's interesting. We share that. All right. So we have two questions for this section, both about majors, which is why I wanted to set the table of how we got to our majors. It sounds like both of us weren't being prescribed by our families what to do. And so many people, I hear that from immigrant families a lot. You got to go be a doctor. You got to be a lawyer. You got to do this. >> Engineer. >> Engineer. >> Dr. Lawyer. >> Yeah. >> So you and I just have folks know, don't come from those places. >> It makes me like, you got to be a doctor lawyer. So we may be coming at this from a different place, but it's still an important place because we are black queer men coming from black families who I was one of the first people to have a college degree in my family. So it meant something. >> Yeah. >> And of course, now I have students who deal with different aspects of this. >> Exactly. So our first question is this, does your choice of major actually matter when it comes to the job market? For example, the studying economics versus English literature make a meaningful difference. So Saehee, you are a writer. So yours does align, but you work with students. What are your thoughts on this? >> Generally no. I think probably now, and this is frustrating because it feels like the goalposts keep getting moved. I think it is probably more important if you have a graduate degree, depending upon what field you're going into. Having a graduate degree versus an undergraduate degree is going to impact how much you get paid, like it just will. Like no matter what. You can probably get a job at the same company, even doing the same role, but the level of degree is going to determine how much money you start at. And as you and I both know, it's hard to make up for starting at a very low point at a company. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> And then I guess something else I'll say is I have a graduate student and I'd like to cite her as an example. Hi Hannah, if you're listening. I remember her telling me that she got a job after graduating in tech at a startup, and the person who hired her was really interesting because she had done some undergraduate work in theater. And he just thought that was so interesting. And she said that it was like, I guess she had to write a play. And he was like, wow, so you had to come up like first act, second act, third act, you had to come up with the structure. Okay, that actually sounds like what we're doing here at this tech startup. And so I think it is more, I think it is about how well you succeed it in your major. That is important. Did you do well? No, don't have as it, middle and grades are not helpful for anyone. I'll be honest about that. And it is more about how you approached your studies and really how you can communicate, like clearly this student, then I'm put, she included it on her resume and was able to, and she was surprised that that's what he noticed. But she was able to go, yeah, and so of course I can talk with all of these tech guys about structure and all of that. So I think it's like, did you succeed? That's what really people want to know about your undergraduate education. Did you succeed? Did you succeed? That's such a good point, especially with entry level jobs. You know, a lot of jobs, if you're just leaving with an undergrad degree, meaning you're not doing something super specialized, which requires a graduate degree, then it kind of doesn't always matter, but how you talk about it matters a lot. So I had a women's and gender studies degree and I still have that degree. No one thought I'd get a job after that. And the very first job I had right out of school was at a hospital doing HIV prevention work. That's actually what paid me a salary, a very small salary at the time. And then I was writing a column at the Chicago Tribune for a very small rate as a freelancer. And then eventually, you know, after a few years I got to transition to being a little a writer. And you know, that first job, they were like willing to take whatever degree I had, as long as I was interested in learning on the job, and I had some basic communication skills, I was willing to do outreach and physical labor, and there was all these basic things. Yes. But I knew how to pitch myself for the role, and I was able to tell the story of my degree, and how it matched the job qualifications on that list. So what I've learned over the years is, whatever the job is, if you can tell the story of your degree in those early stages, and match it in a really creative way into that job, it usually doesn't matter, because at the beginning, kind of doing all the same work, and then you grow into it, and then you use those jobs to build it into other jobs, and it's always translates into something else. Maybe this would be helpful too, because I can say this as someone who now teaches mostly graduate students, but obviously sometimes sometimes undergraduate students do take my classes, actually, but also like you, we've worked in in media, big companies, I've had to hire, oh no, numbers of people. In terms of undergraduate degree, here are my expectations. You know how to meet deadlines. Yes. You know how to educate yourself and meet deadlines in the context of unstructured time, which is different from high school, right? Where you're seeing the teacher every day, where if you mess up, they're calling home. Not if that, you're on your own, you got the syllabus, the professor will let you fail. If you want to fail, you don't have to go to class. Can you, can you do that? Can you think critically? And that's more elevated than a high school education. Can you think critically, both in terms of literature, but also in terms of problem solving? I am looking for an elevated ability to meet the social contract, and that's really important. How do you know how to interact with other people? Those are the like different kinds of skills that you need to have when you graduate. I agree. No matter you're so much. I'm so glad you bring up skills because that ties to this next question, which is, I'm worried that I'm settling for a practical job post graduation rather than a job I'm really excited about, or even a job that's aligned with my degree in passion. So why I think that really ties to what you're saying is, you know, when I think back to, as I just said, my first job was working in HIV prevention. There was a version of me that wanted to go on to do a PhD in public health maybe. You know, my first few years out of college was, will I be a journalist or will I be a PhD? What will I do? So I was taking on lots of different types of jobs and writing. I was the very like millennial hustle culture of yes, try everything and burn out, see what happens, which I don't think everyone needs to do. Some people may not everyone needs to do. But what I focused on through that trying of everything is gathering skills. And when I was working at HIV prevention, what I realized through that was I loved interviewing people. I loved talking to people and gathering information and then building story around those conversations. So when the opportunity came for me to interview for journalism job, that's what I focused on. When someone said, why do you want to go from a hospital to a newspaper? I said, well, they're both gathering information, qualitative information, telling stories that story does is delivered to an audience. It does help inform decisions for hospital or for the public. And it kind of has the same beats. And even now when people ask me about how'd you go from being an editor-in-chief to a producer of theater, for example, I'll say a musical is a magazine, you know, there's a central story. There are brands that wrap around it. There are characters within it. There are, you know, many different players that I have to think about. So once you look at it at a macro level, a lot of jobs are kind of the same thing over and over. And once you just figure that out and figure out how you show up in those different roles and what role you want to do in those systems, you will better find that practical jobs actually just provide you different skills that will lead to the type of job that you may want. But, Said, what do you think about this? I actually think, first of all, it's hard out here, honey. No one with any kind of sense will judge an emerging career person for not initially getting that marine biology job that aligns with that to create like no one because it's just really, really hard even for people with a lot of experience. And in fact, I think it's great. But let's say you want to become a marine biologist. I think it is great before you do that to have been an office assistant and have done it well. Because in fact, if I'm the person hiring for this new marine biology job, I don't know if I want to be saddled with the responsibility of teaching you the basics of a job. Yes. I kind of would like you to have been a barista first. Yes. Oh my god. Yes. Do you have some people management skills? Yes. Do you know how to show up on time and not be like like I like there's a certain level of do you want your dream job to be where you're also just learning about the basics? So I think in fact, you know, I mean apply, apply, apply, apply for those great opportunities. Don't don't shut those doors, you know, before they open so to speak. But I in fact think that practical job is is a great opportunity. It's so great. I am so grateful that I spent my teens working in food and hospitality. What I learned in catering and working the line, I apply every day and juggling things in my life. I've learned more working on a catering order than being an editor of a magazine on how I deal with multiple things at once. And so my first job out of graduate school, I was the office manager. I was dealing with all the school's electricity bills. I was writing the students tardy passes. I was greeting the vendors bringing in the school meals, you know, from the truck in the back. I mean, I am not a numbers person. I was terrified. But like learning how to show up in that way was great. It was great. It's so important. So important. All right. Well, we're going to take a quick break, but don't go anywhere. We have some more questions and they are about AI. Oh, in the specific appending doom for this year's graduates. So stay tuned. All right, we're back. And let's get into two more questions. This first one, which I think is probably on a lot of people's minds. It's is AI a threat to my career as a new graduate. Should I be worried that the job I studied for in college or even graduate school will be replaced by AI? Fair question. We're seeing some new reporting about this. We're seeing, you know, even for people who are not graduating like current students, people are moving majors around and everything, which probably I bet we could find similar articles like this like every few years, you know, the rise of computers. It always comes up. Yeah, totally. Well, one, I think for people who are studying tech, that I don't even know the language. But, but you know, that level left because it used to be computer science. And now it's like the coding and everything. The coding. It's far more nuanced. I would wager that the closer you are to what AI is today in 2026, the more narrowed the window for the ability because it's changing so quickly. So that's a bit of a gambit. It's kind of like, you know, as someone who was English teacher, the fear of teaching to the test. If a teacher or student only focuses on become like the perfect SAT education, you will do well on the SAT. That does not mean you are a great critical thinker. It is not you're getting a great education. Because it's so specific. So one, I don't know if I would tell a student to make AI as its today your whole world as a student. I think it's important to think more holistically. And then secondly, I would just say, AI is about to impact all of us. So I don't think you running around like the house is on fire is necessary. I agree so much. And I think my hope for all of us is that AI will be a tool that is an assistant for all things. It's already being integrated into everything. And I wish it would stop. But I open up my Uber app and see it's being deployed. I look at my Google maps and see it's being deployed. I open up zoom the other day and an agent popped up. So we're fighting those battles. But what I do know is that my training in college as a feminist, as a geographer, as a journalist are things that carry through with me through everything. You know, I approach producing on Broadway as a journalist. I approach making a show called Slebby's Hubsan as a journalist. You know, college is a place to go to learn a skill set and a philosophy of being in the world. And you know, you can be an economist and still be a mom, but you can approach motherhood through an economist lens. Because absolutely is an economic experience. Exactly. So we think these, what you're taking in college isn't just about the job, but it's a world view. So make that the focus because that's how you're shaping your brain and make it less tethered to a specific job. And that maybe will help with the anxiety because then you can do any job through that lens. And then the world will open up to you. Because listen, journalism is going to look very different. I remember telling people at Buzzfeed, they would bring college students as you know, sighted and come to the newsroom. And so when I was there, they brought us some kids from I think the University of Kansas and they were like, Oh, our dream is to be at the New Yorker when we graduate. And I said, Well, I'm sad to tell you the New Yorker may not exist when you graduate. But if you love telling stories, you may be working at Amazon. And that's going to suck. But if you love the process of writing a story and telling that and doing whatever, you may find some solace in working at Amazon. And that may not be what you dreamed. But if you can find a kernel of that that dream within the dream, that may be enough for you in this capitalistic hellscape. And that's all I I can offer you today. And that's what I take refuge in. Is that like, you know, the dream for all of us should not be work at the end of the day. What I love about women's and gender studies is that it helped me understand my own life within this world and gave me a language to move through it. It wasn't because I was gonna get a job as a feminist. That was never the case. And I think my friends that are economists, even my mother and my stepdad who are neuroscientists, they love science not because they make money from it, but because they get really excited about learning about science. I think that should be your focus in college. It's like, what lights up your life? - Yeah, and then be creative about the classes you take and then how you apply it. One of my favorite classes as an undergrad was an environmental science course about apocalypses. And it was a study of environmental determinism. And so it looked at why did the Mayan society, a sophisticated society come to an end? What happened on Easter Island? What happened in ancient Nordic societies with the ISAges? So it was like climate change was often what was coming up, but it was also about resources and supply. It was in ways like it's macroeconomics. And so I'm actually drawing from that class a lot when I think about like, okay, so we're like, getting rid of all these jobs and we're not creating opportunity. What happens would be like, they're only so many of us here, you know what I mean? And so yeah, you'll be okay. You'll be okay. Think about different ways to envision the future through the lens of your major. And you'll be okay no matter what happens with A. - To that point, I think about an urban planning class I took about streets every day when I drive down Sunset Boulevard, 'cause there's this one section of Sunset Boulevard in NLA where everyone goes really slow and crag is like, why is everyone slowing down? Why is everyone slowing down? And I go, because this area gets really crowded with the buildings, so your body feels close, you slow down and then it'll be speed up once the buildings get further apart. And it's a design thing. And he was like, why do you know that? I'm like, I took one planning class. - One class. - Well speaking of the future, here's a question that I think is poignant for a lot of graduates. What about people who are anxious about losing the community, the friendships, the mentors that they have created over the time that they've been in college or graduate school? And now everybody goes their separate ways. Of course we have technology, we have all kinds of means, but that is a big change. What I mean for a lot of us, as gay men, for example, a lot of our early queer communities kind of come through our college education. So do you have any advice thing? - Hmm. What is my advice for this? Because I feel this often when I check my Facebook, you know I check Facebook every day for my memories and there are many professors there that I'm still friends with. I'm thinking Dr. Robin Mitchell, who's still one of the black feminist scholars of French history, black French history or Beth Kelly, a historian that has retired or Le Lafara, who is a scholar who many people in our pumpkin patch are also friends with. And I miss them deeply because they shaped my life so much, but I'm not able to see them because life keeps moving. They're professors, they go do their research and Lebanon and Paris and they gotta keep moving. But I do take refuge in the memories often in what they taught me and I tried to live up to what they told me was right and what we believe in. And so I know that how I live my life is a way that I do stay close to them, but it is impossible to stay in those communities forever physically, but spiritually you will stay connected to those people forever. I think about them and the colleagues I had and my capstone classes all the time because these programs, these studies will shape you forever. College shaped me in ways that high school did not. - Oh, without question. - And so do not worry about them spiritually. - Physically they won't be there and that's okay. You will have to try to see them. You will have to make the time and you will see some of them, but some you won't and that's okay in that is life. But college is so special and you will look back on it more fondly than you will today. - Absolutely. I have a few thoughts. I mean, one, you know, someone who teaches writing workshops and often, oh, the workshop can be a very special circle. And so, you know, when the students start toward the end of the semester, preemptively grieving, on the end of the work. And I feel it too. I start to get a little sad. I'm like, oh, I'm gonna miss, you know, seeing you all every week and it's special. You know, I get to keep teaching the class, but every class is different. I tell them I teach in the fall. I'm like, set a date in like mid-January where y'all can all get together for coffee, for dinner, or, you know, to have a little writing workshop, like make an appointment to circle back. I would say, relatedly, you know, take a moment to reflect on your community. Maybe if you had to make a list of five people, you would like to be in touch, both professors, staff members, you know, your favorite, I had a favorite custodian when I was a college student, you know, your friends, make a list of these people. And one, let them know that they really meant and mean something to you. Don't assume that they know, you don't have to write a card. And just like, take people aside for a second, I'm just like, it has been great. I know things are changing. Here's my information, you know what I mean? You know, if you would like to stay in touch, here's how you can reach me. You know, obviously following people on social media, but I think just thinking about the future possibilities. You'd be, I mean, certainly as a writer. I mean, I'm running into people. It's, it is not linear. - Oh yeah. - These relationships, you know what I mean? But I think understanding that intention is the beginning of possibility. Yes, your circumstances are changing because you all are graduating and all that kind of stuff. But that doesn't, that doesn't have to determine anything really. - No. - You know, if you don't want it to. - And life will pull you back in the most mysterious way. - Absolutely. - There was a college student of mine that we were literally in Gapston together. She graduated, disappeared. I go to a restaurant in Brooklyn, she's the chef. And she walked in and she was like, I left that college program and became a chef. Like people will reappear in the most magical way. So be open to that. Grieve what you have lost, but be excited for what is coming. - Sure. - Should you will never know what is coming. - And I also think being proactive. Like let's say you, your feminist collective as an undergraduate student was everything to you. And you're moving to the other side of the country for a job in Oakland. Okay, like are there similar collectives in Oakland? Are there people in your community there who might know someone over there? You know, begin to find out if we were in a different space or a different place, where would you direct me? Where are the fashion gurlies in Newark, New Jersey? And start asking around, you know, I think we can feel helpless sometimes when we move to the other side of the country. But in fact, it's about intention. (upbeat music) All right, well, it's time for us to take a quick break and then we'll get back to two more questions. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) Okay, we're back. We're big girls now and we're gonna talk about money matters right here. - Ooh, I didn't even see this bar. Oh yes. Okay, let's get started. How important is it to negotiate your salary when starting a new job? Our own Julia Leo said, "This is something that took a while to feel comfortable with because often there is a sense of guilt or just straight up intimidation when it comes to asking for the higher end of a pay raise." - Oh, always ask for more money. All they can say is no. They typically will not resend the offer unless it is something. So I don't wanna say it gregious because asking for more money typically isn't a gregious and people typically don't go too far. I have recently gotten a response when someone asked me for more money on a job that was triple what they were paid the year before and I was like, "Whoa, that is shocking." And we can't fit that into the budget but I met it with great spack and it was a back and forth. But I deeply believe especially when starting out, you know, ask for more money and then if it's a no, ask for transparency on how to get to that level and talk about a ladder of pay raise. What is your year over year raises look like? What does the compensation package look like? - What are the means you judge people when giving out raises? - Exactly and also salaries aren't just about money. It can be about time off. It can be about your 401K match. It can be about work from home or not. It can be about title. It can be there's so many other things going on but always ask for more. The white straight guys are doing it. I promise you and also the first offer you get isn't the highest that they're giving you. They're starting lower because they think you're gonna ask for more. - Yeah, I think you should always ask for more. If anything just as an exercise, I was reading a book today by Adi Calhoun and she talked about some good advice that for women is like instead of seeking approval, seek disapproval. Learn to develop that in his heart, right? And which is why it's like, here you are. Here's a new opportunity. Use it as an opportunity to kind of stretch that muscle. Yeah, I would never, if I want to hire someone as a hiring manager, I would never rescind the offer because they asked for too much money. I would be concerned if it's like a job where like my range is like $100,000 and they're like $300,000. I would be concerned and we'd have a conversation because I go, what about what we're doing here? Make sure you think that we have that. That kind of money. especially for this, you know what I mean? Like not in a shady way. I'm like, oh, our expectations aligned because there are $300,000 jobs out here, but not for this level. And I would be honest about that. And I think that's a good dialogue. Some other questions in this that I think people don't ask enough, how many people are on the team? How long are people on the team typically? - Yes. - Turn over. - What's the turnover? Do people get raises often? Another thing is becoming a manager the only way to get a raise. - Yeah. - It's something people offer. Look, a lot of people are great at their jobs and should get raises and should not have to manage other people to do so. - You know, like those broader questions. - How are you measured for your raise? - How are you measured? - Also, what resources do you have? I've been in situations and this is a later in career, maybe issue, but you get a job offer and you're like, oh, this is cute, but all the money went to your job offer and not the support you need to do your job. So then you're like social media manager, your editor, you're doing video, you're doing everything. So it's like, that can be a thing for sure, but is it worth your time? Will you get enough support from the team to do that? So yeah, just getting the full picture. I think people always start and in at just that salary number, but it's a full picture you're looking for of everything. - Yeah. What's the structure for check-ins? Are we checking in once a week, once a month? And obviously, what's the structure? Like as you said for big decisions that I need to prepare. Are there intense times of year for this job? Some jobs have like a seasonal epiphancy. Like if you work in the nonprofit world, certain times of the year is crunch time baby. We are in fundraising mode. I think that's good perspective to have, but honestly, starting a new job at an entry level, look, we just want to know that y'all can show up and meet the objectives. And you'd be surprised how many people cannot. - And my final note before we go, this next question is, what I live and die by is, if you're considering a job and they're offering you a salary, if they are wanting to buy out your whole time, meaning they expect this to be your only thing that you are doing. You only say yes to that salary, if it is worth being your only thing you are doing. Jobs can be things that also work for you and you can negotiate that. So if the job to buy out your whole time as a first year worker is $50,000, then ask for the $50,000 and be clear. You will have my full undivided attention, but for $35,000, you get me at 30 hours a week and that's cute for you and cute for me and I get to do all these other things and you get to say nothing about it that also works. So make these things work for you in your life. You aren't only negotiating with them, but they are negotiating with you. Never forget that, no matter if it's your first job or your last job, these negotiations go both ways. Period. - Yep, okay, our last question of the episode, what is the first major investment or purchase you recommend, not what we did, not what we did. - That's not what we did. - You recommend making after graduation once you start earning a real income. This could be personal or career related. I will go first, I mean, so making income, I say if I don't already have a savings account, create a savings account and develop some kind of recurring contribution to the savings account and it could be as much as $20 a month, it could be as much as $10 a month, but I think getting in the rhythm of setting some of your money aside just for you, just for you, it feels good, it's a good idea. And then ideally, that fund can be there for emergencies. I think what had me shook in my early 20s as someone who didn't have family support. So when people are like, you know, start saying, I'm like, well, I couldn't save anything because I was, yeah, I didn't have any money to save, but as soon as I was able to start saving, because you can be doing everything right, but if you have no safety net, you need to begin to prepare yourself for emergencies. You need to begin to prepare yourself for the car breaking down or for there to be a flood in your apartment or something and now you got to replace someone. So you know what I mean? So I think that's a good practice. I think that's super smart and paired with that. In Julia did this. I'm so proud of Julia. A lot of new graduates are entering market places in which they're going to be freelancers. The gig economy is the way to be. Yeah, that's a good point. You and I technically gig workers on the show. You know, the show is one of many jobs that we do. So, you know, you should have an accountant or some type of person helping you with your finances. It's not always as expensive as you think it is hearing that. Definitely have someone advising you. If you are taking in multiple forms of revenue, consider, this is not a financial advice, consider things like having your own entity, having other things, taxes become really terrifying really fast. So similar to saving money, thinking about your full financial picture and what's coming down the line is really, really important, especially with things like if you're going to be kicked off your parents' insurance in a few years, things like that. Your 20, 22, 23 now, 25, 26 is going to come fast. So just preparing now for real adulthood financially, please, because listen, it hit me like a ton of bricks in my mid-20s. I was like, damn, what is happening? Free fall, so get help. You don't have to do it alone. Absolutely. I think that's a great point, especially you write so many people. Even if you, like, maybe have a full-time job but a side gig, that's still going to require taxes as well. Even if it's like you're doing photos for a wedding, anything, and also like, get a side gig. I fully believe in like a side hustle. If you're writing, selling a book, something, like do something that is maybe joyful and also brings in a few dollars, some pocket change, some like bar money, whatever. Like super helpful for you to feel a little free, especially in these first jobs where you make them home, being like, fuck that job. I don't want to work there anymore. Like, give yourself a little possibility when you're able to survive when a few hours of sleep at night. Hello. And then one last thing, and this is more general, and maybe this is good for all of us, I think an investment that you should make is understand that the most adult thing you can do is get comfortable asking questions. Yes. So often, we define maturity or adult-ing or being a boss bitch, whatever that language is, is where I don't need to ask any more questions. I'm gonna pretend to have it. And I get it the whole fake it till you make it. Do not be afraid to ask how things work. Do not be afraid to ask other people, how are you handling this? And what did you do before? This is not just about job opportunities, just in general. Ask questions. Where are nice places to live? Where are you moving? Just ask questions. You can feel like that you are, I don't know, admitting some kind of weakness, but honey, the wisest investment you can make is curiosity and openness to knowledge from other people in your life. Also, if you were in your early 20s, early to mid 20s, even late 20s, no one expects you to know everything. Embrace it now. Embrace it. So you enter your 30s, a whole other story. Does change. This is really fast. You become old real fast. So yeah, that expectation that you should have your shit figured out comes that's real quick. Yeah. Well, good luck, y'all. We're proud of you. We're happy for you. Welcome. Yeah, you're welcome. All right. Well, listen, what advice do you have for new grads? Check in with us at [email protected] and we'll share some of our favorites on an upcoming episode. [MUSIC PLAYING] I'm so proud of myself because I was going to say, welcome to hell, but you saw me. No, we did. Yes. We're just going to keep it positive. Keep it positive. Y'all know what time it is. All right. Thank you for tuning into this episode of vipecheck. If you love the show and want to support us, please make sure to follow the show on your favorite podcast, listening platform, and teleprint, or two. Thank you, everyone, for rating, for writing your reviews, on Spotify, or Apple. We see it, and it really does make a difference. As always, huge thank you to our producer, Sean Tell Holder, our executive producers, Camille Stanley from SiriusXM, and Brandon Sharp from Agenda and Marcus Home, for our theme music and sound design. And special thanks to our engineers, Casey Hoford, and shout outs to our Patreon producer, and participant in this episode in our own way. Julia Leo, thank you for all of your help, Julia. And I use Shiu, who creates our social content. And as we say always, we want to hear from you. So don't forget, you can email us at [email protected] and keep in touch with us on Instagram, on our page @vipecheck_pod. For direct access to our group chat, you can join our Patreon @patreon.com/vipecheck. Also, vipecheck listeners can now get a free three-month trial on the SiriusXM app by going to SiriusXM.com/vipecheck. Again, that's SiriusXM.com/vipecheck. Stay tuned for another episode next Wednesday. Congratulations. Welcome to adulthood. It doesn't get more real than this. Bye. Bye. [MUSIC PLAYING] [MUSIC PLAYING] SiriusXM podcasts.