Christophe Carpente: On Art, Architecture And The Homes That Shape Us

This podcast is sponsored by Acrolyssa Shours. Acrolyssa has launched a new Smart Shours system, S1, S2, and S3 with HD digital display. Start showering your way through the app, voice control, or a remote for the perfect temperature before you step in. Visit acrolyssa.co.uk It's a journey we take together to go beyond what we originally probably both of us thought to achieve. And that's where the beauty comes is you end up to a result where you look back where you say it's more than I thought, but I love it, or it's different from what I thought, but it's the right thing, you know. That is where you've done your job. The Christoph Carpont architecture has always been a conversation between people and place. French born and Swiss trained, he began his career shaping environments for luxury retail brands. My house guest today is Christoph Carpont, who founded his eponymous brand almost 30 years ago. Before turning his focus to private residences, Christoph built a reputation for delivering highly considered concepts for luxury brands, including Burberry, Valley, Cartier, and DeBieres. His award-winning design for Christian Laquois' Tokyo flagship, featuring movable glass furniture modules specifically designed to withstand earthquakes, remains a landmark reference point for innovation and emotional engagement in luxury retail design. Christoph, welcome. Thank you very much, Carol, welcome to our studio. Absolutely, so we're sitting on the second or the third floor, second floor in looking out over Notting Hill rooftops, and it's rather lovely being in the centre of a very busy place, but this is kind of an oasis of calm. Absolutely, it's elevated, it's facing south, it's based with sunlight, when London allows. When London allows. It's a lovely spot both to be feel connected because it's nothing in a gate, but it's not facing nothing in a gate. I feel like very much in my bubble here, and I can just close this door as we did now and feeling a completely different space. So you began your career with retail projects for major luxury houses and over 500 you've worked on. And now, residential has been much more part of what you've been doing. You describe architecture as a conversation between people and place. So tell us how that first took shape in your early career and how that evolved into retail and then now moving into residential. Okay, well that's a very big question and it starts with going backwards years and years. I think first and foremost, architecture in any way you look at is actually about building a shelter. We can project on it functions, in various uses, different urban context. Ultimately, you're building a shelter and that would become important when you build a home. I didn't start with that because the early days of my career was in the luxury retail industry. And interestingly, it does lead to the same question, but you don't deal with the end user. You deal with a corporation that projects an image and is looking for a place to highlight this image and make it shine and productive. And so that's one of the function. The conversation between architecture and people at that point is really about making people to connect with the brand. And that is an ever-evoluting situation you take a brand which has its own, I would say DNA codes and values. And you try to connect this with the client of their time, that client and the time evolves all the time. So you end up, and I happen to have this situation with some of my clients, is you reinvent what is people's perception of the brand as time goes. And I was lucky enough to work for brands where I had to revisit my old work because of change of company's direction or management. And you would normally expect as an architect not to follow the next change of management. But actually, it happened many times that I was taken back on board to continue the work that I had started, but with a new brief. And that, what is interesting in brands is that DNA reacts to time and that reaction to time is the briefing and it changes the outcome. So that's where the conversation between architecture and people works in the environment of luxury stores. So the conundrum that you have with residential is that when you're creating a space, you're creating it to be almost time less. Yes, in a sense that you connect this home to a context and to hopefully family who is your client. And I take a lot of pleasure to find what that context means in order to define the project DNA essentially. Which is what are the going to be that let's sit the dots. I want to connect to make this project unique in this particular context for this particular family. That's the aim and that's where architecture meets people in the context of a home, which is another approach then to say I'm building a house. It's a far more emotional connection that I'm trying to achieve. And what did you learn about human behavior that you've taken forward into your residential work? I think that people are highly sensitive to their physical environment and their emotional environment. In the world of brands, it's very much dictated and it's a path that you're pushing through to make sure those codes that the brand represents are met and perceived not necessarily consciously but interestingly they are experienced through what the stores offers. Interestingly, luxury stores use to be very much into a sure force, I would say, being impressive and being magnificent and being super luxurious. Evolution, however, in luxury stores, is very much into creating more and more a domestic environment that gives the brand's personality. It's another conversation per se. But I think what it means is that people want to feel something real. The show itself, if it's beautiful, yes, it's beautiful. But it stops short. You need content, you need something that brings a soul to the place. And I think that's what brands are trying to achieve today with very different aims depending on the brand's positioning and the actual business, the brand is on. And that's probably what has led me quite naturally to concentrating more on the residential part of my work, which I started 15 years ago in parallel to luxury retail and occasionally, with people just asking me unexpectedly if I would be interested in doing their hope. And I gradually enjoyed it more and more and found actually more meaningful process in working close to the end user, rather than working for a brand that is trying to beat their end users. Like having to deal with one person instead of having to deal with a chain of deciding people who are ultimately going to beat their end users. So I think to me, the evolution was quite natural and it led to far more engagement by concentrating on residential, on building homes for their owners. Now what also fascinates me is that luxury retail is so often about storytelling and that's what you were so brilliant at. But how do you translate that narrative into an intimate setting of someone's house? Well, that's what is mostly the key of the new home. You know, if you build a house, you build a number of rooms that have functions, you have a bedroom, you have a bathroom, you have a living space. And the difference is that bringing this space to have a soul and have meaning for their owners, that's what is at stake. lucky enough to grow in a quite large house in Normandy, where we live with three generations, and the house was built in the late 18th century. And it was in its authentic setting, and the level of experiences, family situations, experience for me as a child in this house was, I think for everyone, the same, despite the size of the of the house, was all about the smell, the light, the colors, the sensory experience you built in some room that are completely different from another room. Generation effect adding it to this, you've got a very powerful mix of, I don't know dark rooms, bright rooms, small large, very different smells from what has been curated there over the years, the moments that are regularly experienced in that space, they give meaning, they give what makes the house a home, you know, where you break bread, where you where you party, where you sleep, where you relax, every single room can be transformed into a story you're trying to build with your means as an architect. So in order to understand what a client wants, because they're putting an enormous amount of trust in you to basically understand what they want and put it into reality, because a lot of what you're talking about is things that we can't see. And that's, you know, that's the cleverness is making those dreams a reality. You cannot start with the dreams, but the dreams are leading you in your work. You only know if you have cheated that completion really, it never really stops. It can be scary to hear that whole moment, but the process starts with meeting the client and listening, just observing, listening and being there to pick up your understanding of the context of their context, that text time, it's building a chemistry, but there must be a level of trust to start with, because that's everything. The sense that you want this to work, you know, you really desire this relationship to work is the beginning of everything. And then anything can actually grow from there. It's not abstract, it's like in any relationship between architect and client are never easy, because you meet moments of difficulties, you know, whether this is complex construction issues, leading to some delay, to some cost, etc. None of this is comfortable, but needs to be addressed in that relation of trust, where you give yourself the best, you expose the fact and you present solutions rather than problems. And that's how we move forward in the relationship. Are you always architect and interiors, or sometimes one, or the other? I was educated as an architect at the Swiss Federal Institute of Technology in Zurich, graduated as an architect, worked as an architect with famous architects in France and abroad. I happened to work for an interior designer, Antonio Chiterio, who hired me for architecture, and I left his studio with a desire for interior design. So it was quite a moment for me, in meeting someone like him who had an amazing talent for a product design and interior design. It was brand new for me, it was something I hadn't really approached, and that has certainly created something that led me to where I am now. A passion for detail, a passion for material, passion for the process that leads to it, because our job is complex and has many, many layers, unique to be enjoying the process, to get to what you want, because when you have an idea and it's challenging, you will have thousand reasons not to do it. The question is to resolve those questions, answer them, accept compromises, and not give up on what you are aiming to. And that's that's the process and it happens in every project. Yeah. What I've also noticed looking through some of your projects, that those transitional spaces, like hallways, thresholds, quieter zones, they are kind of in between moments, for them they seem as important as the main rooms. I think the transition between rooms is as interesting or sometimes more interesting than the room can be, because leading from one room to another you abandon a certain story and you enter into another story. In that moment is key, you need sometimes to almost either refresh or being captured by a neutral space to prepare yourself for the next, or you need actually to tease with something unexpected, an artwork, a particular material that creates that element of surprise that something is happening. And it's all subconscious, but it's very effective and it's actually a very playful way of approaching interiors. Art is incredibly important for you and you talk about it as a, it's not an addition, it's a starting point. So tell us a bit about designing homes around art rather than placing it at the end of the process. Well, it very much depends on the subject of the project, on the material we work from. So they are indeed projects where you can carefully design your interior and then think, okay, then we need to think of artworks, but that doesn't quite work because when you bring an artwork to a space, it impacts and it impacts massively because it brings another dimension that takes your spirit and takes your soul elsewhere and that balance again is a conversation. The artwork reflects on the materials you've chosen, on the lighting you've selected and the way you stage that space. So I wouldn't say you cannot start with the interior design and bring artworks, but the work goes backwards and impacts on the interior again. So you have to change and it's almost like an echo chamber until you find the balance between what the artworks brings and what the interior brings is single pieces of furniture. The lighting design is absolutely mastering everything around. Lighting is what brings life to a room while the artist will bring the soul to it really. So you can do a beautiful interior, but that ends up there on the surface of it. The rest comes really because you bring, I would say, the anima to the place. So that's the traditional way of operating on an interior, but sometimes if you have been given a space, it sometimes lacks everything that interior design alone can turn into a pleasant place. And this is where sometimes it happened. I had to start with selecting, finding the artworks that is going to bring the right energy, the right soul to the place. And you think it's easy because you just need to find something that fits absolutely not. There is probably not very many artworks that can actually wake up a space that is completely lame. And I had sometimes to do that just because the context needed a real impact. And interestingly, you start the interior design from there because you set up the soul of the space first before you actually design it. Because that's what ultimately, that's what is leading in your work. Yeah, I love that. And some of these artworks that you put in are really huge, aren't they? Christoph is now pointing out this incredible piece above a stairway with a mesh sculpture. Yeah, it's the most extraordinary mesh sculpture. It's so beautiful, yellow and red and green and orange in quite a cloudy way of bringing it together. Yeah, in a tradition, you know, there's an oak staircase with a beautiful floor. But it's quite jaw-dropping, really. It is spectacular at the same time. It's almost dematerialized. Yeah. And that's why I selected it because this is not a project we're building, but this is, we will use this artwork created by Rana Begum, a young British artist. Say the name again. - Rana become. - Rana become. she's extremely talented and she works, well there's a lot of origins in her in her work but the results is that you get to create a massive impact in a space without crushing that space yeah because it's actually very transparent and that's the same time very present i don't know how to best express it thanks to the layers of mesh creating those clouds overlapping with each other's playing with color contrast it just suddenly it takes the space it takes possession of the space in a very elegant and very lightweight without ever impacting in a negative sense on the space yeah so in the case of Rana's work we are installing it in a nine meter high drawing room which is a big of a challenge is to have a nine meter high drawing room and and making sense of it because you work on different scales different heights when you're sitting when you're standing there's a mids and in how do you react to that space one floor up and that ground floor when you sit when you stand when you walk around so this is all about resolving those challenges this artwork make make the difference and where do you find people like Rana to me come to you or you make it your business to go out and about i do i do go out and about a lot in art shows and i have also a connect to galleries and to curators that are new doors for me so it's an ongoing never stopping research really that nurture every project sometimes dedicated to a specific project sometimes with the established relationship i have built over years this actually allows to go back to what you've experienced elsewhere have not chosen because i wouldn't choose twice the same showing yeah projects are extremely bespoke and dedicated i'm not interested in in repeating what i've done before so even if it would be a similar context it has to be a different answer because otherwise you wouldn't make sense yeah there seems to be a definite shift towards interiors shaped by meaning rather than kind of what's there what do you think has been changing that shift you think it was being at home over you know during lockdown are we more aware of our of where we live is it this whole kind of well-being what do you feel has been at the crux of it i think there's definitely an evolution but it's made of different ingredients i think there's obviously a growing uncertainty about the way the world grows and i spoke at the beginning about the house or home being the first architectural task is to create a shelter that was at the beginning of humanity it's the sense of a shelter and i think that sense of shelter becomes more and more important where you find you nurture your home and your home nurtures you i mean to be frank we shape space but space shapes us and that relationship between architecture and people as you said at the beginning in a home is getting more attention there's a lot of spiritual retreat you know spire wellness has been something in the past 20 years that has grown but people realize you can actually nurture your home to nurture yourself and and find a meaningful way to dress your home that is you and not necessarily following a trend but making choices that speak to your senses and and to your soul i think that we are all trying to get back to having a grip on who we are having a grip trying to get a grip on ourselves i know i am well the world doesn't give you this feeling so i think it's it's it's important you feel somewhere in one place where everything makes sense yeah and i mean i'm looking at this magnificent artwork in a rather grand stairwell would that be your one focal piece in the house or do you have other large pieces yeah it's so it's not just about yeah so so it's it's well in that same space we've got another artwork actually from from the same artist but in a you know painting form that is the work led to the creation of that mesh sculpture originally was a painting and we were lucky enough to be able to fetch both artworks because that they were completely in separate space and the mesh is going to be a new creation the painting is existing and was at the beginning of the paint the artist's research that led to what we are now commissioning and you introduced the client to the artist and they were obviously completely on board with everything that must be so excited yes it's it's it's a it's a very rewarding journey to have the sense and the conviction and the vision that a certain type of artwork and a certain artist would resonate with the client and with the design you're producing for what you're trying to achieve for the space so when you feel this is there and it's really something that grows every day in your mind getting the client to reflect on it let's sink in and come back to you and say yes that's what we should do and it's is an extraordinary reward because you know that that chemistry you've built up over a month of working together has proven to be working it's a journey you suddenly every day share more and more with your client you know as architect you you need your client not just because he's providing the work but you need the client to resonate what you're trying to bring forward amend sometime or deviate but you need that connection and that connection cannot be about my ego it's a it's a journey we take together to go beyond what we originally probably both of us thought to achieve and that's where the beauty comes is you end up to a result where you look back where you say it's more than I thought but I love it or it's different from what I thought but it's the right thing you know that is where you've done your job yeah and when we first met you showed me a book that one of your clients was so excited by the house that you'd done for them that they wanted a book yes they wanted to make a book of the of the house they had it photographed beautifully in a book just for them and the reason it's such a nice thing to do it's a very beautiful thing to do but it's also a very tricky thing because you think okay I have the house why do I need a book on the house and I had also to ask myself you know because we were I was given the commission to produce the book and so the first thing came to my mind is to ask why a book you know you don't really need a book you've got the house and in the conversation with the client what came out is actually we enjoyed the process so much but that process is gone and we have the result we would like to have something that can bring us back to the process it's it's actually a gesture of legacy really is how did that happen and with for what reason and the book is really about how did that happen you know we we buy a house amaze by the house you could basically moving the next day and doing minimal works but you ended up pretty much destroying everything inside and rebuilding it from scratch keeping only the exterior why did you do that you know you don't you didn't have to there was many reasons and it just happened naturally and that's what the book is about is how the design and the clients in conversation led to this new this new house because it's a completely new house from the inside and didn't you have a muralist come to work in the drawing room one day and then he decided he wasn't in the right frame of mind paint yes we commissioned an artist and he was for me it was I was a bit scared because I made the decision we had artists working we bought artists works for many rooms and then when it came to this drawing room I felt like this is a space we should give an artist to work on not just so commission an artist to do something out of this room obviously I had quite my ideas about it so I was a bit scared to let go but I I thought I I need to you know so that was my challenge was to let go and we brought this amazing artist Pierre Bodley who has worked over his career on the most amazing building in the UK heritage building John Sones the museum the museum. He did also the restoration of the Shakespeare theatre. Oh, absolutely. The Globe Theatre. He did all those renovations. He did the Manchester City Hall renovation. Major, major works. Great talent, amazing ability to sense what's existing and how to turn the right material, the right painting to make it alive. And when he came to the space, I had my ideas about, I wanted the room to, because it was a classic setting, I wanted to cheat literally and play with a sort of impression of a classic molding by having them hound painted, but still respecting a sense of classic symmetry, but all-hand painted, with secret doors overlapping the molding. Like a template. Like a template, but in a, I had this reference from Jean-Michel Farg working for a luxury brand back in the 40s and creating a showroom and tie leg days, which was familiar, leading image of something very quirky. So I gave him that brief and he said, okay. And then he looked up and he said, well, this space is actually quite low in ceiling. We need to lift up the ceiling. I said, all right. I started thinking, what's coming next? And he said, we need to paint a sky here. And I was shocked at the beginning, because I thought, oh my god, this is going very wrong. It can be very tacky. I could see the Romans that use it, things like that. This was not the spirit I was looking for, but he was perfectly aware of what he was doing, very clearly talented, with the right inspiration. And he started, this drawing room is open south, north, and west. So, base with light. And it's in the English countryside. It's in the English countryside in Surrey. And so when Pierre started to paint the ceiling, he went in and it was like two months before completion. So there was still a lot going on in the house. It was quite noisy. And he painted it once. Then he was not happy. Painted it again. And then he left. And he said, no, can't work here. I'll come back in a month. And I was like, okay, now we have to deal with that situation, hopefully some going to delay our completion. And I respected his, you know, I understand he needs a state of mind. And then he came back and I met with him and he was painting those amazing clouds really. And I remember I came and I said, I love this very cloud in particular. It's absolutely stunning. And he lifted me and said, yes, this is a happy cloud. The others are not happy. I'll do it again. And I think he painted it three or four times to get just to what he felt was right. And I have immense respect for his work because I was at first, I was anxious, but he was about me really letting go. And the reward was in his work was brilliant. And the whole room certainly came together with the furniture I had already selected and the lighting and everything come to get beautifully and very naturally. And I don't I don't feel personally there's any tackiness into it. There's no room in statues or anything. It's very, very beautiful. And it just lifted up the room in the right way. I love that story. Christoph, I'm fascinated by your, the shelf, by your window here. Because it's like a cabinet of curiosity. Yes. You've got a, you've got a little statue of the queen, yes, giving a wave, our previous queen, Queen Elizabeth. And then a little orange rabbit on top of holding paper clips. Yes. A gold bar snow, what do you call a snowball? A snowball. Yes. And then I look over here and there's Cindy Crawford and Christy Tarlington. And then you've got some cartoon. Oh, it's amazing. It's an amazing space. Well, it's been growing over years, obviously, of accumulation of material samples. Things just picked up card received. And also gifts, you know, friends gifts, family gifts. The gold bar was a gift from my middle son when he was very young. He said this, you're going to get rich. I love that. And I really keep an eye on it because this is the only gold I have is this fake gold bar. And you've got three eye full towers. Yes. That's very much in my heart because this is obviously not what I grew up with, but this is where I met my wife. It was a very talented jury designer, Raphael, who brought me to London. That's how we actually are here. It's because she moved here for work and we thought it's not going to last. And then we actually had one child, two children, three children. And I was the last one really joining the family 10 years ago because my office was still in Zurich, where we were growing a family here. So it was kind of an adventure. Our family life is an adventure. How lovely. And then so is the the very large gemstone? That's obviously yes. That's part of our story. It's actually interestingly, the acrylic gemstone is a gift from one of my clients who was or is a jury brand. The black stone instead is a gift from my wife, which is a box. It's actually a small secret box. And she has a rough diamond that's shaped as a diamond. Yes, there's a lot of animation they agree. Or very found memories actually. That's so nice though that you have your little studio with all your kind of memories and things that you need. And all the books. And all the books. All the books. Massive amount of books. Yes, that's a must. I need to be surrounded by books. I buy probably less than I used to because digital is obviously also taking over there. But I keep digging into those books regularly and I keep buying books because that's what you do. You can't go without the physical experience of the book. Just not the reading. I feel like anything on the screen doesn't really last. And instead having a physical book is like an immersive experience to me. So I have piles of books next to my bed, piles of books in the office and just keep digging in. I love that. And you said that your favourite thing is to come at the weekend when there's no distraction. And when you can just be here on your own with a clear head and think about everything you're working on. Totally. I think when you create, you need to bring yourself in a state of flow where nothing really can touch you. And creating these moments is very challenging because you'll daily life. And as an architect, you have responsibilities, you need to answer the phone and you need to answer a lot of them. And coordination is also what we do. And therefore, sometimes during the weekend, it's not very nice for my lovely team but I have just to close my door and say, I'm sorry, I need that time now. It's not ideal because you want to favour the exchange but it's sometimes just not right. And yes, the weekend is actually a great moment to completely calm down and just come into that sense of immersing into a space where everything is possible and you know something will come out of it that will be good. But those moments, you have to find for those. You have to protect yourself and you have to let people understand this is not against them. It's just that it's what you need in order to get to with you. And that's where you end up with your beautiful Rana Begum piece. Yes, absolutely. At this moment, when I remember, because I met with Rana and the friends who put us together in touch and I was very impressed with her work and I remember texting at 7 o'clock on the Sunday to my client saying, I really wish we can complete this and make it happen because that will make the space. And I was like, going for it. And I felt like I hate putting pressure on clients but I end up doing it actually. But I know it's not right. So I didn't want to overplay it. But I felt like I knew this was the right thing. And you know it. Why should you keep it for yourself? You have to tell that's why it works. And my client was absolutely fantastic and then she replied and said, I think you absolutely right. And we'll make this happen. So, you know, those moments are extraordinary. Like, remember finding a collection of artworks with a gallery. It's just a setting of artworks collected by one person. And they're all minor works from major artists. Like hand sketches, Blamag, Fontana, you name it. all of them. There was even a hand signature from Serge Gasbull, which was completely unexpected in that connection. A small Shakal Laquayal and a Shapline, self-portrait, Charlie Chaplin. And I saw it and I thought, "Okay, we need it all. We need the Hulk." No, because it's important to understand why it's important to get the whole. It's because that collection was built with one spirit with one aim. And I didn't want to distract that. I didn't want that to be spread. I didn't want to pick one and then leave the rest. That wouldn't make sense. The talent of who collected that collection was actually the associations he was bringing into his selection. And I wanted to be kept together. And I managed to convince my client very quickly because I was extremely enthusiastic. Also, the time was running because this collection was out in the public and I can't hold it. So I had the conversation over the phone with my client sharing the image and explaining why it would make so much sense for their family sitting. Obviously, I was sharing someone to the island and he went on and we just did it. This is why the chemistry and the trust you're building in your relationship is key because otherwise you missed those moments because if you have to go by the book, say, "Oh, I've been thinking of this." And then a week later, you manage to meet your client and then they think about it. It's gone. It's not going to wait there for you. Yeah. So this is where the trust and the dynamic and the flow you're creating and the relationship for given by the project and by your vision, by sharing it, you create a moment and that drives the project in a beautiful place. Yeah. I love that. Well, thank you very much, Christoph. It's been a real pleasure to talk to you and learn a little bit more about your work. Thanks so much. The Aqualisa S-Range of Shours is built around choice. Five ways to configure outlets, four lovely finishes, three next-generation controllers, two smart technologies helping keep everything precise and safe and one completely new shower experience. It's showering made smarter, available to pre-order now, visit aqualisa.co.uk. Thank you for listening. Don't forget to rate, share and subscribe. You can take a look at a country and townhouse online and also on Instagram and follow me @carolwamit.