Child Star Finances (w/ Josh Peck)

"Some evil thing happened here, I mean, happened here." Three people die in a quiet suburb in Mississauga, Canada. It's not a coincidence. One after the other, in the same house. Is this bad luck or something more sinister? The worst investigative mess I've ever encountered. Long simmering, what took you so fucking long to get here. From Sony Music Entertainment, this is what happened to the Harrison's. I'm Amy Dempsey-Raven. What happened to the Harrison's is available now on the binge. Search for it wherever you get your podcasts to start listening today. Subscribers to the binge can listen to all episodes, all at once, add free. Hello, I'm Simon Mayo. And I'm Mark Kermod. What a great episode we have for you lined up. Mark, what are you doing on the latest take? It's a packed show. We have reviews of Heart of the Beast, Brad Pitt and a dog, her private hell, the new film from Nick Winding Reffen, a Bournemon and the Devil, a documentary about the worst film ever made and sense and sensibility with our super special guest, gorgeous George McCoy. Don't miss a single second of the latest take. We started out making $3,000 an episode on The Amanda Show. And then by the time we finished Drake and Josh, so that was like 60 episodes total for the whole show. Wow. The average rate per episode was about $15,000. So over four years, we wound up making about 900 grand. But I think we probably between agent manager and taxes, we cleared half of that. Yeah. And then. So much. Working so much and so really are we were making about 125,000 a year. This is Financial Tea. Okay guys, welcome back to Financial Tea, the podcast where I teach you how to build wealth with a side of market drama, money scandals and of course financial pop culture. Today we have Josh Pack in the stew where Emma Sandeles, our first California episode, Josh Pack, welcome to Financial Tea. What an honor. I'm so glad to be here in LA. LA looks good on you. Thank you so much. You've really only seen me with LA on me. I think it's the right, I think it works. We can be in a community. Yeah. But first, let's get into the MDJ market report. What's up, zippers? Welcome to the MDJ market report where I tell you the stories you need to know to see where the money is moving this week. And today is actually a special summer travel edition. I've just been getting a ton of questions about how to get away this summer. Get those cute Instagram picks by the beach without going absolutely completely broke. I know it's something I'm thinking about too. I had such a crazy year. I'm trying to take vacation. But damn, those flights to Europe will get you. Like it is insane how much money everything is. And by the way, just to do a quick state of the summer travel union. Literally airfers have gone up by 26.7% and lodging is up 30%. So you're not imagining it if you think that things are so expensive. And that's why 90% of millennials and 77% of Gen Z are actually choosing to stay in the US and road trips are becoming super popular. So like if you have heard stock, I'm jealous of you because everyone's going to be renting cars. So yeah, this market report is going to be all about what's happening economically that will affect your summer travel. And then I'm just going to give you tips for how to still got a way to spite it, how to deal with friends with money. If you have any other questions, let me know. But yeah, you deserve to have a break, even if things are more expensive. So 78% of Americans are going to take a trip this summer, which is way up from 2025, which was only 61%. But honestly, what made me pee in my damn pants while I was researching this segment is how people are getting creative. You might not want to do a road trip. You might actually want to go away internationally, which is great. And there are ways to do it on a budget. But you are definitely going to have to skip Western Europe. And that is why we are seeing bookings to the Czech Republic up 149%. You know what else is up? Bookings to Kyrgyzstan. Those are up 135%. Catch me in Kyrgyzstan, guys. Australia is up 58%. But the ultimate crown goes to our friend, Krakow Poland, where a pint of beer will set you back less than $3. So everyone is popping off and pulling the summer guys. We're having a polling girl summer. See you there. See you in Kyrgyzstan. Like go for it. Live, laugh, travel somewhere random where your dollar goes far. Speaking of which, let's go through my best money saving travel hacks. So I sort of just got it this, but number one is guess, go to destinations where your dollar goes far. So like avoid the multi coast and me can also set all costs. Go to Poland, go to Czech Republic, go to Kyrgyzstan. Like you can go to these other cities that will give you that European vibe without requiring a second mortgage. I do this a lot in Greece. I go to Greece every summer, but you will never catch me in me canose. You'll never catch me in Santorini. I go to these random ass small islands. It is very inexpensive to get lodging there. The food is reasonably priced. Of course, the flight to Athens is expensive, but just going to lesser known places in a known place is a good idea. Okay, my other really good tip. I do this with airfares all the time and you can do it with hotels too, but book refundable rates early just to secure your spot. Like I do this all the time booking flights, especially with points. It's really easy to cancel them. You just get the points back. But I heard about this app called PriceSync PRISYNC. And they will help you like check the listing before the trip. You can also just manually do this. And then just keep an eye on it and see if they do slash the price. And if they do cancel the original booking and just rebook at that cheaper rate. It's such a good hack. Like I said, I always do this with airfare and I'm going to start doing this with hotels too, because when I was in Bermuda, oh my god. I went on the vacation to Bermuda and I got price gouged at the Rosewood. So honey, you better be using PriceSync. Number three, book a chic affordable Airbnb. A few blocks away from the hotel that you really want to stay at. And then use resort pass to buy a day pass to that hotel that you really want to go to. It's like 30 to $40. But you will get full access to their pool deck, the lounge chairs, the poolside service. We actually did this in Bermuda at the Rosewood because I couldn't get a room. We were there from like 8 a.m. to literally 9 p.m. And we had a really weird loser hotel. But it didn't matter because we got the same luxury experience as people paying like two grand a night to sleep there. And then we just didn't have to spend that much. So expensive at those hotels too. So it just cuts the cost down of everything because you're going to have lunch. But you can't afford lunch and, you know, to buy a bed. And then also I would say like this is the summer of road trips. I am scared of doing a road trip with more than one person. Like I wouldn't want to be smushed in the back of a car with so many people. But you know, fights are so expensive right now. Definitely look into just driving. There's so many cool routes. And it's going to save you so much because air fairs are so freaking expensive. Like I'm so upset that spirit is gone. We need more budget airlines. And then I also just wanted to talk quickly about traveling with friends because I know this game so well. I've gone on trips with my girlfriends for the last like four or five summers. And we've never had an issue with money. And so I think the biggest thing is just to make your budget upfront. I always have used an app to track expenses. I will literally pay for split wise. I just cancel it right after the trip. It's worth it. The pro experience. I think the biggest thing is just don't assume that everyone has the same amount of money to spend. Like for me, when I started to do better financially, I would tell my friends like, oh, I will pay for the nicer room for us. I'll pay for the difference. If you will, you know, book the trip and plan everything. And so, but even if they weren't down for that, like there was never any shame about someone having a different kind of budget. And I will say that you also need to always settle up before the flight home. I always think that it's the best thing to do is the night before the trip ends where you already have a little bit of anxiety about going home. Like and you're packing and you're, you know, thinking about all the shit that you've been forgetting about. Don't wait until you're rushing through airport security or you're distracted or you're back at work. Just do it while you're together. Split everything. It's so much easier. You can talk about it face to face. And I will also say be careful about who you go on vacation with because if it's awkward to discuss money with someone before the trip. It's going to be even more awkward during the trip. Okay, now let's get into today's episode with the incredible Josh Pack. I was obsessed with Drake and Josh growing up and it has been such a pleasure to get to know Josh like he is truly an incredible human. And he was so open. We talked about everything from growing up a Disney star. What it really looked like for him to be the breadwinner of his family as a child. And also the actual finances of Drake and Josh because it's a little ugly. Okay, love you guys. Stay rich. Some evil thing happened here. Three people die in a quiet suburb in Mississauga, Canada. One after the other in the same house. Long simmering what took you so fucking long to get here. From Sony Music Entertainment. This is "What Happened to the Harrisons?" I'm Amy Dempsey-Raven. What Happened to the Harrisons is available now on the binge. I'm looking at the surgery board for tomorrow. These people are ****. Cricket doctors have launched their most ambitious fraud yet worth over $1 billion. One doctor says my kickback was $25,000 and the other doctors go and we only got $12,000. From Sony Music Entertainment and Western Sound, this is Dr. Billions. Coming October 1st to the binge, listen wherever you get your podcasts. So, I always do rapid fire questions at the beginning, so watch out. Yeah, so smart content. You know how it is. So, watch out. They're coming. First of all, Josh, what was your best and worst purchase of the week so far? Early. I mean, we're just starting now. Holy Tuesday. Geez. I know. I'm going to see my mother in Florida. Oh, that's a big one. You got to go see Mama. The Jewish Mother Meetup from South Florida. And I, you know, it's great. You know, this straight or her moves. It all goes back to the straight of her moves. And it all goes back to the straight of her. This is so ill, not good. And I do, you know, I am an avid follower of you. So, you know, if you're going to buy flights right now. You got to use your point. Point. You got to use them. But I was actually able to find a nice flight and it's a red eye. Are you ready for this? You tell me. I want to. Okay, you tell me. From financial guru. Okay. Because I do separate. So, you know, sometimes you have to separate. You can't find it in around trips. Oh, I always do separate. Right. It's very smart. Better. One way flight LA to Florida. Delta. First class. It's 690. Oh, that's great. Great. Oh, my God. That's a true read. I mean, even like, and whatever if you're taking the right eye. You're so, to me, I'd rather fly well at a weird time. Totally agree. Your Josh pack to me. You're just, you know, greatest guy in the world. Media darling. Like, favorite Instagram follow. So, so funny. But obviously you started on all of our favorite show, Drake and Josh. Sure. You are a very first child star in financial T. So, how much did you actually make on Drake and Josh? Like, did you have visibility into your paycheck and to where it went? I mean, I came from like, a lot of financial insecurity growing up. But a single mom, only child. And we sort of vacillated between being lower middle class and then being broke. But she worked in sales. So, sometimes we have like, a great year. And I was getting like, a new pair of Jordans. And then other times I was like calling my grandma to, you know, help us pay for dinner because we had like zero dollars. So then when I started working and on Drake and Josh specifically and I've talked about this. And it was funny because when I was writing my book, I was much more, I wasn't very transparent with the financials of it. And my friend Ryan Holiday, who was sort of like my book. I love him. He's the best. And the like all of his book, the stoic books, the stoic books are so amazing. He had two of his biggest notes because I was like, Ryan, I don't want to go Shredder, but I need like a producer. Yeah. Like someone to send pages to and you can guide me. And one of his biggest notes was like, I would be honest with how much you made. He's like, because tonight is to not bring people in fully and to give them the full picture. Yeah. So I think we made, we started out making $3,000 in episode on the Amanda show. The median rate, like right, the average rate per episode was about $15,000. And then idea of working so much, working so much. And so really are, we were making about 125,000 a year. People always will say like, well, compared to so many other tougher jobs, like who are you to say anything? And they go, I'm not. The only reason I say it is because no one assumes that, you know, or I should say, but people always assume that it's so much more. And why would you ever have to work again? But of course if you made the salary of a dentist or something like that, you couldn't just stop working after four years. Yeah, 100%. And I want to get back to your money story because, you know, like you said, your family didn't have money. But then suddenly as a kid, you became sort of like a breadwinner. So how did flipping that financial dynamic in your household sort of affect your mindset towards money and affect your relationship with your mom? I just think in general, like if you haven't ingrained in you that you never want to be broke again, you will run like your pants are on fire for as long as you can. And I have, and I saw that in myself forever. It's just a deep financial insecurity that you have everything I did. And would force me to be very obsessive in bad ways about, you know, these small little micro transactions. Where I was like really not good at looking at the big picture of things because I was so obsessed on just a month to month expenses because I couldn't get over when something would, you know, I would, I would punish myself. If for some reason I got a late charge of $20 or something, because it just felt so irresponsible. And God forbid I should go back. My buddy, Robert has this quote, he says, if I get a parking ticket, I go, all right, well, I took one for the team today, like someone in the world was going to get a parking ticket. I'd love that. It's my turn and, and thank God I have the means. And hopefully someone who doesn't have the means didn't get that ticket today because they were busy right in mind. That's beautiful. So I have a better perspective now, but like at 20 a parking ticket would have floored me. Yeah, a speeding ticket. No, I would have been a $500 ticket. I would have been devastated, like weeks or days, but like until I climb out of that hole of like how irresponsible and now what? So you called yourself to this really high standard, which is so funny because it's like the work that you do is so joyful and like bring so much levity to people's lives and you make so many people laugh and happy. But then it's like the other side of it is sort of like, you know, you're being really hard on yourself about the financial part of it. Yeah, I think it was, I just, when we finished doing the show when I was 19 years old, I had like a little bit of a runway. But I had to get to work because that certainly wasn't enough money supporting my mom and I for four years to kind of not have to worry after another year or two. I sort of touched on this, but of course, like, like you said, everyone who sees you star on a huge Nickelodeon show, like Drake and Josh, they're gonna assume that you're set for life. They don't understand it. Sure. But so what does it actually look like now? Are you earning any residuals? How much is that? No, there's no residuals on kids TV. Wow. From back then at least. Wow. It's okay. But yeah, there was, it was when the final episode we were done. You were done. Yeah. And did you know like anything about the terms and negotiations for that early acting work? Like were you involved at all? Like you said it went up to 15k by the end. Like was that just sort of, okay, this is what it is. Was were you privy to like, you know, any of those talks? Because now you hear about, oh, the friends cast all negotiated together and like, but on Gilmore Girls, they didn't. And so they got screwed. And so, you know, but I feel like none of the child actors did that. Yeah. It was a different time. And I think it was, there was only one sort of, there was only one place to do it, right? I remember going up and watching shows like all that and. Such a good job. Keenan and Kel. Yeah. And dreaming of being like, wow, like there seems to be one place where kids are getting to act at a higher level. And so I think we all sort of accepted that it wasn't as though we could then go to five other networks or go to YouTube or somewhere else and say like, well, if you don't give me the opportunity, I've got a bunch of different avenues, who sort of like take it or leave it. But in the same way, I talk a lot about like investing in your human capital and your skills. And it's like, even though you don't have residuals, you got something so valuable from the show, which is that you are burned into the culture. And like you're, it's earned. Like I think that even if you hadn't been on the show, just because of who you are, you would have found this huge career in media. But there is something to be said to you for the fact that like you have been in our lives since for so long that now like when people see you, there's this familiarity. And it like has put you in this different level of social media. Yeah. I feel very lucky that at that age, I had to figure out what was next. And I think the reason why I've been lucky enough, and I give Drake a lot of credit too, as far as like expanding his career and how successful he's been in music and touring and whatnot. And same thing for me, whether it was getting to do, you know, Oppenheimer or Ice Age. Ice Age or I, you know, I did this show called Grandfather, where I played John Stamos' son on Fox, which I just wish I could tell Chubby Josh, it was all going to work out. That's amazing. But yeah, I wonder if I would have had that same drive and desire if I knew that I had a really soft cushion to fall back on. I love that. And do you think about that with your own kids, like in terms of generational wealth, like are you scared to give them too big of a cushion, because you don't want them to not have that crit? Well, there's that Buffett quote, right, like give them enough so they can do anything, but not enough that they can't do anything. - Yeah. - And so I wanna make sure that they never have enough to do nothing, but I also, I want them to be passionate in whatever they do. I want them to know that the true, you know, virtuous jobs that unfortunately don't pay in our society, like that they can choose that as an avenue, and hopefully I can subsidize them in some way, because they're meaningful and important jobs, but. - Which honestly, I feel like it's better than like even get like my parents, put my sister through med school, and I'm like putting a doctor in the world is like what a great use of money. - What a gift. - Yeah, what a gift, like do whatever you need to do to keep this girl working, 'cause it's like, we need doctors. - Looking at my kids 529 every month, and knowing that, you know, I'm able to put a little money away every month through beautiful, compound interest, and the wonderful Vanguard fund. - Oh, heaven, a VLO. - That they'll be, you know, 18 and have money to go to a four year, if that's what they choose. Like, it means everything. - And how did you gain that financial literacy to, you know, even know about 529, where people brought into your life to help you manage your finances, and even now like who's on the team? - You know, I'll give a lot of credit to my mom, who early on, I think just sort of the stakes and what she was going through is a single mom trying to navigate the world. She wasn't as good with money as she was sort of later in her life, and I think there was just a bit of survivor mode, which is understandable, and so, but then she was incredibly helpful for me with navigating that stuff. Putting great people around me have an incredible accountant, and I have a big brother from the Big Brother Foundation, since I was young. - I love Big Brother. - It's the best, since I was 8 years old, and he was the best man in my wedding, Dan. - Wait, really? - He's the best guy I know, and he's right books on finance, so. - Oh my God. - He's been incredibly helpful, so I would say like that triangle of my mom, and a wonderful accountant, shout out, Andrea, we love you, and Dan, I've been really lucky, but I've also been growing up the way I did financially. It clicked for me immediately, where I was like, "Ah, got you, index funds." Like five to seven percent interest. - Yeah. - Don't coverage quick. - Nine percent on a great year, maybe, and by things that you cannot look at for the next 30 years, and not have to look at it every day. I was like, "Oh, good old-fashioned, boring, and investing sounds really hot." - Yeah, though, that's how I am, too. I couldn't be me when people talk about getting rich quick, and all this, I mean, you must get a lot of deals of angel investing, and be part of this company. - You're in there? - Yeah, but you're more-- - I never do it. - Yeah. - I'm missing out. - Yeah, I mean, I'm starting to maybe dabble slightly in that, but, and look, I see people all around me who've taken big swings, and have done really well, but I'm like, it's also, I think, the theme of our conversation, has been like taking that silver lining, and treating it as the blessing in the sense of these things, these hardships, challenges that we go through, and I had to make sure my mom was okay my whole life. So I couldn't, like, at 19 and 20, take the same swing, as like a YouTuber that I'll see-- - Yeah. - Who might become a millionaire like that, but it's like, but didn't have to worry. They knew they could always sleep on someone's couch. - Yeah. - I knew I could, but my mom can't, like, she's 70. - Yeah. - So I knew that I had to keep my shit together as much as I could. - Yeah. You wanted stability more than you wanted, like, these together swing. - A big swing. - Yeah. - Yeah. - I love that. I completely relate to that. And I also think that, like, there's no right financial, okay, there's a financial book that I love called, that everyone's read, they call this psychology money. And in the book, it's the whole thing. He's telling you all the things to do, the index funds, emergency fund, how to pay off debt, why you are the way you are, you know, the whole gamut of a finance book. And then the last chapter, he explains that he doesn't do all this stuff, that actually what makes him and his wife feel comfortable, it's like, have a little too much in savings. - Yeah. - And like, to, you know, maybe like, they don't take that much risk. And like, just because of who they are, they've found a financial life that feels really safe for them. But it's not necessarily the one that's the most optimized, but it's the one that works for whatever trauma's there, bringing in, which we know your relationship with money is something that I'm your seven years old. So we carry a lot of baggage. - Yeah. - So it's about figuring out how it works for you the best. - I'm the same way, like, knowing that I have a bit of liquidity for, like, those rainy day moments. - Yeah. - Probably makes you feel really good. - And sometimes I'll talk to, like, my financial advisor and he'll start glitching. He'll be like, well, it's just sitting there. - Yeah. - I'll be like, you better believe it, Richard. - You better believe it, yes. - And he'll be like, would it treasury bonds? - Yeah. - He'll like, would it like, would it, treasury bonds? - He likes dying, don't, nope. You better keep your hands off, Richard. You have a really long-term, reasonable outlook with money. I'm assuming you've been in your fair share of rooms, like, filled with rich celebrities. So what do you think is sort of the worst financial advice that celebrities give each other or take? - To give each other, I'm not sure. I mean, we had Mr. Beast on the podcast, and he was like, if you make your personality, your thing, like, getting that Lamborghini, or getting that fancy prize. Like, first of all, best case scenario, you get it, and then it's going to become something else. It's just not going to live up to the hype. But I would say, like, I just don't think there's any world where you need to posture in any, like, or peacock in any way anymore. - Yeah. - In my particular business, like, I don't think you need to watch. I don't think you need the car. - Yeah. - I don't think you need, there are other businesses. I guess if you're a realtor, you should have a nice car, ideally. - I guess you're maybe you're driving people around. - Yeah, 'cause you don't want to, like, pull up, like, and it'll be, like, a court, even though that would be sick. Like, you show up to, like, a listing in a 2001 Mitsubishi. - I'm sort of obsessed. - I'm buying from this car. - Yeah, I'm like, they got value. That's what I care more about. It's, like, does this person know, at the dollar? - And there's also, like, such, like, you can dress beautifully for, like, inexpensively. - I mean, mango. - Mango. - Mango. - Come on. - You got to love a little mango. - Quint. - Quint. - Oh, quince. - Quince. - Great pie. - Casponser, we love them. - Last thing that rich people are buying it, we need multiple homes for. Can't live in all of them. - Can't live in all of them. - It's gonna become such a stress. - I know. I really, that breaks me out more than anything, Josh, is being cash poor house rich. - Yeah. - And I see it all the time, even people who have one home, because in New York, it's so, I mean, it's expensive here, but, like, it's, and to do the renovation. And, on the upper side now, it's, like, this whole peacocking of renovations. Everyone's talking about how long the renovations take. Oh, my renovations, four years, they're delayed. Oh, it's gonna be five. Like, it's like this, they want you to know that how much renovation they're doing. - It's crazy. - And I'm like, couldn't be me. I want to rent in New York forever. I fucking love renting. - And what's the maintenance in, like, all these buildings are, we're talking about four or five thousand-hour-month maintenance. - No, it's so crazy. And I'm like, why wouldn't I rent and invest my money? And then maybe I'm gonna buy a house that's, like, a second home, but, like, a, you know, a- - In a tax incentive state. - That's what I was thinking. I'm like, Pennsylvania. - Bring me there. They've got lower tax rate. And it's like, go there on the weekends. And, like, it's, you know, will be great. But, like, even there, it's like, I'm not gonna do the whole thing. - And it's also the stress of you get that place. And then, it's like, we're not there. It's just sitting. - And what are the air condition? - I was watching it. - Yeah, who's there? - It's a fucking money bet. - But in the same way, when you get to a certain level, like, for rich people, they, when you're really rich, you're trying to figure out how to spend your money in the most incentivized way. And real estate has a lot of tax advantages. And it is something that is, you're incentivized, it's good to pass down to airs. - Sure. - So I think that for really rich people, a lot of times, the way that you see them spend money is less even about, like, peacocking and more about, like, how can I spread my wealth out so that I, 'cause income is the worst kind of money to have. Income is so easily taxed, so you want assets, 'cause assets only get taxed really when you sell them. So the more that you can have your money in physical things or even stocks, whatever, that's really good. - Yeah, you don't make sense. - Yeah, yeah. But I think that, like, for me, I would, I don't, I'm like, couldn't be me. - Okay, so what's a financial habit that you sort of kept from your struggling years that you feel like still serves you today? - Again, like, silly things, like, convenience charges and whatnot, like, I think I'm pretty, I try to be pretty on top of that and I, I just don't change my lifestyle much. - Like, even if you make money, you never increase. - I know, I absolutely increase, isn't it? I mean, look, I started making money when I was a single guy, now I'm married with three kids. - Three is a lot of kids. - And I still have a Barbara. - Yeah. - I still have a mother. - Yeah, I got a mother. - Did I want to make sure she's okay? And she deserves a good life. And I want to make sure she's always taking care of. So, yeah, I have a healthy overhead. But it doesn't feel like, I feel like our luxuries, like, if we have someone who maybe helps out with the kids for a couple hours or in the week or whatever, like, that allows, you know, my wife time to take care of herself and not feel inundated, you know, constantly inundated, it allows me to work. So, like, those kind of luxuries, I think, is opposed to, like, something incredibly showy or material. - Yeah, like, when you're buying back time. - Yeah. - Which I really think is the best way to use your money. - Yeah. - So, what do you think is your, like, overhead per month? - My overhead per month? I don't know, probably I had, like, 30 to 40. - Yes, and maybe a month. - Yeah, somewhere in there. - And how much is it, like, per kid? Like, do you know when you have a kid, like, oh, it's gonna increase at this much? Or it's not that linear? - Well, you know, because I think the big expenses come with childcare, where in the form of like, you know, either if you have someone who helps when you have a bunch of kids and/or just preschools are expensive, right? Like, even like my kids are in public school, but like, which was important to me. - Yeah. - But, you know, usually preschool isn't free anywhere. So, that's gonna run you, you know, at least, I don't know, two grand a month. - Yeah, and in New York, it's insane. - Yeah. - Easily between a grand and two grand a month. - Yeah, that's so much. - Well, the private school hustle is bananas. - Yeah, I think it's really great that you're just like out of that. - I feel lucky in that way. And look, we moved to a place where like, the taxes and the living reflects. Like, it's not, there's no free lunch, but it was like-- - Yeah. - I really wanted to have my kids grow up in a way that allowed for them to be exposed to everyone as opposed to just like an elite few. - I know, that's what I struggle with on the other side too, where I'm like, I love being by the park and I love like that area, but I also hate that it's a bubble. It's how I feel about members clubs too. I'm like, it's great that like, you're in this members club, but then you're so isolated with who you can meet. And to me, like, my favorite people are like weird comedians. Like, I started my career doing in-- - Improv, I'm sorry, like, comment, sound up. - I know. - I know. - I know. - You see me even worse. - How was it, you see me? - Great, I thought you were great. - I mean, I don't know, I'm hoping there's no performances. - Yes, I'm sure I'm really gonna be able to study. I was loving it, but like, those are still a bunch of my friends. And it's like, we've taken completely different paths in life. And like, I would never meet them if I was in a bubble, you know? Like, it's like, those are the people who expand your world and who are like, who connect with you on a different level versus what you have. What a boring thing to be friends with someone based on, like, your socioeconomic status. I would rather connect with someone about anything else. What books I read, how, like, mostly vibe. - Are you funny? That's really it. - Yeah, yeah. I find people constantly need others to, people need new people in their lives to be pre-qualified. - I agree, that's such a good way to put it. - And I'm like, just live a little bit. - Yeah. - Like, have that conversation at the supermarket. Like, meet someone. - That is true, but you know where the one place I don't think it works is dating. - Okay. - Because I think that with dating, actually being pre-qualified is helpful because if you're gonna build a life with someone, it sort of helps if someone has, like, a similar life to yours. - Sure. - You know, where, like, I've tried to date people who are, like, really different than me and, like, want really different things, 'cause I'm like, oh, this is interesting. Like, they're expanding my world view all of this, but then it, like, actually becomes that, like, your idea of the future is so different than theirs that, like, it's never going to match up. - What have you found was, sort of, one of the worst traits that someone you dated where it immediately just kind of mess things up between you two? When people are, like, and I hate when people complain about their jobs. They understand that a lot of jobs suck, and, like, I'm not saying that you can't complain, but it's, like, when, like, I wouldn't want to listen to someone for the next 40 years, talk about a life, complain about a life that they're not making any effort to change, you know? Like, I understand that we all have to do everything, like, do things that we don't want to do to get paid, and I, but, like, when, like, I dated this doctor who I feel like was really, like, gaming the system, like, like, not going into work sometimes, because he was, like, they don't pay me enough, like, and I just was, like, sort of weird. Like, I didn't love that. - Interesting. - You know what I mean? I was like, I don't, like-- - He worked in an ER? - Yeah, look, he worked in the hospital, and he was like, yeah, I was woodworking today, and I was like, did he have work? And he was like-- - I left my page right at the end of the week. - Yeah, I was like, that way someone's done-- - Yeah, someone needed you. Yeah, so I was like, okay, great that you're, like, getting yours, but also, like, I'm not a badass in that way. Like, I'm, like, I dot my eyes across my teeth. Like, I want to do the best job that I can at what I do. Like, that matters to me. No matter what you're doing, be the best that you can be. And I think also, like, if you're going to have kids with someone, like, that's who you want to have kids with is someone who's, like, bringing that energy. Even if they're not making as much money as you, as long as they're, like, passionate, you know? - Hello, it's Elizabeth Day from How To Fail Here. My next guest is the pioneering British fashion designer, renowned for his signature classic with a twist aesthetic. - It's the Paul Smith. - They say, oh, Paul's job. Yes, head of happiness. That's my job. - What a great job. - I do close as well. - Yeah. - Listen to How To Fail, wherever you get your podcasts. - Hello, I'm Simon Mayo, and I'm Mark Kermod. It's a packed show. We have reviews of Heart of the Beast, Brad Pitt, and a dog, her private hell, the new film from Nick Winding Reffen, a Bourbon in the Devil, a documentary about the worst film ever made and sense and sensibility with our super special guest, gorgeous George McKay. - You got married relatively early by a Hollywood standard. - Super young. I mean, we met when I was 24, she was 20. - That's crazy. - Yeah. - So what was like your financial alignment strategy with your wife when you were transitioning from dating to marriage? Like, did you combine assets? Do you keep things separate? - Yeah, everything is combined. Sort of very standard. - Yeah. - No prenup. - No prenup. What's great about my wife is that she grew up like in a nice way, but like nothing like crazy over the top, but I don't think she ever had to worry and had any financial and security, which is also a gift I'd like to give my kids. - Sounds like you are. - I don't think it's a bad thing. - You know, I don't think of it. I think that's a real gift, should not have that stress. - Yeah. - Being a kid is hard enough. - It's totally hard enough. So it was interesting because like in, you know, she's not about, she grew up in a beautiful home. So it wasn't about the things, right? Like her standard of living was lovely and nice, but like it was never about a fancy car or in the belt buckle or like whatever the things that I grew up carrying about. - Yeah. - She has made me so much healthier when it comes to money. It's kind of crazy. - I love that. - She doesn't have any of my isms. It's so annoying. - I love that. - So it's a different way of looking at money in life. - What do you think her ways are? Like what has she taught you? - Sometimes she'll call me and be like, I'm about to go spend $300. I'm like, live, live a little life. - Live a little life. - And like obviously like that's, you know, like it matters to her when she's going to go and spend some money and whatnot. And she's thoughtful about it, but she doesn't have any of that like those deep fears that are irrational. - But it's also interesting that you know they're irrational. - Yeah. - When you see, I mean, there's a lot of portrayals of couples on social media and how they deal with money. And it's sort of like this joke of, you know, the wife pranking her husband by being like, I paid the mortgage and then being like, oh well, like funniest joke ever, you know, like those videos where it's like the woman is sort of like, I went to Target, like I slipped and fell and like spent $5,000 a whoops, honey, like don't look at your credit card bill. - I target. - Yeah. - How could you? - I mean, take you all day. - I know. - I have to be like 10 cards. - I mean, a lot of people will clear their schedules. - I love Target running at like nine o'clock at night. - That there's a real dream. - And they don't know from that 'cause you're a city girl. - I know by girl, but I had a house, double house, I had a house in Bedford. And so we would go and they had really good snacks. - What a gift. - Yeah. - Just walking the aisles on a nice Target with a fountain beverage. - Yeah. - A fountain beverage? - Yes. - That's heavy. - And just throwing stuff in the cart, 'cause why not? - Why not? - Yes. - You know, it does add up, but like, who am I? And I'm buying art supplies, by the way. - Come on. - Am I ever using them? No, but I'm gonna buy like 1200 different markers. - Canvas. - Yes, I need it. - You never know. It's not the artist in me. But did you feel like on the way that social media portrays like relationships and money? Like, how do you feel about that? - I don't know. I feel lucky that my wife's like, I don't want to be on your social media for the most part. Like, we're not a social media couple. I don't show my kids. - When you show your wife though rarely, do you feel like it outperforms? - No, I hear in there. I mean, like, people enjoy seeing it. And she has her own social media profile. Like, I actually think she wouldn't mind if I asked her more, but I'm like conditioned in a good way. Like, she's not gonna do sticky bits with me. - Yeah. - 'Cause she has like healthy boundaries. I'm like, what are those? - Yeah. - Like, I don't recognize him. I'm like, you know, they're about to get action. Get on your mark and she's like, I'm a whole person. Like, I did not grow up the way you did. And it's healthy and she's like, and in so many business decisions I make where, you know, something will be a good rate. Like, something that could be some good money. But just long-term, it's just like, it's not a net positive for where I'm trying to go or what I'm trying to do. And she'd be like, for what? Like, we're okay. - That's so good. So she also teaches, she teaches you the value of enough, but also how to say no. - Yeah, which is everything. - Yeah, literally. - For someone like me. - So you support your family financially. Obviously, it's like a, takes a village to raise their kids. And you know, equal partners, all of that. But you also support your mom. And it sounds like you have really good boundaries with your mom, with your wife about, or like a good relationship with your wife about sharing money. But like with your mom, do you ever feel like you have to be like, do she need to call you and be like, Josh, I'm about to spend 300 dollars? - You don't know Barb. - I don't know Barb. - No, I'm not there just like, swipe in the card. - Live in, no. She's super respect. 'Cause she knows she was there for every second of it. Like, I'm surrounded by people who really understand where we all came from. And so it's a pleasure. And she's 82. She had me later in life. - What I guess? - She's turning 82 on when Sam, I'm gonna go see her. - So sweet. - And so let her enjoy. - Let them. - So if she wants to order avocado with her cobs salad, let her. - Let her. - Come on. - Come on. - Come on. - I'm like, get the good locks. - I love it, yeah. - You don't have to get the Costco locks. Costco is great locks, but I'm like, if you want to get the higher end Nova for your bagel, live a little. (bell dings) - How does the money compare as an influencer versus an actor? - When I was 15 years old and started making money on Tracking Josh, it was sort of like, I was like, okay. This is it. gives me a lot of power and it gave me a lot of security and I was like I'll never, I'll do everything within my power to be able to provide for the rest of my life. It was a terrible feeling. It's like a little kid where I was like, I saw my mom struggle but I couldn't do anything about it. You said, "Call grandma." That was the only lever you could pull and then you were like, wait, I am the lever. I am grandma. I am grandma. Grandma is me. Yeah. And then I went through, you know, again, it was spending a lot of my 20s with that financial and security because I had a little bit of a cushion but it was constantly, you know, praying that the next job was going to bring something in so that I could add to that cushion or at least not have to deplete it too much. And then when I started on social media, it was the first time that I could do a job and work at something and make money pretty instantaneous. Yeah. And it was revelatory. Yeah. I'll never forget it was 2014. I'd never been on vacation. I was 27 maybe and I was dating Paige who's now my wife and I'd gotten really big on Vine. Oh, I was big on mine too. RIP. Yeah. RIP, but it broke us all. The best. Yeah. And I got my first huge on Vine. I was a number one person on Vine. No, you were. Well, yeah. That is insane. And then King Batch beat me and he deserved it. He deserved it. Wait, number one on Vine. Holy shit. I was the number one person on there and I remember where people monetizing Vine. Well, the first brand deals came about. Wow. Remember it was July and it was July of 2014. And I got this brand deal with the stating company called Badu. Okay. Badu, of course. Of course. Of course. And they were like, we'll give you five grand to make a Vine. And I was like, and they were like, we'll pay pal you. And they were in Europe and I'm like, this probably is not going to turn out. But okay, worst case they spent an hour making this video and they don't send me the money and I'll take it down. And it hit like I posted it within an hour. It hit my PayPal. And I was like, and they're like, you want to do like a couple more this month. And I was like, and it was, and I remember within that month, I mean, like $20,000 from social media. And I call my wife. And I was like, let's go to Bali. I love that. Her boss was going to Indonesia and was like, we know it really well. Like, do you want to come with us? And I was like, oh, like so expensive. And I like never felt comfortable to leave LA. I'm like, what if I get an audition? And like, that's the one. Yeah. And I was like, let's go. Let's go. Let's do it. And like, so I feel very grateful to have to have social media because it made me confident to marry my wife. Like it made me confident enough to have kids because I knew that always being at the mercy of the gatekeepers, maybe I'll get that. 100% maybe I'll get that movie and it'll be a great financial hit, but it could be a year in between. Yeah. So hard. But this, it's like, if I continue to work at it all the time, like data has shown that something comes up every couple weeks, every couple months, and it's, it's everything. So how much now do you got for brand deals? It vacillates, but sometimes it can be five figures, sometimes it can be six figures. It depends. Hell yeah. We love it. I know there's it's so. And it's, but it's not easy money. Like Josh, you're making so much content and it's so funny. So like, what's your process there? Like is it just your brain? Like you've just always had this like genius for the social content? Or like, I keep it up. I always do it. There's certainly people that are like way better than me. And I also sometimes go, you're going to be 40. Like give it up, kid. But like people wanted people. No, I love it. If you're not a lot to quit. I want you to be barbs age and doing it. I need the videos. I would love to be. But it's, you're so right. Because I, you know, you'll hear people go, whether it's actors or social media people and they're like, well, this one deal netted me X. You know, I made $50,000 for, you know, this two weeks in this movie. Right. And people go, like, are you kidding me? Like, I have to spend an entire year to make that money. And I'm like, well, yeah, but there is an entire year to make that money. It was 50 weeks of them getting no work. And a million auditions. A million failed attempts. And they're a mom driving them to auditions when they were little. And like, just like, yeah, from, like, it's so much human capital built. And like, I know, I feel like that too. That that's what I feel like you're the same where you started young enough where it wasn't this like, defined career, the influencer thing at least. Sure. Like, and now it's so interesting to see people like pursue it. Just like, I feel like on the preface of the fact that like, it is higherening or whatever, but it's like, it doesn't really make sense to me because it's not the money is like, it doesn't the amount of time and effort that you've to put into it. It's like, you have to really love it. How do you think about diversifying your income streams? Because you have your podcast, you have social media, you have real, you have your house. Yeah. You have. And you're doing acting still. So are you thinking about like any others? Like what's like your number one? I would probably say, yeah, the podcast is great. Socials great. And then Josh has the best podcast. It is so funny. You guys podcast. It's so good. It's literally I love having you. But the girlies love it. Like it's so glad. It is really like, it's just, it's a treat. Yeah, we try to be girls, girls guys. No, you are girls guys, but also you're just like, have the best energy. And you're so funny. We're basically like two old Jewish men. You are 30 something bodies. You just, you, you need your own curb your enthusiasm. Like it's sort of that vibe. It's fun. We have a great time and we get to have on great people and just complain. It's a wonderful complaint. I love it. But yeah, I would say those are sort of the major things. And then, but then, you know, as far as I did the show on Disney Plus for a season called Turner and Hooch. And that was a few years ago. And that was like this great, you know, year of making like steady income. Yeah. That was like a nice, like weekly paycheck. So, you know, showbiz can be great. It's just you want to make sure that you have something to pay for the times where it gets slow. And the book I talk a lot about, like if you have unstable income, like whether you're in show business or maybe if your own business where you are getting paid like every two months or something, like understanding what your average is. Yeah. That you need to live. And like then, you know, still creating like a salary system for yourself, because I think it's really confusing otherwise, to like feel safety. If you are just always having inconsistent income and then you have those periods without it, like you need to like be good about having your savings and like spending within your means. I just think like don't adjust your lifestyle for a really long time. Like if you start making money, like whatever you needed to do to survive, like within reason, like, you know, pick those small ways to upgrade your life, but like don't overhaul it. Like I've seen it happen so many times. Yeah. So many people I've come up with and work with and like they had one or two great years of money. And then they bought a house that reflected those years. Yeah. And I'm like, what are you gonna do if it gets tight? Wow. I can't. I'm too neurotic, but like I didn't buy, you know, I didn't buy a house till I was, you know, 37 years old, 36 years old. And I knew that God forbid, like everything fell to shit. Like I could sustain it for a good amount of time. But what's also cool too is I love that you took the power back and you have the social media to like make money from your pocket. Yeah. And I think it's so interesting that you had that fear of leaving LA. Like that comes so much from like needing to provide. And like you, you know, what do you say? Like once you were broke, like you're gonna run like your pants are in fire to never be broke again. And it's so interesting. It's also a version of what's important to you. Like now, especially with kids, like had I not done the social, I do get offered things that would take me away for a month or two that I'm not terribly passionate about. Yeah. That would be a good way to make money come. But I'm like, but you're a brand deal from home. I've just been two months doing something that I feel like isn't great. Yeah. So I feel lucky to be able to kind of pass on those and make money in other ways. I love it. So let's do a few more rapid fires than we'll wrap it up. Yeah. So what was the first rich person thing you bought when you felt successful? Taking that that vacation to Bali was kind of it. And I didn't have to sweat it and we flew, I don't mean to brag premium economy. We were doing just fine. Okay. Extra leg room. I checked a couple extra bands just for the fuck of it. Just for the fuck of it. You needed it in Bali. Sure. What's the most expensive mistake you've ever made? Oh, I got some good advice on something that I invested in years ago. And then I just like never checked back in. And I literally wrote it all the way up and wrote it all the way down. Like I didn't lose my principle. But like, I could have sold at the top. Yeah. Yeah. And I like literally just like like a full arch. Maybe that's why we need to just be passive investors. Um, oh, if I secretly audited your bank statements, what would surprise people the most? Oh, this was a good example. We were at my wife and I were getting a membership at Costco because we were using like my family membership for years. I love. And the woman was like, uh, he spent a lot of Costco. And I was like, I don't know, reasonable amount. She's like, because we have the higher end membership that you get 2% back in the year. But it's like 150 is opposed to 100. I was like, well, let me look at your account. She's like, oh, yeah, you spent $9,000 at Costco last year. I was like, oh, my God. What? I was like, I did. And like, it makes sense now. And I think of kids and gas for the cars. And there's just so much stuff. All the Hakan, $30. Yeah. So good. So good. They got rid of the onions and the Kutra mom. That it, that was most important part for me. It's like a frozen yogurt with no topping. What do they call it a loss leader? Like it's, yeah, yeah, it's a loss. It's like a, like something that gets you in the store. I think it is a loss leader. Yeah, like he's willing to take a loss on it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They'll never raise the rate. Yeah, he shouldn't. We need it. Okay. Well, Josh Pack, you are a dream. This was so fun to have you on the the financial team. This was so wonderful. You are the best things for your financial transparency. No problem. Just being the best. I couldn't. I do listen to the pod. And so I was like, I got to come with the numbers. Otherwise, people are going to be like, you weren't transparent enough, but what can you do? You were so transparent. I think you were. You gave us a lot. Are there any numbers? I was just messier. Yeah. That's the issue, Josh. You're too good. Like, it's like, you live within your meetings. Your kids go to public school. I know. It's so annoying. Take care of your mom. You don't, like, I feel like you probably drive a very, like, dependable car. I live a motorway. Yeah. But you know why? Because you prioritize security. Hey. And so I think that you spend exactly in line with your values. And like, you're not here to, like, peacock or anything. You just never want to be broke again, and you want to give that stability to your kids and to your family. They've reached my love. They've reached.