Chet Hanks

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You were made to feel ashamed, you were made to feel, because at some point, and it could be the most minor thing, it could be a big traumatic thing, it could be the most minor, minuscule fucking thing, but it wasn't minuscule to you at the time. And it caused you, and it caused that innocence for you to fucking build walls around it and hide it, and even convince yourself that it didn't even exist. That's not who you are, who you are is the fucking person that needs to, you know, keep those walls up, build those walls and maintain those walls. And that being that person over so many years is what has caused you to collect so much pain, so much pain from having to be that, but then it shows you, all of that is bullshit. That's not who you are, who you are is that kid, is that innocent kid. And guess what now, because you know that, what are you going to do with it? Now you can open your eyes and look at it and every single person you come across, recognize who they are, that they're the same exact way. Rollin' here, yeah, you guys got to tell me action, you know, action. Yeah, all right, cool. I am an actor, a film and a stage, artist, yeah, artist, I dove in a little bit. I didn't want to dig in too much, I've been aware of you obviously, I knew who you are, but I have it like dug in, you know what I mean? That's not because I'm not interested, it's just because I have two kids. You don't dig, dude, you got a life, yeah. But I've seen you and I'm like, oh, cool, you know, I'm like, oh, he's cool, he's, he's, he's a character. Yeah. And then I kind of came to it today, came to that headline about you, it's a lot, the world wants you to be, who they want you to be, and Chet Hanks is going to be, who Chet Hanks is going to be. If not you, then who, you know, yes. Every now and then I see someone stand up for themselves and I go, fuck, fuck yeah. And the more I dug into you, the more I see you live that way. Thanks, dude. In like a very, in a very cool, in a very nice way. Thank you. I see you. You're not a mean guy. You don't let the meanness of the world. I'm not saying this from a perspective of like I think you're always standing up for yourself, but I've seen you in moments, people try to make you explain yourself and you don't always, you don't. You know what I mean? Right? Because you don't have to. Right. Yeah. It's more fun just to troll them. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Which is also a strength. Because they're not going to understand anyway. Yeah. If you did explain it perfectly, they're still going to be an adversarial. Yeah. Because that's all they want to be. Yeah. Exactly. So it's like, I think it's a matter of like just no one who you're talking to. Yeah. Like read in the room, no one in your audience. And if you know that the audience is not your crowd, yeah. Just fuck with them. Yeah. You know, because then your crowd will see that and then they'll be like, they'll get more of them. Yeah. I feel like my crowd is like kind of like people that know exactly what I'm doing. And they get it like they're in on the joke. Right. You know? Yeah. I got it as well. So I guess I became one of your crowd. Hell yeah. Yeah. Well, I've been in one of your crowd since I was a kid. Yeah. Yeah. It was great, man. Hell yeah. Yeah. How's the mobile home? So I say, I love it. Yeah. I love it. It's like, I just love the feeling of like freedom. Total freedom. That to me is, I realize like that, uh, that's the most important thing in life for me hands down. Why? It's just because of how I'm wired. Like, I feel like it's kind of like a personality type, you know, but freedom. Ultimately, if I had to narrow it down, that's the most important thing in life for me. I feel the same way. Yeah. But I only feel that way because I didn't feel free. Right. 100%. Yeah. No, I could be free. Exactly. Yeah. So that definitely has to be it, you know, like that's the reason. Yeah. I always tell people when they're going through something hard, first and foremost, I always start with gratitude. I'm healthy. I'm here. I'm alive. My kids are healthy. Thank you for these problems. These are good problems. Right. If you're in good health and your loved ones are in good health, that's all that matters. Like, everything else is 100% can be dealt with. Yes. Yeah, I just feel like gratitude is the key to unlocking everything because if you're not grateful for at least, you could have a shitty job that you hate. But if you're not at least grateful in that shitty job for your health, for your loved ones, then if you don't learn the importance of gratitude when you don't have shit, you're not going to learn it if you get all the shit. And even if you get all the shit, if you're still, if you've never learned why you have to be grateful, then it won't even fucking matter and you won't even enjoy it. And then what's the point? Right. It's like how many miserable rich people do you know? A lot of them. How many miserable rich people that have that have the fucking live in a hundred million dollar mansion? They hate everyone. A hundred million dollar mansion. That's what they wake up to. They got whatever fucking car they want. They got yachts. They got whatever. If you're not grateful, if you don't enjoy the simple shit, the simplest shit, if you don't enjoy the sun on your face, cup of coffee, the cup of coffee in the morning, oh wow, that breeze feels nice. What can you do? Then what then what's the point of waking up in the mansion? Yes. Why have the mansion? You're not even enjoying the mansion. It's like a bigger cage. And I'm saying that learning to enjoy the simple shit is its own separate journey. Then acquiring what you want and getting to where you want to be and doing what you want to do in your career, two separate journeys, two separate projects to put in work on. And for me, I kind of feel that I still got a long way to go on what I'm trying to do and what I want to accomplish in my career and shit. But I did notice that once I learned to truly love the simple shit, it made up my career happen a lot smoother. Like that's actually the game changer that shifted everything in my career. Like once I was like, I didn't have shit, I'm broke, like I'm fresh out of rehab or whatever, I got nothing going on. No opportunities happening. Nobody's calling my phone. Nobody's fucking, I don't even have an audition. Music. No one gives a fuck about my music. I mean, but I was so grateful to just have a spot, have my bike wake up in the morning. Wow, it's a beautiful day. I'm gonna go for a walk. Yeah, this is nice. Yeah, I'm gonna go for a walk, you know. What am I gonna do? What am I gonna do to it? I'll start off by going for a walk and it's a nice day out. When I got to that point, that's when the phone started ringing. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? It's an energetic thing. Yeah. Like I truly believe that. I feel like we are trained to think that we have to hustle and grind to make shit happen and to some extent that's true. But for me, I can truly say that when I was putting it all on myself, I got to grind. I got to hustle. I got to think of something. I got to come up with the plan. I got to fucking do this. I got to fucking wait, you know what I mean, I got nowhere. Like it was always just one fucking obstacle after that other, it felt like I was just never making any progress. When I truly let go and I'm like, you know what, fuck all that. I got to just enjoy the simple shit and trust God and what I'm worrying about. I give it to God. I tell God, you know, God, check this out. This is what I'm worrying about. I'm stressed about this. I don't know what the fuck I'm gonna do. I don't got an answer. I'm giving it to you. You deal with it. Please, amen. That's when shit started happening. Do you think that it's something like learning how to be happy? Yeah. 100%. I'll also be happy. Could mean peace or maybe happy. Could mean. I think, yeah. I look at it like peace. Happiness is always comparable to being unhappy. Right. - I don't feel like happy is as permanent of a space to be in as peace. - That's cool, yeah. - I feel like happiness can come and go. But peace, I do believe, and it's in my experience that you can have perfect peace. You can be in peace constantly all the time. - I found that same kind of what you're saying, and in different way, right? Because this is what I think anyways. We all start where we start. You start there, I start over there, and I think we're all moving towards something like the same thing we're talking about, which is like, what is life? Bigger it out, what is life? - Fuck is going on here. - Who am I? Right, like, what does this mean? And there's a lot of ways you could explain it, whether it's like with spirituality or this or that or this, but I'm just generalizing it. So we start, I start over there. I'm in Maryland and the sticks over there. You're over here in LA. He's over there. The journey is something like, I think if I get over there, I'll be happy. Or I think if I get over there, I'll be somebody. - Yeah, yeah. - How matter? - Yeah. - We didn't realize as we kind of matter back there. - The only thing actually in our way was our own feeling of unworthiness. - Of ourself. - Yeah. - And that's it. - We are. - That's the only thing that's keeping you from moving forward is if you feel like you're not that guy. - I can't have that. - Like, yeah, you know? - Yes. And then the journey, if you feel like, I gotta do this, that, and the third, and I gotta get to this place to feel like I'm that dude. - Right. - Then you'll never be that dude. - Right. - To me, sobriety, it's the same process. It's just this getting back to self. - Yeah. - Where you get, you know, you get back to, I wanna be in my body, I wanna be in my life, I wanna be in my mind, and I want to be here. - Yeah, and also like, what am I like even into? Like, exactly, like, what is my fucking favorite color? - Yeah. - I mean, you take all this shit away like, what the fuck do I'm like, what am I gonna do? What do I wanna do today? Like, rediscovering. - Yeah, and do you have the calm and the peace and the still? And can you be stoic? - Can you just fucking exist here, you know what I mean? - And be okay, and be without like, needing to do a bunch of crazy shit. - No, I'm okay. I think I'm okay. I'm just gonna stay over here. - Yeah. - But it takes us all a different path to get here. Some people never get there. Some people just get lost in the sauce and they never come back. - Yeah. - God bless them. But growing up out here has probably been a, in one way, I think it could make you crazy. It could be confusing and in another way, it could be a great teacher. You could see all those lessons play out in front of you and you could be like. - I definitely think I picked up on a lot of shit really early. Not so much with like being exposed to any crazy shit, but just in people and in social dynamics. - Yeah. - Like micro, even like very micro subtle social. - All the micro transactions. - Yeah. - Yeah. - Hyper aware of those. - Super, yeah. - From a young age. - Yeah, super sharp, I bet. Hyper aware, so hyper aware that it was like overload. Like there's so much information that I'm picking up on. These micro things that I'm aware of that was so overwhelming that the way I dealt with it was just tune it out completely. Because if I didn't shut it off completely, I would be consumed by it. And that kind of created its own monster. Going back to what you said like a freedom, and that goes back to not feeling free. Well, it's like the circumstances I was born into was like I didn't feel like I needed to meet the bar. - Right. - I felt like I had to excel past the bar in order for me to just be live up to who I thought I should be. - Right, so the bar is an ungodly high. - Yeah. - In order for that to exist, the work had to be done and you watched that work being done your whole life. Is that fair to say? - For sure. - Right, so you saw what that takes, and you have that in you. So that's not like something that scares you. You watched it and you learned likely that this is natural. We think we're different, but we're not so different from the environment we grew up in. - 100%. - And then we struggle to separate ourselves when we grow up. So at some age, 13, 14, 15, everyone's at a different age, but at that age where we start to reject the thing we come from so that we can be apart from it, 'cause that's natural, actually. It's like going back hundreds of years ago, the young men would go out. - You gotta go out, you gotta go out. - Yeah, like you gotta go off by yourself. - Months, then they kill a bear and come back. Right, like it's very natural to prove yourself. - Yeah. - And it's very unnatural in the modern world to have a lot of understanding of what that means. Do you understand? It was much more simple when we could just go kill a wolf or a bear. - It had rights of passage. - Right, in our society. - And so we do other things. - Yeah. - We get tattoos, I got covered in tattoos. And then I felt like I'm a man now. I love tattoos, I'm not regret it. But like it was part of my journey of like, now I'm my own man. - Yeah. - And then obviously you're out here. So, well, what are you gonna do? Oh, how are you gonna, blah, blah, blah, blah. Right, you know what I mean? It's just like a, so you're living in a world where also like, not your inner core support system, but like the world that you go out into every day, whether you're at school or you're the fucking bear or you're there. This is a LA, so it's like the town. Like people talk a certain way. It's just like, and so there's all different kinds of messages and pressure you're getting. I think from my perspective of seeing what, trying to imagine, what would that feel like? That didn't have that. It's the thing I worry about, like I'm with my own kids. They have two parents in entertainment, not the biggest thing in the world. We're not the smallest, but we're like, we're working in entertainers essentially. We're doing a lot of stuff. We're entrepreneurs, but at the end of the day, like we're out in the world and we're entertaining. And that's our job. I mean, we put food on the table and I try to help them understand it because I see what you're up against when you're feeling like you're in somebody's shadow. For me, what I realized is it can actually just be in someone's light, you know what I mean? - Right. - But the world is gonna make it feel like a shadow. - Well, really what it is is just someone else's identity. - Right. - It's like, I don't know about, you know, your kids or anything, but I think you could be common like your son or whatever. If somebody a complete stranger meets him, you know, their first thought is it gonna be. - Who's this guy? - Who are you? What are you like? Their first thought, if they know who he is, their first thought is just you. They're just imagining you. - Right. - They're imagining Joel. So getting to know, getting to know, it's off the table. - Your son is like, everything that they're getting to know about him is all in contrast to you. - Right. - If he's similar to you, oh wow, you're just like your dad. If he's not similar to you. Oh wow, wasn't expecting it. So surprising, you're not at all like your dad, you know what I mean? So everything is going through a filter of your identity is secondary to your identity. So it's like, that's a good explanation. So what that does is like, what it feels like is like, just wanting to be like, yo, I'm here. Like, I'm here too. But me, like, who, who, who I am is not even a thought in everybody's mind. - Right. - It's a not, it's a afterthought. - Yes. - Or if they do have a thought about what you, who you must be, it's negative. It's, oh, I bet he's such a spoiled little guy. - I bet he's such a fucking. - I bet he's such a little fucking spoiled cocky brat. - Or, they're like, oh. - Oh, let me go fucking. - Oh, I could go get next to him. - Yeah. - I want to get a peek. - But see, I'll tell you, it's way easier to pick up on that. You see that shuffling. - You see that a mile away. - Right. - That's easy. It's like, but what you don't understand is, why am I getting this bad fucking vibe from, 'cause you're not thinking that they're even thinking that, you're like, okay, you go to the basketball team and the coach is fucking hating on you. The coach is, and you're like, why, what am I doing? I'm just fucking here. And you don't, you didn't put it together. - Yeah. - They already knew you were coming. - Yeah. - And you're so and so's kid and fuck that kid. - I know. And you would think that, like, yeah, 100%. - Yeah. - Because a child has nothing to compare its reality to. - No. - Right. And it's like, you think you'd have the sense to know. A child, you can't tell a fucking, a 12 year old kid is not gonna get, you know, be in that, like-- - We're not gonna pick up on that. - Is not gonna be on the receiving end of that negative energy and have the fucking wisdom and self-knowledge to know, oh wow, this person is just, you know, they got their own fucking weird shit going on within themselves. - Yeah, they're just projecting on me. You can't, a 12 year old's not gonna know that. A 12 year old's gonna think, damn, what the fuck is wrong with me? - Right. - What's the fuck, what the fuck is wrong? And when you get that, you bigwitously from the whole world, and that's like 95% of the time, the other 5% is like the weird dick riders. - Right. - Those are, those are easy to spot, That's a small minority, that's a small minority, that's a small minority, that's a bulk of it. it is people with just weird energy, like with this weird negativity directed towards you. So the byproduct of that is you internalize it. - And it's confusing. - I'm saying 100, definitely confusing, but over a long period of time, the result for me at least was to internalize it, forming the belief that there is something wrong with me. - Right, and that's just like a big shit sandwich you gotta eat every day. - Yeah. I must just suck, you know what I mean? Like really what it is, is just feeling worthless. - Yeah. - Just, I broke, I felt worthless. People ask me, it was like free growing up. They have an idea in their head of like some like fucking awesome, like, you know what I mean? - You get the guy at Disneyland ding-ding-ding. - She's bringing my croissants like, you know what I mean? Like, and that wasn't her, like, that wasn't it? - Oh, yeah. - And that wasn't it. It was like just feeling fucking worthless. Like feeling like really, like just feeling worthless, bro. - Like not laughing at it. - I know, it's funny. But, you know, the funny, but even funnier part, and this is where it becomes, it can drive you insane, is that nobody believes that your life isn't ding-ding-ding, jeez, please come in with the croissant. Nobody, you could be like, yo, that's not my life at all. Like, I don't live like that. - Yeah. - And I'm like, yeah, whatever. - Yeah, whatever. - For sure. - So it's like-- - Gotcha, gotcha. - So it's like, you're getting shitted on by life. Like, you are shitting on yourself, and you don't even get the validation for someone to be like, hey, like, I believe you. - Yeah. - You know? - Yeah. - So your voice, but you still want to be like, yo, like, speak your truth. And when you do, it falls on deaf ears. - Everyone's like, fuck you. - Yeah, fuck you. - Oh, you're complaining? - Yeah, I bet your life's so fucking tough. - Well, fuck you. - Yeah, oh, poor, you know what I mean? - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - Poor you, you know what I mean? - I understand. - So it's just like, fuck, dude, like, you think that, like, okay, it could drive you fucking, it drives you to drugs. - Okay, you know how they say pressure makes, pressure makes diamonds. - Yeah, the pressure makes the pearl. - Yeah, pressure also bust pipes. (laughing) You know what I'm saying? And I've definitely, I've had some pipes busted. - Yeah. - You know what I'm saying? - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Like, like, you can snap, you know. You can snap and then you have to recollect yourself over and over and over again. - Yeah. - Snapping and then the recollecting yourself. It's a process and it's a cycle over and over and over again. Until the diamond is formed. - You know what I really liked? I liked the, you went on Drew's show. I loved Drew. - Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. - Yeah, she's such a sweetheart. - I liked it. - I was like, this is great. I was looking into this up and then you're a good actor. You're building this like career and it looks like you're having fun. You're like, you're having fun with it. - I am. - You know what I mean? - You're having fun, really having fun. - And you bring an energy to a place that feels like genuine. It feels like you're there, you're having a good time. - Thank you. - It's an important thing when someone shows up, like today you showed up. First of all, like on time with good energy. It brings a, it brings a likeness to the room and makes people feel like they can talk to you. - Sure. - And I don't know what you've been through. I don't know, I know you're sober, but I don't know the story, right? When I sit with you, I see I feel freedom. - Thank you. - And that's what I think is what do most of us want. We want freedom. There are different kinds, but it's all freedom. - Yeah. - And what a better feeling than to not feel need. - Imagine setting your makeup. Then forgetting it's even theirs. Jeldermist technology locks in your look for up to 24 hours with flexible all day comfy grip. - Maybe it's Mavily. - Right, you know what I mean? - Yeah. - How old are you? - 35. - I know you're young. - The good. - You're an old 35. (laughing) - Experience. - You probably feel like you're like 50. - My fucking body feels 50. - Yeah. - Bro, I remember when the internet was invented. - Yeah. - I remember a large portion of my life was spent before the internet existed. - Yeah, it wasn't. - And I remember it. I was old enough to remember it, you know? I remember coming down one day, and my mom's like typing on a computer. And I'm like, what are you doing? She's like, I'm just doing this new thing. It's called an email, you know? (laughing) I'm like, what's that? She's like, well, you know, when you send a letter in the mail? And I'm like, yeah, well, she's like, well, this is email, it stands for electronic mail. I can just write some of the message and send it to 'em. That's all I'm doing it on the internet. And I'm like, what's, you know what I mean? It was a new thing, right? Imagine that kids, now they can't even fucking fathom that. - They wouldn't live without it. - Exactly. And the internet is such an insular thing. - Yeah. - You know, and it's so, and it changes so fast. I kind of feel like the internet is the divide. Whereas now each generation is its own separate island. - In the internet. It's like Gen Z is gonna be completely different than Gen A. Generation Alpha. - The next one. - Next one. - Is it here yet? - Well, yeah, my daughter is Gen A. - Oh wow. - It's your daughter. - If you're about 10, yeah, she's 10. - 10, okay. - So it's like if you're 10 years old right now, you're that, that's the Gen A. - And my kids are Gen Z probably. - Yeah. - 18, 16, 18. - They're Gen Z. - Yeah. - You know? But like I feel like the internet is what's dividing all these generations now. Whereas before there was everything was the same. A kid growing up in the 80s wasn't too different than a kid, or even the 70s wasn't too different than a kid growing up in the 90s. - It wasn't that far apart. - It wasn't, we did the same shit. What'd you do as a kid? You fucking go outside, ride your bike. Fucking chase girls getting a fist fight. Go egg someone's house, play ding dong ditch. - Yeah, I mean like, that's what kids were doing in the 60s, in the 70s, in the 80s, in the 90s. And then boom, internet. And it's like each generation is doing its own weird insular thing. - Right. Like it's not, there isn't a, like just a common thread. - Right. - Yeah. - I just kind of trip on that a little bit. Like I just look at that, it's interesting to me, you know? - But also it helps you understand where what you experienced as a kid of the big actor guy who was also reaching something that hadn't been done really before, at a time where the world was changing. And again, like now, how quickly things get distributed. At the time, it was that version of it. Like the movies and shit was bigger than they could ever have been because of the, because of what was new to the world with the way they were distributed. And VHS and DVD and all that shit. So you were watching someone go to the moon essentially and probably only five people at the time were probably going to the moon. - Literally. - The cost of that. - And it's like that you're a spot on because like, I'm like just learning about all this shit. It's like, my dad was one of like a handful of other actors that would like actually get percentage of the box office. - Right. It was a new thing. And that was unheard of and it will never happen again. The reason why is 'cause the studios when VHS came out, the studios were making so much fucking money on selling VHS tapes. 'Cause for the first time in history, people could watch a movie at their home when they wanted. My dad explained to me, he's like before, if you didn't see the movie while it was in theaters, you never saw it. - You didn't see it. - Ever. - Yeah. And less some rich guy was like, I'm gonna screen this in my screening room. - Yeah, yeah. - If you didn't go see it while it was there, then you never saw it. So when VHS came out. - Change the world. - It changed everything. Well, it changed the studios because not only where they cashed in on their current movies that were in theaters, but their entire back catalog. - Right. - Like billions and billions of dollars. They were making a handover fist with the VHS. So they were making so much money with the VHS that they didn't even give a shit about the box office. That was like peanuts. - Right. - So they would offer certain actors, deals where they would be like, for example, I'm just throwing around random numbers, they'd be like, hey, we'll give you a million dollars to be in this movie. - Plus. - Or, no, they'd be like, we'll give you a, you could either do this movie for a million dollars, outright, boom. Or we'll give you $500,000 or $200,000. So these figures aren't accurate. - Or whatever. - Yeah. - For the sake of the conversation. But we'll give you 40% of the box office. - Sheesh. - So you want to roll the dice on it. If you think the movie might be a hit, take the lower pick up. But if it's a hit, then you'll cash out. He was like, when you set up one of a handful of people going to the moon, that was it. I think it was like him, Tom Cruise, and like Jim Carrey. - So imagine being the guy who's going to the moon and making these new styles of deals. And, oh shit, it worked. Holy shit. I don't know where your dad's from, but it's probably from some-- - From Oakland. - From Oakland, right? So it wasn't like-- - It didn't hurt you. - Right, and was his dad a movie star? Okay, there you go. So it's not like it was a given. Wasn't like a sure shot. I'm just going to be a movie star. - He never thought it would happen. - Right. - He wasn't even trying to make it happen. - Exactly. He told me he would have been just as happy to be in a nobody accurate doing like small plays for like a couple hundred people. - I believe that. - And he would have been just as happy doing that. - I believe that. - 'Cause that's his love for the craft. - I believe that. I'm in a place in my life where I think there's nothing cooler than meeting someone who doesn't have a price with some real qualities versus a perception. - That's palpable. - Right. - That type of energy is palpable when you meet a person with it. Like I think it's about, oh no one was important. - Yeah. - Like, for example. - What do you value? - Well, like I can honestly say this, right? Like since becoming like more in the public eye and like people knowing who I am and shit and you know, I'd be outside and stuff. - It's a humble way of saying. - Well, you've had, no but, but check out. - But this is, I just look at it as people know who the fuck I am. You know, on my own merit, you know? And to me, I can honestly say that being in a gas station and someone's like, yo, chat, your chat hangs in it. And they're coming up to me like genuinely fucking excited. And I take the time to be like, what's up dude? Like, and give them, to make them feel like they matter, you know? - Dignalism. - And to give them good energy. - Yeah. - Right, but to give them kindness, right? That to me is more important than being on a red carpet or winning an award. - It's classy. - It's important. - Yeah. - Because you don't know, you don't know what you could have just done. That person could have been on their way to blow their fucking head off. - Yeah, it's sad. - That person could be going through the worst day of their fucking life and be ready to end it. And they just happen to fucking see someone get excited and you give them back the excitement. You could change some, you could save someone's life. - Yeah. - You don't know what you're doing. - Yeah. - You could have just intervened in a life or death situation for a human bit, for another person. And if it was all just for that one person, it would have been worth it. - Even if it's only happens for one person. - Right. - Ever in the course of your life. If you did that for one person, that is more important than your acceptance speech. - Right. - And when you meet people that are like that, you can feel it. And when you meet people that have lost sight of that, and they only care about the acceptance speech, you can feel that. - Yeah, you can. - And I don't fuck with that. - Yeah. - I don't want to be around that. And it doesn't fucking matter to me. 'Cause those people and me have nothing in fucking common, dude. - Yeah. - But when I meet the real ones, where I can feel that realness, that real fucking, that's a cool motherfucker. That's a good motherfucker. That is the shit. Like I love that. You know why? 'Cause I've met people, a lot of people, that fall into both categories. I can tell you who they are, you know what I'm saying? But check this out. And whichever one they are, you never forget it. Yeah, you can't forget it. - You can't unsee it. And you know what? The people that fall into the lame category, it's like, they can do no right. - Yes. - Yes. - In terms of whatever they fucking-- - Oh my god. - In terms of whatever they're gonna do. - God never wanna be in the lame category. - And on the flip side. And on the flip side, the people that fall into the real, they could never do any wrong. - Right. - I don't give a fuck. What? - What mistake you made. - That's my guy for life, right in for him. It's because he had a one interaction with me where he took the time to be like, what's up? - Yeah, you know what I'm saying? - Yeah, you never forget that. And what's important to me with any fame that or success that comes my way is making sure that every fucking person I meet remembers me as that guy. - Yeah, I did. - That is the biggest flex and the only thing that matters that comes with any of these shit in terms of fame. And as far as success goes, I just wanna be able to live my life how I want and I don't need flashy shit. I don't need to fucking, I don't need to show off. I just wanna be free to do what the fuck I want. Take care of my people and not answer to anybody. - I kind of knew that though. I kind of see that. You could kind of tell right away it was something about. - And everything else is just a icing on the cake. Like, you know what I said? Like, it looks like I'm having fun. - Yeah. - I am. - Yeah. - You wanna know why? 'Cause this shit is a fucking cake walk, bro. - Yeah. - What, I'm supposed to be worried about what? I'm supposed to be worried about, did I do good in this scene? - Yes. - Was I good enough? - Yeah. - Did you like? - Do they like me? - Is that what I'm supposed to be worried about? 'Cause I've been through shit. - Yeah. - That, but it was really worrisome. - Yeah. That I was, where I was really afraid. - Yes. - Yes. - So it's like. - I understand. - It's like the stakes. - The stakes are lower. - When the stakes are lower, that gives you the freedom to be like, man, I don't give a fuck, you know what I'm saying? It's got, I'm gonna let it fly and it goes how it goes. And check that out. When I tapped into that, that's when I do, that's when I was able to perform at my highest level. 'Cause that's all they're looking for. - 'Cause you're free. - That's all they're looking for from the beginning. - Right. - It's who has the balls to not give a fuck. - To be themselves. - To just be. - Right. - To just do their thing. - Do your fucking thing. That's it. And that, but you know what? But that was a long journey to get there. - That's what I'm saying. - That was a long journey to get there. That's what I saw. - Thank you. - That's what I've seen. Is someone has been on a long road, long winding road and never quit on themself and found who they were. But kind of knew who they were. - Do you know what I mean? I think you knew-- - It's a process. - But you made me wrestled with it. - Oh, it was just the evolution of self. - Yeah. - You know? - And that's why people love you. - The seed was always there, but it took a while for it to, you know. - But people love you. - Thank you. - People love you. I told my brother, who's my best friend, and I have two brothers where we're all very close. 'Cause all we've ever had. And my older brother, who's Josh, who's amazing. Amazing guy. And if you don't care about quality and people, you'll miss him, 'cause he's not flashy. He doesn't give a fuck about money. He only cares about stuff that he cares about, and it's all good shit. But he's my best friend. And he looks, but the strangest thing is he kind of, he looks like me. So me and my twin brother, and he has got blonde hair, but he looks like the third brother. And then so, when we were like in our peak of like famous shit, we were doing that music, when we were like in the world like that, like a pop sensation type thing. And it was like, I remember quite literally in like the 2000s, so I'm like 2002 to 2000 fucking, I don't know, nine or eight or seven. You couldn't get away from us. We were like, in the video, that's it. I like, he go places in, if you're like, are you? He's like, no. Right, and he had to like, deal with that. And we were close, so he always dealt with it with love, but it was fucking hard sometimes. But when I told him I was talking to you, he was so excited. He loves you. And that's how, like one of my gauges is my brother Josh. But I'm just saying, you have like people like you, but maybe it didn't always feel like that, 'cause the louder voices might have been. Oh yeah, well, yeah, I just had to, you know, I just had to find my way, dude. You know, I had to find myself, find my way. And like I said, the seed was always like the true knowledge of self is always there, but I had to water it, I had to give it sunshine, I had to give it time, 'cause there were times where I was living, you know, I was running from myself, running, like doing the opposite of what was really me, you know? And that's just a part of the, but that's a part of the process. Yeah. It's an evolution, it's the evolution of self, you know? I think fatherhood was one of the things for me that, at first I would say, it's not like I became a father and then I was like, I know who I am now, but it like brought me, it kind of pulled me in a direction, 'cause I did want to show up, and I kept putting that first, and so slowly but surely, it was taking the place of some things that I, some habits and some things that I did to hurt myself, like, it forces you to grow up, 'cause you know how you see sometimes, you grow up quicker, yeah. I wasn't so young, but I wasn't so old, I was like 28, when I had my, when I had my first kid, I was still immature though, I was very like, 'cause one thing for that'll cure some of this stuff is growing up, you know what I mean? And when someone else becomes more important than all this, you know, we could lament over our fathers or our families or our fame or our bad choices or our anything, or on and on and on when we're thinking about ourselves, but the meaning of our kid comes in the room. We ain't gonna give a fuck about any of that. Yeah, it's like, what do you need? What do you need? It's a trip. I'm gonna take care of you. Crazy balls apart, it's like, I'm really good with words, and I can pretty much argue my way out of anything. Yeah, you're pretty smart, conversationalist. I can argue my way out of anything, but the one person who tells me shit, that I'm like, I literally can't explain any, you're absolutely right. Like, I can't, I have no retort to that. It's my daughter. Yeah, mine too. She gives me the realist, she drops the realist gems on me that are just like, it's baffling. So it's like, not only just having a kid in the act of being pulled in that direction, but then when you're getting, First hand like lessons. Yeah, and honestly, it's like holy shit. It's like It goes fast too, man. She was 10 yesterday. I can't believe it bro I mean, she was a fucking newborn baby yesterday, you know? Yeah, she's 10 like yeah, it's a trip like The parent had pulled me in the right direction of like actually working on myself And being healthier and being a trying to be a a a more whole person. Yeah, are you sober? sober is a one word that I would say Am I in the program? No, I'm not. I never ever tried drugs. Really? I was terrified of them. Really? Yeah But my dad was a really and I say I've said this before so I say that's pretty unbelievable Yeah, being a fucking rock star never the drugs That's incredible. I respect. I mean, I smoked weed I guess I'm not a big weed smoker I don't mind it. I'm not against it. I don't really count weed or like mushrooms as as a drug more than like a natural homeopathic Possibility, but drugs always scared me. I have a lot of anxiety around like and I have some neurosis and anxiety around like being and not in control Yeah, see that was my problem is that I liked not being in control Yeah, that was like the thrill of it you're riding on the motorcycle. You're just rolling the dice Yeah, yeah, and then you get older and you have a kid and you're like, oh my god. It's terrifying to think about that Yeah, my dad was and I've talked about this before so I say with a lot of respect because I I love my dad He passed away in 2019 and he was at alcoholic so he was a really really life-long And and and he died from it and I had a lot of addiction around me I also think that had something to do with I know a lot of people like that my fear of it because but it also made me have a very conflicted relationship with alcohol so I didn't know how to drink well So I never really was a good drinker and then I would have Moments of usually I could track it with anxiety and stress where I like I would go kind of nuts with drinking So I stopped drinking, but I wouldn't say it was something I needed like a program to do it's like I just stopped I'm super supportive of the program for people who get something from it. Yeah, but I recognize that it's not for everybody Right and and I think it's unfortunate that you know a lot of these programs to people's minds It's like they're exclusive with sobriety. It's like they have a monopoly on sobriety Right, it's not the only way to be sober. No, it's not I mean you can literally be sober just by making a fucking decision and not you don't need to go to any Fucking thing or support group or meeting or have anybody tell you what the fuck to do and how you need to do this That in the third in order to be okay or else you're headed for a disaster That's all in your fucking head if you if you're the type you got to recognize if you're the type of person who needs that structure Then get that fucking get it and keep it But if you don't vibe with that don't think that you're kicked out of the fucking boat On the sobriety of the sober boat. Yeah, you can be you can get sober and I know sober people who don't go to any fucking meetings or do any of that shit But they're just like I'm done, you know, I would say you could say I'm in that Category me too because I'd also say that my I don't define myself Exactly as a sober person in the sense of like I think God don't have to wake up every day and think about drugs or alcohol It's not a it's not a struggle. Yeah, but if you are like do you do drugs and do you drink and I say no? I have an in year in years and it's a choice I live clean because I I feel better and I do do think I grew to it So I also agree with you. I think that So sobriety is something you can achieve the program has worked really well for a big cross group of people that I think Maybe don't have either the resources Or the information or the relationships Right and some people need a community. Yeah, they need to be a part of the community when they're making that change and that's great Yeah, but some people like in their nature they they don't want a community. Yeah, like they want to They're kind of like, you know, they like doing shit off on their own and figuring it out on their own and that's okay too So that's my point is that it's like if you're I'm one of those people. Yeah, so if you're one of those people Yeah, you can still be sober you could be a part of the club and not be a part of the fucking club You know what I'm saying? I like I don't limit yourself You're alone because at the day at the end of the day, it's just a fucking decision you make in your mind A lot of the times they'll confuse it with no you have to do this this this and this order You know what I mean? Yeah, and if you don't do it to a T in this order how we tell you to do it You are headed for disaster and it doesn't count and that's bullshit And I fucking disagree with that dude. I love that you're I disagree with that because if you're if you're telling people If you don't do it this way, then you're headed for disaster. Why are you planting a seed in their mind of being in disaster when they're when they're good Yeah, they're good. Why are you why are you creating that? Why would you create that self-fulfilling prophecy to a vulnerable person when they're at a crossroads planting seeds of doubt? Yeah, why would you do that? Why would you just say hey check this out We'll take it take the shit one day at a time at the end of the day do what's just just just fucking Do what you got to do but when you make the decision stick to it And if you fall down get up and if you don't stick to it, it's good. It's all right You can come back in any time and maybe this time can be the time that you stick to it and just chill the fuck out Just chill out that's what I needed to hear people used to tell me that all the time dude. Can you just chill? That's my older brother used to tell me he'd be like he one day. I was like he was like dude check this out one day You're gonna wake up and you're just gonna you're just gonna learn how to chill the fuck out Yeah, and when you told me that I had no idea what he was talking about because I couldn't even fathom that I was like what just when people used to be like you know peace. I had no idea what that meant When people were like, you know like to be at peace I literally like I'm I'm saying like the word peace It's definition did not register in my mind. You couldn't kind grasp it I didn't like that's I was literally like that is just an empty word. Yeah, I did not understand what it meant to be at peace or to have peace Just an empty fucking word for a long fucking time dude, and now that is that's that's all I have You know what I'm saying? Yes, and somewhere in my 30s around your age was where I finally got there But I was going to therapy and I was like had this amazing. I have this amazing guy who is more of a teacher and a coach than anything And it was more I was starting to actually go no, no, no, dude like you're actually good enough Whether you ever wrote a song Are you a nice guy? Are you a good friend? Are you a good dad? Exactly. You try your best. That's what matters Yeah, like can you hang out everyone? You know the answer to those questions then that's all that matters It's like at the end of the day, bro I had to realize that like and I realized this what with plant medicine With plant medicine like I'm talking about specifically eboga. I've again eboga. Oh, I've again. That was just in the news I'll ask like some like really, you know, there's like I was go Bufo. Yeah, you know eboga. What is that all the same? No, it's they're all different Bufo is like the toad, you know like you spoke fucking blast off at last. I don't know what the other yeah eboga what I took is similar to iowasca in the sense that you basically are like laid out Eyes closed for hours. Okay, but just do you go on a trip? Yeah A big trip eboga Is it true that like people who take it like it it's taking addiction down like people with PTSD Combat veterans with PTSD severe drug addicts heroin addicts. They'll take it they they take it one time They never do drugs again. Wow And I understand why you know because I went into it. I did this two years ago And eboga is like more intense than iowasca iowasca is supposed to be they're both very intense experiences. He throw up Yeah, yeah, there's a bit of that iowasca they say is like a slightly more software experience like a more nurturing experience from from from what I've told and eboga is like they call iowasca the grand mother And eboga the grandfather because it's like it smacks you like with like what you need what you're not paying attention to The iowasca is more like nurturing like showing you kind of coaxing you along easing you along with what it's trying to teach you eboga was like Check it out. This is what's up. This is what you're not seeing right so i it shows you yeah whether whether whether you're gonna like it or not right whether it's gonna be Easy to digest or whether it's gonna be extremely painful to digest It's it's gone through loud and clear right and i did it dude and Like the reason why i did like my intention behind it was because i wanted to be like What's my true purpose? Yeah, yeah like what am i supposed to do in this life? Am i supposed to fucking be an actor like am i supposed to go move to you know The Himalayas and and be a Shaolin monk you know what i mean like what like is there something i'm missing here right Am i supposed to change the world in some grand beautiful way and be the leader of some beautiful movement like And what it showed me was your purpose. mother fucker is to be kind. Wow. That's fucking look at all the opportunities to be kind. Yeah. And even though you're a good guy, you're a good guy, but you're missing so many opportunities to to put more kindness in this world. And that is the only fucking thing that's important. The other shit you're thinking about is not important. Focus on that and see how your life changes. That's sick. It changed me. It really affected my life. Where did you do it in Spain? Oh, you went to Spain. Is it like a certain person or place that you found that does it? The Eboca plant only grows in one small place in the world. I grew on the grows in one country in Africa, Gabon. It's in the center of it's in the central country and Africa jungle, jungle country. That's the only place in the world that this plant grows. Central African Republic? No, it's the country's called Gabon, but it's in like the center of Africa. It's the only place in the world this fucking plant grows in this one tiny country, right? In the jungle. And there's the people there, the tribe of people, they're called the Buiti, B-W-I-T-I. Their tradition is called the Buiti tradition. And their entire way of life is based on the taking of this plant. It's like the right of passage to become a member of their society. They speak French in Gabon because they were colonized by the French. The shaman that I did it with was a French guy, a white French guy that went and lived with these people for 15 years. Oh wow. 15 years you lived with them and after 15 years they gave him permission to take it and administer it to Westerners. He is like a little clinic type. He has like a clinic. They do it in different places. He does it. I think they do it twice a year once in Spain, once in Brazil. Oh wow. Yeah, it was incredible. Is that where I began comes from? Yeah, I began. There are clinics that take eboga and isolate it until we find it down. We refine it into just the ibogaine into like a pharmaceutical. Is that a pill? It's a pill. It's a pill. It's a pill. I didn't do that. I took the actual plant. You went to the source. But it's the same thing. And the plant is well ibogaine is the compound within the plant that has its psychoactive capabilities. The plant itself is all they do is they take the bark of this fucking plant from the iboga tree. They take the bark of it, shave off the bark and crush the bark into a powder and you eat the powder. That's it. Wow. That's it. No, that's all they do to it, you know. And the shit. So it's a little bit like mushrooms. Yeah. It's a family of the earth. They don't do anything to it. It's just the way the plant is. It's from a tree. It's from a tree. It's more like a shrub. But the difference is that I'm mushrooms. Obviously you're fucking walking around. You're looking at shit. You're laughing. You're giggling. You're what you're thinking or whatever. This is you are knocked flatlined. You can't fucking you are like comatose. Eyes closed. Can't even fucking open your eyes and fucking move around. But do you know you're there in like are you aware of like oh, I'm on the stuff. I'm in this. I'm comatose. I can't or do you go somewhere and you come back and you're like, what the fuck happened? Like are you aware of yourself? Like you take the stuff and you're like, Oh, it's I'm starting to get sleepy. You're basically for like you take it. And like for like 45 minutes an hour, you're kind of like, wait, I don't really feel anything. I don't really feel anything. Okay. We're kind of dizzy. I feel kind of light. I don't feel bad. I just feel a little like lightheaded. Man, I feel kind of like I just need to like my head is like dizzy. I need to lay down and you lay down and you're like, Oh man, my eyes, my eyes feel so heavy. I just need to like just need to close my eyes. Just need to close my eyes and then damn it fucking hits you and you go somewhere. You go somewhere. You go. If you go, you're gone. Are you conscious, though? Like are you in a dream state? Are you? You are totally. I'm just trying to gauge if I would ever do this because I get scared of like I like I never tripped on mushrooms. I took microdoses which over like in a regimented fashion. And I found it was really helpful. And it did like I did get something from it. Like I did feel like I was just like training wheels for this kind of thing. For sure. I got something from it. I've got a lot from mushrooms, but I didn't trip. It's as you you're you're in another place. You go to another place. And it it it's more like actually you are being taken and along a long long journey. And you're being just taken along the journey. And when you come back from it, however many hours later, do you remember? It's like 12 hours later. 12 hours later. I was like I was like four hours. This shit is 12 hours. When you come out of it, you're still really like they pick you up and they help you to the bathroom because it's still hard to walk. You can like kind of like stumbling. They they make sure that you don't fall and you you can go use the bathroom or whatever. And then you come back down and you just you lay back down the mat and you just sleep for like another 12 hours. So it's like a one thing is like 12 hours because you're you're you're you're you're exhausted after that. So you sleep for another 12 hours. So a full 24 hours is passed with you just laying on this mat. And then you do it again. Again. Again. And then when you come home. Like however many days, whatever. Like are you conscious of the things that have like that you were dreaming or whatever does it come back to you in dreams at night or just like where does it re-emerge like what you discovered? It's fucking etched in stone in the fiber of my being what I learned. But you can't remember it. It's all I remember all of it. Oh, you remember all of it. I remember all of it. Was it dream state like dream images or it's different. It's different for everybody. Right. Some people can get extremely like vivid, you know, like they're in another place and it's like vivid. And I had a little bit of that going on in my second time. I experienced that a little bit. The first one though was like I would see these flashes of images. Like I don't know if you meditate. But like sometimes in a like in a really deep meditation, I can like see with my eyes closed in my mind's eye like a crystal clear image. I have that experience like it's like a like it like I'm looking at a painting or something like I can see it, you know, it would these images would flash clear as day for like a split second. And in that split second, a massive download of self-reflection and knowledge just conveyed in that one image, all that everything that's attached to that image learning like 10 years worth of fucking therapy or information about this one thing tied to this image learned instantaneously. And as it's learned and it as it's it's so instantaneous that it hits you. And then you grieve and you process it. And then for the next few hours, you might just be unpacking all that and grieving it. And then making your piece with it and accepting it. And then it's like you've been through this whole fucking roller coaster of processing with just this one thing. And then once that has been fully processed, another image and it takes you deeper. It's like that was just the first layer. That was just that was just the entry. That was just the entry ticket that you had to understand before you can understand the next thing. That's amazing. Until it gets until it or you get to the absolute center, the center, the next, the nucleus of what it is that it's trying to teach you, that it's telling you. Right. And for me, it was you just like every single fucking person walking this earth at your core are a sweet innocent child. And somewhere along the lines, that child was warped into twisted and it was twisted and warped to hide that sweetness, to hide that kindness, that innocence. Yeah. Because you felt that innocence was making you vulnerable to be treated as, you know, to be a victim. Imagine setting your makeup than forgetting it's even theirs. Meet new grippy setting mist from Mavily New York. Gel to mist technology locks in your look for up to 24 hours with flexible all day comfy grip. Just plump, dewey hydrated skin that still feels like your skin. Try new grippy setting mist from Mavily New York. Maybe it's Mabling. You were made to feel ashamed, you were made to feel because at some point, and it could be the most minor thing. It could be a big traumatic thing or it could be the most minor minuscule fucking thing. But it wasn't minuscule to you at the time. And it caused you and it caused that innocence for you to fucking build walls around it and hide it and even convince yourself that it didn't even exist. That's not who you are. Who you are is the fucking person that needs to, you know, keep those walls up, build those walls and maintain those walls. And that being that person over so many years is what has caused you to collect so much pain, so much pain from having to be that. But then it shows you all of that is bullshit. Who you are is that kid? Is that innocent kid? And guess what? Now because you know that, what are you going to do with it? Now you can open your eyes and look at every single person you come across, recognize who they are that they're the same exact way. Where do they know it or not? Exactly. Exactly. And whether they know it or not, especially if they don't know it. Just through your kindness, just through the kindness that you can give them, help them remember. Yeah. It has changed my life. That's awesome. Because that's what's important because that, what are we, what's going on here? What are we really doing? What is going on here? What is the, what's the substance in this life? Right. What's the substance in this world? Yeah. What do we, like, like, that's why I always say to people like, if we can't talk about this, what can we even talk about? Exactly. So, with your time, are you going to engage with what is the substance of substance? Or are you going to just focus on everything, but because if you're engaged with what the substance is, which is kindness and fucking life, truth, truth and kindness. Yeah. Love. Yeah, exactly. And I, but I like the word kindness because people say, you know, like all, like, all that really matters is love. Well, there's a lot of different versions of love. A lot of people get love, they fix it on one version of it, like the love you have for your wife. Like romantic love. Right. There's lots of love. Right. So, you can't love everybody. Right. But you can be kind to everybody. Yeah. Kindness is like a, in one part, it's an action, in one part, it's a gift, in one part, exactly. Exactly. It's actionable. Exactly. It's difficult to say to a random person on the street and feel like I have to love this person because you don't know there's so much that goes along with love. Not everybody can live up to that. It's hard to live up to that fucking standard of, well, I have to fucking literally love everyone. Yeah. That's overwhelming. But you can be kind to everyone. A total reset random stranger on the street. Can I be kind? Yeah, I can be kind. I can be kind to that person. Even if it's just a smile. Exactly. Right. There's so many levels to kindness. Exactly. In your acting career, what do you like? I know a running point is going and you're on like a hit show and you're having a good time. What do you want to do? Just keep finding shit you excited about it. I have some of my own things that I really want to develop. Cool. I think this out of that. I feel like I have to, you know, because I have, I have the stories that I really want to tell that are personal to me, but I can't do it alone. So I'm still kind of like, I mean, I'm just now getting to, I feel like to the point where I have enough resources to collaborate with people on my own merit. Because obviously, like, what do people are like? What are you talking about? The resources? Yeah. But it's like, I don't want somebody to work with me because they think that they're doing a favor or like, you know what I mean? I feel the same way. I want somebody to work with me because they get what I'm trying to do, you know, it be, you know, so it's the only way it'll be, it'll only matter. It's the only way it'll be genuine and authentic as a art project is if everybody's there because they're excited and they, they see it. Yeah. So you're smart. You're smart to be that way. You know, it's like the nature of being an actor is kind of like, uh, just being a fucking hired gun. You wait for the jobs to come up. You get a shot at them, you get a crack at them if you're lucky and if you're really lucky, then you book it. But you never know what's coming down the pipeline. Right. You never know what's coming. It's a, you don't know until a week before, you know, I mean, it's a former self-expression for me. I didn't always look at it like that. I used to look at it like, I'm a deer in the headlights. I don't know what the fuck I'm doing. I don't know why these people picked me to be the guy. They saw something that I don't see in terms of, uh, I went to the audition. But apparently they liked it. Okay. Now I got to go do it for real. And I have no fucking idea what I'm doing, deer in the headlights, terrifying, terrifying. And in that state, it's hard. It's really hard because you don't have any fucking confidence into your choices. You're doing, you're going off a pure instinct and you're hoping that it turns out good enough. And sometimes you look at the shit and you're like, that was pretty good. Sometimes you look at it like, that was great. Sometimes you look at it like, I fucking butchered that. And you never know. You do it. And you don't know how you did until a year later when you're watching it on TV like everyone else. Right. So it's like a slow learning process of like, what did I do right? What did I do wrong? You have to go, all you're doing it is based on watching tape. That's a year. Yeah. It's a long drawn. That's why it's like you learn slowly after job, after job, after job. But now, and that can always happen. That can always happen. That uncertainty. But I've gotten to a point in my work where I don't give a fuck how it comes out. And I cultivate that mentality. I keep that state of mind cultivated because I know that when I truly feel that way, that's when I do my best work. Yeah, you're free. That's when I see my work later, and I'm like, flawless, like I nailed it. Yeah. So I try to purposely cultivate the truth is is that I do give a fuck. Right. You want to do a good job. Deeply. Yeah. But I train my mind to simulate not giving a fuck as much as possible because that's when I do my best work. And that is all just a matter of your own mental process. I think you can care about the quality of your work without caring about. Oh, no. You have to, doing the preparation, doing the work beforehand is essential, right? You have to prepare. You have to know, have an idea of the person that you're portraying and create that person in your mind beforehand. I'm just talking about the actual moment, right when you're on that, where they say action cameras are on and you're like, no, it's like you got to let go. Here goes nothing. Yeah. It's like jumping out of a plane. Exactly. That's how it feels on stage. Send it. That's how I feel. Fucking send it. Let it fly. Right. Another thing like you asked me, like, what do I want to do with my career? Besides of develop my own shit, I want to do a role. It's, I want to start doing roles that are completely fucking different from who I am as a person. So all of my roles have been really similar to who I am. Like one of the first times I went to rehab, I got sober for the first time, I fucking, I just had a kid. I get out of rehab. I get, I get an audition for a role of a dude who's living in a sober living trying to have a relationship with his kid. There's a show called Marin. I'm like, okay, I fight. Oh, yeah. I'm literally in that situation. I'm like, if I don't get this fucking audition, I might as well just roll it up. And I got it. I'm like, okay, well, this is fucking trippy. Then I do the same role on shameless. Same role. It's a sober guy trying to get sober, trying to have a relationship with his kid. Boom. It's like, okay, I got that one. Then I got to get a role in an empire playing a white rapper. I believe it. Okay. And now I'm playing basically an exaggerated version of myself on fucking running point. So to be able to, it's like, it's like a fucking joke. You know what I'll say? It's like art imitating a life. So my point is, it's like, bro, if you want to ask people what kind of role I want to do, I want to play like a fucking British aristocrat in like the 1700s. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, governor Breelzby came by the house today. So. So. I want to wear a wig just to like fuck around and show people what I can do. I mean, absolutely work on it, but you will. Yeah. But I just look at guys like fuck it or like have a moment or like have a role where it's just so raw where I get to really like show something truly vulnerable of myself. And so when I look at actors like Timothy Xiaomei, like Shaila Buffer, these guys, they get to do that. They're doing that. And I'm like, I'm like, have massive respect for it. And I'm like, in all of them, like, wow, it's fucking incredible. And I ask myself like, I would like that challenge. Right now, the roles you're going to get are the things that I can accept you in. Yeah. All right. And me as the viewer, because I already know you kind of, because isn't that a so and so's kid and didn't he, uh, if he can trouble the thing, isn't he, uh, if they have a brother that's, uh, you know what I mean? Like, that's just reality. Yeah. So what you've had to do with the Rubik's Cube is you're a good actor and you are going to get the opportunity to show people more. But it's going to take time and over time, you're going to get some role in the next probably two years here. I'm pretty usually right about my, when I see things for people, but you're probably going to get some role in the next two years here that it pops up and it's interesting. And you're like, I could do that. You're going to do it. And somewhere in there is going to, it's going to be a different thing that you weren't expecting that you didn't even acknowledge at the time that that was the thing. To over here, you think it's some other thing and it's some other thing that you can't see. Yeah, exactly. And it'll be something that shows something else you have. You're going to age well in the sense of like, you're getting to know yourself more as you get older. Yeah. A lot of people get taken away from themself as they get there. The only other thing I want to talk about is the music because you have your new or project. Yeah. Something out west. Yeah. Because I do music is also really important to me. I know. And you're good at it. Thank you. Yeah, it's just like acting is how I support myself. I'm trying to get the music going, but music to do it and music is the fucking best. It is. It's freedom. It's the best. There's nothing like performing your music. Like I just performed at tour to this festival and for a lot of time, performing at stage coach. Oh, cool. My group is called something out west. It's a duo. Me and my wife and it's country music. Who's your other guy in it? He's my boy Drew. Okay. Drew Arthur. And he's been my boy for a while. He's like a really talented songwriter plays guitar. And we had been friends for a long time and a lot, like several years ago, we started making music together. We never put it out because we didn't have like the right situation and I didn't want to roll the dice on it and put it out because I know what it's like to just put something out. is hoping that it goes viral and you become a huge hit, but it's like. in this day and age, you got to have a plan, so we didn't have the right things in place to, we didn't have any infrastructure, but now we do. We got a team behind us and you go check out our music. If you're listening to something out west, Spotify, music, all the streaming platforms, but there's nothing like making a fucking like writing a song, making it listening to it, being so fucking stoked on it, listening to yourself loving it, loving what you made, and getting then getting to perform it. Yeah, it's done better. There's nothing better, because acting doesn't have that. Acting doesn't have that immediate connection with the audience. Right. You go off somewhere, you're working, nobody knows what you're doing. You spend fucking three, four months filming something. Right. And then it doesn't even come out and for it for a year. Right. By the time it comes out a year, you've lived through a year of your life. Everything that entails ups, downs, fucking strut, whatever. By the time it comes out, you forgot about it. You're like, oh, yeah, that fucking thing. Yeah. It's like, and then if people like it, they're like, hey, dude, I saw you in that thing. That was fucking sick. You're like, thanks. That's all you get from it. I mean, besides the money, that's all you get. You don't get that immediate. It's me and you right here. And it even could happen. Exactly. On stage, anything could happen. It was just kind of exciting. It's like you're going, you go, it's like, I heard someone say this one time. It's like filming a movie or a TV show. It's like being at the DMV with famous people. Yeah. You're just waiting around all day. Bored as shit. Every now and then there, you got to go do it. Action. Okay. Cut. You're like back to sitting around. Fucking bored. Just drinking coffee. And you're there for it takes forever. Forever. Forever. Yeah. And then like some fucking super famous person is like, oh, yeah, you're here. And they're like, okay, yeah, you're here. I mean, like, it's like going to the DMV of famous people, you know what I mean? Like, but it's like, you know what it is, dude, fucking. I couldn't do it, bro. I mean, I do TV shows sometimes. That's long enough for me, but it's contained. So it's like, I like doing TV shows. I really enjoy it. I'm like, always looking for the next show that captures, but it's not acting. It's like reality competition type, like Ink Masters, like a tattoo show. So you get to be yourself. So it's not hard. It's just long hours. Yeah. But it's not hard. Like acting would be hard for me because I'm too self conscious. Yeah. That's crazy because it's like, I don't get nervous acting anymore, but I get hell of nervous before I go on stage. That's funny. It's not for me. It's not. I'm only a little nervous because of the size. So going to like 20,000 people or 30,000 people or 40,000 people, I'm more like nervous in like a respectful way of like what we're about to do for the next hour and a half or hour 45. We orchestrated like not a Broadway show, but kind of every moment has to go together. It's coordinated. Like we do this our show now is like so is like this big rock show. And there's all these moments that have to happen. And everyone has to be in the right place. There's pyro here. And there's pyro there. Then there's this. There's that. And like you have a click in your ear for this track. And then you're doing this for this song. And then there's eight live musicians. And if anything goes wrong, you hear it. So it's like a little bit like a coordinated dance of a certain way. So I get nervous doing it. It's like all like that. Does that just disappear? Like we're free. Yeah. As soon as you get on stage, everything in between the construction of the show is whatever happens. You jump up there or you do this or you say that. But like the show is this like with the video and the lasers and the fire and all the things. It did have to be constructed. So flying that plane is a little bit bigger than what we used to do like in a club. But what about like when you first got started? Like your first fucking like wild. But like were you were you nervous? Terrified. Terrified. Right. And then that just goes you just get used to it. I used to first two shows I did my back to the audience. Yeah. So weird. Yeah. I did it. Just like just be thinking like what if I just forget all the words? And I did sometimes I still do sometimes I still get terrified sometimes depending on like what we're doing. TV is helped doing this has really helped me because I'm less terrified now to talk. Yeah. It's sometimes in between songs. I'm like what a wash. But performing is not hard for me at all. Yeah. Unless I'm with someone and I'm meant to do something. So like if so and so wants me to come sing with them. Attribute. I'm so so I think I'm no longer talented. I've lost all talent, all ability, all skill. I was out of thing and Adam Sandler's one of my favorite actors and comedians and whatever big musician killer. He sings these songs and he's actually like oh yeah. He's really good. He's like he's like and he loves music and he's he can play and he's like he's cool shit. But I don't know him well. I was there and he knows he knows I'm a musician. He knows me well enough to know I'm a musician. But like we don't have each other's phone number. But like see him around and and he's friends with some friends or whatever and he's at this thing and he's playing and he's like come on dude. It appeared. And I'm like it's like Adam Sandler's like dude what are you doing man. Get up here. And I'm like okay. It was so devastating for me. It was devastating. My one opportunity to get up with the Sandman and sing. I couldn't find it in my soul. I was because I get I freeze when it's anything but like I think I've organized my I think I've organized my brain to be able to perform in certain spots. Yeah. And until I organize that way I can't do it. I had a moment like that. I really fucking regretted dude. My parents 30th anniversary. This is a trip. My parents 30th anniversary they had this big party and they invited everybody and they did a thing where my mom hired a live band and she said anybody who wants to perform a song can put their name in a hat and we're going to go through a we're going to randomly draw names at the hat. That's cool. And then you go up and perform whatever song you want in front of everybody. That's the whole party. That's what we're doing at the party. It's like a high end karaoke. Yeah. With the actual band so they had to tell the band the name of the song in advance so they knew they could play it right sick. But here's who is at the party. Barack and Michelle. Oh my god. What did uh, Barox. Oprah. Love Oprah. Anthony Ketus. I mean Jimmy Fallon. David Geffen. Scooter Braun. The list goes on. The list is like, okay. You see what I'm saying? Yeah. Yeah. This is who you perform in front of. Okay. No way. I was like, my mom is like, Chek, what song do you want to perform? I was like, I'm not doing it. I'm not doing it. She's like, no seriously. Come on. Just do it. I'm like, no. Scooter Braun called me because like, I'm cool with him. Yeah. Cause he really like was like, he looked out for me when I was going through shit. I think it's because my mom called him and she was like, Chek really looks up to you. Can you call him and try to fucking. Yeah. Yeah. And he was like, all right, Rita. So he'd be like, I got you. Yeah. He would call me like, Chek. What's going on? I feel like, oh my god. Scooter Braun's calling me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I should know. You're right. I'm going to rehab. Scooter Braun called me and he's like, what song are you going to perform? You're like, did my mom like it? I was like, I was like, I don't want to do it. He's like, I don't want to do it either. Here's what we should do. I'm going to fucking invite DJ Khaled. And you just go up on stage and introduce him. And he's going to go up and do all I do is win. I was like, just thank God. That don't work. Okay. So I do. Yeah. We did that. But I'm telling you, bro, I really regret not singing a song. Yeah. I really regret not doing it. I wish I could go back in time with that party and just fucking just knock Brock and Michelle's socks off. Yeah. Just nail one like, wow. Cause you could have. What a talent. You know what? Hey Tom David Gifford would be like Jimmy I have been a minister. Jimmy I have been a minister. I cut. I was like, that's the moment. Jimmy I have been could have realized that I'm the next fucking M&M. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Blow an opportunity. Jimmy. I haven't we all. Yeah. No, none of that shit would have happened. But I wish I could have at least at least I wish I could have at least had the balls to go do it. Yeah. But you know what? But at the time I just wasn't there being yourself. I was just wasn't there yet. Yeah. But I was like, fuck, dude, that would have been sick. I wouldn't know what song I wouldn't know what song I would have sang. What? Rooster. Allison. Oh my God. One of my favorites. Here come the rooster. Oh, yeah. You know what I would have done. So everyone would be like, okay. If I was going to do an Allison chain song, I would do nut shell. Yeah. And I probably listened to nut shell five times a week. Yeah. Yeah. On the same I just I just I don't listen to it. I don't discover a lot of new music. I just listen to shit that I love over and over and over. Yeah. Do we get everything you want to talk about? Yeah, bro. We're good. Running point is out. Yeah. Is that kind of what you're promoting right now like as things go? I was just that I just came here to meet you sick. I don't give a fuck about the promo. Well, I love video chat. Thanks, bro. Awesome. Thank you. Thank you for listening to this episode of artist friendly. You can also watch the episodes on Spotify. Spotify premium users get no commercial breaks on my show. Make sure to follow like and comment because I always read the comments.