CEO of SoFi, Anthony Noto | Basis Points

All right, hello everybody. Welcome back to another episode of Basis Points. We are very honored and privileged to be joined today with the CEO of SoFi, Anthony Noto. Thank you for being here. Thank you guys. It's a lot more energy than I normally feel on YouTube. So thank you. Well, he's energetic in the morning. Well, you know, speaking of energy, Anthony, the past five years, your company has had a lot of energy, a lot of our audience, which are retail investors, really do just love your company. I mean, they've loved the story. They love you as a CEO. They love the execution. They love the business. I kind of wanted to start off the entire conversation with this question. What does it feel like to be a CEO who yes has to deal with banks and institutions and your former Goldman Sachs, but has a massive audience of millions of individual people like me and Steve that genuinely just loves SoFi. I'd say it's a, I feel a tremendous amount of responsibility. You know, I want to deliver for everyone. I want to deliver for our members. I want to deliver for our employees. I want to deliver for our shareholders. I've been at SoFi for eight years, every day is intoxicating. Every day feels like we have to run faster. Every day, there's more urgency to get to where we want to go and to make sure people feel great about what we've achieved and the impact they can have on their lives. I get emails from members that are, you know, in challenging situations, I get emails from members where we haven't done right in their mind. I get emails thanking us for what we do. And the most rewarding thing is when in any of the three of those cases, we can help solve their problem, help them get there. And it's a tangible way to really get an energy boost to be motivated to make me realize how important our company is and how it impacts people's lives every day. We had a woman that sent me an email recently. And I mentioned this at TPM working yesterday where her daughter had $230,000 of student loan debt. And that is a lot of debt to have. And the world has been irresponsible by allowing her to take out that much debt. It will be nearly impossible for her to pay that back and save and invest to get to where she wants to go over time. So that's just one anecdote of the types of things that we see every day and the impact that we can have. So it's rewarding every day, but it's also a tremendous responsibility. And listen, no one takes the pain more than I do with the stock when it underperforms. If you look at the last year, the last two years, the last three years, if you look at 23 individually, 24 individuals, 25 stocks done great in all those time periods, no one cares. Yeah, no one cares. They care about what's happened here to date. They care what happened the last month. So now is there a tremendous responsibility overall? There's a never, never ending scoreboard, never ending goal line that keeps getting moved and that's intoxicating, but it's also a lot of pressure and it drives me. So let's go back to what you referenced in the beginning, which is this endless scorecard, which is the stock that is associated with so far. On Q1 earnings, you guys grew adjusted net revenue, 41%. Member growth was up 35% product growth 39% adjusted EBITDA, 62%. You guys are gap profitable. Stocks down 40% year to date. Obviously, there have been a lot of people in the retail community that have really fought hard and defended. So far as a company and as a stock. And from the belief that they have that this company is executing, this company is growing 40% revenue growth is honestly, there's maybe 10 or 20 companies in the entire stock market that can grow at those levels. And it's consistent, stable growth that is sustainable, which is speaking to the caliber of the business given for the past five years, you guys didn't have the biggest part of your business, which was student loans because of the moratorium. What do you have to say to the people that are looking at the dislocation in the stock price and the execution of the company that's seeing you making these open market purchases and are wondering why does the market not really get the so far story right now? Yeah, I think we're in a period where people have re-rated the multiple on fintechs generally. And if you're a fintech that's exposed to credit or exposed interest rates, that re-rating has been even more severe regardless of the other revenue streams that you have on a trelline 12 month basis or net revenues about 50% lending and 50% non-lending. If you look at on a cash basis, which we reported net interest income cash of $690 million. So that's cash that we received from individuals for paying back their loans in their interest. And then we had about $390 million of what we said is non interest cash revenue. And so that revenue is from things like so-fi money, things like so-fi brokerage, our LPB business, our so-fi technology solutions business, interchange revenue from credit card interchange revenue from a debit card. So those are the two different revenue streams. And that's about 60, 40 on a trelline 12 month basis if you use that measure. So we're pretty diversified at this point in time. 85% of our products are now non-lending products. We report products and we break it down by segment. So we're relatively diversified. So why are we getting re-rated? We went into 2026 with the best backdrop you could imagine. We just delivered 35% revenue growth in 2025. Stock did incredibly well in 25. Also did well in 24. What was driving it? Earnings increased earnings expectations. And so we took we outperformed earnings. We raised earnings. We grew tangible book value 100% to $7.20 from 2023. So we had both earnings increases, book value increases. And the multiples of earnings and multiple book values both also went up. Because we had really high growth and you know, beating and raising. Right. In 2026, we came in thinking there'd be three rate cuts or plan actually reflected two rate cuts. We report the first quarter and we actually grew faster than we did in 2025. 41% had the same incremental EBITDA margin, about 40%. Accelerated member growth, accelerated product growth had really strong cross by it 43%. So the fundamentals of the strongest credits performed well. Fundamentals have been as strong as they've ever been. So why is the stock down the stocks down because the market took us from five times tangible book down to two times tangible book? Why is the market doing that uncertainty? What's the uncertainty? Well, we came into the year thinking two to three rate cuts. Now people are thinking no rate cuts. We're assuming no rate cuts. We still left our full year guidance, you know, unchanged despite the fact that we move from two rate cuts to zero. And so the markets worried that rates not only don't get cut, but they actually could go up. Right. And so you have persistent inflation, you have uncertainty geopolitically in the Middle East. And you have economic data that says rates may need to go up, not down. When rates went up 500 basis points are multiple contracted. But the day that people thought that rates would stop going up, our multiple started to expand. Similarly, as soon as people thought rates were going to go down, the multiple expanded even more. But now they believe rates are not going to go down and they could go up. And so our multiples expanded a lot. So what do I think about the stock here? I've obviously bought the stock. Yeah. The worst way to value our company is on tangible books. I'll use that as an example. So we have $7.20 in tangible book value. And we currently trade at two times tangible book. I would argue if the multiple goes down below two times, then people think our tangible book value is going to go down. It should not go below two times, not growing it from where it was in 2023 by 100% to 2026. So if the multiple of tangible book value stays at two times and we grow earnings 40% over the next three years, which we've articulated a range, our tangible book value should also grow that amount. Well, if our tangible book value is growing 40%, and the multiple doesn't change, what happens? The stock has to go up 40%. You can't grow 10. We look at 40%. The multiple stay the same. One of two things has to happen. The stock goes up where the multiple goes down. I don't think the multiple goes down from here unless people have a really dire, dire view of the company or of the economy that would cause our tangible book at book value to go down. So I think the multiples can press significantly. I don't really think there's any rational reason for it to press anymore. So the question becomes, can we grow tangible book value 20%, 30%, 40% because on a constant multiple, and we grow 40%, the stock goes up 40%. JP Morgan trades at three times tangible book. Why should so if I trade at more than JP Morgan? Because we're going to have a higher return on equity. We believe we can drive a 20% to 30% return on equity. And if you do a statistical analysis of the correlation between return on equity and the multiple tangible common equity, then you'll see that the higher R O E, the higher the multiple tangible book value is. We use American Express as sort of a benchmark. It trades at six to eight times tangible book value. We've traded as high as five times tangible book value. A five times tangible book value would put us off a seven 20 over $35. I always like to look at earnings multiples to see what that would imply. And we've talked in the past that if you account for our growth and use a peg ratio, most financial services companies and fintechs, if you take a, you know, a comparable group, they have a peg ratio of about 1.1 times. That means take the forward three year growth rate. In our case, let's take 40% multiply it by 1.1 times. That's the multiple you apply. That's 44 times. You do that versus our estimate for the year and guidance of 60 cents. And you get to a stock price that around $25. So easily you can get to justify 25 to $35, which is why I've been buying the stock. When will the market actually pay that? Once they believe rates are going down. And I think as that sentiment changes, you'll see people come in and buy the stock. Right now, it's really hard to convince a portfolio manager to buy the stock because the question that you cannot answer to them say, this is their revenue growth. This is their product growth. This is their member growth. This is the margins. This is what we expect for the year. They have four new businesses, all which that could grow to $100 million in a year that they didn't have before that they're funding despite all of this and they have five other businesses that are growing very nicely that have enough upside. And it's trading at tangible book value of two times. And I think they will have 20 to 30% ROE when they expand margins and growth slows. And then the inevitable question comes, well, are rates going to go up? I'm not sure. Well, rates are going up. I don't want to buy the stock because when rates go up, you think that's happening across institutional investors. You know, if you're portfolio manager, you have to do the math. Like what's the multiple trades at is the multiple going to expand or contract? What's the estimates that people are using for book value, tangible book value for EPS? And are they going to go up or down? And if rates go up, people generally worry about earnings going down, earning estimates going down. Why? Can you pass on the higher cost of funds from higher rates to consumers on the loans and higher interest rates? We've actually proven we can do that. We did it as rates went up 500 basis points. Then you manage credit and hire unemployment. We've shown that we could do that. So when there's uncertainty about the economy, uncertainty about rates, uncertainty about losses, people are going to tend not to want to own the stock because they do and they don't answer those questions. It's somewhat irresponsible. But at some point, you just have to say, I'm focused on the next 12 to 24 months, not the next six months. And at two times tangible book, I'm confident, tangible book value is going to grow. And the multiple relation that contract here unless I've missed something about the solvency of the company, then you can step it and buy the stock. But if you're focused on the next six months, you can answer the question on interest rates. That's one of my biggest gripes with the market right now that everybody wants it tomorrow. Long term investing seems like it's dead. If you're not doing 40% in a month or two, people think that you don't want to. It's a week. Well, a week now. So sorry, a week now. People think that you don't know anything about investing yet. This should be the time when people take an analytical look to a company like so if I, because you're a proven track record of delivering throughout the hardest times for the company, you have a pattern of delivering when rates go up. And if you look at this six to 12 or 12 to 24 months out, you have to at least assume that CME group who I follow for the projections, they change their minds on a dime. And one week it can be a cup by 20% the next week, it could be an increase by 30%. Nobody knows what's going to happen with Iran. The reality is that we've seen oil go from around 104 to 89 overnight because of the thought that we were going to get some type of a deal. If we do get a deal in next several weeks, I've said publicly between Memorial Day and July 4th is the critical aspect. You have to get a deal done by then. If not, I have to reconsider a few things. And if we do, then you have to think that oil has a chance to go in below 80 and then over the next three months, the CPI and PPI prints cool, that should be a golden opportunity for the Fed to go into Jackson Hole and come out cutting in September. So wouldn't this be an optimal opportunity for people to really take an approach and tear through so fine, just say, you know what, this company is delivering on all metrics. This may be a little cheap here. You know, I personally believe at this value, all of those risks that I talked about are baked in. And it's a good buying point. It's one of the reasons why I bought two million dollars this year at higher prices than we're at right now. I think other people will look at it and say, do I want to take on those risks, those uncertainties, or do I want to wait? And I think in this environment, people are choosing to wait. They may at some point say all of the bad news is priced in and now it's a time to buy the stock. I feel like we're getting to that level, but it's just my instinct having done this for a long time. What we can control is delivering the results and that's what we're focused on. And the results have been spectacular. 18 quarters of greater than a rule of 40. You know, I mentioned to a really successful portfolio manager about six months ago. That's pretty well known. That's on a lot of podcasts. And I said, Brad, I know that you invest in software companies for a long time. Have you looked at a rule of 40? I'm like, it's 60. It's because your margins are 40 percent. No, it's not because our margins are 40 percent. It's actually because we're growing over 30 percent and we have 30 percent margins. How many companies have 30 percent revenue growth at our scale and 30 percent EBITDA margins? And our EBITDA margin could easily be 40 percent if we stopped investing, which means our net income margin is probably 20 to 25 percent. You then add back your stock based compensation to net income and you can get to an RWE that's pretty damn attractive. So at some point, someone will do that math and realize where we are in this moment in time and step back in the big picture and say, this is the right time to buy the stock. But to each throne and we'll just keep delivering the results and the stock will take care itself. I don't want to, in any way, mislead you like, does it bother me to stock as much as you're in it? Yeah, it fucking bothers me a ton. Does it bother me that people are talking crap about me on Twitter and our company and disrespecting our team? I'm used to be the CFO. So, you know, listen, at the end of the day, we're being held to a high standard. I've accepted that responsibility. I'll work my butt off to make sure we deliver on it. But it does bother me and I'm doing everything I can to change it. We're not changing our plans. We're not changing our priorities because they're the right plans and priorities to deliver the growth that we've told the street, which is over 30 percent revenue growth and a 30 percent, you know, incremental EBITDA margin. So 30 and 30 is a pretty good outcome. Could we beat that? Sure. We beat it in Q1. We did 41 percent revenue growth on a billion dollars of, you know, a billion dollars or over a billion dollars of revenue with great incremental margins of 40 percent. So you've had a long distinguished grip. Goldman Sachs top analyst. You've previously discussed your critical success factors and how you used a few companies. eBay auction click through rate. eBay, the, it was the search metrics. If you put your analyst hat on again and you were looking at SoFi, what are the critical success factors that you would see that they are doing and need to do to become a top financial institution? Yeah. The, the metric that we report out that would be the lean indicator of that and then I'll talk about what drives the lean indicator of that. The metric that we report out is members, member growth and products and products growth. But the critical success factor that drives that and the critical success factor that will give us competitive advantage is lifetime value. Is we have thought, we have the highest lifetime value. It's a function of a lot of our factors. And we're a low cost operator. Why are we a low cost operator? We're 100 percent digital. Two, we own our own technology. It's not in every one of our businesses, but it will. It's in a lot of our businesses. So in a unit economic basis, we look at each individual product to get to a great variable profit in dollars. We think we have a variable profit dollars that is better than others. But when you combine it with members doing more than one product, that was variable profit dollars increased pretty meaningfully. So as an example, these are illustrative numbers. They're not actually in our financials, but it's analysis that we've done over time. If you look at a personal loan on average, that personal loan will generate about $800 of variable profit based on the revenue that it will generate the size of loan, the interest rate, et cetera, subtract operating costs, subtract customer acquisition costs, it's about $800. If that loan is taken out by existing member, we don't pay a customer acquisition cost. And that $800 goes to over $1500, $1600. That's a very high lifetime value. And that doesn't even include the other products that they do. So our lending business has risk, our lending business requires credit, but it's a huge driver over a lifetime value. When we get a member to take out two or three or four products, that lifetime value goes higher. Now, why is that the critical success factor that allows us to price better than anybody else? And if you give the best prices and the best services we win, if you look at Walmart and you look at Amazon, they both are low cost operators. When Amazon's case allows them to have the lowest prices on products, it allows them to give the best selection, the fastest delivery, and the flywheel keeps spinning. I call that the retail productivity loop. For SOFI, if we have the highest lifetime value, we can give members the best interest rate unchecking and savings. We can give them the lowest interest rates on loans. We can actually serve more people with loans than other people because we have these great internet economics. And so it also allows us to give services that they otherwise wouldn't get. You'll see us actually launch a bunch of what I'd say are service driven capabilities that no one's paying for, but they add to the flywheel of what else they do with us, things like that will put into SOFI+. So our lifetime value is our competitive advantage and that's our critical success factor. And to drive that, it is about having this broad, sweeter products, driving more than one product, driving cross by, and really solving the equation of spending less than you make and invest the rest. And if we solve that equation, no one's going to catch us on lifetime value. That's already a superior, but if we get to the point where I think we can, it'll be indomitable. When I tore everything apart, I really ripped everything out. When I structurally looked at SOFI, my critical success factors outside of that was the tech. Own Galileo acquired technosis, built something that allows you to deploy whenever you want. You don't have to be be held to a third party, your own roadmap, your own vision. And now I really see a coming to a full scale with SOFI USD. Can you walk us through the unit of economics with that and how that's going to be a game change or a differentiator against your competitors? Sure, but let me take the first thing you said. So owning our own technology is an incredibly important element of getting to the highest lifetime value in the best unit economics. As you mentioned, owning our own technology allows us to innovate faster. It allows us to have better data for better personalization. We don't have to wait in line. The motivation for the technology platform, which we call SOFI Technology Solutions now, was driven by the fact that we originally launched SOFI Money in 2019 with a sponsor bank and a different payment processor. And every time I tried to drive innovation in the process, I was able to do it. during that, during that launch and leading up to that launch, whether it was roundups or vaults or two day early paycheck or mobile check upload, our technology provider said, sorry, we can't do that. No one else wants that. We're not going to invest in that. You have to wait in line. And so that's when I quickly realized, if we're truly going to have better products than someone else on the five differentials that we have, we have to own the technology. So it is an critical element that delivers that lifetime value or lower cost operator because of it, and we have better product innovation and faster product innovation. Three quick examples. We wouldn't be launching big business banking with an API-driven ability to do agentic payments if we didn't own the technology platform. Wouldn't be launching. It would take two years. We'll launch that officially in July 1. It's already in marketplace now. We wouldn't have launched commercial payments, which most people don't know about, for SoFi Bank and partnering with companies like Meshpay without the technology platform. We wouldn't be able to sort of rebuild our core in a way that allows us to build things like Payment Hub without the SoFi technology platform solution. So it's absolutely critical. So let's focus on SoFi USD for a second. This is one of the four big areas that are completely new for SoFi, no revenue being generated. So you have SoFi Plus, you have SoFi USD, you have big business banking, then you have crypto, both crypto trading but also crypto lending. So those four areas are brand new. We're not expenses that we had in our P&L at any point in time in the past, until we rolled out the 26th plan. And in fact, at this point in time last year, we weren't contemplating doing any of them other than doing SoFi Plus, which at that point was really struggling we had to figure it out. And I think we have. So in SoFi USD, here's the best way to think about what that is. This is a payment capability that will appeal to both enterprises and consumers. The first place that SoFi USD is being used is actually between SoFi and our trading partners on cryptocurrency. And so if you think about market makers and you think about exchanges, money has to flow between a company like SoFi who has members buying coins on those platforms and those entities. Today, that's SoFi, that's a USDC. Tomorrow, that will be SoFi USD. So we'll change the underlying stable coin that sends payments to all those intermediaries. The second place that SoFi USD will be used is for new partners that we aren't necessarily doing business with today. So we announced the deal with MasterCard. And I saw some people on Twitter kind of poo pooing or deal with MasterCard. Or deal with MasterCards real. They're going to use SoFi USD to enable 24/7 payments. Today, MasterCard's only settling Monday to Friday and they're not doing it 24 hours a day. With SoFi USD in July, it'll be launched and they'll be able to actually do settlement 24/7, seven days a week 24 hours a day. - For SoFi members? - No, for everyone. This has nothing to do with SoFi members. This is MasterCard and their merchant partners, the retail partners. - Which there's a lot of those retail partners. - It has nothing to do with SoFi members. This is a completely an enterprise solution. So one of the things that I've pointed out in the last days but somehow it's just not getting through is we do 8 billion payment transactions today on SoFi technology solutions for non-SoFi transactions. There's some in there for SoFi, but 8 billion transactions are being done by all of the partners that we have in the Galileo platform. They're ECH transactions and they're debit transactions. I want all those transactions to migrate towards SoFi USD. It's cheaper, faster and safer. So that's the third place it'll be used. But the deal with MasterCard has nothing to do with the transactions that are taking place with SoFi and SoFi members. They can use it to settle, but it's really meant to settle all of their other partners ships. So those are three places SoFi USD will be used. SoFi USD will also be available in the next week or so on our SoFi crypto capabilities and crypto investing. And what we'll be able to do over time, this will be launched probably in the next two weeks. So you can go on SoFi, you can go to the crypto area, you can buy SoFi USD, 100% back dollar for dollar, money sits in our Fed bank account, earning Fed funds. And I'll talk about that in a second. That person that has that SoFi USD, they can use that to pay in other places. When it's on our platform, we will actually treat it like a tokenized deposit and give it FDIC insurance and give it interest of about 3.8%. When it's used as a payment stable coin, we cannot provide interest or FDIC insurance. So it will move from a tokenized deposit to a stable coin and then be sent out as a form of payment. And that will also appeal to small businesses and large businesses. And that's the other place that SoFi USD will be used is big business banking. And so as we were launching by selling hold crypto and we were talking to all these crypto-centric companies, you guys know them all, they asked us to build banking for them. And the big question I had was, why do we need to build banking for you? Why don't you use the largest banks in the country? And they said the banks that we can use are small. They're unproven, they have small balance sheets and we need someone that can do both Fiat and crypto together. So we went out and hired the person that built this at Silvergate Bank Ben Reynolds and he's building it for us. Right now it's launched, you can actually do big business banking with us now. It doesn't have all the functionality and API capabilities that will have on July 1st. But on July 1st, you'll be able to tap into an API, build your own portal for your company, do your own assignments internally to users below you and you can actually operate in both Fiat and crypto on big business banking platform and what we'll use there is SoFi USD. So you think SoFi USD is gonna be a really, really big deal. That's my goal, my goal is to get it to, you know, tens of billions of volume on an annual basis and we'll make money on SoFi USD and I do think it's important to point out what's different about SoFi versus others that will have stable coins. Everyone else that has a stable coin today is going down a path of applying for a national trust. National trust have been granted the ability to do payment stable coins through the genus I. They're not gonna be able to provide interest which has been laid out in the clarity bill. The interesting thing about all of those companies is that they have to take the reserves and go out and buy securities to generate a yield. Right, a NIM. When they do that, whenever you buy any security, I don't care if it's a treasury bill or a T bond, there is duration risk, there is credit risk and there's liquidation risk. And those things play themselves out in market dislocations like 2008 when you saw money markets break a dollar. We don't actually have those risks and the reason we don't have those risks is 'cause we're a national bank and we can take the reserves that we have and put them in our Fed Master account. You don't get access to a Fed Master account as a trust but you do as a national bank which we are. We'll earn Fed funds on that cash. So we have no credit risk because it's just sitting there in cash. We have no liquidation risk because that money could be sent via Fed wire instantly and we have no duration risk. You don't have to wait. So it's a huge advantage. So what we're pitching to companies are if you're going to operate in a stable coin and send payments via a stable coin, you should party with SoFi because we have the best regulatory license you can have with the best flexibility and we eliminate these three risks for you. So that yield that we get on the NIM. So let's just say we have $5 billion of existing reserves in SoFi stable coin, SoFi USD and it's at Fed funds, we're earning 3.8% on that. We'll probably give a portion of that away to market makers and exchanges as an incentive for them to use SoFi USD versus other choices. And so as you think about critical success factors, if we can drive the highest most reliable risk reward on NIM as it relates to SoFi USD, we can then incent people to use our currency and our payment rails compared to somebody else's. So and we have other things that we can do from a services standpoint. Even if we gave away all of the NIM, we would make money on big business banking or we make money on trading or we make money on these other types of capabilities and value added services. 'Cause we, for big business banking, we will charge a subscription fee and we'll charge payment, you know, transactional fees as well. In addition to all the other services that we offer in Fiat, which again are all fee based businesses. So if we get to $5 billion and the 3.8% interest would give away 1.8 of it and we have 2% that we have slept over, you can do the math yourself. It's a $100 million business sort of overnight. So and I think the opportunities to really capture not just all of the stablecoin revenue that exists today in transactions, but really convert ACH and debit transactions and wire transactions and fed now transactions to SoFi, USD or stablecoin transactions. - Would you consider this SoFi still blitz scaling? - We're definitely blitz scaling. Wow, we ran through walls to get SoFi USD. It's right now it's being burned and minted with a partner with Bitco. As I mentioned, you know, and so if you wanted to buy SoFi USD today, you'd have to go to Bitco, but very shortly able to do that just on SoFi and the app itself as a consumer and a big business banking on July 1 on that product. So super excited about what it can be. It's gonna be a game changer. It's obviously a payment network that also has a stored value. Today our payments when they're made that value ends immediately as soon as the payment's done. In this case, the payment once it's initiated is the starting point of value and it doesn't end once it gets to the destination and it stays in the ecosystem and the value actually continues to build. - How big do you think SoFi can actually become long term? Like is this really one of those things where it can compete with the JP Morgan to think America's world? - I don't, you know, I'll say this and I'll get criticized for it, but it's what I truly believe. I don't see why it can't be a trillion dollar company. - Really? - I think our products are more differentiated. I think what we deliver for members is more impactful. We're the only company that I know that has every product that we have on our digital platform. You know, at the end of the day, we're trying to solve something that people really care about. We're trying to help them achieve their American dream. - Yeah. - Have the size family they want, live where they want, the career they want, retire when they want. Like that is a very aspiration. thing, but it's 100% what we can deliver and the products that we have can help people spend less than they make and invest the rest. You know 70% of our invest members are existing members, so we're actually teaching people how to invest. I like to say that if you save it'll help you get by, but it won't help you get ahead. You have to invest to get ahead. I've been investing since I was 16. It's made a huge difference in my life. Yes, I've been fortunate to have jobs that pay really well, but well before I've had those jobs, I've been investing. It's helped me get ahead along the way. So I don't think anyone else has the platform that we have. I think it would be really hard for anyone to catch us. So all we have to do is become a household brand name that people trust and we have ubiquity. If we get the 30 to 40% of the world, basically naming so far when you think about us as a financial solution or financial choice, that's unated brand awareness will be bigger than all the companies that exist today. And because we're digital, we can serve in scale at a much lower cost and we continue to provide very differentiated value. I think we can provide better interest rates on checking and savings, better interest rates on loans, better services that other people do not provide and it just keeps fueling it. And your time is the whole world because everyone needs to get their money right. Yeah, we're focused with the SoFi brand on the US today. At some point we'll go internationally. The SoFi Technology Solutions business is international. It's in a number of LADAM countries and it's a big opportunity. People are pushing us to go internationally and we will do something internationally. It'll be slow, it'll be smart, it'll be thorough, it'll tie into our overall investment, thesis and portfolio. But if I look at SoFi Invest, it's up 100% in your year. Home loans is up 100% in your year. Our credit card business is up 100% or more year-to-year. These businesses are just at their inflection point. In Invest, we've gotten to the point now where we have the right products. It's scaling very nicely. It's monetizing really well. I think the monetization per AUM could double. Credit card, it took us a long time to figure it out. We have the formula working now. Our effective interest rate on credit cards going from 13% because we gave a bunch of people zero APR for a period of time to 17%. That's a big inflection point. We've figured out how to market the credit card to existing new members and can build that very responsibly and not have this huge j curve on every person. SoFi money has been phenomenal. It's not slowing down. It's very differentiated. We have four businesses invest money, credit card, and that are doing incredibly well. We'll continue to grow. Then we have these businesses, big business banking, SoFi USD, SoFi Plus, which we haven't talked about. SoFi USD that are also incredible growth opportunities that we're just starting with. We're funding all of that despite the fact that we're investing so much. Our margins are still intact at 30%. Let's get into SoFi Plus. What's the incentive for SoFi members to convert to SoFi Plus? What added advantage do they get on that? So we launched SoFi Plus in 2025. This is the best case study of SoFi's mentality in our culture. The product didn't do that well. I think we added 60,000 paying SoFi Plus members last year. Which is $10 a month. 10 dollars a month. Then we had a bunch of direct deposit customers that were also SoFi Plus members because they got it for free. We spent the year iterating and iterating iterating on what we needed to deliver from a product standpoint to differentiate it to drive greater appeal and acceptance. The positioning is the following. We want SoFi Plus to be the best of all SoFi. If you're a SoFi Plus member, you'll get a better invest experience than just an invest member. If you're a SoFi Plus member, you'll get a better money experience than even a direct deposit customer would. Same thing on loans, etc. So as we thought about that positioning, we thought about what value to put in there, it causes us to start to bifurcate SoFi money and direct deposit offering. SoFi invest and SoFi Plus invest offering. Basically we launched it on April 1st after iterating, iterating like crazy. I think most people in the company wanted to kill me because I kept pushing and pushing and pushing as for more analysis, more analysis. I wanted to figure out the right economic formula where people were really motivated. It was so it was so telegraphic that it was a better value that they would just do it. So we launched on April 1st, one of the big differentiators is that you now have to pay for it. So it's $10 a month, but we give you 4.5% interest on your cash up to $20,000. And so if someone had $10,000 and they're a direct deposit customer and their savings account, they're getting $3.8% interest on $10,000. They pay $10 a month and almost something they get 4.5% on $10,000. So 70 basis point increase. You can quickly do the math and how much they have to increase their deposits for that deposit interest to exceed the $120 a year. And that formula is pretty easy. And so I think we nailed it on bifurcating it. The growth has been way better than I thought. We've added we've added hundreds. We now have 160,000 paying SoFi Plus members. It's only been out for six weeks. So that could get to a million pretty quickly. We have more than 15 million members. I'd be super disappointed if we can't get one million of them to be SoFi Plus members. In fact, every one of our direct deposit customers should be a SoFi Plus member. It's sort of a IQ test to make that choice. It's got tremendous value in it. So I'm super excited about it. If we get a million members, it's $120 million of revenue, direct revenue. But it's more than that. And people switched to it, and I should have mentioned, 90% of our SoFi Plus members are existing members. When they switched to it, two behaviors happen. One, they're now paying us $120 a year, $10 a month. They've actually increased what they're doing with us. Their engagement. And their products there. In the products they already have, they increase their deposits, which then increases their spending. And so all of a sudden, the revenue we get from just the SoFi money member increases. Or the SoFi Invest member adds more AUM. We're getting 70 basis points per dollar of AUM and it's increasing. But then a large percentage of people, after they sign up for SoFi Plus in addition to that increased activity and things they already do, they're taking out another product. And if you go back to what I talked about earlier about Uniteconomics and Lifetime Value being a competitive advantage, we're just driving the financial services productivity loop to the next level. Someone takes out a loan that previously was just a SoFi money member and a direct deposit customer. That's $1,600 of LTV literally overnight because we're not paying a customer acquisition cost. So by the way, we now have more data about the person and maybe we give them a credit card so we can monitor their debt and help them avoid, you know, normally when someone takes a PL, they're actually paying off a credit card debt that they have. And so they should also have our credit card and we could see how their debts increasing over time and stop them before that credit card gets back to $10,000 of balances that are revolving. So the product is not only going to have a direct benefit of the $120 per year, it'll have increased activity in the existing products and it's clearly driving new products. So super excited about it. So SoFi is a technology company. You may operate in financial services and banking, but you own the entire backend. You just made two acquisitions. I may get the interview wrong. I think it was yesterday from the JP Morgan conference. You discussed how you're going to be embedding certain technology and AI features into some of your products. And then a little bit detail about how you're going to be offering more technological advantages for SoFi members. And what is your response to people that say SoFi is not a tech company? It's just a bank. Let me answer that question first. I would think of the financial model as a, I'm sorry, I would think of the revenue model and the cost model as a financial business, right? If you look at companies like Twitter, their financial model is actually advertising. Our financial model is the business of finance, which is considered banking. But the way we deliver our service is 100% technology driven. There's no buildings that we build. There's no real estate that we buy. We wouldn't exist without technology. It's all ones and zeros. So you know, at the end of the day, I think people will say that about a bank because they're debating multiples of revenue, debating, valuation and the revenue streams are financially oriented like other financial services companies. My view is I actually don't care what you call us. I do care if you believe we can drive compounding growth of 30% in revenue and earnings growth of 40%. If you believe those things, everything else takes care and 20 to 30% are we? Everything else will take care of itself because I can get the outstanding values whether I values as a tech company or a bank or a diversified financial services company. If you believe 30% revenue growth compounding 40% earnings growth and ROE of 20 to 30%. In terms of those tech solutions around Galileo and technesis, I guess how are you thinking of the RFQ process, the ability to get more and more financial institutions using your back end? And how do you think that can scale over the next five years? Yes. So far, technology solutions, I think, is probably the most misunderstood thing about the company. And that's my fault. And so first, let me say this. The concept and the vision of being the AWS Affentech will never go away. What are the being the AWS Affentech is building technologies that financial services companies need and non-financial services companies need to do financial services? The biggest person, sorry, the company that has the greatest needs is so far. No one has bigger needs for so far technology solutions products other than so far. No one. No one else has all the products that we have on an only digital platform. So we have greater need for cores. We have a greater need for processing capability. We have a greater need for payment hub capability. And we have greater need for risk and fraud. No one else. So so far, technology solutions builds for the company that has the greatest needs. And if we build for the company that has the greatest needs, shouldn't all those products but used by other people, they should be if they're built for the company with the greatest needs in the most complexity, we should build the best product. So we would. not be where we are today if we did not make the acquisitions we did in Galileo and technosys and built out the capabilities across the four areas that I mentioned. I spoke about the solar solar and solar on the labor of the point, but there's so many examples I could give you where we wouldn't generate revenue in this other business if we didn't own that business. And so we're excited that this July will roll out to SoFi Money, a new modern core that's in the cloud that's better than any other core. Technosys had a core before. We decided to take it to the next level and the next version of it and we're excited about that. But today there's four basic revenue segments to think about. You have corp, you have processing. So that's debit, a CH processing, the Galileo business and issuing, which there's still a lot of demand for it. We did uncouple ledgers from that. So the second area is core banking cores and ledgers in all the banking as a service APIs that we've offered over years in terms of account opening or two day early paycheck or mobile check upload or rewards or disputes. And so all the APIs are still there. So the first thing is processing, second thing is cores and ledgers, which are independent now and then all the APIs. Third thing is payment hub. So today, if you look at SoFi, we do self-serve wires. SoFi technology is just seems built self-serve wires. Today, we enable FedNow, so instant movement of money. So if a technology services team built that product, we already do ACH, we do debit, we do Zell, we do person-to-person payment, the phone number, we do person-to-person payment, email, we'll do stablecoin payments as well. So payment hub is meant to be a self-serve business, API enabled for companies to come in and enable those types of payments, including Apple Pay and Venmo and all the other versions. Right. And then on the fraud and risk side of the equation, you can imagine we have a lot of fraudsters that try to open accounts or still accounts on SoFi. Some people lose their cards or their credentials and so we have transactional fraud. So we have a great need for this. It cuts across all of our 12 businesses. And so we have seven products in the fraud and risk bucket and the go-to-market. The teams in the process have changed in the go-to-market against those four areas. I think it's a much cleaner way to go to market than with brands. And we're going to market with products instead of the brands of the companies that we bought. That's always been part of my thesis, is that SoFi will be building exactly what they need. They're one of the most complex, if not the most complex, because of the digital first. And then be able to white label it and power their competitors, generate incremental revenue, multi-year contracts, annual kickers. Is that still in the flywheel for the future? Yes. We aspire to do all those things. One of the other things that we're doing is removing the responsibility for building infrastructure software almost entirely out of SoFi. And the reason for that is, is one of the principles I've been emphasizing for eight years, is that regardless of who builds a technology at SoFi, whether it's the money team, the invest team, the member team, credit card team, doesn't matter who it is, they have to build that technology for themselves, their business, but also anyone else at SoFi can use it. Right. So it has to be enabled for anyone else to use it, and anyone else outside of SoFi to use it. Well, the reality is, is that that principle doesn't always get upheld when you're trying to get the market really fast, and people have to cut corners in short timelines. So my view is, if we actually put all the infrastructure capabilities and development into SoFi technology solutions, they have no products that they use. They're building for other people by definition. So by default, result in every product that we build, 100% being built for anyone at SoFi or any third party. So the actual talent won't even sit underneath the businesses with SoFi brands, so it'll all sit in SoFi technology solutions. So you guys have now introduced Cash Revenue Metrics. Why do you think that's a better way to model the business than before those metrics? I don't know, avoid saying a better way. I think, you know, use our SEC file documents or 10Qs and 10Ks, aKs, etc. Use GAP accounting as one way to do it. The reason why we released Cash Revenue is, we want to make it easier for people to understand the business. And the accounting is complicated. Fair market value accounting is complicated. Cost accounting and CISO cost accounting. They all have pros and cons. So as we were debating how to make it easier for people to understand the business and answer questions we would have on accounting and the differences between companies, I literally said, what if we actually just reported Cash Revenue? And if you would run when they're in the room at that point in time and said, what percent of our revenue do you think is Cash versus non-Cash? People would have said about 50 to 60%. So imagine they're shocked when we came back and said the 2024 and 2025 revenue was almost 100% Cash. And the reason why that's the case is the business scale to such a point where the accounting almost kind of washes itself out. And I'm simplifying things. And my goal is until like tell you everything that you have to consider. There's many, many things beyond what we'll be able to cover here in the accounting that you have to consider to come to these conclusions. But one way to model the business, if you just want to do it in a simplistic way and not complicate matters is you just take our net interest income and see what it's been over time. That is literally Cash. I mean, very, very small piece of it would not be Cash. But I did this a couple days ago in preparation for the JP Morgan conference. I looked at from Q1 of 2024 until Q1 of 2026 or a long time period nine quarters, how much net interest income do we generate? It turns out to be $4.6 billion of net interest income. In the first quarter of 26, we announced $690 million of Cash net interest income, which happens to be the same number that's on the income statement in our disclosures for net interest income. So $4.6 billion of Cash net interest income. If you look at the premium value from fair market value on the balance sheet disclosures, it was $2 billion. What does that mean? What means we generated more than 2X in Cash revenue from the loans that had recognized $2 billion of non-cash premium. So when people talk about fair market value accounting and premiums, it's $2 billion of a premium. But the actual cash generated by those loans that have non-cash revenue recognition of the $2 billion is two times that amount, which is pretty amazing. Which says the loans are producing more cash than the initial marks on the book that are non-cash cash marks. So you can now model that. You could look at our balance sheet, take the ending balance sheet, beginning balance sheet, apply to it, and that interest income number, that's calculable over all those quarters. We actually disclose it. And you can get to the next quarters cash revenue number and next quarters N.I. Not very complicated at all at all. If you look at the other revenue stream, $390 million of non-interest income cash revenue, which I mentioned before is basically fee revenue and interchange revenue, etc. Not going through all the pieces of it, LPB revenue, tech platform revenue, $390 million. If you take out of that to LPB revenue, which isn't really product driven, and the rest of the revenue is product driven, the LPB revenue is literally just, we're prusing loans for somebody and we're getting paid fees for that. So it's not a product driven metric. If you take that out, which is $120 million, you take the remaining revenue and divide it by our number of products, you know how our revenue per product metric, a monetization metric. You could then decide what you want the products to grow over time. They currently just grew 37%, so whatever number you want to put in there, 35%. And then look at the revenue per product and say, why would revenue per product go higher? Well, revenue per product could go, and this is excluding LPB, revenue per product could go higher because the amount of AUM that they have an invest is low. And as they add more products like retirement products, margins, margin options, etc., the revenue in AUM will go up and invest, and so the revenue per product will go up. As they get more deposits, the revenue per product will go up. As they monetize credit card better, the revenue per product will go up. As so-fi plus grows, revenue per product will go up. So all of a sudden, you could look at product growth and revenue per product growth, and you can model together other numbers. It's funny because there's a lot of people saying so-fies, hiding stuff, they're not transparent. And from what I'm hearing here, you guys are doing everything you can to get people to better understand how to value the business. I think the accounting's hard. I think the math is hard. And every time someone questions the accounting, I literally go back and look at everything all over again, and I get to the truth and I feel comfortable with it. And this is a shorter way to get comfortable with it. Like if our cash and interest income is below the non-cash revenue recognition, there's a real problem. Right. But it's 2X that. So I feel really good about the quality of what we're underwriting, and you can see what the actual loans are producing a cash revenue, which they have to exceed the non-cash recognition that's up front over time. You can't hide from morality when it comes to cash. And I would also say that you can't hide from the members, and the members growing, not declining, tells a very powerful story, especially the way that you're currently scaling. What would you say to all the people that are not using Sovi? And maybe some have a notion in their mind that they don't have any physical locations. I feel more comfortable with a financial institution that has a physical branch that like a go-to, part A, part B. How big is that opportunity over the next 10 years as we see a very huge wealth transfer because there is a whole generation that will be passing on a tremendous amount of assets, and people will need to find their banking solutions. Yeah. I think on the digital side, there are businesses where there's no reason to have a physical building. So brokerage, you don't need to go into a physical building. People have been comfortable doing brokerage digitally for years. Credit card, like, why do you need to go? There's nowhere to go. We're giving you money to spend. The businesses that I do think you need, people will have to make a choice on, is withdrawing cash and putting cash in. And so we try to make that very clear. very easy, but if you believe you need to have a branch within a few miles of your home until you get comfortable with so far, what I'd say is open an account, put some amount of money there, use it for a month, see how reliable it is, see how valuable it is, and then slowly make the change. Now I have five children and a wife, obviously. Have you had time for everything you do? Well, I'm a little bit older than if people think our oldest daughter's in her 30s and her second oldest daughter's high 20s. See, you were telling me you're almost 60, I couldn't believe it. It's crazy. But anyway, they all, I tell them all to have a secondary account. No one should have just, I want them to use so far as their primary account. I want the whole world to use so far as their primary account. We should have a backup credit card. You should have a backup account because what happens if something goes wrong? You don't want to deal with that. So, there are some things where the probability of something happening is not the measurement of whether you should do it. It's whether it could happen. Any of it's only a 1% risk that 1% risk you can't live with, like you need access to money. So, for those people that are worried about or branch not being close to them or they're worried about, can we deliver? Try the product as a portion of what you do and gain the trust over time. Our goal is to make sure that we deliver on that trust every time because our model will lose value if we can't build that trust with you so that you do the second and third product that you need with us. So, do you think the LPB can be a billion dollar business, so far? Definitely. You know, and I do want to address the questions about LPB before we talk too much more about it. What I'd say is this, we are making a boat load of investments in 2026. I mentioned four other than SoFi Plus, which we had no idea in 2025 we're going to do. So, you get to 2026. Obviously, there are estimates out there on the street. You start thinking about all the things you can invest in and you get really excited about big business banking. Like, how can you not? It could literally be a huge business. SoFi USD could literally be a hundred million dollar business by the end of the year. Super exciting. SoFi Plus, I think it's going to do well. I'm not sure. But we got to be prepared to invest if it does well. We do crypto by selling hold. We're going to have to build that, build awareness of that. And then we want to do as that build and we get assets, we can do lending off of it, which would be really different. Shading get people to get rid of their credit card debt and take out a secured loan at it even lower rate than our PLs. Those are four entirely new investment areas. They all need engineering and product. They all need financial services people. They all need people teams, et cetera, et cetera. Then you look at SoFi Invest. It's going a hundred percent year of year. Do we want to shortchange that investment? No. Credit card, we finally figured out that we want to shortchange that investment. No, we shouldn't. We're also launching small, medium, business, which we're in. But we haven't been doing it on a part of our prior territory basis. And June will launch it on a proprietary basis. And SoFi money, do you really want to slow down? SoFi money, it's getting these great deposits. It's like the tip of the sword. Same thing with SoFi Relay. So instead of actually taking investments away from other people, we had more capital. We had more capital because we were opportunistic in case we would need it. Well if we have more capital, what can we do? We can lend more. The lending is more revenue. Well that additional revenue covers all those investments. I just said that we can still get to the earnings estimate of 60 cents that we've told the street. And we may actually grow a little bit faster. So as we came into the year and looked at all the four quarters of 26 and 2027 and said, Hey, we've committed to 30% or more top line growth, 30% incremental EBITDA margins and earnings estimates. If we increase all the investments, how do we get there? Well we should actually put more on the balance sheet because it's more revenue. And so we came into the year with a point of view on what we're going to put on the balance sheet. In Q1, we produced a bunch of originations. We're able to deliver on the loan platform minimum commitments. We fund our balance sheet first, that number. And then the rest goes to at least our minimum commitments and LPB and then some upside. We actually delivered some upside to LPB relative to our minimum commitments. We actually had a lot more demand. We probably had another billion dollars of demand if we originated more. But we originated as much as we could. It fed the balance sheet first because we needed to revenue to cover the costs in the future costs. Not not just all LPB. If we shifted two billion dollars to LPB, the LPB number would have been up. But we get to Q1 of 2027. You don't have the net interest income from that two billion dollars and all of a sudden I have a hole to solve there. So it's a bouncing act. I think we're great allocators, the capital managers of risk. And this was an allocation decision to fund all these businesses to deliver on our near-term objectives. But really set us up for 2027 and 2028. And oh, by the way, some of these things could hit and impact the back half of 2026 and shock the world. Thank you for the big business banking. I've been really mad. You know when that came out, he made a video on YouTube for like 40 minutes just so excited. I've been talking about big business banking for probably a year and a half, two years now. So thank you. It's been one of the things I've wanted to see Sofie do. One of the things you haven't discussed publicly, my question is would Sofie consider ever becoming an administrator of 401k and 4.3 B plans? It's not in the current plans. Would we consider it absolutely? If it's, you know, so I think about fast selection, content, conveyance and better together. Selection is not well understood by the market or competitors, which I am happy about. I don't want them to actually know what we mean by selection, but that's a form of selection. Retirement accounts is a form of selection, being an administrator has certain benefits to it, etc. It's not in our current plans and something we could do over time. I actually think retirement accounts are the least appreciated asset within invest. It's really sticky money. You can drive good revenue off of it without additional costs. You remain a destination for people to have to come back to. And I think we have to invest even more in retirement accounts. We've done a good job. But there's even more that we can do. Anthony Noto, CEO of SoFi, thank you so much for taking the time. We really appreciate it. Got a quick couple of rapid fire. Just to get to know a little bit more about you. First of all, can you describe your day today? What does it look like? I know it's probably changing every day. It's different by every day. The week, Monday mornings, I kind of have my alone time to do some work, get my thoughts prepared for the street. We have a document that we put together each week as a staff that we go through. That has a very structured approach to it. So I review that and we have a staff meeting about two hours after I wake up. After that staff meeting, I'll have a bunch of different meetings. I have a weekly meeting on Monday, on crypto currency and all the stuff that we're doing there. We have a weekly meeting on SoFi Plus and everything that we're doing there. I'd say Tuesday is a hot Podge of different things. It's either talking to partners, talking about potential buyers on the loan side. It's about recruiting, interviewing people. It's about doing one-on-ones with management team. You love all of this. You've done a lot of business your whole life. You still love doing it. I don't desire to work any other place. I know I'm technically not the founder of SoFi, but I kind of feel like it's a different company than when we took it over. Maybe it's a refund or sort of mentality. I couldn't imagine doing anything else. It's intoxicating. Every day I wake up, I feel a sense of urgency to run faster, to run harder, to reach higher. That's a great thing to get you out of the bed. I hope I can do it as long as I can and the company allows me to do as long as I can. What's the main lesson, Coach Sutton, instilled in you that you have taken with you through the business career? Coach Sutton was a great coach when I was at Army who was a defensive coordinator. He actually taught me the defense in about two hours when I got switched from fullback to linebacker. Slow, fullback, quick linebacker. I've heard that before. Anyway, Coach was great and he built on a lot of the same tennis that Coach Young, who was our head coach for all four years there. Coach taught us so many things. I think the most important thing is that he built in us is culture. The three words that he would use for us and our team was Pride Poise team. There were moments when we had friends that were doing stuff that were self-serving. One of my best friends in the world was a quarterback and he was a freshman and he was put in a room with a senior quarterback that was starting and they walked into the hotel room and my friend put his bag on the first bed and the other quarterback. The senior knocked his bag on the ground. My friend that was a freshman turned to the senior quarterback and said, "Muni, mooney, mooney." It's not Pride Poise team, it's all about you. We held each other to that standard and that's what allowed us to build a camaraderie to overcome beating teams that were well better than us. Coach taught us a lot. He used Sun Sua Tun. We had a different card on our chairs each week when we walked in. I saved them all. I looked at them frequently. Probably the biggest thing he taught me was what are the most important things we have to do to win a game? When they turn over a battle, when the time of possession, when sudden situations, when the fourth quarter. You do those things when the game. I try to apply that to everything. Do you go to more football games now with the SoFi Stadium or when you were the CFO with the NFL? I'd say it's probably pretty equal. The difference is when I go to the games at SoFi Stadium now, I'm there with business partners. They're enjoying the game. I'm enjoying the game. It's not work. Yes, they're business partners, but we're there to have fun. It's social. We don't really talk about work. Maybe an odd hear thing or there. When I went to football games at the NFL, my back was typically to the field and I was getting grilled by one of 32 owners or one of 32 presidents or the commissioner or God knows who. I went to my first Super Bowl and I don't think I saw a play and by the end of the day, my throat was horse and I had a headache and my mind was spinning with all the questions I got asked. Favorite food? Chicken Parmesan. That's this thing. Last one, Anthony Noto. What is your favorite movie? When Harry Metzali. It's a great one. You can watch it. I've actually watched it. What's his name? Don't say it. Matthew McConaughey's in there. It's not not Matthew McComayy. Who the hell on? - Billy Crystal, Meg Ryan. - Trust me, you've never seen this movie in my life. (laughing) He's seen about 10 movies in his whole life. It's something that there may be two movies you could say that he's seen. - What's the famous line? - Yeah, I don't know. - When you know who you wanna spend the rest of your life with, you want your rest of your life to start with? - What was the, the Matthew McConaughey with the 10 dates or something? - I have no idea. - Yeah, I know what you're talking about. - That failed. - Yeah. - Goldie Hans, that was it. - Anthony Noto, CEO. So if I actually hear the actual last question, what is your master's-to-hole retumbest that continued to hold on to the stock? - We're staying true to our mission, our strategy and our plan and prioritization. Nothing's changed. We're gonna keep delivering. The stock in any short period of time is not gonna always reflect reality 'cause the uncertainty of interest rates. I know it's hard to believe that's what's happening, but to the best of my belief that's happening. And if there's someone that we're doing wrong that's causing it to happen, we'll do what it takes to fix it. I read everything that's on Twitter. I understand people's point of view and we're working our butts off to make it a great outcome for them. And when I buy our stock, it's because I think it's of great value and I want the world to know how confident I am. And I'm not focused on the next quarter or the next six months or the next year and getting a return. I know that $15 is trading at two times tangible book. I'm pretty confident our tangible book is gonna continue to grow. And even if the multiple doesn't change, which I think it will, they'll have a great appreciation from here. I've never bought with leaps, but yesterday I was on chat GPT and started looking at leaps. And the reason is, this is not happening. I'm not that scared. No, no, the reason why I did is like, I only have so much cash. I may have a certain amount of wealth, but when it comes to cash, I'm not selling so far stock. And I'm happy you said that 'cause a lot of people are like, "Well, he's worked so much, he's throwing a million dollars." It's like a million dollars is a lot of money. I don't think people realize where I came from a million dollars was if you ever heard that in your life, you were one half of a percent of, so I think everybody should go listen to your speech from Stanford at the National Football Foundation. - Well, thank you. Anyway, I was looking at leaps to try to get more exposure with a little bit of cash. I have left that I can allocate towards it. A lot of what I've invested in over the last 30 years has huge capital gains and the tax implications are pretty significant now. So I'm just trying to find a way to get more exposure and do it in a responsible long-term way. - And we should say thank you to Chris Hager, who was a retail investor, who really loved SoFi, and now he's working there just any thoughts on the experience of working with Chris. - Oh, he's doing a great job. He's a breast share fret, a fresh error. Gives us great perspectives, very passionate about the company. I think if he could be transparent, I think he would tell you that his enthusiasm and passion for what we're doing and confidence in it is greater now that he's at the company than he was before. But that's up for him to say. But he's working hard, he's energized and great to have on the team. - Anthony Noto, CEO SoFi. - Thank you. - Take your time. - Thank you for coming. - Thank you. - It's how to lose a guy in 10 days. - How to lose a guy in 10 days. - Just assume whenever somebody says their favorite movie that you have not seen. Just assume that, please. - The Leap's clip is gonna go from now. - Oh, right.