Celine Dion’s Triumphant Return to the Stage

Hey, everyone, it's Natalie. If you're not yet a time subscriber, I have some news for you. You can enjoy full access to the times without a paywall for 30 days. All you have to do is download the app to get your first month completely free. And if you're already a time subscriber, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, here's today's show. There's a classic moment in every Celine Dion concert that everybody in the room is waiting for and it's when she's doing all by myself. Oh, by myself. So we're all waiting for it. Maybe I'm projecting my own feelings, but there's a really, like, a strong performance anxiety. Is she going to pull off that note? That note that we're all waiting for. Oh, by myself. You could feel the arena just holding its collective breath and she does it. And then she lets out this very visible sigh of relief. It looked like she surprised herself. It was just a fantastic moment and the people around us were screaming and crying and I talked to the woman who was sitting behind me afterwards and she said, that's one I knew she was back. From The New York Times, I'm Natalie Kitrowa. This is The Daily on Sunday. Last month, Celine Dion, widely considered to be one of the greatest singers of our time, made a triumphant and emotional return to the stage. Followed years of uncertainty about whether or not she'd ever be able to perform again, after being diagnosed with a rare neurological condition called stiff person syndrome. My colleague, Elizabeth Finchantelli, was there to see it and today she'll tell us about how Dion found her way back to her voice and to her fans. Also, I love her so much. Can I say that? It's Sunday, October 11th. Elizabeth, welcome to The Sunday Daily. I'm very happy to be here. I want to start by proposing a theory about why this Celine Dion comeback is so compelling. She has clearly captivated so many people all around the world and I think it's because her fans have this very special relationship with her, like not just her music but her personality, who she is as a person. She is a diva, yes, but unlike most divas, she somehow feels very accessible. She lets us into her world, she's vulnerable, she's extremely quirky in a way that feels unusual for a person of her status and fame. And I think that all of those things have made us, myself included, deeply invested in her return to the stage. What do you think about? Well, Celine Dion is an interesting case because on the one hand, she has all the signifiers of the diva. She lives in a gated community in Las Vegas. She has a wayhouse of clothes, literally a warehouse of clothes. She's always very well put together. And yet, you get that very deep-seated feeling that she has not changed. She comes from very hard-scrabble family in Quebec. She's the youngest of 14 kids and her parents were running a little cafe piano bar. And there is a feeling that she is still that person, that underneath everything, she has this very unique way to connect with people. In that sense, to me, she really is like Dolly Parton, who is another superstar who you felt. You really have this very intimate conviction that she has not forgotten where she came from. There are people who really connect. They're background, they're bringing with who they are now. And regardless of how many bazillion albums they have sold, how many Vegas Presidencies, there's still that sense that they are of the people. And it's a very rare quality and you can't acquire it. In her case, there's really the sense that under the cure and the couture, there's still that same person. Right. I love that comparison to Dolly Parton. Let's talk about your relationship to Celine Dion. When did that begin? Well, technically, I mean, I was kind of not really paying much attention until I was dispatched to review her first headlining concert in New York, which was in 1994 at Town Hall. Uh-huh. It was a lot of Canadians in the room. She, at that point, she's already famous. She's very famous in Canada. She's famous in France, but not superstar famous in France yet. And in the US, she already has like two top ten hits, right? So Power of Love and Beauty and the Beast. She really is not an unknown, but it's her first headlining show. And I went in pretty much neutral. Not particularly interested in Beauty and the Beast, but OK, like Lizzy the phenomenon. And also, you know, I'm a struggling freelancer. I won't go review anything. You throw at me. OK. And I remember writing that she, she showed a very commendable restraint, which in retrospect is just like the funniest thing I could have written because that is one thing she's not known for. It was trained. But also at the time, I'm listening to like Bikini Killman, I was a huge grunge fan. And coming from that is not your style of music. No, it's not. And like at this point, I'm listening more to like New York noise rock, pretty world stuff in general. It sounds like you were impressed with her technically, but you weren't necessarily going to go home and turn on Celine. I did not go home and turn on Celine. Mm-hmm. So you have to remember the 90s is really the decade when Celine Dion becomes Celine. That's the decade when she goes from a slightly gauky, a little awkward, québécois girl, who's well-known in the French language market. That's when she morphs into the sleek superstar. She basically means she does not drop her last name, but she might as well drop her last name. She really becomes that kind of person. And there's some kind of big moments, you know, it's all going back to me now. Oh, by myself. And then of course, 97, my heart will go on from Titanic, which becomes this kind of like the huge worldwide hit. And the disdain for her is just as strong as the popularity for her. She usually explain that. You're saying she's having all these hits, but there's a lot of the same thing. There's a really strong critical. This is before the quote unquote "poptimist" moment when it becomes okay to re-evaluate the way pop is perceived. This is really the peak. We're in the post-grunge era and her brand of just straightforwardness and naked emotion does not go over well with critics. So words that come up a lot in reviews from that time are schmaltzy, bland, and loud. There's the sense that she works too hard on it. She works so hard at singing so loud and people like this sense that you're not trying. But it comes to you naturally. And she just tries so hard and it's seen as cool. Exactly. She's really the epitome of the uncool. Also there's the sense that she's not staying in her lane. It's really there's this moment in the 1998 taping the first VH1 diva's live. There's a moment when she's perceived as trying to upstage Aretha Franklin. So funny because I remember that and thinking maybe it's just in high time but that it was this incredible, beautiful showcase of all these power voices. And now it sounds like it was contentious. At the time it was. It really was. Like some people were like who is this, and also a Canadian. Who is this Canadian trying to tell us Americans who know all about power belting? Like what to do. There's this really this sense of that. So another thing that she does at the time is that she's the first one in the modern era to have a residence in Vegas. Like she goes to a room a venue that is tailored for her show in 2003. Now this seems completely obvious. Of course. A del is doing it. I mean, everybody loves a del. Yeah. At the time this is seen as like oh my god. This is where talent goes to die. Vegas. Talent goes to die in the desert. This is a part where I have to come back. out as a lifelong Celine Dion fan. My mom's from Montreal. I have been listening to Celine forever for as long as I can remember. So maybe I just feel defensive of her. But people were showing up for these shows, right? I mean, the critics may not have loved her, but the people did. Right. But she is dismissed by the critical establishment as, oh, that Canadian belter can, yeah, yeah, she has good pipes. She can sing. But, you know, she's in Vegas. And, and then all those hicks can go see her. I am kind of neutral on that. I don't really follow her career. And then in 2008, she finishes her run in Vegas. And she goes on tour because she's a workaholic. And I catch that tour. I catch a stop at Madison Square Garden. And that's, that's really when I became a convert. That show blew my mind. And you have to understand, I'm really, I'm not a fan of arena shows. I don't like when I go to show, I don't like watching it on a screen, which often happens. Yeah. That show blew me away because she made me forget. I was with 20,000 people. That's the first time when I saw for myself her personality. I had not been aware of that. And her ad libbing on stage, her off the cuff comments, the weird little dances that she breaks into her banter between song, like some of itself completely like what? Because it sounds like what you were seeing was this really cookie side of this person where it's like, okay, her image is of a schmaltsy, you know, kitschy belter, as you said. But in reality, what you saw was this weird, really funny person. Yes, with a real personality because she had always been presented a little bit like the singing robot. Oh, she can really hit all this stuff. She's like singing and droid. Like she's almost not human. But like, where is the feeling? I mean, that, and in research, like, it's such a ridiculous accusation because she's full of feeling. It might not be your way to express feeling. Her way is very sincere. Right. She's just herself. And whether that's true or not, I don't know, I don't know Celine Dion, maybe she's not like that at all. But I really fell in love with the stage Celine that night. And did you have the sense at that time that you were seeing something that other people just hadn't, that your fellow critics hadn't and that maybe if they did, their impression of her would change? I really did feel that. I felt, well, first of all, I felt like there was some, like, it was a humility moment for me too because I thought, oh, well, her fans really, the ones who go to our shows really, they already knew this. Why am I so late to this? It's always a very healthy feeling for a critic, I think, to have that moment. But at the same time, my friends and peers were like, oh my God, you want to see Celine Dion? That is crazy. Like the tide has not turned yet. But it's about to because we really at the moment when YouTube is about to explode. And YouTube was very, very good to Celine because what starts appearing on YouTube are videos of her appearances on talk shows, for instance. You know, I love singing, but I love to talk too. Being the 14th child of the family, when I have a chance to talk, I talk. Her personality is in those appearance on the daytime talk shows. Are you trying to have a baby? Are you pregnant? I am not pregnant yet. But we're working on it. And it's going fantastically well. I was not aware of that. There's a completely, like, blind spot. Mm-hmm. And then YouTube appears, and a lot of others discover her because suddenly we're starting those videos of her appearances on talk shows. They're super cuts of her cookiest interviews. And there's many of them. A little bit in material out there. It's great. Time to make the donut, you know, that guy quit. You could be the little donut person. Imagine. And we realized that she is an eccentric. There's a real person behind the pipes, so to speak. I really think YouTube and the clips of her appearance really helps change the tide. Do you think also, Elizabeth, that what was cool started to change at the same time? Because you were talking about this period of time when irony was, you know, the thing you wanted to kind of embody. But as we start to get later into the aughts, it sounds like maybe some of the moors change there, too. Yes, I think the cultural context is changing, but what's remarkable is the context that changes because she doesn't change. And she switches from the daytime talk shows to the late night ones. And that's a big difference. You didn't want to do that, son. My heart will go on. I'm sorry. I think very telling his her appearance on the Carpool Karaoke with James Corden that they shoot in Vegas, which is the best. Classic. It's the club. It is incredible. Classic. Where she makes fun of Titanic. Right. She goes on a boat. Yes. With James Corden, I mean, it is an act of self-satire. And everything that leads up to that moment, too, when they're in the car, and even he seems stunned by her. He does. I've watched this one more times than I should admit. And it makes me laugh every time. If you feel down, I would say, listen, go watch the Celine Dion Carpool Karaoke with one point, he makes her give out some of her shoes. And the way she plays this out is incredibly fun. It's just great timing. Yeah. You don't feel good. Are you okay? I need alcohol. That's bad. Because she's also making fun of herself for being a little bit of a diva and having the largest shoe collection known to man. Yes. People realize that she has a great sense of humor. And she can also make fun of herself. And my third time seeing her was in Brooklyn at Berkeley Center in February 2020. I saw that show. And that was a very good show. It was amazing. None of us in the crowd knew that she was already ill. I know. I think about that all the time. No, please don't cry. No, I will. But I do think about that all the time. No, I know. And she said in a recent interview, actually, that she had had symptoms for 17 years before the official diagnostic, which had been leading to like abrupt cancellations and things like that. But they could not figure out what was going on. So very rare disorder. So they could not figure it out. Right. And then in 2022, she makes a very dramatic announcement. Hello, everyone that she has been diagnosed with a neurological disorder called stiff person syndrome, which affects something like one in a million people. It's a very rare disorder. And frankly, nobody really knew what it was. Right. I always give 100% when I do my shows. But my condition is not allowing me to. And then she kind of disappeared to look after herself. Okay. I want to talk about what we learned about what Celine is up against and how exactly this disease affected her voice. We'll do that after the break. We'll be right back. So I think like a lot of people had never heard of this disease stiff person syndrome before Celine's announcement, because it really is so rare. So can you just explain how this disease affects the body? So basically what happens is that you get this severe muscle stiffness and very painful spasms that really kind of lock you. And you become a steady, you have very, you have a hard time walking, for instance, and it affects many things in the body, including the vocal chords and the singing. Right. And as far as I know, I don't think there's any treatment. You can manage it, but you can't cure it. Right. So in June, 2024, there's a documentary that comes out called I am Celine Dion. And it's filmed almost entirely in her house. And we see her pottering around and doing stuff with her two younger sons and making coffee and she's in her sweatpants. And one of the things that the documentary covers is how this affects her voice. My lungs are fine. It's what's in front of my lungs that's so rigid because of Stifterson syndrome. This is her instrument. Right. Her voice. She can't do what she loves doing. And by all accounts, she loves singing. She breaks into song all the time. And she can't do it. It's like I know you. That's what happens. It's like I know what I want to do. And now you can show me. Yeah. She's a huge perfectionist. And she has no control on what she. is doing when she's singing she could start croaking she could just the notes won't come out and that's what happens and it's very difficult for me to be here not to show this to you that is devastating yeah it's so raw I mean you can almost hear her heart breaking so in the film we see her going to the studio working on songs trying to sing trying to reconnect with her the voice that we all know and sometimes it goes okay and sometimes it doesn't at all and then she goes to a physical therapy session and she has a seizure and fortunately her therapist is there and he helps her she keeps spasming I could lead to a crisis she's laying down and she's completely she's her face is frozen in this rictus of of pain there's all these merciless close-ups and of her it's incredibly I cannot believe she let that be shown yeah I I mean I saw the documentary and it was almost unbearable to watch this scene and it goes on and on and on it takes quite a while for that seizure to subside and this is when you realize oh my god like how long has this been going on it's this like this every day what it's it's a really awful scene and it's I mean we are of course we're reading she was human but this shows a level of vulnerability that she often had been accused of concealing in her songs hmm her songs when she sings come across even when it's a plea of like oh by myself so by myself I'm gonna make it like she turns that into a statement of strength and so her songs even the tender ones are you feel like this is someone in control and the documentary shows someone who is not in control every time something like this happens and it makes you feel so embarrassed and so like you don't like to not have control of yourself and the film ends on this kind of question mark like can she still sing we we don't know it feels unresolved I would say having watched it that the assumption was that she may not ever be able to perform again it was it was pretty bleak which makes what happened next even more insane okay tell us what happened next flash forward one month a mere month after the release of the documentary July 2024 the opening ceremony of the Paris Olympics and there's this wild rumor that Celine as landed in Paris she has arrived why would she be there perhaps she will perform how where nobody knows why do I have goosebumps when I know what's gonna happen keep going we're also invested in life and so we're watching and I was actually part of the New York Times team covering the opening ceremony and we don't know what's gonna happen and it's pouring rain was so miserable and then the opening ceremony builds up to this moment of pure glory where it ends with the effort hour and who's on the air for tower Celine Dion I think I might have screened and she does a song that's everybody in France knows I'm not more identified with edit pf this was obviously a huge huge moment but it was just one song right we don't know yet whether she's back to form right and then nothing really happens until March of this year when she announces a string of shows in Paris that is not just one show that several shows in a huge it's the largest indoors arena in Europe and it's a real show it's not one song so what's your reaction I've got to be there well I want to hear all about that night your response the fans response and most importantly Celine's performance we'll be right back so Elizabeth you traveled to Paris to have this full circle moment with Celine this is last month you had tickets this is the very first concert of this week's long run of shows that she's doing take me to that night of the show what was it like to be there let me live vicariously well before we get there we have to talk about the buildup to that night and the reason why we were in France France is the country where she became a superstar you might argue it was in the US but France is really where she connected deeply very deeply and emotionally with a really big audience she has a huge repertoire of French albums and in fact her 1995 up French album do remains to this day the biggest selling French language album of all time oh well the point is she has this huge huge kind of parallel stardom in France that helps create this incredible buzz it sounds like yes there's posters everywhere I went to the Celine pop-up shop at the Galerie de Fayette wow okay there is selling the Celine macarons assortments and that's a real thing it's a real thing yes they put her face on them or no it's a bit no oh please Natalie it's it's classier than that okay I'm American I'm not French no the kind of star pastry chef Pierre me did a Celine collection so apparently she picked her favorite flavors and there was some really there was some classics you know like caramel passion fruit combo interesting and then there was one with like combo water and like anyway there was some really interesting choices in there okay if this was in Vegas we would have put her face on donuts I'm just saying and they would have thrown off the shelves it sounds like it was no it was actually a classy classy box okay and 38 euros by the way wow for eight like yeah it's not a cheap macarons so she's everywhere the city the city has organized a public karaoke battle that was really hilarious so she's everywhere like the coverage is so intense there's actually on French public radio there's a daily debate at noon it's called a noon debate and one day the question was is Celine Dion the greatest singer of all time or not and they had a pro and a con wow I feel like the pro was better but I would be biased just to give you an idea of the expectations okay so incredible buzz leading up to this thing it's finally the night of the show what was it like to be there I went to the arena with my brother so we're we're pretty much very excited as we walk into the arena and then we have to wait for almost an hour and of course my mind is racing to some backstage drama where she's collapsed I mean I'm having flashbacks to the documentary we don't know what's happening I would have thought the same thing it could be jitters it could be some kind of intervention I we don't know but she's very late do you think other people felt that way too we're worried in that way I don't know that anybody could have seen that documentary and not think that like it must have been in the back of everybody's mind right and finally the lights go down and she walks out and of course the crowd erupts and there's this moment which is just kind of soaks up the the applause and the love that's like emanating from the arena and then we hear the intro to the song called on the Chanshpa which means we do not change it's I think it's just a fantastic song and it's a very very emotional song because it really is one that is drawn very directly from her life and she has to stop singing she's crying I'm tearing up just talking about this it's great she's literally stopped singing because she's she's crying yeah she's just she has to pause and she's just like really reclempt and everybody's kind of like roaring and applauding and trying to like will her to continue. And frankly, I had that little pit of anxiety almost the entire time. Even when I was like, okay, we're home free. We've done it. She's good. I still couldn't help myself thinking, oh my god, what's next. So how long did she end up singing for and just describe what that was like? Well, the set was really masterfully built because it started very slow with slower songs, but that are not belty songs. You could tell us who her voice was warming up. She looked a little tense at first and yes, nervous. I had not seen her look nervous possibly ever. Then she started doing faster stuff. I feel loved by Donna Summer, which merged into I'm Alive, which was a great, great segue. She did another huge French hit which is a duet with one of her backup singers. A song that is a perennial at French weddings. And towards the end, my brother said it looks like she has de-aged. He said, look at her face. She looks 20 years younger than when she started the show and he was right. Her face had completely relaxed, the lines of tension and disappearing. It was wild. She has been completely rejuvenated by this. She had regained her confidence. Can I just ask how this is possible, how Celine managed to do this? Most of us left her in this documentary at a point where she was really struggling. So how did she get to this point? We're now she's singing for hours on end. She has said in an interview that basically it was a mix of therapies, vocal therapy, physical therapy. She's mentioned immunotherapy and also regular Pilates, ballet classes. So it's a mix of working on the voice, working on her body, working on her movement. Physical therapy, I think, is really important. And we could see that in the documentary. She worked very closely with her physical therapist. And I think it was being able to take the time off and work on herself in a house that's clearly as being probably modified and has the space for her to do what she needs to do. I really don't think she would have committed to not just one, but a string of shows. And then there's more in the spring where she'd not convinced 100% sure that she could pull it off. What was the quality of her voice? What's your assessment of that? To be clear, her voice has changed. This is not the pristine crystal clear. Clarion, loud voice of the 90s. And that's two things. One is natural aging. Voice changes with age. That's just going to happen. And then you have the effect of the illness. And I think we all are aware that no, she's not going to sing like this Celine from 1995. But I'm not sure that she's quite ready to fully embrace that yet. I think when she starts dropping all by myself or my heart will go on from her set list, I think that's when she will embrace the new voice. This is completely like guesswork on my part there. But I think that is where she needs to go if she wants to have a career. The career that she can have. So at the show that I saw, I think she clearly pulled it off. And to be clear, it's a mix of vocals and also this dramatic presence. She still has it. She still has it. Yes. So being a stage animal is it's a very unfair situation. You have it or you don't. So how did the show end? Listen, it's all a blur, frankly. It was such a blur. There was this sense of like, oh my god, like, we did it. I made a promise. I made a promise to come back and to be back on stage. So here I am singing for you and singing for me, singing life. And I mean, we, we did it. There was this sense of like, we carried her through this. She did it thanks to us. Like, I'm totally petting our collective back there. But no, but I think it's a testament to her deep kind of ingrained sense of connection to all of these people that everybody felt that way. Yeah. No, it's absolutely true. So we left the arena and we headed back to the subway and it was really packed with people. And there was this spontaneous sing-along to one of her biggest French hits with that the crowd just sang along as it walked to the subway. And when that song was over, they just did it again over and over. And this was obviously the first of many shows. This is now been going on for weeks and weeks. And the fan reaction to her has been maybe the biggest story in all of this next to the comeback, right? There have been just video after video not just of the fans adoring her but of Celine engaging with her fans in Paris. It was really wow because of course, everybody knew what hotel she was staying at. So the people were outside, greeting her and she would spend 30 minutes to an hour sometimes talking to people, dancing on top of cars, singing along with them. No, it's been amazing because you can sense the joy in it on both sides. I think for a lot of her fans, the feeling is, it's not just that Celine is back, we're all back with her. Well, she provides a very stable presence. We often feel unmoored, we're unmoored by technology, we're unmoored by events beyond our control. And she has injured incredible hardship, something that really kind of attacked her very being. And she has come back. And there is the sense that she has really not changed that much underneath the couture outfits. Thank you so very much for your support, your patience. Celine Dion is still Celine Dion. Celine Dion would always be Celine Dion. I am everything I am because you loved me. Well, Elizabeth, thank you so much for bringing your energy and hers to the show. Thanks for indulging me and letting me talk about Celine. Anytime. Today's episode was produced by Lissa Dudley with help from Tina Antillini. It was edited by Wendy Dorr, engineered by Rowan Nemistow. And it contains music by Diane Wong, Dan Powell, Rowan Nemistow, and Marion Luzano. We had production assistance from Dahlia Hadad. That's it for the Sunday Daily. I'm Natalie Kittrowett. See you tomorrow.