Can England afford to lose to Australia?

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Check out the 2026 Toyota RAV4 at your local Toyota dealer or visit Toyota.com. See packages and options at Toyota.com for feature availability. Five lives rugby union weekly. Chris, action question to you. Last week you declared on the pod, Melissa, your wife was having 25 kids and parents over for Halloween, and knowing you as I know you, I'd imagine some kind of calamity happened. I don't know if this is extreme or not, but I unscrewed all the handles for the rooms that for the room I didn't want them to go in. What? These little access. Is that weird? Is that weird? No, that's very smart, because those kids with chocolate apps, they're amazing to get in through to stuff. What is weird is you not having the ability to question us to whether that's not a dream or not? Unscrewed. I was up at 7 a.m on drilling doors, bundles off. But it worked. It worked. It survived. Everything was intact just about apart from the cleanup operation. It was the adult's more worse for word than the kids, to be honest. But all in all, it was an overall success. No, it was all right. So that's enough of the Halloween chart. We've got a big old week, that's for sure, because the nation's championship kicks off on Friday night to review in what was another blockbuster weekend in the Gallagher Prem Toolkin Sean Edwards in the company Danny Care, Chris Ashton, myself Hugo Monier on Rugby Union Weekly. Right, Lads, who's in your nation's championship final? Who are you putting in there? Seems a bit weird. It's a bit weird. I bet they've not sold many tickets because we've got Bang, Bang, Bang, Game, Final. So everybody's sat there going, "Are we going to get there or not?" But who are you putting in the final, Luke, South Africa? Well, I mean, the purpose of this is to find out the best in the North, first the best in the South, from the best in the South, is Africa and the best in the North for France. But will they get there? Yeah, France have lost the game because they lost to New Zealand away. Yeah, I think Ireland might get there. Well, they'll have to beat South Africa. That'd be fabulous. Mate, they could have them two weeks in a row, they're like, "Now you're right." They'll have to beat South Africa. England have lost the match because they lost against South Africa. Scotland have lost the match because they lost against South Africa. This has got his England blinkers on. He's going to England for the final, in England, no. England won't be in the final, but I think it's going to be South Korea and New Zealand versus France. If they win three games though, they're there. England. Yeah. Well, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. France wins the same though. Okay. France won't because France plays South Africa in Paris. And if we'll just go on on form last year, South Africa beat France in Paris down to 14 men for the majority of the game. So who's buying tickets here because everybody's waiting for the last weekend? Well, I think you're just going to buy a ticket for the weekend because it's Friday, Saturday, Sunday. And I would buy a ticket for a Sunday because you're going to see the two best teams of the world play ahead to head, well up for that. And then you're just taking a gamble on Friday, Saturday. But either way, either way, I think that finals weekend, shoot, it'll be amazing. Because you're going to, you're going to see all the best teams in one city at Allianz Stadium. I think, I think it's, I think it's going to be great. I just think kind of like you actually, I think we need to get there for people to see it to be like, oh yeah, that is actually amazing. We get to see all these countries in one spot. And everyone's playing against everyone or we get a winner and then it's, then it's on to the World Cup. These teams won't see each other then until the World Cup, which is, which is really cool. But growing stuff are going to have a problem there, Allianz Stadium. They're in nightmare normally, but three games in a row. You win the Prem and they want you off the pitch in ten minutes. Well, there's some massive games everywhere, boys. Scotland got New Zealand, Australia, Japan, England, Australia, Japan, and New Zealand. Ireland, Argentina, Fiji, and South Africa, and Wales played Japan, New Zealand, and Australia. So, some massive games, but which of the home nations are going to get the most wins? Start with you, Monye. Ireland, I've got Argentina, Fiji, South Africa. I can definitely see two wins there. She's laughing. England, I can see two wins. So, I think the smart money would be on England or Ireland. Wales, I've got Japan, New Zealand, Australia. I can't see two wins there. Ashley? Oh, and I'm just a bit gutted for Scotland because it was all ready for them to take New Zealand and New Zealand and just turned up, haven't they? Just completely different team again. So, it's going to be really, and it's normally, it's a good time to play them first. You're quite happy to get them first. It takes them a week to get going whenever they come to autumn. Although they don't get beat, it still takes you still for like, you've got a chance first week. And they've just been so good in the championship. You're like, "Oh, man." You never know, though. You never know. He's known the time for Scotland to finally get it done. No, no, it's no. No, I don't think it is, Ashley. Oh, I'm just being calm. There must be something they could do. I remember there's one Colt-Rubilee coach, mate. He painted the changing rooms pink once, like, an hour before the game. You know the fumes and stuff. Oh, yeah. There's got to be some that they can do at Murrayfield. Just do something that's quite extreme. But we'll get you a win. And then after his history, no one bothers. Yeah, man, sit here, you've just done that. And I'm not sure that's that philosophy going down that one. I'm on a boat, maybe putting some haggis, some rotten haggis in the corner of the room. Not what you're talking about. So do Scotland playing New Zealand fast? England got Australia this Sunday. Let's talk to the team. Okay, so the England squad has dropped. It's quite different from the training squad. Based on mainly because we've had injuries. So Spencer and Randall are in for Mitchell and MacParlan. Mitchell's having a scar on his hamstring. MacParlan could potentially be back for some of the games we don't know yet. So we're in C, Theo Dan replaces. Two Palotto and Seb Atkinson of favourable. So come in instead of a Jomo and Calorie. D.C., let's start on the Scramaths. Yeah, disappointed for Archie MacParlan. He he's been flying the last year or so with Northampton Saints. Probably would have made his debut in one of these four games. Maybe the Japan game. I think Jack van Portfleet or Alex Bitsch will start and bench the first game against Australia. But Alex Bitsch allow now this fourth hamstring injury of the year. It's not recurrence of a similar thing, but he's had both hamstrings injuries. Not sure if he'll make any of the games of the next four weeks. So really disappointed for him because for me, he is still England's number nine. I still think he plays at a tempo that England need to be allowed to unlock the dangerous players out wide. You have to play quick. You can't slow it down. Forze a problem, isn't it? Forze a problem, same place. Forze a big problem, man. Yeah, it is. So hopefully it's nothing too serious. He needs to, I'm doesn't he, but he's just one thing he's not got. No, but JVP will start versus Australia. Yeah, Mitchell won't be fit. He knew straight away, watched it, his reaction, held it straight away, came off and then filled thousand. As you can understand, you know, he considers all these plays to be his children. to be low step. i fod i'n gweithio. Mae'r i'n gweithio'r i'n gweithio i fod i'n gweithio. Mae'n gweithio i'n gweithio i'n gweithio i'n gweithio i'n gweithio i'n "Alex Noses Boddi" but he was obviously just tred in with severe caution. He wants to do what's best for Alex Mitchell. Of course he'd love him to not be injured and be playing this weekend and I'm almost certain he would have been, but now you've really, really, really got to take your time. You've got our first answer. The first thing is, how severe is the hamstring injury? The second thing is, are there any underlying issues as to why this keeps recurring, because you've got to knit that in a bud, because that's just taken away his game time, which is gutting. And I'm also gutted for Archimic Parlin. This is the second time the week of an international where you're almost certain he would have been capped. He's been taken away from him. He got injured in the preem final, almost certainly had gone to South Africa, and it's happened again. It's not been a good week for injuries for Northampton, losing two nines and a ten who almost certainly would have all been involved in England this week. And Tuppelotto, contact injury and training? Yeah, sounding like it was a fairly intense couple of days. And yeah, contact injury for Tuppelotto, which is going for him, because again, the huckers have been set up, and they, Jamie George, Luke Houndicchi, Theo Down, but Tuppelotto's worked his way ahead of Theo Down, or at least for Steve to have a look at him. And then he'll be devastated to get an injury like that. And Theo Down comes back in, which is great for Theo, but you're disappointed for a young English hucker that was trying to break that mold of those three being set. And he adds something a bit different than he. He is more of a, you wouldn't say he's set piece specialist. He is more of a on-field sort of day in colds type player, giving the ball, getting running at people, we can do something a little bit different to Luke and to Jamie. So desperately disappointed for him, and disappointing to hear two injuries in training. You know, these lads have been flying all year for their clubs, get injured the week of potentially first cap for both of them. So wish them all the best that they were covering. Sorry, just on Tuppelotto, I think they've been going full noise because Steve is really, and he's actually come out and said it, it's concerned about the breakdown. I don't think Steve thinks the Gallagher Prem is a good enough playground to get the guys ready for the contact area international level. So he's had him for a couple of days, and yeah, they've obviously put in a bit of hard graft, but at the expense of losing some players. So the concert area comes Sunday, I think it's going to be huge. Yeah, how big is this weekend then for Steve and this England side? Lads, because Australia, Battle Harden, been playing a lot of rugby coming over to England. Probably at the best time they could come, do you think, to playing in the first game? England obviously haven't played together for a few months. I think England should definitely still be Australia at home without a shadow of a doubt. But how confident. How confident of a doubt. I think they should. I'm just saying, how confident are you that England will start with a win? I'm confident because they're at home. I'm confident because I think we're a nation filled with quality players. My nervousness is around the emotion of the game actually. Because playing in simple, England cannot afford to lose on Sunday. They just can't. Because you'll then stare down the barrel at Japan, who they'll beat. And then the all blocks. So I can't underestimate how big Sunday is. And I get it. For Steve, he'll be saying the exact opposite. It's just another game. We're primed. We're ready. Try and take away and dispel all the pressure from his players. But I don't know. Lads. I just think there's a bit happened in the squad and in the premb. That has just changed the outlay of the team, England's team. I don't know. I think I feel like it's quiet. If he makes the right selections, it could be quite positive. What's the right selection actually? Picking the lads that are playing well. And that would be in that team. I'd put Marcus at Flyer for I know. 100%. And I'd put Furbank at 15. Do you think he will though, Ashley? Well, if we were having this conversation, two weeks before Marcus got back, and before George Furbank and Marcus Mf30 playing together, and Quinn's got two wins, and the team was. I don't want to say a chance for him, but drastically drastically different from what they were. I just feel like that momentum has completely changed. And what's happening at the sale with George? Don't particularly think it's down to him. But he's in a team that isn't going forward and the not, the attack isn't firing. Surely it has to be Marcus. If there was ever a time to pick Marcus, he's got a pick Marcus. Ashley had a pick in. Yeah, it's been not fit. I think he's in the squad as he's been dating the squad today. I don't know whether he's fit or not. I think depending. I absolutely don't turn a row in that quick. No. If Finsmith is fit and fully fit, then I think obviously he keeps his place as fly-off. But I think if he's not fit, to then not pick Marcus, who's had three brilliant games in a row, is on form that relationship with Furbank. You could see. I know it's only been a couple of weeks with Quinn's, but I think that is the relationship people want to see. That was the Finsmith, George Furbank relationship, for Saints the last few years, which is so good, having that extra ball player out wide. And I think, from the sounds of things, George Furbank is loving working with Marcus Smith day in day out. I would pick him. My worry is if that coach in setup, if they're under pressure and feel like they need a win, are they more likely to go to someone like a George Ford who they can absolutely trust and has done it there and has been there, done it, got the t-shirt, hundred and eight, however many times. But I would love to see Steve be brave and pick Marcus Smith. I'd like to see Will Joseph get picked. I would. I think he's. That one's a bit risky right now, that one is. It's risky, Ashie, but unnecessarily risky, I think. Speed in the centres. Yeah, speed is a 13. I don't think you could beat it. And that kid is on. Absolutely on fire for his club. The relationship, as you. I think you said it last week on the pod, Ashie. There's already a relationship between that concern and Will Joseph. I would be tempted to go. If you're going to go, Marcus Smith at 10, you also feed speed with him and you throw someone like Will Joseph and you get that sort of exuberance that Will Joe will give that team. So I'd be quite bold this weekend, if I was a coach in that team. See, he's interesting, because. Often a coach has philosophies. If you can't train all week with the team, you're not going to be involved with the weekend. I don't know if Fin Smith is. being trained in and leading the team all week. So if he's not going to be fit in invertechomas till like Thursday, Friday, then. I think Marcus has to start. And I agree with you, DC. I just don't know. And I almost want to get away from the language of. picking players on form, being bold. Just picking them because they're on form. Marcus is flying. That should not be considered like a bold selection. And we know Steve as a person that loves combinations tried and trusted. Well, and we know England always slow starters in international rugby, whether that be nation championship or six nations or slow starters. But what they do have is the gift of combinations, in sync, in form. Plug and play them. It's like Tetris. Smith, Ferbank, Bang. There you are. Combination fixed and sorted. Will Joseph and Seb Atkinson. They've just played the last five matches together. I know he played on the wing at the weekend, but they know each other. I can activity. He has played a lot on the wing, but he's also really good at centre as well. So I'd love those selections. Am I expecting to see those four selections all made? Probably not. But I think they're all deserving of a selection. I think Finn back to being back as well as a big, just a big boost. You don't have to put so many minutes on. I'll try and hope that Genji would go because I thought Genji did really well after the bench and played that role at the end of the game, finish flying off the game. Finn backs to me and backs big as well. It just looked better. Couried back fit. Chesms flying, Martin. It's all just Mara's back playing well. It just feels a bit better. It feels a bit more positive than where we were three weeks ago. I think the lads come in too a little bit. Yeah, Finn Smith's disappointing. Hopefully we fit further down the track. But I think we should be going to beat Australia at home. I think Finn backs to Will Stewart as she's massive. Having them too back. We don't then have to rely on a start in front row and then maybe a bit of a drop off coming off. There isn't a drop off. And in certain games last year, on the in before Finn Baxter was picked ahead of Ellis Gens for what Finn can do potentially scrum time. So I think those two are massive. That's why I'm hoping that England go bold. I'm hoping that they go brave because my worry, and as going back to your point, who's do they have to win? If England don't pick those form players and they go for, if they went for a George Ford at 10 and they went for Henry Slade at 13 or they went for a Tommy Freeman at 13, playing him out of position again, and they don't win, then I think they're going to be in for an all mighty amount of stick. Whereas I think an England fan, well I am an England fan. I prefer to see England go pick their players that are playing well, as you've said, oaks, and go out swinging the bat. And if they go out swinging the bat and they don't, it doesn't work, then it isn't a train wreck for me. But I think if they go and slow the game down and trying to use tactical kicking as their main thing, and it's slow and it's dodgy and it's bit boring, and then they lose, I think they're going to be in for all sorts of criticism from everywhere. Listen to this statin on Marcus, in his last 15 caps, he's played more Scrum Aft than he has fly off. Yeah, I saw that earlier. He's good at Scrum Aft, man. He's good, yeah. God, he's lost. Lads, if put you in the coach's room, how do you frame this autumn with everything we've said? And I think it's, if we can frame this in the right way, I think it will maybe narrow our focus in terms of selection and everything else. So what's the expectation from the coaches? What do you think this England team, this England coaching group, want to get out of this autumn? I don't, I don't think they, obviously they're having those conversations, but I genuinely think right now they are a game to game. They cannot, because of what's on it and what the pressure that they've been under, they are mad. They, the amount of stuff that's gone on here, worst thing is, worst six nations history, then a review, then we've gone into the summer. It was all over when the Lads pulled the game out in Argentina that win. We'll back to it again here. We don't know what was going on happening in the Australia, really do it. We just, we just don't really know. Those coaches are not thinking, obviously I've been in the conversations, but they've got to be going, we just need to be Australia and we just need to be Japan. There's no, there is no more. Of course, but we're 10 months away from World Cup. We can't be applauding game to game. Just go, oh, let's just win this one. There needs to be a helicopter view in terms of whether it's minutes into this, if it's trying to develop the strength and depth on the bench, if it's tactical awareness, if it's just to absolutely now down by 9 and 10, there has to be some non-negotiables up on the coaching, coaching staff's rooms. This is what we're shooting for. So do you think if they're loose to Australia, New Zealand, Steve, will still be there? These? No, well, let's park, let's park New Zealand. New Zealand. That's why I said Australia, aren't New Zealand? Well, I think people can forgive England to lose an against New Zealand, but lose this weekend. I think that's all they've voted about. I think they did. It should be, but we know most coaches, most coaches, most groups, most sporting institutions are spinning two plates. Wanting to win today was also trying to develop something further down the track and the best coaches are able to spin both of those plates. I totally understand that. What point does pressure take over that? Ask Michael Carr right now. Is he looking at next year's squad? No, he's not looking. He hasn't been looking past this weekend, is he? See, I, I think like I, I look at that squad in Australia and I generally think England can go four from four. These next four games I do. I generally think, I generally think there's enough mobility in there and there's enough quality and it's been showed the last four or five rounds of the preem and you know, the round in Europe wasn't amazing for all the clubs, but I look at the squad, I think it's, it's boosted by a couple of big front rowers being back. Like I said, I've been fed back so we'll stew it. Your point on will they work out the nine and send? That's going to be hard when two of your top three aren't, nine's aren't going to be there for probably the first two, maybe even the whole, the whole thing. But I still look at that squad and I think some international coaches would give their left arm for that squad and there are players on banging form and I, I would, what I would like to see is a Lee blackie imprint in this England squad of the next four weeks. I'd love to see a proper attack and some proper endeavor and I'd like to see a game plan, which unlocks our dangerous outside backs, which for me is our point of difference, is our X factor. I want to see Manifeta were both. So on the ball, 10 or 15 times a game once he told me Freeman on the wing on the ball, 10 or 15 times a game. And I want to see some flow and some zip in our attack with the non-negotiables of test match rugby and the non-negotiables are playing for England of an absolute beast of a set piece, which can go through you, but then also have the ability to go round teams as well. I couldn't agree more about playing to the width. If I ask you to name your back three now, which I will, who's in the back three? Three, two, one. Money, Freeman, third bank. Okay, great. I could have asked that question six weeks ago. You just said the same. Can't say the same for the centres. Just can't. If not a clue. I could have asked you the start of the six nations who your centre parent is, we'd have all had different centres. The summer would have had different centres and we could also let a different centre partnership now. So you think 12 is pretty solid. 12 is pretty solid, yeah, instead, but we have absolute certainty about the quality, the calibre and the connection of that back three. So if we're so certain about it, we're so sure of the quality. Use it. Use it. In Argentina, who's the best player on the pitch? Money. Why? Got an early touch. Got him into the game. He was cheekhead. He looked like he was AI. Like it was a joke. Some of the stuff he was doing. Let's use them. Tommy Freeman's are British-lired. I reckon George Furback would have been a British-lion without breaking his arm again. We have sheer world-class quality there. Use it. Let's not, let's not disappoint the opposition. Let's not hide our some of our best weapons. Let's use it. Let's be expressive. And so, once again, I don't think it's bowled by putting wit from the ball. I just don't because our best players are most destructive players are out there. So let's fashion a game plan whereby they can get it. I've had a look at the forecast. It's nine degrees cloudy. Drives a bone. There's no excuse. That's what I want to say. I couldn't agree more to you, DC. That's why I think Marching probably will get the nod at 13. You know as well. Just been there before Steve kind of player. You trust him. Steve definitely trusts him. He trusts he's playing what most picked back in the World Cup three years ago under Steve. He probably hasn't found his form fully at sale, but I think that's indicative of sale as a, as a whole. I agree with you. I think you'll never, you'll never get let down by picking Joe March at 13. But I do think when someone like Will Joseph is on the form that he's in and the confidence level is so high. Why not? Why not just give him a go? It's the little bits that get me. You know, like just at that level, you can get caught out without having a couple of goals at it. Just small things that can get caught. And there's the thing that Marching's played with Marcus too. It's like this quite a bit of connection there, isn't there? Will it be on the, will it be 23, I think for me? Will Joseph? Yeah. If he's not starting, then I think he has to. But then if Steve goes 6-2 and he picks 40 at 10, then we can see that. Then Marcus is 23 and 9s on the 22. Sure, that's not necessarily a 6-2 against those. You'd hope not. The 13 selection, I think, is massive this weekend. For two reasons. One, because I think it's important that we bed in a certain partnership, but equally because of how Australia play. I've said this many a time. I think, therefore, it's some of the best ball-handed forwards in World rugby, the way in which they move the ball and use their decoy runners at the line and stretch the ball and spread the ball. And by the way, Australia got a pretty reasonable back three, I think Tom Wright. I think he's so intelligent, he's so electric. So 13's got a job to do to fill the field, get up and just continually put Australia under pressure because they're a team that plays from deep and loves to keep hold of the ball. So I think that's a massive selection. I mean, they're all going to be big selections, but 13, I think, are going to have to work really hard both sides of the ball. Five lives, rugby union weekly. So it all starts Friday night boys, Ireland. taken on Argentina and who's you spoke to an Argentinian coach didn't you because Sean Edwards was on your pod which was brilliant with Sarah make sure you check that out if you haven't already and he adds a few things to say about what happened with England Oogs do you want to summarize how that went down? Did you say he had a phone call with Steve Borthwick? I mean he was ready in the room wasn't he as a Red Rose coach I think he made an inquiry about the England men's and Steve was honest with him which Sean really appreciated and just said I'm happy with what I've got and that was that he became a free agent Sean in his classic way and I loved it actually and it just shows you how patriotic he is it's like if he'd offered me a assistant kit man I'd be ready for work this is a guy he's won over 50 major titles and honors assistant kit man ready to work he just wants to serve his country which is England that opportunity is not there for him yet but to keep him busy and to sharpen his tools he's drawing forces with Argentina I think it's a great appointment of course it is he'll certainly make them a better team I don't think it's a simple I know in his mind he just it sounds like he's desperate to get in there but if Sean let's say if Sean Edwards kit man he ain't just gonna do the kit is he I don't think it was a literal state but he just said well I'm taking it literally if you do anything to get in there when you've got that guy there he's not he's big personality he's going to be in everything wanting to do he's wanting to have an involvement and even if he doesn't realize he's trying his best as the area of it it's impossible for that for that to happen just because he's he's Sean Edwards so if he's in the room it said it will be a big change within the coaching group even if it said under his name kit man it really wouldn't be would it well Rassy was Cypherka's water boy for a season and he was on the roof with lights and cones and signaling everywhere it's wicked for Argentina like I kind of think one man I mean if you can somehow get Argentinians more passionate which I don't think's possible but if anyone could do it Sean Edwards probably could but we said it a few weeks ago didn't he there isn't a job currently with England there just isn't I mean there's four coaches in that England squad currently that are involved in defense or have been doing defense in the past couple of years and I think it isn't I mean it isn't the way life works either like I'm pretty sure Sean doesn't want to go asking for jobs Sean would want people to want him to go and get him to give him a job do you know what I mean so it's obviously not the right time it's not the right time for him to be around the England men's squad he obviously enjoyed his experience with the red roses and was I just hear the stories how much the girls absolutely love working with him and how much he loved working with them but we all know rugby is a very funny place and at the end of World Cup slot of things happen there'll be a lot of turnover in coaches and changes and he's only signed to the end of the World Cup with Argentina so then you never know where's where's going to be next but I think everybody just everyone loves Sean everyone wants Sean to be happy and be somewhere where he's wanted or where he's loved and I think the Argentinians are going to love him. Glad to open a weekend as DC's already said it all kicks off Ireland against Argentina we don't really do this all that often but should we do predictions for the opening weekend is this because you are feeling quite confident no no no no no no no how are your how are your ugos predictions going down at the moment okay do you know what I'm glad you're asked one because I didn't realise how annoyed people get if you say their team's going to lose what you have to pick someone like one team wins one team loses that's it less the tigers fans on my case they think I've seen a few comments people like you can tell he hates less there by every time he commentates on this true though it is true what this you always say it's not exactly I've come yeah exactly I am but I've commented on less than once in 18 months that's because this is this is karma because for as long as I've known you and listened to you on this portal then joined you you when it comes to predictions you go you go a bit quieter and you allow the allow others to speak which is a brilliant thing to have so then now it's just great because I've done some predictions and I've got absolutely hammered but the problem is people can't understand it's all hypothetical and it's a lot of it is an educated guess of course you don't know the answer but it's just great to see you get in the heat for us well Bristol had only lost one game I asked in game all of last season so fun enough I backed the home team to win and yeah like less there's less there's tigers fans were heads were falling off their shoulders but that's fine right island Argentina who's winning do we just go one two three and shout it out because we don't want a copy island Argentina three two one island saturday at 1140 italy is Africa before you say this have you seen italy's injury list oh my gosh online earlier wow there's a good what 12 or 13 top team I think this is 16 top players not available and tell us who their first game is against please you go so I forgot the double world champions and they've been on my team on this out I've got I've not seen it yeah yeah read it out I should just right it is villain set Aaron set Creel d'Alande hooker vineberg gommazulu gommazulu van deburg yeah yeah is he very good player v sir de toit kaleesi nor oh my gosh marcher modder more at more at must start no salamann more at good player de toit marks nish nish oh no oxencha oxencha oh my god nish nish nish nish nish nish nish nish nish nish nish oh my god that has got to stay let me keep going on the replacements here nish wessel wessel wessels wessels yeah nice that right steam camp low to yaga han hanicom hanicom you just you're just saying it though I know I know I know as she has brilliant the villia's grant loboc oh bad of I just read they much enough I was on doing that game like that nip mollons would be living with you right now yeah I mean wow that is a full noise could love the best team they could pick I think we're all with there's no point counting down I think some Africa okay scholar New Zealand 210 three two one New Zealand they'll be very close though I caveat it'd be very close to that what for the first 13 no I think I genuinely think it'd be close again they're going to run and close but I just think New Zealand paper again just don't want to worry New Zealand I've got some intrigues haven't they they do they do the survey is not there he's not there he busts the shoulder yeah so it might not be as clear cut as what we are suggesting here all available for New Zealand here we go go you ready surveyor Caleb Clark Lomax frisell Jacobson Rubenlove Carter Norris Proctor Parker there's a few there's quite a few yeah there's a few like they'd all be start Rubenlove be starting Caleb Clark be more or less starting to very be starting that's one to be okay four six seven eight nine ten that's eleven players not available for New Zealand it's it's a chunk that is hefty but I think they'll still have enough I mean they'll choose between Bowden Barrett or Richard Mawonga at ten I think that'd be okay where was Japan count then three two one Wales Wales the score line might be bigger than the attendance right I hope it said the tickets are flying off the shelves for that game okay there's a lot of available tickets hopefully there's a late flurry France Fiji 810 on Saturday today. Three, two, one, France. So we agreed on every single one. Oh, yeah, we are, haven't we? Sunday, the eighth of November, kickoff, three, ten, at the Alliant Stadium, England for Australia. Oogs is pausing and he's scratching his beard, which makes me feel like he might do something bold here. He won't do it. He won't do it. Yeah, got the margins. Yeah, they won't do it. Three, two, one, England. England. Oogs, why, why do that? Why, why did you wait? Because are you a bit nervous? You are nervous, I can tell. Very nervous. Genuinely, I'm very, very, very nervous. I'm nervous for two different reasons. I think people who casually follow rugby will see that Australia have been battered twice by New Zealand, like really recently, but that's not the yardstick to measure Australia against. I think New Zealand are quite clearly and comfortably way more in sync and just a better outfit. I still think this Australian team's very, very, very, very dangerous. So I'm nervous for two reasons, one because I think Australia are very good side. I mean, currently Bill is back in the Australia squad quite clearly. For me, at his best, he was the best utility player on the planet. He was unbelievable as a 15. We watched him in the Prem, whether it be at 12. He played everywhere. He plays everywhere. He's a great squad player, but when Ben Donoughton is, you're starting number 10. I think that says a lot about the development of Flaharves in Australia. This isn't just a new thing. I think this has been going on since Stephen Larkham. Any decent ball player must just go to a league and be a standoff scum after Christmas. They just lose the malt at that sport, early doors. Yeah. It's got to be the answer because they've just not been able to get any lads through in that position. They've got some freaky shaft leads and they've not really had. You've got a scum after as well. They're probably just all halfbacks, probably just comparably if they're half decent. I know we've already spoke about this. Just one more point I've just thought of, just on Marcus. He's just a surprise, isn't he? Where you can plan for 40. You can train and you can know what he's going to do. He's going to move the game or move the team around and kick him in the right places, pass and hit forwards. You can't really train for Marcus. You can't plan for it. I just think he's at the age and he's got the experience and just give him the shirt. I'm letting play. I just think he's different wife and Smith's not there. I think Marcus has got to be the answer here just because he keeps the opposition. They're not going to know what to expect within. They're not going to know how to handle it. But he's more than just that. His goal kicking, his goal kicking at international level, by the way, is exceptional. His world class and his game management again at the weekend. I thought it was class and we're focused on Marcus, but I also word for Quinn's. Quinn's backing up a Saracens win with a win on the road and let's cast the mind back to this time last year where they got nailed down at Sandi Park. 36 nil. So it was so important for them to finish off this block on the right for building momentum. Real, feel good factor than they can focus on Prem Rodriguez. It's been heaven and hell, hasn't it for Harlequin? They started off season so poorly with some of the worst performances to then back up three or four matches now in a row where they are slowly, not even slowly, they're rapidly building a really aesthetically pleasing game plan, but also get in the right results as well. Yeah, I was with them backster earlier and he was saying the messaging hasn't changed. The message hasn't changed for the first couple of weeks to now. And I said to him, he didn't obviously say it. I said, you know, the difference is when you put yourself as in feedbacks to Marcus Smith on two Germany workouts players, just the confidence that they give to the players around them. And Finn was so complimentary about George Furbank's impact in the last four or five weeks of how much control, how much confidence he's given players around him and in adversity as well and times where it's not going quite well. He said he's just been brilliant at stepping in and just telling the lads everything's going to be all right. And they're going to be fine. Let's just focus on what we could do. And that combination we mentioned earlier between Smith and Furbank, I think is huge. Like I don't think you'll get a better 10-15 combination in the Premier. And if Quinn's can keep putting the ball in front of those two boys, then I agree with you lads why Marcus, I think, will play a fair bit over these next four games of the Nations Championship. Are we speaking to Finn? When I speak to Finn, I couldn't feel any more northern. Yeah, you do feel, you do feel very different in his company, don't you? But he is the nicest posh lad I've ever met in my life. But he doesn't, his poshness doesn't rub off on me. It just makes me feel more northern. It makes me feel the opposite way. Yeah, agreed. So from down near the bottom of the table to right at the top, Leicester Tigers absolutely flying four wins out of five. And all a teammate of all of ours, Jeff Parlin back in the day, absolutely chuffed for him. And probably this surprise package, along with obviously Gloucester, but I don't think anyone would have had Leicester bang top of the table after five rounds. Lads and playing some great stuff. They've had some injuries as well, but having Oli Chesa back, how big was he? I think the job that Jeff Parlin is doing is extraordinary. Barely had a hooker at the start of the season. He only had Oli Chesa for a couple of matches. He lost Tommy Reffel in a league where everyone just score in loads of tries and his thin kind of there who's not a seven, but he's operated as a seven. And the best thing about it is I think, I don't know what you think actually, I think they could get loads better in terms of just their play. I think they showed unbelievable fight, great grit, spirit, they're tough, they're a tough nut to crack, but I still think they're doing it by not playing like the best rugby. So when they get going, like, when they properly get going, I think they are going to be such a danger and threat to everyone in the league. Lest have got this ability, it might be the history of the club and it might be the fun base because it's biggest in the league. But if you've just got this ability to take players in, make them feel like really loved quickly. And you'd think the players have been there for decades, some of them, you mix that in with lads that are proper, lester diehards that have been there, watched as a six year old kid and know they're playing for lester. I just think they get the combination right and they have this ability to just accept players and then they become one of their own, like Radwan. Radwan's from Newcastle was at Newcastle, but he just, I don't know, since it's gone to lester, he just, he's properly part of lester. And it's struggled to find, like Vanda Flea, the prop, he's probably going to be there for the next year, ten years, he's probably going to be there for the next ten years in a lester. One of like, it could be a great player. So I just think they have this, Ray Wainwrights already fly in the Tuckum Inn and he's playing well. They just have this, I don't know what it is about the club, there's something unique about that club, but they have this ability to just accept, rugby players in as one of their own quickly and they'll have to get on with it and they just work out for each other. Yeah, but word on Freddy Stewart, I think he's having the best season he's had for a few years. He's just unlucky and he's read. He's so unlucky, because you can tell that whatever he's been told to do, I think it's fairly obvious, they're wanting to be more of a ball player and a threat to the ball and more attacking and he's so solid, we know he's got great booze, unbelievable, the high ball, but I've done a few lester games this season, but watching him, he looks so lively in the Northampton game in the East Midlands Darby, I loved his attitude, like we interviewed him afterwards and it was like, I loved that it was wet, I loved that it was raining, I loved that it was gritty and any coach listened to him think, should be thinking, oh, what in my team? I think he's having a great season, but he is currently blocked at 15 by George Fairbank and I think George would be the first choice. And I reckon the next couple of years, the next guy coming through is going to be James Pater. I think his brilliant exceptional talent could be starting for England by the next World Cup. If I was advising Freddy and we had this chat, didn't we? I think on Saturday, I think Freddy Stewart could be a world class number 12. I look at his like physical profile and it's no different to Jordy Barrett, big, ranger, tall, lad. Freddy's got decent amount of ball plane ability within him. He's obviously got a monster kicking game as well. He's tough and he sticks it about I would be honing my craft and my skill base and go in. Do you know what I could make myself good enough to become undropable at number 12? I could see it. I mentioned it to DC on Saturday. As you were hearing it for the first time, thoughts. No chance. Only because I don't know this for a fact but I strongly think if you don't do that stuff from being a kid, there's no chance. It would take too long to be able to a new's going to spend the time and where you're going to be able to get the practice and you're not going to do it in training really because the kids are the other lads are the waiting. There's just not the ability to get in that time under his belt to try it unfortunately. And if he's not got it, the boat and the Barrett of this world have all done that from being kids. Not saying it couldn't happen, but it's obviously a jet magic jet conversation with Jeff be like, mate, I thought on a plate 12. You're really good at 15, mate, and I've got a load of 12's there. Remember Denny did it? Solomon did it. Eddie Jones text him like he did just firing out messages. Anyway, you got to play fallback mate to him. That's all he put in this message. So Eddie, Denny comes flying in and he's like Adam and he's got to train up fallback and he's got to do finger fallback of a like Denny. Hang on, mate. We don't know, it's a good idea and it's what we can try and get in there sometimes, but probably can't do it this week, whatever, but you just try, you want it to get it done, but you didn't have the ability to put the time into it. It's tough. I totally respect the fact there's not enough time. I just think Freddy has the raw materials to potentially be that, but you're right. Yeah, he's not going to say, we've actually got Orlando Bailey and Will Wond and Solomon Cata that all mixed between 12 and 13. You're fine. We don't have another, I mean, he's got 15's, but he is the outstanding 15. I just selfishly. You know, in the say way Tom Young's went, I don't think I'm going to make it. That one's crazy. That is crazy. I'm going to go play in the front row and then he just went on and did it. So just for like pure selfishness and like longevity and where you've got your best chance of earning caps, whenever we pick a prem team of the season, the hardest position to always select is at 12, always. Never, never just stand up. At 9's and 10's, they just pick themselves. Wingers, you just opt for like who scored the most tries and 15's at 12's. I don't think people want to play 12. They don't get the ball. They're not having enough involvement. A lot of them until first team in games. I feel like they're always getting missed past or running the line that nobody wants to run. So when they're kids, the best kids want to be in the position where they're getting the ball all the time. And I think that's what 12 goes lost. I've got a theory on centres and I think when you look at the best teams in the world, the ball players and the access they try and find is 10 and 15. The best team in the world in Africa, Feinberg in Angola, Zulu this weekend in Damon, Villamsa, France, it's Ramos and Jalabair, like or Intermack and Jalabair. At New Zealand, it's Ruben Lave and Damon McKenzie or Barra and a Barra. That's what we go. We go 10 and 15 at Scotland, it's Thin Russell and Kinghorn. At England, it's Finsmith and George Furbank. So that's where you get your quality. That's where you get your skill. That's where you get your play. So we just overlook centres. We overlook centres and they're not skilled, of course they're skilled enough, but they're not skilled to the level where I think the game used to be with them. They're just overlooked and I'm thinking we should put more into centres. It comes back to Samburgis, isn't it? 100%. Honestly, that's 2015. Samburgis. Honestly, have a look at all of the centres in our league, English qualified and look at their skill sets and there's some exceptionally talented players, but when you look at their skill set in terms that they can all kick run pass. How many can you name in this league, that can all kick run and pass? As a centre, which used to be the number one thing you had to do? Just 12. 12/13. Well, Slady can kick run and pass. Slady, 100%. Yeah, it's why Van Mrensburg was pushed quick to get into the squad and getting going, but he's obviously. He's just kick run and pass. How are we even hesitating to name centres that can kick run and pass? We've just named rattle off two. This England, one of the largest play pools on the planet. That's why the best two teams of the world, South Africa and you know, DLanday, Jordy Barrett, you go bang. That is their 12. It's been their 12 for five, last five, six, seven years. DLanday, what, over 100 caps now, him and Jesse Creole partnership, bang. Then you pick your team around them to the mean. But yeah, I still, I mean, that 12 shirt is still one of the most pivotal positions at the pitch, the spine of the team. And you've got to be as tough as a Batrower and make as many carries, make as many tackles as a Batrower does, but also have the skill and the dexterity to be able to unlock a backlight. Like it's an incredibly tough skill. That's why I would challenge the youth pathway where you've got all these Batrowers, you've got hundreds of sixes and eights, sevens, mate, one of them, amazing 12. I wish someone had got older Ben L, 10 years ago and God, right, you're going to be a 12 or guy pepper, someone like that, some of that profile, get him out of the forwards, get him in the backs. So what Jordy Barrett is the best 12 on the planet, I think, and learning it has not far behind him. But hey, let's see how it goes. Massive weekend of rugby chance, where you're going to be, you're all at Twickenham. I'll be at Allen Stadium, mate. Yeah, I'll Potter on Dome, why not? Nothing else to do on Sunday. To save me chasing Wade, he ruined every weekend. Apparently, apparently he walked in, because I was at the game, he walked in to the stadium and went to the staff. Where's Ashley? To the receptionist, the woman was like, what is he going on about? But then I did come and say, I'm a name, I said, weirdly, one of the players had just asked for you. She didn't know what was going on. So yeah, I'm not chasing him around this weekend, but I saw him in the tunnel, had a good chat with him. He was pretty desperate to break it on the weekend, so he didn't. I've got a four weeks off of chasing him around. Ashley, are you over it? Are you completely over it now? Because I would be if I was you. You know, man, because I've got no option. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let him have it. As long as he likes knocks it quite far on, just don't please just go one ahead. That's going to annoy me. Don't just stay one ahead. If there's a one ahead, I am serious case for getting going again, surely to God. I could do a game and knock a couple over that without question. I could find the determination to knock a couple over. If he goes five, six, seven ahead, that's brilliant, amazing, but please don't just stay one ahead of me. That would not well annoy me. I would like him to score it and run straight off the pitch and retire. Like we said to you to do. Yes. Well, if he does stay on any retires, I'm not keen yet. I am running. I'm backing. Yeah. To be continued, cheers, Jens. Have a good way. Cheers. That's all. Thanks for downloading Rugby Union Weekly. For more info, head to the BBC Sounds app. It often starts with a question. What were lines doing in York in the third century? Why was Jeremy a lonely snail? Then we search for answers. It's one of the first times really that you consistently see someone painting teeth. I know that sounds bonkers. If I was going to define mathematics, I would say it's the study of structure. As I was doing the research for the programme, my jaw just dropped further and further down. In our time, it's a world-class seminar every week. Watch the discussions unfold and explore over a thousand conversations in our archive. I'm Misha Glenny and every week I'm joined by expert guests to explore the ideas that shape our world. In our time, listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts. Coffee? 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