Caller: “I’m Jealous of My Wife’s New Friend”

How do I handle my jealousy when my wife's friendship feels like it takes priority? This person doesn't have the same responsibilities that we do, they're single, they've got a great job and so their life is they have all the time in the world where we have very little. And something's not sitting right with me about this. What's going on? What's going on? This is John of the Dr. John Deloni Show. So grateful that you are here. Talking about your mental and emotional health, your marriage, your kids, whatever the next right challenge is in front of you and the next right thing you're going to do to begin unwinding and healing from some of these challenges and making your life a little bit more peaceful, making your family's life a little bit more peaceful, making your community a little bit brighter because it's wild, wild times out there these days. Thanks for joining us and this show is real people going through real challenges. If you want to be on this show, I would love to have you click the link in the show notes and it will send you directly to Kelly our overlords and she will work and get you on the show. Let's go out to Birmingham, Alabama and talk to Alan. Hey, Alan, what's up? Hey, man, how are you doing today? I'm all right, brother. What's going on? Doing good. So my question today was, how do I handle my jealousy when my wife's friendship feels like it takes priority? Tell me about her. Yeah, I'll give you a little bit of background. We have been together for 15 years and married for nine. I've been together a really long time and I will say that my wife is literally the best friend that I've ever had. So let's get that out of the way. I'm not talking about her at all, but we have three kids, six, four, and two. So as you can imagine, life is hectic. But through the through the years, it's been, I'll be honest with kids. Now we've just started that kind of drift where we're together all the time. Yeah. And I've been on cruise control and I'll be honest with that. And I haven't pursued her the way that I should and trying to, I want to marriage that, you know, my kids see and see it and be like, if it isn't that, then I don't want it. You know what I mean? Sure. So, but through the years, we've, you know, gotten into the hustle and bustle of taking kids, take care of kids and kind of let our relationships slip where at the end of the day, we're exhausted. We kind of just go and do our own thing. And so with that recently, my wife had a little bit of a health scare and we thought that there may be potential for brain surgery and leaned in on our church and had really good friends, but through that, she developed a really good friendship with somebody who kind of stepped in and talked with her and was with her through that whole process, with us through that whole process. And then through that, just created a really good friendship. And my kid, the door, this person and but through that time, there was opportunity for her to kind of escape and get out. And I wanted her to have that where you have somebody, something to do on your own. Get out of the house, go do something fun. And through that process, it just seems like that's kind of incrementally gotten more and more and more. And so, and on my side of it, when I watch her at home where it's hard and difficult and, you know, there's a bazillion things to do and manage and then I watch my wife that she goes out the door and I see a glimpse of the person that I fell in love with that I haven't seen in a while. What do you think your wife is like if she was on the phone telling me I've met a new friend and this person brings X, Y, or Z to her life. What would she say? I think freedom, so to speak. What does that mean? She doesn't have to plan anything when she's with this person. This person doesn't have the same responsibilities that we do. They're single, they've got a great job and so their life is they have all the time in the world where we have very little, if that makes sense. So it's that I can just let my hair down and not plan anything and just go enjoy myself. That all sounds awesome and the challenge here is I feel like one of two things is happening. Either your wife has a new friend and they go hang out and I'm assuming there's not a romantic connection here is that fair? Yes, that's fair and we've had that conversation. Okay, and so she hasn't fallen, she's not falling in love with somebody else. No, I don't think that. I just think it's like it's more of an emotional time of like someone that is new. That honeymoon relationship, that honeymoon feeling when you're meeting somebody new and you're making those connections and everything you talk about is new to that person. Where when we have those conversations, it's been 15 years of a relationship. So it's like it's just not that spark of creating something new, I think. Man, something's not sitting right with me about this. When you've talked to her, what's her response? When you've said I miss you, I see versions, like I see glimpses of the full of life you that I fell in love with. Why are you gone all the time now? And again, I'm assuming that's why you're calling because if if you have a wife who's met a new friend and there's there's you're in I feel like you're being vague, gender wise and is this like some dude she met. Hold up it hot yoga. Absolutely not. Okay, and is this. I mean, it doesn't it doesn't matter either way, but if she's got has feelings for a new woman that she met a new young single woman like. I'm assuming that's not the case. And if it is, that's a whole different conversation we can have. Yeah. But if she's got a new friend who's young and single and has disposable income and they're hanging out once or twice a week. I would celebrate the crap out of that. I'd be happy that my wife has an adventure to go on and I'd be happy to wrangle the kids a couple nights week all by myself. Yeah, the I'm assuming though that the reason you're calling is that it's way more frequent than that. Depending on the week and it what it's all day texting back and forth. It's a distraction. Yeah, you're not. Yeah, it's that, but it's also like this person is kind of embedded on our lives. Like there's everything we do this person is kind of involved with and it's not like, but it's not like. It's not intentional all the time. Like they're just there. Like we work out together and this person is involved in that group and we are heavily involved in church and that person is there. And it's just it's like there is that time and then there's also the time of when they go out, if that makes sense. And so like I'm trying to win that portion that part of her back and not that she's giving all of that away, but it just it's kind of. I get really jealous like I missed that. Have you told your wife that? Yeah, how'd that go? Um, I think. She's kind of she's working through her thing her own things as well in counseling. We just tell me how it went. Tell me how it went. She felt like it was an attack. Was it? Probably. Okay. Um, it was more like I wanted to see the response like like I'm jealous of this because I want that with you like I want that the old relationship of that that intimacy of like talking back and forth and sharing funny things and like the kind of a kink in that is that we. Everything we do is together like I work with her like all of our lives are entwined together and then sometimes she's like, you know, honestly, I just need a break. Like I just need to get away and although all of our time is spent together, it's not that you know that intimate. That those seconds sometimes feel like it's, uh, it's going through the motions. I mean, yeah, and when you have a six or four and a two year old annual work together, 95, 98% of your relationship is logistical. Yes, absolutely. And so you become co managers or like you mentioned early roommates, like you just we have this many tasks to do and we get these tasks done. And I mean, there's a vaguely with which you're talking and I can't put my finger on it. So I'm just going to, I'm just going to shoot a shotgun. Okay. And yeah, yeah. All the pellets out. Um, it could be that you treat her like a like you're her boss. And nobody wants to, nobody wants to hang out with their boss. Yeah. And it could be that you, let me just run through several scenarios. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. It could be that, um, you have a very particular way you want things done at all times. And now she's got a younger, single, disposable income, burning person who's like, let's do that at whatever. And there's a spontaneity. It could be that you're, um, super nerd and she's a super free spirit. And she finally found another free spirit that just celebrates her for being a free spirit. And it could be that she is numbing because there's just so much going on in her plate. And she has another full time job after she clocks out when that's taking care of all the kids and you're not helping around the house. I don't know what the thing is, but it's getting to that bottom rung here. Yeah. Because the way you're describing it. Yeah, man. Like, I don't work with my wife. And she needs a break from me sometimes because I'm a lot. I'm definitely a lot. I don't, I don't, I don't deny that. I would say more so she's the more like, you know, type a, this has to be done this way. This is how the house is run. This house is clean. So she's more that way. And I'm more relaxed. Like I'm more of a homebody. And the way I relax is being at home with my people and you know, doing the things that we do. And the way she relaxes is going on adventures. And so like I've tried to be more intentional about that. And like she, when we had the conversation at first, it went over like a lead balloon because it was like, you just want me home. And this isn't how I rest. And this isn't, you know, what I want right now. Like I've spent six years, you know, giving my body to three other people and giving my time to that and being strapped to a chair and my entire life revolving around keeping these things alive. And then they're joking in that. Like they're, they're the best kids ever. And, but there's, but don't, don't blow off what she said, what she said is really boring. Right? Yeah. Where I would push back on her is she can't do, I mean, she can't divorce you, but like freedom doesn't mean abdication. Yeah. Like going and having adventures and feeling like, okay, now I've got finally got at least one kid that can get in and out of the shower by themselves. I got two kids that can sort of kind of go to the bathroom on their own. Like I'm seeing kalimpses of getting one, two, three hours of my life back. And if you are sitting right there in the wings and know those are mine, give me those two. There's going to be friction there. Right. And so it's a, it's a delicate balance of she's exactly right. And running away from everything isn't the solution either. But I, I'm going to be honest with you, brother, I'm torn between this is a, like, y'all are just at what you've heard me say this a million times. Y'all are the natural swipe the deck clean. We have a brand new life, a brand new marriage. We're coming up for air after a long six year winter season. Yeah. Who do we want to be? Yeah. And what does our life look like? I want to get to know you again, because I don't know you anymore. We work together. We live together. We share the same bed, but I don't know you and you don't know me. Yeah. And I'm, I'm feeling that sense of, I don't know if this applies to you, man, but it's just ringing in my, in my, the middle of my chest right now. The old saying, um, if you're not, your spouse is biggest cheerleader, somebody else will be. Right. And so if there's not a constant, like you are constantly looking for ways to let her know how amazing she is, not just in words, but in actions and support. And you might be doing that. Somebody's going to come along who either romantic or just friend and it's going to feel like a free for all. Yeah. Right. And because the feeling is finally, somebody sees me or here's the other thing, like or your, your marriage is much, is a much thinner ice than you're wanting to acknowledge. Yeah. I, I think it was, it's more the, the former, I, I really do, like a, a lot of communication is probably one of our biggest issues. Like we both have our families the way we handle things is her family was, you don't let anybody know you're struggling. You bury that way, way, way, way, way deep. And you know, that's nobody else's business. Okay. But hold on. You've been married for 15 years. Yeah. And so I'm going to say something is going to make me sound or nine, but you all been together for 15 years. It's going to make me sound like an ass. But here's the thing. Here's the thing. You all been together too long to keep pushing back on. Well, this is how her parents talked to her. And this is how my parents talked to me. Yeah. You all been together for a decade and a half. You all get to choose to treat each other differently. That's right. Regardless of how y'all grew up, like that's just being an adult saying this happened. And now we get to choose what happens next. And most of the time when folks come to me and say, I would say 99 times out of 100 when a married couple sits down with me and says, we need to work on our communication. What they're asking is, how do I get them to do what I want them to do? Yeah. And that's no way to that is that is communicating to win. And you'll lose 100 times out of 100 instead of communicating to connect. Yeah. And so man. It's it's it sounds it on paper. It's so easy. And what y'all have to work through is really difficult. Yeah. Because she's quickly creating a world, a secret world that doesn't include you. Yeah. And I be willing to bet that she feels like she has been chained inside of your secret world for the last six or seven years. Yeah. And so the challenge for both of you is to say, there's an alluring secret world over here with this young single person who just likes to run rough shot and just have a good time. And it feels awesome. And by the way, the version of you, when you say like, I see old you that I fell in love with. Number one, don't ever say that. Number two, she feels that too. Yeah. And she remembers that awesome version of herself before she had to wipe 15 butts a day and make sure her husband got off and make sure that there's food in the fridge. Like before that world, she remembers that too. And so the magic for you to is how do we create a liveness in the reality where we find ourselves? Yeah. And you have to have two people who are willing to seek for that because she might not be interested in looking for that right now. Right. And that's going to take you learning and practicing and being excited about loving her in a way she likes to be loved. I'm going to do a couple things. Number one, I'm going to send you to the together app for free. Okay. I want y'all to start using it. And she won't use it with you. You can use it by yourself. Okay. Okay. Number two, I'm going to send you the and I'll put a link to the show notes for anybody listening. It's a conflict framework. And I've talked about it enough on the show. So I just had the team build it out and put it make it nice and fancy. But it's just a PDF. But I'm going to email it to you. And here's what it is. It is the path to having a hard conversation. Yeah. And that's where y'all are. And it will walk you through. Here's what I'm here's what I've seen. Here's what's happening. Here's the stories I'm making up about it. And that's where you've got to be honest. The story you leave, you're always on your phone. You're always texting her. You're sitting here. The funny memes are not me. The stories I'm making up is that you don't like me anymore. Yeah. The story I'm making up is you are over me. Yeah. The story I'm making up is I'm not lovable anymore. And then you be honest about how you feel and then you be honest about here's what I would love to see. And then you be honest about here's what I'm going to do next. And none of that is you're always on your phone. You always leave. You don't want to hang out. Those are all accusations. This is a frame to actually solve a problem. And she might not want anything to do with it. And if she doesn't, then you have to you have to metabolize because the story you're telling yourself right now is America's great. She's the best. She's my best friend. She's all these things. If you sit down and say, Hey, this really matters to me. And she's like, I don't give a crap. Then you have to be honest that your marriage isn't what you think it is right now. You don't need some professional support. Yeah. I mean, let me know how this goes. And if she wants to call in, I'd love to talk to her too. I'd love to hear her side because again, something just isn't sound right to me. But maybe it's as simple as she's dead on. Six years, her body has not been hers. Six years, she's had 24, 7, 365. She's been on call. And man, now that that door is cracked open, she feels alive again. And we got to figure out how to, she has to and you have to have a harness of liveness and create it inside your home. And that will include both the vehicle and to have friends outside your house. That's super important. So thanks for calling brother. Hang on the line here. We'll get you hooked up with some resources. We come back. A woman asks how to get her husband to take their age gap and future planning seriously. We'll be right back. I know some of you out there are hurting. And I mean really hurting. Your marriage is falling apart in real time, and you and your spouse both know it. You're watching a son or a daughter disappear into addiction, and you feel completely powerless. Some of you are carrying trauma so deep and heavy, it's affecting every area of your life, and you've tried everything you can do, and you can't seem to shake it. 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How old is he and how old are you? I am 31, and he is 48. Okay. You know, been together. How long so he met you? You were really young when you were met, huh? Yeah, we met pretty young, but you know, it's one of those things that like, it just completely made sense when we got together. Very cool. We've never really had any issues. We've never had any strife, and that's why it kind of also gets harder because we've never really had issues, and we've always been on the same page. And I think I'm just freaking out, too, because his mom passed away at 58, 10 years ago this Sunday, too. And it's just like, as he's getting older, it kind of just makes me think nervous. And honestly, like, very profoundly sad to think about, you know, the future and maybe having the less time with him. Sure. So if there's a close your eyes real quick, if there's a table, and it's a round table, okay? And there's the version of you. There's a person who's actually it's not you. It's just a person. And they're the ones saying the things about his health. I'm worried about his health. I'm worried about him is long term viability. I'm worried about fill in the blank. All things you're worried about. All right, and open your eyes. If you were to be talking to that person who just keeps spouting off worry about him, what questions, like, how would you challenge that person? And here's here. I'm making it too complicated. So let me let me simplify a little bit. Is he in bad health? Not overall. I know he has high cholesterol and high glucose levels. So he's like getting into prediabetic. Is he overweight? Yes, slightly. What does that mean? He's got like visceral fat around his abdomen, but overall not too bad, because he did just get hard scans and lung scans this year. Okay. And they came back. Yes. But he had like smoked cigarettes for 20 years. You know, he lives off of like candy and soda. And so just doesn't make me nervous. Okay. So he's not healthy. No, overall, no. I would say he's not. I mean, he would argue if he is. Okay. If he's living off candy in soda and he smoked for 20 years, he's going to have to be extra intentional about us, help moving forward. And I'm going to add a caveat to that if he wants to. And so let me ask you the next layer. How much of this is projected future grief? I mean, I am honestly a future planner. And I know it's projected future grief partially too. But I also, the thing is we've talked about it. And I was like, I don't want my quality of life diminished because you decided to be selfish with your health. And I feel really guilty about it because he is a great person. I love him. But it's one of those things where I I don't think it's fair and I don't think it respects me or our relationship to put me in that position out of something he could have controlled. Okay. Let's I'll go with you on this on this train right here. So what would be fair? What would he need to do to be fair? I think taking care of it like exercising more, managing his cravings more. I mean, we all have like we all want candy in soda. But you know, just being a little more like responsible about it, being a little more intentional with how he takes care of his body and treats it. So I don't expect them to live for 100 years with me, you know, but what's your ideal outcome? I think if we could just like even if he makes it to 70s, I would be, you know, at least give me a long time with him and to spend time with him like I'm trying to retire early so I can spend more time with him. But you know, he does things like this and it kind of feels like I'm putting a lot of effort in and I'm not seeing that from him as much. Where else does he fall short? Honestly, he really does it and that's what's kind of like so frustrating with it because he's such an amazing person. He balances everything I don't do. He does everything he does. I do. We never have issues. We're just at other opposite of each other and it works out so perfectly. But this one he gets so upset and he he takes it as like a personal flight. Honestly, he will tell me that I can't change him as a person but I'm asking him to be a different person and to me just feels like such an immature view of it. And that's why I think I struggle too because it's like almost coming from his pride and I don't know what to do with it. What are some ways you've attempted? We've talked about it in couples counseling. I've tried to sit him down and let him know that I just want to spend more time with him and he does acknowledge that it wouldn't be fair for him to put himself on me as a burden because he decided to be selfish but he also doesn't feel like he needs to adjust himself and I think in his mind he's still 30 even if his body isn't and I'm having a hard time breaking through to him and because you know his work coming up on the anniversary of his mother's death his father's been having a lot of health issues himself. I think it's just making me a little more anxious. Yeah. So one of the core characteristics of anxiety is planning projecting future travesties and dragging them into the present and trying to solve them. And so in you and I could talk for a few hours on just the landscape of your life that has led you to I want to hang on to present and future variables as much as possible and I'm even going to frame them in moral and character ways as a way to further grasp control over things that might happen in the future and at the same time I'm I'm I'm tracking with you on I it's hard to project that onto somebody but what you're saying is the exact reason why I started taking care of my health. Because I have family members who are unable to just go play for 30 minutes outside. And I wanted to, to me in my head, it felt like a way to honor my grandkids that I haven't, don't even have yet, by begin taking care of myself now, right? So I actually, I actually buy that. I want my wife to walk in the front door and be like, "God, Lee, that's so annoying. He's still good looking. How old he is." Right? That's a goal for me, all right? And so I track with that. My experience has been, if somebody is struggling with their health, if somebody is struggling with their weight, if somebody is struggling with their diet, and somebody is pointing a finger at them, saying, "You're doing this to me." That is a, that is a two handed shove out in the middle of the street in front of an oncoming bus. I've never, ever, ever seen that work. If you're, if you're watching your husband drink a two liter bottle of coke and eat a bag of twizzlers, and your first impulse is not compassion for what in the world is that numbing out for him. I want him to have a full, wild, fun life, and that's not the path. Versus, I can't, I'm going to freaking be having to push him in a wheelchair when he is a stroke. Like, you get what I'm saying? Like one of those is a path of compassion, and people who are hurting respond to folks who sit down and grab their hands and say, "I see you, and I'm worried about you, and I love you." It's really tough to be like, "Man, if you get cancer, it's going to be a pain in my butt." I'm going to have to, like, I know, that's a, that's pushing somebody away. Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah. I mean, I told him, I was like, if it's like medical, like something happens, you get an car accident. Like, I'm not, I don't, it's not those things that I would push him, but I'm like, but this, like, diet. If it's diet related, if you got told to start taking care of yourself, and you decided to ignore it, like, that's, that's damaging, and it, it feels like you don't care. Care enough to take care of yourself so we can have a happy life together. I think that's where the algorithm, I 100% understand what you're saying. Just having sat with folks for more than two, two and a half decades now, who are struggling like he's struggling, I just, I need to tell you, the path you're trying to get his attention on is not going to be successful. The path is, I want you to feel so good in your own skin, how can I love you? Not if you happen to get diabetes, what a pain in my butt that's going to be. Yeah. Okay. That makes sense. Yeah. I know. And I think it's just, my anxiety makes me, you know, go to the worst scenario. Okay. I, I want to challenge you on that. Okay. As a guy who has struggled with anxiety, my entire adult life, anxiety is not going to make me do anything. Anxiety is an alarm system. That's it. With the fire alarm goes off in the building, I still get to choose whether I sprint out and knock over old ladies and shove kids out of the way or if I walk orderly out of the building, I get to pick what I do next. He's just the alarm. Yeah. And so if you feel powerless to your body and then you're projecting that powerlessness onto this guy and making it a character issue, you're eating twizzlers and that's in a front to me. I mean, that, that is a one loss. That is a relationship of you versus your husband that will never be successful. If there's a conversation about I want us to build this life together, a life of peace, a life of warmth, fun, joy and I want to take you dancing. I want you to go hiking. I want us to continue to have crazy sex into our 50s and 60s and 70s and I see you not feeling good anymore. I feel you slowing down. How can I love you? That's a different, that's an invitation, man. Yeah. That's a wife pursuing her husband, not shoving her husband. You get the difference? Yeah. Yeah, I do. And I mean, I know my language is harsher than I mean it to be and I know he doesn't respond to it. And then we've talked about that and I try to work on it, but, you know, so you're right. I feel powerless. So I think it stresses me out more. I want the William Glasser is an old psychiatrist. Much of his stuff hasn't aged well, but some of his stuff I think is still masterful. And he talks about something called the total behavior car, if you will. And most people are driven by their emotions or their physiology, meaning I feel angry. I feel anxious or my back hurts, my neck hurts, my shoulder hurts, my whatever. And if we let those things drive our car, the car that is our life, we'll always be running over people, shoving people, crashing into people, it's not a fun life. And so the change is I'm going to move my thinking and my actions to the front seat, not the trunk. I can't always feel, I can't always, in fact, rarely can I manufacture feelings. My feelings are going to come and go. My emotions are going to get big, big, big, sometimes cool. I get to decide what I do next. And for somebody like me, somebody like you who feels sometimes powerless at this huge shadow of anxiety, the thing that makes it dissipate is I'm driving. It's actually, it's the most empowering thing I can tell somebody who struggles with anxiety, which is the path is directly through it. Here's what that looks like for you. It's instead of sitting there going, man, he might, he might, cool, I have to come up with my own retirement account. We're going to have an, we're going to start saving extra money so I can hire some help when and if you fill in the blank. It's just me, it's just me owning reality, choosing reality. I don't want to do that, but it's me getting in the driver's seat of my own life and not just outsourcing all of myself to this thing called anxiety and this thing to this guy. I've got to take some ownership of my life. And you need to be super, another thing that dissipates anxiety is clarity. When you say work on your health, if I'm him, I would say, dude, I just went, got, I went got a heart and lungs scan that gave me the all clear, what are you talking about? And for most people who struggle with anxiety, they're searching for a feeling of peace and the finish line keeps moving. So he could quit eating candy and then it would be the sodas and then he could quit doing that and then it would be he's not exercising enough. And then he would start walking and be like, well, you never good running and he starts jogging a little bit and it's like, well, you're not lifting weight like the finish line keeps moving. So you getting very clear about here is how I've seen you be the best version of yourself where you love being alive in your own skin, not just collapsing on the chair after a few days of day of work, hammer in a two liter bottle of coat. You know what I'm saying? The clarity. It's finding that tension and going right through that door with specifics. And then if he looks at you and says, I will never change. I won't. And I have this conversation all the time. I will not stop drinking. I'm not. I'm not going to lose with the weight. I am not going to stop cheating on you. I'm just not. And you have to look in the mirror and say, am I going to leave or am I going to stay? And if I'm going to stay, how can I create safety inside of this world? And all of that is about you retaining autonomy. Do you what I'm saying? Yeah. Now, I see what you're saying and that's really helpful because I think I focused too much on my own spiraling internally. And I kind of forget who I'm at someone outside of me that I'm dealing with not my own. Yeah. And the path out of us out of remember this statement, rumination never solves anything. It feels like productive thinking like you're practicing things. It never solves a thing. The path through that rumination is taking action. Cool. Here goes my brain on one of its stories. I'm going to go do something in service of three people. I'm going to go do three things. I'm going to go for a walk. I'm going to go lift weights. I'm going to go write my husband a note and tell him which I love him. I'm going to put it on his pillow. Yeah. The prison is locked on the inside. Yeah. But I think there could be a powerful conversation where you go to your husband and say, hey, I've been attacking you for a long time and I'm sorry. I'm going to change how I talk to you about this stuff. I'm watching how sad you are that your dad's deteriorated. that your mom passed away and I'm projecting how sad I'm going to be one day when you pass away. And I am dragging future grief into the present and it's poisoning our home and I'm sorry. And I am worried about your health. I love you and worry about your health. I really do. And I want you to feel alive and I want us to go dancing and I want us to have fun and I want us to be silly and I want us to be sexy again. And I'm watching you feel less and less good in your own skin and I want to love you anyway I can't. But I'm not going to nag you about this and that and that and I'm not going to because nagging never helps. But I'm going to love you really, really hard. Hang on the line here I'm a senior copy of building a non anxious life and I want you to read it and maybe you and him can read it together and it will give you all both a path towards creating a home that you want to both be a part of. Thanks for call sister. We come back a woman asks how to tell her mom and her sister that she no longer wants to discuss weight loss with them will be right back. When I'm cooking at home, chopping up vegetables, trimming a venison or tea bone steak or when I'm feeling a little bit extra dramatic and cutting up a nice fruit tray. I want to know the knives I'm using will actually do what they're supposed to do cut well. This is why I bought my wife the culinary kitchen knives from Montana knife company and it's why I use them as much as she does. Montana knife company knives are razor sharp right out of the box. They're balanced and they do what they're supposed to do over and over again. Their knives perfect it Montana knife company makes their knives right here in the United States in years of experience going to every blade. They come with a free lifetime sharpening guarantee which I've used. I've sent them off and got all my knives right back razor sharp again and these knives will still be sharp when my great green kids are cooking with them. Head to mkc dot com to see what's available right now and one thing you should know Montana knife company knives sell out fast. Sign up for email and text alerts so you can be among the first to know of new releases. That's mkc dot com. All right. Hey, before we go to the next call my brand new book. I've been working on it for several years. It's all about answering two questions is marriage in the 21st century still worth it and if so, how are we supposed to do it? The book is called building the marriage you want. It's available for pre order now. If you pre order it now it's 2499 and you can lock in a hundred dollars and free bonus items which includes the enhanced audio book early access to the ebook and one of we've never done this before one of my talks on communication and marriage that I gave at the money marriage retreat. People always ask me hey can you stream it can you stream it we never stream it. I'm making this talk live for immediate download. Get your copy at ramsey solutions dot com slash store building the marriage you want. It's got to boys you Idaho and talk to Sam. Hey Sam. What's going on? Good morning doctor John. How are you? Good. What's up with you? Um so I guess my question for today might be a little bit tamer than what you deal with normally. Um so I could use some tame Sam. I think I need this but you also say when people say that it's it's always 10 times worse. I appreciate it. Um so my issue lately has been with my mom and my sister so my mom is she's 70 she's going on 71 and my sister she is 39 I am 28 so I'm the youngest. I live down the street from my mom and my sister they both live together with my sister's daughter who's 12. But I tend to go over a lot you know just to hang out they would that when I'm bored or whatever lately they have been both using a GLP one which is cool. They have been losing weight I have no you know problem if people want to use like a weight loss medication I have like no judgment against that. But lately they have been I guess sort of pressuring me to kind of hop on that train with them and you know we aren't or I guess they aren't really an active group. I like to think I'm the most active out of all of them I go hiking a lot kayaking I'm not like the perfect weight. I'm overweight for you know my height and age whatever kind of like an insecurity I've dealt with like my whole life but as I get older it's just kind of something that I don't feel as I don't know like irritated towards myself or I just kind of learn to you know preserve my peace towards my thoughts towards myself you know try to be. In a more positive mindset anyways um an incident occurred maybe about a couple weeks ago I was over at my mom's house and I was just sitting in the living room watching TV and they both kind of like. I don't know like blindsided be like they they would kind of bring up like oh you should try this and you know every time they do I'm like no thank you you know just like I'm not interested. Um but it just got to the point where they just would not stop badgering me about it and they're like oh come step on the scale we want to see how much you weigh just try I have a little bit left over and this one shot just try it. Um you lose weight immediately and I was just like no thank you like I don't understand why you you know don't take no for answer. Um and then I just got to the point where my sister she grabbed my wrist that was like trying to pull me towards the kitchen where my mom keeps her medication. And then my mom did the same thing with my other arm and they're just like kind of like lightly pulling me towards the kitchen and I was just kind of like don't you care more about you know my happiness other than how. I was like physically perceived and my mom was like I don't care if you're happy I just want you to be healthy and I was like whoa. So I left and I went back to my house to and I was really frustrated because I was just like dude what did I just hear like that was kind of crazy. And you know my sister texted me she's like I know you're not happy I could see it on your face whenever you come around and it's just like that. Because like I'm around you guys and this is kind of something you bring up almost every time that I'm over you know and it's like. Like you guys are really toxic so I guess my main question is when these things come up like I know there's no magical phrase or words that I could say to just make them. Understand but I guess how do I. Shut down the conversation in a way that just says hey like I'm not down for this like I'm. I'm chilling off the GLP ones like I'm over all the. You know diet weight loss talk like I'm doing things on my own I guess that's my question for you. You've you've you've accomplished a rare feet Sam and that is I am speechless. Thank you I appreciate it. It's kind of been something that like has been brought up with my mom her. Are my entire life especially like growing up so it's like I guess a lot of those insecurities I've had an adulthood kind of stem from that. And it's like she you know she wasn't she's not a really active person either so it's like I know I know but let's do this and let's don't let's because you're playing their same game. Because they're their game they're playing is we are now suddenly going to be thin which is going to give us the life we've always dreamed of. You're not thin so you can't possibly be happy i'm joyful active. You have to be surrounded by shame and self-loathing like us and your response please don't let it be well i'm active and y'all aren't active right you're into playing the same game just with a different scoreboard. I'm out completely. Opt out of that game completely to answer your question um. My hope is you don't go back over to that house. Like listen to like I want you to hear back what you told me it's not that they were there telling you that you're less than because you're overweight. It's not that they sat down and said hey we found some really unique benefits with this GLP one which I've heard over and over it's great and yada and it's man if you want to talk about it that's good. They physically grabbed you and tried to drag you into another room to inject you with medicine. The doctor has not prescribed. you. Yeah, no, that was that's madness. I was like that's really honestly gross on like a physical aspect and a psychological and a spiritual head. It's a it's a it's a gross upfront on every it's illegal. It's it's on every single plane. That's not okay. Yeah. And here's what's heartbreaking that you have to metabolize. Right? Bad bad use of the word metabolize there. That's my is you probably have a link. Not just a an aunt an aunt Sam link, but a deeply rooted connection to this 12 year old little girl. Yeah, yeah, because honestly, it's been kind of, you know, dad to see yes, it's a heartbreaking and the it's the same cycle that's kind of like starting over. That's exactly right. And like, dude, like I'm watching this happen again, but from the outside in a sense. I know weird. But you're going to have to grieve the fact that your mom and your sister have put stipulations on their ability to love you. Yeah. And that's that's a nightmare. Yeah, it kind of is. I mean, don't get me wrong. Like, I do, I do love them. I love all of them. Stop, stop, stop. You've been protecting them your whole freaking life. At least for this 10 minutes, though, what they did to you was horrific and wrong. And I'm sorry. And I, I guess there could be a case to be made. I'm thinking of this in real time. So I might say this wrong. Here's what makes us especially insidious to me is I think that they thought they were doing the right thing. And that makes it even that makes it that makes it even harder to internalize because you can't just say they're evil. You have to say, Oh, you think this is loving me, holding me down and dragging me and trying to inject me with your used medicine. Yeah. Right. There's a, like, you're not evil. Y'all are insane. Yeah. I think that a lot about them. Yeah. And so here's the thing. All you can control the end of the day is you. Right. And if you want to keep going back and inserting yourself in that relationship, in that situation, on that couch, knowing what's coming, you're an adult. You can do that. Or if you want to begin to seek support and care from other wise older women in your life that are not them too. Because what they did was wrong. You're going to have to grieve the fact that your mom puts stipulations on what love looks like. I'll love you. If you take the medication, I say you need to take and you internalize it. You think you're happy, but I know you're not. Yeah. It's gaslighting 101. Sam, it's not weird. It's wrong. And can I tell you the thing I want you to be really careful of? If and when the day comes that you decide, I want to, I'm not from a place of shame, I'm not from a place of, I'm not worthy, not from a place of, I'm not lovable, not from a place of, I'm not beautiful, but from a place of, I want to, I just, I get one lap around this track called life and I deserve to feel good in my own skin. Don't not pursue support and care to spite them because you'll pay the price for that. Yeah. Yeah. This is a big one. Yeah. I mean, if you're right, when I always cause a call to the statement and something sometimes worse. So, yeah. I mean, I guess from like an outside perspective, it's like, of course, it's like my family's, but I'm just like, you guys are crazy and weird and then, you know, we try to move on and, you know, they try to, you know, say sorry just to, I guess, shut me up, but then it's like, you know, hearing it from you, I mean, you're pretty well versed in family relationships and relationships in general. So, I just know that shame has never changed a human spirit ever. Right. My buddy, Ian Simkin says, whatever you think hate is doing, whatever you think shame is doing, love can do better. I'm sorry you don't have that. Thank you. The challenge before you is you can't go through your life without it. And if the, especially your old, your mom, if the one person for God's sakes your mom won't give it to you without stipulation, the hard, hellacious road ahead of you is to go find it. From someone who will love you. And yes, love means challenge too. Love means honesty, but the love never means shame. Yeah, no, I get it. I guess I've kind of, I guess, especially, you know, growing teenage years, it's like, did feel a lot of shame for, I don't know, I guess just being me. And then it's like the older I get, it's like, I, you know, I grow confident and just learn, you know, ways to, you know, take care of myself, my brain, all that. I mean, I'm not perfect, but I am. So I was kidding. None of us are. None of us are, right? Right. I just, I really try to just work on work on myself a lot. So it's like, when things like this happen, I'm just like, whoa, I know, but also I get the sense from you that you're a kind of just chuckle it away. Yeah. Yeah. That helps you avoid a lifetime of you walking downstairs or walking into the kitchen and seeing the look of disgust on your mom's face. Yeah. And seeing your big older sister, who you idolize in love and you've sat with her through relationship breakups and all heard all the stories. And then she looks at you and goes, I mean, I wouldn't say idolize, but, you know, you know, you know, I mean, she's your big sister. I respect. Yeah. Yeah. And, um, man. I have high, high, high love and care and respect for parents who sit down with their kids who are, who are unhealthy and say, I'm worried about you. I love you. Yeah. I have zero respect for people, except for parents who look at their kids with disgust. Yeah. Um, yeah. And I'll tell you, separate from your mom, separate from your sister, my biggest dream for you is that you wake up and you feel good in your own skin. And part of that is psychological, but part of that is physical. That your back doesn't hurt and your knees don't hurt and you can go hike whenever the heck you want to, you can go dancing. You can go be silly and goofy. All of that matters, right? Yeah. It's a both-and and the, the dragon you're going to have to really wrestle with is, I don't want to do these things out of spite. Yeah. I mean, I like to think I don't. I just kind of do things because like, I do love going outside and immersing myself in the outdoors and just enjoying nature. Like, I do it pretty frequently. So it's like, when they brought this up, I was just kind of like, you know, not, not trying to play their game too, but I'm like, I'm a pretty active person. Yeah, but again, you know, we're not talking about activity levels or not talking, we're talking about a mom who looks at her daughter and says, I'm going to put my disgust with myself and my lifelong shame with how I look. I'm going to cast that on my daughter and make her carry it too. So much so that I'm going to try to drag her into the kitchen and inject her with medicine. I'm gonna rally her sister too. Sorry that you're wrestling with that. You cannot go over there anymore or you can let them know, hey if you'll bring this up again I'm just gonna walk out and so if you're sitting on the couch hang out with your niece and your sister says so have you thought about you just get up and walk out the door and just go home you live right on the street or you can I think a break is warranted they put their hands on you and try to force you into just madness madness. Yeah this was just like I called it anytime somebody says this is a light one is almost never is I'm sorry that you're wrestling with this you're worth feeling good in your own skin. Make sure the call sister will be right back. These days we basically live our entire lives online and that means the risk of having your identity stolen is off the charts not only could someone run off with your bank account your address your social security number whatever but untangling that mess when they do take it all is a nightmare you're calling banks you're dealing with fraud departments you're out of cash you're filling out mountains of paperwork hoping this all clears itself up but you can avoid all of that stress all that worry and time wasted by getting identity theft protection from zander insurance zander constantly monitors your accounts to make sure nothing shady's going on they're always watching where you aren't looking and if your identity does get stolen an actual human being not some AI chatbot an actual person will work to restore your identity for you you don't have to deal with all the hassle and because zander protects you up to two million dollars you never have to worry about some scam or stealing all of your money I've got zander my family has zander in fact the company where I work Ramsey they give zander ID protection to every single team member that's how important this is to us identity theft could happen anytime to anyone getting ID protection is a gift to future you get identity theft protection for yourself and for your family right now by going to zander dot com that's zander with a z dot com or click the link in the description all right Kelly something awesome happened what is it all right so this is from Amy in west Alice was constant and she writes the Ramsey network and particularly John and team have helped me change my family tree I am one of the OG 17 I had a lot of trauma in my childhood this show inspired me to face the forest fire of dysfunction that I grew up in and begin healing before starting a family I knew I didn't want to repeat my childhood but I didn't order to start the show and therapy has changed me so much my husband and I now have a one in a three-year-old and I am amazed by the different life that we are creating for our kids we just became debt-free including the mortgage I felt that it would be the final step in July and changing or in truly changing our family tree my toddlers quickly humbled me by acting like toddlers at a celebratory dinner though nice not being bad just being toddlers doing the healing has given me so much patience and peace that may not have been the magic finish line for us but I am reminded quite frequently when raising our kids that we are truly changing our tree day by day it stops with me damn what's her name Amy one word Amy Helia that's so awesome I know it's two words Kelly suddenly turns into a grammar math nerd at the same time actually it's two words is there a comma between Helen yeah no exclamation point at the end definitely unless you're cool if you're like super cool you're just like hell yeah like period that's kind of the dopest way to do it that's kind of awesome hey Amy um I mean I'm speechless I'm proud of you I'm so proud of you congratulations sister keep going day by day by day love you guys bye