Bruno Fernandes: Roy Keane Twisted My Words. They Offered Me £200M, I Said No.

In the football career you go through a lot of ups and downs and a lot of difficult moments. And let's say the ones that suffered the most are family. They see your good moments, your bad moments, your good side, your bad side also. But they always stand by you. Your time at Manchester United has been a bit of a rollercoaster like this. And so on that day when you get a big offer to leave Manchester United for a contract that was worth reportedly 200 million, why didn't you go? Manchester United's captain, Bruno Fernandes, has arguably become their greatest player in the post-Ferguson era. There isn't a single player in the Premier League who has more assists since his arrival. He's won more Club Player of the Year awards than Ronaldo. And only five players have scored more than his 70 league goals. So I'm at the Manchester United training ground to ask him the questions the footballing world wants to know. Including, recently Roy Keane criticised your mentality based on a quote he claimed you said. How do you respond to that? He came criticising me, killing me, saying that I'm not good enough, that I'm not a good captain, that I'm not a good player for the club. It's okay, I don't mind. What I don't like is when people lie about things. I even asked Ole his number to have a word with him. Did you speak to him? Guys, I've got a favour to ask before this episode begins. The algorithm, if you follow a show, will deliver you the best episodes from that show very prominently in your feed. So when we have our best episodes on this show, the most shared episodes, the most rated episodes, I would love you to know. And the simple way for you to know that is to hit that follow button. But also, it's the simple, easy, free thing that you can do to help us make this show better. And I would be hugely grateful if you could. If you could take a minute on the app you're listening to this on right now and hit that follow button. Thank you so, so, so much. Bruno, to understand somebody, I always think you have to start with where they started and the early context that they grew up in. And we were just talking before we started recording about Porto. I'm on a journey to understand why you are the way that you are, because you're such an anomaly on the pitch. And your career, when I tracked the journey of where you've come from and how you continually were promoted. And pushed forward at a very young age. It's clear to me that your early context, your early upbringing and whatever it was that was present at that age has shaped you in some very, very important way. What is the sort of earliest thing I need to understand about where you came from and that environment? For me, it's all about family, it's about taking care of other people. And I think to succeed, not just in sports, but in life, you need to be, you need to be very careful of your surroundings. So, I think the value. The values of my family, the values of my, of my parents were, were what make me the person and the player I am today. The older I've gotten, I'm now 33. So I think I'm two years older than you. The more I've realized actually with time, what I learned from my parents and like the values that my dad in particular gave me. He never, for a lot of the things, it's not something he ever said to me. It's like modeling what he did. So seeing how he behaved. Yeah. What's that for you? It's kind of the same, you know, like, um, my father was never a person to, to show. Show his emotions too much or tell you what to do or how to do it. Uh, he would just do it and you would understand by, by, by his behavior, by the way he does things that, uh, that was his way of showing us how he has to be doing. Was never a person of like hugging, kissing and stuff. He's got now into that. Even when I come out of games and stuff, you see, like, I, I, I always get his hug. I always get his kiss. And this is something that I, as a kid. I knew how much he loved me, but, uh, in, in this small aspect was always my mom giving this kind of love. He was more, uh, in the way of, he was showing how things have to be done. How, how much you have to sacrifice yourself to certain things. My dad was very strong with me in terms of like games. Imagine I could come out of a game scoring two, three goals or whatsoever. And my parents, my dad, in this case will always pick up the bad moments I had in games to make me understand. That wasn't, that wasn't, that was good, but wasn't great. It's always margin to improvement. You know, it's all small things. And I think I've learned such from such a young age to deal with criticism that I'm now in probably in one of the biggest clubs in terms of like carrying criticism and attention that doesn't hurt me. Like, I don't like it. Obviously no one likes to get criticized, but it doesn't hurt me. It doesn't change the way I behave. It doesn't wait to doesn't change the way I want to do things, but from the other side. It makes me understand there's still things to improve and I listened to that and I look at my game and I see if he's needed of changing of improvement in my game and my dad was always very strong in that with me and I see nowadays the parents, you know, my dad never wanted me to be a footballer. He wanted me to become a better person, a better player on or a better student, everything I wanted to do, he just wanted to me to do it at like 100%. So if you want to do this, you have to do the best you can, you can't just be happy with the you go to a test and let's say in Portugal was from zero to 100% and you have 98 and you will be the most obvious person who will know you can be happy because that result is amazing, but you left 2% then that you still can improve. So you always always showing me that even if it was just a small thing or a small detail, you still have something more to do, you still still have something more that you can improve or become better and that's something that has stuck with me, not just in football, but in life. I don't like to do things 50%, 67 to 80. Whenever I'm included in something I want, I want to go full I want to learn as much as I can. I want to be the best version I can in that aspect, whatever it is. I mean, it's, it's really interesting because I, I wonder to myself how you I think you start playing football at five years old. Yeah, five. And were you good from five years old? Were you different from your peers at a young age? In such a young age and I never think about being a footballer. I just wanted to play football for life. I'm just happy playing football. I just want to have this ball in my feet every time, all time. And you joined FC Infesta? Yeah, that was my first club. At five years old, I mean, I've got some photos of you as a young man here. I've got so many photos here. You must be roughly around that age then. And remarkably, I read that after one training session, they moved you into the older group and you played with people two years older than you when you were four, five years old? Yeah, I was five playing with the seven years old. Why did they move you into a different group? I went for the first session and it was a futsal session, five-a-side, but like an indoor thing. And after that first session, they told me that like, no, you need to get on the grass. And then I think it comes just, you know, I looked at the other players and that other people that were training with me and I didn't want to be better than them. I just wanted to like, getting at them was the same as getting at them. Getting at my brother that was five years older than me. For me, it was no different. If I have to beat him up, I will beat him up. You know, like 1v1, I'm going to go past him. I have to tackle, I'm going to tackle him. He's going to tackle me stronger. It doesn't matter. I tackle him again. And I had no fear. And I think that was the thing that made me become better and better because I was never the best. Like technical ability, yes, I was good. I was the best? No. Speed, was I quick? Yeah, I was quite quick. Was I the quickest? No. I was the strongest? No. I was the tallest? Of anything of that. I had to sprint with someone that was quicker than me. I'm going to sprint with him and I'm going to, I might not beat him, but I'm going to get close to that. I actually read that you were so aggressive that referees sometimes asked your coach at Infesta, Sergio, to sub you off. Otherwise, they'd have to send you off. Yeah. I mean, that kind of correlates with what you were saying there about fear. Yeah. You were aggressive. I was, that's what I mean. Like I had no fear, you know, like I wouldn't look at faces or sizes whatsoever and think, like, oh, it's bigger than me, you know, like it's going to be stronger than me whatsoever. I would get into any ball in any moment in the game with no fear at all. This is probably the best times in my career between Infesta and Boa Vista because this one is Infesta, this one is at Boa Vista when I've just, I stayed probably a year at Infesta and Boa Vista got me straight away. And you moved quickly up and up and up and up. And that was one of the remarkable things I'd noticed when I looked at you starting playing at five years old, getting promoted to an older team and then quickly almost in all the clubs. You know, I'm looking at when you were 17 years old and you left Portugal and moved to Italy to join Navarra. Yeah. And after three months there, you were promoted to the first team. And then you very quickly joined Udinese. Yes. And at Udinese, you met a guy called Francesco, I can't pronounce his surname, but Guidolini. Guidolini. Yeah. He was really, really formative in your career, wasn't he? You were what, 18, 18 years old? 18 years old. Yeah. Why was he such an important part of your career? What did he teach you or give you at Udinese? He was the manager that probably gave me the basis and the foundation to be fearless and express myself, you know, like to get my head out of so many things that were going on. And as a young kid that has just made the step into Serie A and he's like, oh, I need to, now is the moment I need to show myself, but he was like, you don't. me that you have the qualities when you were in second division in Italy that That's why we bought you. And to be honest, I was on the edge of coming to Watford on loan. Watford? Yeah, because it's the same owners. And we're getting at the edge of the transfer window. They just bought me. And obviously they had a big squad with a lot of players. And they were like, we're going to send you to Watford. You're going to be there playing for them. And I was like, what have I done? Like, I wasn't good enough. And then in the same moment, they called me to go to the hotel, pack my stuff. Because it was like last days. Pack my stuff. I was with my girlfriend's wife now. And she was like, don't worry. We're going to go anywhere else. And you're going to succeed. And I said, but why can't I make it here? Like, what was it that I did wrong that the manager is not looking at me the same that he's looking to other players? And in my head was like, have I done something wrong? Have I not showed my full potential? Have I not shown that I'm good enough to be in this team? And I don't know why. In the middle of all this thought, the sporting director called me again and says, Bruno, you can't go anymore. The manager wants you to stay. He says, he loved you. He loves your attitude. He wants you to learn from him. He wants you to understand how he wants to play and everything. He says, you might not play much this season, but he's pretty sure that you are the type of player that will succeed at this club. And then we had many conversations. And I think when you want a manager for young players that very quick will play and will think like, oh, I'm the guy now. He's going to make you understand, stay calm. I got you, but you're still not there. And he was so good for me. It was like a father figure, you know, like, but not just for me. If you speak with every player that was there at that time, they knew they were important for him because he always showed that. And that's why we made me so much more complete in terms of understanding the moments and the process that managers have to go through their heads and what they think about players that is better or what. So. However, that you don't understand whenever a manager puts you on the bench, you just think doesn't like me is, is doing this because he makes, he wants to make another one play what that's a, but the way he did it with me and all the players that were around me at that time, we were so happy that the environment was very, very good. As a young man, when you're this age, you're 18 years old, what are your dreams? And if I'd asked you at the time, what does your future look like? What would you have said to me? As soon as I became a professional player, I was like, I want to be on, on, on the top clubs. I want to play for, for the big clubs. I want to be in the champions league. I want to, to play for trophies. I want to become the players I'm looking at. I want, I want to become like them. Did you think you could? Yeah, always. I've never, I never doubt. And at 22, you get a call, um, and you returned to Portugal and signed a five-year deal with Sporting in a deal worth reportedly 8.5 million. That next season you scored 20 goals and added 13 assists, which is unheard of, unheard of for a player in your position. And what I read as well is that Tottenham were interested in you at that time. Um, and it was, it was at one point highly likely that you were going to end up moving to Tottenham. I'm very glad you didn't as a Man United fan, but tell me about that. So Tottenham call you. Yeah, I spoke with Tottenham and, uh, we were very close to get an agreement done. Um, then in the last two days or one day of market, the Sporting just said, we, we're not going to sell him. We are going to keep him because we need him. And you want it to go to Tottenham. Yes, because I wanted to play in the Premier League. Why? Because for me, it's the best league in the world is the most competitive one is the one that I think when you grow up, you dream to play for, you know, like full stadiums, top clubs, top players. Obviously I was, I was lucky enough that my dream club to play in England was Man United. And obviously Tottenham at the time was the option I had, and I was very, very happy to join them because they showed me the process. That they were going through the manager that was there at the time. They also really wanted me all the new things, the new facilities and everything. So I was very happy with the, with everything that I could see, uh, going forward, but, uh, it didn't happen. And for bigger reasons, I guess. And then in January, I got, I got the call that, uh, I was, I was hoping for, for, uh, for two, three years already. Tell me about that call. Cause I know Manchester United has, has been, you know, in your eye for a long time. I mean, it's been a long time. I know you grew up watching people like Cristiano Ronaldo play for this club. And I think when he, I think when he first played for Portugal, you were, you were a young guy, you was like eight, eight or 10 years old or something. And he had been a great star of Manchester United, but, but I think generally people of our age group, we grew up in the heyday of Manchester United, the Sir Alex Ferguson era as well. So why Manchester United? And can you zoom me in? If I'm a fly on the wall, when you get that phone call from your agent, I guess that Manchester United are in, I can see the smile on your face. I was, um, let's say I was in my wardrobe. I was getting, getting ready to go to bed. We just had to, my wife was just putting, uh, kids, uh, my daughter at that time. I only had my daughter, uh, to bed and I get the call from my agent. Uh, I knew things were going on and everything, but after what happened with Tottenham, I didn't want to put my focus on transfer windows. And I never did it in every step of my career that I've changed club. I always said to my agent, whenever he's like 95%, that the club really is. He wants me and he's ready to make an offer. Tell me. And then I decide if it's like the right moment and I want to go. A part of that is I'm like, just keep him apart. Keep me apart. I don't want to know it. I don't want to like to lose the focus of what I'm doing to something that I can't control. And after the Tottenham thing, I was like even more because obviously I was basically done. And then all of a sudden, last day of sporting just says like, guys, oh, they text Tottenham and say like, oh, we're not going to make it. So he called me and he said, Bruno, so you told me to not speak to you until we had something like. Concrete. Concrete. But just so you know, they also have agreement already, everything. So it's just on your side now to say yes or no. And I was like, yes or no to what? And he said, come on, you've seen the news. I said, my agent calls me guys and Miguel, the news are every day different. Every day they're going to put a new club that is interested in me. So I'm not, I'm not going to be focused on that. He said, okay, Man United is coming for you. I know, I know this is like why you want. So just so you know, this is, this is what I want. This is the one that you've been waiting for. So it's on you now to make a decision. And then for like 10, 20 seconds, I didn't, I didn't say anything. I was, I was crying, but I didn't want to talk because, you know, like your voice starts going a little bit chocky. And then all of a sudden my, my wife gets into the wardrobe and she says, I'm still on the call. And she goes like, why are you crying? And like him on the phone say, are you crying? I was like, just, I turned that off and I was like, Miguel just called me. And then in the moment. I'm trying to explain to my wife what's going on. He's calling me like repetitively, like I need an answer. And I was like, and my wife was like, why are you crying? So like, this is like what you have dreamed for. Like this, this is the moment you've been waiting for. And I was like, oh, I don't know. It's just too much. Like I've never expected after everything that happened with Tottenham. I would have got the chance to come to the Premier League again. And having the chance to come to the Premier League with Man United is it's, it's like a hundred percent. Of the dream complete. So obviously then like, I just, I just call him back and I say, like, I don't even want to know anything else. Just tell them I'm going, obviously I was very good at sporting and I was very happy there because I really enjoyed my time at sporting because was when I became probably the best version of, of myself as a player where I improved so much in that two years and a half, but then was like the dream of playing for the Premier League. And I think from every sporting fund, they really. Really understood that was, was ready for me to, to go and do the next step. And when you joined, I mean, here's the famous photo of you signing with Manchester United. Yeah. It's funny that the smile that you still have in your face when you look at this photo. Yeah, it's, uh, because I think when, when you look back, as I said, like this is the day your dream comes true, so it's, uh, it's probably professional wise. I think I put this one and sporting together because of the importance that sporting had in my career. But obviously this, this was the cherry on, on top of the cake because this is where I wanted to be. And you joined the club at a time when the club was in a bit of a turmoil, struggling, you know, Sir Alex Ferguson has left, um, we've cycled through a bunch of managers and we've got, um, Ole Gunnar Solskjaer as the manager at that point. I think the club was seventh in the Premier League when you joined. And it was going through a time of turbulence. You knew that Manchester United wasn't the most stable club in the world, but you chose to come here anyway. And based on your record at sporting, you would have had a lot of other opportunities to join a club that was more stable. That was, you know, and it's interesting because clubs can have a big impact on a player's future. Players can have a big impact on a club, but it also goes the other way. And as someone that runs businesses, you know, the environment you join has a huge impact on everyone's behavior. No, no, irrespective. Irrespective of how hard you try, you chose to join a club that was at the time unstable. Look, the game I looked before I came here was, I think, Burnley, United-Burnley, and United loses at home 2-1. I don't remember exactly, but I know, I know they've lost that game and it was just like days before I came. And I was like, I still think there is, there's a lot of potential in that team. And a part of having potential. that I'm trying one of the biggest clubs in the world and I know that clubs go through periods where things don't go the way they want but sometimes it's not just because they're not great it's just because other teams are being better than them and that's that's fine because in football you're not going to win all the time but the thing you can do is like you can bring your own values your own experience your own qualities and trying to help everyone else around you to become better to become the team you want to see and I think at that time that period of then we had the COVID time and all the stuff but that period from there to the end of the season the team was unbelievable and the season after we got second place and because we struggled in certain moments of keeping keeping up to to the standard of city that at a very good end of season but for me was like I wasn't like I'll fix that I was like I'm gonna be the the magic the magic the magic magic powder that's going to solve all the problems but I really knew that this club had something special and for me to join it was was like I can be part of something that is going to become great again and I still believe that and obviously it can take time it's taking more time than I thought yes of course but at that time I had too many dreams in my head and they still are here and still a lot of things that I want to achieve but this smile and this guy that came here in 2020 is still is is still is still the same guy that wants to to win and succeed at this club I'm wondering you know because there's been so much said about the environment at Manchester United over the years I I know a little bit about the environment when Sir Alex Ferguson was here because I interviewed a lot of his players and having been to Carrington before and actually going to the grounds and actually sitting in the hospitality lounge and waitresses coming over to me and talking about when Sir Alex Ferguson was here and how he knew everyone's name and then how it changed it was really interesting to me to get a lot of this feedback because it highlighted how small things in culture can have a big impact right down to the way players play and there's always a story that Gary Neville told me about with Wendy and her charity balls he told me a story of the players walking past Wendy who got the charity ball signed for a local charity and one day a couple of them didn't sign it and Sir Alex Ferguson came downstairs and he quote fucking killed us and it's a strange thing to do like to care that much about a small detail in culture but over time Gary told me he understands why Sir Alex Ferguson cared so much so my question to you is really about the cultural evolution at this club and what the fans are desperate to know about like how it's changed and how it feels different from the time you arrived in 2018 up until today I've brought in my behavior my the way I've been raised and all these things and I think every different player has brought different things to the club but I think one of the things that I've brought in is that I've brought in a lot of things that has to be always there is the respect for people and I think that says for me is a non-negotiable thing like if any player comes to this club and he doesn't respect the physios the people the stewards the people that are in all the desks we have here the people that work for us in the restaurant the chefs and all these people that are around us taking care of us even if you don't see it or if you don't think it or whatever is for me is a non-negotiable thing that respect has to be always there and more than respect the care you need to care about them because if you have a good foundation a good base of respect and and care in in your club it's going to get better the environment gets better everything is more positive because I think and and this is probably the way I've been raised I treat everyone in the same way I don't treat the players in a way that I don't treat the clean lady or the people that are in the front desk or the people that the stewards and at the entrance you know if I see a player that's not a good player I don't change that if I say good morning to these ones I say good morning to these ones I don't change that if I give a handshake to these ones I give a handshake to this one if I greet them as I'm greeting my teammates they will feel part of it they will feel involved they will feel as important as them even knowing that the role of them is completely different of the other ones because the the role of a CEO is one thing but if the cleaner doesn't clean everything nice and leaves everything prepared and well well done and everything you will notice that something is wrong you will notice that this is not where you want to work for you don't you notice that you don't want to be the CEO of a company that has trash everywhere yeah and so why wouldn't you greet the person that takes care of you takes care of your place to look so good and to make an impact when people come in from the outside it reminds me of something actually Johnny Ive said so Johnny Ive is the famous Apple designer that designed all the Apple products that we know and love and he said um it's very hard to feel care he goes but everyone can feel when someone didn't care you go to a restaurant and they didn't care small things he goes it's like he said um care is just this thing in the background this ambient feeling you have when you arrive somewhere but you can't you can't like point out exactly what it is but you can feel it that's the thing I think it's more that you feel it but you don't see it and I think touching this point I was I was talking about cleaners my mom was a she was cleaning houses for work so I never wanted the people that were cleaning the house to treat my mom badly or let's say downgrade the work she's doing for them because for example now I have a person that works in my house I don't allow my kids to talk badly to her I don't allow my kids to say grab that you put it in place and I said it to her in the first day she came to work and I said if something is not in the in the right place obviously I want you to clean I want you to put things in place I want all of this but I don't want my kids to tell you oh that uh arrange that or put this in place no if they want something they can ask you but first of all they need to be respectful if they can't make it they have to ask you but in the respect way but if it's something that they can make you have to make them make it not like oh you do it no just explain them how to do it show them the way so they learn with it and this probably the way I behave with the people that work with me it comes a lot because of my background of not like it to see my mom because I was not in the houses obviously I don't know if they treated well or not my mom never said to me that any of the people that she worked for were bad but to her or treat her in a bad way so I really think that that made me understand that because I don't want that for my mom I won't make that to other people I've been a Man United fan since I was a kid so like my siblings were born in Manchester I was saying to you before I was born in um in Botswana in Africa but because I've got two older brothers who are Man United fans I very quickly became a Manchester United fan I remember like three four years old then as soon as I could when I was 18 I moved up from the southwest to Manchester at 18 years old and I lived here and went to my first Manchester United games I've seen the club go on this incredible journey um from you know Sir Alex Ferguson's era to this sort of period of transition to where we are now and it's my observation my honest observation that after in the post Fergie era the club made some bad decisions as it relates to recruitment and culture um people often talk about um Edward Woods I'm not going to I'm not going to try and stitch you up in a way but I'm anyway I'll get you to talk about anything particular I'm just expressing my opinion they talk about Edward Woods uh strategy towards signing players and it being a bit flippant and then you look at the sort of group of lads that we had and just as a United fan watching on the pitch I felt the culture was a bit confused because it didn't seem like it seems now where it seems like there's this really strong central agreement around the values it felt a bit I don't know a bit like we had signed players because they were famous or big but not the because they fit and I feel when I look at the club now I go oh these guys kind of fit and whoever's doing recruiting is thinking about character it feels to me like there's been this process over the last couple of years of getting rid of the wrong character profiles and I think how Ameren really spoke to this he really talked about getting rid of the players that didn't have the right character profile just to add one more line to this I've spoken to a lot of players at the club in past and present and they expressed the same to me as well that there was an issue so far that has now been solved for I think the main mistake that the club has done through the years that we've changed manager through manager they were very different and that's already a bad sign not of recruitment because then you bring in players that fit that manager but the next one you brought plays a completely different way and the three or four or five that you bought don't fit this one anymore and then you have to buy another four or five and then the constantly change of strategy in in the club or in the way we wanted to play whatsoever was not was not the best because then obviously it becomes that the players don't suit anymore the system is not even more the character than it comes up but it's more the system then obviously we can talk about character that players there were certain players that were not a perfect fit for the club but you never know it until you bring it to the club I think sometimes you can see it and I think it's their players that I think the club by the behavior of the players that I think the club is they have on the pitch or the behavior they have on on social media whatsoever you can see if they will be a fit for the club or not and I think the main thing for the club as you said there you need to bring good characters because that will be more important to build something that good qualities because good qualities they all they will have you don't bring a player too many and I did that as I have qualities but if you can add the qualities to the character that's a win-win because the qualities will be moments that the quality won't be as good as you want because players go through periods that sometimes they play very good sometimes they play very bad but the character remains the same and that's the character you want where they are on a low to be the right character to push himself to be on a high or at the same time when they are on the low to be the right character to push the other ones to be at the top level and I think that's the main thing that the club has to do in terms of recruitment and everything is bringing people first of all that want to be a Man United to play for Man United not to be a Man United just because it's a big club they want to be here because this is the club they think and they really understand that they want to succeed with this club they want to bring this club back to the days we used to see Man United I know being 12, 13 years I know but we want that to get as short as possible to become that club that won 20 Premier League titles and is joined the most in the Premier League so character in a football club is more important than the quality because the quality you're always going to get it and you can improve it This is what I heard from Patrice Evra I remember him telling me that he met Sir Alex Ferguson in an airport I think in France and Sir Alex Ferguson sat him down and said are you willing to die for Manchester United and he said yes and so he shook his hand he said welcome to Manchester United and that's a different way of recruiting he's not testing if he can kick a ball well he's testing if he's got the heart and that mentality that I think Fergie and previous sort of cohorts of Manchester United really really cared about I think Sir Alex obviously he's done mistakes in recruitment too because obviously not every player was great but he always brings players in any time in any moment they would fit the club and that's the main thing I think in terms of recruitment this is like something that is not for me to get involved but I will say it I understand the club as different managers that comes in and different ways of playing and whatsoever but the recruitment has to be for Man United because the player will get normally a five years contract and the manager will get two and you know that if something is not working the club always gets rid of the manager first then it gets rid of the player because it's much more difficult so I think you always have to bring players that fit the club and then you bring managers that fit the club and the players you've got and I think that says to be the thing that for example let's talk about Klopp and Pep why they were so successful because they chose the players in togetherness with the club that will fit the club the system and the way they wanted to play and through the years have they done mistakes of course have they bought players that didn't work yes I think were more the ones that worked than the ones that didn't and the ones that didn't work I haven't seen many of them coming out and talking bad about the club or about the manager whatsoever yeah it's difficult to be there and a club buy you for 50, 60, 70 million and then you don't play when you thought oh I'm going to play because they're paying this amount of money for me I'm going to play then you get there you don't play of course it's difficult but what I've seen is that they built in a way that the squad was strong enough to take care of those players that were not playing and were struggling one of the things I've noticed as a change especially this season is all this social media distraction people posting on their Instagram stories when they don't play their brother's sister posting my brother should be playing whatever all of this sort of like social media stuff that some players were doing over the last couple of years seems to have vanished and this is just an interesting you know we talk about small things being interesting signals it's one of the things I've noticed this year there isn't social media nonsense going on how like I guess my question is is that something the club has done has there been have they sat you down and said stop this social media stuff or is it just a consequence of getting the right people together I think it's a little bit both but at the same time I think the club has to be the one being strong with the players when they see something that is not right or they don't like it or it's not good on the players on the team on the attention this club gets I think the club needs to talk with them and with the agents with the families whatsoever that speaks out and says something because I think it's also on the players to make the players the families and everyone that is behind them understand that what they put out or what they say can have consequences on our careers do you talk to the players about this if I see something that I don't like or if I see them posting or replying to some people on social whatsoever because for example from such a young age I've said to my parents I've said to my brother I've said to my sister I don't want you talking without my like without me knowing it not because they don't know how to talk whatever but they're not aware what can be bad or wrong they might think they're going to say something that is going to be good for me but maybe has repercussions on other people and I don't want them to do that so my parents never spoke my brother never spoke my sister never spoke when I wasn't playing let people make noise let people talk it doesn't matter what they say I know for my mom for example she suffers a lot with this and I say take it in don't care pray at your saints like you do to me all the time and and make sure they do the right thing for me because that's what matters and she kind of like gets okay with that obviously I know that probably when my brother says something or my sister they want to reply to something they want to say it's not true why are you talking about this or my brother or whatever I don't want them to get involved in that because it's not going to be good for them it's not going to be good for me and it's not going to be good for my environment and I don't want that but I think that is because I was strong with my family in the first moment and I think that's who I have to be I don't go home to my family like no this manager this this manager that I might say what I like or I don't like whatever but I don't go in a way of like if I had someone that could put something out because I've been doing this I don't care like to people to put out oh Bruno is training so well Bruno is doing this Bruno is doing that I know I'm doing it that's enough for me and it's true because you know you've been through this process of transition with Oli then Carrick then Raph then Eric then Ruiz then Ruben then Fletcher then Carrick again and actually one of the remarkable things is I've never noticed your attitude towards the managers be any different I can't tell I can't tell as far as I'm aware you support them all and that's how it should be I think if you've got a problem I think as you know a player you should go tell them but we shouldn't know you know and we don't know with you I don't know what you think of them I agree with that because first of all I like every manager that comes in my way because I learn with them and every manager that comes in has their own idea has their own thinking has their own way of playing and they want me to do one thing the other one another thing the other one another thing and for me that's good because they believe that I'm capable of doing different things that I was doing before so what I won't give to the managers is the choice or the option in their head to think I'm not going to play Bruno What do you do when you're not happy about something though? As the captain and you go have a chat with them? No I do whatever they want me to do if they think it's the best thing for the team I'm going to do it either I agree or not believe it more or not I make myself available for what they want to do 100% if then it works or not that's on them to decide to decide that if it needs to be changed or not I'm not going to go to the manager and ask them to change formation the way they play if they ask me I give my opinion if they don't ask me I don't say anything What have you learnt about what a good manager does and how to be a good manager from the six managers you've had? For me look through my career I've always heard that certain players should be treated in a different way than other players I don't believe in that it's like the same as having a business you buy certain people to do certain things because you believe they're the right person to do that so I don't think that I'm going to you then should change the way you behave with them you should probably approach them in different ways I believe in that because I'm not the same as you yeah so do you treat players differently on the pitch because you're you know you shout at lots of your teammates are there some that you won't shout at as much I treat all of them the same and I think they're kind of getting to know exactly why I do it everything that we train in imagine let's see during the week we train this and we have seen images of this we know what you have to do the managers prepare for us for that I demand that at least I don't I don't care who you are we've been a full week preparing the training the game for this this we need to know how to do it then if you can make a pass or you can make a goal or you can make a tackle that's different that's the qualities I need from each one individually but I've learned to talk with them in different ways but with the same end result not like I won't like go to one and say like being scared of saying things to him and the other one like because he's younger whatsoever I'm gonna like shout at him whatsoever no if I have to shout at this one I'll shout at this one if I have to praise this one I'll praise this one the same way I praise this one and I think that you can see in my interviews I'm not afraid of saying what I feel at the same time I'm not afraid of praising players for what they've done or what they're doing even if they probably in the moment they haven't done as much as they needed to get the praise but for me I think he needs that praise to get into the next level so I'm gonna give him something but I make him aware I've gave you something but I'm expecting something more from you it's like my dad giving me like you need to be better you need to do more because he knows I'm capable of more and this is why I demand from the players I demand I'm very strong on them because I really believe in them. I have said this so many times to so many different players. It's like, trust me the day I stop talking to you the day I start shouting I stop shouting at you is because I don't believe in you anymore and I don't believe you can improve anymore your time at Manchester United has been a bit of a roller coaster like this kind of like up and down and up and down you went second and then you dropped down the league you're second and I mean the last two years have been a prime example of that finishing near the near the bottom end of the table and then this year back up to third I'm wondering as a fan when things get bad and you hear all these sort of rumors breaking online that the manager is going to be sacked does that impact the dressing room like do you guys in the dressing room because you've been through it so many times where a manager has been removed do how what's that like when you know things are going bad no first of all you feel it for the manager is the first thing because I think obviously certain players will feel it more than others because it's their players that play more than others and they obviously the ones that probably don't play they don't like the players that play more than others and they obviously the ones that probably don't play they don't like the players that play more than others and they obviously the ones that probably to see managers going but at the same time if a new manager comes in is a new opportunity for them to probably get into the team more times than we're getting before and I think going through the process of changing manner is probably the worst thing in in in sports because it's starting from zero again and either either people believe it or not when you're through a process you want to get to the end of the process and understanding what's what that has gave to you as a player and what you can do more with that staff with that team and with that manager to go even further more why didn't you lose hope because you went through that process of starting from zero making progress manager goes back to zero making progress manager goes back to zero you know why because every time I've spoke this with Diogo before every time you come for pre-season is like a new start and you always get that belief of like this is going to be the this is going to be the time this is going to be the time is moments through the season that you you get this belief the things are not going well but the main thing I have is belief in myself so I always think if I do things right and I take people to do things right and I help them to do things right as a team we still have a chance of pushing ourselves into positions we want to be and this let's say this season has been that case because we struck we struggle obviously we didn't change manager because of results because we were two points behind second place and like five points behind five first place we were same points till I think from third to seven place was everyone with the same points something like that so we were we were there was something different with this with the club that they felt that the trust between them was was broke or whatsoever and they kind of decided to start a new process and that was bad because for us when Ruben came what was passed from the club is like this is going to be a process we're going to go through this going to be good and bad times but we're going to go through this obviously then the club decided that it was time to part ways and you started from zero from from with Michael but then you've got results and you went to the end of the season and you finished third and you finish what doing probably in the time Michael was here till the end of the season till now is we probably the team that has made more points what did Michael change I think in in the first moment what what what Michael tried to do is like to give stability to the team because as every manager understands when you come in after a break you understand that you need to give stability and peace of mind to the players to get back to the level he thought we could have and he brought the foundation and the base that has been in this club uh from the time he played until the time he managed and then he left so he knows he knows the club he knows how the club wants to play and he knows what the fans want to see how is he different like what's what tactically or from a character perspective what does Michael bring as a manager I know as you know just an hour ago or so it was announced that he's going to be the Manchester United manager going forward um which is great news um but what is if you had to describe him to me as a leader and a manager what how is he different I think he's a very he gives you a lot of calmness you know in terms of uh why he wants from the team the way he demands from the team the way he demands from the team the way he demands the way he coaches um he gives you he gives you a good way of going to the game with with a good peace of mind but with a lot of responsibility because I think from the time he was here with Sir Alex he gave a lot of responsibility to the players to make decisions and to make choices on the pitch that have to be on you he gives you the base he gives you the foundation he gives you certain rules that is like the non-negotiable ones but then he also knows and he wants us to take some responsibility through the game that things might change because you prepare a game full week obviously but then the team could come and uh do a different thing like you prepare to play against a 4-3-3 because they always played 4-3-3 and then they come and they play 3-5-2 and then you go like oh and now the manager can't be on the sideline telling you where to press where to go so as a player as a players have the foundation have the base have the rules non-negotiables and from there on we need to find a way of like okay let's imagine we can't press because they've changed everything and the press we prepared was not was not the one we needed let's get compact let's get together they don't get into our block when we have the ball we play with the ball we get into the halftime and then the manager will give us the message that he wants to give or whatever he has seen that we need to do differently in a way of getting a better result from the from the pressure and I think that's what he gave to us the calmness and the way he prepares games was very good but when things were not going in the way we wanted he gave responsibility to the players to like make it work then we solve it ah so like a bit of freedom to it's not exactly freedom because freedom is a different thing it's like it gives you freedom with the ball to make decisions because he says that's your responsibility on the ball I can't tell you where to pass the ball I can't tell you where to shoot I can help you where the space is going to be and I think that the most important thing for a player is knowing where space is going to be you need to know where spaces are to then play with it you know that they have big gaps there that we can hurt them from there and this is the message that has passed to the team like if we attack from here they have less people on this side we can bring more people in the box from this side we want a very good counter press because they have two strikers so we need to have three people in the back two of them mark one of them stays behind so this is the small things in the foundation that he gives to us but then he says many times I can't tell you where to pass I can't tell you where to shoot I give you the solutions but might not be there so you have to find a way of making the good pass the good shot the good decision because I'm not going to be in your head in that moment in your head it's going to be the ideas I gave you and some of them will be good some of them won't work out so you have to make a way of like understand the good ones I gave you and the other ones that are not working well you need to find a way of make it work so it's more just he gives you the principles instead of specific instructions on how to play and what to do it kind of gives you but then he lets you balance through the game okay he lets let's say he lets the players read the game because in 90 minutes many things happen and not gonna always happen what you see in the video hopefully yes but not always for example let's say we had the chance against Nottingham Forest that I passed the ball to Brian and his scores we have seen the same chance from Villa against Forest the exact same chance exact same movements exact same passes and we've seen that we visualized that and we've seen that we've seen that we've visualized that and that's why that works because we had the ideas we knew we could make that happen and we made it does he get angry because he seems like such a calm guy when you see him in press conferences he's very calm and very you know yeah he did he did he did got hungry one once or twice but he's very calm in the way he speaks but I think I think everyone gets angry anyway but he's a very calm presence and he's someone that speaks very well knows the timing the words he knows what to say um and whenever he got when he let's get let's say more aggressive within us was was the time that we needed to to get that from him and the way that you play is interesting because when I was looking at um a bunch of your quotes over time but also how I think about business you are a player that takes more risks than most people and we talk a lot about failure in business and how you have to increase your rate of failure to to get better outcomes but you're a player that is not shy of taking a risk and you're a player that is not shy of taking a risk and you're a you play in a way where you you sometimes lose the ball but you also as we've seen this year and in many other years you often are generating more opportunities than any other player on the pitch how do you think about this because the way you play means that sometimes you're going to make a lot of mistakes you're going to lose the ball more so than other players I'd argue even more so than some of the previous midfielders we've had like Carrick who would often choose a more safe option than trying to play it through a thin gap what's your attitude towards risk I think it's always risk reward you know you need to understand how much reward you're going to get from that and if taking that risk is good for the team or not let's say the position I play you need that it has to be one of your main skills to take risks to do things that the game demands from you and to make sure that your team teammates in the front get the ball in the positions that is going to be the rate of success for them to score a goal is going to be higher I might miss two or three times, but if I get one right, can become a goal for us and i think there's nothing better than a risk reward that is a goal so i think when you play as a number 10 position obviously you don't want to lose the ball you just you have to make that as less as possible but in certain positions you lose the ball more often than others wingers will lose more the ball on one of you once then midfielders do fullbacks will do normally more crosses than centerbacks will do number sixes will make more tackles than a striker will do so it's a balance in the team that you need to have let's imagine i played with kobe and casa they're not a risk player so if i take four times let's say a risky pass and they take one each that's six times a game so i need to be the one that takes four they need to be the ones that take one one each because the responsibility they have in the team is the one that they make the team play from the build-up push the team forward to then get the ball into the players that have to take the risks because if you don't have the players that take the risks you're going to end up bubbling and we talk like for example let's say man city there is a team that's that let's say guardiola tiki taka all these things the players that take the risks cherokee is now the player that takes the risks phil foden doku mares will be the ones that taking the risks on a 1v1 has the manager ever told you to take less risks eric told me to take less shots from the outside of the box he showed me a board with my success rating of shots on target shots of target and goals show me the positions where i was more effective and he told me i think you need to get more into this positions to then make your shot into what positions let's say close to the box like in in the position we will see the box and you would say like more throws left hand side you score more goals more throws the right hand side your you aim more the goal towards the middle of the of of the of the edge of the box you miss more shots so he was like get more into the left side don't get more into the right side or close range long range so but then obviously is is we come back to the risk and reward because sometimes obviously you're going to score a great goal from 25 yards out but how many times you're going to do it out of five you maybe score one and it's a lot already so i need to make that risk become less and less and less getting more risk probably from 18 yards because their possibility of me scoring a goal it might be three in five because i'm much more closer i can put more power in the ball i can be much more effective i've spent the last decade building and investing in companies and so often the conversation around marketing budgets follows the exact same pattern the budget gets approved but then the results don't come back and most of the time the creative pitch and the offer is fine the problem lies with the audience ads reach people who will never buy or refer nor do they have the power to sign off anything at all and this is why so much budget gets wasted linkedin ads for a sponsor of this podcast lets you reach them specifically by 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this square let's say you i would say let's let's put it like this yeah no just just need a square oh you just need a square this is let's say imagine we are talking this time this this is the spaces where i think i can be more effective in this square year and different managers asked you to play in different positions within here because for example uh let's say let's put here with ruben he used to play three at the back one wing back two midfielders uh another wing back and striker and two tens with ruben i played a lot of times here in this position when he first came and you wanted me and and in this position these two more more more than often you wanted me to be one of these two to help here to help these two midfielders to build up and to get this guy higher in a position when he can be in the last line and to get the ball into this tube so what position would you call that like left if this was the left 10 let's say but he wanted me to play more like as a left midfielder to help them to like first of all to have more stability in the middle second to get the ball going forward to take the risk of passing the ball forward then i played a lot of times here what we're going to do is we're going to make you unfortunately we're going to make you blue just so we can see which one you are okay okay so in this one when i played here many times you wanted me here because they were pressing let's say three against three and you wanted me to come and do the overload so we have one more player to build up so they will open up this one a little bit more get this one more offensive normally it was luke shaw and as a full buck he was used to playing this space and so then we could drive the ball and they couldn't press with the three they had they wouldn't be able to press because we always had this one also to bounce the ball then whenever we go up the pitch with the ball you wanted me here ruben did yeah you wanted me to play more a little bit more higher to be one of the three tens and make this line of three tens then for example with the ole i was playing we would play like four two three one and i will be the number 10 and you wanted me to do this uh i can't go across and sometimes you wanted me to do and get the ball here or here to make the long passes and to make the switches to the the winger i think this bit here in the middle is where i'm more i can i i think we all can see the best version of bruno if you ask me where i prefer to play anywhere on the pitch i think for the way we play this is the position i i can be more effective but i think i really enjoy to play here because i really enjoy to get the team to play and if you're not playing if you i played many times with uh tenard like this i was the number six playing with two eights and i really enjoy it to play here and it make make myself being different a different player more aggressive off the ball someone that has to cover spaces for these ones regardless of where you are on the pitch which can change what is non-negotiable in terms of how you play commitment that's that's non-negotiable like the commitment i have for what we have to do it doesn't change by me liking the position or not me preferring one position or the other um that that won't change um i think running fighting and team spirit can never miss it doesn't appear to me that you ever get tired and also one remarkable thing about you is you don't seem to ever get injured i get tired and i got injured unfortunately oh but how how does that happen because i watch you right it'd be the 89th minute and you're like oh my god you're running up and down still is that genetic or is that something you do in training what is that i think obviously i've i have to say that i have good genetics but um is i i was talking with diogo about this the other day also in and the nutritionist about like genetics how you how you treat yourself and everything uh but then then at the same time i said to them you know what's different on me than the other ones because i always train 100 i make the training as a game i i need to make some extras if i feel that the training wasn't like enough let's do something else let's do some shots let's do something crosses to someone let's do something that can make me go out of training and feeling like i'm tired why is that important because i think in the game you need to get tired and then you know like for example when you are when i'm training shooting practice or last third passes i rather train that when i'm tired because it's going to be the last 20 minutes of the game your brain is not going to work in the same way it was working in the beginning because you get tired and you get to think slower a little bit so you need to be able to train your body and your brain when they are tired and i think if you do that in training when you get to the game and you start getting tired your brain is used to that also your body is used to be tired and he knows how to react into into that moment these core principles that have been central to how you play have led you to being given this the captain's armband which was quite there's lots of talk of it at the time because mcguire was the captain before you and it's quite typical atypical for the captain to be displaced while they're still at the club and for someone else to be brought in and as fans from the outside we wonder how mcguire takes that how harry reacts to that but also what that means to you to become captain of uh your dream club no obviously for me was was a strange time because i was not expecting you know uh tana called me to his office to speak with me and to ask me if i wanted to be the captain of the club because he had decided to change the captain and he wanted me to be to be the one to lead the team from now on uh obviously first thought was like very grateful i'm like something that i've never dreamed about you know like you you can have many dreams but you don't dream about being the captain you know like of your club and i think the second thought was like this is going to be tough on harry and the first person that i spoke with after i got out of that was harry because he knew already i think the manager spoke to him and before i said yes i went to speak with him uh because the manager basically made me the question if i wanted also like he didn't said like you're going to be the captain that's it point he asked me and i went to speak with harry and the first question i made was if he was leaving the club because obviously as you said it's not something normal i've never been through this in in my whole career and i spoke with him about that the offer that they gave it to me and he said yeah i'm going to be the captain of the to be honest to him and he said he said like if is there someone that that deserves that is you and i'm very very happy that is is you getting the captain armband that uh if if i have to take care of for myself i think you really deserve that and i think that was the point that made me understand i was doing things right you know uh obviously i know for him was very difficult and i don't think he would have said something bad even if he felt it uh to me but the way we spoke and the way i think i've been treating him through these years also in the same way of like i said straight away to him like you might have lost that armband but you're still one of our leaders and that won't change everything that we've been through because are you when he was the captain we always make decisions together also because i was one of them and that hasn't changed now because every time i have to do or take some decisions for the team i speak with certain players and harry is one of them that is always there and your performance this season speaks for itself uh you've won you've well you've done 34 appearances which i think is an achievement in and of itself because a lot of players aren't that consistent on the pitch um you've scored eight goals 20 assists you've got 12 player of the match awards which is the most by any player in the premier league six player of the month awards and only sergio aguero harry kane and muhammad salah have more all of them have seven and you've also won some matt busby's player of the year award for the fifth time the most by any other man united player and that's an award voted by the fans and there's other awards that i know you've won in recent times i saw you on stage the other day winning more awards what has what's happened what why why are you sudden you know you've had you've been consistent throughout the whole time since you've been at the club but this year seems to stand out for some reason no i think i think for this season first of all i think when the team shines the individual comes up and i think this season is being much better from the last let's say two seasons at the same time uh i think the assists record and all this going around made made me having a lot of headlines and and and stuff like that obviously it's an achievement that hasn't been done for any players just kevin de bruyne and thierry so i've got the little graph here it says yeah kevin de bruyne thierry actually spoke to thierry about this as well and he sends his regards to you congratulates you on um joining him up there and with with the record yeah it's it's something like that i'm very grateful for you know like we i put him i put my name in this in this case with them up there is something something that i've never dreamed about or thinking about i like i probably start thinking about that when i got probably into 16 17 assists i was like oh i'm i'm actually getting closer now but it was not something that was in my head because in my head is always improving my last season and getting better numbers better outputs better performance and was never in my mind that i would go to 18 19 20 or whatsoever uh but obviously when you start getting close you start thinking about a little bit and then all of us as fans start watching the games to see if you can do it and then and then obviously i think um i've been very consistent in terms of performance during my six years here but um probably other years were people that stand out that more than me and that's why i probably didn't got as much attention as i did this season with being captain and with being at the biggest club in the world i think in terms of fan base um with that comes pressure and responsibility the world talks about you you know no matter what industry you're in an occupational hazard of being at the very very top or the peak of your powers or being even better is more and more talk and you know i think especially because of this people are talking even more about bruno fernandez than i've ever seen you know my group chat i've got my united group chat and we're watching the game we're watching we're willing you to we were willing you to reach this record which you did and now because you're you know people are saying you're the player of the year in the premier league they're they're giving you all these big awards with that comes even more criticism and i think this is where your childhood has prepared you yeah but your dad sounds like your dad prepared you i wanted to i wanted to clear something up because it was on my mind um and i imagine it's frustrating for you which is when your words are twisted in the media and recently roy keen based on a quote he got completely backwards he claimed you said i should have shot but i made the passes and used that to suggest that you were chasing individual assist stats but everyone who actually listened to the interview including myself knows you said almost the exact opposite you were being self-critical of yourself and saying you should have passed the ball instead of shot because you wanted the best for your team and so interestingly because i've spoken to so many of your your players your you know your teammates over the last couple of days about you they also told me that this is the exact opposite of your mentality on the pitch and off the pitch and i know it must be frustrating for you your leadership style to be sort of misrepresented in that way how how do you respond to that like how do you deal with that when you hear it and you go that's not what i said yeah to be honest like i've always said i don't mind criticism i've always take criticism from everyone and anyone and i never replied to anything or whatsoever people have an opinion they think it's good but whatever what i don't like was when people lie about things and this case that you said about roy keen basically what he said is a lie because you can either either you saw some other interview or you saw some other interview or you saw some other interview or you can't say that i said one thing that i've just not said and luckily for me is everything on record imagine if he wasn't like then people will think like oh yeah bruno is is the guy always trying to go to the assist but one thing that is consistent is my number of creation is always the same so it's not that i've been trying to reach this now no i've been creating chances since i came to the premier league probably more than anyone else so he hasn't changed that my type of play or aim of play or way of playing hasn't changed since i came to the premier league it's not that this season probably roy keen saw someone like bruno creating more because he wanted the assist worker no he's seeing the same bruno that is about risky reward is about creating chances for his teammates is about getting the best out of the other ones because the thing is like you will get criticized in a way if you say if you're scoring goals you'll get criticized because you're not passing the ball and you're shooting if you if you if you're doing assists is because you're passing too much and you're not shooting to score goals so it's going to always be like that people will always make the the the balance the way they want they won't balance thing they will put it the way they want to the things to be and obviously i think i've always showed a lot of respect for for working and for everything is done for the club and for everything is is is um is always said i've never ever had something to say i've never said something wrong i even asked ole his number to text him to be honest to to to have a word with him to say like that i don't mind the criticism i don't like when people lie about things that i say because this is like it goes a little bit over the top of the things that i think uh are acceptable i accept the criticism i accept that he can say things that i don't like and i don't like to see it but as i said before that improves me uh what i don't like is that people make their own words on what i say and it's not true he can criticism criticizing me killing me say that i'm not good enough that i'm not a good captain for him that i'm not a good player for the club whatsoever it's bad it's okay i don't mind it's okay Is it an easy opinion? I like it. No, obviously, I prefer Roy Keane to. give me some praise sometimes because I've achieved something that not many players have achieved I understand that this club is about winning trophies I've never taken that off my mind I've always said in front of everyone that I want to in the Premier League and the Champions League I never said I wanted to be the best player in the Premier League never never one time any person has heard that Bruno wanted to get the assist record or get the goals record or get the player of the season or get being better than anyone else no Bruno wants the club to be successful Bruno wants the club to win trophies and that's all Bruno wants I accept his criticism I accept that he might like me as a player or not likes me as a person or not but what I don't like is that he puts words in my mouth that has not been said that's the only thing I don't like well I am I did actually ask your your teammates what you were like and I asked them on and off camera on and off the record I couldn't get some of them to be very serious but um what I what I received is lots and lots of voice notes from lots and lots of your your former players I text around uh last night and I'll play you what they said my friend Bruno taking this opportunity to spread some love to you I just wanted to take this opportunity to tell you how much we value you as a player and as a person I think not many people get to see how are you after the games and uh outside of the pitch so I would say that's one of your best qualities the way you care the way you one of the first to help everyone the leadership your consistency that's something that I take from from example and you know it it's been a lot of years together right now so hopefully this this can continue and we can win so many things and so much much more things together skipper Tom for me you're a world-class footballer consistently world-class as well um which is which is very difficult I think everyone knows that how good you are but I think more importantly from from my view is how you are as a human being and that's the side that not many people get to see you know the caring compassionate supporting demanding at the right times but yeah I think for me that that is by far and away probably your best quality that's why you're the leader of this team and such a good human being so for me proud to call you the captain of the team and I think that's one of the most important things about being a captain but more importantly a friend so top class I mean what he does on the pitch obviously speaks for itself but I mean away from football he's he's an unbelievable human being the way he treats people looks after people the way he lifts others when they need it and I feel like the respect he gives everyone around him that says everything about his his character and I feel like I've been lucky to spend a number of years with him and I've been lucky to spend a number of years with him and he's one of them people that you you kind of appreciate having around you every single day he's the type of player who makes people around him better without even trying we love you Capitano we love you Capitano I mean I had so many more but we just don't have the time yeah no it's just uh you know the standout from that for me is just uh the way they speak uh from me as a person I think it's just it's just it's just a person not more as a player you know like uh and you you picked some people that I'm very demanding on them you know like um Diogo and Luke as as being probably the players that have been more time with me Tom is probably up there with Harry Harry Luke Diogo and then Tom and these uh is people that I really respect a lot but as I said to you like it's not what they say about me as a player it's more what they say uh from me as as a person that uh that makes me very proud and very happy because uh you you can be a good player and I'm gonna meet a lot of good players in the in the world of football and you can train with a lot of them and meet them a lot but uh I think that uh what it stays at the end is like the way you behave as a person and I like to see that I have the good values that my parents showed me that's what I said at the start when you started describing what your parents had instilled in you back in Porto it sounded like what all your colleagues and your the players you play with said to me as well because I've done this before and people will say oh he's a great player he's amazing whatever but what was consistently true through all of those messages and there's so many more is they all chose to speak about you as a human yeah and that's clear that clearly comes from what whatever your parents did at a young age why does that mean so much to you I can see it in your face no because as I said to you uh I think as a player you can be as good and the way you treat people around you is the most important thing because you spend so much time with them that uh they kind of become part of your day by day you know like you see more often than and then I see my parents for example I obviously my wife and my kids is the people that I see the most but then after that it's them I don't see my friends from Portugal as often as them my parents my brother my sister I see more them and and the way I behave the way I've been raised the way I want to live my life is the way I want to live my life is the way I want to live my life and the way I want uh my kids to be is is the way they have they've said the things about me and this makes me very proud what what is that emotion I don't know it's just like uh it's good to hear that just just that it's so interesting because I don't think any anybody else that I've met would respond how you're responding to hearing people talk about you as a man and as a human I don't know I'm just a soft guy it doesn't look on a pitch but I'm quite quite a soft guy one thing I've learned from interviewing a lot of founders and building companies myself is that trust is the real currency of business it's the thing that gets customers to buy partners to say yes and investors to back you but as you grow trust stops being just a feeling and becomes something you have to prove because the bigger you get the more exposed you are customer data security expectations regulations and other things that you can't all of it and the risk of one small mistake becomes incredibly significant and if you've ever tried to scale while keeping on top of all of that you'll know it can become a full-time job but our sponsor Vanta automates your compliance processes and brings compliance risk and customer trust together through their AI powered platform and the companies already using Vanta say they spend 82 percent less time on audits because of Vanta's platform so if your organization wants to inject time back into building and growing make sure you head over to vanta.com slash diary that's vanta.com slash diary I've done almost 700 interviews with some of the most interesting people in the world and one of the things you learn which is unexpected is that vulnerability is the doorway to connection and after sitting here for two three hours with a guest I feel a deep sense of connection to them and as they leave what I get them to do is to write a question in the diary of a CEO we've taken all of the questions from the diary of a CEO we have put the question here on this card with the name of the person that wrote it so you can sit at home as I do with my fiancee and my colleagues at work and other people in my life whenever we get a minute we play the diary of a CEO conversation cards and it is incredible what happens these are great if you're in a romantic relationship and you want to connect your partner more these are also great if you're in a team and you want to bond your team together and I have to say they're also great for families that want to learn more about each other and that need a good excuse to spend some time in a digital world in the analog environment connecting human to human it is remarkable what the right question at the right time can do go to thediary.com and you can get these conversation cards right now one of the things I learned through my investigations is that you have a a clause in your contract and you don't have to confirm or deny this I'm not going to ask you to but what I what I discovered is that you have a clause in your contract which allows you to leave for a year and a half and you don't have to confirm or deny this I'm not going to ask you I was I found out 60 million and you chose not to leave Manchester United you got a very very very large financial offer I mean I've seen some of the numbers that are reported up to 200 million to leave Manchester United and you chose not to leave you could have rode off into the sunset you frankly I think the way you were playing you could have gone to almost any club in the world you could have got paid more and probably would have had a more certain guarantee of winning silverware and for some reason you chose to leave Manchester United and you chose not to leave Manchester United and you chose not to leave Manchester United and you chose not to leave when that offer came in reportedly from the Middle East that you know the big offer that we're hearing for a contract that was worth reportedly 200 million why didn't you go I said it before I I haven't fulfilled my dreams here you know at this club was that a conversation you had with your wife yeah also what was that conversation she seems to be there all the time when you make these big decisions oh of course she's the one probably I never make a decision by myself because obviously moving around nowadays with two kids as there's a lot to say obviously and more than I don't know become a most richest person in my hometown I want to live my dreams and pass through the values to my kids that they they need to have and my family is always going be the number one priority in everything i do because they followed my dream they they my wife obviously i know on the other side it looks great life obviously a lot of money good a lot of good things but she chose to live my dream with me and that says a lot about her because let's say that when she chose to do that i was 17 years old going to a club with one point like let's say uh oh you say 1500 you say 1500 yes a month uh in italy uh a lot of um uncertainty let's say she had uh her own life she had uh her own dreams and uh obviously she she said like i'm i'm gonna help you and uh that's what she did since uh since day one until now so she always has a say on everything i do and you've been with her since she was 16 you're 16 yeah 16 she was 16 now i was about to be 17 so more or less and uh and then after that we have we have constructed a beautiful family two beautiful kids yeah and so on that day when you get you get a big offer to leave manchester united she's the first person you speak to of course as always i spoke obviously first my agent because he speaks with me about the offer but then the first thing i did was call her and i was in uh uh i think was hong kong there we were uh like we went on the post-season tour and uh timing was not the best to talk with her because of time difference and everything but she was there again and uh what the words she said was like have you have you achieved everything you wanted to achieve in your career is this the next step you want to give for for your future and for your career like because obviously this is the league i want to be this is the best league in the world this is where i'm gonna enjoy my football as i'm not going to enjoy it in any other place so we we still have her dreams to fulfill why does that make you emotional i don't know talking about family it's uh it's tough just because um in the in the football career you go through a lot ups and downs and a lot of difficult moments and uh let's say the ones that suffered most of them because they see your good moments your bad moments your good things your bad things your good side your bad side also but uh they always stand by you so that's the most important thing you can have in life and she's always been there yeah she looks like my fiancee a little bit she's portuguese portuguese girl very down to earth i hear yeah she's she's the one that pushed me down to earth also when i'm probably getting too much or feeling too big she's always also very very tough on me to make me understand that's all the things to improve it's my let's say she's the second version of my dad probably that's why i chose her and she chose me in a certain way does she know this does she know have you been able to tell her yeah yeah i'm uh she's not she's gonna i can't say the word what she's gonna say after she sees this and she's me crying she's gonna say i'm very soft i won't say the word exactly let's say i'm the affection one you know the one that likes hugs that likes uh she's she's more i don't know she's she likes she's she i think she she's through her life she had uh she had many things going on and she built this thing around her that she doesn't need let's say she doesn't need much love or whatsoever but is there many moments where i know she needs i know she feels it i know she kind of like she's just like it's not good at saying what she feels and uh i'm more open i i show more my emotions i show more if i care if i don't care if i suffer if i don't suffer she she kind of closes a little bit for herself um but uh she's a very strong woman to be honest i know you have two beautiful kids together yeah she we have a beautiful girl that was the first one at the time we were in italy and then it came little gonzalo when we were in england so one say that she's always saying that she's half italian and one uh that basically looks like british is white blonde um and uh one half english let's say and then two full portuguese people i didn't realize your celebration where you you cover your ears is for your daughter yeah she covers her ears right yeah she used to do it when she was younger she's too old for that now she's a little i don't know be very very strong-minded very strong attitude she has a lot from me in the terms of uh being very strong and very she's like uh she can take care of herself very well it's exactly like her mom well i wanted to say thank you i'm a man united fan and hearing that you you know have gone through this very tumultuous period with the club where you could have gone where you've had many offers from many people to go and do something else and you've had offers where people offered you even more money and for whatever reason and i think it i now understand that it's a very strong relationship and i think it's a very strong relationship because i've understood your values that your parents instilled in you you chose to stay and to stick with us as a club and as a fan base so on behalf of myself and all of my friends at my united fans and the majesty night fan base i just wanted to say a huge thank you loyalty is increasingly rare these days in football um because people are often thinking about other things so as a man united fan thank you so much by doing that you've also taught me something as a man you've also taught me what loyalty is and i think it's a very strong relationship and i think it's a very strong relationship and i think it's a very strong relationship and i think it's a very strong relationship and how you treat other people and you've taught me a lesson about responsibility in my businesses in my relationships and in my life and i think this is a really important lesson because there are so many young men that look up to you and what you've said through the good and the bad times is that you keep on going you keep on going you keep on fighting you don't give up you don't quit and it's so great that the captain of the biggest club on earth has those values and puts those values before other things that might tempt someone with less integrity so i just wanted to say a huge thank you and i also am passing that on from many of your teammates who are very very very glad that you stayed okay thank you very much i really appreciate that that's very kind words from you and i hope you stay even longer because i think we're coming into an interesting period of manchester united where i think we have a lot of the sort of foundations in place now to carry on that's what i hope so and i think that's not the only thing that's going to change but i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future and i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future and i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future and i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future and i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future and i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future and i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future and i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future and i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future and i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future and i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future and i think that's going to be a big part of what's going to happen in the future huge gap between the manager and the ownership or the players and the ownership that usually enclose their structure they've i think from what i've had from players they've put that structure in place now how has it changed within eos's arrival no i think was first of all was important because as you said uh not that we didn't have a structure but was very difficult for players to understand where where they had to go to talk in certain situations that we were not very clear we should talk with and now I think it's very clear that you have Jason then you have Omar and then you have Sergim I'm very aware that now the structure that we have is a good foundation and a good base for us to understand where and which places we need to go if we need something as a club or as a players. Has it improved? We started the process with Ruben where we thought that would be a process of three four years that was the plan of the club then we know there was a break in a relationship there between the manager and the club and they had to change unfortunately and now they today they have announced that they want to go in the direction with Michael and hopefully for me I hope that he stays stable because the main thing the club needs is stability in terms of managing because if you really believe that Michael is the guy and you took him to the job I think you have to give him the foundations you need to build what things he needs for a successful team. the same time i think you brought someone in that knows what are the values of the club and i think that's the main thing and the most important thing that the club brings people in that know the values and know what's needed and have a great character to be at this club and michael's the guy yeah because as i said i think he's the one that knows the club better than any any player that here uh he's being probably more time at the club i've been with him as a manager assistant manager and then manager the way he behaves uh he shows that he has the character to be the manager of man united and think that's very important to have someone that in the the full process will know always where he wants to go where he wants to be and how much he wants this club to succeed you said to me earlier that since michael carrick has joined man united have won more points than any club in the premier league and that's statistically accurate for this to continue on and to continue going forward obviously the summer is going to be really really important you and i was talking to a few of the other players about this as well like diego what needs to happen this summer in your opinion for manchester united to continue to move up and potentially even fight for the title we need recruitment this is obviously we know we know like obviously we losing casimiro there is a pie vault pie vault thing that we had so we're going to need a player to replace him uh either is a player that is already in the house it is a player that's coming we need to reinforce the team to become stronger as a team not we need the best player in the world this or that no we need players that want to come to united to understand that we through a process that we want to win the league but it might not happen but this is the way we want to go to become the successful club that we were before so i think the recruitment has to be the right one we need to bring the right people in again as we did last summer i think in that ruben was great in the choices he made to bring the players he he did to to the club because he brought good characters good players and good professionals also and i think that's very important for the next one bruno we have a closing tradition on this podcast where the last guest leaves a question for the next guest not knowing who they're leaving the question for and the question that's been left for you is if we sat here in five years time and the five years that had just passed were a huge success what would have had to have happened huge success oh and let's say that i've i've won the premier league i've won the champions league with the club and uh we've brought got the odds we've brought the club back to the place he has to be in terms of club obviously in five years time i would like to be able to that's one of the gold ones too with my national team of course that's let's say that's my biggest goal in terms of career the world cup probably the world cup i would say because winning the premier league and the champions league with this club will be amazing but representing my nation will be all that i can do and i think that's what i'm always the biggest achievement i have in my career because not many players get to do that you know like uh representing your this is when you represent your people when you represent your parents your brother sister wife kids this is you you represent that small nation inside but in size but big in quality and big in in love and and fearless a fearless country that conquered the world many times in different ways and do it in a in in a football way will be will be a great achievement for us irrespective of what happens here and i i very much believe that manchester united has now the potential to go and challenge for these trophies here because of all the hard work that has been put in by many people in this club but also because of your loyalty um irrespective of what happens uh you're going to be a cult here at this club forever not not not irrespective of this stuff because i think you've done something which is even harder and even more rare in the modern world which is you've shown tremendous loyalty unbelievable character you've shown humanity and you've set an example for the club when we were at our weakest when we needed someone to do that the most it's all well and good doing it when everything's great it's all well and good but doing being that committed and that loyal and setting that much of an example and continuing to run on the pitch but also to be an exceptional human off the pitch when times are hard i think says even more about a man so again on behalf of the club i think it's a great achievement and i think it's a great achievement on behalf of all the man united fans a huge huge thank you and um please sign the contract when he's in the table bruno thank you thank you very much we're done thank you so much thank you you