Bob Lazar & Luigi Vendittelli - IPN Live Show Portland

(upbeat music) - Ladies and gentlemen, I am very, very excited about tonight 'cause we got a stacked card, as they would say in the UFC, really good undercard, solid main event. You guys have been left in the dark about who the guests are, 'cause there are multiple guests tonight. It's a really fun show. I'm glad you all made it out. You won't regret it. But to begin, I do want to bring some friends out here, really close friends. Some of my closest friends in this space, and they've been really welcoming, and they've been like brothers to me. One of them has a successful YouTube channel on sort of consciousness and philosophy, and the other one is a six-time US memory champion. Yeah, wild. So we're gonna have some really good conversations to get us started, ladies and gentlemen. Please put your hands together for none other than Michael Phillips from Third Eye Drops, and Nelson Delis. (applause) Grab a seat, oops. Grab a seat, any of those? I'm over here. Ah, let's get comfy. Don't mind the browser sign, baby. I'll tell you about it later. Ah, this is nice. This is nice. This feels like I'm in my living room here. It's very comfortable. Very cozy. So in a nutshell, in a small nutshell, we'll start with Nelson. Can you? I mean, you're an inspiration to me. I met you years ago when I was doing magic stuff, and I was desperate to increase my skill in magic. And I saw you on a Netflix special, and then I reached out to you because you had done these insane memory feats. This guy's memorized. He'll be humble about it, but he's memorized like 10,000 digits of pi. To give you a small hint on how hard that is, just to say the numbers, it could take them up to three hours. It's not fun. So strap yourselves in because Nelson, tell us about what you do. Yeah, so my whole stick is I learned how to memorize things. I never really had a good memory. My grandmother passed away from Alzheimer's, which was unfortunate, and a whole thing our family went through. But that was what inspired me to start working on my own memory. I didn't know what that meant, but I discovered that there are memory championships, and that people who compete in them trained their memories. I never thought that was a thing, but I was curious and learned how to do it and took it to the end level. And you won which memory championship of 2025? The most recent one was 24. 24. And then you stopped. Any plans on because you said you'd stop after five now, and then you did it again. I don't know if you were back there when I said it, but I'm going to compete in two weeks at the 26th championship. No way. Thank you Nelson. Yeah, and this year is Michael Philip needs no introduction. Also has a great memory, but for esoteric and deep philosophical western esotericism and a bunch of other wonder nuggets. Tell the audience for those of you who don't know about third eye drops, what it is you do. Oh my god, well, is this, is it not? Yeah, this is on right? Yes. What Chris said, I think, is a pretty good introduction. And all of that leaves into this topic of high weirdness and UFOs in a way that I love talking about. And I can't really help myself from talking about it over and over again. And it's funny that you call it you do a stick because it's really like the furthest thing from a stick. If that's a stick, I don't know what the hell I do. He's got an actual skill that he's developed like his brain is so huge. This is really fascinating. You guys, you guys, you've not done each other's like you haven't been on his pod. No, but it needs to have a lot of sure. Yeah, definitely needs to happen. You know what's interesting. There is like a correlation here while we're just like chatting away before we get moving on, but there is a correlation because like, I know there's a book called Moonwalking with Einstein, which is a great book, Josh Fowler. And it's this, yeah, all right, Josh Fowler is here. And there's, there's, it's this guy's a sports journalist who learns about memory athletes and then tries to compete and takes a year to practice and then enters the National Memory Championship and wins it. And he writes a book about it. It's amazing. But in there, he talks about the history of memory and how it goes back to like the Greeks as well, which you're very interested in. So I thought that was like an interesting connection there. Yeah, and I mean, back when I learned about that, that was the one story you'd always hear about the genesis of memory techniques. That there was this tale of Simonides was in a hall and he stepped out for a moment and the whole thing came crashing down. And when they were trying to identify the bodies of the people who are around the table, he used his memory and imagined their locations. And that's kind of what the classic memory tool that we use called the memory palace is based on. And so it goes back to the Greeks, but it goes even further back than that. I didn't know that until, you know, the last few years when I discovered that, but, you know, the Greeks use it, civilizations before that use it. Because they have to keep progressing their stories, their song lines, and it was all through memory. Yeah, very interesting. And now we don't need it because we have phones. So, you know, throw it out. It's not going to serve you. We got AI slop. We have vibe coding. Who needs memory? Speaking of which, do you guys like this little interactive thing we got going on? It's pretty cool. Something you might not know about Nelson as well, if you follow my channel you might, but this is actually something we all have in common. Nelson, first of all, got me. He is the reason I started Area 52, which is very cool. Like we were talking about remote viewing and how. So he was, it's a very strange story, but somebody reached out to him on a Facebook group that he was on a memory group. And it was like this guy recruiting people for like some hedge fund who wanted to train people to remove you the stock market. Memory athletes, memory athletes specifically. And so instantly I was like, whoa, like that's so compelling. You know, you're putting money, you're putting an actual number on this thing that I thought was not real. And, and they taught him. And he did fairly well. He has some like incredible hits. And then he taught me and I got so fascinated that I documented my journey. And I was going to post it on like my magic channel and I was like, this isn't for them. This is, they're not going to like it. You know, and they're not going to understand. They're not going to go deep enough. They're not going to go into the research. And so I started Area 52. And like so you're directly responsible for for the channel. So thank you Nelson. And that was a huge catalyst for me, too, because who's been watching Area 52 since the beginning, by the way. Those I want Chris to bring back those early investigations because I absolutely loved watching these to go down that rabbit hole of remote viewing. And that's actually what led me to reach out to Chris and asking to come on my show. And then that led to me going to Monroe Institute and both of us sort of having a body experiences and you having out of body experiences. So yeah, there's. Yeah, it's an interesting overlap. Yeah, there's like a like an interesting energy here that brought us all together. And I'm very happy that we we did make it here. Speaking of which, there is another interesting energy that we've attracted. And that's all of you. And I've asked you in an email to, you know, provide me with perhaps an experience that some of you have been through and a lot of you came through. Ton of submissions. So I want to thank you, first of all, for all of that. It's incredibly. Yeah, I mean, it's not lost on me that like it takes a lot to like share that and volunteer yourself. You know, to be to be a guest on this show. And I believe somebody who we chose is here tonight. I'm looking. Yep. And what's the gentleman's name? Yoni or Christie's. Salvatore. That's right. Salvatore is here tonight. Sorry, I forgot the name. There's I read through I think 30 submissions like literally some of you. Some of you wrote me a whole chapter. But very compelling. You know, nonetheless, I'd interview all of you. So thank you so much for everybody just actually putting yourselves out there. But I would love to bring out our guests a local from Oregon that has a story to tell. Let's give it up for Salvatore. Keep it going! I'm going for Salvatore, everybody. (audience cheering) You prefer Salvador or Salvatore? Am I saying it wrong? Salvatore or just Sal? Or just Sal, I like Sal. Sal seems like a chill guy. Salvatore, Sal, you had a really compelling story. You actually have like a lot of history with the phenomenon it seems like. And I wanna get into everything, but obviously, I might have to be a separate episode. Understandable. Yes, but I would like you, there's a story right at the top that you told, and I would love if you could share that with the audience tonight. Yes, it was September 30th, 2023, driving on Route 99 between Eugene, Oregon, and McMinville, Oregon, where I live. Shout out McMinville. Two lane highway. We had just gotten on doing a full moon ritual with some friends. And-- What? You don't gloss over that. (audience laughing) The hell does that mean? Like, what is this? I just was like, did you turn into a werewolf? I don't know what that means. What is a full moon ritual if you don't mind? For me, it's goddess orientated. And I have a minimum of 15 years of Western esoteric magic behind me. (audience cheering) Amazing. And at least five years of Shakhta Tantra behind me. Wow. Which I had no choice to go towards because as you discover what you're supposed to do on this planet, that's what you should do. Incredible. Very cool. It's not sure what the ritual is, but yeah, let's move on. (laughing) So we're driving north on 99, 99 W, it's called. And I notice at a certain point, there is a vehicle tailing me extremely hard with one headlight. And I always have a mantra on my mind while I drive. Though it's a dangerous thing to do because driving is not the time to go into any kind of a trans state or anything like that. You need to focus on the road. But it's just a mindful practice to always stay present. And I bring that up because that's my life. That's what I do. But anyhow, I'm driving my wife Natalie. Who is here next to me? To my right when the passengers are seated. It's dark out close to midnight between 11 and 12. And to the right, out of nowhere, there's a vehicle behind me like tailing me really hard. And just when I get to the point where I'm like, man, something doesn't seem right. Like, does this person wanna kill us? All of a sudden, a extremely bright green with a tiny bit of purple, but predominantly green, what looked like a comet exploded. Very low to the ground, just to our right. And I've seen multiple, the meteor shots. Yeah, the precise, like the meteor-seagant cross. It was big, close, it should have hit the ground. It lit everything up, like the whole inside of the vehicle. And what appeared from it, instead of smashing into the ground, was a silver, classic shaped flying saucer, which somewhat looked like that, but more seamless. Wow, more perfect. And it had all white lights flashing around it. I'm not good with noticing heights, like 100 feet, 300 feet. But if I had the guess, I'd say 100's too low, 400's too high, maybe a couple hundred feet to start. Just to our right. The whole situation lasted about a minute, which that's a long time. That's a very long time, yeah. And I don't think it left our view till we just couldn't see it anymore, because it's very pastoral that drive, but you get pockets of trees, a lot of farmland. And it slowly hovered towards, you know, our right away from us, starting very close to our right side. And, man, you know, as soon as that happened also, I noticed that that vehicle was not behind me anymore, and that was very strange to me, you know, like what happened to the vehicle? And that was a single light behind you, right? A single light. Yeah. And it was like a car from the 1980s. I don't know what. Interesting, you know. So the disc is in this clearing as you're moving past like these farmland trees, it's a silver, what time of day is it again? It's between 11 and 12 at night. Okay. Yeah. So it's pretty dark, but you're seeing it illuminated because of the lights that are on it, because of the white flashing lights that are flashing in a circular all around it. Oh, well, you know, and it was, to be more, I mean, I have pinpoint location, I can point you on a map or where this happened. And, you know, it was on Route 99, just past Monroe, Oregon, which is a town of a few hundred people, I mean. Yeah. Wow. I mean, give it up for Sal here. That's an amazing sighting. What did you do in that moment? Did you feel like I need to pull over? I need to keep going. Were you like, what was that? Like, what was the reaction and what happened after that? There was definitely a adrenaline spike when it happened. I mean, I don't care how much meditation you do. You know, this was very nuts and bolts on the ground. And I'm driving, you know. I don't care how many astral experiences you have, conscious outside of the body. You're driving, you've got to be focused. So, and I think that's what was out of all the amazing experiences I've had outside of being right here in the body. This was just so amazing. And my wife didn't want to talk about it at first. You know, she was just like, I need to process this, you know. And I said, look, we've got to talk about it, you know. And, I mean, there's, the conversations have not ceased in our small household. And that is, is she here with tonight? Is she? Oh, yes, yeah, good job. Shout out to the plus ones, by the way. Great time to call out the plus ones. Thank you, plus two's, everybody joining who's been dragged here against their will also. We appreciate you, we really do. And, you know, just suspend all the things that you have in your mind, the preconceived notions. Hang out with us in this weird little, you know, space. Thank you. But, yeah. That's really, that's really remarkable. But Michael, do you have a question? Yeah, well, two things come to mind for me right away is despite the fact that it was nuts and bolts. Do you think the fact that you were doing this ritual or the fact that it was a full moon could have something to do with it? Like, it makes me think of like, you know, John Keel talking about window areas, or they're being like these times where the veil is thinner, where things may be able to like poke through or something. Did you get that kind of a sense? Absolutely, because, yeah, there's no doubt about it, that, you know, and, you know, I was kind of, when I told this story to Mufon when they interviewed me. Oh, you reported this? I did, absolutely. Very cool, okay. It took a little courage, you know? Like, it took me a little time. Oh, good for you, yeah. But, it's like, I couldn't get through the interview without bringing up my spiritual work, because I spend a lot of time in a temple space, you know? I sacrifice fun times for that, but the temple space becomes fun times, even though it seems boring. But, there's just no doubt about it. And I've had prior experiences, you know, that kind of prove that. And I mean, I could literally talk all day if I get too much into that, but the short answer is definitely yes. So, the moon has something to do with thinning the veil, is that what? Well, I mean, that's kind of just, like, common lore, right? That, like, when it's a full moon, there's, like, sort of a yes. Yes, that, the moon. But, also, do you, do you only do ritual during the full moon? No, no, no, no, do you, do you do ritual? Do you sit there as boring as it is and do it when you don't feel like it? How much energy and time do you put into it? And these things do thin the veil. So, it's like, you can't stop these practices, you know? The, the, the, the building. of the astral body and learning what that is is only the beginning. You can't stop, you know, it has to go on. Before it, was there anything leading up before that big event? Was there any small things that evening that were like off or different? Well, as I've slightly alluded to or somewhat alluded to, it's like, yes, because it's part of my life to do these practices and it's led to experiencing that reality is more than just us sitting here with these physical objects right now. But that phenomenon with the UFO is the last thing I expected to come out of this. You know, I mean, yeah, you're expecting something perhaps non-physical to interact with you or something maybe a little more subtle as synchronicity or something perhaps not a physical nuts and bolts silver disk. That's pretty, I mean, that's yeah. But it has, I agree. I think, you know, it would be all too strange for it not to be related. Do you know what I mean? It makes more sense in this case that it is related. I would think. Yeah. I was going to ask, you know, it's been three years right? Since that happened afterwards, were there any other notable kind of somewhat seemingly relatable events that happened maybe after as a residual effect? Absolutely. And without even getting into that second incident, just on that drive for one, there have been more than one experience of us both seeing simultaneously white or green orbs vertically shooting out of the sky straight down and they would despair behind trees. Also, well, maybe this is getting a little too far in the weeds here, but I mean, we're the right spot. These are the weeds people. We are the, we are people of the weed, both in perhaps metaphorical and, you know, literal sense. It's just Portland. All right. There was an evening at home after a night of ritual and offerings in my own home temple space that I then laid down and continued with my mantra work. And a lot of things that happened for me, astrally, are between the point of wake and sleep. A lot of other people, it's after that four or five hours where you hit the REM cycle. For me, it's that point between wake and sleep. And I'm doing my mantra, which is Sanskrit, feminine Sanskrit, beja words, basically. I won't say what they are. They won't understand it. So I'll get, I'll speak Sanskrit, beja go ahead. And I become conscious and then in between space and I'm seeing through my ceiling. And I knew I was seeing through the ceiling of my bedroom because there was about one third of the ceiling to my left, left. So I wasn't hovering outside of the roof. I was still like level with my bed, my consciousness. And I look up in the sky and I see what looks like a white star. It's dark, right? And I say to myself in the state of lucidity, right? Oh, it's a star. As soon as I said that, it moved and came closer to me and got bigger. And then just to the left of it, one of those white orbs shot down right next to it. So that brought a lot together. That was a moment of bringing my spiritual work together with this phenomenon. Right. What you had seen with your eyes in the objective physical realm, you now also had some non-physical confirmation of what that was. Exactly. Very cool. So do you believe that that thing that went down in the physical projection of it was some type of spiritual or non-physical thing sort of bleeding into this reality? Is that fair to say? It's exactly what I'm getting at. And what do you think that is? Well, it's definitely intelligent. I can't say exactly what it is. I could speak with a little bit more certainty of my actual spiritual work than this, but even though it's bleeding into that, it's intelligent, likely much more intelligent than I am. That's for sure. Incredible. You're a very fascinating person, Salvador. I give it up for this guy. I'm very interested in everything you're saying. Obviously, so much to share. Do you have somewhere where people could contact you if they wanted to or if they wanted to know more about your practices? That's something you share or is that something you keep close to the chest? I don't have any channels to reach me. But I do have a lot of experience with Kabala and Archangelic planetary magic. That was my Western practice. If you had to direct someone like me who's a complete like lame and muggle in this world, I'm very like I barely did my toes into any of that. You've probably gone a lot deeper. Obviously, a lot of this than I have, where would you direct me to start learning about this? Where would I go? Well, that's a big question. That's why I ask. There's so many books to read. I don't have a classical education. I spent years, I would break up my sleep and read these books and do ritual, and I'd wake up, I'd sleep at three hours, and there's a lot of books. Francis Barrett, the mages, the heptomeran was the first three books of a cult philosophy. The fourth book is the one that the heptomeran's in. But there's just so much. You need to build a library. I actually still read physical books. Yeah, same. Physical audio books. No, yeah, I love reading too. It has to be a passion. It has to be something you truly want to need to know that there's more to this planet than what they're trying to get us to believe it is. I think you're on to something, Sal. Ladies and gentlemen, please warm round of applause for this very great man. Awesome story. Thank you so much. Thank you to Huxer. Thank you, man. Give it up for Sal, guys, come on. Wow. Wow. Look at us starting off with all the all the layups, all the easy stuff, right? He's an into it. No, flying saucers. I mean, this was 2023, I think you said, or yeah, 23. Flying. That's why he's here. That's why we brought him. What's the 800s number of pie? All right, sorry. Seven. I'm not going to look it up. Is it, though? One attention. Yeah, yeah, one attend. No, but like it is wild because you don't hear very much about flying saucers, you know, in the 2020s and on. And so I'm I'm very happy to know that there's still here. That's like, that sustains me. What do you guys make of this? I wonder why I never have those experiences. Yeah, I would love to have that experience. But you've had like an astral experience, yes, but not a nuts and bolts thing. Like that as a kid, I always grew up wanting to see the craft, a craft of something, you know, I've definitely seen some, you know, questionable shapes and lights and stuff. But yeah, there was somebody who said this. It was on one of these recent shows that we did. I forget who it was, but it was like, if you're not sure that it's a UFO, then it's probably not a UFO. And I tend to side with that, right? Because if I see a light doing a movement and it's like a it's a triangle or something, it's like, yeah, I don't know what that is. I can I can tell you what it's not, but I don't know all the variables. And so I'm always there's always a part of me that's like, ah, I just, my mind can't go to that's definitively an alien or whatever. But a flying saucer is one of those things where I'd be like, yeah, that's it, that's it, that's the one that's undeniable. But you had a triangle go over your house. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But again, you know, and military, there's like, you know what I mean? Like I have a, I have a sneaking feeling and not maybe not all of them, you know, because there are, you know, Bashar, Daryl Enke, I interviewed him in Los Angeles a few nights ago. And his encounters in 73 of which there was two was the same triangular craft. Witnessed by multiple people with like the lights on the ends and the one in the middle. And You know, part of me thinks that like in five, 10 years from now or maybe 2027 or whatever, like government's going to say, "Oh, it was us." And it's going to like kind of negate everybody's sighting, even though maybe some of those triangles are not the government, but I feel like that's what's going to happen. It's kind of like the stealth bomber, like, you know, there was like legend of like this, you know, anomalous, undetectable craft. But yeah. You know what that makes me think of like the closest link. Does anyone read secret machines, the first book, the God's book? That's one of the ones Leventa did. And there's a whole chapter in that book about the relationship between like western esoteric magic and the flying saucer, and he makes a direct, you know, correspondence between like the magic circle and the flying saucer. And I'm going to get parts of this wrap wrong, but it's something to the effect of like, maybe the flying saucer is some kind of manifestation of the magic circle, whether it's like someone doing rituals in our dimension or someone in a different dimension, doing rituals that they're like in the car doing a ritual. Yeah, right. Yeah, exactly. So I mean, you know, you see like the 2D versions of these magic circles in these grimoires, like the haptameron or like lesser key of Solomon or like whatever. And it's kind of like the idea of, you know, you're within that space when you're doing this ritual. And that's like keeping you protected with like angelic names and secret names of God and stuff like that. So maybe it's also like projecting something somewhere else and it's manifesting some kind of saucer manifestation, I don't know. Yeah. The one thing that sure is I don't know. Yeah. But you would think they'd be, they'd look more Gothic in that case, I feel like they would be less mid-century modern. Yeah. That is true. That is true. They look very like Swedish design, like these things or something, you know what I mean? Yeah, Scandinavian UFOs or like, I mean, this sports model, you know what I mean? Like this thing was like, when I first saw that craft, like even like the Billy Meyer photos and it's like, it's a beautiful vehicle. Like it's a, like objectively, it's a beautiful design. Like this is like the Lamborghini, this is like the classic car of UFOs, you know. So whoever, if it was them that designed it. There is, there is design, they have culture. Unless it's completely based on just geometrics and I'm wrong and then that's why it's appealing to me. I don't know. But it's timeless too, right? Yeah. It was the same pictures that we have from the early 40s and 50s. Yeah. The same, like it still feels like futuristic. It does. Yeah. Yeah. From somewhere else, you know. Yeah, it does. Still has that Jetson vibe to it. Yeah. Side note, I always, I hated the way that in the Jetsons they had like, they had a remote that did everything. I just had one red button on it. And like that was the future I wanted. And now I have a remote with 300 buttons on it. And I have like a 20 page leaflet on what my remote does and it opens up a menu with 400 other buttons on it. And like, this is not what we were promised. There was some where we signed up for it. We want the metal button with a little antenna, you know, a little red button and you just does everything. It washes you. All right. Anyways, I digress. Um. I was going to ask Michael, have you ever had an experience in the sky? Not like that. You know, and oddly enough, the one, the closest thing I've had to a UFO experience, it's not that exciting of a story. So I'll tell it in like the shortest version. It's that light that I saw above Monroe Institute that I think I told you about, like it, and it's so weird that it happened there. But um, within probably 15 minutes of getting to Monroe Institute for anyone that's seen pictures or has been there, there's like this big rose quartz and people are just kind of attracted to this rose quartz because it's a big novel thing and you know, it's supposed to have these, um, great properties to it. So you want to be close to it. Um, so long story short, me and two other participants are standing out there. We had just met and we all see this like just a light in the sky that sort of looks like a star or something, but it's a middle of the day. But then it goes away and then it reappears like a little bit further like in a different direction, but it's clearly the same thing. And this just happened like three or four times and I actually did film it, but it just, it doesn't look like that much on your phone. But yeah, that was strange. That's like the one thing I've seen that I truly don't know what it was and I, I can't explain what it was. It just was really like a light that was behaving strange and like disappearing and reappearing. Yeah. And you know what the thing that strikes me about those particular sightings is I've had a few of those as well is what makes them so special is the timing. You know, if I'm just out there, you know, seeing something in my car and I was like, that's a weird light or whatever. That's one thing. But when you're actively like, like you said, you're near this crystal you're on rather certain energy, you know, after last year, it was like a few weeks after my father passed. And I was with my brother, my younger brother and I was going home at the time he was living beside me. We pull up in our driveway at the same time and we get out and I say, Hey, what were you doing? He goes, I was just going through dad's stuff. You know, we were like going through his, you know, old stuff and I was like, Oh, cool. And as I'm talking to him, I see a flash behind his, like his head and I go, dude, I just saw like something in the sky flash. And both of us walk into the middle of the street where we get like a better view of the sky and we're just kind of standing there sort of reminiscing. And I literally, and like I haven't shared this and I film this video, it's wild to me. And I go, you know, Hey, dad, if you're there, show us something. And I'm not kidding. This light just appears on the horizon and it starts getting bigger, but it looks like it's coming towards us. And it's like lower than like a satellite or a plane, it's much bigger and I'm like scared. And I turn to my brother and I'm like, you see that? My brother is very skeptical of this stuff and he's like, Oh my God, oh my God, oh my God. And I'm like, yeah, and I pull my phone out and he's like, yeah, good thinking, good thinking. He didn't even think to get his phone. I'm like, I'm going to get my phone. And I start filming this and it's like kind, it's big, it's a big light. And then all of a sudden it starts going up and then it kind of fizzles out. And we were both there. My brother to this day would be like, dude, I don't believe in this stuff, but that was real. Like that was real. He does. And I don't know what that is. But again, on video, you see a light that gets brighter and it goes up, but it's like, okay. It's like unimpressive, but it's the timing of like asking for it. I was in a very like emotional state, so as he and like, it happened then. So it amplified it for me, but yeah, it's on video, I'm really like, what is it, you know? This kind of how it is. I think it's time we bring out our first guest for the night. You guys don't know who we're going to be. Our guest here tonight is someone who is become a very dear friend of mine. He's an amazing person. He's very knowledgeable. I had him on the podcast recently and he is a creative person. He's a director. And someone who works very closely with Bob Lazar. This is my good friend, director of S4, the Bob Lazar. He's for it. Luigi Benditelli. Guys, give it up. I have a seat, Luigi. Very, very happy to have you here, Luigi. Thank you for having me. It's so funny with Luigi, because we've been friends for a few years now. We live actually like 40 minutes away, and so we're always hanging out and talking to each other, calling each other. When I asked you to come on the podcast, you've been on before and I've interviewed you before and we talked about all sorts of stuff, Bob and whatever, but I knew you had a story that no one else knew about. And I was like, unless you were drinking wine with them at contact with the dentist. That's right. You heard the story, too. That's right. I remember that. You heard it, too. Didn't you? No. You heard it on the podcast. I've heard pieces of it. Yeah. Not in full until then. It's one of those things where like, when you started telling me this, we were there for like five hours going through this story and I was like, "This is blowing." It's like the Da Vinci code. Yeah. Yeah. It's. So you're going to go ahead and tell a story. No. No. No. No. No. What was that response like? I have. For you. Yeah. That's what we talked about. I didn't know we were going to talk about that when you invited me on the show. So I went on the podcast, we were supposed to have a conversation. The film was just out. Yeah. The Bob Lazar film was just out. It's something like, "Okay, we're going to talk about that." You cut it off pretty fast. You said, "All right. Enough about Bob." I want to talk about what you've been, so I was like, all right, you know, done a lot of stuff and then you mentioned You know, would you be willing to talk about the story with Sarah and Lily and all that and I thought okay and Never that I expect the response in my entire I think it's like 38 years involved in this and you know Finally talking about this in cool environments for like maybe what like four years or whatever the amount of messages and and People reaching out was the biggest I've a far past surpassed the Bob was our you know film People reaching out to me. This was like on another level So so I I called Chris and I was like dude This is this is just it's just insane So that story hit a nerve. It definitely did how many of you watched the podcast with Luigi grab applause It's It's really hard to abbreviate the story and I know there are a lot of plus ones that are like what is this story? Jeez, I don't even abbreviate that it's so hard, but go ahead I want it. Yeah. Yeah, so you guys are here until like midnight, right? So yeah, you could do that So yeah, it's it's it's the craziest stuff. Yeah, so essentially I mean in a very very tight nut shell Yep, I I don't know for for those of you actually I do want to say something for those of you who watched it I made a mistake during that podcast and I I mentioned something about a cat Some cat energy a lot of people wrote about that you know, and they were and people were like what about the cat energy And I forgot to finish my sentence when we were doing that and a lot of comments were like what about the cat? So I just want to talk about the cat for a second so that sure puts that to rest Yeah, also guys if you haven't noticed you can participate with emojis like we're encouraging our phones and stuff So you you haven't I didn't mention it before. I'm sorry, but like if you feel like you want to like partake throw up some emojis There you go. Look, that's cool. You some you don't believe in throw up a red flag show a red flag do whatever you want All right, that's cool. Yeah, I could see them there. So So for all of you know the story There was a girl named Sarah that was in Montreal and she was in my house and she said there's an energy of a cat in the house and I said I don't I don't have a cat never had a cat You know, I was allergic to cats and I was like no there's no cat So I forgot to finish this but after Sarah left Montreal and went back to Great Britain The day after was Halloween so I was in Montreal and I was driving back home and I Get to my house and there's a cat on at my door and this never happened before I've been living there all my life And did never happen before and I was like that's weird and this it's a white cat with some black spots And it's clawing at my door and I thought I wasn't thinking about Sarah I was just like who's what's the cat? You know, so I'm like okay, you know move the cat Try to get into my house the cat would run and try to get into the house and I'm like No, so I move the cat try to open the door real fast the cat really would want it like go into the house I'm like no as I grab the cat put it further away. I'm like stay I Open the door and the cat ran some like All right, let's say open the door and let the cat in Now as a cat in my house, then I'm not thinking about Sarah and the cats, you know going around the house everywhere Figuring out what this house is and and I'm figure I'm like freaking cat in my house now What do I do and I'm allergic to cats? So I was like I can't have the cat along, you know I love cats by the way, they're my favorite animal, but I I'm allergic to them so it had a collar and I had a little you know something and There's something really funny about this because My friend Lisa who's part of this story as well nickname me something many years back You know, I think you remember this butchoo butchoo. Yeah, in French Canadian This is going to sound really crazy, but in French Canadian it means cabbage patch doll okay No, I see it and and the reason why she nicknamed me butchoo is because She's six three and I'm three foot six so So she calls me butchoo Now the way Lisa if you if you remember in the story we put up a picture of her as well, right, and there's a whole background There's a whole story. She's six three Insane. Yeah stunning looks like exactly like the Nordic, you know, yeah, type and Also has a wilds very very Get into one day. Yeah, that's another story. Yeah, and and so I Grab the cat and I I wanted to read the caller and it said butchoo on the caller and I'm like what are the chances of that? so I call there's a phone number I call it's a lady that was living a few blocks from my house and I call her and she says Oh my god, my cat never ran away. This is the first time. I can't believe you found it Please can you bring it back? She's an older woman. I said absolutely. I found I can't remember what I found But I put the cat and I brought her about the cat back and I got back home and I thought that was weird and Hit me when I went back home. I'm like, wait a minute That's what Sarah said there was a cat in my house There's a cat energy and I found that just weird because it's like why would she have said there's an energy of a cat in this house When there was never that was the first cat that ever came into my house. That was just weird. Yeah So very another another weird part of that story. Now does it does it mean anything? We don't know. It's probably nothing. I'll see myself. Sorry. That's a crazy synchronicity. I mean Yeah, it's a while and the fact that the cat's name was butchoo. It's like that's that time. Yeah, it was weird. Yeah, so yeah Yeah, synchronicities are are for me. I mean, they're a wonderful way of sort of living your life. I found and I think that's something that we all haven't gone Probably a lot of you that are here as well. It's like you you there's that there's a dichotomy of what a coincidence is on the logical side and what a Synchronicity is and the beauty of it is there is a duality In this comparison because the coincidence like the synchronicity is by definition of coincidence, right? That's what it is. You're like oh, it's coincidence. That is the definition of a coincidence But you can live your life thinking that everything's a coincidence or You could live your life looking at it as a synchronicity. So a coincidence but with meaning and What I found is that if you decide to live this more magical Existence then more magical things seem to happen and and that's just been true for me. Yeah And it's been it's been fun to practice I want to I want to go over to Nelson actually because Nelson you have a wild Relationship with synchronicity as well. Yeah, it's it's really ramped up in the last few years since kind of connecting with you and this world a little more I just find dimes everywhere Specifically and my brothers in the crowd and he's the most skeptical person of this kind of thing So he's like oh anybody can find a dime, but I haven't found a dime. Yeah, okay. I don't know what you're talking about I you've told me this before and I'm like maybe once in my life I don't remember finding a dime right you have a jar this high. Yeah, that's like filled with dimes and and when I started noticing them more Which was after my retreat at Monroe and two two years ago or so? I was getting a lot of finding a lot of them and it was the timing that made it even crazier each time I find one It wasn't just like oh, there's one it was like there's one when I was kind of thinking about one or or asking for one or Looking for an answer to a question and there it was in front of me the moment after I mentally set up to myself and I realized also that in my life I've always found them. I just kind of said. Oh, yeah I'm I find dimes and it's it's a good omen, but I realize like they've always been in my life I remember my brother's too young for this, but when I lived in France we grew up in Europe traveling around lived in a house out of power outside of Paris and I remember in the ground I was just playing in the dirt and I found an old dime From I must have been from like 1910 or something And I always love that school, but like now that I think about it. What the heck is a dime doing in France in my yard, right? So it's was it was it by chance one of those old dimes. It has like the wing headed. No, okay It just says one dime on the front. Okay. I think it says yeah Yeah, I think it's just I think it's just says ten cents on on the front. It's one of the old old ones I keep it in a box in my pants offs, but yeah good. I was gonna say this it's actually Synchronous that you bring this up because has any any Robert Anton Wilson fans in the crowd he in one of his books It might be Prometheus Rising, I'm not sure, but he's one of these very mercurial esoteric authors who's, you know, he's having UFO experiences and thinking he might be in contact with some intelligence from serious, but he's also very logical and agnostic about it all and is willing to go through all the different possibilities, but one of the thought experiments and one of his books is to try to manifest quarters on the ground. And basically, he encourages you to say, "Try it where you're manifesting it or synchronously discovering them, and now try it where you're just convinced it's only your own attention." So he's not telling you which one it is, but he's encouraging you to play with these different modalities and ways of experiencing things. And one of them happens to be that, like finding coins in the ground, yeah. Very cool, and Nelson also, you know, he's got a physics background as well, and he's a very, you know, I think, by the very nature, you are a skeptical person, not a skeptic, but like you look at things and try to rationalize them, but when you find them, what do you do with them? Well, I log them, I keep track of what day it was, what was happening that day, if it was heads or tails, I also keep track of how I interact or find other coins, right, because I'm not just blind to the dimes, sometimes I find a penny, like anyone might, right? People find things to do, yeah. And I do find pennies, I do find quarters, I do find nickels, but statistically it's always more predominantly dimes. And more heads or tails, that's one thing I've been keeping track of more, and it's mostly tails, I buy how much? I'd have to look at that, I'm still collecting data, but I'd say probably like 80%. Like what? Wow. But it drives me wild, because then I find one heads and I'm like, what do I mean? Is tails good? I'm trying to figure that out, trying to map it to what outcomes are happening. You know, I think tails is a good, so I mean, I think they're all kind of basically a wink to me from whatever it is that I'm on the right path, right? Well, it's like the alchemist, yeah, right? He had these in the book by Apollo Quella, like he had the stones that he would just ask like that one time. Right, this question, right? It was like yes or no, and that was kind of like heads or tails. And what about the years you log this as well? I do log the years, I haven't really noticed a pattern yet, but you know, I've had ones that go all the way back to early 1900s, I have ones that I just got one the other day, it's like the new minted ones from 2026, they look brand new, they're amazing. That's really exciting about that. I don't know, that blows my mind because I don't find dines, and I have, if you look at our chat history, it's like after a while, I was like cool, he sends me, I have 30 photos of dines, of just like, oh, another one, and it's just him pointing to a dime. And he's like, oh, man, I was just at the racetrack today, and I removed you the color pink. And so I bet on the pink course, and I usually put five bucks, but I found a dime. And so I put 50, now $1,500. Yeah, this is the Belmont stakes was being held as one of the big race races of the year. I live in Saratoga Springs, and we have a little racetrack, but they were holding it there that year, and I found a dime on the way to make a bet. And I do a weekly remote viewing thing for horse racing specifically, but I don't really bet on it. It's just to gather data and, you know, see how I'm performing, but this, I'm at the track, the Belmont stakes is big race. It's like, okay, and I go over to the cashier, you know, it's old timey, put the cashier where you say what you want, who's going to win, you do trifecta, the box, whatever. I don't really understand all that stuff, and I don't even understand horse racing. I just see a color, and I put my money on it as the winner. And I've got pretty good results, but this one I knew, I knew that black was going to win, and I was thinking to myself, what, what, I usually put like ten bucks, you know, I'm not a big gambler, but I was like, I know that this horse is going to win, I should put a lot. But, you know, you temper your expectations, and you're like, no, I should be responsible, I don't want to put all my money. So I put 50, right, it was huge. But it's a weird feeling, knowing something's going to happen, and that dime was the thing that kind of like, let me know, and the race was insane. If you want to look back, it was 2024, the Belmont stakes, this horse, nobody was saying its name for a winner, and it was last place, last place, last place, and just earned its way up. It was won by the tip of its nose, a doorknob, and I remember being like, yes, pin drop, nobody ever, everybody was like, who would that be a doorknob? Except for the owners, they were happy. Yeah, I was like, I won like 1200 bucks, it was crazy. It was a weird feeling. Imagine if you were a gambler? Dude, yeah. Think about how much money you lost that day, doesn't it? That's a fascinating story, that's incredible. But if I can, I have something about synchronicities that happened to me, when I was a kid, my grandfather used to work in a flower market, and you always used to take a red carnation, he would cut it, and he would put it over his left ear. That was his trademark. I grew up, my grandfather always having a red carnation cut short over his left ear. So that was like, as a kid, I knew he would have a flower. When he died, I was named after him, so when he died, I started finding cut red carnations in the street. So I have them in a box, they're all in a box, and at a certain point, I moved to China, and I lived in China for a while, and it was my birthday, and I was in Southern Canton Province, and we were in this different city, and I was staying in this apartment hotel type of place, and I was on the 17th floor. Nobody was staying on the 17th floor, it was just me, it was a really nice place, and so my business partner was there, he brought his family and his girlfriends families, because it was my birthday, and the door, somebody knocked on the door, and I opened the door, and it was his girlfriend with a small red carnation in her hand. And I'm looking at her, and it was Tracy, I said, "Tracy, where did you get that?" She goes, "Right here in front of the door." I'm like, "What? There was no flowers in the building, I made it a thing to go like, where are the flowers?" I go, "There's no way." And I went down in the lobby, there was no flowers. How did that red carnation get there? And to close off the whole, you know, synchronicity, years later, my father passed away, and on the day of his funeral, it was a monster snowstorm in Montreal, I mean, mega snowstorm, okay? And everybody was in the funeral home, at the end, everybody left, and I've got these bags, I had a bunch of stuff, it was the wake, a bunch of stuff, and I'm walking away. Everybody went to this exit to the right of the funeral home. I, for some reason, I have no clue why I did this, I decided to take the long way out of the funeral home. I don't know why, and I was carrying stuff, so it was like no logic to what I did. I just did it because I felt like not going where everybody was going. And I went to another door, I was the only guy there, and one of the guys working there saw me carrying all these bags, so he just opened the door for me. And as I walk out, the parking lot, because all the cars were on the other side, so the parking lot was a perfect white, there was no cars that driven, so it was like perfect white snow. And right far in the center, I see this red little thing, I swear, I walked all the way there, and it was a little red carnation on the snow. May God strike me that, I saw that, I still have it. And it's like, what does that mean? That is the very definition of a synchronicity. That's what I mean. You can say coincidence, but this clearly has a very deep meaning. And Michael is going to explain exactly, in a way, even though it's an unanswerable question, it's also the most softball question, because this is something I've done multiple videos on, something I've deep dove on in terms of what it could mean, what the confirmation bias aspects of it are, what the history of the idea is. And of course, I think this is a super old idea that's gone by many names, right? But it's in a modern sense, it's coined by Carl Jung, the famous psychiatrist, and we actually had a weird, it's very strange actually that we're spending so much time in this show, like totally unscripted talking about synchronicities, because they came up when we were looking at those books today in this, like we were walking earlier today, going to a camera store. And we stumbled across this little, like, not yard sale, exactly, but it was in like a driveway somewhere, it was just random stuff for sale. And we're looking at random books, I'm like, oh, it's kind of synchronous synchronous that we found this book in that book. And then right when we left, there was a giant picture of a beetle, just a giant picture of a beetle. And for anyone that knows Carl Jung, his most famous story is a beetle synchronicity story. So it's just super weird to be talking about synchronicities earlier today, seeing the beetle. Now we're talking in an extended unscripted fashion about synchronicities. It's just weird. And ultimately, you know, he was kind of ambivalent about what it meant. But he was smart enough to warn against, you know, like this is ripe for like confirmation bias and flights of fancy and like thinking that you're controlling reality. And he was saying that ego shouldn't think that it's driving synchronicity. But what he believed is that it's like we're stumbling across what the ancients would have called sympathy. So in these ancient esoteric systems, most of them believed in sympathies. Like there are these, this was like invisible language of nature. And to be like a magician was to understand those symbols and understand how to manipulate those symbols. So I think what it is is it's that fat, that nebulous, psychical faculty that we have that's always like rubbing up against the transcendent. And we don't really know how or why things happen, but they do happen. And we see the meaning. And it's oftentimes like they're just beyond explanation, far beyond chance. So I think it's like we're rubbing up against that dimension of meaning, you know, and when you do certain things, it again, sends that boundary. That's what I think at least. I knew you could do it. Before we move on, we do have a special message. Now, as many of you know, Luigi did do a documentary, and it's a bit of a big deal. It's called S4, the Bob Lazarus story. It was number one on Amazon. It is now free to stream on prime. And it's like trending, which is amazing. People are watching it. If you haven't seen it and if you're a plus one, maybe don't start there. Maybe start with like something a little like, no, seriously go watch it. It's amazing. Congratulations again. It's just such a fun. Yeah. I got to you know, witness the inception and the creation and every step along the way. And it was just such a delight to well, I mean, at times, you know, it was ups and downs, you know, making a and I'm going to say this again. I want everybody to know that I myself, my team, everyone, thank you, Chris Ramsey. Because if it wasn't for this guy, we wouldn't have made it all the way to the finish line. So thanks man. All right. I appreciate that. Thank you. I appreciate it. But your our friend, Bob Lazarus, kind enough to send us a little video for you guys tonight. So Yone, if you don't mind, we got a little little video. Hey guys, good to see you. Sorry, I just can't make it. I guess got too much stuff going on here. We got fires nearby and all that stuff. Well, the man himself and himself. Well, give it up for Bob Lazarus. You know, too bad he could have made it tonight, but he wish he could be there. He's dealing with some fires and stuff and he's got like horses and whatnot, but you know, nice of them to. Wait a second. What's that? What's that sound? Ladies and gentlemen, our next guest tonight and resident of Oregon, Mr. Robert Scott Lazarus. [Applause] [Music] [Applause] I made it. So you made it. I'm a little curious. Round of applause. Did we fool you with that video? No. Wait too smart. Yeah, we got to work on that, Bob. We got to work on our magic trick a little more. Thank you for being here. No problem. Good to be here. So currently trending once again on Amazon. Is the story of S for the Bob Lazarus story? How has the response been for you since this movie came out? How, you know, obviously you've had people reach out and you've seen some response online. How has that been so far for you? Oh, it's been a tremendous response. I mean, it's really changed my life, really. It's the first time I don't really have to explain what happened to me. I can just point to Luigi or refer to S for and said, you know, here it is, but it's amazing how well it was done and it's really changed the whole dynamics. Yeah, it's one of those movies where, you know, even someone who's, you know, I've seen all the documentaries on your life up to this point, all of the recordings, all of the YouTube videos, you know, and like many others, we're always just, we want a little more. We're always like, you know, there's got to be, there's got to be more to the story. And I'm sure you're like, no, that's it. That's it. Here you go. But then Luigi makes this, you know, movie. And you guys, all of a sudden, gave us more. More than we thought could ever, you know, sort of be conjured up from this. You gave us a physical sort of representation. Well, a picture's worth a thousand words. I mean, that's what it is. How many times can you tell the same story over and over? But if you're able to show everything exactly the way it was, it takes on a whole new dimension. Yeah, absolutely. Luigi, quick question for you. When doing this and like, okay, you got out there, you made this movie. How do you feel with, you know, once this is out there, it's being received. What's your gestalt on this? Like, how was that received for you being someone who's, you know, you're going up against the biggest story almost in, in UFO history. This is a monumental task to tell a story in this way, specifically and very accurately. Once that was all done, how did that feel for you? Well, that was the, the first, well, the first thing was I always felt a certain degree of extreme responsibility because I knew how incredibly controversial the story was, how a lot of people pay so much attention to every single thing Bob would say. And I reading all the stuff throughout the years online and you read so much misinformation, not, not purposeful, sometimes just people explaining it the wrong way. So it was important to make sure that everything was 100% what Bob said he saw so that at least there was the, the starting point was accurate. If you wanted to argue the story, at least you're starting on the right track. And when that, when the film came out, obviously, I was nervous. Are people going to like it? It's the first time I make a film. So I was really worried that, you know, I liked it, but are people going to like it? And it ended up being a good film. And people were, thank you. And the people were responding saying, finally, we finally understand what he saw and what the story was all about. And that was really rewarding for me, for my team, because, and I felt happy that I was able to deliver that in a, in a digestible format. Yeah, monumental task. And you did, you did it, you did it justice, I think. I wanted to follow up with you, Bob, because the last time, you know, you appeared on my channel, you know, we had kept this secret for almost a year. I had, you know, when I interviewed you the second time on my channel, most people don't know this, but you were there that day to shoot an episode with Travis Walton. Oh, right, right. Yeah, we had done so. If you look at the interview that I did with Travis Walton and the second interview I did with Bob, you'll notice I have a clock in the skiff and has a date on it. And it's the same date. So like, those some of you clued in or like, wait, it's the same, because it's very subtle. But that's also why those podcasts were shorter, because, you know, they, they were spent. They were, they just had a, you know, 19 coffees in the diner. And I felt, I was like, my heart's gonna explode. Like, did this, get this coffee away from me. But yeah, we kind of like kept that for a while. And after the second interview, after the first interview, there's an extra like seven minutes of that interview, that kind of like, wasn't really recorded like we stopped sound. And then like, we just kept talking. And you would said to me, you said, man, you know, I'd really love to meet Travis Walton. You said, really interesting Luigi talks about him a lot. And he's someone that, you know, I feel is very credible. And some, I'm, I just want another letter on the crossword puzzle. I just want, you know, It'll be nice to talk to them. And I said, "Bob, I. " I'd move mountains to make that happen. And with Luigi's help, and I even remember a texting and be like, what if he did this in a diner in like the 50s and like you were like, hell yeah, that sounds really cool, you know? And I was like, say less. And I built, I remember sending you pictures like that. And then you know, bring it down. And I get you to sit down and for in my opinion, one of the most legendary conversations just over coffee and pie. What was that experience like for you? How did you feel about it? And how did you feel after getting to speak with Travis Walton? Well, it was great. For some reason, I just always wanted to talk to Travis. I mean, one of the reasons was, I saw the movie they made and Travis hated it. He said it had nothing to do with what happened to me. I heard so many conflicting stories. And I just wanted to hear it from the guy. And you know, just to meet him, to ask him questions and just to see what he really meant, what he really went through was, that was really cool. I mean, that was, that was a great experience. Did you walk away feeling like, did it raise your conviction level on his story? Yeah, it did, yeah. Yeah, you always get a different feeling when you're hearing it, you know, directly from the horse's mouth, as opposed to a repeated story or a movie or something like that. But yeah, there's just something about. And, you know, Travis had said the craft he saw looked almost identical to the sport model. So I wanted to quiz him on things, because he got to walk inside. He saw it from different angles. And it was just really interesting to get feedback from him. So, yeah, it meant a lot to me. So thanks again for making that out of me. My pleasure. You know, it was interesting, too, because we were, I remember we were sitting together. So like, you guys didn't actually me for the first time on camera, it was like very, we spent some time together the night before, because you were both just eager to meet each other. I kind of wanted to keep you separate and like, have that meeting happen. I was like, no, this needs to be, you know, these guys need to talk to each other. And we were sat down at the office all together, just conversing and like, we kept making a joke. I'm like, we should have filmed this conversation. But at one point, you start, you're like, Travis, what about the arches? And I'm like, hold on, hold on. I'm like, we can't cross this line. I'm like, we got to keep something for tomorrow. I remember feeling really bad about that, because I wanted to stop you. But you did have a burning question about those arches. And what was Travis's response to that? He doesn't, does he remember seeing them? That was kind of nebulous. His, he says, I do kind of recall something like that. But it's, you know, Travis said a lot more important things to concentrate on when it was there, like trying to get away. But, you know, the archways are significant to the operation of the craft, because they're waveguides. And I kind of explained that to Travis. And it kind of took him back, you know, to where he remembered there was something along those lines. But I mean, it couldn't give me a definite answer if it was exactly the same. But I really did want to know that if the craft-- and he was in more than one, if they all had that kind of construction on the inside. If you could, because you, by the way, you did a great job interviewing Travis, which is what it ended up being. Because I didn't know how I was going to go. I was like, hey, you're just going to, I'm going to leave you guys to it. We're going to set up the cameras. We actually left to the room and kind of just like set the waitress in. And like, we didn't want to, I didn't want to like push it in any way. I had that little briefcase with your files, which is a fun little touch. But if you had to, because I think you had pretty good interview skills, I think you're a pretty good interviewer. I don't think so. No, I actually, to be completely candid, I think you're way more comfortable interviewing people. Like, I've seen you on multiple interviews. I've interviewed you, like even now. But I think you as an interviewer, like, you were really good at letting people talk. Not like I'm being out. I'm probably more comfortable interviewing someone than being interviewed. Yeah, I feel like I'm great with that. Who would you interview if you had a chance? Now, I'll let you go maybe dead or alive. Anybody, if you could sit down with somebody for two hours at the flying saucer. I mean, we're just talking about UFO related? You know what? One UFO related and one not UFO related. Oh, man. How much time do I have? I don't know. I can't spontaneously come up with an answer. All right, we'll come back to it. I will produce an answer in the next five minutes. Amazing. In the meantime, Michael Nelson, do you guys have any questions? Yeah, I do, for sure. I've heard a bunch of your interviews, and I love that you stick to what you know and what you saw directly. But I'm really interested in the relationship between the phenomenon and consciousness. And you often hear from experienceders that there's like this uncanny aspect to a lot of these sightings. Like the guy, I don't know if you heard the experience who was up here earlier, but he had been literally doing like a full moon ritual before having like a classical UFO, like disc shape UFO appear in front of them. And there's just so many, you know, stories to this effect, whether it's like instant communication between these beings and the experience or whatever. So I'm just curious, when you were especially in contact with the craft, but even secondarily, were you exposed at all to anything having to do with this weird relationship between consciousness and the craft or consciousness and the beings and-- I was not, but I do have a friend that is so convinced that there is consciousness attached to the craft in some way. I mean, he goes into the construction of the brain, microtubules, and I mean, how they-- and these topics are only just being touched on now in depth. I'm sure you've-- you're familiar with that. And he swears that he's got this figured out and consciousness is a substantial part of how everything works in unison. And I mean, to the point where he'll just call me like, it's 6 o'clock in the morning, because he's been thinking about this, and I stopped taking his calls once and a while. You know, I just-- I can't wake up and start thinking about that. It takes me a while, but he's a great guy, a brilliant guy. And, you know, but I didn't have any direct connection to that. I didn't see any evidence of that. But he is slowly convincing me that that's the case. Interesting, interesting. Did you get any sense that there could be a special relationship between the brain and the craft itself in terms of how it's piloted or interacted with? It has to be something along those lines, because there's no physical controls. So I mean, look, it's not that-- you know, if we talked about that in 50s and 60s about some kind of mental control, it sounds like something from Star Trek, but now it's no big deal. You really can, you know, control relatively complicated systems in that way. But there has to be how else is the craft controlled? Unless it has something to do with the top level, which I have never had access to or had information on. So interesting. All right. Yep. Please. Are you familiar with the professor from-- I think it's MIT, Rudy Child. One more time? Rudy Child? I don't think so. Yeah. He is a professor from MIT as astrophysicist, if I'm not wrong, and was interviewed by George Napp at one time. And he says he spoke to somebody who had been on the program. And he was in favor of Bob Lazar. And was explaining that he is convinced that there was some type of mental connection between the occupant and the craft. And there was some type of communication he had heard between some academics or some scientists that had been involved in the program. That was how this thing function, that there was a connection to the machine with our brain. This is a guy who's got a lot of credentials at MIT, who came out publicly talking about this. Obviously, not a lot of people like to bring it out in the public. He's an older guy. But I spoke to him. I'm in communication with him. Very, very smart guy. So you should look into that. It's really interesting. I definitely will. Yeah. Yeah. I've always wanted to ask you about this just because obviously I have a fascination with memory. And you're in this position where you've been telling the story that happened to you so long ago and you've had the say it over and over again and, you know, people have gone on and told your story for you or done documentaries about it, and then, you know, this gentleman comes along and is sitting with you painstakingly going through all these memories to rebuild them. I would imagine that, I'm already amazed at how you were able to go into those depths and find the detail to construct something that was so detailed. But it must have been because of bringing out those details that brought back the memories if that's what you're going to have. That's what I'm getting to. So, like, as you're coming up with probably something that's hard to describe and probably fading a little bit, you build it a little bit. I'm sure that kind of revitalizes or helps kind of job in the way. Yeah, it absolutely did. I wish I had an example that I can remember, but that occurred, and in fact, I think it was setting up the lab or something in there. Yeah. You know, we'd put it on the computer, essentially, walk in there and, you know, turn around and wait, there's a door missing, and, you know, there's absolutely a door there. And, you know, by walking through it, I think that even happened in the big hanger, too. It was just once you see yourself there, you can kind of see what's missing. Yeah. What memory dropped out. Yeah. But it also says that the memory is still in there. It just needed the connecting fabric to get there, which was, you know, seeing a basic interesting structure, but missing the door, and then suddenly now you have the door, and I'm sure that just seeing that door probably unlocks some other details, right? Yeah. I think it happened all through it in different levels of intensity. Yeah. The things were big, and, you know, I remember the light in the tripod light in the craft, you know, how the cable coming out and you're like, oh, yeah, it was orange. Yeah, the extension cord. Yeah. The extension cord, because you're like, he would always tell us, look out for the cables, you know. Yeah, yeah. There was also something else, a big container that the blue liquid, what is this? There is a big container, which is called a Windex, it looks like a big container of Windex. And what does it do? I have no idea. It was just there. It had nothing to do with what we were doing, and I had just forgotten about it until, you know, we started putting the lab together, and well, it was the lab came together. You remember? Yeah. You remember the door right away. It was instant. As he walks into the lab, the first thing Bob says is, wait, there's a door that's missing, right, to the right. It was instant. And I remember going, well, wait, why would there be a door there? It goes to the hanger, and you said, yeah, that's where we went. And immediately was like, okay, that opened up a whole other thing, because then when you're in the hanger, you had the adjacent hanger door, and there was little doors in there. And you said, wait, there's a missing door in that big door. And everything started cascading, and his memory was just coming right back. And I compared it to when you look at, you know, if ever you bring out an album, old photos, and you look at, let's say, a picture of your own house when you were a kid, and you see one thing, and you go, oh, yeah, and then suddenly everything starts coming back. Same thing. You're in a place where you can't go back. And so, the difference is, is that, at least the photo is, it's an actual photo you took. The thing you created is not real. You've built it from him, and it's kind of like this recursive loop that just rebuilt his own. Yeah, right, yeah. It's pretty cool. It's like a virtual memory palace. Booster, yeah. Or, yeah. It's like a mind palace. Yeah, I've heard of that. Yeah. But it is interesting too, because spatial memory is like our strongest memory, isn't it? That's what I was telling you earlier, how I remember all these digits of pi, it was placing them in this memory palace and how powerful it is for humans to remember spatial information. So, it's not surprising that-- We do. Why? You shouldn't recruit it, Nelson, to help-- That's true, yeah. That's true, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, just like Nelson just holding Bob's head, and he was like, come on, it's in there. All right. Yeah, think harder, Bob. I still can't believe you can remember 10,000 digits of pi. It's not that crazy. Yes, it is. Yeah. Yeah. It's not that hard. It's not that hard. I did have one more question about memory again, but is there any memory that you're aware that you've forgotten just because of time that's passed and it's faded that you wish you remembered more? Oh, good question. I know that's occurred, but I don't remember. You know, I remember. That's your answer, yeah. What-- maybe like the documents, is there like-- is there was a lot of documents they had you remember? No, you know, I really-- I know a lot of people focus on those because, come on, all the answers are there. But, like, that's when I first got into the project, and I was just going through these things. They probably just sighted and even know if they were real. So I just flipped through them quick, oh, really? Okay. And, you know, that was that. And I never got to look at them again. So-- Yeah, that would be fun to go back into that mind-palace. Yeah. If I could remember what I saw on each page, that would be kind of cool. Yeah, there's something in the works. That's all I'll say. All right? All right. Interesting. We won't pry. We'll be polite. Yeah, go ahead. I was going to say Bob looked surprised when he said that. There is. It used to me. I am surprised. Yeah. You know, one of the things I wanted to say about memory and today's technology, because you said, you know, I built something that wasn't real, that is like a loop where it makes him remember something. And one of the things that I hope that comes, and I'm obviously myself, my team, always at the very forefront of learning about technology and what we have as tools. And AI is obviously the biggest thing that's arrived is revolutionizing the world, whether we like it or not. It's here and it's not going to go away. But I would love to see, and hopefully we are able to make the existing computing equipment that we have able to do it. How cool would it be if we could basically speak to AI, like we speak to chat or whatever we speak to, whoever decides to speak to something, we're speaking to a robot these days. And imagine saying to a robot, and you're looking at a screen, and you want to build your high school from your memory and see how accurate AI can start building it in 3D while you're talking. And that would start opening up your memory to things and how accurate could it get where we start building our memories visually in front of us. I would love to see that in the next ten years. In the black mirror, yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, you did that in a way, terrifying, heavy thought about who you'd like to interview yet. Yeah, I'm sorry that it's going to sound so typical, but I'm still going to have to go back to Einstein just because of where he was on gravity. Oh, well, let's set it up next time or episode, it's going to be a tough one, but we'll make it happen. We need to get selfies for a backup here to do some rituals and we'll get back to you. Just give me a good old shovel, I guess, and a potion, I don't know. Is there anyone in the UFO field that you feel like that you'd like to interview one more time? I don't really know the UFO field. What about John Lear? Would you go back and if you could sit down with John more time? I've sat down with John a lot. What's the craziest thing John Lear has ever told you? Oh my god, oh my god, yeah, let's go, and we're going to clip it right there, but what is like the most insane thing that he's told you because he's said some stuff? Okay, we can go on for a while, that the sun is not hot, it's just that the atmosphere of the sun's on fire, but the, you know, the globe itself is solid, there's people living on it, and the same thing with Venus, there are people there, and I say, "When does the crazy park start?" Yeah, we're getting there, we're getting there, I mean, John Lear had so many crazy ideas that The thing is John was a great guy, I really liked him. But he had no BS filter at all, and like I said before, he could have a four-star general come in and say, "Hey, I've got to have an instrument formation here for you," and he'd file it, and then he can have this literally happened. A neighbor girl came over and she said, "I can see radio waves," and he said, "Okay, and you know, he put some bolts together and they both have equal weight," and I said, "Well, that's crazy John," and he said, "No, it's not, she said she can see radio," as I said, "All right, all right, well let's get a walkie-talkie, I will bring one over, and she can sit there, and I'll key it, and you know, she won't be able to see it, and she can tell me when she sees radio waves, and she doesn't," and I said, "That's a fair test," he said, "No, you can't do a test like that," but there are so many crazy things. But within all the crazy things, like he would still talk to, like for example, a four-star general. So he had new context, really did, partially because of his father, and he wasn't a very accomplished pilot, he had every flying certificate and world record you could possibly have. But as time went on, he just started thinking in a nonlinear fashion, you know, it's just different. Yeah, he's, I mean, clearly there's some unhinged theories around John there, but also, he would still talk about things like the MJ-12 documents or like the Aztec crash and stuff like that. Yeah, to him there were supposedly hundreds of UFO crashes, which just doesn't make sense. He also said, "In the Nellis mountain range, there's over a billion aliens that live inside there." And it's, you know, "Where do they ever come out?" I mean, how can you not see a billion of anything? But he just had so many crazy ideas, but he had a lot of great information too, knew a lot of, you know, prominent people. Yeah, I have a feeling if anyone could get some novel and, you know, good information out of him. It would be you in an interview, so I mean, yeah, definitely. But yeah, of course, if I may ask you, if you could have, you already have about Rushmore of guests on the diner talking to each other, who would you, ideally, love to have next? I mean, there's a few, there's a few, like, alive, like, yeah, yeah, otherwise, strange podcasts. Yeah. Yeah. One of us isn't drinking coffee, you know, I guess I'll get the bill. I would say there's a few, like, on the celebrity side, I'd love to interview Dan Acquardt. I think it's totally underrated. He's, did Joe Rogan want? He's into Crystal Skulls, he has obviously his Crystal Skull vodka, but his whole family has a history of, like, paranormal things. He's got a book coming out soon, which I can't wait to read, and he's a very fascinating person, a Canadian, as well, so definitely Dan Acquardt, but also on the more sort of UFO side of things, I think, man, huh? Jacques Vallet, yeah, that's a deep cut, I think, definitely Jacques Vallet, I'm hoping to make that happen, actually, eventually, yeah. You know, I know he's, you know, he's getting up there and he's not really traveling, I think he's done doing, like, public appearances and stuff, and so, yeah, I would love to, even, even, honestly, he's one of those people who, even off the record, off camera, I would just love to, like, yeah, he's like the closest thing to, like, a shaman we have in, like, this ufology business, like, he's been to more encounter sites than, I think, anyone else, he's intertwined with some of the most interesting people and events in the last, like, you know, whatever, decades, it's really, really, you know, this guy helped invent, like, the internet, like, you know what I mean, like, he's, he's just a really, really special guy, I think him and then Dan Burish, I think, could be the other one, so, but, yeah, and also, I believe in Canada, Dan Burish, so, you know, love to make that Dan, if you're watching, if you're at home, you know, or Marcia. Yeah, he has to come out. He's got a, I mean, but, you know, that's one of those ones as well, where it's like, I'm just going to let you talk, and you guys decide, like, not going to weigh in on this one. And I think, here's another, here's a controversial one, and this interview is coming out next week for you guys, so, um, I interviewed for four hours, I sat down with Richard Dodie, I already hear the comments on this video, they have at it, um, gotta say, very affable guy, it's in his interest to be affable, I understand, but, um, the, the conversation was fascinating, we got through a lot of stuff, it's one of those, like, suspend your disbelief, like, you know, giant rocks, grain assault, um, but, uh, very interesting, nonetheless, those are, yeah, that's a little sneak peek. How about you? If you had to talk to somebody in this field, oh, I probably tomed along just because I'm a huge blank fan, but I just love to hear him spew all his stuff. Yeah. Nice. Um, Michael, I mean, if we could, if we could find him, uh, General McCastlands, McCastlands and, and LeVenda together would be insane, yeah, like, I just, someone, someone who really knows what's going on behind the scenes at a very high level who, like, you know, oversees like the woo saps, like the way to acknowledge special access programs doesn't have any compartmentalization, talking to someone who has, like, the crazy philosophical chops, you know, and, like, seeing how all of that would come together, that would be kind of the missing link is like, we hear about the nuts and bolts, we hear about, like, the soft sciences, and there is, like, what joins those two things together is, like, this weird, uh, Greek mythology or something. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Plus, you know, he'll specifically talk about these programs, craft, bodies, but then he'll say, you know, space craft, but that's not the correct parlance and he'll, and he'll talk about interdimensional stuff in interviews as well. And it's like, how does all this fit together? Like, how did the, the bodies and the craft and the, what, you know, it's just, it's all these, this constellation of super fascinating things that you could guess how they might connect, but you're just not sure. Yeah, and also, um, they're doing that probably to not say the thing because then we all think it's the thing, right? So they're trying to be purposefully nebulous, like, like, you know, you'll say things like, oh, it's non-human biologics and like, they're like, okay, so like, plant spit, like, what are we talking about? Like, no, no, it's non-human intelligence. So the dolphins and cats are like, like, there's no term that, like, correctly vaguely describes everything. It's, it's funny hearing, like, grush specifically, like, oh, like, they're bipedal plasmoids and you're like, so we got to call the ghost busters, I guess, now, like, I got to, you know, these, these things all sound very strange, you know, but yeah, they're, we can't put a, we can't put a thing on it until we know what it is because then or else, everybody thinks it's, you know, Martians or Venetians or whatever it is, or people in the sun. Um, the witch has dispensated, um, all right, I think it's time to, we got a few questions, we asked you guys to, and you guys probably didn't know the guests were here today, but we'll get through the questions and maybe we'll throw some your way as well. Uh, you only do you want to pull those up? All right, perfect. All right, here Bob, do you mind if I join you? All right, all right. Um, okay, the number one question, do you think everything is related to IE UFO's paranormal ancient civilization? This is by agent angel, Bob, I'll start with you, do you think it's all related? It's a very generalized question. Yeah, uh, very possibly, very possibly. Yep. I think we're all in agreement, we're all in agreement. Very possibly. Okay, um, okay, this one, I felt like Michael had something more, I got, I got a better one for Michael here anyway. These are all Michael questions, by the way, agent, Mr. Kim asks, is physical reality a manifestation of consciousness? I mean, do you want the short answer or the long answer? I mean, I, I'm a big fan of idealist philosophy, which posits that consciousness is like, Brown. level of being, of course, for anybody who's ever heard me talk for more than two minutes. There's a good chance that that's what I was talking about. So I'm a fan of that theory, yes? Yeah, okay. Okay. I like this question. Do the visitors listen to human music? Whoa. And why wouldn't they? Luigi. They have to. They've created it. If they're here, they pretty much, they're bopping, you know? They know the music. Yeah. Maybe that's why they're here. Who knows? Maybe they're making the music. You get there. Actually, you know, artists, the muse. I mean, Kanye is. The diamond. The Demiers. Right? Kanye is pretty weird. I mean, he could be an alien. That's true. Yeah. They're at least familiar with it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, they would have to go. That's so. Maybe they're like, ew. I don't know. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. The next question is. Yeah, go ahead. Is the Sasquatch real? Slash coming to get me? Oh, it's there. Yeah. The Sasquatch is interesting, because we are in Sasquatch Country. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Are you guys all fans of The Squatch? Um, I have no idea. Uh, I'm going to leave it up. I think you've got some good takes on the Sasquatch. Sure. Well, first of all, I live near Whitehall, New York, which is, we got the big foot over where we are. Uh, you guys call them Sasquatch. Um, but I've traveled a lot to Nepal and done some mountain climbs, and they have, of course, the Yeti. Um, one of our investigative reports at the beginning, uh, was since I traveled there. I was going to, and I did, which haven't kind of put it together, but filmed, uh, kind of it, as much as I could, a deep dive into Yeti lore, uh, over there, um, in Nepal, which was really interesting, especially in the Sherpa community, the, the, the local to live near Mount Everest. They, it's funny. I would bring it up. I was asking everybody, have you ever seen a Yeti? Have you ever seen footprints, blah, blah, blah. And they would say, they laugh, don't be silly. And then they'd stop laughing and be like, they'd tell me a story where they knew somebody who had seen footprints or had an experience or their father had told them stories. And so there was this kind of, uh, pervasive lore that existed within the community that had been around for centuries. And they, I think deep down, truly believed that this being existed. Was the real proof I'd never really got to the bottom of it, but it seemed like they all had this story of something out in the wild that they had encountered. And they didn't know what it was. And I feel like that's also kind of similar to what I got out of people in the area where I live when I ask about people who were kind of well versed in the Bigfoot lore. I don't know what it's like out here with Sasquatch. But I think there's kind of like this unknown that people like to have to, to kind of encapsulate the things that they can't fully describe. And I think Bigfoot is one of those things, the Eddie Sasquatch, whatever you call it. So do I think it's real? I think yes, in some sense, I don't know if the actual being that we, the, the, the cryptid that we're talking about is the, is actually out there. I could be wrong. I don't know. But this is just my feeling that it's more of a concept that we, like an archetype. Yeah. Yeah, like a subconscious archetype of something, some type of projection that we're putting on to the unknown, a round of applause who here believes that they have seen the Sasquatch. All right. That's not applause, one more time. Round of applause, who's seen the Sasquatch? That's not nobody. That's kind of very interesting. Has anybody seen, there's a guy on Instagram who claims that he has like a Sasquatch corpse? Oh God. Yeah. Basically everybody was like calling bullshit on it and he's like, I will saw through it. Yeah. And show you the cross section. And then he did. And he's like, got a picture of himself with this cross section of a giant Sasquatch. Aren't they getting, aren't the pieces very big or weird or is it just me like, they're huge. Oh, yeah. The head he has is gigantic. Yeah, it's like, gotta be, it's like at least the size of his torso or like, from here to it's, yeah, it's big. I appreciate the hustle, you know. Yeah. It's tough to make a living on social media, dude, you gotta like, get out there and decapitate a Sasquatch. It's a lot of work. I think for a lot of people, like the cryptid conversation is a very slippery one and it's like an area they don't want to go. And from, I'm kind of one of those people that's much more skeptical of that. But you hear stories about like, skin walker, when to go, moth man. And it's like, you know, John Keel was also very reluctant to believe it as well. But he would always talk about these things happening in concert with one another. Like, again, these window areas, these times where it would just be a huge uptick and all kinds of weird sightings of like, of creatures of, of craft wolf man or like, yeah, I mean, all the skin walker ranch stuff. It's, yeah, there's a lot. Yeah. I was just going to throw it over to Bob, curious to know what you think about cryptids. Like, what's, is that ever crossed your mind or are you like, I'll believe it when I see it. Like, what's your take? I don't know. I'll believe it when I see it. Yeah. Yeah. You don't believe any of those old, old video, you know, where he's like, everybody knows I'm doing this. You know, like, you know, this video. Yeah. I just haven't seen enough evidence, I mean, but you know, if you're talking more along the lines of skin walker, you know, is that I'm a little more, I lean a little more that way. Really? Yeah, I've known that not my personal experience, but I have a lot of faith in George Nappu's research that for a long time. And I knew Bob Bigelow, who owned the skin walker ranch and looked the reason he sold it was because he's, you know, petrified of what's there. And, you know, they've had other physicist and, you know, the research of the place and have entities have followed him back home. And, you know, even, even George was concerned about the thing, but it's just because I, you know, trust the opinion to these people and I don't think I'll be going there. That was my next question. Yeah. You wouldn't stay overnight. No, no, no. There's no reason to do that. You've heard about the hitchhiker effect and like all that stuff. Yeah. Not like in that at all. I don't know. I'd be good. The question, like, is it worth the risk to potentially see something? Wow. Yeah. I mean, I've talked to Brandon Fugel, like I've texted him, and like, I'm ready. I'd go. I mean, why not? Nice knowing you, though, but bring some stuff home. Yeah. Who knows? Who knows what that stuff is? Really? I also had Ben Woodruff. He was a biologist on Skinwalker Ranch. He did hired. He has a great interview and Ben's a lovely person and he's also like a falconier and he's like, he just, he loves studying sort of paleontology and, you know, all this, all the stuff, but he's found tons of anomalous things regarding the biological side of things, like the plants that are affected, the animals that are affected, like, for instance, the mammals that are, like, bigger than a mouse, when they find them or any animal for that matter, they don't decay at all. They stay limp. They don't even go hard. There's no rigamortis. They had a rabbit, I believe, that was there for three months or a skunk, three months. No decay. It literally did not decay and they were studying it. It was so fresh. Blood in it after three months. This is unheard of, completely impossible. And the second they took it off the ranch, it started decomposing. And so then they're like, is there something there? What if we bring in a dead animal, will it, like, and how does it affect human life? Like, there's all these questions because the cows as well, they die and nothing eats them. Like nothing, no ant, nothing goes near them. They're like, we're not, you know, like a lot of mutilation stuff. So yeah, very strange stuff. Maybe I won't go. I don't know. But that's really all we have time for, unfortunately. Tonight, folks, we've gone over our time. Thank you. I want to start by thanking my co-hosts. Thank you so much, Nelson. Pleasure. Being here. Thank you all. Go check out Nelson's work. He has a YouTube channel as well where he teaches memory techniques. He also has a book called "Remember it," which literally will help you remember things. And then he's got another one called "Everyday Genius" that just came out. It's a great book as well. So thank you, Nelson. My friend over here, my good compatriot and fellow cohort in the, you know, phenomenon realm. Michael Philip from Third Eye Drops, thank you so much. (audience applauds) So nice to have you explaining all the things that I don't understand, it's really, and Nelson just remembering it, it's awesome. Thank you, Luigi Vendetelli, for everything you've done. (audience applauds) Thank you. Thank everybody. And thank you to the man of the hour, Mr. Bob Lazar. (audience applauds) I do wanna say, Bob, I've thanked you before for everything you've done, but this, what we've created here is very special. This is very cool, and I do not say this lightly. I don't think I would be here if it wasn't for you, like on this stage, I wouldn't be here. And I don't think we would have this if it wasn't for you, like we're looking at the sports model that you're like, you are a massive, massive part of this. And so if nothing else, if we don't get answers, if we don't get government disclosure, if we don't get any of that, we got each other, we got this community, and that for me is more than enough. So thank you so much for allowing us to be here today. I know you're welcome. Thank you. I thank you to you guys in Portland. You guys have been absolutely amazing. Best crowd so far. We love you so much. Have an awesome and amazing night and a safe trip home. Good night, guys. (audience cheers) (gentle music) [MUSIC]