Arun Gupta on Bringing Silicon Valley’s Spirit to Public Service

[MUSIC] We think about what we're doing is not creating a pipeline of public servants. We're creating a community of dual citizens, public private sector citizens, people that ultimately understand the language of both, the culture of both, and have networks in both, and in doing that we rebuild trust. Welcome back to Talks at GS, where we speak with pioneering leaders about their careers and the future of their fields. In a live conversation, Goldman Sachs' John Mallory joined Arun Gupta, CEO of the Noble Reach Foundation. This episode was recorded on June 5th, 2026 at Goldman Sachs headquarters in New York City. Let's tune in now. Good morning everybody. I'm John Mallory. I co-head our wealth management business here at Goldman Sachs, and on behalf of all my Goldman Sachs colleagues, welcome to Arun Gupta, who's joining us today I've gotten to know Arun, and the work that he and Noble Reach are doing and Arun was a very, very accomplished venture capitalist for many, many years, a couple of decades. He spent time as a professor, both at Stanford and at Georgetown, and he is a best-selling author of a couple of different books, including one that's on the best-seller list right now. So I'm looking forward to diving into some of that with you. Thanks for being here, Arun. John, thank you for having me, thank you to David Partners at Goldman. You guys have been great partners at Nobriage. And we hope to be for years to come. So let's just get into it because there's probably varying levels of understanding about sort of what the Nobriage mission is all about. And maybe you could just start there and tell us a little bit about it. As John said, I was in venture capital for 25 plus years, Carlisle and Columbia Capital, latter half of that, investing at the intersection of mission technology partnership. Then started teaching at Stanford and Georgetown, and with teaching a class called Valley Means Mission. How do you take down to parallel spirit of the Valley, but not wasted on Candy Crush 3.0? Like, we need your talent, your brains working on big problems that matter, but do it in a for-profit way. You know, this doesn't mean that like doing good can't mean you can't do well, and that if you're doing well, it doesn't mean you can't be doing good. Work now at Nobriage is really around the following. The superpowers of our countries, we create talent better than any world in the world, and we innovate better than any world in the world. What we haven't done over decades is really connect those two ecosystems to government to solve problems at scale. So our best talent isn't going into government, and our best innovators are collaborating with government. There's a stat that less than 7% of tech workers in government are under the age of 30, 7%. We have four times as many over the age of 60. And so we really sought to embark, John, with Nobriage to help kind of fill that void of like, how do we inspire this top tech talent to kind of go into government? So top AI, cyber, bio, even finance, and business students. And think teach for America about point of public service, right? We used to say government selling careers, but students are buying experiences like all of you, if someone comes to you and says, "Hey, come join us for 30 years." And then at the end you'll have this great pension, you're going to be like, it's going to fall on deaf ears. Same job if we come to you and say like, "Hey, come work on the biggest problems at the largest scale with the most differentiated technology for two to three years." The lines have to door. So a lot of this is a marketing problem. Art the area change was that actually you guys care more than other generations do, previous generations do. We've just made it hard for you to find those opportunities and hard for you to engage in them. So we're out, John, really recruiting from the top universities, but we had applications from 90 plus universities, so it's broad but selective. And to show that we could place people in federal, we started in federal. First cohort was 250 applicants for 20 spots. The next cohort was 1300 applicants for 30 spots, and we moved to state and local as well. So in 10 states now, I want the legacy to be like, how do we revitalize people wanting to go in and serve, but also feeling like it's a career enhancer when they do that. I think we've found ourselves in a system where we think service means altruism only, but it can be an end. It can be altruistic and a career enhancer for you, but we've missed that last piece. And so that's a lot of what we're trying to do. How can companies help with that? So, you know, you guys have been helpful already. And part of our theory of change out of the gate was to show that we need students to feel that this is something either or. Right now, again, I think what keeps people from going into the public sector sometimes is like, if I decide to leave, will people value my experience? I'll give you an example. We had two Stanford students, both female CS majors. One got selected to go into Kessleron, which is a prominent defense program. And her friends go, why would you do that when you can do all these other things in the valley? The other one was selected to teach for America. And her friends go, wow, that's amazing. You're going to serve, you're going to give back, and then you can go do whatever you want. And part of the notion of that, and what's powerful in that being yet, is that the one getting the affirmative reaction is actually earning half this much money. So this notion that like, oh, people don't do this because the money, we don't buy it at the early stage where you guys are. And then what we found is part of the reason is because Teach for America's viewed is that like, look, if I go do this, private sector firms recognize it as a program that they want to hire from. Like, I know I can go do that. And it's a career enhancer for me over time, along with it being prestigious with my peers. And we think about what we're doing is not creating a pipeline of public servants. We're creating a community of dual citizens, public private sector citizens, people that ultimately understand the language of both, the culture of both, and in that have networks in both. And in doing that, we rebuild trust. So look, your firms are great example, a firm of people of a firm that has plenty of executives, plenty of folks that are dual citizens. We just don't celebrate them in the same way we need to. But also people that have been in the public service, right? And they're now a golden. And that's a powerful connection, right? Because when young folks can see that like I went into public service, this person was in public service. And now they're at firms like this or other firms are like, wow, this can really open up opportunities for me. What does noble reach emerged? Can you talk about that for a second? So as I said, there's two aspects to what we set out to do. One is like, how do we get young talent going into public service? The other is around, how do we get our top innovators to collaborate with public service and research? So we all know how much, you know, federal funding goes into research. But how do we get more out of it? Right? How do we get more out of that funding? As adventure capitalist, I think my bias has always been around the labs and the commercialization of the tech and things of that sort. The biggest miss ends up being people underestimating over indexing on the technology and under indexing on the talent. As if you see, you're like, until you find me the executive or the entrepreneur that can do something with that and find product market fit, build a business model like it doesn't have much value. And I think that's been a recurring theme across our innovation ecosystem where why we're not getting more out of the research and development work that we're doing. So what we're doing at Emerge has really been started with DARPA, whereby they would identify research of national interest, researchers doing that. And then we were out managing a program that connect them to entrepreneurs that could identify that research and that have a network of other people that they can bring to the table. Okay. Who are early customers, who are early partners. A researcher, and it's nothing against the researcher, but a researcher may not know what a good product market, not only good, what a great product marketing person looks like. Right? An entrepreneur will, especially one that's built it. And in part of our thesis here is, we talked about the talent piece and scholars what we're doing is being more for early careers. This is a way for Lake Career folks to be able to get involved and give back. And what we found is there's an equal desire there and I'll put myself in the Lake Career side. Have folks kind of going like, all right, I've had a successful career, but like, how do I do something that's kind of giving back? How do I combine personal ambition and civic responsibility? And we have found that there's a growing network of folks wanting to do that. Again, the pathways to do that is difficult. And so that's what we're trying to open up, like, you know, create much more of an entrepreneur core that can collaborate then with these researchers and technology is being developed and bring them to market. You and I talked at a separate time about this, but what so neat is what you're doing is at the bottom level, sort of bringing people up at a very young stage, who will probably think differently about things over the course of their careers as a result of the experiences they're getting with Nilburich. But we also did talk about this concept that the demographics are such that you do have an entire portion of the workforce that is going to be able to work, you know, well into their 70s, you know, kind of thing, but probably not at places like Golden Sacks for a whole host of reasons that's not going to be what they want to do and how do you, some of those folks deployed to. So I think that'll be an interesting, you know, ongoing discussion about all this. Can you just talk for a second on why it's important for the individual that this mission is important to them and how these kind of programs can help satisfy that? What about from the government's perspective, meaning we're in a very, you know, complicated geopolitical time and the fact that, you know, from an infrastructure standpoint, we may not be aligned in such a way that we're pulling the top talent to be working on some of these big problems. We're in the 250th anniversary year and everything else. Have important from a government perspective. Do you think it is that we activate, you know, the kinds of things that Nilburich is looking to do? - Yeah, it's a great question, John. And I think we're at a, for those of you who are in a book called Freedom Forge, we're in a Freedom Forge moment right now. What does that mean? Freedom Forge was a book written about pre-World War II, where we looked at our government and our manufacturing capacity was pretty antiquated. We brought in people from the private sector and within 18 months we were able to really build manufacturing capacity that enabled us to kind of be victorious in World War II. I think we're in that moment right now, as far as our digital or tech capacity, in business and finance capacity and private sector capacity. Like how do we get the best and brightest around this? And the reason I say that, is that it's as important now than ever, is that our adversaries call it civil military fusion. They take the best of their government and the private sector and the fusion together and they go to market. We've somehow found ourselves calling it the revolving door. Right. And so it's a little bit of an own goal. That doesn't mean we don't need to have standards and ethical guidelines and things of that sort, but especially on the technology and the business side. If we can't figure out a way to now people to kind of come in, contribute and then come back out, like that's not good for us. We're not gonna be able to compete at the level that we need to compete. And so that's a lot of the infrastructure that we're talking about trying to build. And so to your point on the geopolitical comment of where we are right now, I think the 250 at this is an important milestone because it allows us to reflect on for nearly 50 years ago our founding fathers created a system based on independence, right? And we've all benefited from it. And I think the opportunity and the challenge for the mission generation as we write about the book, is we need to take that now create a system of interdependence. Because that interdependence is gonna be important. Like we can't just be funneling talent, your public sector for 30 years, your private sector for 30 years, you're not for private for 30 years, and you're going to academia for 30 years. Because the problems we have span those sectors. And so building careers based on the problem versus the institution is the shift, right? Like right now our systems are based on either job titles we're looking for or institutions that we wanna be part of. Because we're looking for stability. Not the why are you doing what you're doing? What's the problem you care about, right? And the former is getting disrupted in a world of AI. And so we argue a little bit in the book that stability is the new risk. Like it's riskier to go do the stable, what you think is the stable thing. Because the stable thing really isn't stable. So why not go find the problem that you care about? Develop fluency in that, right? Knowing that the world's gonna be kind of constantly changing. And maneuver accordingly. And I think that is kind of what we think, this sense of interdependent is around, is like how do we create those crosswalks? And people do it, like your firms, again, has a disproportionate number of folks that have actually done that crosswalk. But like how do we make it the norm, right? Across society and how do we celebrate it? So that's what people want to do. So I'm curious because you're in DC, you have lots of connectivity at all levels of government with different institutions and government. How are you finding the receptivity? I mean, part of this is our leadership, but at least on the political side is very fragmented right now. We've got all that as a backdrop. Behind closed doors, what kind of receptivity are you getting from government and leadership around these kinds of things that you're trying to do? - Yeah, John, it's a great question. And it's probably where I get my most, most of my energy and optimism. Because I can sit with Republicans and Democrats in the last the same question as academic leaders and corporate leaders. And that question is, how can we help? Because this notion of like we need to get our best talent engaged is felt deeply at the government level and the public service level. And it's not an ideological thing. You know, what we didn't talk about of what we're trying to hopefully impart as well in what we're doing and why you needed not for profit and the outside to be helpful is how do we decouple mission from politics? Right, we can't be in a world where like, depending on the politics, you know, our best and brightest, only half of our best and brightest go into the other half don't. Like there's just too much stuff that needs to get done, consistently no matter who's in charge. And it's easier to kind of associate yourself accordingly. And so, you know, I'm actually very hopeful and very optimistic about it. I do think we're in an interesting moment and time right now where some of it's, you know, largely because of the geopolitical environment that people feel like we need a different way of doing things. Right, so the same idea as five years ago, it's like, yeah, yeah, that's a government's problem. Where the private sector we're just gonna go do X and academia is gonna go do its own thing. I think everyone's realizing like, we need an all of nation approach. And there's a role that everyone plays in this. - And actually, speaking about the governors and sort of doing some work with states and municipalities, what's the importance of this on a geographic basis having, you know, some investment that's outside of the key ecosystem of Washington and Silicon Valley as an example? - Well, this is why the state and local is everything. 'Cause you can't just have it feel like government is only something that's happening in DC. 'Cause the truth is for most people, 80% of their public service interaction is really local. Unfortunately, what they interact or hear or watch on TV is the federal stuff. But getting folks engaged at the state and local level and take Oklahoma as an example, they're just really phenomenal stuff happening there. You know, it's just with the mayor of Oklahoma City, we have three scholars there. You know, those scholars came from coastal, you know, west coast and east coast cities. They're like wanting to now become permanent employees in Oklahoma City. They would have never experienced that. There's actually a cultural connectivity opportunity here as well. This isn't just like, oh, I'm from there, so I'm gonna stay there. This is about exposing people to like, the great part of what makes this nation so amazing. And, you know, and I think we've lost that connectivity. And, you know, I think that's the opportunity as well, but I think state and local is incredibly important. On the innovation side, you know, we're spending a decent amount of time with Victoria and my colleague here in Sri Ramaswamy on, you know, collaborating on place-based tech hubs. So we're doing it in Tennessee, you know, again, with Oklahoma, Arkansas, Florida. Places that you wouldn't associate wouldn't necessarily be that, but the leaders around there are very interested in pulling that together. And I think that becomes incredibly important. So I think the state piece is an important piece, not only on the talent side, but also on the innovation side. - We sort of skipped over on the scholars program itself. How is the application process working to this sort of the vetting, like how do you actually select the folks in the cohort? - Yeah. - So, you know, if we went out, we, many of you are probably familiar with like, Can Shake and, you know, apps like that. And we're reaching out to universities and just really promoting the program. - Right. I mean, this is, you know, brass tax on the ground, you know, reaching out to folks. We've got applications from 90 universities, you know, so this isn't like, hey, we're just gonna go to the top 10 universities. And this is, you know, what I like to say that it's broad but selective, right? And then we have, you know, a process where we have essays, we have interviews, and then we select finalists from that pool. Now, a critical distinction is, we're not placing anyone directly. 'Cause then what we do is on the other side, we have agencies that are looking to hire this kind of talent. And so think of it more like a residency match, where we're gonna then introduce you to, you know, three or four agencies that you put as your top picks, they'll, you know, and wherever there's a match. And you guys decide if there's a fit and they make an offer to you. And that's important because there needs to be agency, you know, pun intended. On the student and hiring person. This can't be like, hey, we're forcing these folks on to you. Right? And what we're trying to do for you though, is curate that the people at the agency light are committed to giving you a great experience. Right? This is like, hey, we're just gonna get a job to get a job. And that's incredibly important. And then once you kind of get selected and placed and matched, you know, you're part of a cohort. So we're about to launch our third cohort. We'll have, you know, somewhere close to 100 folks. And we'll bring them in for two week boot camp in DC. And we had like, you know, Secretary Count Liesa Rice come speak to them. We had, you know, Secretary Romando, people from the Trump NSE and the Biden NSE speak to them. You know, so that they can see that this is a non-partisan thing. But also have folks from industry that have been in public service come speak to them. And we want them to feel a sense of like, this is important. There's a gravitas to this. And this is what's happening now with tech force. And so you have, you know, and through topic and open AI and Google, their CEOs will come and speak to them. the scholars in video. Because we want, it needs to feel that this is prestigious. It needs to feel that this is important. And in that, we, in the boot camp, if anything, the one pedagogy we try to provide in there is, how do you have an entrepreneurial mindset? Like how do you have a builder mindset, even though you're going into public service, which could feel or thoughtable. Wait a second, like I know, but we want you to be thinking about how to identify problems and how to go solve them. How do you have it more of a design thinking mindset? And that's the boot camp. And then we don't stop there. We provide scaffolding. And so our third of the case was the following. You can't just take great young achieving folks like you and then drop them into an agency and say, hey, we'll check in with you in two years. Because as I shared, these agencies are big. And the age layout of them may not be as conducive as you would like. So what we try to do, what we do do, is provide scaffolding to ensure your success. That scaffolding includes mentorship. So you go into an agency and we find a dual citizen that would want to be your mentor. Example, in our first cohort, we had two young scholars go into space force. Their mentor was General Raymond, who started space force. And part of the theory of the case is like, look, when you're your first job, what you do is important, but who you do it for is even more important. Right? Your mentors are really important. Because they set you up for the next two, three things you're going to go do. So mentorship, the second is skill development. So this is where our private sector partners, and you all were great at this as well, will come in and do like a half day boot camp. Like what's financial modeling look like? What industry analysis, the latest in AI, or cyber from our tech partners? So students feel like they're touching and feeling the things that are out there from the latest and greatest. And then finally, community. Like we want them to feel a sense of community. And we bring them together quarterly to get together and share what they've learned and share what they've experienced, but also look, share like every day is not going to be a great day. I'm sure it's the power of your cohort when you bring Allison. Some days are better than others. But there's a power of having folks that you can kind of go to and go grab a beer with. And so you wanted to create that cohort feeling. And so that's how we've created our program. Ultimately, we want to create again, a community of dual citizens. And while it starts with young folks going in, we want it to be about their mentors and faculty members as well. And so in a DCF context, the terminal value of our program really is the community. The next cohort is joining partially to the job they have, partially because of the cohort that they're part of. But I think even more so because of this community that they're going to be part of for the next 60 years. And that community is like, hey, look, I'm now looking to switch one of my careers. Do you know people there? Can you help me? And that's what we're trying to build. I'm afraid we are out of time. But this has been a great discussion. And thank you for the work that you're doing with Nobel Rees, because I think it's really, really important work. I think the government will be better for it. I think a lot of individuals will be better for it as well over time. And it's really exciting. And congratulations on the success of the book. Well, John, thank you very much. I just want to thank you and when I thank David Granson in the entire Goldman community for your support as a partner, early partner, and getting going. Because I think that credibility is incredibly important. It's validating. And I think I don't think we would have expected to be where we are in such a short period of time. And I think part of that is through your partnership. Thank you. Thanks for-- Thanks for joining us for another episode of Talks at GS, recorded on June 5, 2026. If you enjoyed the show, we hope you follow on your platform of choice and tune in for another episode. The opinions and views expressed here in a reservoir of the date of publication, subject to change without notice, and may not necessarily reflect the institutional views of Goldman Sachs or its affiliates. The material provided is intended for informational purposes only and does not constitute investment advice or recommendation from any Goldman Sachs entity to take any particular action, or an offer or solicitation to purchase or sell any securities or financial products. This material may contain forward-looking statements. Past performance is not indicative of future results. 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