Are Annie and The Gherk the same person ?

You are listening to the Why Smart Women Podcast. The podcast that helps smart women work out why we repeatedly make the wrong decisions and how to make better works. From relationships, career choices, finances, to faux fur jackets and kale smoothies, every moment of every day we're making decisions. Let's make them good ones. I'm your host, Anima Cuban, and as a woman of a certain age, I've made my own share of really bad decisions, not my husband. I don't mean him though, I did go through some shockest to find him. And I wish this podcast had been around to save me from myself. This podcast will give you insights into the working of your own brain, which will blow your mind. I acknowledge the traditional owners of the land and which I'm recording and you are listening on this day. Always was, always will be Aboriginal land. Well, hello smart women and welcome back to the Why Smart Women Podcast. This week I have as my very special guest, everybody's favourite GERKEN the GERK. And we are going to talk about an episode in our lives that talk on, I think, some very interesting. I don't know, how would you describe what happened to us the GERK? I can't help but welcome. Welcome. Thanks for having me back on, I appreciate it. And thanks for, yeah, thanks for, yeah, we had a ride, didn't we? We had a ride. And all sorts of wonderful people, some allies and some not- Not to allies. So you, it all started with a brisk afternoon stroll. I think you found yourself passing the forest. I was having brunch in D.Y. Lovely. And I chanced upon the forest of the fallen. Yes. We need some music under that song. So music. Yeah, that's it. So it's an interesting juxtaposition, the forest of the fallen, because in some way they've printed out. It's a juxtaposition, lots of reasons. But they've printed out these limonet plackards. And we've talked at length about that most of them are just online anecdotes. I've done a deep dive on about a hundred of them. All right, so just let me backtrack what they do is they have laminated pictures of people that have presumably all been murdered by the vaccine. And they are laminated in their stuck-on sticks. And it's sort of like some sort of temporary post-modern graveyard. Yeah, that's in, and they picture themselves as telling the story that, you know, the government's trying to hide. And so a lot of these are self-submitted. I, and if you others have submitted quite a few of these fake stories and a couple have gotten through, which we'll reveal another time. And there should have been, it was a test to see if they anyone was betting these. I did send one as, you know, as the gerk, that didn't get through. So there is, there is a little, that's it, the gerk is dead. But there are, we've got two through that we know are completely made up. And if they've used fake medical terms, I will reveal them at a better point. Fake medical terms is awesome. That's it, that's it. So, but will we have another time for the authors or the organizers for the forest for fall and you will put two revealing suggestions? And the point of this sort of post-modern looking installation is to ensnare passes by. So you're trotting a lot. And then you look and you go, "Oh, what's this?" And then someone rushes at you and goes, "These are the deaths of people from the vaccine." And of course, they're spreading this desperately bad misinformation. That's right. And so, where the juxtaposition comes, well, one of many juxtaposition comes into it is you can't actually take up close photos of them. Because they're one zero scrutiny, they're one zero inquiry, and they don't want any of that. So unfortunately for them, people like yourself and some others have taken a lot of up close photos. And it's allowed us and the team of other people to do some really good deep dives on these. And so it sounds a little bit sort of more, but in some respects, we've booked up. So a lot of current reports are publicly available. We just look at social media. We even reach out to some of these people as well, but apparently. To the law. So that's it. And some people have been modified that they've just been used, and they're like, "How? How is my details on there?" And then they've come back to me and they've realized, "Well, they're sister-in-law." Who's like an anti-vaxxer who was submitted there. You know, they had a motorbike accident, and their sister-in-law put that down as. Yeah, a vaccine injury. I mean, there are some real, egregious ones like where a chap literally, like they sadly, like they live up to the mean. Where a guy did die in a genuine car accident, really sad. The mum had posted on that because he received the vaccine two days prior that that must have caused it because he's reflexes wouldn't have. Yeah, so it's just. There are some, there's a sad one. Do you know Dave O'Neigh's? He's pretty positive. Yeah, yeah, I know O'Neigh's. Yeah, so he's sister sadly passed away back in 2016. 2016. Was 2016. Well, she. And now credit. One thing that Dave O'Neigh's, he. This had nothing to do with him. Just make it really clear. But he's. Correct. In terms of. Sorry, I don't mean to reply to the death either, but like, he didn't submit her details for the forest of the fallen, but her. There is a plaque died with her on there. And so he rightly so skits it publicly and said these guys are just off the charts. Yeah, when Dave O'Neigh says that you're off the planet. Oh, it's you are off the planet. You are off the planet. So that. You're out in stratosphere right, if he thinks that. And I just wanted to say about her, that the sad, very sad thing about his sister is that she committed suicide. Yeah. In 2016, which is eight years prior to when we had the vaccination. So the vaccination has the masonishing reach, doesn't it, to go back to the. Yeah, so they. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and they're not even saying, you know, because vaccinations were a thing back then, but they're saying that it was the mRNA vaccines and stuff. So again, we don't know. We don't know who submitted that work, but it is a really good representation of the level of. Or lack of level of scrutiny or cross-referencing to any of these. Like it is just an open source thing. And so I won't. You know, we got a page called Forest of the Fall and Luminative Lies. It's a little bit of a cheeky heading there, but through there, we catalog. We catalog each and every one of those cases that we're able to get up close. And yeah, a lot of them we don't definitively know what the course is, but we break it down on balance of probability. And so they talk about. You tend to get the same themes along the whole thing where. I mean, yeah, they just don't feel great after all they feel. They feel robbed of something and. You know, a lot of people are just. Just. So a lot of the people that make suffrage, so they'll talk about their vaccine. Malays. Malays, yeah. And so it's. I learned a new condition called Nessibo. And it's like Nessibo. No, it's like Nessibo, but Nessibo. And it's very typical sort of. You know, a lot of people just said they failed a sense of trade, you know, after the vaccine. Oh, it's different. They failed. And you know, it was very high up to you. We could spend an hour talking about. We could spend an hour talking about the fact that. There seems to be absolutely zero comprehension from the anti-vances. And specifically around these people that propagate the forest of the fallen, they seem to have simply zero comprehension of correlation and causation. It just doesn't exist in their blood. That's it. That's it. So you doing your. Your civic duty had. They came to fight us. who were completely brunch, taking your photos and you were just swarmed by. by these people. And so. She. Okay, so let's go back. She recognized me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then he was trying to say, "Don't you bark, yo, you." He was not saying that to me. That would have been silly. He was. He one of them rushed up and said, "Oh, do you want to talk to the family?" So I said, "Look, no, I'm good, thanks." And then she saw me, the woman that runs it. And then she. And then she monologueed at me about how it was me, Annie McCubbin, had the "Why is not women" podcast. I wasn't very smart. And I was the. What of the Girk? I was the good. No, what was I? She knows the Girk. She's friends with the Girk. Yeah, the Girk sidekick. Yeah, yeah. Or something. And. All while this is going on, it's sort of this. This. This symphony of. of nulliness, like in the factory on this farm chat, and he's like, "Here's like, she had an invite to part." And she's. Yeah, someone going off of. No. Of these. You know, just talking to confuses past the bars, like Japanese tourists or something, you know, about how the heart was the size of file apps, you know, after they'd had the. The factory. Yeah. So, yeah, so that was. That happened. And she followed me around and filmed me. And then I went and had another coffee and pretty much just. I don't know, thought, "Oh, that's that." And then went about my business and had a couple of very nice glasses of wine that night. And then the next morning I woke up and Rosemary Marshall and the playgrounds who run their. very good page had said, "Look what we found, good on you, Annie." And it was the video that she had filmed of me and she'd uploaded. And at that point, it only had about 4,000 views. But it went nuts, right? It's not like. Yeah. And so that I shared it. and I think it's been shared 20,000 times or something. 80,000. 80,000. I'm doing an AP. It's sort of backfired on her because it's not the thing-- and this is the second time Rosary's shared something that she's thought-- it sort of was like a cell phone. So she thought, oh, this little show, and it's completely backfired like the internet stunts thing. There was about a year ago, she was at a protest in Sydney. And I was giving that a bit of coverage. And again, it was just the clan car of just every on-ball and every grievance and stuff. That pretty poor turnout, big scheme of things. I think it was in Hyde Park or something. And so she's filming and she's like, this is a lopset snarky gerk. And so that is completely unheans. But one of her disciples sent it to me and said, her, her, her, her. What do you think? I said, that is the nuttiest thing ever. Who is going to Hyde Park or any demonstration? And ranting about filming themselves, yelling about a cartoon gerk. And I can none of these seem normal. And so it's the second time. So at the bit in what's important? So where it sort of gets to be sad. And I'm not necessarily sinister. But I think just outright sad is that in that video, with you, she then started talking about a particular mother of a vaccine victim. Have been aware I am still getting her around about that by the cookers. So that opened up a sort of a, you still are? OK. Yes. That sort of, they've eased off with me. I mean, that opened up a secondary story arc where it sort of goes full circle in that during the forest of the fallen laminated light inquiries. One of the most high profile cases that we talked about and did a bit of a deep dive on was a no. Now, I'm not going to-- Did you have a guinea pig in the north? No. No, I don't think I will. Because it's just not necessary for the context of the story. But genuinely, so looked into it now. I've been approached by-- so just frankly, this is the young lady did pass away. And-- And it's very-- The time-- It is a really sad story. So the short version of a longer story and the timeline is somewhat debated here. So I'll give the mother of this person the benefit of that's that, but what happened was so they'd received the vaccine. And 46 days later, they were experiencing-- now this is back in 2021. So pretty much the height of the pandemic. Listen, semi-rural Australia, I'd say. Would you say that? I think not quite full of rural, but semi-rural. And so she presented at the hospital with asthmatic symptoms and had been treated that evening with Ventilon and sent home and told the rest. Now, there's conflicting versions in that I've read two versions where the next day her employer had asked her to come in. This-- the victim's mother had said, "No, it was about three days later." I don't think that's necessarily-- he nor he nor there. I think if you have an asthmatic episode or an asthmatic attack, that you're pretty much out for the best part of a week, especially if you work in a high-trigger physical arm. Well, she worked in-- We won't say what the environment it was, but she worked in an environment that had a lot of dust and other very, very strong. I'm an asthmatic myself. And we strong asthmaticers. Yeah, high, high, high, particularly environment. And yeah, it's just-- And so this poor young lady went back to work a day, slash all three days later. There had been some text messages shared with her friends and family that she was reluctant to go in, whether she was pressured to go in or she was just a dedicated young part of work. Is it by the by anyway? It's a bit by the by. I mean, yeah, or a bit of both. And so she went into work on the back of this and had been fan-collapsed in that high-trigger, high physical-- In particular. --in environment, in a particularly-- --and a physically demanding role. And so she had was either-- I don't know whether she was declared to cease there or shortly after once, once she'd been taken to hospital. So really sad story. Unfortunately, you know, like, now, I've been approached by a sibling of this young woman and her close friend as well. They both confirmed that she had known asthma or asthmatic sort of issues in the couple of years leading up to it. And they have both sort of said, you know, they're really-- they're both gathered that she's being used in this way. The mother has been immediately surrounded by the ecosystem of, you know, this anti-bax client network. She was used by a particular fringe political party to give testimony at a-- they call it a semi-inquiry. It was a bit of a-- again, it was a bit of a clown show. Nothing came of it. There was no evidence. Nothing was concluded. Now, we don't have any-- so the coroner's report had been requested to be kept profit, but that's a family request. So the family requested that. However, the mother has said publicly that there had been traces of my carditis found in her daughter's heart. There had been some chemical markers on that. And what conclusion did she come to about the myocarditis? A bit of a-- Yeah, yeah, that's right. Now, I suppose that you are multiple times more likely to develop myocarditis from-- The actual vaccine. The COVID itself. COVID infection, that's right. And it's normally more severe as well, if contracted when, you know, from the vaccine. So, yeah, I mean, I grant that. Yeah, she may have had myocarditis. Could she have had contracted COVID during that time? This is the peak of the pandemic. The reason she was discharged in hospital so quickly, which I think she was let down, but, you know, some credit to the hospital staff is they may not have had the capacity to treat her accordingly. Or that they probably weighed up the risks in the sense that the hospitals were inundated with COVID patients. And so, I guess it's a balance between doing keep a estimate of her-- Yes, that is. Yeah. Having an asthma attack in this environment, in a high COVID, you know, during your respiratory pandemic, or do we send it home? So, there's some questions there. I think the reason I felt compelled to make such a song and dance about this particular story is because I think it just gives too much of a convenient bogeyman and get that clause for genuine failings that should have been explored and pushed further. So, what was the responsibility of the employer to insist that, no, no, she needs signing off before she comes back to work? This is not appropriate. I know that there was probably a high dependency on her in that workforce. But, yeah, and this is just my opinion. I don't like it. Yeah, there's some issues around, yeah, maybe the hospital care may not have been adequate, but again, it was in the midst of a respiratory pandemic. There's also lots of questions. And so, the mother then reached out to me publicly. I've invited her to discuss it in front of me. Hang on, hang on, I'll back it up a bit. So, this happened. And then, and then the picture of the woman that we know, the woman that has unfortunately died, we know that she was actually a pro-vaccine. Her picture is laminated in part of the photo fallen. I've taken a photo of it. And then, the mother has reached out to you and said, what? So, just to back up slightly, so the former, well, she's still best friend and one of the siblings, both said that they both acknowledged that this person had us more. They both also acknowledged that she was pro-vaccine. And she sort of a little bit tongue-to-tank used to mock her, mum a bit, and be, you know, the-- OK, so her mother is a bit prone to respiratory theories, correct? Well, yeah, she had, according to the friend and sibling, they've always been an anti-vaxxer or have been for quite a few years, definitely before the pandemic. It was a little bit of an eye-roll. They sort of, you know, cheekily sort of mock their mum a bit. Like, no, you know, like sort of-- Yeah. And it wasn't until this tragedy had struck that it became a more sinister and more overwhelming. Like, it's become-- it's become their entire identity now. So this person-- now, I felt modified at first, because I don't want to bring up the nonsense. But, you know, you've got Rosemary shouting this lady's name in public, and to you, the talking about her mother and she was devastated and things like that. And I've just-- you know, they've threatened to sue me over it. I've just said, if there's anything I've presented here that is not factually-- or that is not accurate, please provide me with contrary evidence. So I can't accept the anecdotes from anybody. I'm just trying to base this off information that is publicly available and facing it on balance of probability. And so nothing's been produced yet. I mean, I had all these sort of bots and ghouls and, you know, fake accounts and things, you know, demanding that I publicly debate the mother. And so, why would I do that? Like, why would you do that? But I have-- I haven't bought it. It's false equivalence. It's false. - I have no problem and so I'll have nothing to do with it. - That's it, so I've invited the mother to discuss with me privately. Now I've had her, I guess you've called them the liaisons, try to orchestrate something. They want me to go to her public group and have it out with her there. And so it's this real to me. - It's theatre. It's all theatre. - It's all theatre. - I pull myself in her shoes. So I've got young daughters and I think genuinely if one of my daughters had died through for any reason, if they died from a dog attack, you know, and then suddenly some bizarre page of her dog was making claims that one of my daughters haven't sort of didn't die in that way. The last thing I do is, well, her, do you want to debate me in a public group like I? - I know. I probably ignore it, but if it just became something I couldn't ignore, then I probably talk to the prime理 and say, "May, you don't know what you're talking about." And these are the reasons. - But it's not about that. - And also they tend to, and I noticed this when they were following me around filming me and also in the delightful follow up deluge of trolling that I had, is they seem to think that they have cornered the market in grief and you must not question them because this is a grievous story and we are nothing but, and we are uncaring, but we are the opposite. And to your point, all that's done by co-opting the story and putting it in a corner it doesn't belong in, it then reduces the chance that there will be analysis about what actually went wrong, which is wrong. - Yeah, right. So they are almost the personification of grief farming really and it's, and this is, I'm talking about the actual, the forest people here, not the genuine, the family of the forest people, walk all the eliminated forest people around. So they are grief farming at this point, probably a bit of recreational outrage. I mean, for them, you see their interactions, it's fun for some of these people. And I'm just a dissuade, I'm not talking about the family or the mother of this whole, you know, about moving on. - No, no, no, no, no, you're not moving on. - Yeah, it's a buzz. Like we sort of joke, we have, we have the lady that runs it, we have her husband frequently come on the page, now, not being an agent, but would it be fair to say both of them are in there, both retired? Is that right? - I think they do are tired. And I think they have a lot of time on their hands. - Yeah, they just spend just just abusing people with the most viral language. And it's like, is your daughter know that you speak to people on the internet this way? Like do you have a brain key? - I don't know. - Do you see the front of your brain key? - And also with such, you know, back to the psychology of it, it's such shocking rejection because they were like, you know, who are you to be so rude? I was not rude. I was extremely restrained and quite friendly in polite, but I'm apparently rude. And now I'm your drunken, oh, then I released a little video because I had a chat to Martin Bella. And he's go at Annie, he's hilarious. So I released a video in which I was talking about the wine because I can't stand that earnest crap that people post, trust me, nuts. So I was having a glass of wine. So whoa, well, I'm your wife and sidekick, it was all about my appearance. - That's it. - How ugly I am and I'm a drunken. Oh my god, I was so astonishing. - I'm just a lady that comments if she's quite factually based and the husband was in the comments and she said that doesn't make sense. All that, that's different to what you said. And he goes, quiet, troll up, you know, it's just a reply and it's like, what? So it's just, yeah, I mean, they're off the charts. Yeah, but I, you know, the way I put it, it's it's like these for there, but they're sort of their autumn years and they're just they're just spending. - Around an individual. - They'll, yeah, they'll post 17 times a day at 20 minute intervals in. - Right. - It's like, guys, like just go and enjoy yourselves. Like you're not, this isn't the 70s. Like you're not, you're not rebelling against some, maybe in the 70s, I don't know. - I feel like they probably missed out on that sort of whole movement. And they, you know, they're probably just busy raising your family and working and, and, and not around. It's like, it's like that this is like a, not a midlife crisis, but like a post life crisis where they want to try and relive the, the glory days, the glory days of, yeah. - It's turned into this sort of, this bizarre sort of, I don't know, like, - This is very, very bizarre. I did a, I did a talk about it. I've got to send that to you by the way. I did a talk about it. A hilarious talk, if I may say at the, I'm skeptics in the pub. - Yeah. - And I had, I talked about you, I talked about Martin. It was really cool. And then I put up some of the comments and the room went quiet. They were like, are you, are you serious? Because they, people are not exposed to that level of sort of vitriol and viciousness. They were really stunned. And not only that, but I had sort of mitigated it. So I really, I didn't know the worst of it up because I don't, I don't want to make them bring up their pub mail. So I'd sort of put some fairly benign ones. They were stunned. And I think. - Are you still getting, you're still getting unhinged voice notes and things near you? - I do. And I get people, what they're coming, they're trying to friend me. And then I just, it was only last week I had the one saying that clearly I'm a sad woman and I'm you. - Yeah, that's it. This isn't the first time that you've been, you've been eligible. - I've been here. And also David's been here. That's it. - I have a son and a daughter that still haven't been you, but there's still time. I don't know. - There's still time. I should be one of the dogs as well. - I know. - I know. - I know. - Very self-acquired story. And he's like, you better be more careful. And there's like, I'm excited. - No, Matt. - Oh, Matt. - Matt. - No, that's separate. No, that's, that's like, so. - Which one do you think? - So, this year they like be more careful, David. Are you still an actor? And it's like, I don't know who David is and no, I'm not an actor. And then I realize I'll talk about your husband. And it's like, that's not who I am. It's like, well, that's what you would say. And it's like, don't worry, I'll protect your identity. It's just sort of like, it's like, yeah, it's not me. But no, I've been, I've been about seven people now. The latest one is Maddie T. - Who is that? Where did they get that from? - So, there's a guy, so he's actually reached out to me. He's a really nice chap. He's, he's, again, unhinged messages. Listen to that. I will get him, I might even bring him on here onto the pod just to have a, Jack, so we did that once before with other David from vaccination stations. - He was lovely. - He's a really nice guy. We needed to bring him on again. - Do you have to be David to actually be on the podcast, though? Do you have to be David? - I think so. I think so. So, but yes, I'm Maddie T. And I think where they've got this from is because in his bio, he talks about how he debunks. - Oh. So he's involved in like he's a software engineer, but he, oh no, he debat fragments stuff. With some technical IT. - Oh, yes. You've said a word there that actually, or nearly got, yep. - Yeah, that's, that's it. And so I think they think that that's what I am, or whatever, because it's like, oh, he debunks information and - Must be him. - And stuff, so it's him. So I don't know how they're drawn that conclusion. He sounds nothing like me. One of them even posted it beginning a little bit creative. And with the image sharing stuff and their credit to cure me and Maddie T to like hugging or whatever. And it's like, and they're going to reveal. So they're claiming they get it, they're going to go to his place of work and take the placards there. - Take the Mayor, great. - And so I said to Maddie, like just, and he's like mad on self-employed. So they can, they can do what they like. - Go hard, go hard. - Go to my office, quote unquote, and hang out the front sort of thing. So they've got no idea. One time I was also, I forget her name, I was a lady, a parent during one of the protests or the anti-backed protestors lady in a green dress, wake class, see that I'll ever be. She was filming them, calling them F-wits and laughing at them. - That's you, that's for sure. - They've said that must be me, because she was wearing green and non-green and - Your green. - How did they get you, how did they get me for you? Because the guy was so definitive that he got me. And I was this pathetic sad woman. And, but have they not ever listened to us? Like how did, - No, they just say I'm just some Rando that sort of - Talking to me. - Yeah, I can. - And I knew. - Yeah, no, this has never made sense. They can't have to play it either. This is what we are with around. It's, yeah. - And I think that's, I think that's, you've actually nailed it, is that there nothing makes sense, but the mental gymnastics, they jump through in order to reach a sort of preordained conclusion is the point. They just want the conclusion. So anything, it's just, it's just the biggest, fattest dose of confirmation bias on the planet. That's all it is. This is what the conclusion I want to come to. So I'm going to post-rationalizing, I'm going to use motivated reasoning, and I'm going to use confirmation bias. You are her end of story, and anything that doesn't fit that, is just chucked out, right? - They find, yeah, that's right. So they, What I've found with some is they find it more unsettling that I'm probably just someone normal and not necessarily that remarkable in the sense that bothers them more because in their brains they are 99% and they're right behind them and it's the 1% elites and shadowy cabal who are trying to go against them so in their brains it's like no he's I've got to be more important or impactful or remarkable in real life. Yeah, I really am. Do you think you have like an underground, some sort of underground seller arrangement with a whole lot of screens and all that sort of stuff and you sit there? Yeah, that's it. I'm like, I can't even say that like that. Yeah, that I'm funded by A.C.O. and I'm an online worker. Or I worked for the Australian Institute or there's this some brand you know I'm funded by I don't know like this. That's what they need to tell themselves. So I've done other things, happy to run with it for you know as part of the elur of it all but it's it's pretty unremarkable and I think that's sort of an interest of the more. And also neither of us are paid by Big Pharma which I've now been accused of. Well that's it. Yeah, it's not to get too grandiose but sort of like that the sort of 9/11 conspiracy is where yeah, it's harder to come to terms with the fact that it's all happened with just guys with box cutters, not cases with box cutters. Something so so primitive in a lot of ways can do something so impactful. Not comparing us to 9/11 hijackers but yeah but in their minds it needs to be none of them they weren't normal like they weren't nut cases. They were a part of the Saudi Arabian rule family and the the Jewish must have had helped them and all these big kind of I don't know. There's a there's a brain bias where we cannot conceive that large events can have a small and ordinary cause. That's right. Large events must have something that's equally sort of a little and dark and large and it's not true. It's it's the it's the assassination of you know a Robota Kennedy exactly the same Robota Kennedy you know. Yeah that's it. Yeah that's right. So it's I'm I'm Danny Andrews or I'm Malcolm Turnbull or I don't know name name the person you don't like. Albo currently. Yeah. Well you would think so. I was just looking at some I'm going to make a post about it. I was just I went back to the I've you heard of the way back machine. The one no tell me the way back machine. So it's it's a it's a plugin or an app where you can set a date. So you can go back to say January 2025. Yeah. And it's the internet as of that date. What? So it's all the headlines and so it's really good. I've been using it for work a little bit around a brand of evidence gathering and so it's really good. If someone says something or or or or promote something and they delete it with a way back machine you can go back to a particular date and you can see it before it was deleted. Wow. So yeah the reason I came across it was I was actually reading better. I won't do much of it. I was reading about a Supreme Court case where I think it was like I was like some soap company and they're getting sued and not Johnson Johnson. No. And Johnson Johnson. Interesting case but anyway. Yeah. It is and they they had claims that no they never they never and they basically scrubbed internet from from this kind. They've been making and so the the first time that the way back machine was used as evidence in court because they're with we go back to you know and so that's all what's this way back machine now I've gone way off track. Anyway, I went on the way back machine. And I took that's it and I took it. I took us back to January 2025. And there were 10 polls in the space of four weeks that came out that had Peter Dutton as the preferred prime minister and leading in the polls and surging. And I just thought like wow, like I forgot all about that completely. Was sort of going through and then what happened? How did he end up in the as a dumpster fire? Wow. That's that's it. So it was it was the worst loss that the Liberal Party ever suffered since a non in 34 or something. So they got absolutely roasted. So I just sort of going down this rabbit hole a bit like well, it's what they call astro surfing. And so it's when the media and I don't know what's what hang on hang on what's astro surfing. So astro surfing is forcing. So you you just overwhelm public opinion with a particular particular stance or all take. And so it's yeah, and so you're you're forcibly putting this thing front and center of everybody to try to change the conversation. So now I don't necessarily think it's a sinister is you know that they're all sitting in Murdoch HQ and you know what although I do think that they do have some similarities. I do think that. Sorry. I don't think all media outlets of you know that the smoking man is is dropping. Yeah, what they have to talk about this week. But I do think that there are. I do think that they are like the algorithm rewards certain headlines and whether that be biocinal accidental. Well, let me tell you that I was walking through Woolies yesterday just prior to us having a two hour blackout which I don't need to go into but it was very strange. Anyway, and I saw a headline on a daily telegraph of the mirroreds. I haven't read a newspaper for about 20 years and it said Paul Pauline Hanson Pauline Hanson calls for stricter security amid terrifying ordeal. It was that sort of thing and I was like, oh, that's going to be a bit hurt the press club when yeah, when the yeah, who are they? They are. Get up, get up, drop a banner right. Yeah. And just for people that live overseas, we have a far, a hard, far right party emerging with a particularly inarticular leader and that she spoke at our national press club and it was well, just astonishingly dreadful. But in the middle of it, a banner was dropped by an activist organisation that sort of actually talked about some of her prior policies. Fine. So what's happened is then the press or this part of the press, instead of talking about the fact that she was talking, you know, a big lot of populist extremist nonsense has focused on the fact that how did they get in and drop the banner and it's some sort of left wing plot. And of course, then you have people walking past and, you know, coming past with their raisin toes bread and butter and milk and going, yeah, that's right. She was in danger and there you have it, right? That's it. So Barnaby Joyce said, you know, who's the, who's the, what is he? He's not the deputy leader. I don't know who he is. But he's like, put a pin on bomb. That it's the irony, the irony is the lady that's based her entire career, political career on performing stunts. It feels unsafe that someone's pulled a stunt. But for our overseas listeners, well, like she is tremendous and I speak to like friends in the UK and Europe and the US and stuff like she is tremendously underwhelming for a quite populist far right figure. At least with, you know, you've got Farazhu. Yeah, you can go on YouTube and look up. Just dushing it out, right? Just dushing it out. Yeah, I'm back in the 2010s when you're European Parliament. You have his few little jingles here and they're quite entertaining and they get a smirk all the pen, you know, she's a bit, maybe cheeky, but saucy sometimes, but she's a bit saucy. Yeah, it doesn't have any of that. She really struggles to articulate. And I just don't think she's compared. I mean, even Trump was entertaining. I mean, it was bizarre. Yeah, but not anymore. It's just sad. But I mean, you know, in the lead up to the 2016 stuff, those primary things were Republican primary debates and stuff like it was like jaw drop. Agreed. Yeah, so she doesn't have any of the charisma or social skills of it. Yeah. And so it's a bit, we don't quite have the fun excitement of a real. No, we really don't. It's a bit sad. It is. It is. But what else can he get it before it's just we've sort of been through this. I've got friends that send me, oh shit, she's up in the polls again. And it's like, we had all this before we done and none of it came to any fruition. In fact, that was hard. And she was. And it's like, it's just, yeah, it's the same. And I don't want to sound like a, you know, a mega supporter in 2015 and just call all polling nonsense. Yeah. I think there's something to it. But again, it's just such a small slug up. It is such a small sliver. And of course, it just, it gets in those sort of simplistic notions of, you know, who can I blame next for my electricity bill? You know, they're very, very appealing to a person who feels disenfranchised and angry. And there it is. It's a simple, it is unfortunately simple, easy to digest notions that are the easiest to jump on the back of and run. That was a terrible mixed metaphor. I had horses and. chewing, but anyway, you get a lot of training. No, it's simple. Simple answers to complicated. Everything's complex. Yeah. Yeah. I call it bumper sticker solutions. People want a bumper sticker. And so it's a bumper sticker politician. Yeah. She sells, does well on the bumper sticker front, but it doesn't, none of it ever stacks up when it comes to screaming or daylight. So, and her, well, of course, her, her, her, her senators keep getting, you know, being done, their criminal past keeps coming out and being exposed. So, that's not ideal, is it? And I think, you know, there's all that that's going on. I think it's just going to be, I don't know. I don't like reading it. It gets under my skin because then I start feeling really concerned at people's capacity to understand complex matters. Yeah. That upsets me that everything is sort of small and, and derivative. So, we don't ever get to the meat of what's actually going on here. You know, that's, yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's partly why we're here, though, isn't it? Or do we do it? Because I get that people are busy and they, you know, it, like, I don't, I don't blame anyone for not wanting to read about complex policy on their way to work or at a lot of way home. Yeah. So, I feel, you know, that's what we're sort of pushing against a little bit that we're trying to show people how to get the information about that or provide our opinions. I think that's why people value our opinions about this sort of thing. We're not always right. But it's always right. Yeah. I can't believe you said that. Yeah. David agrees with me. Yeah. When he passed your husband died, I wouldn't have pushed back. You would never have gone down the route. That's right. That's very dangerous, very, very dangerous. Yeah. That's it. All right. Well, there's a lot, maybe next time we can leave the forest of the fallen to its inevitable chopping down. Yes. Yes. Full of falseness, after an untimely, nice, you are. You are. It is. Thank you. Yeah. It's on the chopping block. And then we'll, I think we'll have a shot. Let's, let's go next time and have a shot at the political landscape because it's, it is a febrile and interesting area to deep dive into. Is it not? It is. We'll try to make it exciting. Australian politics has a somewhat of a dullness to it, which I think is good. It is. It is a good thing. I found myself watching UK question time again, because it's a little bit more fiery and a bit more punchy than Australian question time, but I don't know. Boring is good because I think we need, we need, we need, we need boring. Yeah. But you know, I do go back to the fact that I visited my father and law, the South Sudan in his nursing home and every single person working in that nursing home, compassionately, kindly dealing with some very difficult people was from Nepal. I just want to say that. Yeah. Absolutely delightful. So, I don't know, I don't know about the monoculture, but let's see how we go. No, that's a whole other episode. So my closing note on that, I'm sort of toying with this idea of it and doing a bit more exploration, but just to sort of summarise a bit on sort of the hands and arts and what they stand for. Like my theory is the three, the three biggest, the three policies that would have the biggest impact on reducing their reliance on skilled migration would be free or heavily subsidised childcare, free tape and subsidised university and make housing cheaper. And so, if we implemented those things correctly, Australia probably could have the skills that we need, not all, we're always going to be reliant on skilled migration, but we'd definitely be having potentially, it could be having some more, if people choose that's what they want to do. But one nation of voting against all three of those measures consistently. So they're not interested in reducing migration or the reliance on it. They are just, you know, it's just, it's just jingles and populist nonsense. Noise and fury signifying nothing. That's it. That's right. So, fine, may become a learisk. Okay, on that, I thank you so much, for joining me. And please, will you come back on soon? Sure, yeah, let's do it. It's, we're struggling to a long start, aren't we? That's right. I think we'll, yeah, that's it. We'll reach out to David from vaccination station too. Just just just remind everyone that he's not me either. And yeah, I do, I do find a fluttering because all these people are fast-smart and eloquent than I am. So I do, I do, I do feel a bit of fluttery when they'll want to someone and say, that's what it is. So, okay, I'm pleased to, I'm, I'm a smartest now, but yeah, sure. So yeah, yeah. All right. Well, thank you to the Gorken and to all my listeners wherever you are in the world. Stay safe. Stay well. Keep your critical thinking hats on. See you later. Bye. Thanks for tuning into Why Smart Women With Me and In Macubbin. I hope today's episode has ignited your curiosity and left you feeling inspired by my anti-motivational style. Join me next time as we continue to unravel the fascinating layers of our brains and develop ways to sort out the fact from the fiction and the over 6000 thoughts we have in the course of every day. Remember, intelligence isn't enough. You can be as smart as paint, but it's not just about what you know, it's about how you think. And in all this talk of whether or not you can trust your gut. If you ever feel unsafe, whether it's in the street, work, car park, in a bar, or in your own home, please, please respect that gut feeling. Staying safe needs to be our primary objective. We can build better lives, but we have to stay safe to do that. And don't forget to subscribe, rate and review the podcast and share it with your fellow smart women and allies. Together, we're hopefully re-shaping the narrative around women and making better decisions. So until next time, stay sharp, stay savvy, and keep your critical thinking hat shiny. This is Annie McCubbin signing off from Weissmart Women. See you later. This episode was produced by Harrison Hess. It was executive produced and written by me, Annie McCubbin.