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[email protected]. We know you have other questions too about parenting, careers, dating, and mating. Keep sending those our way in every now and then. We'll take a break from explaining the news. Also answer your advice questions. We cannot be held in response for any of the outcomes if you follow Scott's suggestions for your personal life. Our first newsletter will drop next week. But you can sign up now on our new website at pivotshow.com. That's pivotshow.com. Her husband in this is quite the villain. And you get to see his penis. We'll back the track due to it. His penis is in the movie. Hi everyone, this is Pivot from New York Magazine in the Box Media Podcast Network. I'm Cara Swisher. What did you do this week? I'm going to tell you what I did. Did you go to a football game? I went to the parents' weekend. Me, and Louis, and Megan, and Alex went to a football game. Oh, that's nice. We had such a good time, the big house, it's called. It was wonderful. We had a great weekend. I took Louis and Alex to a stay-house. Alex ate a steak as big as your head, essentially. And we had a great time. We had a lovely family weekend. It was very nice with our son at Michigan. It was very sweet. Do you want to know what I did? I did the exact same thing, except at another great public university. I went to parents' weekend at UVA for parents' weekend. And just be serious for a moment. And I'm sure you feel this way. But there's this quiet, unspoken of cohort of families. Where the kid goes off to college. And right away, it comes off the rails. Like, we've had friends who, for whatever reason, got upset. They didn't get into a sorority. They missed their parents. They're overwhelmed by being away from home. And it's really too bad because, I think, especially among wealthy parents, the general view is the only track to being happiness and purpose and reward involves college. Not recognizing the two-thirds of kids don't end up with their traditional bachelor of arts. And it kind of brings the whole household down. And so, when you go to parents' weekend, as I did, and your kid is doing good academically, not great, because he's doing great socially. And it's just having such a good time. What I describe as parents' weekend is, like, this 48-hour exhale, if it goes well. It's like our son is thriving. Our son is making friends. Our son is learning about himself. And it's just so rewarding, because you do hear stories of kids who, you know, haven't been away from home in kind of the first couple months or rough. And sometimes they leave. It can be. Yeah. I didn't have that experience with either one of my boys. But I still have two more to go. But I just loved being there. Well, it's so much fun. It's so much fun. I'm not a big football fan, but it was a really good game. It was much closer than they thought. And just being, you know what I was thinking? It sounds crazy. But I was sitting in that scene. It was 111,000 people in this, in the big house. And it was against Indiana. And first of all, Indiana fans and Michigan fans got along fine. And then everyone literally was all together. That's how I'm singing. And for some reason, I was like, I love America. Because it was like all of us. It was such diverse crowd. Everyone was getting along. Everyone was having fun. It was just like, there was no internet. There was no Elon Musk. There was no Donald Trump. There was no noise, noise, noise, noise, noise. And it was really nice. Like it was a beautiful day. And it was, and I know I'm being like, oh, you know, whatever. But I thought it was great. I went to UVA football game. Let me be clear. UVA football game versus Michigan football game. Yeah, I know. Is like a German PBS documentary compared to a superhero film. I mean, no one does college football like this again. Unless you're going to the SEC. Unless you're in Indiana. Which would beat them. But yeah, the go to like go to a band. Big 10. There's a big 10. My son is explaining to me. But all of a sudden, it was me. My son and his mom. And all of a sudden he put his arm around us. And they were coming back. And that wasn't it at all. They put their arms around each other and sing the college song when they score a touchdown. And I'm like, I should have known better. He hasn't put his arm around me since he was four. But it was incredibly rewarding. Yeah. And you get to speak to all these people. I can't even imagine. So me and my son, we get recognized a lot. Yeah, we did too. LeBron and Irving Villaches have walking around the Michigan campus. You guys must look so ridiculous together. We have a lot of fans. A lot of fans came up to us. Oh my gosh. People don't know. My favorite memory of Alex is when Kara and her wife and Alex came down. And Alex was young but fully formed as in a monster. We were watching some shitty documentary that Amanda made us watch about. Librarians and uproar of something. But your guests, we agree to it. And Alex came over and he sat down. And I'm not exaggerating. Everyone else in the couch went up two feet in the air. We're like, wow. He's a big man. I know. It was great. We had to move on. But the best part was also that Louis and Alex were together and they were growing it up. I'm going to take my youngest to go see the UVA. It was so big to do with them. Just being good brothers together. Anyway, it was really fun. Anyway, what was the weather like? Gorgeous. Gorgeous. It was like 70. It was fantastic. I love moving to Michigan now because it's not cold. You made just slow your roll. Go to a basketball game. It's everywhere. I have to go back. Anyway, we have to move on. I'm going to talk about it at the end. Anyway, we've got a lot to get to today. So let's dig in. There's so much. I mean, we've got the anthropic IPO. We'll get to that in a second. But it's a busy time for elections. Let's hit those quick. Brazil's left his president Lula. Just one re-election. Though his right wing opponent, Bolsonaro, who's the son of the previous Bolsonaro, is refusing to accept the results. Of course, he isn't. And Serbia's longtime leader. This was exciting. Israel is also going to the polls this week. Voting over their Netanyahu gets to stay in power. It looks like he's not going to. But who knows? The other guy's not going to be able to form a government. And here in the US, the midterms are now just one week away. Before you get to midterms, talk about what these elections. Something's coming. I don't know what it is. But it's going to be great. Well, I mean, you can read it either way. I don't know how much of a litmus test results. Because Brazil has a compulsory voting. And also, while it looks like the populist or the progressive is going to take the election, the son of someone incarcerated. It looks like they're inheriting was the equivalent of the magma movement. So you could, I think, interpret that other ways. The most encouraging thing is what's come out of, is it Serbia? Serbia, Serbia. Yes. And that is, I think young people are the immune system here. I think young people are saying, there's a variety of things plaguing the world right now. But if you look at what's going on in France, if you look at the election result in Serbia, I think what has happened is that young people are saying, we're sick of old people voting themselves more power, more ability.
to engage in corruption and voting themselves more money, and this was a student-led electoral victory. Now, unfortunately in America, young people don't show up to the voting polls. They get a Robin Hood account and start trading crypto. I'm not sure. I hope we've seen uptick in young people voting. You know, that'll remain to be seen, but loosely speaking, if you had to be reductive about it, you would say that there is a pushback on corruption that is being led by young people who are fed up with not only corruption, but a lack of affordability. And also, what, for example, in France, the statistic that is just sort of, I think, rolling over the world right now in a variety of measures is the following. In France, a third of the education budget goes to paying the pensions of retired teachers that are no longer teaching. That is just not sustainable. And I think young people have kind of now granted, there will be opportunists and just thugs and just people who are angry, who will join in and take advantage of it in our anarchists. And, you know, that's unacceptable. But the, the, the, the, the, the caracene waiting for matches of different flavors here is the notion that there is a corruption scandal across the world right now. And the young people feel like, okay, enough of using my credit cards such that you can keep going to Mozzalon. I don't know. It was really interesting. At the game, the mission game was all of dual stuff, vote of dual. It was really not a single microger sign anywhere, which was really interesting. And I know it's a cut, but it's not. I can't say Michigan is as liberal as in that particular school is necessarily, but it was interesting. But you're right. I think, but I do think young people are engaged politically, much more so than you think. I think you're seeing it. Hope so. And I hope they do vote, but I think they are tired of older people, so run on the table for them. Now, it'll be interesting to see what happens in Israel. And if this government, if Netanyahu loses, if the new person can form a government, yeah, yeah, election day almost doesn't matter in Israel. It's their ability to kind of play chess, which Netanyahu has been a grand master of the form of coalitions. And unfortunately, the way he stayed in offices by forming coalitions with very far-right ultra-ledger scribes. I've been watching that election closely. I mean, obviously, I'm more focused on this one. A lot of protests. A lot of students. Yeah, that's really interesting. And we'll see. We're going, we are seeing the numbers here move in the, again, the democratic direction. Let's let's talk about that former president Barack Obama is back. He hit the campaign trail this weekend accusing Trump of bringing chaos and cruelty and corruption to the country. Nice bunch of seas. He even channeled his inner Logan Roy saying administration officials like Pete Hagset are quote, not serious people. Obama then took a shot at Trump's White House. Makeover, let's listen. I don't know if you've noticed, but he seems very focused on home renovations. He should be on HGTV. Guys building a ballroom that's bigger than the White House. It's paved over the Bros. Garden. Put a helicopter pair it on the south lawn. And there's gold everywhere. What's up with the gold? Everything that's more gold. He's got the White House looking at the light. Who's saying open the cheese kick factory. He got to miss him. I gotta say he is funny, but you know, he did this for Kamala. It didn't really work, but was sort of on a roll. Meanwhile, election officials around the country are preparing for potential federal interference. In the midterms, there's already caused for concern in Alaska. The Justice Department filed a lawsuit at Trump's request seeking to block certification of the Senate race. Have the Republican incumbent loses. It's because of the name. It's ridiculous. Attorney General Todd Blanche's Trump is not trying to take over a state election anyway, shape or form, which is precisely what he's trying to do. And of course, Elon Musk is pouring even more money into the midterms. He just gave another 76 million dollars to his pack, bringing his total contributions to Republican groups. This cycle to more than $445 million. The pack is spent more than $12 million attacking Texas Democratic James Taloriko and Taloriko's pushing back against Elon. Let's listen. Elon Musk wants our land. He wants our water. He wants our taxpayer dollars. And he wants his very own personal United States senator. He is trying to buy Texas. But on November 3rd, we're going to deliver a crystal clear message to the world's first trillionaire. Texas is not for sale. He's been using this line all over the place. Let's start with Obama thoughts on this. He's going all over the place. Again, he did this for Conley. It was not effective. I think Saddam Hussein, it's as if Saddam Hussein opened a cheesecake factory. It's sort of the line of the midterms. And what Obama gets at the rest of the Democratic party doesn't get is that ridicule is more powerful than indignants. And while everyone-- For being righteous, right? Yeah. Outrage. And that is comedy is a strategy. Outrage is a hobby. And he's just very powerful. He doesn't come across this mean or trumped arrangement syndrome. He just ridicules the guy. We don't have anyone like him. And what he does is he creates an atmosphere where he comes in late. He is very-- Few people understand brand management like the Obama's. They are very, very crude and manicured in terms of their appearances who they associate with when they say and when they don't say, and they're smart to hold back until the very end. And what he does is he probably adds 10 or 15 bips to every Democrat running. And that's powerful. He's not going to save a bad candidate. But he might-- he quite frankly just creates-- he's another, you know, a couple million gallons of water forming a wave. Now, how big-- you know, again, it's the candidate more than anything, but he provides cloud cover. And what this also means-- I mean, going forward, the thing I'm most worried about is November the 4th. Yes, you and Hillary Clinton. Yeah. I really hope that Democrats don't mistake this. This says in a blue wave, it's a red rib tide. And what it comes right down to is if we take the Senate and the House be clear, it wasn't that Democrats are back. It's just for this moment, the American public decided they hate Democrats less because Democrats are not polling. And if the Democrats and Speaker Jeffries don't immediately move to a series of bold proposals about affordability, restoring a progressive tax structure, taking away the anxiety that Americans feel around health care and security, more sanity around reform policy, specifically our tariff policy. We're going to find out that, yeah, they had a one night stand with us, but they're not interested in having a relationship with us. Right. They've got to follow up. They will. And they also have to worry-- this is what Hillary Clinton bought up last week-- is let's worry about what he's going to do between now and January when they have to see this new Congress. He's going to try all manner of hygiene. He's trying Alaska. He is. But he'll continue to do so, and he'll get more and more possibly demented because he really is. With someone who covers him clearly, I was like, well, maybe this will finally shut him up. And this person was like, absolutely not. It's going to get worse, worse and worse. Yeah, but I will say this so far, the way I see this, when I was building, when I was renovating a home, our neighbor basically found out he didn't want construction while he was there. So he came up, he hired a lawyer and just got in the way of development and showed up to the local review board and said we were threatening to manatee population. Anyway, just literally through-- you know, tried to obstruct it. But eventually, at least in Florida, eventually you get to renovate your house. And that's kind of-- because the law kind of weighs in, and you can delay an obfuscate, but you can't change a lot. I think so far. So, for example, Calche has Democrats, puts 76% chance of winning the seat in Alaska. And that's Trump carried Alaska by 13 points and 24. In other words, I think all this bullshit attempt to interfere in the elections. I'm not saying it's not important. I'm not saying we shouldn't be worried about it. I'm not saying we shouldn't push back on it and have lawyers at the ready. But I do think ultimately that person with the most votes in this happened in, you know, this happened in 2020 that our democracy did hold. What unfortunate about it and what Sasha Baron-Cone was talking about, as I love the term shared lies. And what he said, they really struck me and what's kind of the longer-lasting thing about this is that if you were in the bubble that those January 6th writers were in, were they really guilty because they thought they were being patriots. And so if we don't have a series of, if our leaders don't have a series of shared truths, it's becoming the Republican strategy, the Republican acceptance speech or the Republican post-election speech is one of two things, either I won or it was rigged. And they're just can't continue. They're going to have to, they're going to have to be what they really are. I do think if it's convincing enough to feed that they will turn on Trump immediately, if not sooner. They've got to get him in the rearview mirror and move on in many ways. They can't keep hold on, by the way. He's already pretty demented these days. And with those little outbursts, he has those noises he makes, I think they've got to move him way off-screen as much as they can.
And that said, Elon Musk continues for money. And I suspect you'll do the same for the presidential to try to get JD Vance made president. What this money is staggering, Scott. This is staggering amounts. I know Michael Bloomberg gave $80 million, but this is nothing like that. This is crazy. - It's staggering and at the same time it isn't. Because while numbers create a metric above a certain amount, the metrics begin to become very opaque and our brand can't even wrap our head around it. So, okay, first off, $440 million. A staggering amount of money, it has an impact. It has a lower impact. The ROI is going down and I'll come back to that. But to give you a sense for that and how until we overturn Citizens United, our democracy is gonna be whittled away one cut at a time. It just is. To give you a sense for what that means, he's a trillionaire. So $443 million, oh my God, with a staggering amount of money. Okay, let's put it in relative terms. You're a millionaire. You're worth a million dollars, okay? And if this group of politicians gets elected, it might get in the way of your car wash. And so you'll do anything to keep this representative out of Congress because they don't like your car wash, because your car wash, they have deemed, is bad for America. And you have government contracts and you're getting tax credits. So, all right. And your state, that's why he's so demented against Tel Rico, obviously. This candidate is an existential threat to your ability to stay a millionaire. What, let's just not even go to politics. Would you be willing to spend $443 on the campaign? That's what it is to him. $443 million to a trillionaire is $443 to a millionaire. So for the cost of a really good dinner, if you saw huge advantage in leverage to you getting one candidate elected over the other, would you spend $443? - Absolutely. - So the question is, and I now believe this, I think we should let our trillionaires cook. I want them to make a lot of money, but on one side, you have to have campaign finance reform. And two, I do think much more progressive taxation, protects us from this type of corruption. There's really nothing good from someone becoming a trillionaire. And people say, well, he's smarter than us on business, granted, or most people on business. And he deploys capital in incredible ways to benefit the economy. I'm not suggesting he shouldn't be allowed to make trillions. I'm not suggesting he shouldn't be able to invest it and take the CapEx right off. I don't want to decrease his genius or his investment. What I'm suggesting is when he decides to take the money and recognize that gain in do things such as spend it on a boat, or spend it on a political campaign, which is not tax deductible, before he does that, it should be taxed at a minimum, AMT of 40%, and possibly more than that. - Okay, I agree. - Okay, shut the fuck up. - No, this is something you've been saying. I can't believe that the Democrats, this is something Democrats who went on, they've had enough money. They have enough money and they're now fucking with us. And I think it really is, it is coalescing people, the amount of money he's giving. You know, he's sort of become the bond villain of our country. And I think especially with Tallerico, the obsession, the obsessive, you know, and he doesn't even have Natalie Harp to write those for him. And just like on and on and on, there were like 20 of them in a row in one evening, laid into the evening. And the reason he, of course, is going for Tallerico is, 'cause all his stuff is, he moved to Texas to get away from people. By the way, California helped him a lot, but they just, they, but they didn't like one thing he did, and so he had to leave on a big old flounce. Now with Tallerico in Texas, he's going to have a problem. And he left Texas. He left for Texas and to get a bunch of subsidies from going away. Now he doesn't, he's very upset about a Tallerico-led Texas. Anyway, we'll see what happens, but it's an enormous amount of money for an unaccountable trillionaire to be able to spend. But even, okay, so the Democrats have vastly outraged Republicans in terms of number of people and underraised in terms of the amount of money. Why? Because there's regulatory capture among billionaires and then, oh, these guys will wash my back. They'll scratch my back. So, I'm all over them. The silver lining here, and I think this is a reason, you know, in my, you know, I have a lot of reasons why we should vote blue. This will send a strong message that the market, I think the market is starting to gag on money. What do I mean by that? Just as if you poured too much money into anyone asset class, the returns go down, $440 million, just 10 years ago could have got one president elected over the other in a close race. Now, it might not even get a senator in Texas elected. So, you're gonna see, and this is good, good thing. The bottom line is, this is the full local TV station employment act. - Right, yeah, like, you know, these. - Which is owned by conservatives, which is kind of funny. - But local TV stations lose money for basically 44 weeks a year, and then the eight weeks before the election, they make it all back and forth. - And election, people who make it down, etc. - In swing districts, etc. Anyway, good luck, Elon. I hope it turns out like it didn't Wisconsin. Okay, Scott, let's go on a quick break. We come back and Thropic takes the next step to our going public, how exciting. - Support for the show comes from Framer. If you wanna create a website that looks great, feels handcrafted, and comes together fast and seamlessly, then look no further than Framer. It's a complete website platform, not just a builder, so teams can launch and keep improving their sites in one place. 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Harvey is trusted by more than 3,000 customers across 70 countries. More than 200,000 lawyers, 80% of the Amla 120% of the 4 to 500 are all building with Harvey. They're accelerating review, sharpening negotiations and covering insights, drafting first responses and more. And they're doing it all in one secure place, built for legal teams. This is how the future of agreements has been crafted now. Learn more at Harvey.ai. Harvey does not provide legal advice. Users should always independently review and verify any output from Harvey. (upbeat music) Scott, we're back. Anthropics officially filed its IPO, which everyone knew was coming. Let's go through some of the details. The company's revenue has skyrocketed, bringing in $16.3 billion in the first half of 2026 up from just $1.2 billion a year earlier. But the company reported an $80 billion net loss in the first half of the year and this had been reported previously. Anthropics committed more than $600 billion to future cloud computing deals. Five of the company's customers accounted for about a quarter of its revenue for the first nine months of the year. [BLANK_AUDIO]
94 pages of filing are spent on risk factors with the company warning investors about rogue AI models in the opposition to data centers and Thropics co-founders including CEO Dario Amadeh would retain a combined 50.1% of voting power The company hasn't yet revealed how much it plans to raise or it's offering price It's a really interesting Situation and by the way at the very second I'm doing is Elon is trashing data centers because of course He's in the data center business and he's trying to kill all the other Neo Club businesses But talk a little bit on Thropics. Well, it's it's staggering It may it may be the fastest scaling software company. It is the fastest getting software company in history So effectively, let's talk a little bit about the numbers So what it shows is okay revenue in 2024 was 386 million in 25 it was four and a half billion so up 12x and so far this year in the first half It's clock 16 to call it an annual rate of 40 so it's 10x and 26 So first half so it basically 14x It's revenue from the first half of last year I've been trying to sort through the numbers It they called it a net loss of 81 billion ignore that because 72 billion of that loss was the accounting loss You have to take when you take a convertible bond and convert it to equity. Yes explain it They borrowed money and then they turned it to equity So an incredible innovation in the debt markets is something called a convertible bond where you pay them kind of a blow market interest rate But you get the opportunity to convert your debt into equity if the if the equity goes up And so it's a chance to kind of have the downside protection of a bond the company gets cheap capital Which it can pay back and cheap equity if the stock goes up. It's it's kind of a it's a great innovation But when a debt converts to equity, which is kind of a good thing for everybody shareholders get a little bit of delusion But you take the debt off the balance sheet You no longer owe that money and then debtors get to participate in that sweet sweet returns of a growth company But if you when it converts You have to take that as an accounting loss the actual conversion from debt to equity if you go if it's a billion dollar is In convertible debt that converts to equity you have to recognize that billion dollars as a quote-unquote accounting loss So the numbers I've sussed out is basically it did 25 billion and lost nine But if it's going four or five X at high margins It should be able to get to profitability now they've done a bunch of like You know hookah's focus to try and show that they're sort of profitable I hate this fucking adjusted EBITDA shits or for example what Anthropic does and Open AI doesn't to their credit Anthropic books the full revenue of a token sale Whereas open AI only takes the 20% that they recognize because the rest goes to the neo clouds and stuff like that This is there's just no getting around it this company is Scaling unbelievably fast This is anecdotal evidence, but quite forget their permissions From I get from cloud co-work have probably in my opinion been the greatest innovation for me in terms of a change in my life since Uber So let me ask you what's the problem? What what are you worried about like the beta beta? There's just tons of risk here besides AI rogue obviously Okay, first off government if government regulation if if the government can come up with some sort of regulatory policy That let's these guys understand the rules by which they're playing by and gives the public some type of certainty For what is going on here not going on here? The IRGC figures out a way to just hack a light signal at a busy intersection and then blame It and then spins up their bots and blames it on AI You know the states are going to start banning AI models People are scared of this shit right now and people don't trust it 75% of Chinese trust AI only 25% Americans There's an existential risk Americans hate it. It's not just not like it. They hate it They it's the the terms are very, you know, it's really interesting to see Attitudes everyone was saying that the scarcity was around chips. It's not its electrons. It looks like its power There is huge risk around the levels of CapEx they have to make and if these things don't keep 10 Xing all of a sudden Those I had it up anthropics commitments to 400 billion people are saying it's six to 800 I don't know how they got to that math, but regardless unless they keep 10 Xing, which they are doing right now Someone's gonna go oh The math doesn't work and then competitive risk Nvidia is talking about taking their GPUs and putting them directly on a client of phone Which quite frankly might leapfrog LLM's and then you have meta With its own LLM that is free that is number one in the App Store that has a direct relationship with half a billion businesses And and three billion consumers. There are threats everywhere But the reason there are threats everywhere is this is a blue whale That and there are orcas everywhere thinking how do we take this thing down? But the blue whale is 10 Xing right now. Yeah, it's interesting. This is like it's the Google essentially is how I think of it like is it the Google versus Anything else and and where will it go? And I think the issues are What'll happen to the open AI IPO post this depends on what it does at the same time if it doesn't have as impressive a Bottom line here. They're gonna have a real problem and then what what do the big companies do? What is a Microsoft do? What is a what are the rest of them do because there is a precariousness that I think Elon was pointing out Which is all these neo-cloud businesses are gonna go belly? I call them guppy Guppy level extension or something. Yeah, I forget something with guppies but but and he's talking his own book because he sells compute himself It's that's how he's making money. He's not making money in people using it as much as it is renting out his space And so it's important to him for these things to happen. It's all sort of it feels a little jangle like some of this There were it's like a lot of circular deals, but let me just I'll go back down. The consumers are using it consumers Are using talk about those numbers. Yeah, it's I hate this, but it's a just a measure It made 1.6 billion in operating income in the half. It's a tempestime margin in a year earlier the margin was negative 159 Let's see what happens when they actually started counting for it in a in a rational mature way But I still think the growth growth kind of cures all problems Computing infrastructure costs were 9 billion in the first half that's already more than the 7.3 billion It's been in all of 2025 But still you can't get around the fact that anthropics revenue growth and efficiency has been incredibly impressive get this get this stat Revenue per employee is about 6.6 million. That's up from 1.4 million a year earlier So the efficiency here is remarkable. By the way, that's greater revenue per employee than every mag 7 member Except Nvidia and it'll probably surpass Nvidia's revenue and per employee. So well run. This is a well run company much better run They don't have that. I mean, this is the nightmare This is the nightmare for politicians and for citizens and for college grads and the dream for shareholders They don't employ that many people And they're there revenues up 1400 percent their employee count wasn't up 1400 percent They didn't 15x their employee base And this is what is so I just can't get over This is how every board meeting in a growth company works. The CEO comes in and says we're going to grow revenues 12% next year 14% next year. That's like a modest account of yeah, which means I need permission to hire another 8% employees or Increase my employee base 8 or 10% which will increase earnings 15 to 20% next year and we go right at it have out of brother Metta Two years ago or six earnings calls ago said oh, we increased revenue by 23% and we did it with 20% fewer employees That should have said shut that literally all of a sudden and no one likes to talk about this If you use the term a ion aboard meaning they expect the next sentence to be I'm going to do more with less And when I say more I mean more revenues and less employees and this is what this is what anthropic is showing Yeah, 100% it'll be okay last question. So we got to move on to the subject What is the valuation in November when it goes public? Well, it'll be looking at I'm trying to think what their 27 projected numbers will be If they're first have if they're out of run rate of 40 I think it goes out at 2 trillion because I'm just 2 trillion my Greek lands are going here If it if it's doing 40 this year and they think they cannot 10x a bit 5x that's 200 billion on 2 trillion that's 10x 4 12 months rate. I mean that looks cheap compared to SpaceX and some of these other guys. Yeah, yeah And let me say for everyone it's coming after the election the Democrats just got a lot of new donors Because this is not a this is not a mega group of people. Let's just say it's it'll be interesting to see where they deploy their political capital When going forward and speaking of how you deploy your capital Elon Musk is finally admitting that SpaceX restricted Ukraine's access to starlink Yeah, think this is what Scott and I said he did Um, he's claiming Ukraine violated starlings terms of service by using it for offensive drone strikes to kill people Which Ukraine disputes, but Elon also said star showed as a different system controlled by the US government and what they decide to do is up to them And it's again a bunch of lying Ukraine says starlink and star should are now operating at normal speeds after more than a week of disruptions It impacted military operations and led to the deaths of people in Ukraine That incident again reminded people on much power this guy has and will and and
whether they'll do anything, anything at all about keeping them in check. I also know Musk also probably invested about $1 billion in David Ellison's skydance. They need the money, but guess what's got? I'm living! Sorry, I just had to say that 'cause I know you like it. Though they're trying to get me to stay again. They're trying to get me to stay. - Good, here we go. - I'm telling you, they're trying to get me to stay. - It's all economic. The cost of you leaving are minimal because you make a lot of money on a podcast for the jarhead. - I get it, I'm just telling you, I was surprised 'cause I keep y'all wondering. - I'm surprised too, I'm surprised I want you to stay. - I know, I don't know why. Maybe David doesn't know, but we can make very quick. Look, we said he was lying about it, he was lying about it. He is in a position to influence battlefield decisions and he shouldn't be. Trump seems to be out of it or lying, either one, not good. Neither choice is good, and Hegseth doesn't seem to be anywhere here, should be the one having decision-making power here, who knows. And an unaccountable trillionaire should not be making these decisions. I don't know how else to say anything, anything to add. - I'm very excised about this, so I want to talk about it, but I just briefly want to return to Anthropic for a moment. Just in the risks section of the S1, I just want to highlight some of my favorite things. Open quote, advanced AI could pose catastrophic or existential risk to humanity. That's my favorite. Our AI models may behave in unintended, misaligned, or autonomous ways. - They could blow us up. - Capabilities may advance more rapidly than our ability to develop, validate, and implement safety measures. Okay, that means your product shouldn't be out in the public, folks. - Right. - Anyways, so musk. - Speaking of an unguided missile. - I'm shocked he's not spending more, 'cause I can't imagine the first person that's gonna be hauled in front of Congress on November the 4th is Elon Musk. And for all of his lawyers, he's not gonna be able to avoid that for very long, because imagine Charles Limberg, a hero, an innovator, an idol. He was on the side to be fair as a lot of Americans were, and they said in World War I, it wasn't worth it. The Jews wasn't worth the squeezed force that's their problem. Now they want us to send our young men back. Let's partner with Hitler, he's not that bad. Imagine if Limberg had purchased McDonald Douglas, and he could have raised the money, which at the time was the premier aircraft manufacturer. And then it was converted for militaries. There was a military business version of McDonald Douglas, and FDR started converting DC-3s into bombers and giving them to Churchill to try and stave off fascism. But there was a guidance system on these DC-3s. And what if Charles Limberg had the ability to remotely turn off the guidance systems, and all of a sudden London was burning because they didn't have the ability to deploy their defensive bombers. That has happened here. What would they have done in the middle of the last century if they found out that a private citizen was purposefully throttling back the defense capabilities of who the American public supports and considers an ally in the defense of a murderous autocrat? So this is nothing short of, in my opinion, and I've used this term, if what went down here, what was alleged to go down here went down here. And unilaterally, Elon Musk decided to throttled back star-shield slash starlink, so that they could not launch defensive drones. And our ally has been weakened strategically and there has been civilian deaths. Then in some, he is a traitor to the West. And our government is at fault for not putting in place guardrail such that one person who is not elected can have that type of power over history. - What do you think he admitted it this week after lying about it essentially? - I think he's gonna have to go before Congress. And I think his lawyer said, no, no, no, no, don't say. - Stop tweeting. - Stop, stop. - You're gonna have to go in front of Congress and either say I lied or lie again, and you don't want to lie in front of Congress. So come out of the closet now. There's a ton of noise. This is a huge story. This would be the biggest scandal of any decade if it happened in any other decade. - Right, yeah, I agree. - But there's a ton of noise, midterms. Just put it out now. Just put it out. You throttled it back and say you were confused or you didn't know or you don't like so much. Whatever it is, take your medicine now 'cause you are gonna be hauled in front of Congress. - Yep, they are. That is something. And it's by the way, it's bipartisan. There's Republicans speaking about this. There's not. It is not just the Democrats gunning for him. It is, it's lots of people. And I think, and by the way, it's global too. FYI, and he's starting to see problems in Canada. And Europe, and it's fighting with India. This man can't, he's literally, this is not gonna end. Well, any of this for him. But he's got a lot of money, he's gonna keep spending it. All right, enough of Elon. Let's go on a quick break. We come back. Audiences are flocking to that new Elizabeth Holmes documentary. - Support for the show comes from gusto. Nothing is more relatable than postponing that one tedious task plaguing your to-do list. For a lot of business owners, that's probably payroll. Gusto is here to take it entirely off your plate. 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If you're ready to launch your business for Black Friday, go to Shopify.com/pivot to start your free trial. That's Shopify.com/pivot. Go to Shopify.com/pivot today to hear your first. (upbeat music) Support for the show comes from NPR's Machine Gods podcast. AI news comes at you nonstop, but what does any of it actually mean for you? Machine Gods from NPR helps you make sense of it. It's hosted by my friends Kevin Russe and Casey Newton two of the best tech journalists on the beat, well, except for like me. They give you unmatched access to the industry and they're fun to listen to too. Casey and Kevin take an AI realism approach. They report on AI as it is. They don't cheerly for it or panic about it. The show explores what AI means for work, for life, and for all our futures. Weekly episodes, mixed interviews and industry news analysis so you can be in the know from all the angles. And you don't need to be an AI expert to listen to Machine Gods. It's made for smart, curious people who want to understand what's happening without the hype. Because regardless of how you feel about AI, we can all agree it's important to keep yourself informed and you might as well be entertained while you're at it. That's exactly what Casey and Kevin are committed to doing. Listen now to Machine Gods in the NPR app, wherever you choose your podcast, and Kevin and Casey, thanks for the money. I'll spend it well. (upbeat music) Scott were back a nearly three-hour documentary about Scrake's Theranos founder, Elizabeth Holmes, gave a comic book movie a run for its money this weekend. You can see everything directed by Nathan Fielder and Lance Oppenheim was the second highest grossing movie at the box office just behind Clayface. The film has now made $45 million in two weeks. The biggest debut for a non-musical documentary since Michael Moore's Fahrenheit 9/11 in 2004 and it costs just $7 million to make. It's also generating Oscar Buzz possibly coming to first documentary ever nominated for Best Picture and maybe picking up and acting nomination. I'm gonna spoil the movie, so just deal with it. By the way, this has been written about a lot, so I'm really not spoiling it. But listen, skip ahead now if you don't wanna hear it. I have some thoughts. This is a, I liked parts of it. I didn't like other parts. He's full of trickery. This is what he's known for. I am a way, I put something
out that I said, "One Amanda Saferid is the best thing ever in this movie." She deserves an Oscar. Secondly, Elizabeth Holmes reminds me of every tech person I've ever met. Constantly denying account, what we just talked about, denying accountability, lying through a teeth, committing all manner of crime, and acting as if she's the victim. She is sort of the distillation of every single bad tech person I've met. By the way, she maybe shouldn't be in jail compared to them. She absolutely should be in jail, but maybe they should be too, but you can have that as a separate debate. It's a really interesting movie. I suspect there's a lot there. I think he's playing with them. He's well known for that. He's pretending on their side a little bit. I don't know who knows where he is because he's such an interesting filmmaker. I don't usually like his stuff, but I tell you, it is riveting. It's really interesting about identity and lying in truth in this society. That's what I have to say about that. The fact that it's making so much money, Scott, people are sitting through this is a three-hour movie. This is not a short movie. My showing last night was packed at an Alamo Drafthouse in Crystal City, Virginia. That wasn't able to get tickets except for there. And I barely got those. Alamo Drafthouse at Crystal City, Virginia. In case anyone forgot your wider than a snowflake. Well, it was the only place I could get tickets. It was crazy. But it's really popular. I know. We had a good time. I'm bored. Bring me a beer. Bring me some sliders. It's the dark, so I can't see what I'm eating. Bring me some of those. I love ordering cuisine in a movie theater. Then you know you're in for some fine dining. It was actually not bad. Nonetheless, this is interesting that people are sitting through in a theater. The theater stuff is going really well for it. That in and of itself is an interesting phenomena. Any thoughts on why? I don't want to see the movie. But as you said, second biggest opening ever for a documentary behind Fahrenheit 9-1-1 in 2004. In a Perth theater, it's outperforming Clayface, which probably spent 10 times that. Clayface. Which is supposed to be good. Yeah. It costs 40 million to make this cost $7 million to make. It's great to see. I'm super excited. I'm super excited to see I want to see the documentary on the guy Husky down Everest. I think it's called Everest. That looks really cool. But it's nice to see documentaries having their time in the sun. The only thing I'm sure of about this. So I've told you, it's not easy to feel sorry for Elizabeth Holmes. But it struck me that the only reason she's in jail is because her board got very, very angry and felt like they were taken. She took a lot of money from a lot of rich white guys. The rich, powerful white guys. Yeah. Anyways, the only thing I'm certain of is what her punishment should be. Her punishment should be a staring contest with cash betel. And I think both their heads would blow up. That's funny. She's been sucking up to Trump and trying to get out a pardon. By the way, that's the humor. I think his name is John. I need to start crediting this. I'll tell you this. It's not a documentary exactly. It's something else. It's a drama. The music is used. It feels like a thriller. It feels like a movie. And by the way, by the end, it's not clear what you saw. So it's not the documentary in the traditional sense of that, you know, it's laying out a case. It's something. It's, it's a mind fuck of a, I say it's a movie. And, and it's, you have to see it that way versus anything else. And for everyone online who says to me, don't you understand Nathan Fielder? He's fucking with you. I do understand it, people. I understand his genre. I think he's very talented filmmaker. I would recommend seeing it. Scott, if I were you, I think you would enjoy it because it's a movie not a documentary. I find, I find her and the sociopathies she represents. Yeah. Just uncomfortable. And my sense is, all of these men have just become such fucking idiots in, in her gaze. Like, all these older men she seduced to invest or be her boyfriend. Well, that would attract you to it. We'll add the pants. Yes, exactly. It's weird. It's a weird color. I have to say, I'd rather large, but it's a weird color. Yes. He's, he's, they somehow, I don't, I don't understand why it's there, but there it is. There it is. I, I think you would like it. I have to say, it's not a documentary in the traditional sense. It is something else. I just don't, I just, I'd also get who, who she is because she's just like a lot of the people I've covered, which is without accountability, completely acting like a victim and a stone cold liar. And that is what I, that I did walk away from it. Do you think she deserved a 10 year presence sentence? Probably not. Not great. Like, I don't know. But nonetheless, I think she's guilty, guilty, guilty. Yeah. I think she's guilty too. And, and, and, and, and, and, and, and listen to like Tyler Schultz and others who went out on a limb and John Kerry Rue. She's a grifter. And so is her husband is a massive grifter. And I have to, I want to see it again, because I want to see if I think that Nathan field fielder has been tricked by them or he tricks them by pretending to be tricked by them. It's, it's, it's a very much an origami of a movie. And you should see it, but Amanda S is fantastic. That's why you should go, Scott. I love Amanda. You are going to be like not just that. She is a great person. She's a great, she, she, she's part of this movie and reenactments and stuff like that. And let me say, she, she starred in the Hulu series about, uh, there. And I was, if you meant to drop out, if you remember. It's like really scanned my emotions. I think the reason I don't want to see it is, I'm traumatized looking at her in the way she talks. She looks at people the same way my ex looked at me when I ordered fries after she said she wasn't hungry. Oh, that's funny. That's not that funny. You're not laughing. It's a little funny. It's a little funny. You know what she does a lot and I, is a trick is whenever she's talking to you, she shakes her head. She's like a car salesman. She looks, she looks like my youngest when his mother asks if he remembered to take the chicken out of the refrigerator. She looks, he looks at her like, why would I deceive you? Of course I did. I know it's still in the refrigerator. She just freaks me out. I don't, I do not want to become a tractor being manure gaze. I, I just want to see the Amanda C. Freed Bartz. It's worth it for Amanda Cifrent. That's it. And it's not about Elizabeth Holmes. It's about Amanda Cifrent and the crazy ex-husband. I mean, husband, not ex soon to the ex-husband. Yeah. Yeah. No, he's, he's reached out to me a couple times. What did he reach out to you about? Nothing, nothing untoward. He, he heard my calm. I, I'm, I've made comments several times that it, I get it, I meant, I mean, I get that Elizabeth Holmes is not a sympathetic character, but it just struck me that what it, there's been the, the line between fake until you make it and fraud is gotten increasingly blurred in Silicon Valley. And it just didn't sit with me that they seem to have absolutely the public, the media court seemed to have no problem putting away someone for 10 years. And she just happened to have ovaries. I just, to me, it just struck like, okay, one of these things is not like the other. And that when, that a lot of the male, male founders, who I think have done very similar acts of fraud, they seem to get lower prison sentences. Now, having said that, someone would come back, what did her partner get? The guy, he got, he got the same. He got more, he got more. Well, okay. So that directly contradicts what I'm saying. But anyways, I have said, I have shown some, I don't call it empathy, but I have, I have talked consistently about, there's something that doesn't sit right with me about her sentencing. Now, so he reached out to me and said, I appreciate, basically, I appreciate your kind words, which you like to get involved. Would you be interested in getting involved in a movement to try and get her out early? And I'm not, you know, I think that the courts have made it. Maybe looking for money, they're trying to revive Theranos 2.0. So, no, I don't think it was, it was coming to me for money. I think he, I think he generally wants to get the mother of his children out of prison as soon as possible. Or that's the sense I got. But it was, it was, it was a very, very minor email exchange. Yeah. Well, stay away. It was what, go see this movie. Well, I don't know. I wouldn't mind hanging out with him and, and providing some comfort to his friend Amanda. She must be quite. He's not his friend. Anyway, one more quick break will be back for wins and fails. Hi, everyone. This is Cara Swisher. And I'm Scott Galloway. And we want to tell you about Pivot, our twice weekly podcast. That's right, Cara. What a thrill. It's a chance for us to break down all the big things happening in tech business and politics. Yes. And I keep you in check so people can make it through each episode, whether it's digging into a constant changes in the world of AI and social media or trying to keep up with whatever the fuck Elon is doing. We're here to give you our take on all of that. Every Tuesday and Friday morning we drop a new episode about some of the major stories of the moment. And Scott is a prediction machine gazing into his crystal ball to tell you about where it's all heading. That's right. So if that sounds like a good time for you, especially Mr. That's Right, you can follow us on your favorite podcast app to get new episodes every week. Okay, Scott, let's hear
some wins and fails, would you like to go first? - So my win is just in terms of media. I watch something called, and I haven't seen a war movie that I didn't like. There's a new war movie out, a screen planned directed by Peter Berg, who's, I think, a great artist, or a great filmmaker. It's from Imagine Entertainment called The Mosquito Ball, and it's an American war sports drama, and it's basically, it's based on the 2022 Buzz Bissinger book, The Mosquito Ball, A Game of Life, and Death in World War II. It's about a game played during World War II, and it's essentially these four-top American football players who are enlisted in the United States Marine Corps after the attacks on Pearl Harbor, while preparing for the Battle of Okinawa, and most World War II movies are about the European theater, and this just shows just the brutality and cost of war. It's well done. These things are very hard. It's very hard to recreate battle scenes and do it well. I don't think anyone's done it as well. As Steven Spielberg did in terms of his depiction of the landing on Omaha, but this comes pretty close. And it's also, Bergen Grays are also collaborated on Friday night lights, which was another great sports film. Anyways, I think war movies are really a really good reminder for people like me who have a tendency to be a bit more war hawkish of just the real costs that we outsource mostly, not all, but mostly in terms of combat to young men, 'cause reality is young men are disposable, anthropologically, if you have a village of 100 people, and 40 of the men die, the village survives, that 40 of the women die, the village goes out of business. So especially in a society where young people don't have as much opportunity, we find wars for them. I don't think that's true with American most instances, but you just see the brutality of war up close, and they do a good job. It is a very difficult thing to recreate. Anyways, my win is the movie, The Mosquito Bolt, they really enjoyed it. My loss is very straightforward. If a general of NATO was found out that he was somehow involved in the scaling up or scaling down of Starlink or Star Shield, and we found out that that individual had throttled back a private citizen or someone in the military had throttled back the capabilities of Starlink. What would we do? And why is it any different from Elon Musk? If the CEO of Delta, if the CEO of Boeing figured out a way to inhibit the defense mechanisms and defense, if they had of Northrop Grumman, if we found out the CEO had throttled back the guidance systems on our nuclear submarines, what would we do to that CEO? How is this any different? We have normalized the standard of behavior and given the mother of all dangerous hall passes to people because they are billionaires. And this cannot continue. And if he got permission from the president, then the president needs to be held accountable. But the CEO of Boeing is not allowed to throttled back military aircraft, mid-flight, defending our allies. And that is exactly what happened here or appears to have happened. So I'm super excited. I'm hoping there's gonna be a blue wave. I've been bringing on candidates. The divides are pretty good. But on November the 4th, these candidates have to do a couple things. It's about affordability and it's about accountability. And I don't, first off, when I say accountability, for God's sakes, please don't try and impeach the president. Please don't. But absolutely in terms of corruption, hall people in front of Congress. And we're gonna see a lot of names we've been talking about over the last two years who are under the impression that they're immune from all this shit. But absolutely my fail here is America has normalized a private citizen becoming the most powerful person in terms of military technology and potentially the fate of the West. Hall this person in front of Congress. - Hall him, bring him in on a dolly. All right, my win. You know, I was traveling a lot in the last couple of days and I ended up watching nobody wants this. And I didn't love last season. It's in its third season now. I thought it was kind of silly. I liked it at the beginning. It's on Netflix. I think this season is wonderful. - Nobody wants this. - Yeah, it's a little too. And it's not because of the main couple which is Adam Brody and Kristen Bell who are perfectly fine. They're like, he's a rabbi, she's a goi. Oh, they're ever gonna get together. Nobody wants this. And it's a very solid comedy, stuff like that. But there are two characters in this. Justine, I think it's Loup or Loupé who plays Morgan and Timothy Simons or Simmons. I think Simons plays Sasha. The brother, they're the brother of the man and the sister of the main character, woman. Have the most beautiful relationship. He's from Veep. He played the really tall guy, the obnoxious guy on Veep. - He's supposed to be a wonderful man also. - Oh, he's amazing. This guy, he was on, what did he play? What was the name of the character played on Veep? - Jonah. - He played Jonah on Veep. He was amazing. She played the wife of the dumb brother who was, I think, a prostitute on succession and she was great there. The two of them together are one of the most lovely friendships. I suspect it's moving. I watch the old thing to romance. But the way they interact as a man and a woman, it's really refreshing. And I think they're just the most lovely pairing. I'm sorry if I mispronounce their names. The, my fail has got to be the executives now trying to suck up to Democrats. I am getting a lot of incoming from companies now. I think they're suddenly very worried about what's about to happen. And they're worried about looking like assholes for sucking up to Trump really pretty much. And so they're making all these moves. I find that, I've just been invited to four different company parties, tech company parties, which did not happen in the last six months. Interestingly, someone who did, who has gotten a bit of trouble, Bill Marr, went to the White House again for dinner. It's fine if he wants to go to the White House, whatever. But Trump then posted as long as true social post ever, a 1,300-word diatribe against Bill Marr for certain, must dinner not have been great. He just, he got criticized for going. He's getting criticized by Trump. You're gonna see a lot of this kind of stuff going forward is people, you know, being angry 'cause you were, you were canutling with the president. So it's a fail. They, I don't want them. I didn't want them then, and I want them now. So it's gonna be interesting to see them trying to re-enter society if he loses his badly. It's people think he did, he will. Anyway, we'll see where it happens. - So just going to the Joan Ad files, and that is, Joan was probably the subject or the receptacle for some of the best insults. It was called the Cloud Bobberer, Guy Scraper, the pointless giant, the wrong shape, human scaffolding, the world's biggest single cell organism. I'd still, I still think next to modern family, I think Veepe was the best written show on television. - It was. - As you have been in my house more times than I have, I don't like stuff. I have no kids. I have no people. I don't like, you know, I have yogurt, champagne, in, you know. - Very expensive champagne. - Some, a few, if you pre-rolled and that's it, one, and I get all this chochki shit that I throw out immediately. I decorate my house like a Swiss architect who's, who's, you know, got ADD. Anyways, the, the one thing I have in my room, and it's the first, almost the first thing I see, I wake up every morning, it's Tammy Haddad, sent me a Veepe pillow, and it's Mount Rushmore, with Julie-Louie Dreyfus's face on it, and I wake up and it just makes me smile. - Yeah, she's the best. - I love that show. Whenever I'm a little bit down, I turn to trucks. No, I turn to, I turn to Veepe, or sometimes I watch curb your enthusiasm, or modern family, if I'm feeling like I wanna cry. - Yeah, yeah, anyway. She's in a play in New York, by the way, with Alison Janney, who's also spectacular in the diplomat. - Julia-Louie Dreyfus? - Yeah, there's a thing together. - Why doesn't she come, why doesn't she come to one of our live pivots? - I think she's busy being on Broadway, Scott, I believe. I'll tell you. - She's a Broadway schmod way. - All right, I will tell you. - She's Broadway. - I will tell you, she's a very good guy. - She's a shy and retiring person. She's great, she's, I spent a little time with her, I really like her. Anyway, we wanna hear from you. Send us your questions about business tech or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com/pivot to submit a question for the show, or call 85551Pivot. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot. And be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back on Friday. - Today's show was produced by Laren Neiman, Zoe Marcus Taylor Griffin, and Dodd Wise, Menorning and her shout-out entered at this episode. Thanks also to G-Brows, Mrs. Vera and Dan Chalon. Michelle Kroas, Fox Media's executive producer podcast. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks for listening to Pivot from Box Media. We'll be back later this week for another breakdown of all things tech and business. Kara, go blue. (upbeat music)
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