'Angst'

Glenn, when I say 'fear', what do you say? What do you feel, maybe? - Yes. It's less slippery than the start. What are the words written down when the core of the word is understood? Big words, very big words. Very big words, they are two big words. Very big words, they are two big words. Very big words. We use a lot and often 'big words'. But what do we actually say? And we mean the same thing. Words form us and the world around us. They carry our thoughts and feelings. One word can make the difference between connection and break. We, Typhoon and Jitzke, look for the personal meaning. Big words, very big words. Big words, very big words. What do you mean by 'fear'? I don't have so much trouble with that. Fear is... Yes, fear is... Hmm, good afternoon. I'm afraid of something. I have to think about it, but fear is... - Especially... - ...pressure. And therefore not being who you are. Yes, I think something bigger. Maybe something bigger than yourself. The creation of your own image of what fear calls upon. Instead of being objective, real words are fear. Fear is for me an object of love and fear. It has a dark part. Maybe it's a misunderstood part. But for me, how is love and fear related to each other? Let me start with something that totally resonates with me. It's a small part of a big story by Marianne Williamson. Our deepest fear is not that we would be powerless. Our deepest fear is that we don't have the power. It's not the silence, but the light in us is what we fear the most. That dark part, I went very deep. Burnout, depressurized. It was a moment when I just didn't want to be here anymore. And that part of fear, which becomes a sort of ice, I think that was the part of the misunderstood light and is for me. And is that the fear of who you could be, or the greatness in you? Yes, the greatness in me. I mean megaloma, but everyone has gotten such talent. I just got a big box of light and joy. At the same time, I always struggled with the position in the world. Just like many others, but from young to old. As long as I remember. And that part actually made me very, very afraid. At some point, I couldn't bloom anymore. With hard work, with the rush of numbers. How... how is fear for you? I think that certainly now fear doesn't play such a big role in my life. But I don't want to say that I'm not surprised or anything. But for me, fear is very close to sadness. Or worry. Err, anxiety. If I get an unexpected message or unexpected letter, then I can feel that stick in my stomach that I've done something wrong. So for me, fear is very connected, I can't be there. But not from myself, but from another person. From another person, yes. Well, now I have made love and a divorce and new love. I have traveled, I have been in an ambush. So it can point. So there were people standing there with big weapons on me. And that also survives. So I think that I have learned to go the way. I can, I can fall. But I have developed the skills now. Maybe with clothing, but it does stand up again. I'll survive. And I think there is a kind of deep basis at the moment. That I think, yes, I still find a lot of things exciting. Very exciting. But fear is almost too big a word for what I feel. Because what happens to you when you feel afraid? I can then go inside and get very quiet. So for me it is extremely important at some point. And am I going to look for it, Skydiver for example? I think it's a terrible idea. And the first time I did it, it was just completely unnatural. Just to let your legs bungle at a few kilometers high. Absolutely. With the airport door open. And then jump out. And the first few seconds of that free wave are really terrible indeed. And there a little less terrible. But I really want to do it. I really screamed so hard. And the second time I wanted to do it. But then in fully embracement of the fear that I felt. Actually as a spiral to train indeed. And I just prefer to do it than to let me do it. I'm just listening and sometimes I'm afraid of fear. But I don't think it's fun. Is that also allowed? So I think it's fine to do exciting things. But I can take care of myself. Sure, sure, sure. I also think that I'm very often afraid of people. Very often I'm afraid of things that don't really exist. Is there real fear? Is there real fear? Yes, fear is about things that really can happen. Where you can also be very sensible to be afraid. So if you walk the highway. Is it really something to be afraid of? Afraid that you can get rid of it. But it's often also afraid of the phrase. It's a very old casket of Robert Long, do you know that? No. It's all fear. That's a song. Tooth? Tooth? Yes. And that's all fear. All fear. All the great writers are afraid of it. And when something happens to Roy, then it has to be like this. Who is most afraid? Often has the least fear. Who are you? But I've hit this as a child somewhere. I think that's one of those things that you often hear. So who is most afraid, often has the least fear. So you're actually afraid of what can happen. For your thoughts of what can happen. And for me, well, in the course of time, I notice that I'm taking it back to what can actually happen. Then the thought of the fear is less. And then it's just getting exciting. And exciting, I can do that. Excitement is okay. Yes. Yes, fears. You have no confidence. It's like you're confident in the Netherlands. Self-confident. Is that because, for example, you have a solicitous break. And you have not prepared enough. Then maybe you're afraid of the solicitous break. But if you have good news, then you wait and okay, I have no reason to be afraid. What do I mean? No confidence, right? Yes. Then I get on. And that goes for me about uncertainty. Yes. So in English you say the leap of trust. So you have a situation that you know. And you jump into uncertainty. Yes. And then you can handle the uncertainty that brings with it. I don't know if I was in the Netherlands for a long time. I studied in Uganda. And I met someone who had a children's theater business. Somewhere on a mountain on the side of the sea. Victoria Lake. And then I wanted to go there. And then I just went there, carrying a backpack. But it was a long journey. So it was a big bus, small bus, small bus. Brommer. And then walking. And in the meantime it was dark. But there is no hotel on a hill. And that you know, oh, this is pretty exciting. Because I don't know anyone at all. I don't know if they are at home. I couldn't call them. So I just went there. And then you feel it's very exciting. But not that fear, but that going around with uncertainty and having no confidence in the situation. I didn't know where I went. But having confidence in myself. And that it would be good. So that leads to self-confidence for me. I feel a lot there. Yes, beautiful. That confidence that it will be good. I recognize that. Also very good. Everyone has been in a situation where they knew actually I shouldn't have been there. How often have you noticed that it will be good. Also it becomes very exciting. And I think it can also come with the years. But I've been here once. And then it was also good. So just let me have a bit of confidence on that. Did you have a moment when you thought that you couldn't be there anymore? Or did I do stupid things in my life? Yes, but really those things that you think of. To give you a small example. I went surfing at Sri Lanka. After 10 days I thought to be able to go with the locals. And to be able to jump off a rock with my surfboard. That was a real fear. Yes, I had to have real fears. That is such a moment that I think from the back. I had so much mass. I took part in a lift competition. A lift competition? Yes, so that you leave with a group of students. And then you arrive somewhere in France first. Yes. And we were with a group of backpackers. Actually a big group in a too small French car. And we were sitting in front of it. And that gentleman who was going away, he had a bottle of wine next to him, so to speak. So he was getting more and more cheerful. But we had a competition. And that you think you have to get out of it. And that you know, well, not, well, not. And he got into it. On a two-lane road. And there comes a huge freight car on us. And I can still see myself in the front seat. With my nails in the leg of the one I was sitting on. Because it was so small. And that was really millimeter work. Oh man, oh. Fear. Your heart beats in your ass. Your breathing is fast. Sweat breaks out. Your spirits are tense. Fear is a healthy reaction to a real exhaustion. But we often experience fear if there is no physical danger at all. We can be afraid of everything. For spiders, for the dark, for the wrong choices, for the judgment of others. For good relations and strong cultures, it is important that we exchange ideas and arguments. That we call leaders to the order when we do the wrong things. That we share our feelings and thoughts. But many people feel afraid to speak out. If we don't say what we want to say, we take action in a group. And our decisions are getting worse. In families, at work, and on political decision-making tables. We then call it unsafe to say something. But it will only become safer if we say what we want to do. In fact, it is very simple. If we make sure that what has to be said can be said, then we use the wisdom of the group. Then we use our potential. Unfortunately, we often don't speak out of fear of everything. Or in a very unfortunate way, which we do not understand each other. And when we speak out of fear, with the other unnecessary scoffers, this leads from bad to worse. We prefer to give others the guilt than to come under our own feelings. We are often not so good at contradictions and different opinions. We prefer not to say anything out of fear of the relationship. The human drama is that we are just getting bigger conflicts that can make us even more afraid. Because if we don't say what we really want to do, then tensions often go up sooner than they get less. Then we make jokes to clear up the air. We don't make promises and we have all kinds of excuses for that. And instead of talking out of the conversation, we make decisions without talking to each other. We say yes and we say no. We rumble through hard-necked doubts and all kinds of seemingly harmonious situations that open up conflicts. Many people are afraid of conflicts. That is, I think, the mistake of the people. The fear of being calculated after an remark makes us not say anything else. We do not make promises, even if we are not there, to keep the love and peace. And that does not work. The thought-fault that lies here on the ground is that we think that peace and harmony mean the absence of conflict. While good relationships are created in reality by constantly solving bigger and smaller conflicts. We know for sure that there will always be different opinions and wishes between people. So harmony and peace does not mean the absence of conflict. But are the results of a series well solved conflict? So, beautiful. What I find beautiful about you, to put it this way, is that we sometimes forget why we do something. And I think the word quality is so beautiful. The quality of our decisions. But actually, we have it about the quality of life, the quality of love. And if you know that that is on the game, then you want, I think, also to be bold to go to that conversation, not to go for that appearance harmony. So I find that very, very, very beautiful. Because do you do that for yourself? Or do you do that for the other? Not to talk about that, not to go for that. Yes. I also have to think about oppression, so that you are not allowed to be who you are and how often we oppress ourselves by recognizing what we actually think or feel out of fear for the education. And I think that we often think about that we say negative things to each other. But I had a new love in my life and the first time that you say to someone, "I love you." Who says that was the first? And if I'm most recent in fear, it's about that sentence. Because if you speak it out, then that deep education can come. And what does that mean then? Can you still stand still? I can still stand still. So in that light, I can feel again that fear and love are so close to each other. So close to each other. I know that very well from my love life. There was a moment when Marie, now my wife, we got married a year ago, we were dating for a while, because it was a complicated hashtag. It's complicated. At some point we both went to Bali, but we didn't know each other at first. And during that trip, I first met a couple of girls on the beach who were playing and said, "Hello, what's your name?" You know that and said, "You gotta go, friend." They just wanted to know everything about me. Then they said, "No, not really. A little bit complicated." And then later, I was arrested on the airport in Bali by a taxi driver. A very nice conversation. At some point they said, "You gotta go, friend." And I said, "Ah, again?" Then they said, "Did you tell her that you love her?" And I said, "No, we don't do that in the Netherlands." This is not... That's not the dating protocol. We have 60 different functions and stages of being with each other or not. And the longer I tried to explain to them what was normal here, the more I realized what was forbidden to sell. And there was a voice in me and they said, "You're just a scaredy-cat." And when I... You know, at the moment it's true, it resonates in your whole life. And with that message, that feeling came to my mind. And I said to them, "Listen, I choose you." I think it's scary. I don't know how this should be. I don't know if I can do this, but I choose you. Let's find out. And a year later we were divorced and married a year later. And I really trusted that. But that came because I realized that I was deeply, deeply, deeply afraid to be in that complete love. Wow, I think we were in the same taxi at the same time. Really? What do you mean? Well, I was also in Bali. In which year was this? A year or a little ten years ago. Okay, yes. And that was a situation that I had a very beautiful, beautiful relationship of 20 years, father of my children, fantastic. And that also went to the end. And that is always painful. So I was in the war and I was working in that region. I was there with my family, my family was flown back. And I was alone. So I came to Bali. I had a week, a little bit of rest to work again. And I was really looking for something. And I came and I took a taxi. And she asked, "Where do you want to go?" I said, "To a hotel." And then she said, "Where do you want to go?" Yes, that's a bit wide, so to speak. "And where do you want to go?" And I said, "I don't care." "How do you do that?" I said, "And then I had to cry." And then the taxi driver looked at me and said, "You know, I'll take you to a place where your soul can find you again." Beautiful. It was so beautiful. And I have to think about that now, because you're a taxi driver in Bali. But for me, that was also when I was so left to the left. I was also very afraid of everything that could break. Yes. And it would break a lot. Yes. So I couldn't see where the whole thing was. And when your soul finds you again, that's when you get together with yourself. Yes. I think that you can have that self-confidence to go on with it. I don't know exactly what to say. We were together for two and a half years, so we did participate in that. But to be honest, I was afraid of that. It was unrelenting. To be honest, I was really afraid. No. So, yes. No, I am quite proud of things. I can easily put things off. Yes. Yes. I'm going to say that confrontation, let me put it this way. So... So it didn't have as much influence on me as on my daughter, let me put it this way. Psycho. Yes. Yes, I think that fear, especially your freedom, is taken away. I have lived very insolently, my family has been taken away. The school didn't go to work anymore, nothing went to work anymore. So fear restricts your life. Yes, I think so too. Yes, the climb. Fear of losing my life. Yes, it really went from fear for the future, that it will never get better. But fortunately, I see that being positive again. But that wasn't the case. Of course, there are moments when that fear comes up. But then you can relate it and give it a place. And you know that it is no longer realistic, that fear. So then it takes off. And I can talk about it well. So that's also very nice. I myself had a light form of some kind of stalking around me. Not so far from the street, not on the street. But I know very well the feeling that at any moment... Something can be said, what can be hurt. And that is a very clamorous feeling. So those words that are used, clamorous. That your life is taken away, that you don't have things in your hand. That you don't have any control over what can happen. And what I think is nice is the kind of antidote that they would call it. Yes, just a nod. If you no longer have any control over it, how do you look at it from your work surface? Yes, that is frightening. So we have, from my work, look at the culture we create with each other. It gives an order to the Gauls around us. So if that order is a discussion, I don't understand what is going to happen. Then I look for a new order. The order, if you do something that doesn't fit in my order, then we have beauty. That is matter out of space. Then you are something that is not at the right place. It is out of space. Beautiful plant, wrong place. Matter out of space. And matter out of space, we find it complicated. Because I can't put you in place. That is scary. We need that order very hard. And if we don't have that in big changes, then anthropologists call that liminality. In the meantime, that is what was, that is not more than what is going to be unknown. And what is there, that is the Gauls. And then I often say, behind the scenes, of uncertainty, but that wins. So there is that Gauls, that uncertainty. And there we need rituals to be able to deal with it. And the rituals then give the order. To hold on to you, to go from point A to point B. And to put that in the light to say so. To come under eye contact. Yes, exactly, yes. I was afraid of peace. There were more and more people around me. They seemed to want to rest on the ground and feel me from top to toe with lack. Gauls. Up. More. I grew up and died. Successful, not completely beaten. Dicke bak, big house. Riding on, parking, but never the engine. Just. Not. Home. And I know it. The real struggle lies in our heads, in our thoughts. With the invisible instead of people. The deception, the untruth, the fear. I am no longer afraid, because I know who I am and how to pay for the love. So here I am. Peace. Peace. Don't be afraid. Stand next to all fears, keep on sharing. Love comes, love waits. Love is raw, love is soft. And if everything changes constantly, that is our constant. So stay the same. Keep waiting for me. Stay fighting for us. Stay dancing. Stay bright. Yes, stay dancing, stay brighter. It is the face of... ...dancing as if no one is watching. I would say dancing while everyone is watching. Because you are not alone, you know? So with fear, you know, invisible voices in your head. Fear for the disgusting things that are there. Fear for what others think, if you may be there or not. If there is such a deep human rights question, I really think fear is a very big word. Yes, how could you make it smaller? Well, for me, it is the whole time in my own life, in any case, doing the reality check. Yes. What am I actually afraid of? Yes. And then looking at the light, then there is a lot of fear. Yes. Because fear is something that may happen, but maybe not. It is so beautiful what you are saying. Because in my life experience, I have also learned to care for the therapy. Really learned to ask myself a few questions. Because with that, I reveal my thoughts, my ego. Also often the clan where you are afraid of. And are you sad about something? And because of those questions, do you set your fear or what it might be? Just in the light and then it can no longer play hide and seek. And I notice that things are exciting, tension becomes fear when there is little attention actually. So I recognize that question. What do you have to learn when it comes to fear? I think to let go of it even more. Public perception, yes, you often take that with you. I would like to say that it was not so, but you do it anyway. And I now learn that it is more to first check in with yourself. You can trust yourself. I think that I will be a bit more loving and different, kind of indifferent. So a bit less afraid of what people might think. And you, what do you have to learn to fear this word? I think the struggle for me is that I have to make it exactly safe and safe enough. And that the art is to find that balance. And I know that safe in the sense that I know very well when it is safe for me. Also in very tight situations. But my challenge is to find that unsafe piece the coming time. Nice. Thank you. You too. Thank you for listening to the Big Word Podcast. On Wednesday, October 5th, in the National Diversity Week, we organize Typhoon & Jitzke, a unique event called Rhythm of Life. With an amazing masterclass on diversity and inclusion for organizations. And tonight a big concert of Typhoon & Band. With Jitzke's deeper talks. So go to Rhythm of Life, go to event.nl for further information and information.