An ex, a slob, and a real life 'Golden Girls': How to survive roommates

It's been said that being neighbors with America is like sleeping with an elephant. One gets affected by every twitch and grunt. Well, these days there's a lot more than twitches and grunts in dealing with the US. I'm Paul Hunter. And I'm Katie Simpson. We're reporters here in Washington and every Wednesday we'll bring you a smart conversation to help you make sense of how American politics are affecting Canada. Our new podcast is called "Two Blocks from the White House." Find and follow now wherever you get your podcasts, including YouTube. This is a CBC podcast. Let's do something together. I want you to pitch the country right now. Why would you be a great roommate, Deb? Oh, come on, really? Hit me. Just let it come on. Ugh. I don't know. I'm fun to be around. I can talk about any topic because I've had so many jobs throughout my life. I've flown airplanes. I've built a high-performance car. I've been a private investigator and it's bailiff owning my own business for 10 years. I'm not a country music person. I still listen to rock, some rap. I'm into all that still. I guess I'm just not good at it. Deb sounds like 10 different people in one. She may be the world's most fascinating woman. But right now, 67-year-old retiree, dead king. She isn't having a lot of luck these days finding someone to be her roommate. Uh. It's in St. Norbert. Three bed, two bath. Right now she's strolling through Winnipeg ads online and showing me just how dismal it is out there. It's a space fully finished basement, but it's not really saying anything else. It's just describing the house. Some of them are a bit more expensive like this one's like $2,300 a month. If I could afford that, I'd be on my own. Thank you. Deb's current roommate situation isn't working out. So she needs to find a new place and she needs to find it fast. And preferably, a house with a fence for her dog, Cirque du Soleil. Yeah, I'm trying to find a roommate for a long-term situation. Um, and I'm not having a good time. I have to block two people over the weekend. You know, the advice you'd put a picture up. I did that and it's a picture that's from a long distance. And so I was corresponding with these two men. And I get the picture of the house and there's not even a yard or anything. So I said, "I'm sorry, it's not going to work out after all." Next thing you know, there text in me talking about my looks. Oh. Yeah, it turned into like a dating app. So I'm not too happy with this at all right now. Quite honest. That's frustrating. It really is. I am serious. It's more stressed than I've put up with it in a long time. What are you looking for in a roommate? Well, I'm pretty chill. But also let's face it, I can be set in my ways. Like, I'm 68, didn't it be 68 next week? I don't want a messy house with stuff all over the place. I like people to clean up after themselves. I already raised a daughter. You know, I don't need to raise a roommate too. Just somebody mature. That's responsible. Friendly. And maybe someone taller than me that can reach the shelf. That I can't reach. Just a normal person. I'm just looking for a normal person. Male, female, doesn't matter. Age isn't even that important quite honestly. I think I'm interested in it. It's all about now. You're definitely interesting. Well, I'm feeling like I'm on a dating app right now. It's a weird. That must feel weird. Because all you want is a roommate, but you're right. When you start trying to say, these are the great things about me. These are the things that I want about you. It does feel like you're trying to reach for a relationship, even though all you need is someone to live with. Yeah, exactly. Hey, you know what? I doubt it. Maybe someone who owns a house might listen to this and say, hey, she sounds like a great tenant. My last landlord, Boge, definitely say I was a good tenant. I feel for you, Deb, because I have been there scrolling through the ads, making the calls. And I kind of think I'll be there again at some point. Like right now in the country, roommate households, they are the fastest growing living arrangements. So many of us, we know this now, or we might be coming up against it pretty soon. Yeah, if you ever live with somebody, you know it's never just about splitting the rent. You can move in and be best friends or end up moving out because you're sworn enemies. It's really a role of the roommate base. Today on Now and Ever, we are moving in to see how X's friends, strangers, family are making their roommate situations work. I'm Yffee Chiuweta. Yeah, I'm Trevor D'Ane. This is Now and Ever. So at the bottom on the top. Let's top. That's for the rules. Many 50 pounds of books. Joel Casey is helping Jordan Woodward pack up his stuff. As Jordan says goodbye to the apartment that they've shared together for the past year in Invermier, British Columbia. These are-- these are special. So here. Oh, yeah. Can make a home for them. Yeah. But even though they live together, they aren't too fond of calling each other roommates. It's weird. It's very weird. It hasn't gotten not weird. We don't call ourselves roommates, which is just like-- I know. We're better friends than anything at this point. So yeah, there's no-- Do you know what you're going to say? Like, hey, roomy. No. No. No, not that anything. Hey, really? No, that's not the vibe. No. [MUSIC PLAYING] Trevor, this is how I know you haven't lived with roommates in a while, because no one says that. That's roomy. No, that's back in the 1900s when we just say that. I don't even know when it was. Well, Jordan and Joel moved in together last November after dating for around half a year. Now, things were going well until they weren't. There was a lot of miscommunication. And then, honestly, a lot of my part have just worked long hours at the job I do. And it takes a lot of toll on me at the end of the day. At the same time, I just kind of lost the hurry to get back home. You just become distant, and that space just gets bigger and bigger until it's kind of unmanageable at some point. So-- I don't think we knew how to show up for each other while also showing up for our businesses, our actual jobs, ourselves, other people in our lives. It just felt like we were both kind of drowning. Just a handful of months into living together, they decided they actually might not be meant for each other. But they still share it at least. It's quite hard to find a decent accommodation around here. Yeah, the seasonal rentals. They're only six months because we live in a ski town vacation area. It's just hard to actually walk in something that's worth the money that you're paying. It's like there's places here. It's like $2,300. And you're in an apartment building that's Airbnb every night of the week, and you can't sleep. This is very transient. This place was really good for both of us, because it was a brand new unit. So we're the first couple that's ever lived here. I had a lot of offers from friends being like, you know, you can come crash here if you guys are having any issues and stuff. And I was just-- again, it seemed like putting a label on it. I didn't want to just go crash to friends place. I've got a dog here too. We take care of, and it just made more sense, honestly, to just try it out and continue living together until the lease was up. How did it blur the lines for you of your relationship and moving on when you say, OK, we're done, but let's stay here and live together. I think we rode away for quite some time. Like, when you say that, I don't even think that conversation really happened of like, we're going to stick this out until November. I think we kind of just sat with that with ourselves for quite some time. Part of the reason the relationship probably ended was because of the lack of communication. Yeah, I agree. So without that being spoken about, you kind of just sit with it and you don't really know the other person's answer. So it was a little bit of walking on eggshells for a little while. If she went out to see friends, I stayed home and just kind of played video games just to distract myself. I'd want a lot of solo hiking trips. And I think that definitely helped both of us just kind of having that alone time. It was hard to decipher. Is it over or is it just a rough patch? Like, moving on isn't something that I see happening until like we are in separate places. What would you say are some of the initial changes that you made even to like, to your living arrangements? Who ended up taking the couch or who ended up having to like, move to like the spare room or something like that? I moved all my stuff into the office. I moved all my stuff into the second bathroom. Like, it's up to on the couch. Like we switched for like two weeks, three weeks maybe. And then we're like, we're not sleeping on a couch. Sorry. We both-- I value my sleep. Yeah. And I'm not sleeping on a couch. We're going to stop there for a second. So you guys have been sleeping in the same bed then for the last bunch of months as well? Yeah. Yeah. There are too many layers to this. How does that work? while sleeping in the bed. comes with its own complications as well. So expand on that. Yeah, please do because I'm like, what complications are you talking about? You know what complications I'm talking about. I would like to know what you're talking about. I don't like it. Never mind. I'll just leave it there. Well, if you two were to look back, because you guys both talk about how like, you guys kind of both went into your own spaces and a lot of things not being said during that time, if you could go back now, what's one thing you wish you would have kind of said in that time period? I feel like I was in a lot of pain and I was trying to deal with it myself. So I wish I had to like, told him how much I was actually struggling versus trying to figure it out myself. You know, I closed off myself to friends. I wasn't answering calls from family. And then I try to just be, I don't know, just trying to be a man and just deal with it yourself. Like, don't show feelings. Don't, you know, don't act on it. But yeah, I was, I definitely wish I was more open. What I wish I would have said was, hey, I'm like, I'm willing to talk. And right now I'm just trying to close myself off because that's just like the safety thing to do. Was there a point where you guys got used to living together as X's and it became like noticeably easier and more comfortable for both of you? I think so. I think eventually it was like, you either radically accepted or you radically don't. It was quite resentful for like a little bit. So I don't know really when we kind of stopped the arguing so much. There's been a lot of common ground that we've come to. Yeah, it's got to be some work put in for that. And I think that's what people aren't willing to like, ride out is the rough part before like things start to actually get easy and enjoyable because you did love that person at one point or maybe you still do. To discount the whole relationship and move on in dating is kind of, I think it's quite disrespectful to the time we did spend together. I get the feeling that like staying together and living like this really helped heal the break of a bit. Yeah, like if I had that choice to just go crash on a friend's couch, like I think just jumping ship early like that, it would have honestly like caused more issues. After, you know, we go our separate ways, like we will still see each other in town. We'll still see each other at the gym. We might still hang out. We might still walk the dog. Like completely discard somebody from your life just because a romantic relationship didn't work, but a friendship does. You're not gonna really know unless you go through that like weird uncomfortable period. Yeah. Like Jordan is my best friend through and through and I wouldn't have figured that out if he had just moved out. So staying together in this home made you guys friends. I think so. Yeah. I think better friends than we were before. I want to start talking about you moving out now, Jordan. Yeah. What made you decide now was the time to do that? I was looking for a little while and yeah, I found this place that came up and it's a new building. I kind of just like made the jump and I've been like putting it off a lot too because I've been enjoying like this time just kind of being just together as friends and just kind of getting to know her a little bit more. And yeah, there's no pressure. It's just kind of like we're just hanging out watching TV going to the gym still doing the everyday things. And yeah, I was was pretty like scared to move out because I was just like, well, that's an actual an ending like it's actually coming to an end now and I'm not going to be seeing her every day. And yeah, I need to come to terms with that. I think we both do. We both need to understand that that's that's a real thing that's going to be happening tomorrow. So tomorrow, I'm not going to be like, I'm not going to lie, I'm having to impact anything. I just like, hopefully it'll get done. What are you having a process or confront now that you know that after tomorrow, you're no longer going to be living together? It's definitely going to take some time to get used to like waking up by yourself. Like, you know, you come home and the house is full and everyone's happy and you know, like Chewie is his dog. So like no welcome committee coming home, you know. Oh, that one gets me. Yeah, people can't see, but your your eyes got all teary there. Oh, yeah, they did. As you talk about it, it's interesting because you guys did break up a while ago, but this kind of feels like it's this moment tomorrow was like the real breakup. Is that safe to say? Yeah. Yeah, it's like a natural, more natural ending to it because we're not, we won't be living together anymore as we said. And then we're going to have to just deal with living, you know, just solo. Who's cutting onions? Yeah, I didn't expect to get a watery here, guys. You guys are both losing a roommate tomorrow. We are. What are you going to look for in your next roommate? Nothing. There's no next roommate. I had friends being like, you know, we should, if you're moving out, we should move in together and stuff. And I'm like, I had that phase of my life. When I, as I said, I lived in other ski towns and I just don't want that anymore. I don't want to have someone else to live with unless it's like obviously for a serious relationship. So I think that alone time for both of us will be, it'll be hard, but it'll be, I think much needed because we'll kind of find out like what path we're going to carve next. So yeah, I think that's very important. So and honestly, I just don't, I wouldn't look for a roommate. I don't want to share my space with somebody that I'm not like romantically involved with. Yeah, yeah. Although there was like six months where we weren't involved, it just felt more normal for us to be roommates. Now that we're going our separate ways, like I don't need somebody else occupying my space. (upbeat music) You know, living with people, it's messy. I'm kind of curious to see what happens with Jule and Jordan in a year. Like just, you know, who are they to each other? You say, talk? I don't know. Let us know. And if you want to see pictures of these X's before they moved out, head on over to CBC, now we're never Facebook and Instagram pages. Now if I told you to picture a group of women all over the age of 50, living together in a house as roommates. Thank you for being a pin. It's instant, isn't it? Yeah, obviously. The OG roommates who made me think like this is what it looks like to be an older woman. I think of Golden Girls. Obviously. And while Blanche, Rose, Sophia and Dorothy had their fair share of shenanigans, I think Bev, Linda and Catherine are living it up pretty good as well. But yeah, we date and we have private space that you can go to, the basement's a guest room. And so people can go and watch TV or do whatever. There's a sock on the door knob. I throw a boy that area. [MUSIC PLAYING] Find out why one woman opened up her home to other women her age as they stepped into their senior years. That's coming up in just a little bit. Today, we are finding out what happens behind closed doors of roommates. Now, a few years ago, we were there on the day a group of friends moved in. We're walking into our house for the first time. Oh, it's open. Yeah, I love it. Wait, is the door open? Oh, it's open. This is very-- Leslie. We're walking into our house. Yeah. Is this the house that I ended up on? Is this the house we bought? It's amazing. We all own a home before we're 30. I'm-- It's a shop, chat. [MUSIC PLAYING] It can be hard to find friends you're going to split the rent with. How about a $1.3 million mortgage? Friends, Marissa, Matt, Chet, and Isabella are walking through their single family home for the very first time. What do you think of the molding? They're home. Yep. These four friends, two couples, will be splitting a house. All four of them will equally contribute to the down payment and the mortgage of this 2,000 square foot home in Toronto. It's a concept that started out as a joke. The joke was just a life-- We were going to live together forever. We would live in this apartment where we paid $6,500 each a month for it all of time. No, but there was also a joke that we would all buy a house. But we just had no concept of like, logistically how you would ever do that. And we periodically saw articles about, oh, these crazy people who have decided to go in it together. And then so what Marissa is sort of alluding to is she found a bit of like an ad or a posting about someone who is running a workshop on co-ownership. We went to the workshop as just like a lark or a bit of just curiosity mostly. And then like a week later, we were actually talking to an agent and like, she was like, I will make this happen for you. We were like, oh, OK. I think it's kind of interesting that this is something you just joked about. And the end result was the four of you going in on a mortgage of over $1 million together. Mm-hmm. Yup. My chest feels tight when you mention it. Well, you say your chest is tightened. But in that moment, when you're sitting down and you're signing. to this commitment that is so far from being a joke anymore. What's one word that comes to mind when you think about that moment? -Math. -Nausea, I don't know. Like, it's happening too fast. What am I signing? My life away? You're committing to like, approve your whole life and like, it's a whole new neighborhood. You're like, I guess I'll live your forever now. It is intimidating. It's a large mortgage and everything, but divided by four. -So divided by four? -Yeah, so it's less commitment than you'd expect in most instances of purchasing your first home. So I kind of feel like one of the reasons I did it was because it's less anxiety-producing. You can split everything in four, right? Like, if we have to buy a new furnace or renovate or whatever work we have to do on closing or any emergency, all that is kind of easier in that sense. Like, it's like you have less of a burden. I feel like divided by four is a mantra that you all say. -Yeah. -It's like I'm a little stressed, but spread that around. -Yeah, no, but 100%. 100%. -So how do we understand what are the steps that you've taken to make sure that this co-owning relationship works for you? -20 plus pages of contract. -And lots and lots of hours of talk. -Hours, like this weekend we probably spent 12 hours. -No more than 12 hours. -Yeah. We literally have a whiteboard in our living room. Like, you just literally sit and you're like, "Okay, if one of us breaks up, then like, what happens?" "What happens if you die? What happens if you default?" -What happens if you want to move? -Yeah. -Like, all these things. -What happens if you have a job in New York? -Yeah. - kind of thing. -I think most important decision that we made was that, like, at any time for any reason you were allowed to force a sale. -At any time, any person can exit, which gives the other remaining people the right to buy their quarter. If they can't buy their quarter, then it forces the sale. -What was the most contentious thing to negotiate in that contract? -I think revisions. -Like, really? -Or revisions. -It's use of common funds. -That was like a five and a half hour conversation. It's good to do it while we're all, like, mutually agreeable before anything bad happens, so that when maybe someone is angry at somebody. -Yeah. You at least have a framework for not being disliked. -Well, it really sounds like you've considered so much. And I'm curious, you know, when friends enter into even just business together that can have huge impacts on their relationship. How has, have you noticed any changes to your relationship now that you're committing to buying a home and existing together in this way? -I've stopped talking to Matt. -We're actually at a quote-unquote advantage because we've already sort of understood what it means to occupy the same space as each other. If this were two friends or four friends or whatever it happens to be who weren't already occupying the same space, I would suggest to move in together first. -That's probably actually pretty good. -Like really sound advice. -Like friends together. -Just rent together. Find a big place. You'll spend a bit of money, but you'll learn an awful lot about whether or not this is something you actually like. Because, yeah, there may be surprises. I really hope there aren't any surprises. But, you know, we sort of understand each other at this point. -It sounds like you're all in a really good place in a really strong relationship with each other. Which is a perfect time for me to put that to the test. -Fight to the death. -Not quite. I do want to play a little game with you all, though, just to see how well we're all getting along. Are you all up for this? -Sure. -Okay, it's a little throwback to the newlywed game. -Oh, boy. -Go on. [music] -Where is this? -Gran? -Yeah. -Okay. Who is most likely to leave dishes in the sink? -Jent. It's not fair. That's totally fair, man. -I actually think it's Izzy. -Oh! -There you go. -I'm really excited for the other day. -Yeah, I'm really excited for the other day. -It was there for three days. -I don't think I do. That's fine. -This is why dishwasher's exist. -I'm a friend of guys. I'm so mad. -I thought so. -You know what? You can add this, uh, make it page 21 in the contract. -Yeah. -Ownestly, don't do that because Matt has so many dishwasher opinions. -Oh, yeah. -That's so true. -I do. There's an optimal way to load a dishwasher. -Who always has to have the last word? -Jent. -Jent. -Oh, wow, guys. -I'm here for you. -I don't like this kid. -You literally walk away while talking. -Yeah. -I mean, that and endering my thoughts. -I feel like I'm learning so much about all of you in just these few questions. This is your last one. How do you all feel about splitting this mortgage five ways and letting me get in a. -How much do you know about home renovation? -I don't know, but I can brush up on my contract box and together we'll add another 10 pages. -Tonight's good. -I'm excited to meet all your new roommates. -You know what I should have done it. Because this story was from a few years ago and I remember at the time being like 1.3 million divided by four friends. And now, kicking myself. I've been in a different position if I got in. There's still time. Marissa, Matt, Chad and Isabella. I'm still here. -Uncover from CBC Podcasts is your source for exceptional storytelling and groundbreaking journalism. Unveil the shocking secrets of one of Canada's most prolific fashion moguls. -He far exceeds Jeffrey Epstein. He far exceeds Bill Cosby. -And dive into the unsolved murders of two Canadian billionaires. -This is a perfect storm of conspiracy theory. It's got all the ingredients and none of the answers. -With new episodes released weekly, you'll hear the very best and award-winning true crime. Listen to Uncover, wherever you get your podcasts. -This is now or never. I'm Efi. -And I'm Trevor. And today we're reaching out to roommates to find out what happens when you share your space and your life with someone. -I had a strong idea of what this would look like. -Okay. -Growing up every sitcom seemed to have a premise based on roommates. -Yes. -And I just thought, "Oh, it's a fun, sexy time. There's those archetypes like the two who are in a will they won't they? Or the weird neighbor who's always around, but you're just a lovable goof like I thought. "Oh, it's a magical utopia and we're all sexy and it's amazing." -There's a part in me that still kind of hopes that I will end up in a living situation that's like a scene out of friends or the golden girls. Like, that's the dream. -Well, if that's what you're looking for, you're gonna love meeting Bev, Linda, and Catherine. -Hello. -Hello. -Hi. -How are you doing? -Hello. -Gerzy. -Hello, Gerzy. -He's our watchdog. -That's a very terrifying watchdog, right there. -Hi, I'm Ellie. -Hi, Trevor. -Linda. -Linda, very nice to meet you. -Catherine. -Catherine. -Bab, very nice to meet you as well. -Now, these are three of the five women who live in this absolutely beautiful, century-old, three-story character home in Winnipeg. And it's called twin pillars. -Can I get a tour of the house? -Yes. -If you listen to this, you can actually see why I call this house rockin. -We have a three-season room here. -Look at this. Is that a hot tub I see? -That's a hot tub. -Yeah. -Okay, we're gonna do the rest of the interview in the hot tub. Ladies, we're going on the hot tub. -Did you? -I wish. -Ah. -I offered to go home and get my suit, but then they were like, we should probably just do the interview with our clothes on. -That's good advice. -I know, you think so, eh? -Bab's suik, though. She's the person that actually owns the house, and she and her husband, they bought it about 40 years ago, and they raised seven children there. Now, as the decades passed on, her husband unfortunately passed away, and her kids, they all moved out of the house. -Sounds like there's a lot of space. -There's so much space. This house is gigantic. And that's why Bev decided that she was going to open the doors to it to other women of a certain age who were just looking for company, and a fresh type of retirement community. And here's my conversation with Bev and two of her roommates, Linda Trano, and Catherine Lowry. I started by asking Bev if she always knew what she wanted to do with this home. -Absolutely. -Really? -Yeah, I ran into a friend of mine who I knew, like, ten years ago, and she said, "You finally did that thing you always wanted to do." And I thought, "I was talking about this ten years ago. I was really surprised that I had wanted to do it that far back." -What made you want to do it all the way back then? -I didn't like living alone. I found it quite lonely. And, you know, I looked around and I saw lots of other women who lived alone in their own houses, and they were lonely, because you don't have that natural sort of community that when you're living alone, it feels, you know, safe and comfortable because it's your own home. But the price you pay is loneliness. And I really didn't want to do that. I wanted to be with people who I could share ideas and stuff with, and I just find this is really quite great for me. It's almost like setting up a family. You can consider yourself a family, not just roommates or, you know, someone who happens to live there. It actually is about caring and sharing. So that's what an attentional community is. -What were you looking for when you moved in? -I was looking for company. I was living in a condo in Osborne Village. And that was new for me. I was there for a year. And it was lovely. And there was a great deal. view, but I'd come home and I'd go, where is everybody? Everybody's just closed off from each other, right? And I was just lonely. I mean I have people all day but I'd come home. It was just like, "Ugh, what am I gonna do now?" Moving into here just kind of changed everything for you? Yeah, it was fabulous. Yeah, it popped up on my email and I looked at it, I said, "That's for me." Yeah, so we had tea here in the living room and it was awesome. I don't even remember talking about living. We had so many things to talk about. It was very cool. It's like we hit it off, so. Did your friends know us at difference in you? To like being lonely, to all of a sudden being here? I, you know, I don't know, but I know I don't see them as often as I used to because I have built-in community. So yeah. Do you enjoy it here? I love it. Yeah, I've been here. I'm the newest one here. When did you move in? On me. Me? What made you decide to come move in? Well, my son moved out and I've lived with only him most of my life and he's been in and out a few times. So I've been alone long enough. Yeah. And I want to share my life with other people and look after when and otherwise we age so that we don't have to burden our kids and go to a nursing home or something like that. What would your friends say when they found out you were moving in here? Well, my brother, who's from your state, said, "Well, you've got an exit clause, I hope." You know, he was skeptical, right? Yeah, he was. And I had them all over actually, my whole family last Friday, a week or so ago. They were really happy for me. And my son actually says, "Yeah, mom, you belong here." And you know, it's funny when you live alone. Sometimes you start to become a hermit. I did. And I've talked other women. And then you know, you get into lots of reading and you know, just being on your own. And then when you have to be invited somewhere, it's almost like, "Oh, no, I've got to get ready and dressed." But then the next morning, I'm like, "Oh, it's lonely. Why do you make a goal?" So yeah, I just feel more alive, more energetic. What do you think when people reference a certain TV show where it comes to the people who live in this house? Like the Golden Girls? Well, they were really focused on dating. But yeah, we date and we have private space that you can go to. The basement's a guest room. There's a sock on the door now. I'm actually like, "Avoid that area." No, for some people, it's important. So that's a good thing to do. And yeah, if you have a partner, then that's. I mean, we wouldn't want to have somebody move in here. That would, I think we draw the line at that. I think in the beginning, you must think to yourself, "Okay, I'm going to have this house, with all these women, it's going to be fun." But at the same time, you don't know who you're going to be bringing into your home. What was that first kind of interview process like or the first woman you brought in? Well, Linda was the first one. And it was by word of mouth. We had sort of mutual friends. And we just had a chat about what she wanted and what I wanted. And it's worked out really well. But now we have. We do have a process. We send people sort of a paper on what we're doing, that it's an intentional community. Don't think you're just renting a room. And then we. One of us takes the monitor. See if they're still interested. No, they're still interested. We have a questionnaire that we send to them that sort of is about their values. What's important to them to see if they are a mix for us. And if that looks okay, then we all do an interview with them. That must be intimidating. Did you feel intimidated when you did it? Well, that was very formal with me. You know, she said we put a lot of importance on the interview and that kind of thing. So, yeah, I'm a little nervous. Do you put like bad copter and whole things on you? Well, you know, it's a process and I think we need to have a. We do have a year contract with people. And then at the end of the year we decide whether or not that's working for us and for them. Well, we also have policies like we have our meetings, our monthly meetings. And we have a policy set up on, you know, we have to be realistic, that you know, it's always going to get along with everybody. So, you know, how to solve a problem directly with that person and then hopefully you can come to an agreement. And if you can't, then we take it to the table. What is this? Is that the policy manual? Oh my goodness. Can I flip through this? I'm so intrigued. Okay, I am sorry. This is like a thick little bone manual. Overview principles, memberships, meetings. Yeah, food and kitchen tasks. Okay, can you read the principles here for me and the under the food and kitchen tasks? I know the principles. Everyone has one day that they cook and at least two days that they clean after dinner. No one is obliged to be there for dinner but it's expected that you text or call the cook two hours in advance if you aren't going to be there. Okay, these are old. It was just the first page. So, what is the next step for you guys here? I intend this to go on forever. Yeah, this is a model that I believe in. I like it. I don't want to live anywhere else. And, you know, for other people who want to do it, I really think it's great and I would help other people who want to do this kind of thing. Timeline-wise, how long do you expect to live here? I'm planning to die here. So, whatever long that takes, maybe, I don't know, 20 years? 30? Febs like you're on a one-year contract. Oh no, she's beyond the one-year contract. Okay. So, she's permanent now. How about yourself? I intend to stay as long as I'm healthy and alive. I love this old community. I really do. Come join the party. We are one room coming up in June. This is thinking of an advertisement, I think. I don't need any convincing. I love what they've figured out with each other. It's great. It's one thing to hear about this house, but it's another to get like a crib-style tour of it. I captured it all. So, if you head on over to our CBC, now we're never Facebook and Instagram pages, you can see what this entire house and the women in it. How they're living. You know, we've had a lot of lovely roommate experiences on this episode so far, and I know, firsthand, that that's not always the case. No. I feel like a lot of people out there have bad roommate stories. Trevor? I do. Yeah? I live with a roommate and started off really great. I live with the two roommates and things were wonderful. I lived in the basement. They lived upstairs. And then they both moved out after a while for their own reasons. And then a new roommate moved in, who I didn't know at all upstairs, like not at all. I don't even think I even met them. And then the next scene, no, parties were being had late nights, beer bottles everywhere, pizza, dishes all over the place. Like, I just remember being downstairs in the basement. And like, you're just like, boom, boom, boom, boom, like this music play. It was like four in the morning. And I'm like, I am living down here. Like, you have to know there's a human being downstairs that's dealing with this. And it was off. I moved out within like a month and a half because I just I could not deal with it. It made me realize how much I wanted my own space at that point in time. Yeah. And did you stick with it? You haven't shared since? I have, well, I have, I have a couple of wild roommates now. There's seven and nine, but oh my god. You're talking about your kids. There is wild as they were back in the day. I will admit, I have probably been the bad roommate. Like, I am sure there are some people out there who will tell you some if you roommate stories. And I like my school. You can call our listener line. No. Oh, don't do it. But you can share your own bad roommate experiences. Even if you like me, where the person who maybe left the dishes a little bit too long or didn't do their part in cleaning, it's okay. It's okay. It's a safe space here. Head to our CVC now, never Facebook or Instagram. And sound off. Tell us your bad roommate story so we can all be in it together. Oh, the juicier the better. Yeah. And if I've lived with you in the past, this is not an invitation for you to reach out to me. The past is in the past. Hi, my name is Sarah Scanlon. I'm Jennifer McDowell. And we started planning 10 years ago to buy a house together as friends and we did it four years ago and are loving it. One of our close friends who lives in Toronto, she calls our house the eco lesbian retreat. And it does be a little apt, you know, as a vibe that we're trying to aim for. If you're wondering what an eco lesbian retreat looks like, well, for Sarah and Jen, it's in a thousand square foot three bedroom bungalow and gulf with a huge yard. And a commitment for it to be a space not just for themselves, but for their community. Sarah and Jen have been best friends for 17 years and they've been co-owners and roommates for the last four. And if you think close friends who also happen to be exes, don't necessarily make great roommates while Sarah and Jen are here to prove you. wrong. Jen and I met in our very early 20s and started dating when we were young pups. We dated for about a year and we stopped dating but transitioned into staying kind of in each other's lives because we both really liked adventures. We both really liked to go on canoe trips and go on hiking trips which is really lovely and it's kind of hard to find people who do who want to do those things to be honest and so it's very white lesbian of us but you know it is of one of the reasons why we stayed. I'm glad you said it. Put the elephant right in the front of the conversation. Yeah some of our friends definitely make fun of us but we continued to do those things with each other and over time we became like closer and closer and just had so much care for each other and became each other's kind of person in the world like it was about 10 years ago. My partner who I had actually been living with and I broke up and she was moving out to go work on a farm and surprising and that was happening and we were just kind of like talking about our features and Jen brought up just the idea of like well we could live together. Like how sort of ship is basically impossible on your own so then just looking for what other ways and who would I trust to do this with me and yeah romantic partnerships are always a bit complicated because the romance of it just you can't do everything is logically your brain just let's the emotions take over and it makes it a little harder so who do you trust that's your friend and rather than a romantic partner. Which is funny because I think the dominant idea is that you should trust a romantic partner like first and foremost in terms of making like a home ownership decision and so I love that you were like oh no that's that's the risky decision to make. Yeah there's something about the fact that we have known each other for 17 years we have moved through conflict we've moved through really hard stuff we've moved through relationship transitions we've been able to be different versions of ourselves in different locations we've had pretty significant career changes we've had really significant relationship changes we've showed up for each other you know we have the ability to allow each other to evolve into different people without feeling personal the fact that we don't you know fight about intimacy we don't fight about like how much time we spend with each other we don't fight around how much sex either of us are having like these types of things don't fuel into our co-ownership stuff. When the idea was first brought up where their thoughts of you know what would happen if like a romantic relationship showed up that was a challenge to this or yeah what were were there reservations in the beginning before you knew how it would turn out. As far as the relationship components of it which is I think the thing that people get the most like weirded out about I think that between us it is not felt hard I think other people have had feelings about it. Other people you've been in relationship with them. Yeah if they could automatically seems a little bit threatening to a lot of other people people have their typical picture and they're like well how can I fit in I don't understand this picture. I've had to have pretty transparent conversations with people from the start of my relationships being like hey like Jen is my life person we're domestic partners we go on a house together and a lot of our big decisions are we map out with each other and we talk about with each other and that doesn't mean there's not lots of space for intimacy and for love and for you know big magical love like I you know I'm I'm so magically in love with a human you know who who is not Jen and I also love Jen a lot but you're like hello but like it just it can happen differently you know my partner who lives in Toronto we kind of do every other weekend between our two places and you know there's a future where maybe my romantic partner who maybe likes then more time here and you know what would that look like we open space for lots of different futures if we need to switch in one of us needs to move or something happens we'll figure it out together we'll work away around it so it doesn't have to like impact the other person money is really stressful for most humans it is a really stressful thing to being a lot of debt to feel the the worry about what if something goes wrong and I think that um you know making co-making decisions about your home your nest these are all really big things that like an impact like how we feel every day and I think that honestly not having those added layers does simplify things it takes a bunch of conflict patterns off the table you do make me think of the times that I've I've lived in shared space and even when there isn't like romantic connections as part of the mix there is still like expectations of other people like even just like how much do you expect we're going to spend time together casually like if I'm just coming in and out for a period or a season how how do you decide or or have those conversations around like how are we going to be in this place with each other I think that we are lucky to have a similar pattern of both liking a lot of autonomy and independence and so you know when you live with your romantic partner you don't really go to Canadian tire without letting them know you're going to go to Canadian tire Jen all the time all this like bathroom will come out she'll just be gone and like that's just like normal right similarly it is never given that we're going to hang out you know we don't want our only conversations to be able to butt logistics and we want to make sure we're catching up and checking in but our lives about what's hard about what's good and not just always talking about like did you get toilet paper and so you know we do plan intentional time for just the two of us to hang out to like make dinner to watch a movie to go for a walk well let's talk about how you manage and keep track of the more like tangible logistical things that are a part of like sharing space and sharing a home so we have had tour charts over time just so when there's more than two people in the house at our our check-in meetings we would kind of acknowledge and be like does this feel fair for everyone or do you have resentment and then I think the house is in Vienna's Sarah's names and so we're getting the capital from the house so we put in a bit like a hundred dollars extra every month to build up for like one we have to replace a root for whatever and so that's like the simplify between us when we first moved in there was someone living with us yeah so and he was like this is really stressful for you guys I want to contribute more like I'm willing to be in part of this and so I took the amount kind of of like the running costs of the house all the like bills and then also the interest on the mortgage as like regular expense to just keep the house going and so that got split evenly and then above that it was like capital so me and Sarah paid more above that so we got more capital and then Brad paid less and so he technically has this percentage of our house that I we could either buy him out one day or if we sell it one day we just look at that you know it's a little small lump of money we did offer it to our roommate after that our next roommate then chose to just pay a small amount of rent that was like based off of how much she makes because the thing is we also make more money than that roommate did and so we were also trying to figure out like what felt fair and what felt reasonable I was kind of mesmerized by it because as you were talking I was sort of troubleshooting different shared living arrangements I've been in and being like oh that would have made a good one or whatever but I am picking up in there that there is some consideration that like this might be a a time limited thing for sure who knows what could happen to either of us in a year our lives change right I think what matters is that we're committed to trying to make sure we don't screw each other over so even how we bought the house we made sure that you know if someone passes away the other person doesn't get kind of screwed over in that process of like losing the house and so we want to create long-term stability for each other and and some friends in and out of our in and out of this space the conversations are changing like I brought this up to a lawyer years ago and he kind of laughed at me and that same lawyers who helped us do this and so I think like people are finding different ways forward you know we're also talking about potentially you know having a friend build a tiny house on our property there's a whole other complications there but like people assume that we're doing it this way because we've known there are the choice but we're really intentionally choosing this based off of like what our priorities are and what we want from our lives and our ability to commit to a lot of people and it's about being intentional about how do we want to live our lives and not doing it in a particular pathway just because society is always told us that's the right way we get to carve that out for ourselves and I think it's like pretty cool to have a partner in life who wants to collaborate in like building a different community-based future you know I love that [Music] I'm serious Trevor talking with them I was just thinking oh if I could go back in time and just have this little bit of advice like you know managing expectations about how to be together in a space and all these sorts of things it would have changed my living situations really yeah if you've been listening to this podcast thinking I need to share this with my roommate so we can roommate better head to the cvc now and ever podcast wherever you listen to podcasts to get this episode and any of our past episodes and run it back big thank you to our team of producers who helped put the show together this week serratate sam rowie uhanas, rigid forbs and jeska singer I'm Trevor's name and I. and your roommate Yffi Chiuatelou, we'll see you on the lini. - Oh, you'd be waiting all that episode to drop that deep golden girl's cut. - Right, all right, listen, there'd be people who taught me what that was even was. - Oh, thank you for being a friend. - See you next time. (upbeat music) - For more CBC podcasts, go to cbc.ca/podcasts.