Alison Roman has a secret menu order at Keens.

Live from WSA, this is "Expense Account" and it's your boy, J. Lee. Today our guest is Alison Roman. You know Alison Roman. Her recipes have defined the last decade. She is our millennial queen and I am her millennial page. She went to the word "garlicky" and the word "liminy." She owns a little store upstate that's called "first bloom" and she's written three cookbooks. Her fourth cookbook comes out on November 11th. It's called "Something from Nothing" and all of the recipes are really elegant and simple and grown and sexy. There's a lot of confidence in these new recipes. It's a great cookbook and that's all to say that I'm a really big fan of Alison's and I'm so glad to have her here. We talked lore and we talked keens. We talked make-out sessions. We talked about the milk bar corn cookie. We talked about cat UTIs. We talked about a lot of things. I really hope you enjoy. This is "Expense Account." Thanks. Hey Alison. Hey Jason. Do you remember the last time that I saw you? This is really random. You don't remember because it was a big day for you. It was a big day for you. It was one of the- I do remember. I have to work through this memory and I don't think it's going to make for a very good podcasting if you- So you remember it and I'll never- No, but you were with your almost wife. Yes, yes it was. That's all I got. I know you were together. This is like not very funny but I thought it was very funny. For those of you who don't know, I don't drink coffee and I also like I barely drive like I'm the worst driver. I'm trying to- I can't wait to hear how these two folks- We're only trippin like three times in my life. We were upstate. We were staying in your Andes, New York. We didn't have anything to do that day and we looked at our phones and guess what was opening that day? First bloom corner store. The first day of first bloom. You're like we should go to Alison's opening of Alison's store. Yeah. And I was so bored that day that I'd drink and like what's the name of that place? It's a coffee shop but it also smells like outdoorsy where kind of- Cascals outpost. Yes. Yeah. We were there and I had like a- I don't know. I think it's called like a moose latte or something. It has- I checked out. Yeah, it has like a- it was like a- I don't drink coffee. It was like three shops- Did you have me today? I drink a Coca-Cola. Okay. Sorry. Don't call me up. I don't have to. People are listening to you. I'm just kidding. You sound great. I'm nervous. You sound great. We're gonna edit all the settings on purpose. No, no, no. We're not editing this out. So I drink this coffee. It was three shots of espresso and- Oh my God. That's too many. It's like a cup of maple syrup or something. It's crazy. My heart was pounding. I was sweating. I told my friend I was like I'll drive there. I'll drive to Alison's store for the first day. I drove and we started driving like Jason. You're on the wrong side of the road. No. No. And I was like, oh, sorry. And then I got there and you were very busy. And I was like, hey, and you're like, wait, I know you're right. And I was like, yeah. And I was like, I'm Jason. And then you like had to turn around to talk to a customer. But at that moment, I was like very caffeine like ecstasy. Like I felt like I was tripping balls. Yeah, you're really at a tender moment. I was I felt crazy. I should have given you like taking you upstairs, giving you like a blanket or turning around to talk to a guest. And I was like, Hey, I just drove for the first time. I never drive. But you know, to turn your back and you didn't even hear. And then my God, the customers in the store was like, wow, that's great. I'm so proud of you. You know, the first blue customer is nothing if not community oriented and generous and kind. And then we drove away. And she was we saw on the road and we gave her a little wave. And I was like, that's my friend who's supporting me when I drove for the first time. That's a beautiful story. I'm glad you made it because the roads up there can be. I mean, they're nice. It's a safe space, I think, for the most part, because there's they're not there's sparsely popular. There's no there's no line on the road. Yeah, it's kind of a metaphor for us. So what's what's side of the road? What is sides if there's no line? Yeah, I thought that it was just like sides like left and right is a binary. Like are we in the United States in the UK? Are we in the Catskills? I don't know. My girlfriend's from Australia, like, I guess I go to Japan. But you know in Australia, they do drive on the same side as the United States. That's not true. I think it is true. I'm Australian. Are you sure? I'm Australian. I go to Australia. Like American. I'm a I'm a I'm a de facto spouse in Australia. Like I get not until this weekend. You're not. No, we already did it during COVID during COVID. I became like an honorary Australian so that they would let me live there during COVID. There's no COVID there. You were living in Australia during COVID. Six months, no COVID. Wow. Yeah, it was the best. The last person I made out with was an Australian like before like the night before locked out at servos. Wow, at servos. I went to so I went to Wu's and then I went to servos and my friends and I were extremely drunk and it was like nobody was in the streets. I'll give you like a gold. Yes, please. Nobody was in the streets. It was like very apocalyptic. We were all like what is about to go down? This is so airy and wild. And we went to servos and we were going for a night cat martini and the restaurant was pretty much empty and there were like two people in line for the bathroom and I like went in line for the bathroom and I started chatting with this guy that was in line for the bathroom. And like we made out just in line for that. Wow. And then got a star. Like 42. I don't know. I mean, there was the energy of like you know his name. Don't ask me that. No, it's okay. I think his name was Angus. You did remember any other name. His name was Angus. I don't remember any woman's name before my fiance. Yeah. I only know my husband Max. As I remember, I forgot every woman. Exactly. Yeah. That's like anyway, all to say, he went to Australia like the next week and he brought. He was his mission zero. It could have been you, Angus. Yeah. I think that was his name. I feel like that's a memorable name. I shouldn't remember. Angus. That's very Australian. Right. Okay. I'm going to go with that. I have a present for you. Wow. Okay. What is it? It's this. It's a. Oh my god. It's so cute. It's a tiny little Dean and Deluca bag. It's weird. Did you get it from Tokyo? They still have Dean and Deluca and Tokyo. I love it. It's so much. It's a little dusty. It's a little cigarette inside. It's not a real cigarette, but you can pretend. And thank God. I'm a mother now. Yeah. I'm just kidding. You don't. Wait, this is so cool. Yeah. This is for my bachelor at party. Wait, this is amazing. Yeah. Thank you so much. It looks real. It really does. Yeah. This is incredible cigarette. Next time you get pregnant, you got to hold onto that. Go stand and die square and like. Well, Jason. Jason had asked me in an email yesterday. Who's Jason? You. I'm just kidding. I was like, fuck is that? Not your name. I was like, are you Angus? You don't call me that. I'm in my. Oh, sorry. No, no, no. I'm coming out of a closet. Okay. Good. Thank God. I'm Jason now. Well, also, I should say, I mean, we're really jumping around a lot. It's very chaotic episode. But I didn't know who you were. As as your nom de plume. Yeah. Okay. I didn't. I didn't put it together until I like looked on Instagram. I was like, we have all these mutual friends. I don't know who this is. And then you had dinner with my really good friend, a meal. And I was like, yeah, great guy. He's who I was with during the pandemic. Oh, yeah. I lived with him. And I was like, he, and then he described, you know, I was like, I don't know who this is. This is my ex friend's random. No. And then I, well, and then I had, I forget who told me or how I pieced it together. But it then occurred to me that it was you. And I was like, oh, because I know you through such a good business. It's such a bizarre way of people. I try to describe to people the thing. And they're like, seems like it's like, oh, my friends, girlfriends, ex sister, like something. Yeah. This is one of those. This is one I used to work with at no bar. Yeah. You were her friend. Okay. Let's keep it simple. Let's have a story about milk bar. Okay. That is the story that I tell that may or may not be true. Oh, yeah. Okay. So the mutual friend who we know each other through, they worked in milk bar together during the early days of milk bar. Mm-hmm. And she used to bring home cookies. We lived together. And she used to bring home cookies all the time, like test cookies. Some of them were just like leftover cookies at the end of the day. But I remember when the corn cookie was developed, I loved the corn cookie. I still love the corn. It's not so good. But I still, I like the corn cookie was my favorite cookie from milk bar for a time. But when it first came out, I remember she brought it home. She's like, we're testing out these new cookies. And I got the cookie and I brought it to my nose. And it smelled like semen. And then I told her and she said that from my memory of this story, she said that she went home, went back to work. And she told Christina, or whomever, that this, that her roommate said that this cookie smells like semen and that the recipe changed. And it didn't smell like semen afterward. Wow. So is this something that is, I'm completely scared. What's up with the kids saying things are lore. Are you hearing that? I don't know. Because people aren't even using the word correctly. They're just like, that's lore. And I'm like, what? But this would be an example of something being. It's part of my lore. Yeah, this would be lore. Is this lore lies or is lore? - Or the truth. - Laura's just a story that we don't know can be corroborated or not. - Yeah. - Like, we don't know, there's no way of knowing. - But you have no way of gonna be smelling that. - I don't. I'm sorry. It doesn't mean it wasn't true, but I. - You weren't going on smelling that. - I think when things smell like semen, you never forget it. And so I think that if it had, it would not have forgotten. Like those fucking ginkgo trees. - Yeah, ginkgo trees. - Yeah, I'll never forget it. - Yeah, that's it. - And you don't because it happens every year. They don't let you forget. - Yeah, I know. - They're disgusting. - But they taste great. - They're nice. - I used to work at a very, very fancy sushi restaurant that's not being named. And they-- - Tell me later. - There's masa. (laughing) And they used to get their ginkgo nuts. They used to go to Central Park to collect the ginkgo nuts. - Stop. - Yeah. I mean, but then there's, like, you go to these parks and there's like a whole, like, crew of Chinese people trying to collect these nuts. It's like Asian people in general, trying to, like, fighting over these nuts that are all over the ground. - That's incredible. - And it'd be, like, four nuts for, like, $50 or something. - That food cost is nice. - 2010. So that's, like, what, $500 dollar or something. - Yeah, no, it's too much more. - You know, some wine is only aged for, like, a year. Silver oak takes four years. They really take their time with their bottles. - Four years. That's, like, how long it takes to get a table at the corner store. - Exactly. They're patient. It's all carbony, so neon. Age and American oak barrels that they make themselves in Missouri. And over 75% of Silver Oak's grapes are sourced from its own estate vineyards. Sounds like the next season of expense accounts should be shot in California. - I would be totally fine with that, because this account would probably go pretty great with some take out from John and Vinnie's. - The expense account podcast is built in partnership with Substack. I've been spending a lot more time on the Substack app. It's become my favorite escape to scroll productively and it's also where I've felt my business. Substack is where I read Lincoln Bio by Rachel Carton to learn what brands are actually doing right on social media and where writers like Jalille Johnson are reinventing real-time fashion reporting. A few weeks ago, I went live with Derek Thompson and it felt like thousands of us were hanging out and talking about the state of parties. Everything for Feed Me lives there, too. My daily newsletter chats about New York City, live videos with pop stars, like Audrey Hobart, and of course, there's always debates in the comments section. In fact, while I'm here reading this ad to all of you, my readers are talking to each other about where guys on Wall Street have been taking their lunch meetings. Go to Substack.com/Emily to get a free month of Feed Me in the Substack app. - So you have this new book. - I do. - What's it called? - It's called Something from Nothing. - Something from Nothing. I started reading the intro. It's really beautiful. - Did you cry? - I was in the process of writing my wedding vows as listening to the emotional music to get me in the mood, but then I was also reading your book. So I was getting a little like, it was pretty sentimental. - Because I didn't mention wedding vows. - Yeah, that's the thing is that now, I still have not finished my vows, but-- - Oh, I finished mine like-- - I think I'm gonna do it like the day before. - Yeah, and then I had stress dreams about it for like the next six months. - But like, there's a part in the intro for the book where you're talking about your husband's wedding vows and about how he said in his vows that his favorite moments with you are these moments where you're cooking at home and that you are making something from nothing. - Mm-hmm. - And now it's so hard for me to not, like every time I start writing, I'm like, the best moments with you are when you're, when I, then I'm like, oh! - Yeah, and you can quit vows. He crushed mine so hard. Like, I, he's such a great writer and I think that people at the wedding didn't know, like I, because I'm the more public writer, he's more of a writer in like a script film way and I'm like, you know, writer in the way that I'm a writer and I think people expected my vows to be good and they were good, but his were fucking great. They were so great. But yeah, okay, so that part of the vows, I actually hadn't planned on including them and the introduction of my book. That felt like maybe-- - That was really nice. - Two personal, thank you. But my friend of mine who I had passed the introduction along to, who knows me pretty well and who was at my wedding, she was like, you know, that moment and like what he said, really, I feel like belongs in this book. Yeah, which was basically like this sort of sentiment that because he got to see my creativity at work and that was what drew him to me and he was like, my favorite times with you are like, when I see you do what you do best and like be creative. - I mean, that's the coolest thing about, when you see your partner like cooking, like literally, or a bit of work, like that. That's like the sexiest, that's the thing that makes you a lot of the partner. - And in my case, it's both medical, ethical, ethical, yeah, yeah. - But the book was, I looked through PDF. It was great, it's so like confident. The other books are about like making food for like show kind of and this is just like making food for yourself and for your family, it's about like beating more than it's about hosting. - Impressing, yeah, I feel like, yeah. In a way that's like actually, like it's everything, I'm like, I'm astonished at how simple everything is but it's like it all that has your depth to it. - Thank you, I appreciate that. Yeah, I hope that people don't interpret simple as boring because I don't think simple is boring and I think we know that when something is executed well and it's like a technique-based thing where it's like, are you roasting it long enough? Are you cooking it long enough? Are you doing it at the right time? It makes such a difference, but I think dining in for me was like, okay, this is who I am and there was a lot of pressure for your debut book or your first book to be like, I gotta like really cram it in. I gotta be like, okay, I'm showing range. There's like a bit of like first impression energy and you're like, okay, you're like first date, you're like, I'm like wearing my best outfit. I'm like, this is who I am. And the second book, Nothing Fancy, it was sort of like, you know, subtitle was on Fancy Food for having people over because that whole ethos was like, it's not entertaining, it's having people over. I'm like really trying to make people feel comfortable that like, if you're not sort of of the Martha Stewart era, where like you're not gonna build a tower out of like shellfish and olives and what crudite, that you can still invite people in your home and cook for them, but like that does involve a certain, a different style of cooking than like when you're at home making lunch. Yeah, yeah, and I mean, most cooking is actually just at home making lunch. Exactly. One of the people should be at home making lunch rather than eating something. Yes, exactly. It's not that hard, which is such a cool thing about it. And would you describe them as pantry meals? I feel like I don't even want to describe it. Well, pantry meals are such a gross thing to say. Yeah, it's like the lamest phrase in the planet. I can't help but that, do you know, pantry meals? Yeah, pantry. I don't even like word pantry is like the least sexy thing you could say. Yeah, I mean, it's like panty pantry. I know, it's like, I don't love it. It doesn't feel good in the mouth. They also got bad mouth feel. I know, but it is like, you know, it's worse than pantry covered. Huh, I mean, well, you have those upstate, but we don't have those. We don't have those upstate. What do you mean upstate? You don't, you have a little nook in a little cupboard. We have them in the 18th century. It's interesting how surely there's a cupboard. Yes, it's interesting how there's a cupboard. Because they are rooted in a hearth energy mentality. I don't think by virtue of being north of Pekipsi, you have a cupboard, but that's minus conception. Yeah, that's something that a lot of people don't know is that just because you're past a certain point upstate, you have a cupboard. But yeah, really unsexy connotation to that. And like, you know, I don't want people to think this book is just like cans of beans, like warmed over a tea light and like hoping for the best. Like it's red and redemption. Yeah, like there's, it's also just like, okay, how do you, like if I'm gonna buy a jar of capers, what else do I do with it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's a whole chapter on vegetables. Obviously, vegetables are not in your pantry. Yeah. But like, you should be able to be like, okay, if I have a fennel bulb. Yeah. And a jar of capers, can I make something really amazing with those two things if you already have like olive oil and salt and the answer is yes. I mean, the thing that's so daunting about so many cookbooks is like going to the store and searching for all the ingredients. That's annoying. It's like, I don't want to have to buy lime leaves or whatever. Oh, yeah. I don't know. That's the hard part of them. I'm like, oh, then I have to spend like $50 on like new ingredients when I could just go to a restaurant. Yeah, I think if you like start with what you have in your pantry. And like honestly, a lot of the recipes in this book and the food that I've been cooking over the last few years has sort of started with the fact that like I was upstate during that time a lot. And I didn't want to leave the house or the grocery store was 20 minutes away or was snowing or like the grocery store was closed. So I was like, okay, well, I have a can of tomatoes. I have a bag of lentils. I have like half a bunch of old herbs and like a frozen chicken. Like what? Okay. Well, let's just figure it out. And that's real cooking. Yes, it is real cooking. And that doesn't mean that it's like a failure. I think there's just like weird energy where it's like, oh, I just made like a fridge clean out meal. It's like some of my best work is fridge clean out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, that's the most impressive thing. That's really like having constraints like that is we're real art size. Yes. Anybody can do anything if you have access to everything. And when you don't, that's when like real ingenuity and like it shows actually how skilled you are. And I think that the ability to also like not put an extra flourish on something and be like this is confident enough to stand alone. Like, there's not a ton of herbs in this book. There's not a ton of like yogurt or cheese or whatever to finish shit with. It's like a very brown, earthy like like we're leaving it. Yeah, yeah. And like also the reader, I think at this point, I'm saying at this point, meaning like assuming they've read all my books, they know they cannot yogurt. They know they cannot cheese. They cannot herbs. They've grown up with you. Yes, hopefully. And I think that they know these things are sort of like the baseline. Yeah. Sometimes I'm like, even I go to a restaurant, I'm like herbs are crotch. I don't know. - I went to a restaurant the other day, I'm not kidding. This salad had 87 things in it. It was an abomination, and I couldn't believe it. I couldn't taste a single, I was like, what the fuck is going on here? - I almost love how, like, egregious that is. - You know, I will say above all, as well as the different episodes? - Like, can you even name me 87 different ingredients? - No, me neither. But, like, I loved the restaurant because of how unabashedly Balzi it was. - Yeah. - But I did not enjoy the food. - And they were, my friends were so confused. So, like, so you loved the restaurant, but didn't like anything we had, and I said, "Absolutely." - Lots of restaurants I don't like, but I like all of the food. Could you write reviews, you think? - Yes, I would love to write reviews. - You should do it. - I can't write them with my real name, though. And I think people would know that it was me. - Do it as J. Lee. (laughing) - Do you know how jealous I was of you when you started writing reviews? - I don't know. - For that reason. - And everyone's like, "Oh, now you see his face." - Yeah, well. - But, you, I, I would, that's my dream job. - Yeah. - Because I think that I'd be really good at it, because I, I really, I'm, I'm so not out to get anyone at a restaurant, and I also understand what it's like to work at one. I understand how hard things are. Like, I really feel like I'm looking at it holistically, and, like, feel a lot of empathy for the struggle of, like, front of house, for back of house, for cost, for this, that and the other. And, like, especially in New York, where it's really hard to do this, but I also think that people are not fucking rising to the occasion. - No. - You should, for the amount of money we're spending, we should expectations. - And if we can't do it, don't do it. - We deserve the world. - Yeah. - And you know what the problem is, it's the people with the money don't have the taste or the skill. - Yeah, yeah, I know, it's like-- - And the people with the skill and the taste, oftentimes don't have the resources and the money to execute. - Yeah, I know. - And so you've got this, whatever, I don't need to tell you that, but. - But, do you think that I could write recipes? (laughs) - No. - How could a person, do you think it's the best person? Like, should it be a person that's worked in a kitchen? - I don't know. I think it's a really specific skill set. And it's really hard to tell now because. - Yeah. - So you think I can't do it? - No. Well, you could, anyone can do it. If you-- - You said no already. - I know. But I'm just hearing you talk and I'm thinking, no. I'm thinking that's not the right skill set thing. - I know, I would be myself up over too much. I'm pretty adept cook, but I'm very hard on myself. Yeah, and I don't measure. And I'm more of an intuitive kind of cook. - Yeah, and that's the thing. - I can make a recipe. I can tell someone how to make the cook. - Yeah, I mean, you can if you decided to dedicate your life to it. And the way that I have, I don't write shit down or keep track of what I'm cooking when I'm cooking, but I can also cook something and then 15 minutes later write down exactly what I did without actually measuring anything and have you follow it. And I bet the recipe would work. - Yeah, I'm very-- - But only because it's like, I've been doing it for so long. It's like a muscle memory thing. But I think that there are plenty of people that are great writers and not great at recipe writing and plenty of people that are great chefs and great cooks that aren't good at recipe writing. - Yeah, I mean, you're a really good writer. Like, some people that write recipes, I'm like, their recipes are good, but you're actually a very good at telling a story or something. - I appreciate that. - Like, when you were a kid, is this something, I don't know, the kids want to-- - I want to be a writer. - You did? - Yeah, I want to be a writer, but I didn't think that that was like a viable career path. I didn't think it wasn't on my list. That's things. - It was on your list. - Veterinarian and English teachers. - And that's like, yeah, it's like, you have a hot English teacher. - The class of caring of vet and English teachers. - Yeah, mine's like spy or maybe like, I'd be like a forensic scientist or doc, like some kind of like surgeon or something. - You're so unimaginable as a child because especially in like a, I mean, I'd be interested to ask kids today 'cause they have access to something. - People want to be Allison Roman though. There are people in the world that want to be-- - I mean, that is very flattering. Yeah, I mean, because-- - He addresses you for Halloween. - I do, yeah. I mean, I'm such a fucking predictable. I mean, I'm wearing an awesome costume right now, my god. - I'm like, I'm gonna wear like a sweater of Jacob's sweater on my neck. - This isn't joker. - Yeah, but the button down is, but the button down is. (laughing) - Damn it. I know. But yeah, I did want to write. I spent a lot of time writing as a kid. It was like a real form of communication and like, you know, I guess it's like kind of, it's not a dark story, but like, I was grounded a lot as a kid, because I was fat and nothing. It was just the way that my mom disciplined, I guess, and to get out of being grounded, I wrote a lot of letters. - Who are you writing letters to, Connor? - My mom. - Oh, to your mom. - To my, to my local judge. - You know what I'm doing? - To my mom. - To be like, it's what I call back. - Do you slam, I wrote you, but you're still in calling. - No, to be like, here's why I shouldn't be grounded. - Oh wow. - But they were good and I wasn't grounded anymore. - Really? - Yeah. - What was your case, you're a good girl? - No, I was like, here's why. And I would like, anyway, and my mom was like, "Damn, it's good." This is well written, but I'll just say that I read a lot as a kid and I very early on, attached myself to the idea that writing was a very, for me anyway, effective way to communicate my feelings in a way that I didn't always find possible verbally. - Yeah, I mean, I'm only just starting to write really, I never really. - How did the, how did you get here? - Me? I just have been doing Instagram and then basically, I realized that my best skill is, I can write a cover letter. I'm like, any job that I apply to and I'm grossly underqualified, I get a call back from anywhere because I'm really good at writing a cover letter. I realized it was like the first writing ever did. - So niche. - Yeah, I mean, and then it was just me being manipulative basically. - Well, what do you think I did to get out of being grounded? - Yeah, I was saying. - I'm a huge manipulator, yeah. - It wasn't that you could be an effective emotional manipulator through your words. - Wow, that's, wow. - And that's what I'm trying to do with my wedding vows. - She's already said yes, you're already married, you said. So she's in. - Domestic partners. - Okay, but you're also manipulating the audience. - Yeah, yeah, I know. - And that's huge. And there is a pathological thing about writing publicly where you are sort of trying to manipulate them into getting them either on your side or there's something there. - Yeah, yeah, I mean, I think when you're writing, like, are you trying to be a people pleaser? - Not anymore. - That's, yeah, I feel like I recognize that in especially in a new book. - Thank you. - I'm definitely trying to be a people pleaser. - You can't, I'll save you the time. - I like a little bit of pleasing. But yeah. - And once you find a people, you can- - I'm mostly pleasing myself. - Yeah, and once you find the people you can please, that's great. And then if there's like a life cycle to public writing or public persona anyway, where there's like, when you're new, you, and then the people that start to like you, you're like, they're like, oh, do you know this kind of, this is amazing, it's amazing. And so let's say then you have like 10 people in a room and they're like, wow, we love this. - Yeah. - And you're like, this is great. And then all of a sudden you look up one day and there's like the 10 people who really like you. And then there's like, you know, let's call it four people who really don't like you. And then like a few people that are like indifferent. And you're like, well, how'd you get in here? - Yeah. - And then double that time and there's like, a mix of all those things. And you're like, well, what happened to just the 10 people who really liked me? Cause that was awesome. - Yeah. - But like you can't really control that, right? - Yeah. - And so I think the second that you start to- - You read the comments like that? - Never. I never read the comments anymore. - It doesn't ever like, you never like hate your motivation. - Never. - Yeah. - Because I've been through so many cycles of quote haters and like, now the internet is like- - Oh, it's crazy. - Buckwild in a way that is like, I'm not even curious anymore. Before I'd be like, well, what are they saying? Like, I'm not even, there's not even a small part of it. - You don't have to know if they're a real person at this point. - They're almost never, they almost never are. I, unrelated, but I, whatever it has matter, I was just gonna take too long to tell the story. No, I'm just, I've noticed like this weird uptick in targeted bots. And I've noticed this because I've done a lot of podcasts lately where the podcast itself will add me as like a collaborator. Where it's, so I'm not posting for my account, right? So the comments I'm getting are targeted at that podcast, not at me. And so it's like talking shit on the host. And it, and so I never, I don't know, but you click on the profiles and it's all, and the comments are very pointed. They're pointed at the host and they're very personal and they're complete sentences. They're not like AI slop, right? - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - But you click on the profiles and they're all like 24 year old blonde girls that go to San Diego University. And I'm like, there's no way that those girls know who that person is. Like they're not real accounts. And so I'm like, what are we, what's going on here? - This is like a terrifying to me. - I feel like I'm wearing a Conor-O-Malley podcast right now. I'm like, what's happening? - I wish I was the funny. - Yeah, anyway, I'll just say that you stop learning to try to please people because then you start not being yourself. And I had dipped into that at some point where like, you're trying to soften yourself or your edges or your opinions or this because you realize piercing people off makes you feel bad. - Yeah. - And then you realize you don't like yourself when you start to not be yourself. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, I guess, I'm not sure if that is true. (laughing) - And you never lose that, Jason. - You're enough. - Yeah, Jason, I just actually, you know, I changed my last name yesterday. - You did? - Yeah. - So what? - My girlfriend's last name. - You took her name. - Yeah, 'cause she is the coolest. - What is it? - Gauntlet. - Gauntlet? - Jason Gauntlet. - That's not her last name. - Gauntlet, like the night's glove. - No, I know what it is. - Yeah. - Wow. - 'Cause we gotta imagine it's different. - It is so metal. - Yeah, it's sick. It's like, you gotta wear a certificate and they're like, does that, do you either of you want to change your name? I was like, sure, why not? And then I was like, - That's cool. - Jason Gauntlet, come on, that's sick. Come on, I sound like a spy. - That's doing huge numbers for you. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. But can we shout out, we're not doing shout outs yet. - Okay. - But can we like, talking about best, in my opinion, the best restaurant in America, you know what it is, you know what it is. It's not in New York, it's not in LA, it's not in Chicago. - And you know that I've been there? - Yes. It's in North Carolina. - Nangs? - Yes, nangs. - You know I've never been. - Oh, but you went to their wedding. - Yes, I've cooked with silver, I've had silver's food, I've never been in a name. - Oh, we should go. - I know. - We should actually go. Like I want an excuse to go, let's go, actually. - They're in town next week. - Oh really? - Do you want to come to lunch with us? - Yeah. - Okay, we're going to lunch on Tuesday. - I'm free. - Next Tuesday. Okay, where should we go? We actually don't have a place to go. We can talk off fun. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I honestly think Nangs is the best restaurant in America. I don't know how it's not on any lists. It's been on a few lists, it needs to be. - On more lists, yeah. - Number one. - You know, I don't pay attention to lists. - They're almost. - Any more, I know, for that exact reason. But I hear you because to a lot of people, they're not bullshit. And to a lot of restaurants and businesses, they're really maker-break. And so I agree, for the businesses, it's very, very important. - It's just like one of the most radical meals I've had that like- - Really? When did you go? - I actually went for my, it was like the first year they opened, when was it like two years ago for their, my friends' bachelorette party. - Oh, man. - I mean, I planned the bachelorette party kind of, and I really wanted to go to Nangs. And so I was like, let's go to Asheville. We can go hiking. - Cool. - We can go to the restaurant and go to. - Oh, nature, yeah. - Yeah, my friends and nature guy. But I loved it. And then they did a pop-up here. And I don't ever hold it against a pop-up. It's hard when you're not- - Pop-ups are tough. - Yeah, but they, one, the menu was big and two, everything fucking hit. And all the ingredients were like, they had their sourcing like top-notch. Everything was like- They care, so how do you met Silver or Cherry? - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I hadn't really known them before. I ate at the restaurant, but now it's been like three years. So we're like on the online market. - Silver cares so much. Just like the level of, I would say, not like detail because there's nothing that's like fussy or precious or like fine dining-y in my eyes. It's more just like detail in like what you were saying, like sourcing and like soul. And it has to be this way because it's what feels right. Like there's intuition and love that goes into it. And it's, yeah. - Yeah, I don't know. And just like the- - And also just like unique food. - Yeah, like Filipino food. - It's one of the few times- - I've eaten a lot of food. And it's like one of the few times I've eaten a meal and I felt like I'd shift in my palate. - Oh, wow. - Like there was like a bitter melon dish that I like can't stop thinking about. - You know what I'm reminding me of? The first time I had Silver's food was like, and this may be reductive. - Yeah, yeah. - But it was like the first time I had like Mission Chinese food. - Yeah, that's exactly what it is. I mean- - Well, you're like, "Oh, wow." Well, you're just like, "Oh, I've truly never had food like this before." - Yeah, yeah, Mission Chinese. Yeah, for me was very formative for us to add. - Me too. - Yeah, and I remember loving taking everyone that comes to town. - Me too. - My friends from Chicago, I was like, "You never have food like this in your life." - Yeah, it felt like very, I went to the one in San Francisco. So I had had like versions of it, but the New York one was really special. - Yeah. What's your keens order? Depends on how many people I'm with. Let's go for, I always do the Porter House for two, that feeds four people. - That's it. - No, that's, yeah. We only get that, we're fucking keto over here. - Yeah, I think so. - I thought I was talking about that. - I'm just saying for the meat, you need one steak. Even the Chateau-Briam for three is too much meat for four people. I'm here to say. So Porter House for two, for four people. I'm working backwards here. Cream spinach, I like the baked potato, which is controversial, because it's the least interesting potato. - That's one of the least favorite potatoes. - I know, but it comes with the sour cream and chives, and a butter, and the flaky salt, and the pepper, and you make your own little situation. - It feels very you. - Let her cook, you know what I mean? Table-side baked potato, I love to see it. - Yeah, you like a- - I also like the tiny potatoes with the butter and the herbs. - Yeah. - I'm just not, 'cause the other friends fry with a, that keens. - I'm fry, but I get the hash brown. - They're not really hash browns. - Yeah, I know, but I, I'm just like, I don't know. - They're good, they're fine. You know, I'm a, I can. - Mashed potato, a mash. - I'll do the mashed potato, because more than 90% likelihood that somebody I'm with wants the mashed potatoes. - Yeah, everybody wants them. I don't even love it, but yeah, you got anything else. - Well, good, I'm, mashed potatoes just always make me feel like. - You know the mutton? - No. - You don't do the mutton. - I mean, I, I do it, I don't, - You've done it. - Do it at Keynes, no. - Huh. - Yeah, I do the porterhouse for two, for four. - Oh, yeah, I need to be a fan of my- - If we're a six, I'll do both. - Yeah. - Before four, I do porterhouse for two, for four. - Yeah. - And then I do, I also really like the string beans. - Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. - And sad, I have her vegetable sides in my, okay. Then I do, from the top, I do shrimp cocktail. - Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. - I do, listen, carefully, this one. - I'm listening. - I do the wedge salad. - Yes. - No bacon or tomato. - No bacon? - Listen, no. And I do the dressing on the side, because I like to dip. And if they ask you to chop it, you say no. - I don't know. - So listen. - So listen. - Okay, okay. - And then, and then you order the bacon on the side, which is thicker and crispier and juicier than if they had cut it up for you and put it on the wedge. And you get more of it, and it's more delicious. And it's more meat that also augments your order of the porterhouse for two, for four. - You're like one of those people that's like, you gotta be really nice to the people at Chipotle. (laughing) If you get a burrito bowl, and then you ask for a side of tortilla, you get way bigger. - Okay, so I live in San Francisco for a long time, and that was, and I had no money. I was like, so broke. And I lived down the street from this tockery, and what I would do is I would get one, I found the tockery that had the most generous portion tockos. And I would order one tocko and then get the chips, the free chips. - Yeah. - And then I would. - With your nachos. - Yeah, I would sit there with my one tocko, and then I would eat the meat on the chips, and it was like I had two meals. I knew how to stretch, and I know how to optimize, and I know how to order at a restaurant. - It was a very skinny friend, and I called her one tocko, 'cause we went to a restaurant, she only ordered one tocko. - That's a disgrace. Well, unless you're me and you're 23 living in San Francisco, you don't have any money. - No, I'm starting to feel bad for calling her one tocko. - Yeah, I would feel bad. But how many times have you been to LVD, Louis Vuittor? - At least six. - At least six. I feel like I love Louis Vuittor. I almost went there yesterday, but I was like, if I go there, I'm not gonna be able to do this podcast today. - Yeah, you really, you know what's funny, 'cause the first, second and third time I went, I was pregnant. So I didn't even fully have the kind of fun way to experience it. - It is, I was glad, actually. - Yeah, 'cause like-- - And I was drinking a little bit of wine and stuff, so I wasn't like, you know, well, not without some of the zero. Not without some earthly delights, but yeah, that's also where you get in trouble financially at LVD. Like you can kind of get out there reasonably if you're not drinking, but the second you're like, you start with a martini and then you have a bottle of wine and then you end with a cocktail. It's like, then you're looking at-- - It's too bottle of wine, it's like, it's real. - And then you end with a bottle of wine. - And that's my thing about the grill, so I'm like, the grill is actually reasonably priced. - Is it? - I don't know. - No. - It's perfect, so you know going in. You're like, okay, 125. And if you didn't have a drop of alcohol with tip, you're getting out 150, right? The grill, there is no chance in hell that you're getting out there, even if you didn't drink alcohol for under 150. - What if you get a steak, one martini's two martini's there? - Okay. - What if you get only-- - It's like one tacos, two tacos. (laughing) - We're just gonna steak one martini in a salad, or the duck all oppressed in a salad. - I gotta be honest, I've been to the grill maybe twice in my life, and the last time was, I can't even remember when. - Yeah, the room is very beautiful. - I don't ever dine with anyone who wants to go there, and I don't wanna suggest it. - Yeah, it's weird to be like-- - Because it's so expensive. - Let's go to the grill. - It just, for some reason, feels too much, even for me, who loves nice things, but that's maybe too nice. - Something from-- - Yeah, that's like-- - Yeah, unless it's a humble can of beans, I'm not interested. - Yeah. - We talk about Valley, Ali. - Ali from a Valley. - Ali from the Valley. - Yeah. - That's you. - Yeah. - How's that? (laughing) - What was that? Well, I was in high school. It was awesome. - But it was calling you that people from the Valley too? - It's such a dumb lot. I mean, no one cares about this. - It's a good rhyme. - Okay, it is, yeah, it is a good rhyme. When I grew up in the Valley, the San Fernando Valley-- - Yeah. - Eight in a row. - Eight in a row. - Yeah. My friends and I were all friends with the boys. Like my girlfriends and I were friends with a group of boys, and they lived in Thousand Oaks, which is an 805 area. - Okay. - Okay, so we were in the Valley, they were in Thousand Oaks, and I was Ali from the Valley. - That's what they call you. - Yeah, because it rhymes. - It rhymes. It's a good nickname. - I know. - Yeah, but if you're not in the Valley presently, it doesn't quite track. And then when I left high school, I became Allison. - I was only Ali for four years. - This is how the reason that I asked is not one 'cause it's a good nickname. - Thank you. - And two, just 'cause I feel like you're one of the few people that I would never, I guess I know that you're from LA, but like you are, feel like a New Yorker to me. You're like one of the 15 years. - Yeah, I know. You're one of the few people that I feel like really made the real transition. - Oh, yeah. I feel like I really have. People ask me all the time if I would go back, but I think it's because people don't know that I'm from there. So they ask me if I would move there. - Would you? - No. - Okay. - I love to hear it. - No, I have no interest in that. - I love to hear it. - I think the only time I think about it in sort of like a wistful way is, you know, now that I have a baby it'd be nice to be close to my family. And like sometimes when I see my friends that have like purchased houses and they have a yard. - Got a yard in a house. - Well, yeah, yes, it's very different story. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - It's a story. I don't live there full time, and it's on a highway. And it's very different. It was a grocery store, but yeah, I don't know. But no, culturally we're not a match. - You were an LA person, you're a New York person. I know you're an upstate person. - No, I'm not yet. - That's hard. - It is hard. And I mean, it's really on my mind lately, especially because. - When do you cross the line? - I think you gotta be full time. - Okay. - I really do. And I tried to do both, and I think that I proved to myself that at least for me, it didn't work. - But you're split like. - Right now it's not. - Because you have your, you have your. - It's because I'm blaming, yeah, also I'm blaming the baby. I won't bore you with the details, but basically like, once you commit to child care in any capacity, whether it's daycare or nanny, you pay for it. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - And when you don't use it, you still pay for it. So like, going upstate for a week, you're still paying for it. Then we go upstate, and then so it's like, my husband and I have to split the day. It's like, okay, I'll watch him from this hour to the end. And then you're, and we can't afford to not work. And so we need help. And we're lucky enough to be able to afford the help, but like, yeah, I mean, any person who's a parent will tell you it's such a mind-fuck to be like, wait, I work to afford the person to watch my baby. - Yeah, that's what I'm saying, so that can work. - Yeah, you're like, you know, but if you love what you do, do you ever work a day in your life? - I keep trying to, I mean, like, when does the time come for me? I'm getting married, but apart, man, I'm like, when does the time come? - Do you want kids? - Yeah, surely, some day when I'm rich. - Surely. - When I'm rich. - You know what's funny? I don't think you have to be rich to have kids. And I say that because there's like this misconception that people are gonna like, right, but people are gonna like have their shit together, they're emotionally or financially and then have kids. I don't know anyone who has parents that had their shit together financially or emotionally before they had kids. Most people I know, they're like, yeah, my parents didn't do X, Y or Z until they was like seven. - Yeah, no, that's fine. So I want to go on vacation, the grill every night, I like, every night I go to the grill. I don't want to give up my grill habit, you know? - Yeah, well, you can't go to the grill with a, with a lay-off fall. - And not allowed children. - No, I, you know, I tried to go to, for my 40th birthday, I was in Italy, we went to Italy with a baby. - Nice. - Mostly fine. - Where'd you go? - We went to Pullia and Rome and Sicily. Yeah. - Nice. - That was great. - Piazza Romano. - No. But I, long story, but our Airbnb canceled 'cause they had like a septic tank explosion and I was like, you know what, I'm gonna go to Il Pelicano. It's my 40th birthday, fuck it, let's do it. I had like credit card points that I hadn't used. And I was like, okay, the only thing less sexy than pantry is buying a hotel room at Il Pelicano with credit card points. - Oh, no. - That's sexy for me. - It was sexy. It showed that I am physically responsible. - That's where my girlfriend's main thing. - Credit card points should be sexy. I think it's hot. If you can do something really nice for yourself. - Let's, let's go, let's go. I, I hear you and I see you and yes. - Let's make 'em sexy, baby. - I am with you, I'm at 100%. We love our chase-fire card in this house. (laughing) - Anyway, and so I called, yeah, we gotta cut all that out. Shit. - No, we gotta, we gotta. - And so I booked it and I was pumped and I was like, "Gabe, we're doing it, I deserve it, I'm 40." And I called them like three days before we were supposed to arrive and I was like, "Hey, I'm just calling "to make sure you have the crib in the room." And they're like, "The crib." And they're like, "I was like, yeah, for the baby." And they're like, "Oh, no, we don't allow children "under eight." - At the hotel? - Yeah. And I was like, what? - Just sleep on the side. (laughing) - Just sleep in the car, sorry. - I was like, you mean my perfect son? Who sleeps like 19 hours a day? It's not allowed in the whole property. Anyway, so we had to cancel and reschedule, luckily, the nice folks at Chase caught me my points back. - Oh, I mean, I've been at Chase customers for those like 15 years old. - Same as my first and only back. - Me too. - I've only ever had Chase. Actually it was a Washington Mutual when I signed up. - Mine was first Chicago. - See, yeah, it was like a small regional bank. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But you have something, you have like a new thing that's new that I'm just hearing about today, right? - Yeah, I, I, I, I, I surprise launched. - I saw this next shot. - I know, I saw that too. - Like right before the spot I was like, no one told me. - I know, well, cause I didn't know when exactly when we were launching. - Yeah, yeah, where's this from, that sauce? - I know, yeah, I, I came out the tomato sauce. - Just one. - Three flavors. - Three flavors, what is it called? It's called a very good sauce. - This, this was called. - Yeah. I think it's actually called a very good tomato sauce. (laughing) I think I should look at it. - I should look at it. - I don't know, I've been like staring at it for 100 years and so it's under the first bloom name because it's sort of a pantry staple. - Yeah, one of the three flavors. - It's a classic sort of garlicy tomato. It's the last time I'll ever use the word garlicy and I'm sorry for creating a monster. A spicy tomato with fennel and then a caramelized shallot with anchovy, which is a mild after the shallot pasta. - You brought the shallot pasta back in the new book too. - I did. - It's time, how long has it been? - It's, I mean at this point, it's a relic. The shallot pasta recipe was published in 2019. - It's like Indy Sleeves. - I know, maybe, yeah. - There's something, can you imagine there are people that are born that do not know at shallot pasta, but they're gonna know now. - Yeah, yeah, it's time. - Yeah, I felt really, I was excited to put that in a book. I was like, I really kind of wrestled with it. I was like, it's, yeah, it felt so good. - I was like, do I? - I was like, it exists online, but like does it belong? It's like, it does belong at a book because there's a difference between a recipe that is online under somebody else's published situation and owning your own shit and putting it in your own book. - Was it changed at all or? - No, 'cause it's perfect. - I guess the way that was presented is just. - I took a new photo. - Yeah, it was just, I don't know, it's so cool. I loved that. It's like an anarchy remaking funny games or something. - Basically, yeah. - It's shot for shot, with different people. - Michael Pitt. - Yeah, exactly. - R.I.P. - I loved, did he die? - No, he's just, yeah, M.I.A. - Okay, so next time say M.I.A, don't say R.I.P. - He just washed. - He just washed. - Maybe he's coming back. - Yeah, let's, I don't need him. - Okay, he can stay. Wherever he is then. Yeah, anyway, so I made, we made tomato sauce. This was like a long time project that I'd been working on and it takes for fucking ever to come to life and I was supposed to launch it last December. - Yeah. - And then I had the baby a month early and put everything on hold and was like, well, I'm not gonna launch it in the summer. Like it was just like, never the right, and I was like, when I was the right time. - Yeah, it's full. - Yeah, it's ready. - Are there seed oils? - There's no seed oils. - Oh, seed oil. - There's no protein added and no seed oils. No sugar added. Also, I'm gonna take, I'm gonna use this platform to say it's not a marinara sauce and all tomato sauces are. Every fucking tomato sauce on the market that is being shoved on our throats is a marinara sauce. - So what makes it not a marinara sauce? - It has texture. There's like bits of tomato and garlic and onion and it's like chunk. I mean, I'm not gonna use the word chunky because that's gross. - You're like, it's chunky, it's garlicky, it's lemony, it's gochujangy. - Sup it. Sup it right now. You shut the fuck up. No, it's like it has texture, it has body, it has like personality. It's not a smooth, it's not a thick soup. - Yeah. - You know what I mean? - That's awesome. Yeah, I'm always like, I don't know how soft it is. - And it's not the spirit marinara marinara. It's popular for a reason. It has a time and a place, but it's sort of become all we know. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Unless somebody goes out of their way to be like, this is a chunky marinara. And you're like, well, what if we didn't do that? - You're like with pulp. - Exactly. It's very with pulp. Again, this isn't, it's not like an either or situation. There's room for all sauces. But I was like, oh, yeah, there really isn't one like this. And I think it's important for me to say also that it's like not a replacement for cooking or for making your own stuff. It's more for like when you can't cook or when you don't want to cook. - Yeah. - Because I experience that too. - It's funny because my girlfriend's family from Australia is in town right now. And like marinara sauce is not, it's like an American thing. - Yeah, it's very, very American. - I think like to them, a marinara sauce is a seafood pasta. And that's because it's marinara. - Like of the, of the sea. - Marinara, of marine mariners. - And it makes sense that that should be a case. - I hear marinara, I think mozzarella stick. I think dipping. - Yeah, what did I, oh, at the odion, they use, what are they, it's like, - I can't, you know, I gotta talk about the odion menu with you one day. - Oh yeah, it's, I gotta be in my bonnet. - Okay, we will, yeah, the menu, I love how nice it is. - That's an example. - I love the restaurant. - Yeah. - I got some notes. - I got some notes. - Oh my god, let me read a review. And you just publish it. - Yeah, that's what I'm saying, you can be me. I will be your, you can be my, you're not. - I'll be your, we're going to, we're going to want. - Yeah, you're out of two of you. - Okay. - Okay, so now we're going to do our shout outs. - Okay, I'll start, think of some stuff. - Yeah, yeah, I'll start. So I'm shutting out. Fausto. Fausto is my barber. He works it. That you were going to say the restaurant on Flatbush. I was like, wow. Oh, I know. Yeah. I'm like, I'm really into this time. I said, no, it's my barber, Fausto. I don't know his last name I should, but he is a key to salon. And he's been coming to my hair for like three years. I just got my hair cut for my wedding. He is, I don't really understand what he exactly what the qualifications are, but he's a master barber. I go to the shop called Keita because it's a Japanese barber shop. He, I tried to make an appointment with someone. He's the only one that's not Japanese. He's amazing. Like, never have to go in and show him like a picture of like another man. Like, I'm like, this guy looks hot. Can I, which never works. Yeah, I'm like, can you make me look like this hot guy? No, and he can't. He's just, he just, you go in. He sat down in his chair and he knows exactly what to do with your hair. And he takes like 10 minutes and he can talk to him and he makes pleasant conversation or not. And he's just so efficient. He's never like asking you what to do. He just does it and it's right. And so that's so rare. And I got in trouble with him for a while because like, I showed up like 10 minutes late, like three times in a row and he, he told my friend to tell me that my friend, like a bunch of my friends get their hair cut by him to tell me that I was in trouble. And so now I'm just trying to get back in his good graces. Fausto, we love you right or die, Fausto. Yeah. Wow, Fausto. Okay, getting a lot of airtime. Yeah. Just because it's top of mind, I am going to shout out Isabel and Narnie, who I work with because they basically helped when I said, like, how soon can we have a tomato sauce in the world? Yeah. They made it happen in such a way that like also allowed me to be a new parent and finish a cookbook and do all the hundred other things that I was doing and did such an amazing job. And like, this was not a project that we did with like outside funding or any other company or brand. No, I want to approach you to do it. No, that's so cool. I was just like, I want to do this. I wonder how these, I always wondered how these things happen. And I always imagine like, there's a lot of different ways. Like, Prego comes to you and is like, oh, we can like put your face on a Prego bottle or whatever. They never approached me. So I approached myself. Yeah, nice. When you said Prego, I thought you were like referring to me being Pregnant. And I was like, please don't ever say that word. That is disgusting. Yeah, no. Anyway, but they worked really hard and everybody involved it. And I just think that there's something to be said for doing things in a small, organic way. And it's so undervalued, especially, I think, in the food world, especially in the CPG world. Or everything is just like a consumer packaged goods. So like anything that's on the shelves in the store. Where it's like scale, scale, scale, like you launch with like a $22 million funding round and you're launching in target and like, how fast can you be? Yeah, be bought by Prego. It's either Prego faucet or you can want to get bought by Prego. Exactly. And that's always the end goal. And to just kind of start something small and just be like, I don't know, like, I don't know. People that are business minded are probably listening, being like, you're an idiot. And that's a bad idea. But I have done well so far and I do believe that good things, like, uh, succeed. And anyway, shout out to small businesses and to people doing things in a small way. Yeah, uh, you need a Gideos or like, I mean, Prego. Yeah. Anyway, Prego, call me, you know. My next shout out is something related to something we're talking about, like, right before we started recording. Um, shout out to Flipper, my cat. Wow. Oh, yeah, yeah. She's like been struggling lately. Lots of prayers. Got up, uh, uh, UTI. And I just found out through Allison and through Cammy who, uh, works with feed me that there's like an epidemic of cat UTI at the moment. Well, among us three, because all three of our cats have a UTI. They don't have, uh, Ryan has a cat. Ryan has a cat, uh, but no UTI. It's a baby cat. You're a baby. How old is your cat? Can I see a picture later? Okay. It's very cute. Uh, well, he just just proved my theory, but well, he's too young. Yeah, he's, and guys don't get UTIs. They do, they, well, they get, they get urine crystals. But I don't know. I want all the cats that are out there with UTIs really hanging there. Stop hanging on our rugs. We're mad. We don't like it. We understand it, but it's not good. Just like, and once they go once, I know, I know, I know, I know. It sucks. Shout out nature's miracle. Yeah, which is a good. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But then that, that to me smells bad. It's a pee. No, it doesn't smell bad. It's a pee. Nothing smells bad. I don't know. Now I just associate the smell of pee with the smell of the, uh, the inside cleaner or whatever. Um, okay. I'm going to shout out, uh, my local flower shop garden garden. Yeah, GRDN. This is in the city or it's in Brooklyn, Brooklyn. Yeah, they have such a delightful array of flowers all the time. And it is like a bright spot that I get to go in and pick out flowers every week. And I make my own arrangements. And it's just like a nice little treat that I do for myself and for no reason. And almost every time that I have flowers, someone, if they see me, if I run into somebody or whatever, they'll be like, oh, is there an occasion? And it's so nice to just be like, no, it's just, every day is a gift. Every day is a gift. And to have fresh flowers in your home is like just the tiniest, most wonderful thing. And I do, I, my real trick is that I, I do the high low, I mix in the bodega flower. Wow. Because garden is very pricey. I'm going to do that. And, and sometimes you do like the nice expensive, impressive flowers from garden with, you know, sometimes the bodega, which admittedly the flowers are less quality. It depends. Sometimes they have really nice dollias. I had, I got some insanely beautiful dollias from this bodega also near me. But you got to get them on Sunday morning because that's when the flowers come in. You got to, you got to know your flower people. And where they're getting their goods and when they're coming in. So shout out to, I'm going to shout out Anthony and Jeff. Yesterday, my girlfriend's parents are in town. And yesterday I ate at, we ate a friendship for lunch. Very nice, really good lunch. Yeah, we had, um, it's an oyster, the oysters and sausage thing. And then you go to full of fries. People a lot of us. So yeah, the fries are the best fries ever. You just get a big bowl of fries and that and it's like, it's the best lunch. Some bubbles. Really? It's great. But Anthony sent us a bottle because we're getting married. Anthony was there in he sent us a bottle. So shout out to Anthony for that. And then we went to Wal-Say for dinner. Great dinner. Have you been to Wal-Say? No. Oh, it's amazing. Is that the cider place? No, Wal-Say is like an Austrian restaurant. Yeah, but it didn't, it started as like a cider. No, they don't have any cider there. Really? It's like a-- It's in the East Village? It's West Village. It's like a very far west, like West. Oh, I don't know what I'm talking about. Nevermind. It's really great that I did the best lunch all in the city. Wow. The cocktails are great. High praise. Yeah, the desserts are amazing. I don't, yeah, everything is really good there. It's really like just like, it's a restaurant for like, people who don't care about money. But it's like, everything's just done right. And it's like casual. It's like, it's a little more, it's like, fancy for us. No one people, but it's, everything is just done. Really well. And we ran into our friend Jeff there. And he sent us a cake. A full cake? No, no, a slice of cake. That's nice. But yes, I appreciate everyone sending us little things for our wedding, I guess. Little nice little things, I guess. That's really nice. Yeah, I was like, and really impressed the parents. They're like, oh, wow. You guys know people at these fancy restaurants. They're not people that work at the restaurants. They're people that are eating at the restaurants. Wow, that's really nice. Yeah. She's probably not going to listen to this. But I'm going to shut out our nanny bell. It's her 50th birthday today. Oh, yeah. And we love her. And all caretakers, any person who professionally cares for another human, let's shut them out. Because it is a often thankless job. It is a tough job. And it allows other people to do their jobs. And you're like, very much like a part of their-- it's like, you become this de facto part of the family. It's like a very intimate role. And we're-- I'm grateful that that is like an option, you know? But like, I'm-- I don't know. How often do you see her? Five days a week. Wow. That's such a just even see someone that much is-- I know. Well, especially because I work from home. So I'm not like leaving at nine and coming home at five. It's more like we're like-- Wow. Yeah, that's really special. It's really special. --to open a kitchen about roasted squash. Yeah, to hang out with somebody. And to trust them enough to take care of your progeny. I think he's going to be more-- we were talking the other day, like, he's so into music. We're like, maybe he'll be a musician. We're like, DJ? No, I think he's going to be a writer probably. I know. We're like, don't choose that. No, get in one of those little DJ things for me. No, I'd rather him be a writer than a DJ. If he wants to be a DJ, he's going to have to move out unfortunately. I will not foster that. Well, thank you guys for listening. Thanks for listening. No, it's expensive. Thanks, Allison for coming. Yeah, of course. This was great. Thanks, guys. See you soon. Bye. And time to roll the credits. Expense account is a production of "Feed Me" in partnership with Public Sound in Substag. Our executive producers are Emily Sunberg, Jason Gauntlet, and Ryan Woodhall. Our associate producer is Kami Fatte. Our audio engineer is Luke Maldolph. Our video editor is Izzy Cross, and our graphic designer is Justin Sloan. Expense account is recorded at WSA NYC. For more episodes visit us at feedme.substac.com. See you next week.