Air Force Veterans Abducted By Aliens Reunite After 50 Years [EMOTIONAL]

"You remember me! We were on November 5th, November 18th, 1977. Do you remember what we encountered at 1 o'clock in the morning and no good for five?" "I don't know. I don't give a five. What's in your heart? What's in your heart?" Imagine your 23 years old, tasked with guarding a nuclear missile site in the heart of the Cold War. It's midnight. And while on duty, you and your partner witness a giant glowing spear hovering over a live thermonuclear weapon. For strange-looking beings glide towards the window of your truck. You're taken aboard a craft, examined with sharp instruments while receiving telepathic messages. And all the while you hear the shouts of your partner somewhere close by. When you finally come to, five hours have passed. Your partner is frozen to the steering wheel, completely unresponsive. And you're parked beside a reservoir dam, more than eight miles away from the missile site. You're taken back to the base and separately interrogated. Then the Air Force transfers your partner. And you don't see him again for 50 years. Now you can stop imagining, because this is the true story of Air Force security policeman Mario Woods. "My name is Mario Woods. I serve the Air Force from 1975 to 1983." This told this story countless times. Mario's been on the history channel, Discovery Plus, News Nation, this show. Over 40 appearances. In each time he asked the audience to find one person, Michael Johnson. Michael Johnson. Michael Johnson. Michael Johnson. Michael Johnson. Money has been spent trying to locate Michael Johnson. We've looked in hospitals. We've looked in. Can't find him anywhere. No, sir. A person who could validate his experience and corroborate his story. Dawn. Seemingly forever. Here's the thing about hunting for a man named Michael Johnson. It's one of the most common names in America. Good luck finding Michael Johnson in a sea of Michael Johnson's. Many start to wonder whether this long-lost partner of Mario's was a figment of his imagination. Mario hired private investigators. He consulted the FBI. Online amateur sleuthers went nuts. He says Arrow, the Pentagon's official UFO office, has promised him that they would look. But they all came up. Try. If anything, my guess is that a lot of these people and organizations probably saw Mario as a liability. And Mario and Michael as people to keep compartmentalized. Someone to corroborate a story they'd rather remain stigmatized. Kept in limbo. Because all it took for our fledgling operation at American Alchemy to beat a multi-agency manhunt was some online searching and basic outreach. That's right. A fan of the show, shout out Jason Miller, hit us up with a Facebook page. A page just sitting there. And lo and behold, it was for a 70-something-year-old Michael Johnson living in South Carolina, fitting Mario's description perfectly. Michael had even posted these words. My boys in South Dakota on Ellsworth, 75 to 77. So we tasked a very talented recruiter to find him, and he did, in about a week. I couldn't even sleep, man. I've always done maybe an hour. You are about to witness history. 50 years of these two Air Force veterans being apart. We get to relive one of the most extraordinary nights of their lives. You know, you're bringing two pieces of a story that have never met for 49 years, and now they're like getting to share notes. And we're not just going to interview Michael Johnson. He courageously agreed to go through a full hypnotic regression on camera. This is a very safe time to remember. Without further ado, maybe the most inspirational episode to date with two of the best men I know. This week's courageous American alchemists, Mario Woods, and Michael Johnson. (Music playing) Hey, is this Michael? June 26th, 2026. 626, 26. Even I've never met at his job in the middle of his work day, and I explain only part of my motivation for reaching out. Nothing about November 5, nothing about a UFO. Michael doesn't even know my name. Let alone the fact that I have a podcast covering any of this stuff. You're talking to Jesse. My friend was stationed with you at Ellsworth in 75, and he really wanted to reconnect. He wanted to know if I might be able to patch him in. I think he'll be excited to hear from him. What's his name? His name's Mario. Mario, Mario. Is he going to take you to Ellsworth with me? Yeah, I think he worked with you there. Yeah, yeah. That name sounds familiar, but you know, that's kind of strange because I've been trying to order some of the guys back there. Mario, Mario. Is this his first name? Yeah, Mario is his first name. His name's Mario Woods. Woods, Woods, Woods. Would you be down for me to patch him in? I think he'd be so excited to speak to you. Hey, Michael, Mario, you both there? Yeah, Michael. Yeah, yeah. You remember me? You remember me? What was the real state squadron? I said, "Mr. Sight, we'll be the state squadron. What, man?" I'm like, "It's me. It's me. It can be back in my hand." We were on November 5th. November the 18th, 1977. You were working vacation building. You did not know anything about the 68th area. I think you read the 66th, 67th area. Where you? Is that where you were? Yeah, that was me. That was me. That was me. You just arrived. You remember what we encountered at 1 o'clock in the morning and November 5th? On the, on the demo side, was that UFO? Was that UFO? You remember? Yeah, I remember. You remember? You remember how large it was? It was big though. I was never saw. It was huge. Why? You remember what happened? What the heck you were going to have this look down on like a crazy suit? Like a. It wasn't supposed to be a word. That was a long time ago, man. Yeah, four and a half years. I think I'm looking for you, man. I want to make sure you've got my phone number. Okay. I have put your name out all over the world. Michael, you're famous. Now, you are. You have been served for by the damn FBI by five good investigators by arrow from the Pentagon. And I've got chills down in here with tears in my damn eyes. This isn't your voice right now. Michael, do you remember having seen the UFO? Like when you talk to friends and family and you say, "Oh, yeah, that time." Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I remember very well. I just keep it up and it won't believe it. It won't believe it. Yeah. How far over the top of the blast door was it, Michael? On the 50 feet, 50 feet. Maybe maybe a little higher than that. It was a little higher than that. But it was close to them. I remember that. It was close because it was bright. Michael, would you be open to reconnecting with Mario? We could fly you guys both out to Austin so you could meet in person and hang out and maybe we could film kind of the reunion. Well, yeah, that's, that's possible. That's very possible. You know, I just want to make sure that my, because I know my brain will scramble, so I'm just trying to make sure you know, get. I'm the Michael Johnson. I mean, he's saying to not keep some Facebook because I'm on Facebook, you know, I'm black now. I know. I'm in a hotness like Michael Johnson for all my life and saying like 49 years, but I'm at home with you. I'm sure about that. I'm sure about that. Look at how about $10,000? Yeah. Kind of look at you. Yeah, well, definitely. If you said so, I can sound me too, you know, because. I had a lot of issues up there in South Dakota. I had a lot of issues up to, too. - I was just down there, 21. - Hmm, I went through all the awareness. I went through everything. - It didn't even go much, it didn't even go much. - Yeah, I was up there, I was up there, my family just goes to having trouble, just having trouble, stuff. And I prefer to say that I can find nothing but saying, I'm pretty much that up there. - Come on, man, I have to scramble, man, for a while, cause I'm just jammed, I just let it go. I say, nobody's been in any way. - No, I think it was intentional when I, when I think I walked to see a close encounter in the third guy, when they did that scene at the mail box, yeah. - Oh, there's something lost by the scenes. I just had to get out of there, you see them? - Nobody's looking at this, man. No sight. - Yeah, there's no guy there. - You're gonna have to throw him, throw him, throw him back, you know? - Yeah, I'm thinking, you see, so how long can it be? - Oh, I'm ratting though, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - Everyone lost it, everywhere I'm gone, I've always looked, yeah, everything else, but when I got a computer, here in the first person I'm trying to shoot, I searched for, I was there. - Special, oh boy, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. (dramatic music) (ominous music) Mario, how are you, man? - Oh, good to see you. - Oh, you've run me too, hell, I can't do that, can't I? - What's up, bro, how you doing? - How are you feeling about seeing Michael Johnson? What's going through your body right now? - Man, I couldn't even sleep, man, I've only slept maybe an hour. - I had restless legs syndrome, I couldn't have to walk around that damn plane and just thinking about it, man, just seeing him again, you know? - He was saying, like, they scrambled my brain. What do you think he meant by that? - I don't think he's got, I think he's pushed so much back himself instead of allowing it to come forward and feeling it and then living with it, 'cause that's what it comes down to. You can push shit back in your brain forever and put something on trigger it. Sooner or later, something's going to trigger whatever that memory is about a person, a woman, an incident or anything like that. - Michael, what's happening, man? How you doing? What's up? What's going on? - How you doing? - Good, how you doing? - You're great now, man. - Man, you're in crazy shape. Both of you in Mario. - You're about to see Mario who you've been separated from for 50 years. What are you feeling right now? - Well, he never, he never turned his back on me. He never left me. That's one thing I could say about the brother. He's an honor, man. He never forgotten me. - What up, bro? - Give me a hug. - It's been a while. - I know, dude. Are you excited to meet Michael? - Oh my God. - Michael Johnson, man, the guy that was just like, he was like there for everything, but he was a mythical creature. And even like in Mario's last interview, which you just probably recorded like a month or two ago, he's still like, I could feel how much he wants to see this man before he dies. And just, Jesse just calls me what? Three, four days ago and goes, we found Michael. Get to Austin. - And it's so wild to how there's like truth and fiction. If you watch disclosure day, it's like you have two people, Daniel and Margaret. And they're like two like walking hard drives with like latent information that needs to be reactivated. And they're brought together. And then like you have the whole puzzle. The two puzzle pieces are like brought together. And that's kind of what's happening now. - Yeah. - It's so wild. - It's finally happening, man. - I like the amount of podcasts. - That's where you talk about Michael Johnson. - I'm wanting to connect you with him. I'm wanting to find him, it's unbelievable. - So you were thinking about - Going back to South Dakota. - Going back to South Dakota. - No, we talked since that we talked. - And then we got in touch with you. - Yeah. - Coincidentally. - It's just like that. - That's crazy. - I'm gonna get your door, hold on. - Okay. - This is nice, man. - How are you feeling? - You feeling good? - I'm, you know, I'm, I, I want that light to you. - This is too much. It feels good. (laughing) - It feels good as I have. - Uh, I haven't had one of those in a long time. - Uh, let's go, go see Maria. (gentle music) (laughing) (laughing) - Look at, look, my man, my front of the man. My man, all this time, don't forget me, don't forget me, don't forget me, don't forget me. - Don't forget me, don't forget me. - Don't forget me. - Oh, you scared me, bro. - I'm okay, bro. (laughing) - I'm on the frame, man. - Let me see, you bit, oh, I'm on the frame, oh. - You know, I went up there and believed you were, and I found up there, one, get the grip. - Uh, yeah, yeah, damn, fuck. - Oh, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. - I'm sorry, I'm sorry. - I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. - This guy was real cool with me, he was real cool. We didn't hang out too tight all the time because I dropped his everything, but he always speaks to me, he always speaks to me all the time. What's up, you know, every day, I was seeing him, I was 64, 68 cutlets of green, you know, going up and down, you know, elsewhere. - In my T-R-C, yeah, yeah, yeah. (laughing) - I heard you been looking for me, man. - Looking for you? - Yeah. - Looking for you? - I'm sure, if you are searching for your happy ass, all of 'em, every one of 'em. - You've known this so many Michael Johnson's out there. - Yeah, and I know your mental initial either. - Yeah, you put that scene in. - Just describe how you guys are feeling right now. - I wanna cry, I could get emotional, you know what I'm saying? And everything, see my brother here, my homeboy, you know, here, and he never forgotten me. It's the best thing, you know, he kept looking and looking. You know, he didn't give up on me. He thought I was still alive, you know what I'm saying? With that, okay? So when I found out, and you talked to me about it, you know, everything, you remember what I said? You see, you got the right Michael Johnson? - I'm black, you're true, you know what I'm saying? - You know, when I knew that he did find the right Michael Johnson is when he said, do you remember what happened to us? 1977, at November 5th, and then you said, oh, the UFO, said 1977, Ellsworth Air Force Base, November 5th, and he said, oh, that UFO. And he hadn't said anything else, no other details, and you immediately said that UFO, that gave me the chills. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. Michael, what do you remember from this, you know, fateful night that Mario's obviously been describing this for years now, in podcasts? And so for him, in some ways, it's easier to remember because he's keeping the memory alive by retelling it, constantly, for you, it's just this thing that happened to you 50 years ago, and it's probably a thing due to the way you were treated by the Air Force, that in some ways, you've tried to kind of put behind you and forget. So what details do you remember? - I do remember the simple fact that there's a big bright, a big bright light in front of us. I do remember that, it comes close, it goes back out, and everything, all right? I do remember that 'cause I was frozen on the steering wheel, frozen on the steering wheel and everything, and I believe it's not, I heard him talking, but I couldn't say nothing. I couldn't say, it was like, don't say nothing, you know, it was like I was just in a trance, right there, and everything, he was going off, he was, you know, he was upset and everything, when he said, you see that, Michael, look, you know, everything, but I couldn't do it. And so the next day I know was, my eyes were burning. It was like, I was staring straight ahead, but I couldn't blink, couldn't blink a nest. So I just kind of like, I faded out, I did. I passed out on the steering wheel, I assume, just passed out, and I couldn't think of anything else to do after that, at that point right there. I was looking around, when I did come to, I looked around, seeing blares going around, around a truck, you know, around a truck and everything, and I just kind of just dizzyed, just faded out. a lot of gain. I couldn't do much, but I do know if he was there. He got out of the truck and everything. Describe the kind of object moving around the car very quickly. Do you remember anything about it? It was a human form, it was like a human form. Human form? Like a human form, pointed head, like point decks of type, you know? Interesting. And do you remember anything else, any other details? Don't fear. Don't sound like don't fear. Don't don't worry. Don't, you know, something to that point. Don't worry. Don't worry. Everything. But I couldn't concentrate, call you, learn around me. You're going around me and everything. Mario Woods, you've been telling the story of what happened to you in November of 1977 at Ellsworth Air Force Base since 1996. That's correct. And you have one of the most detailed accounts I've ever heard. The only whole missing in it is your partner who is now sitting alongside you. So for the first time, we'd love to hear your story of what happened to you with Michael Johnson sitting next to you. That's awesome. I'll be happy to tell it. Let's just go back to the day. Our day started going to the State Health Building, which our security police main office facility, which is a reconditioned hanger. You know, all the shifts are there together. We line up in position, you know, we're, we get our briefing. What's going on in the field? We had American Indian movement at the time. They were doing some stuff today. They kept us abreast of all that. You know, there were threats on Mount Rushmore and they wanted detonate aside or they wanted to do something. But we met that day at Garmout because my team member, Steve Walshaw, that's his name, young guy. He went home on North Carolina to get married. So when we went back to the field, he would, he was on vacation and they sent Michael to work his days off on our shift, his commander option day. We got to meet shake hands, talk a little bit. I didn't know him prior to that time. I'd seen him around because he was a color enthusiast. He saw my TR-6 Triumph convertible. He liked that. We talked about it. So we were good to go and we came out to the site and we talked, I stayed up. I can't remember if you went and laid down for a while. We worked at 6 p.m. to 6 a.m. I was looking at TV, I was looking at Barnaby Jones, the Rockford files. Come on out of here, man. You gotta see this. I didn't want to be out there. Mario, he was just gone home. Right, right. Look at this. Look at this. Yeah, man. Yeah, you know what I'm saying? Because there's nothing out there, but Perry Dahl's, Ralph Snake. I don't want to see all that. On right is Van, you do ones of the call, 30 is mine, the deaths. In there from kills. Everything was going really normal, nothing out of hand, nothing strange. At about 9.15, I just took a notion to go outside and smoke a cigarette. And I'm just looking around. It's a super clear night, super cold, and nothing was out of place. And I just happened to look to the east, really directly east, and I see this big old light in the sky, a different color, a different gradient of a light. Do you mind if I flip my lights at this thing? In no successive form or no phonetic alphabet or anything, I just flip the thing off and on, off and on, off and on, three times. And I just walked outside kind of quick, not even knowing how to get a response or I didn't expect one. About 30 seconds passed and I said it went off. Came on. Went off. Came on. Thinking he just shared a friendly, unconventional exchange, he goes back to his business. That is, until just after midnight. All of a sudden, I hear the alert phone in the flight security controller's office go off. Yes, sir. I hear it sit for November 5. In inner and outer zone alarm, all it wants, above ground and below ground, something is directly in the vicinity of the most destructive weapon on the planet. We go to the end of the road, which is a dirt or clay road. No other traffic, just as we're the only thing out there. I just had to look over about the four o'clock position. In the far distance, in the direction of November 5, I see this glow coming up off the ground, just pulsating. And he goes. What did you say? Whatever man. That's exactly what he said. As we dropped off onto the dirt road and just barely started to crank left, they're set this object. And I said, look at that. I don't even know what Michael said at that point. I said, look at that. What are we supposed to do with that? I said, I'm going to tell you what I said. What did you say, Michael? I don't know. You know, literally, I can't, I don't think I can see it. You can swear it. Yeah. Fuck a shit. What is that? That's what I said. That's what I said. What is the shit? What is that? Just like that. But that's the natural reaction. It honestly was. We pull up at a 45 degree angle. I did. It turned to 45. With a great question in both of our minds, and as soon as we stop the vehicle, and just try to take in the magnitude of what was above us, this damn thing, man, this light just went or the glow or whatever it was just blue down on us like it came down like that. It was just like a shield of light just just encompassed everything and everything about us. It lit up stuff that has probably never had light on it. I don't think that's just how permeating it is. I've felt as if, you know, there was light shining through parts of my body or something. It took up the whole missile sight, man. It took up the whole everything. Covered everything. The diameter of that thing was so big that it actually exceeded the perimeter of the fence line. I mean, he was blowing my mind, too. I was still. And he was on the steering wheel just like that. You were grabbing on that steering wheel. I want to take that 45 angle, go elsewhere. You know, I want to take off. You know what I'm saying? I want to take off. You know, what's the wildest type, turn it at me or go? I couldn't do it. As soon as that light hit us, it was a pressure placed upon us right on your front of your body like pressure, like something pushing on my chest and I was having trouble breathing. And I never had any any issues whatsoever in him, too. We couldn't breathe. The air was being sucked away from us, vacuumed out. But yet there was a pressure exerting some kind of energy or force. And I felt like I was even with a parka and flight pants and bunny boots and everything we had on, I still felt as if I was being lifted up toward into the back window. I felt like everything was rising. And it's lightest, so permeating that in that seated position, I looked and I looked right down the center vent of that dashboard. And there were those two vents and there's one on this side, one on that side and you get the heater vents on the floor of black rubber mats. And I looked at that vent just for a flash and I could see way down in there. And then I picked up these particles that I thought was glitter, which didn't make any sense at all with what's going on. I mean, and I just watched them just move by so side. I just looked at them. I just like, I don't even know if I said anything at that time, but I know we couldn't breathe and I knew I had to do something. So without saying a word, I said, hold on a second. I just rolled them into down. I took my glove off of this hand. My trigger guard was open on my weapons. I could use it with my left hand and my forefinger. That's what they were designed to do. And I got my black three cell, three D cell flashlight. There's a pull myself up on that window and I reached out my left hand in front of me like this and I put it up and grabbed the light bar of the bubble above me and held onto that and I took my flashlight and I just flashed my flashlight at it three, four times like that. Just like I did it to side. Not even, I couldn't even see if it was working. I just kept flashing my light at it. I was just asking for relief. Okay, it sets us. I'm just asking for relief. And when I did Dad and I felt as if I succeeded I just slid back down in the seat and I rolled that window up Not knowing anything else I don't know where my flashlight went but I grabbed my weapon and I put it between me and I said Michael I leaned over and I said we can breathe now. It's gonna be okay. Yeah He's just like this He's just like that on that's true. I don't know if he's looking up or down or anything and in the flash if a second no sooner And I said that This this black ball just Comes out of nowhere and honestly it was between four and six feet in Diameter like a like a big beach ball with vents on it and of a black color that like not like these microphone Booms but a different black than anything any any color or any blackness It was scary black it was just so tough, but damn it was damn it was just It could I can see myself you don't have words for it. You don't have you can't explain it You know me look at it and think what the hell what is that? How is that? How can it be that color maybe like almost like a tear in the fabric of reality itself? possibly or Yeah, a whole opening up and that blackness or something. I don't know. I don't know, but I know it was a ball 46 feet in diameter, but he's strange lines on it like vents and it just sat down in front of that hood about that high above that dark blue hood on that Ford It sat there for about three seconds and then it just went right over here beside me over there beside him In the back back to this side and front of him again back to this side and front of him again sat right there and he just went And it was gone. I didn't even know that it left it just left my visual Radio at that time And I just went what the hell Was that he's not saying I'm gonna say that's good shitless and then this smell Just with the windows up this smell just gets inside that vehicle and I'm like, what is that? And I didn't have I don't know. It's like sulfur in ammonia like bad shrimp on a cooler And I've smelled that before and so it just threw my mind right into that time frame I'm trying to say something to him But he's not hearing me or I'm talking just I'm just talking out loud I guess I'm just trying to make some sense of everything I was out. I mean I couldn't do nothing at that time. I couldn't do nothing My eyes was hurting my head But I heard you talking But I couldn't respond Well stuck And I got a really strange feeling on that on the right side of the vehicle and that and I thought that was the safe place You know the craft is here. Whatever it is you call whatever it is It's just to the left. It's closer to him than it is me But I got a feeling on this side of me And without looking first the first thing I hear is From low to high to not fear do not fear at that particular moment in time I just I just turned to my right like this just looking and I just see these shadows from about 20 feet away And I'm trying to I'm trying to focus on what I'm looking at and as they approached me There was three small ones and one tall one in the back and he was about a foot and a half behind The three in the front And The small one on the right he had they had they were in uniforms and he had on his little waistband Our little waist some kind of thing in his waist and it was a little rod about that long 8-10 inches long and reminded me of a of one of those five cent pencil erasers We used to get an elementary school cost his five cent had a bigger eraser on the end of it a yellow pencil His face or his head was shaped differently than the three In the front And I I felt fear when I saw all that one. I didn't fear I didn't feel fear with the smaller ones But I did with him And it was at that moment in in my in my time in my head It wasn't what I it wasn't what I was seeing That did what it did to me It was the nanosecond of time. It took me to register what I'm what I'm seeing What was the head shaped like on the big one? More pronounced jaw a smaller little smaller lip line Eyes at a little different angle and they all had large black almond shaped eyes The small ones get to they just weren't as large as the as the tolerant behind them But his facial construction was different than the three small ones in front of him And as I said they weren't walking they were sent they were gliding in some way and they weren't fast They weren't slow. They were just just moving steadily and of course that fear just Built up in me because I knew they were coming and there wasn't anything that I could do or what I do I couldn't shoot them. I wouldn't shoot them and The last thing that I remember was just my vision Just getting smaller and smaller and smaller and then it just went black When Mario comes to the missile site is gone the truck is parked behind the wall of a reservoir dam near a town called Newell More than eight miles from their post His boots sink into mud in a field that should be frozen solid Something very hot had clearly just been on the ground next to the truck His watch says it's around 6 a.m At least five hours of their lives gone never to be recovered And still in the driver's seat is Michael breathing heavy eyes open hands gripping the wheel tightly But totally unresponsive as if he's catatonic As I'm contemplating what I just stepped in I was in that radio that motor rolled a radio with a little microphone hanging on the dash Pop the life and said when security controlled in November 1 November 1 what's your location? And he said November 1 do you need medical help? And I said I don't but I'm not certain if my partner Needs it or not in the whole radio network just went silent for a minute because all these other sites are wing security control And all these other flight security controllers all these other security placement are here and everything that we're saying we're talking about everybody So I was instructed to do one minute security checks as they were going to triangulate our position The rescue team comes to their location sheriff's deputies out of a local town called Sturgis a state trooper comes as well I didn't know this till 2021 was that Two deputy sheriff's had been dispatched from Sturgis South Dakota by requests of the wings of wing security control on base 55 miles away Compared to where Sturgis is Sturgis is 29 miles south of Nuel in a state trooper who that was his area And he heard his father say not knowing anything about anything Well, why do you want me to go look for for them? They're better Equip than I am for something like that whatever that was why do civilian deputies matter because the Air Force controls Air Force paper It does not control the Mead County Sheriff's dispatch log if those records survive this story has a document with a date on it When Sergeant Garza pulled up say what's going on? He said Mario. I can't talk to you about this He said I'm just here to escort you back to another control Followed them back to the launch control facility I pulled in right in front of the flat security controllers office and they just Disindered upon the vehicle. I don't know what's wrong with Michael. I said I don't know what's wrong with Michael. I said I can't get in to speak They took me into the day room. They started banging me, but questions everything was just at one time coming from every Space in my mind and I just went and sat on the toilet All of a sudden I get this ringing in my ears when it happened everything turned like lime green to me I closed my eyes and when I did I had this feeling. I was leaving my body And when I opened my eyes that last time I saw four fuzzy feet walking by Pause walking by the bottom of that door. That was a dog handler in his drug dog I'll be out in just a minute. Yeah, no worries man. You're all good. Just came in to check on you I opened up the stall door and I just went to the sink and I just turned that faucet on its ice cold water And I just dried it myself in water. I would just soak and wet Would you do take a bath and off we went to Ellsworth? Michael and Mario are taken separately back to the base and interrogated apart Sounds as if you've had an interesting evening Michael goes to medical first Michael, one was the first moment, if you recall, where you were kind of yourself again, where you had come to, after you were in this sort of kind of catatonic state, you were kind of stuck to the steering wheel. At what point are you like, you know, shake it off, I'm back to my normal self. And then at that moment, what do you think just happened to you? Are you thinking about like, you know, do you have theories as to what happened to you? Well, after they took me out, took me out of truck and everything, and I remember the LTE on one side, and I was like, "Who's on the other side?" Is it Facility Manor attack or master sergeant? They would drive me back to the base. I wonder, did they take you to Colonel Spraker's office, or they take you to medical? No, first I went to medical. Okay. Because if that means you were there before I was there, well, I was being interviewed, because I left just a few minutes before you did. That's why I was coming together, getting myself together then, you know, after that right there. But I was still out of it, but you know, I was able to get around, move around and everything, and be puzzled, "What the hell, man, you know what I'm saying, what the hell." I assume also you probably, upon preliminary assessment, you probably needed the medical attention sooner because you were in proper shock. So it makes sense that you would be taken up. Do you remember what was, what the medical procedure was like? I just remember, I just remember it shot some in me, some in my vein and stuff, you know, like a little small physical, like they would give me a physical, you know, and everything. I remember that very well because it hurt me, it sting me, you know, "Oh, you know, like that." I do know that perfect. I do know that, check my eyes out, because my eyes would say, "Yeah, yeah, can you see? Are you having fun?" Yeah, I see. Maybe I did have some part of my eyes, because my eyes would hurt me bad. It didn't give me a thing for my head, my head would burn it, like my brain inside, it was hot, you know, like I had my brain or something. Did they ever say anything about sodium pentathol? Yeah, they did. I didn't mention that. Yeah. Cusodium pentathol is a truth serum. One of the main reasons I'm able to go multiple hours on these podcasts while staying mentally sharp is because of this little drink. It's a product I started using years ago, and it's called Keytone IQ. I know the founders Jeff and Michael personally, and I was thrilled when they agreed to sponsor the show because it's one of the few products I trust to give me clean, sustainable energy. I've been taking a little shot of this thing during every long recording, and it lights my brain on fire. Here's the science behind why it actually works. When you're running on glucose or sugar as your brain is most of the time, it's essentially burning dirty fuel. Your brain could be like a Ferrari, but you're feeding it 87 octane fuel all the time. Keytones are what your brain actually prefers when it's operating at its best. Normally, you'd have to fast for days in order for your body to switch from glucose to ketones. This little shot of ketone IQ gives you the ketones directly, so your brain runs the way it's supposed to without any spikes or crashes. So visit ketone.com/alchemy for 30% off your subscription order, plus receive a free gift with your second shipment that's ketone.com/alchemy for a whole 30% off. Or find ketone IQ at target stores nationwide and get your first shot free. Yeah. They did. So sodium pentathol is a truth serum, and there's another famous case at Royal Air Force Bent Waters, and this is called the Rendlesham Forest case. The three US Air Force officers who were involved in this case all went back and they were given truth serum to see if they could retell everything that they experienced. You said something really interesting to me on the phone, and I think Mario is there too. He said, they scrambled my brain. Do you remember anything like that? That's how it felt. That's how it felt. It really felt like that. Like what it did, that was happened to me. I know who I was. I know where I've been. I know my family. It was like they tried to erase your identity or something a little bit. You know, the people I knew on post, you know what I'm saying? The other context of sodium pentathol in which it's used was like CIA mind control experiments. And so I wonder if they were trying to get you to forget the experience. I'm still puzzled why the lady stuck me that needle in everything we would talk about in everything, and felt funny with burning in my arm and everything. But I was worried about that for a long time. Was it something LSD or something else or whatever? What did you feel that doing to you physiologically or mentally? Like what did you feel the liquid, really? And you remember them talking about sodium pentathol? I was missing that as wild. I mean, that's definitely a truth serum, and they used that in other contexts when it came to, you know, nuclear UFO cases. Yeah. I remember that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Just after his abduction, Michael noticed that his right arm was sore. In fact, it was really weak and he could barely use it. Nothing torn or broken. Since then, and despite being right-handed, his right arm works less well than his left, it's literally weaker despite being the dominant hand. This is the kind of minute detail that nobody would ever bother to invent, especially somebody that we had to seek out. Were they all flight surgeons or were there anybody in like more interesting official suits or tweed suits or uniforms or I think it was an OSI in there too. Okay. It was a special investigation. Yeah, especially I think it was just one in there too. Do you remember a tall man in a tweed suit? You do. Do you remember anything about him? No, I thought he reminded me of my base commander. Uh, my squadron commander, uh, Colonel, I can't remember the last name. Which, which base? No, it was a man in the tweed suit fat or skinny. Skinny. He was a light bird. He was a light bird. He's a light bird. He's kind of like a peacock, you know, kind of like a peacock. He goes very skinny though. That's what I'm saying. If you cock, you know, they like that, you know, he's never long and everything, you know, her grace on top and everything. And you felt like like the intention that you felt in the room, you were like, you felt like they were trying to figure out what happened or kind of mess with you in a way where it was like, we don't want Michael to recall this. I think a little both. A little bit about the time feed me everything. Yeah. It was time feed me info and then try to take it away from me. Do you remember the info they were trying to feed you? I didn't see nothing. Mm-hmm. Were you drinking? Yeah, I got asked that. So we're just gaslighting you? Well, they had a drug dog on the site before we even got back. So that had already been initiated. And they had to come 55 miles away from the base. The main sport base was we were to go to the to go to November one. Do you remember the drug dog that brought to the site? That's not a drug dog. Yeah, I remember that. That's a special phone call. That just didn't happen. And so after, so you experienced this with these, you know, flight surgeons and with Air Force Office of Special Investigations and the whole time are you trying to remember yourself or analyze what had happened to you or are you confused or what are you feeling when that's happening? I feel lost. I feel lost. I feel lost. I feel lost. It's scared. Everything. And like, you know, what you're going to do with me? What you're going to do with me? I see what I see. I know what I saw. I know what I saw. You know, and everything. And I didn't want to say any more than I have to say because they were kind of drilling me. They were drilling me. You know, well, how do you feel now? Questions like that? How do you feel right now? You know, I think they asked me one time, do I get along with my mother? Yeah. Stay at home. Okay. Do you get along with your mother? You know, like that? In the robe and the right robe. You know, and everything like that. And I'm just like, and the nurse over there just sitting down, you know, just sitting there and everything. I said, you know, what's this guy doing? What's going on? Sounds like they were looking for holes or leverage or some sort of diagnosis that they could point to to explain away the experience you had just had. Yeah. At that time, it makes sense now what you're saying, but at the time, I didn't think like that though. I just think like, don't tell why I didn't see. Don't tell them what I don't know what I've seen. What I know. I remember saying, we're in my partner. You know, don't worry about him. He's okay. You know, I say, well, we're in my partner. I say, partner, you know, and we're yet. Don't worry about him. I say, okay, words, you know, my partner words, you don't I still say don't worry. You know, and that piss me off right there. That piss me off. Me too. It got me to, to almost a combat mood and everything, you know, like that. I know it was half a human being, okay, and everything, and you see him. You know, he was a main one that was holding me back, you know. But for my, you know, being there for my back, he had my back. - Stayed your name. - I'm Michael, Michael Johnson. - That's right, and nothing happened last night. Did it? - Nothing happened. - You're going to be okay, Airman. Nothing happened, nothing happened. - Where's my partner? Where's Woods? - Don't worry about him. Give him the sodium pentathol. - Nice and easy, nice and easy, Airman. - I do remember, I was getting to this machine. It's like a shower stall, like a shower stall, and everything. Got in there, and it closed it up. It was dark inside. I heard how many sound going in while I was in there. - Okay. - I remember that, I heard that, because I, you know, this is a shower. What I'm doing in here, you know, in my box of shorts, you know. - Yeah. - Have you ever seen that before? - No, I never seen that kind of instrument. Never seen it. - Okay. - Mario's exam is equally strange. A flight surgeon spends long minutes on his gums, his teeth, the floor of his jaw. - Something wrong with my teeth, Doc? - All the while, Air Force Office of Special Investigations agents are listening from behind a partition. And then the doctor tells Mario something that he doesn't know yet. He has burns. Seemingly radioactive burns. Straight out of closing counters of the third kind. - He went up here and he just clipped up a piece of skin off there and he took the whole tool and he stuck it right down in here, but a cork on it laid it on that tray. - That tissue entered the United States government's possession in November of 1977. And then it was probably classified. So the US government has literally confiscated and classified a piece of Mario. This piece of skin has never been accounted for since. So for all of you government transparency hounds and freedom of information act experts out there, this might be one of the cleanest records to target in the entire story. - At ease. - Now the debrief room. Because what the Air Force did next tells you a whole lot about how they treated UFO incidents on the inside back then. Five men in the room. The wing commander, the deputy base commander, agents of the Air Force Office of Special Investigations and a civilian in a great tweed suit. Nobody ever names. He answers their questions candidly, but he plays it smart when it comes to what he saw. - Had I said that I saw these beings, they would have immediately removed me from the PRP personal liability program. I'd have lost my clearance, I'd have lost my job. I'd have never been in the missile field again. And I was newly wed at the time, and I needed a job. - Two men, the same experience. Mario's career survives, Michael's doesn't. - I just got so point to the point that I was drinking for a while, you know what I'm saying, everything. And I fucked depression, all that kind of things going on in my life, you know what I'm saying. I had a whole hard life. And so where I live after my article 15, but all about discharge, all about discharges. It's a really good all about discharge. Okay, well, you know. But I never really got the field of it and everything. And the thing, by the way, though, I was trying to go into Marines after that. I was trying to go into Marines, I said I'm fixed, I'm going, I'm going to go into Marines and stuff, you know, or the Navy. I'm still good enough, but they coded it. That's kind of code on it. - Like a 1A or something. Yeah, I know what I mean. - And God told me, he's taking icon Congress to get it off. And I just said, man, well, I could be a Boy Scout there for that matter, you know. I mean, I want to, you know, get back here. I'm young, I'm ready to show support everything. So it didn't work out. So I stay up there doing media jobs for a while, before I left media jobs. - They put you on like general duties or something like that, right? - Yeah, picking a trash, putting in the bag and stuff. I don't know the pain, I don't know the pain. I'm paying the bill inside of the building and everything. Like that boy with a grass and everything, you know what I'm saying? I mean, it was degrade. - That's a highly trained tactical individual from the Security Police Academy. - Lackling Air Force Base. - I mean, and combat training school, just Camp Bulless is a prisoner of war training camp. - Six weeks. - Yeah, man, we'll, we'll, we'll, we'll, we'll just work with the Rangers, man. - Special forces. - Yeah. - Well, I loved it. - Yeah, I mean, you know. - I killed a couple snakes me to go. (laughing) - And I got ripped by a scorpion. - Yeah, I, I, I stuck one in my hand. - I got a cute couple. Can I do something? Go ahead, Johnny, go ahead. - That's why I never said what was that decided that when I saw them and I saw those beings. I never, I never would say that. I said everything else, but I wouldn't say that because I'd have been cleaning up those barracks grounds too. And you know it. - Yeah. - Now you might be wondering about the total blackout period. The period between Michael and Mario seeing a massive glowing red orb over November 5 at midnight with beings hovering towards their pickup truck and waking up eight miles away next to a dam. Let's find out exactly what happened during those five and a half or so missing hours. Pay attention to your droolings. Pay attention to flashbacks. That's how the conscious brings up more memory. - We're calling events from a traumatic let alone supernatural experience is inherently problematic, especially when it involves missing time. The mind files what it can't process in rooms it doesn't hand you the keys to. And often that's adaptive for you to move on and go about your day-to-day life. It's common for experiences to undergo hypnotic regression to unearth those shards of memory. Mario had his years ago, the session recorded. Mario couldn't play it back. The recording sat on his shelf for a year before he could bring himself to press play. The regression itself, which caused Mario to relive the experience was so traumatic for him that it caused his heart to go into atrial fibrillation. But to get the full story of what happened to Michael and Mario that night, we needed Michael Johnson, a man who has never been hypnotized in his life and has been repressing this memory for 50 years. We needed him to give hypnotic regression a try too and see what we could unearth. So we flew out legendary hypnotherapist, Ivan Smith. Ivan has probably done more hypnotic regressions of experiences than anyone on the planet today. And she's the author of this amazing book that you should all buy called Chosen from the Alien Hybrid program to the fate of the planet, quite the title. I want to give a trigger warning here. What you're about to see is very intense and somewhat disturbing. And we should all commend Michael not only for undergoing this, but for sharing it and letting this air. Mike, do you got this? You think so? Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. You're way stronger than you think you are. You're going to be great. Oh, so I hope to get this over with, man. I just feel so drained, episode drained. The Michael, I want you at this time to visualize, imagine, or picture yourself at the top of a beautiful, unique staircase with two very sturdy handrails in each side. So as you're standing there, you feel very safe and very secure. Knowing now that this is the right time to remember, and a very safe time to remember, and you start down, and five, four, three, two, one, and zero. Because you allow yourself to gently drift down into a deep, deep sleep, and allow yourself now to gently drift back in time back to the winter of 1977. Describe where you are on the base. I was with my partner, my set partner. OK. A strange object, real bright, came out of the sky. We had to repost the sight. Came out of the sky. I couldn't believe it. OK. Take a good look at that object, and just try to describe what it looks like. - A big, big, big. built in a big, built in the one-house built in the night. Now you're able to look ahead of you out of the windshield. Just try to look out of the windshield and describe everything you're seeing or sensing or feeling. I saw it spinning objects. I saw it spinning objects around me. I saw it spinning objects around me, spinning around the truck, the whole truck. I saw three individual objects, one of the other worlds in front of the truck. Try to describe what you're seeing but in front of the truck. Three creatures. Three creatures and they were seeing this whole world was in front of me. Try to describe what they look like. I mean, you had a big-ass eyes, a kind of big head for him sticking out. Skinny. I mean, it wasn't made up of a man, it was made of something that was putty, like putty. It was standing in front of me. I just looked at him and he said, "Mom, you can hear him, mom, I can pull him out of the room. Everything. Don't fear, don't fear. No fear." We'll see no fear. No fear. Okay. And you're seeing him through the windshield? Yeah. Okay. I didn't know if I turned my head, I know I just kind of like put inside of my vision. And I see these four shapes, they're not walking, they're just gliding, three small ones and one tall one. I remember calling Michael's name, but he didn't say anything to me. At that point, seeing him scared the shit out of me, it scared me so bad, I couldn't do nothing anymore, it was just, I heard him, I couldn't say nothing to him, I heard him, I heard him. Michael, Michael, you all right, did you see that? I don't know what happened to me. You're still sitting in the truck? No, I'm in the truck, I'm in the truck sitting in the truck, he's sitting in the truck and he's grabbing me, trying to pull me and I'm trying to fight myself to wake up because I know it's conscious, I was just trying to fight my way to speak, to be back in my body. And he wanted me to get out the truck. Okay. I couldn't get out the truck, they had to pull me out the truck, I hear things going around me, you know, like I was, like something was raining or something, water moving, you know, like somebody turned a fire hydrant on or something, you know. Did you see any water? Did you look around? I tried to look around, tried to look around, I looked to my right, looked to my left, looked, I saw a space out there, empty space, I see no ground and nothing. Okay. Okay. I had a headache, felt like I had it, real serious headache, you know, all of a sudden I got a headache, my eyes, so I don't know what to do, I didn't know what to do, I didn't know what to do. I did hear, I was conscious, I heard Muriel. I heard, you know, getting in touch with your head, as your head is hurting, do you sense or feel anything touching your head, causing the pain? Squeezing it, somebody that's having a touch, squeezing my head. Okay. Squeezing it in which way, from ear to ear, on top, on top and on the side. Okay. Squeezing it. Okay. Without feeling the pain, continue, describing what does it feel like? Needles. Okay. Where do you sense or feel the needles, doing just fine, just describe everything without feeling the pain, allow the information to come forward. Where do you feel the needles, my ear, my head, I felt the needles in my head, I felt my hip is squeezed, no where do you feel the needles, what part of your head, my my ear, okay, buy your ear, buy my ears, each side, both sides, okay. They take me somewhere. And what position is your body and, I'm laying, I'm on flat on my back, okay, and I can't, I can't believe that these three little guys or whatever they are carrying me, and I, and I think whatever I'm breathing helps to relax me and I'm not sure what it is, there's something that's placed on me from behind, and it's on my left, it's behind my left ear on my neck and upper ear area, and I remember saying something that feels like a crab, and then I hear Michael, and his voice, he's upset, he's very, he's really upset, and he goes, oh man, he goes, why am I here, and the little one, the small one, just as plain as they says, because he's here, and I couldn't make sense of that. Michael was only a maybe a foot or so away from me, I mean I couldn't turn and see him, but he was just behind me, Mario, Mario, you here? Getting in touch with your body, do you sense anything touching any part of your body? Do you feel pressure anywhere in your body? My chest was heavy, okay, my chest was heavy, okay, do you sense any movement around you, any sound around you? Yes, my hands were on me, something felt like hands on me. Okay, where are those hands, my chest, my thighs, and what are those hands doing? What does it feel like, what are those hands doing? They're cutting into me, cutting into me. In what part of your body? My thighs, my ankles, my ankles, both legs, just take a look down there towards your legs. You're doing just fine, without feeling the pain or discomfort, just try to describe what is causing that? No, I don't know, they were sticking things in me, they were sticking things in me, I felt some going inside of me. Who is causing the discomfort on your legs? These funny creatures, who have it, how it was, it was a human. Okay, do not fear, we mean you know harm, are those the same ones you saw out of your windshield? Spinning around, that funny head, shape, mother, yeah, yeah, yeah, how many do you see down towards your legs? About three. About three. About three. Okay. It was freaking, it was filling on me. Okay, what's happening with your head? I'm gonna touch your shoulder, I'm gonna touch your shoulder, take a deep breath, take a deep breath. Remember, you came out of it, what's happening, tell me what's happening, they grabbed me, where? I was punching the grower, okay, I was punched, then I stopped, okay, stop my head, stop hurting, okay, my eyes were staring, I couldn't open my eyes, I closed them, I opened them, I opened them, I opened them long enough to see what the hell was going on. What's causing your eyes to be irritated? Lights. The lights. The lights, it was so bright. Okay. It was like an operating table, like an operating table, you know? Okay. Yeah. Okay. Michael, you're doing just fine. Oh. Keep going. They're off me, man, they're off me. - Are they still touching your body? - Yeah. - With heart. - With chest, my chest. - Okay. Tell me what they're doing on your chest. - Push down, push down, my chest. Push down, my chest. - Okay. - They stopped. It put something in my mouth. - What does it feel like? - Rubber. - Okay. - Is he riding? - Take a look at the riding. Just try to describe it. Where are you seeing the riding? - Next to instruments or next to. - Okay. - Never's next to. Things that are all now like a console. And he takes his device, it's connected to something else, not a wire, but a cable or something. He bends my wrist backwards. And he goes to add into my wrist with it. And he keeps telling me you're too relaxed. I'm not gonna hurt you. I said, "You are hurting me, you are hurting me." We're helping you, we're helping you. - Oh, please, listen up. - I asked you, "Do you help everybody?" So that they need to be. - Uh-huh. You're doing just fine, Michael, you're doing just fine. - Oh, man, hmm, hmm, hmm, hmm. Get off me. - Keep describing what's happening. Remember, you came out of it and you're safe. - No, just describe everything. - Hey, tell me all my stuff, it starts like slicing my back, cutting my back, cold, the cold blade. - Uh-huh. - To my spine, to my spine. - Okay. - And back and forth. - Okay. - It's, it stopped. - Okay. - They stopped. That was it. That was it. - Do you feel anything else on your back? - No. - Okay. - No. - I don't know how long I'm there, I've been there, I don't know what their intentions are. I'm just so afraid that I never get home again. Nothing about all the times I've ever, from a boy when I've seen these things, when I'm not them, but they're, they're craft. They've been coming a very, very, very, very long time. - This is your planet. This is our planet. Where is it? - I ask about Michael, until Michael's okay. - Uh-huh. - He'll be all right. - Do you hear anything from them? Do you hear a message? - Do not fear. Do not fear. - How do you feel watching that? - Wow. That was, I was pissed. - Yeah. - I was pissed that I thought they're gonna do some, some stuff to me, you know. - Yeah. - I really did. I'd come and, you know, I'm on my stomach, I'm helpless and stuff. This ain't no jailhouse, this is here, you know. Ain't no peanut butter sandwich, you gotta pay me some way, you know I'm coming from. - Hmm. - But, you know, he didn't do anything, it didn't do anything. But stop by, in my back, right here. Then that was it. I remember that, I felt that, I felt it. 'Cause I was thinking down, they were gonna do something to me. - Hmm. - Yeah. - They were gonna do something to me. - Hmm. - The specimens are something they were gonna do something in me. - Yeah, and that's actually a common thing with experiencers, that sort of thing happens. So, and there are even theories that there's some sort of interspecies breeding program going on because of how common that is, so. - Yeah. - Damn, man. - Yeah. - It must be a violating weird. - Yeah, it was. - You just have no control. - Yeah. - I couldn't do that. - I couldn't do nothing, you know. - It was really hard to see you viscerally. Like, 'cause I could hear through my eye, I knew that you're, as you're describing what they're doing, you're back to you, you're scratching the couch, like the other on the couch, and I just knew that was the most somatic part of the, of what you were going through. Like, there was so much of your body contracting and you holding, I can tell that that was the deepest part that you've gone. - Damn it. - Yeah. 'Cause I was, I was conscious, you know. - Yeah. - Sorry. I was conscious. - Yeah. - No, and you could feel whatever anger, you know, it's you're being rational, though. - No, that's right. - And you know, it really is me, we know, uh-uh. - Yeah. - Ah, no, that didn't go on to happen. But I was, I was helpless. But I yell, I kept screaming. - Well, you know, it came up in your intro session with Yvonne before you went under, and I remember the detail coming out of you feeling just so uncomfortable and violated when they were examining you after, because you were also in your underwear. I like to be in a room with a bunch of men on dress. - With men on these, the military? - Yes. - And they made you take off your clothes? - My uniform. - And so they could examine, okay. - I remember, I was like, huh, it's an interesting, that that detail really stuck out, you know. After you've gone through, after you had gone through everything that you'd gone through, but it made sense when you went under, and it almost was like a trigger for something that you had just gone through. Because you were just violated on the craft, and then now you're violated again by your fellow soldiers on the base. So that was like an interesting link as we were. - Yeah, I do remember, I feel funny. I feel funny in everything, and I thought they kicked me in the nuts too, you know, in everything. - Man, shoot. - I wonder if it was like, they were taking spinal fluid or cause it feels like, that would be pretty central to any sample collection? - Yeah, central nervous system. - Yeah, nervous system. - Yeah. - I knew that that biology, yeah. - Yeah, huh. - Whoa. - It's not easy to listen to, I'm sure. - Man, that was awful. - Yeah. - That was awful. - Yeah. - Do not fear. Two men, two rooms. Hours apart, neither in earshot of the other, the same three words. Words Mario has attached to his memory since 1977. Whatever happened in November of 1977 at Ellsworth, those words were definitely a part of it. In the middle of the most gut-wrenching stretch of Michael's playback, Mario's phone pushed its verse of the day, and the verse was about fear. Fear not, do not fear. - What is the verse of the day? But like now we have to give a one-step-not-fear? - No, not wear is the sort of cuteness. (dramatic music) - Well, when I was sent to keel control, I got a real strict briefing from Master's Harden Gray that, of course, you know, re-inerated everything that was said in Colonel Spraker's office about not talking, said people were talking and discussing what happened to he and I to their best of it, what they had been told, which was not much. And even though things were not said at guard mounts, for instance, the week's following, people would just walk by and just slow down and look at you, even though they wouldn't say anything, they wanted to. And, or they would say something to someone else and that person who might have been your friend would say, yeah, they think this and that and they think, you know, what the hell is wrong with you? Or why would, you know, why did you and he go through this or anybody else has and it really gets to you? - I was not the drinking type. I didn't smoke. A lot of guys around there actually mad at me 'cause I wouldn't play cars and, you know, drink or anything, I really got mad at me. So, it was like, they thought, they thought like, - For example. - Yeah, they thought maybe like I was OSI, somebody, somebody on the cup, snitching on, you know, we had snitches around there, but no, that wasn't me. It just, that's how I grew up and everything. And as far as bullying, yeah, yeah, because how my, how I was at the time, very bad crew, not too heavy, not heavy weight and these guys coming from all walks of life and everything wouldn't get away from it with their head. And they want everybody else to join them. I wouldn't join them, you know. They had those little gang, I wouldn't join them. - So, I was actually outcast, and actually I know, I was riding back with somebody, I was riding back with Sasha, I can't remember his name, I can't remember his name. I was not talking, he kept saying he's gonna be alright, 'cause I asked him, you know, what's going on? Where are we going and everything like that? He said, we're going back to post, we're going back to base, we're going back, you know, we're going, we're going to go and talk to some people. - Are you remembering something else? - Yeah. I remember getting to a fight with the sergeant and one of the missile sites. - Okay. - For. - Because of way he was, there were questioning you and treating you. - Yeah, he was trying to bully me, trying to bully me, trying to bully me. He was bigger than me. - Mm-hmm. - And he told me, I told the sergeant manager, I came here to the sergeant manager name was, I told him, "You don't get him off me, leave me alone, just leave me alone, man, I'm tired of this, man." - Yeah. - You all got to pick on me. - Yeah, yeah, try not to keep punishing yourself about that. You were defending yourself. - Oh! - You were defending yourself, Michael. - Everybody got to pick on me. I got tired of it, I got free left with it. Talking nice guy, can leave me alone. - Yeah. - He kept grabbed me. Everybody thought it was funny, it was funny. It was a funny way I put the M16 up to the net wasn't. It was a funny day when I caught him up there and did it. Everybody day, everybody punked out. All right, that would be so scary. Yeah, you're a bitch now, what, you know? - Yeah. - Oh. - Where did this come from? - It's okay. - It's all in there, Michael. - Where did it come from? I mean, whoo. - It's traveling. - Wait, I'm a killer, I'm a bitch, I'm a killer. I didn't care at that point. - Yeah. - I'm glad to handle, I'm glad I didn't vote. No, man, I'm just so tired, tired, everything, going this way, going to school. I'm leaving this way here, I was put on, and it was worse. - And you've been holding that in for all these years, for all these years, Michael. And give yourself some credit for being here. - I like to say, I got, I just put on playing shit, I got kicked out, and everything, all of a discharge. I stayed in Rapid City for a while. Before I left, I talked to, I talked to Muriel, you know, before I left and everything. - What do you recall about that conversation? - What they do to you, man, what they do to you? What they say? You know, let me come in, let me come in, let me come in, we need to talk. The Muriel started talking to me about, oh, I can't remember what it was, but he said something, he was something, he asked me, did I see anything? I said, yeah, I saw it. I said, I saw it. But I don't know how they gonna make, make it seem like I didn't, okay. But I just told him straight up, man, let's just get some drawings doing it. Let's do something here, man. I saw something, I wanna write it down before I forget. - What'd you draw? - Funny, I was looking at alien, man. And I see what I've seen for what I've seen, everything, just, you know, almost like what a kid would draw and everything. Face T, you know, everything like that. I don't know what it was, I've picked it had. - Do you remember that being in your mind? You remember seeing it? - That's what I'm saying, I was drawing while I was seeing it. - And what did the being look like? What did the face look like? - Angry, angry, big guys, angry. I remember, I remember I was in some place, I don't know where it was, but I was in another empty space of capsule something, and I saw things that were flying around, floating around rather, whatever, and everything. And so I just kinda just showed it off and everything because I didn't know for sure if I was on the floor, my head on the floor, and I'm trying to talk to somebody, but I kept bumping, I kept bumping, kept bumping to somebody, you know, and everything. And I thought it was Muriel, you know, like I was on this side, he was on that side. It was like, he was on the table, you know? What happened back there, man? I was lying down, somewhere, and there was a glove on a floor, a real shiny floor, nothing like the inside of that truck. - This is a crucial part of Michael and Mario's story. Michael vividly remembered seeing one of Mario's gloves, lying on a very shiny floor. Nobody else on patrol that night had a pair like these. - Or Michael Jackson glue. - Michael Jackson, you remembered the music. I do remember the glue. I remember the, I was, I was, I was like, "What's my body, I'm teaching you, "because I see it with the glue, and it was a nice, "super nice glue, that was an hour on tape." - The night of the incident, he pulled the right one off to work his flashlight. The same gloveless hand that the flight surgeon with later find burned. But again, Michael remembers seeing this glove on a shiny floor. And even though Mario took the glove off, he kept it with him. In the middle of all of this, that's what gets you. In the middle of all of it, you know, there's a glove on a shiny floor. And he said that to me, I, you know, my wife, she was sitting over here, and he was sitting on the couch, and I was sitting a little bit around the table. And when he had a pad in front of him, and I had a pad in front of me, and a pencil. And when he said that, I just looked at him and I crossed my head, and I remember kind of looking, questioning myself, was so, wait a minute. Not my gloves, you know, I can't lose one of those which was a B-52 pilot gave him to me my first couple of nights there at Ellsworth in the B-A-Q barracks, which is like a, like a, like a makeshift hotel. When you first get to a base, you got to have a place to lay your head. So you can go to the B-A-Q like hotel and spend the night. Well, he and I shared a room. There was like 10 beds in there. I was over and that in, that was that in us. And I just saw his stuff, he was unfolding, and I said, man, those are bad ass gloves, man. He said, yeah, you're gonna need some of these living here. He said, I've been here before, and he goes here, take these. He just gave them to me. So I always prized those gloves, and I don't even know what happened to the left hand one now, but that day, and he said that, I ran in my room. And I kept my ditty bag, or a hawk bag. I kept it in the closet. Well, I didn't want to look at it, so I grabbed it out, old gray looking bag. I emptied that, and I insiped it, and I emptied it on the couch next to you, and I spread everything out, you know. I did, I did everything, and my left hand glove was there, but the right hand glove was gone, and I didn't even know that before. Holy shit. I'm missing one. So you think the glove literally maybe was taken by the beings? Who's left? On the spaceship. Yeah. Wow. Yeah, it was there. On the UFO. Yeah. On the floor of the UFO. And you pulled out your ditty bag, because Michael was like, I remember seeing the glove on the floor, and you only had one of the gloves in your bag. Well, my comment was, I said, Michael, an F-154 pickup truck got rubber black mats. What do you mean a shiny floor? That brought my curiosity to it. So I ran into my bedroom and grabbed it, came back out near an unzipped and dumped it radio, underwear, shave kit, everything, right on the couch, and there's my left hand glove, no right hand glove. So somewhere floating around in the cosmos, you have your B-52 glove. They do, along with old radios and old TV. Maybe it'll go on in a museum, I don't know. And that's right. Yeah. Mario, you also, at certain points, remember walking through almost a room of, like, antiques, like old gramophones and vinyl players and-- That was in a dream. I didn't recall that in hypnosis. What connected the dream with the abduction experience, possibly? Like, what makes you think that that might have been what you experienced in the room? The small being and the foggy atmosphere. Was the small being leading you through that room? Yeah, so you allowed me to go, took me into the room of old things and just allowed me to be there and to look, and I don't drive in, draw here, but on the back side of this wall, there's a window, and it's a round window, and it had a pie slice out of it. And you told me, I could go look out that window, and I just shook my head, no, I don't want to see what's out that window, and I didn't go. But the iron, the solar machine, the stereo, the lamp post, was all items that we had in our home as I was growing up, not these items, but items just like that in Port Arthur, Texas. So that's when I took it that maybe they were, maybe they were like archaeologists or scientists in some way collecting this stuff from the human race. I don't know. And asking our opinions of it or what have you, I don't know. Do you remember now, when you try to remember the shiny floor of the UFO with the B-52 glove on top of it? Mario's glove, do you remember that? Oh, yeah. You do. I do. Wow. I do. I definitely do. Wow. In fact, where I would sit, where I would lay down, when I saw it, I would lay down when I saw it. I was on, as I said, I was being probed and, you know, and everything, and turned over and back. And I saw a sawed paper, I thought it was paper, it was a hand glue, it was a glove. I saw it, but I kept the note of it. I didn't pick it up. Bye. I saw it 'cause I was thinking he was doing the same room with me. Wow, okay. So I kept that in my mind. So my brain was scattered, like, you know, scattered. I remember Glove. It was nice, clean, civil glove, you know, just 'cause he bragged about it. I remember, you know what I'm saying? It was nice glove 'cause I was gonna take it. (laughs) So you even, while you're being sort of traumatized in this UFO, you're like, "That glove's nice." And I wish I could take it right now. Bloody hell. You know, I'll be dog around anyway. And everything. - When you recreate that face in your mind's eye, the big eyes, does that somehow feel familiar to you or does it feel very foreign? - No, I feel familiar. - Mm-hmm. - I feel familiar. You laugh at me about seeing guys, people walking among us, but he is shaped like that. And I have seen it. - Mm-hmm. - I have seen it. - Does it feel friendly or does it feel neutral or negative or does it have some sort of like emotional connotation? - Bist of fire. - Mm-hmm. - You know, I look at him, he's on like that, and he's just walking on among us, you know. But I just, I have seen strange looking people my time. - You think there are some people in society that might not be fully human? - Mm-hmm. - I really do. I should think that, but I was thinking that for years now. - Well, you're not alone in thinking that. In fact, one of the kind of foremost pioneers in UFO research is a billionaire named Robert Bigelow who spent all sorts of resources in trying to, you know, figure out how UFOs fly and work. And he worked, you know, with the Senate majority leader, Harry Reid, in an official government capacity in order to kind of reverse engineer UFOs. And he has quoted, you know, in multiple interviews saying that aliens walk among us. - Yeah, it could be among us, you know, whether they're hybrids or they're some other kind of, of really look alike, you know, kind of thing. - So I think you're in good company. But you texted me something very interesting before coming out here. You said, can't wait to see you guys. I appreciate what you have been doing to make me feel a little easy after a half a century of not knowing who I am. What did you mean by that? - I think, well, I meant by that was, nobody believed me. Okay, I wouldn't talk about that much. I feel like, you know, it's just something that, I would have to take with me to my grave. I didn't think nobody believed me. And my morale was down, okay? I was going to change his depression and everything at that time. A lot of things hit me hard. I stayed to myself a lot. I don't talk to people. It's a bad thing to do. I need to talk. I go to the VA now more than I ever have and start talking about the certain things to ease my mind. 'Cause I can't sleep at night. I have a hard time sleeping. I can't sleep. I wake up two or three in the morning and I gotta be at work at eight and everything. And that really took a toll on me, mentally, anguish, mental anguish. But when I got in touch with you guys, I fell a lift up. I fell a lift. I fell a lift in every day. Oh, that's somebody I heard relate with me. Relate with me. You know, and then when you took back the hill, I said, "Wow, it had changed my life. I'm about to retire." And this has come without on me. Oh boy, I felt good. I felt good. You should know, but do you know who Robert Hastings is, Michael? I heard of him. He's amazing. He's really just an honorable, good guy. And for decades has thanklessly and thanklessly is an understatement. Relage with a lot of backlash and at times death threats and calls to his house has just been with not a lot of money coming in as a result of this, has chronicled people like yourself and Mario and other guys working at nuclear bases all over the country. And even certain civilian energy grids where he's just, you documented this ubiquitous connection between nuclear and UFOs and tick-tax saucers, orbs, all these sorts of crafts showing up at these sites, often tampering with the nukes. In certain cases actually affecting the employees directly. Sometimes you have close encounters of the third kind. But if you read his book, it's almost 600 pages and you come out of it and your stories don't exist in a vacuum, they don't exist in isolation at all. They're of a variety. And so we actually have two copies that we just bought and I'll gift you a copy. But that, I mean, so you really feel like you're not alone. You have all these guys in this book who've experienced similar retributions. Yeah, I read it. Yeah, it's a great book. Definitely with that. And we're in it. Yeah, you guys are in the book. You're in the book. Oh, yeah, your name's in there. Here's a book. That's it right there. Yeah, check it out. The nuclear connection is long-standing, widespread, and ongoing. Hastings is a legendary journalist, UFO researcher, and the author of UFOs and nukes. A nearly 600-page book comprehensively chronicling UFO experiences across nuclear bases in the United States and abroad. A former American alchemy guest, he's spent decades meticulously examining the nuclear UFO link through experiences like Mario. He's met almost 170 of them to be exact. Missile security, radar operators, weapons officers, photo-instrumentation specialists, you name it. All of these guys, time and time again, report seeing orbs, lights, tic-tacs, hovering over extremely sensitive military assets, sometimes tampering with nukes directly, and sometimes, as in Mario's case, abducting the people guarding them. Maumstrom Air Force Base, 1967. 10-minute-man nuclear missiles go offline, while security police report an object over the gate. This was confirmed by two men in two different rooms, one of whom was launch control officer Bob Salis, who's been on the show. We're talking between September of '66 and March of '67. We lost 30 missiles to UFO activity. 30, that's pretty insane. Big Sur, September 1964. An Air Force camera crew films an object firing beams at a dummy nuclear warhead in flight. And the officer who captured it is told, "Lutenant Jacobs, you are never to speak of this again. It never happened." And then, he was deleted from the government. That photo-instrumentation officer, Bob Jacobs, was definitely in the government. In fact, he managed 130 people in his role. And later, in the '90s, he was finally vindicated and given backup by his major, Florentz Manzman, who was also aware of the UFO incident. Also, in September of 1964, at Vandenberg, another missile security officer, Richard Barth, was taken aboard a craft with four alien beings. While being abducted, Barth was told by one of the beings that they needed to do recon on human nuclear missiles, so they could ensure that humanity wouldn't destroy itself. And if you're wondering, Barth and Jacobs didn't even know that one another existed. I've spoken to many of these witnesses personally. They've all served their country with honor and pride, and now have completely normal lives outside of their remarkable experiences. And less do you think that this is only occurring at American nuclear bases look no further than the Rendolshem Forest incident in 1980. This English forest was the site of the largest nuclear stock pile in Europe at the time. Or you can go as far as Japan. UFOs are spotted so frequently by Fukushima, famous for its nuclear energy grid, that there's a local mountain called Mount Senganmori, with a museum dedicated to UFOs at its base. Or take presidential advisor Harold Maumgren, who held pieces of a UFO in his hands that came down from a high-altitude nuclear test in the Marshall Islands, the Blue Gill Triple Prime Test. The pieces were collected and rushed off to Sandia National Labs in New Mexico, where Lawrence Preston Geist, Jeff Bezos' maternal grandfather, and the future founder of DARPA, showed Malgrim the pieces. - It reached for some steps in the end of this. These are things that have come down around Washington. - So you're looking at, like, material, anomalous material? - Yeah, the Breedy. - Yeah. - Take even. canonical cases like the Roswell crash in 1947. Roswell wasn't a random desert in America. It was the largest concentration of nuclear weapons in the world at the time. It was the only one. Finally, South Dakota's own Ellsworth Air Force Base itself has a long history of UFOs showing up on site. On August 5th, 1953, a trained civilian spotter calls into the base. A blazing light is suspended low on the horizon, pulsing, and within minutes, radar at the South Dakota Base locks onto that unknown object. What happens next becomes legend. One pilot gets dispatched and chases the object for 120 miles across the prairie. He can't catch it. The thing keeps a perfect 3 mile gas, towing with him, pulling away from a military jet like it's standing still. This thing's flight capabilities are not normal. And it doesn't end there. That same night, the UFO rolls into Bismarck, North Dakota, where 45 stunned townspeople and military air defense personnel watch strange lights dance across the sky for two nights straight. Radar, pilots, dozens of witnesses across two states. Even Captain Edward J. Ruppelt, the head of Project Blue Book, the Air Force's own UFO investigations unit, called it the best UFO report in their files. And to this day, the Air Force has never explained it. And in 1978, one year after Mario and Michael, a security team at the base abandoned Asylum, with the access plug open, which no security policeman does unless he's more afraid of what's above ground than of the court marshal. The stories are endless, all at Ellsworth. Mario and Michael didn't join that pattern by reading about it. They joined it together at 12.15am on duty. But the history of UFOs goes beyond this amazing 600 page book. There are thousands of documents from 1945, the advent of nuclear weapons. In 1954, the first time a U2 spy plane was ever built, so there were no high altitude reconplanes in existence at the time, that discuss UFOs around nuclear bases all over the United States. No skeptic has ever been able to explain this away, and I don't think they'll ever be able to. Drones were invented decades later, and the documents come from every government agency, Army, Navy, CIA, FBI, and they definitely all didn't coordinate well with each other at the time. What really got me was all those sites out there, why November 5, the closest to a town, closest to the launch control facility, in the least amount of travel time for all other nine missiles. I don't have the clue. They know, they know that site's connected. I mean, what is their visual acuity of being able to see things under our ground? I don't know. Electrical wires leading all the way back to November control, 50 feet below the ground, can they see that? I'm sure they can. Nuclear man, nuclear. You know, well, the nuclear contained contained in the head of that missile. It's not, it's not all over the site. What is it? What is it? Uranium, man? You know, well, that's something. Somebody wants something. They know what they're here. They know it's there. Do you know, on other cases, on Ellsworth Air Force Base, across the years, two other cases? Two other cases. Which, what do you know about? Before we got there, there was another case in, in Walsh, out the Coda, where two guys are, it was in the echo area, responded to another site. And I was told this at a later time. And, anyway, the two guys were somehow separated at the, at the site itself. And one was found like a quarter mile away, with very few clothes on, weapon, and everything else, not missing, but way away from him and not in, in his ultimate control. And the other guy was out of the vehicle. And he was a couple of hundred yards away from the vehicle, which was sitting outside of the facility itself, outside of the, the LF. And he too was like 90% naked. And it was extremely cold. And somehow, somebody found him. I don't know a backup alert team time with the story that I got was kind of broken. Who'd you hear the story from? From a guy that was out in the field, was talking about it. After, you know, after I heard that too. After, after, after I heard that too, because, you know, people asked, people heard about this stuff with us. And people asked me about it in the field. I mean, when I'm in the keyhole control, I mean, there was nothing but officers there. And the flight chief, and you see the flight chief and all visitors that came out to tour the facilities, they came to Kilo. They'd been separated. And one of their clothes had been removed. Yeah, both of them. Both of them. Their vehicle was, there's two, three hundred yards away, weapons were separated from. They were that little or no clothes on. And it's extremely cold. And it's not laying down in grass out there. That's some, you know, I don't know if you walked around Robert's place. So do you see the cactus on the ground there? Yeah. Well, that's similar. How common do you think this is? You know, I probably heard about four or five other cases and not just in the missile field, but back at Ellsworth also, of objects coming down the runway over the, over the weapons storage area, WSA, or the uploaded aircraft on the alert pad, which at that time were B-52 bombers. And then when aircraft were scrambled to see what these things were, they just flew off in a distance and vanished. They just would come back. And I think some of this was even in the late fifties. They would come back and they'd re-scramble the jets after again, they'd be playing hide and seek half the night. But I mean, one other thing I thought I had is if, you know, if this Eisenhower rumor that like there was a deal done in 1954 and Edward's Air Force base and he was, you know, had this dentist appointment and he was in Palm Springs. But in fact, it was really a cover in order to do a deal with the aliens in order for them to, you know, basically have access to the American population as far as medical experimentation. Where would you want to limit the medical experimentation to? It would probably be these nuclear sites. You'd probably want to confine a lot of the medical experimentation to where you already have the most kind of iron-clad secrecy setup, all of these protocols. That's a good way to think about it. And so I wonder if like you're like, yeah, you can, you know, abduct people in our population, but like, you know, most of them have to be, you know, in these sites. Be milberry or be something in conjunction with those sites. Is that what you mean? Yeah, and then Air Force Office of Special Investigations has like more of a sense that they can rapidly respond. Right. Because they know, you know, okay, there's something going on at these nuclear sites where we're already, we're already like we have our our kind of apparatus setup. Somebody told me long ago about that very thing that that these visitors already had a place picked out where they wanted to reside or be able to be here on this planet. And of course, it was under a mountain range and it was dulcy. That's fast. I didn't even know the name then. I never heard of it. Yeah. Does have you ever seen, let me show you a picture of a guy and then I want to see if he looks familiar to you. I don't want to give you the name. I just want to see if the face looks familiar. Hold on. This guy would familiar at all? Like a younger version of him? Simple calm talking and everything. He was very calm talking. Do I'm looking at him? Very calm, talking. Very smart. I can't picture him. I see a guy like him. Like you say, younger version. Younger version. Hang glasses on book. You know, show them Rick Doty. Good job. There's one thing that rings true across all of these cases. The Air Force Office of Special Investigations, OSI, always shows up. They swear the witness to secrecy, sometimes threatening them into silence. But Mario's debrief involved perhaps the most infamous Air Force Office of Special Investigations agent of all time. Rick Doty. For 37 years, Mario didn't know it. The junior OSI agent at his elsewhere debrief was just a face. Until 2014, when that exact face showed up in his living room, and Mario shouted at the TV, "I know that guy." The name on the screen was Richard Doty. If you don't know that name, here's what four decades of reporting has established. Richard Doty spent the early 1980s as a special agent stationed at Curtlyn Air Force Base running disinformation against UFO researchers. That's not an accusation. It's his own admission, backed both by documents released under the Freedom of Information Act, and a great book called Project Beta by Greg Bishop. Bishop documents the infamous case of Paul Benowitz, an albuquerque-based engineer and businessman who thought he'd detected something anomalous, flying over the base, and instead of being given a simple slap on the wrist, he was fed fabrications about local, quote-unquote "alien" bases in nearby Dulce, New Mexico. He was given forage to documents and invented programs until he basically unraveled right into a psychiatric hospital. At one point, he was even given a computer that he was told could decode alien signals. A challenge and duty he became obsessed with. He was delivered occasional true fragments braided with lies, all to protect what were probably real classified programs he had been snooping on while living across the street from Kirtland. The whole unfortunate saga is chronicled beautifully by Bishop, and it made Doty the most radioactive name in this subject. The government's UFO man, and the reason you can't trust the government on UFOs. At some point, the government's strategy on UFOs moved from "be silent" about what you saw or else to "oh yeah, you saw an alien." In fact, there are 16 races of aliens from four different star systems, and you happened to meet the lizard people from Kepler 186. In other words, it moved from a categorical non-admission of anything to a promotion of everything. Flood the zone with nonsense. Understanding truth involves finding a signal in the noise. To divert from the truth then, you can try to stamp out the signal, but that can be hard. Sometimes it's easier to just increase the noise. "State your name." "Michael. Michael Johnson." "That's right. And nothing happened last night. Did it?" "Nothing happened." Now, look at what was done with Mario's case in 1977 at Ellsworth. Literally, a fake incident was created in 1977 in November to discredit Mario and Michael's experience. The event is known as the November 1977 site L9 incident. There's even a famous supposed Air Force document claiming that on November 16, 1977, a day before Mario and Michael's real experience, at site L9 Minuteman Missile Field north of Ellsworth, aliens shot at Air Force security with a beam weapon at a launch facility. That's right, this document says that aliens supposedly attacked a nuclear site. The Air Force document reads like a security log. At 8.59pm, on November 16, 1977, an outer zone alarm goes off at L9, and a two-man security alert team, just like Michael and Mario, A1C Jenkins and A1C Raky, is dispatched. On arrival, they see a bright light shining vertically from behind the fence. Again, kind of similar to Michael and Mario. Raky goes to investigate and encounters an alien-looking figure in a glowing green metallic uniform with a helmet and a visor. The being then aims some unknown weapon that disintegrates Raky's M16 and burns his hands. Jenkins then sees two figures, fires two rounds at them, and watches them board a saucer about 20 feet in diameter that glows green, climbs vertically, and vanishes to the east. The document escalates from there. Nuclear components missing from a warhead, Raky hospitalized, and his rifle never found. Written on a supposed Air Force letterhead, this document would be totally remarkable if it weren't totally fake, a documented hoax. There's no matching Air Force record for this document, a freedom of information act claimed that was never substantiated was the source of it, and misspellings, like missile with no second eye, and launch, but spelled with no "you" so it's spelled like "lanch". Strategic is spelled both as "strategic" and "strategic". Also, just look at the second page of that document. Four names. Four social security numbers. Airman Raky's number ends in 7-5-5-6. Sergeant Stewart's number also ends in 7-5-5-6. Investigator Brad Sparks showed the radiation figures were physically wrong for the actual survey meters, and the call news report tone didn't exactly match what you'd expect from an official document describing missing nuclear warhead components. These are errors no Air Force typist would ever make in a classified missile security report. No airman ever came forward, no hospital record ever surfaced. This is literally pure BS. But why would such a story like this get fabricated? Well, it's probably not a coincidence that this story is about a two-man teen, just like Michael and Mario, getting attacked by aliens in November of 1977 just a day before their actual event occurred. But it gets even crazier. The trail on this fake document leads back to none other than Richard C. Dodey, according to well-respected physicist and UFO researcher Bruce Maccabee, researcher Bill Moore acknowledged that Dodey confessed to forging the Ellsworth document, the entire L-9 incident, made up by Dodey. The same special agent with the Air Force Office of Special Investigations, who has publicly described being tasked with hoaxing the documents that psychologically destroyed Albuquerque businessman Paul Benowitz. The same Dodey, who now himself admits to being present at Mario Woods' debrief. So I'll let you be the judge, but it kind of seems like Dodey might have been in training for Air Force counterintelligence during Mario's debrief, a role he officially started a year later. But maybe this was his first Decento job. Pretty crazy, but it's also intelligence at its finest. It's an age old tactic, surround the truth with a bodyguard of lies, create slightly modified versions of the truth that are provably false, so that anyone who finds and publicly promotes the truth is considered crazy. You're essentially inoculating the public against the truth, ensuring that they never look into a topic again by pre-stigmatizing it. So I think it's a reasonable conclusion that Dodey ingested the details of Mario and Michael's abduction and crafted a false but very similar story to ensure that no one would ever take it seriously again. Of course ultimately will always be left speculating, and we won't have a smoking gun. But if you aren't already sure, then take this fact, Dodey actually did a podcast with Mario, where he tried to double down on the story, and then he tried to cover his tracks by saying some of the details were mistaken. "He was so covered by the guys that did the podcast that it was very difficult to get a straight answer out of any three of them, and it was really quite frustrating." I'll let you go find that footage. It's available to anyone who searches. But unfortunately, this all means that Mario's skin samples, and probably both Michael and Mario's files, passed through the hands of a man who 18 months later, would begin one of the longest running deception campaigns in the history of this subject. For a long time you had been saying that Jack Reed was the officer in charge in your case, and then you bring it up to Dodey and he was just very casually admitted that that was the case. And he acted at very beginning like he didn't know Michael's name. And I said, "Well, I asked him, I said, 'What do you mean you don't know him?' You knew my name. Why would you not know Michael's name?" Because he just tried to shove it off a little bit, and I just nailed him on it. This show literally never comes after people gratuitously, and I don't want a hammer on Dodey. If I had one message to him, I would implore him now. If he is in fact continuing any of his flood-the-zone strategy with aliens and UFOs, just lay off dude, leave 70-year-old Mario alone. He's clearly gone through enough, and the American people deserve better too. So I hope for all of our sake, and his, that Dodey, if he had any involvement with that fake 1977 Ellsworth alien attack document, if he could just come forward and come clean. Just as he did with the stories he fed Paul Benowitz, again, Mario and Michael don't need that validation, but it would at least be a sign of respect, and the best way to repent. Michael, how do you feel now that you know that in society, the frame is actually flipping where before, maybe it was this shameful thing that you had to kind of shove in the trunk and not talk about, and now it's celebrated and seen as a really unique kind of inquiry and foray into the nature of reality, who human beings are, which we're just kind of starting to get to the bottom of, but it's being accepted at the highest levels the president is now talking about it. You know, the Pentagon is looking into this officially, it's no longer this stigmatized thing. How do you feel about that? Just disappointed, because it was there, here when I saw it was there, when I was little boy seeing it, and now, over the government, now they want to talk about it now, you You know, the fire is open now. for this. People been seeing this for the longest time. I've seen strange occurrences in Missouri, in the Old Zarks, Texas, earth force. I've seen it. Now they want to make sense. Where is normal 30 now? No, it was the normal we saw. But now you want to make it normal. I feel a little disgusted. But I accept it. But I feel disgusted. Don't buy it though. I really do because we've been saying people had died saying that what they had seen people passed away great-grandmothers, our forefathers, seeing this. Hell, it'd been back in slavery Civil War days. Strange days happenin'. Sure did, didn't know. Food and food fighters do war all day wars. Yeah, you think you shoot at somebody and shoot at nothing. Where's your fire out there? The guy in Vietnam told me that. It's spook. Oh, sorry. No, don't apologize. I think you're right. He kept a 50-year-old order to keep his experience a secret out of habit and shame. Long after the Air Force forgot he existed. In Mario, Mario kept it for a different reason. After the service he went to the Department of Energy, Oak Ridge, Los Alamos, a queue clearance, reinvestigated every 18 months. One word about his first hand-sighting of beams and beams and that career quickly grinds to a halt. I had to repress this because my first clearance took over eight months to obtain, which I couldn't quite understand because I never had any infractions or anything like that with a law. When I was discharged under honorable conditions and went directly to work for the U.S. Department of Energy. After that first clearance, it went four months later. They were doing another clearance on me, a recheck. When they do that, then it's just not a one-on-one thing because the office personnel management does these clearance checks. They research everything back about 17, 18 years and they'll pull up your second and third grade school teachers so they can find a minister alive. They're trying to get like averages and they can see what kind of person somebody that comes from a young age, that's how they can kind of gauge things. I really believe that. I have a lot of faith in them. It just four months after my original clearance after all the guys kept looking at me like, "What the hell's taking you so long? What did you do?" Put that guilt trip on you. I once had a guy at DOE tell me, talking about, because anytime I could talk to some of these people about some of these things, I would. These people are basically, they'll say anything for a little bit of attention. They'll talk to you because nobody really talks to them. There's no clocks. There's no windows in their laboratories. Have you ever had any conversations with any of those people that lead you to believe that we have UFOs and hangers? Well, we have technology. They never said full craft on alien being or anything like that. But I was always interested in what do we have? Well, I had one guy just say, "Well, their propulsion systems are not built. They're grown." What? Yeah, the propulsion system is not built. It's grown. We've talked a bit about longevity and life extension on this show. 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And I restores kicking off their summer savings with some very big discounts. Right now, you can get the Elite Plus Alumina face mask bundle at an exclusive deal when you use code Jesse at irastore.com. That's Jesse, J-E-S-S-E at irastore.com. Please support our show and tell them we sent you. I was always interested in what do we have? Yeah. The propulsion system is not built. It's grown. Like a biological material or something? Yeah. It's grown. That's what he told me. And then did you say, "What does that mean?" Of course I did. Well, I can't go into that, but I'm just telling you, they're not built as we have cymbal and engine or a V8 engine. These are grown. And who was this? High-level description. Somebody that had the capability of running a control room at Los Alamos for a burst of an element. Interesting. That was in charge of that. Whoa. We say a burst of an element. Yeah, of a mercy of an element. I think that's element. Is that 95? I think it's 95. When you say a burst of an element. They put it into a reactor. They put it into a reactor and they subject it to alpha beta gamma. Gamma. They burst it like it would be like a mini blast, but it's contained. It's just granular at this point. And then they can scale up for whatever else it's intended to do. Do you say anything else? Metal surfaces could be manipulated to put things through in or out. And whatever that means. What does that mean? Metal surfaces? Metal surfaces or surfaces that can be penetrated or exited from or entered into like pass through a wall or pass through. Solid objects. Solid objects. Solid objects. Oh, yeah. I mean, that seems to be like what you see them do. Materialize, dematerialize it well, and then pass through solid objects. It all has to be frequency and sound, and they're studying hell out of that, right? Well, if you were also, you had like perfect macroscopic, you know, quantum coherence, then you could theoretically like pass through a wall or something. Sure. At night time, I do see, but nobody knows, listen to me, I just see lights out and out there running, nuclear sites and everything. I said, there ain't no here, you have a car, that's no black hump, that's not even a B-52, you know, it goes up, wake up, wake up, go down. So I just thought maybe I just saw there's some reflection of lights. See, so you saw other UFOs at Ellsworth Air Force Base before your experience. Yeah, I did, but who I'm gonna tell it to? Nobody's gonna believe me, you know what I'm saying? And I just say, well, you know, even on a parent rich in the reservation, you know, I saw one, I saw two, two on parent rich. Now it's time for an update, because since we've filmed this, Michael has recovered all sorts of other crazy memories. He's piecing things together at a rapid pace, and some of these new fragments are remarkable. He told us that in the weeks before that November night, cattle had been turning up dead around the missile field. These cattle were not killed by predators. Often their eyes were missing. Sometimes their tongue would be missing. One of them was split in half. In certain cases, they were bloodless, marked with precise incisions, your classic cattle medallations. Cattle medallations were a real documented problem across the northern plains in the 70s. Sheriff's investigated. States did. The FBI eventually did too. Nobody ever explained them. And when Michael photographed one of these mutilations, his camera was confiscated. Make of that what you will. All of these nuclear sites are also on sacred Native American lands. And so there's something about, it's like the skin walker thing. And, you know, Lakota land in elsewhere, this case. Yeah. But all of these sites are on Colorado. - We call F.E. Warren, Cheyenne Wyoming, yeah. - Cheyenne Wyoming, yeah. - Oh, yeah. - So what's that about? - There's one part of this story we haven't turned the page on yet. The land itself, Ellsworth, as with many American nuclear sites, is placed on some of the most sacred Native American land in existence. A bit of history. American Indian lands are estimated to hold as much as 50% of potential U.S. uranium reserves. In fact, Edgmont, South Dakota, at the southwestern edge of the Black Hills, about 80 miles from Ellsworth, was one of the earliest uranium boom towns during the Cold War. So Ellsworth is in close proximity to enriched uranium, making it a great candidate for storing nuclear warheads. But it wasn't so convenient for everybody. 150-minute man silos were sunk into land that was guaranteed to the Great Sue Nation by the 1868 Fort Laramie Treaty, a case that was apparently so egregious, that the courts called it as dishonorable a dealing as American history contains. In fact, the Lakota Sue people have refused compensation for the territory over 40 years, because taking it would accept the premise that they gave up the Black Hills in the first place. They call the territory "Hey Sapa Paha Sapa," which translates directly to the heart of everything that is. Not a name that you'd call anything that you'd part with lightly. In Lakota cosmology, the hills are specifically a sky place, a star map where ceremonial sites on the ground mirror the constellations above, where the thunder beings arrive at bear butte in storm and lightning to deliver terrifying, transformative visions, where fallen stars descended from the sky world, and where the seven girls rose from bear lodge to become pliedies. The American government, in other words, took the region its peoples understood as the hinge between the earth and the sky and planted the apocalypse in it. And farther southwest was the Navajo Nation, a people also deeply connected to the cosmos in their traditions and teachings. They also inhabited land rich in uranium that would later be mined to build the nuclear warheads at Ellsworth. Their most important tradition, the Navajo Nightchant, a sacred nine-day winter healing ceremony centered on restoring balance, health, and harmony. Remember this Navajo Nightchant, because it'll come up again in this video. And seeing closer encounters yet either, that was the next thing afterwards a couple weeks later when they see closer encounters. - Well, aren't the similarities with close encounters just wild with your guys' experience? Because you see that the car gets sucked up onto the craft, right? - Well, you know. - I saw the part where he pulls up to the mailbox and puts the flashlight in his mouth, Roy Neary. And the mailbox will start rocking. Of course, that's Hollywood, you know, but you know, 77, they got curiosity up a great deal. And then that light hit him. And then it seemed as if everything inside the truck started moving, it reminded me of us. Everything started like being pulled up or like there was no gravity in there or something. And then he seems to be, you hear these low-pitch hums in the movie. You can see it today. And you see him, he's kind of, he's kind of, as if somebody's programming him or sending him something that he is either downloading or understanding something different. Doesn't know what it is. And then all of a sudden it just goes out, that blackness. And then it reappeared at the intersection, am I correct? Okay. That part right there, I didn't watch to the intersection then at all. I got up and took out of the theater. I had to, I just ran out and sat on the curve on mainstream right there in front of the theater. My wife came out a few minutes later. She said, what is wrong? I said, I can't watch that part. I feel like you're portraying my life in there on that screen was what I said. Richard Dreyfus also receives a sunburn in the movie. And you guys both received burns and samples were taken of your burns. Correct, I didn't know if they had a Michael or not. I didn't, I didn't know. And a sunburn is basically just UV damage. And so if you think about, you know, red shifts and blue shifts, you know, kind of stretching and crunching light, which is what these crafts would do if they're flying in the ways we think they fly. And that's what they would cause. They would cause, you know, irradiation. He said, because he's here. And they didn't say, they didn't say my name, didn't say his name, just said because he's here. And that was exactly what we said. If anything, this Spielberg coincidence makes me think we're living in some bizarre simulation. Close encounters comes out the same week Mario has his experience. And now in the midst of reconnecting with his long lost partner, Spielberg decides to release disclosure day. About two experiences abducted together in childhood, but separated for decades. They reconnect through synchronicities and experience a hypnotic regression together, unlocking the truth about their past. Sometimes the truth is truly stranger than fiction. The bizarre synchronicities don't stop there. 1977 generally was also just an explosive year for alien contact. Just listen to all these firsts. In August, a radio telescope in Ohio caught the wow signal, a strong, narrow band, 72 second signal out of the Sagittarius constellation. Nothing like it before or since, possibly an extraterrestrial broadcast, and one that's sitting unexplained to this day. And that same month, almost as if whoever sent the wow signal knew this was about to happen, Voyager 2 left Earth, followed 16 days later by Voyager 1. Two robotic explorers sent towards the outer planets and eventually interstellar space to act as humanity's message in a bottle. As the secretary general of the United Nations, I sent greetings on behalf of the people of our planet. Each spacecraft carried what was known as a golden record, containing the sights and sounds of planet Earth, a mother's soothing voice, a whale song, the composer, Bach, greetings in 55 different languages, a family portrait, monument valley, and you guessed it, the Navajo nightchant. Humanity's own attempt at first contact, a record pressed with a prayer for harmony. In fact, this year, 2026, on November 18th, at 316 AM mountain time, exactly 49 years from the time Mario and Michael were blacked out aboard a spacecraft, Voyager 1 will be exactly one full light day away from Earth. You couldn't write that up. The first interstellar probe ever sent out by humanity to make contact with an ET civilization breaks this huge milestone, 49 years to the hour of Mario and Michael's experience. And just months after their reconnection, humanity has spent those 49 years waiting patiently for a reply, listening for another narrow band hit, maybe from Sagittarius. Mario spent those 49 years waiting on a reply from a partner that had vanished. But maybe the lesson here is that contact isn't still crossing the darkness toward us through space. It's already here, and in 1977, it was looking down into our missile silos, transfixed by our dual nature of good and evil, of love and fear. Michael, if you had a best guess, what do you think the beings that you and Mario encountered in 1977 were? - Well, I think you were, do I think you were? - Yeah, where are they from? Who are they? If you had guests. - I just, yes, they've been here before on this Earth. They're back from a visit. I really feel that I feel that there have been people here before us strange beings and stuff. They don't have to be in the same form reawaring, you know what I'm saying? That had been the same form, but I do believe that there had been life here for us and everything, and it's still here right now, among us. - What about family history or when you were a kid? Because we know with Mario, he actually saw something with his mom, and it's usually a common thing with experiences that you check their childhood enough, you check their family history and you'll see something come up. - Yeah. - Do you have anything like that? - Oh, I had a strange, Thoughts strange sightings, but all my father's I know my father my mother my sister my brother Was interested, you know, yeah, I was not interested in everything. I was sit out there in St. Louis and from St. Louis Okay, if you know St. Louis and Missouri and all that I'll be out there tonight Out the park O'Fallon Park sit on the bench young young guy And if I know if I knew what would happen to young boys then I will never get out there Yeah, you know, but I was out there because everybody should pick on me, you know everything And they have nobody so I got there and relax and look at the interstate. Oh, all we love Travis He didn't stay 70 going this way going that way. Why would they pick on you? Oh, because I was different because I was smart and because I you know I had no big brother like they had big brothers and stuff like that, you know I talked funny in everything and all that kind of thing It's it changed though. I guarantee you change, but in the meantime, that was my mama my mother responsible for that But anyway, I was all sit there and I was look up at the Gateway Arch Gateway Arch and everything and I will see lights going by everything. I will see lights going by I said now if I see that somebody I see that on interstate two, you know what I'm saying and everything You know it go by it come back this way, you know This ain't the earth show. This ain't the air show they had recently. This is something else But I didn't pay attention. I just always at the time. Just something just look at you know what I'm saying And this was about 9 o'clock at night I should be out there. I should be out there at that time of night I should be out there by wolves because I got tired of being picked on, you know in everything and I wanted to just get away for a while and be myself Mario is part Native American and he thinks that maybe part of some of his kind of extra sensitivity to this sort of stuff comes from his Cherokee heritage Mayan. Mayan. Sorry. It's my in heritage. It's okay. Do you have anything like that in your background? Well, my mama's Cherokee. Really. That's where you got it. Whoa I'm a stuck Mario's background is Cherokee, but your mama's Cherokee Her mother's Cherokee my mama's Cherokee and everything and Mario's that is Honduras and that's the Mayan roots. Yeah, yeah, Mayan roots. Okay, and you but so there's actually All sorts of like, you know intelligence people are now coming out saying that Native American traditions are a big part of You know like having even that sort of you know lineage ancestral lineage or our part of is part of propensity or predisposition to like experiencing things But that's that's what gives me though because I've been fascinated with the Native Americans anyway And I like going to Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota. I would go out there Yeah, and that's where I would see lights all the time But I have to say because it's still so dark out there. Pine Ridge you have been a pine ridge. It's just this office There's nothing out there or the badlands. Oh the badlands. Yeah But you felt at home there and you would see lights me - it was too. I wasn't scared. Oh, yeah What about I could go there today leave here and go there today and go I could go there and live Do you ever see UFOs there or do you just felt kind of at home energetically there? Other than 77 I only saw one other thing in the Kilo area and it was an object that it looked like an egg that went straight to the ground and Mark Wade was my team leader. We were going to Kilo tin and the reason we were going to Kilo tin because it'd been snowed in And we were how we would have to dig out the antennas so they could reset But we didn't do it. We just you just rather gas trying to trying to be saw an object like an egg did it crash And they just know I was I saw it in a rearview mirror on the side Western mirror as we were going away for as we go on toward Kilo tin I saw this I just was looking and I see this thing in a side in the big side mirror go Come down like that and it was maybe I Don't know three four hundred yards behind us and it was small and it came down and it zigzagged and it just went down and went off Whoa, what year was that? 78 Michael, did your mother who was Cherokee ever experience anything sort of paranormal and it see any UFOs? Well, I don't know if she ever saw anything per se, but she was deeply religious You know, she was she was religious and everything and That's why that that's that's why I was getting back with you. I was a little boy out there on the state You know, she didn't like that, you know, she didn't like that in fact she joked with me Somebody will come down and snatch you like that. Come down and snatch you come down and snatch you It's like she knew that you were going to get taken or something You know, it's because she's very protective of me and our everything so I you know, I know how that is Yeah, but but the fact that she said come down and snatch you shows that she has like Mental concept of the fact that that could even happen what you think you know aren't familiar with any of these things alien abductions or yeah, some of these traditions you talk about I never seen like that You say say you come down. I just looked at you know everything like that. Did you ever ask her to hey mom? Did anything ever happen to you? No, but she said there was living out there. They were we're not alone She did say that we are not alone out here And she she's from Texas is Texas and ways ways there and everything and she she told me she seems things that you know You won't think will exist When they exist my mother was taking me to my first grade school which was dequeen elementary and We were about the fifth there's seven of the car back in line and I'm on the passenger side in the in the front seat No seat belt. We didn't do that back then My sister was in the back seat and of course my mother's driving and she stopped short of the car in front of her And she says look Anthony look at those flying saucers When's the last time your mother ever said something like that to you? I mean, I'm just six years old five and a half six years old And I just couldn't even fathom what she said and they were right over a church Just maybe 25 to 50 feet in the air and there were three of them. They were beautiful When I saw those three saucers And pulled off their Texas that morning my mother was taking my middle school my sister was sitting behind her in the car You know my my first thoughts when I went and I said where are they mom she said right here and she put it up at them And I go oh my I said oh my like that look at that and in my sister she said I'm scared mom and she said There's they're not here to hurt you No reason to be afraid and she said they're not here to harm you And my sister didn't say anything back then as the door was opening But when I stood out and got the full gravity of what I was looking at It was never a more right moment They were supposed to be there. It was like it was like um It was almost as it was almost as if more than I could describe A greater power Be it God be it angels be be it a civilization They were like checking on us That's the way I felt like it was right as a rain. I felt no fear whatsoever At all they were the most beautiful crafts I've ever seen in my life They are absolutely gorgeous and exactly alike all three of them And they just sat there hovering and when I felt how comfortable I was with them That's when I turned in a look and saw everything out there In the playground to the people hanging out of the windows of the one building school from first grade to twelfth grade Would you know everybody's pointing their fingers in the air like that looking at them Everybody and it was as quiet as it could be And when those things went they just went And they were I mean I washed them go all the way up just like that vent right there until they were just like that and never gone They were in space in seconds Do you think the UFO you saw in 61 and the beings that both of you encountered in 77 Were aware that you would reunite 50 years later Oh, that's a great question. Wow. That's a blow my mind. I never know about that My question right there. There's a blow my mind question right there Are we came to them? Are we are we related to them or something some some form, you know Because I believe back in I believe back in in the days of the Egyptians Have have some kind of secret colds and everything but the pyramids and everything They're always fascinating. We had how who made that who I was formed Well, well, well, aliens been here before this as seen mind you miss I see questions how how the stone got here in England the The stones who who did this you know what I'm saying in intelligence form I'm not sure but I already read about things like the only subjects like that talk Because if fascinating me you see certain things that being for centuries sent you for man before Jesus they say was here You know Somebody was here before Jesus. It's all throughout the Bible. Yeah He texted me all of them all of them. It's in there. You know that Mario was kind of imbued with a newfound interest in Wonders of the world, but specifically the Egyptian pyramids which he bonded with Amar about After that experience. So he was changed in a way that gave him more interest in those sorts of things I had to find out everything about archaeology and pyramids Mm And so that was just something that it almost felt like it was installed inside of you were downloaded Yes, you know God made fun of me in the missile field because I'd sit at the diner-ing tables in the day room and I'd draw a pyramid. I'd put a weird top on it and all the sparks coming out of it. Now, I call that an Atlantian pyramid. Michael, you've had other strange experiences happen to you since that 1977 experience. Right. Yeah. What else has happened? Well, you know, like I said, I finally got a job driving trucks and stuff, you know, everything, and I like the Southwest anyway. I like the Southwest, and I was having a load-- Me, sure. --have a load going to our pencil, to our pencil and everything. And I picked up a load from our pencil, going back on twinning, going back to a dials for the word, everything like that. I don't know how I got side-rounded, I don't know how I got side-rounded and everything to where I was driving, did they say the interstate, you know what I'm saying? It's not the interstate. I got off that, I guess, to a truck stop, I guess I took a wrong turn. I did get off that truck stop. I must have took the wrong turn, and I was going to take it back to the interstate, but kept taking me deeper and deeper further further into where, nowhere, I knew where I was going. And I was driving, driving, trying to help me get out of there because it was dark, deserted, dark. So I was just driving, and then I saw some come across me in front of me, come across me, and I'm driving and looking around, and saw them come across me, I said, "Damn, what was that?" Like a UFO? Yeah. Just came across me, and I'm just like, okay, you know, come at that time, I was like, "Oh, hell, but I'm going to lose my job, I'll wear more of it by my job," and took a little going to be late, going back to New York somewhere, going back to New York. And next day I saw a police car, a squad car, come up behind me, okay, the lights are. So I pulled over, and everything, he asked me where I was going, and I told him I was going back to my destination with the truck, he looked at the truck, and he said, "You know where you are." Like that. I said, "Well, 1000 Texas, you know, you're in the valley." And he was strange, too. He was strange, he was strange looking, too, and he said, "What are you doing out here?" "Well, you're going, like that to me," I said something, I said, "I did say something wrong." "Yeah, you're going to government property." This area, this area is off limit to everybody, civilians, everybody. And then I remember saying, "That's why I saw the signs out there, no trespass, no trespass, and you know, and everything." How many hours had passed since he made a wrong turn in Texas? Jesus. Two. And that coincided with a UFO flying above your dashboard, the car. So it's almost like maybe a similar kind of missing time event as what happened to you in 1977 at Ellsworth. But that's a lot of missing time there was like they wake up nine and a half miles away. This is they wake up four hour flight away. And his son thinks that maybe it was Area 51 where he was dropped off. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. And then the cops, the police, he escorted me to get back to the main road and everything. And so I got back on the main road and stuff like that. He told me, "Keep straight. Just go on. You ain't supposed to be here." He sounded like a contractor. You know, you stop, you stop again, you know, they might, they might take you, they might take you away, whatever, you know, they might take me away like that, you know. And that was it. I got back on the main road and you said he looked funny. Yes. He did look funny. What did he look like? He was short. He was short. Face was puffy. He had a head on a Debbie doll kind of hat, like a Debbie doll kind of hat from cartoons and stuff. And I feel like maybe he was not fully human or. Yes. Because he talked to me. I asked him questions. He talked to me like, "Slow, you know what I'm saying? Slow talking back to me. No, you need to go back this way." You're engaging me. Okay. And I said, "Well, I need some direction, everything. I will help you. I will escort you back. You don't come back here no more." That's what he said. Just like that. Don't come back here no more. On the last day of our trip, we decided to rent a beautiful house for Michael and Mario by Lake Austin and just let them reminisce and chop it up and spend some quality time with each other. So now we get to find something and now he starts to settle with now. How do you say to death through your part? That's right. We know it now. I'm just glad that we're only 230 miles apart then. That's a trip. As the night got dark, we packed it up and went inside and decided to surprise Michael and Mario. With all of the AI recreations we made of their experience from this episode. The worst thing that happened to these two men wasn't their abduction. It was the human factors around it. It was what happened afterwards. Their interrogators spent most of their time trying to explain away the experience. To make Mario and Michael the problem rather than deal with the incident head on, the demotions, the overseas deployment, the decades of downplaying and denial. Two vetted, screened armed young men did exactly what the Air Force trained them to do. They responded, they observed, they reported. And the system's answer was to gaslight them, split them, spit one of them out and to file them away. To manufacture a stigma and every veteran watching who ever swallowed a report because the truth would cost their career. This episode is yours too. Mario never got disclosure. The government never confirmed and maybe never will the essence of his story. But that's fine because one recruiter with a laptop did what multiple government agencies failed to. Found his partner, the person he'd been asking for for the last 50 years, ever since being pulled out of that Ford pickup. And with that, he and Michael have something way better than disclosure. They have closure, ordinary people, crowdsourcing their own truth. As the sanctioned version never came. Now they're reconnected, their brothers for life. But like so many people who served, they're living paycheck to paycheck. And since they don't get paid to share their story. And they're both over 70 and still working blue collar jobs. Amar and I decided the best thing to do was to launch a GoFundMe page on their behalf. Link below. Whatever you give goes directly to Michael and Mario. This will serve as much needed money for their retirement. And if you wore the uniform, at that base or any base like it, and you've been carrying your own November night, an experience that indicates we're not alone, you just watched what 50 years of silence costs and what breaking it gives you back. You may look. The comments are open, are emails in the description. But one question still lingers. What actually happened to Michael and Mario? Who were these beings and what did they want with them? When you strip everything away, a signal exchange, at least five missing hours, a truck at a dam, mud in a frozen field, burns a doctor found first, one glove with the memory of another on a shiny floor, drawings and recollections of a shape, size, and color of the craft. And three words, surfacing in 1961 on a Texas school yard in 1977 in a dead truck, in two separate hypnosis sessions, and finally in a push notification. We also just have two incredible heart-centered veterans who wouldn't give up on each other, and they're now reunited because of it. Something clearly happened at Ellsworth. But what exactly was it? Perhaps the only recurring words transmitted by the beings are a clue. Do not fear. Every wine, say about 2600 years, a man named Daniel is standing on the bank of the Tigris. When he sees a being with a face like lightning and eyes like torches, his companions flee. Daniel's strength drains out of him. He collapses face first into the dirt, and the beings' first words to him are, "Do not be afraid, Daniel." Fear not is the closest thing the biblical angels have to a recurring catchphrase. It's said to Zechariah in the temple to marry at the enunciation, to the shepherd's outside Bethlehem, to the women at the empty tomb. It is functionally the angelic protocol, step one of every close encounter of the scriptural kind. Modern people conceive of angels as friendly cherubs that you see on hallmark cards, but biblical angels are actually not that at all. They're utterly terrifying, it's never a fun encounter. It's overwhelming, blinding, and ontologically shocking. The reason the angels say do not fear is because they have to. The experiencer is almost always drowning in fear. The keel's visitors arrive as interlocking wheels covered in eyes, wrapped in fire, and storm. Daniel is left trembling on his hands and knees. The witnesses don't feel warm and fuzzy, they feel annihilated. The pattern is always the same three-beat structure. Number one, overwhelming presence. The witness is paralyzed, terrified, physically undone. Number two, reassurance. Do not fear, delivered before anything else can happen. Number three, the message. The witness's life is never the same afterwards. Now read any serious collection of high-strangeness abduction reports. Michael and Mario at Ellsworth among them, and you find the identical grammar. Paralysis, terror, a communication, often telepathic that leads with calm. Witnesses who spend the rest of their lives haunted, transformed, unable to fully return to the person they were. I was terrified the whole time. Jacques Valle, the legendary French astrophysicist and UFO godfather that Spielberg depicted in closing counters, spent his career pointing at exactly this. His argument in his great book Passport to Mugonia was heretical to both believers and debunkers. The UFO phenomenon isn't new, and it isn't necessarily extraterrestrial. It's the same phenomenon humanity has always encountered, wearing whatever mask the culture provides, to medieval Europe, angels and demons, to the Celts, the good folk, who also incidentally abducted people and distorted their sense of time. To 1977 America, a craft and beings at a missile base, the technology of the encounter updates, the facade changes, but the structure of the encounter, terror, reassurance, message, information, is ancient and weirdly stable. Whatever this phenomenon is, it has a clear real estate and timing preference. These things show up at moments of peak instability, either to save things worth preserving, or destroy things that have become unruly. And are now worth discarding. The Bible's pattern of angelic deployment is exactly that, angels and scripture are not evenly distributed. They cluster at hinge points. This where timelines can shift drastically, where the destruction or survival of a people is on the table. To angels walk into Sodom the night before the fire falls. An angel stands over Jerusalem with a drawn sword during the plague of David's census. The angel of the Lord moves through the Assyrian camp the night the siege breaks. Angels are, among other things, scriptures, ordinance inspectors. They show up where annihilation is pending, sometimes to deliver it, sometimes to call it off. So where would you expect such beings to appear in the 20th century? Humanity spent most of its history unable to destroy itself. Then on July 16th, 1945, in a stretch of New Mexico desert, Oppenheimer named Trinity and sit with that name for a second, the most secular project in human history, christened after the triune god, its director reaching for the Bhagavad Gita's "I Am Become Death" was no smaller language fit. We acquired the one capability scripture had always reserved for heaven, fire from the skies, cities erased in an instant. This was a truly promethean act. If the biblical watchers were real, and if their historical beat was, stand at the hinge points where worlds can end, then missile fields in South Dakota and Montana are not a strange place to find them at all. They are the obvious place. The prophets stood at the gates of doomed cities. The phenomenon parks itself over the silos. The venue changed because the circumstances did. But underneath it, the same archetype. Ultimately, we don't know what Mario and Michael saw, and neither do they. Visitor, watcher, archetype, alien, angel, demon. Every descriptor falls short and contains a lot of baggage. Jacques Vallet might say this was a mythological encounter, at the pressure points of human belief and power. Other great UFO researchers, like the legendary Stanton Friedman, would say that these beings are probably extraterrestrial. But Jacques met a sociological analysis, Stanton Friedman's extraterrestrial overlay, and any sort of biblical comparison, is all just analysis. We are trapped by our complete inability to describe transcendent experiences. The point is there is an underlying pattern, and it's been going on for thousands of years. Something ancient, perked up, and resumed its rounds the moment we built the nukes ourselves. And its first words to two trembling airmen in the South Dakota Prairie were the same words spoken to a trembling prophet on the banks of the Tigris. Historically, these beings have spoken to man through complex numerology, signs, symbols, and synchronicities. A phenomenon we have experienced plenty of throughout this trip. They reconnected what on 626-26. He landed at 111, and Amar, who's coming from Yes Theory, he is taking off at 111. Whoa, look at the 111. Look at the 111. That's wild. We're picking Michael up at 222. So in that vein, perhaps do not fear, indicated a foreknowledge of Mario and Michael's glorious reunion. Perhaps this was always part of the beings' plan. This should be an inspiration to us all, so that we know all things are possible with the grace of God. We should maybe worry a bit less, because perhaps we're being looked out for. Make God bless Mario and Michael. I thank them so much for the courage and vulnerability it took them to share their story. I also want to thank Amar, Yvonne, and the entire crew that helped out. Keep your mind, eyes, and heart open. I'm Jesse Michaels, and this is American Alchemy.