AI Insider: "You Can Make $1M in a Week!" The 3 Hidden AI Gold Rushes in 2026

What do you think are the three many gold rushes happening inside AI right now that no one is talking about? Yeah, I would say almost like The last time I was on here, I said that The thing young people should be doing is building AI apps and marketing them But I realize now that even that is too much work for the average person to do despite that being like a completely viable way to make her millions I think AI video will spawn in a whole new era of Labor for people to go out make AI videos for companies to service marketing material or just completely up and all social medias as we know it You know because really that like that the where the world happens today is Instagram Reels and TikTok Functionally, this is where mom Donnie gets gets made mayor of New York City. This is where a OC becomes like one of the most famous politicians in America This is where social media is where things happen and AI video has the potential to completely up and social media And the easiest lowest effort thing that somebody can do to make their riches a sub gold rush Of AI is just AI video like go out there and make AI videos email a bunch of companies Here's a UGC video that that that I made for you that you made all mine run this as an ad and if it's not profitable Then don't ever talk to me again But if it is profitable then put me on a retainer for $3,000 a month And I'll continue to make you AI ads just like this and you can literally sit there and just fucking type in AI Some some bullshit with a million typos and like making it make an ad for this company more broadly though I would say the the way to make money with AI today Is to capture the value of like people who do not know how good AI is right now There are so many companies like this so many people like this In fact, I would say 99.9% of companies in the world today are like this They have the opportunity to use AI for something that they are not doing And you whether that's making ads for them because they're not tapping into AI video enough Whether that's making websites for them because you know they're not freaking that out enough Whether it's building AI apps and then selling that's the average consumer who doesn't know that they could five code this themselves over a weekend. This is where you stand to make your money And there are so so many ways to make millions of dollars doing this There's so many people that I know who have made millions of dollars doing the most absurd things Building the most random apps doing the most random bullshit for different companies There's marketing agencies that exist now that subcontract middle schoolers to make AI videos for them And then sell those as ads like like this exact process that I talked about I'll make you a bunch of ads for your company and rather than having you know like an in-house A grand empire of 40 like like a huge building with 40 UGC creators And like like having to go through all all that nonsense Literally just DM a bunch of 14 year old TikTokers online Have them make the ads and then sell that to the company There's marketing agencies that exist like that today There's marketing agencies that exist for LinkedIn ghost writing Where you don't do any of the ghost writing You just convince to someone that you can make LinkedIn post for them And you just generate a bunch of AI random bullshit And the person that you're selling to doesn't know at all that What what you just sent them is completely age-generated And you didn't look at it You know like for all they know there's some fucking 45 year old It doesn't even know what fucking chat chat chat chat is There's so many people making money in so many different ways And if you had to ask me you know like like the three sub categories I say that the the highest level If you are the most competent and smartest person watching this video Then you probably want to do something that serves the AI labs You build a company around whether it's you know providing them data You know building infrastructure for for for for them to run their models on Trying to develop some some some some some some sort of thing That will slightly improve the efficiency of some data chip of of of of of some shipper GPU Anything in that in that field it's right. It's it's the VC money is is flowing in that field Like truly billions multiple billions to be made there If you want to build an app you know you can you can you you can go out and build apps If you're not interested in taking a swing at that level You can build an app can market it. It's never been easier to build before It's never been easier to market before And you can market it with an AI influencer You can build that in an afternoon get it approved by the app store in the next three days And you can market it entirely with AI influencers And in theory this is all possible It's possible for you to spawn in a million dollars in a week You can do that you can just go on some AI video platform and just figure out like okay Here's a UGC video that I think would be funny Send it to any company and be on a retainer and just make 10k a month doing that There's there's there's just so much so much so much money to be made at so many different levels me personally this it makes me want to go back to every podcast I've done and every podcast I've seen about how to make money with social media and just apply it to AI video specifically Because there's a million different ways people have made money with videos on social media like YouTube agencies that like sell ads for creators and there's like long-form content There's short-form content. There's audio content. There's transcribing the videos into other languages You can make AI videos in other countries it's a lot of stuff like that. There's Facebook ads UGC content like you said but if we let's try to distill this down to make it super accessible And you can take your time on this one. I If you had to go from zero to a million dollars in six months with AI video How would you do it? Step one search up cdans 2.5 find any provider Step two find 100 software companies who have raised over 10 million dollars of venture capital Step three or every single one of them make a compelling ad and add that you think you would watch On social media yourself using cdans 2.5 Step four email every single one of these companies every single day with the ad telling them I made this ad for you for free go run it as an ad if it's profitable put me on a retainer I'll make you more ads if this ad performs for you pay me $10,000 a month I will make you more ads just like this and I guarantee on making money if it's not profitable Completely ignore this email never talked me again But I made this for you for free email them that same thing every single day until they respond Step five repeat this eight times and you have eight clients paying you $10,000 a month and over a year you make a million dollars I guess six six months so sure repeat it 16 times get 16 companies to to sign us off by the way This is something that I would sign off on That would work fast people this question a lot that would work though And then just any uh one bit of advice to add to that on how to make good AI ads If you are young and interested in making money One of the only advantages that you have because realistically on average You're a super than the generations before you on average There's more competitors out there in the space of entrepreneurship than ever before and uh one of your only skills That you have is the skill that you spent the last 14 years of your life doom scrolling It hours a day on tiktok or Instagram bills or youtube shorts or use of kits and there is actually a way to use that to your advantage Which is you have the unique ability or I would say even most people watching this video And I really think the average person watching any video online is some fucking arded farmer in Kansas that is going to be incapable of doing anything that requires any sort of cognitive ability at all But genuinely for the average person watching this video It is possible for them to look at a video and say this is boring or this is not And that is the only skill that you need to make compelling AI ads or compelling ad videos That will actually work because what surprises me almost every single week at least once a week I have an instance of this surprising me is these 40-year-old boomers on Facebook do not understand what's boring They will genuinely read the most AI slot bullshit ever The the the the the most disgustingly m-dash filled essay ever and they'll send it to their grandkids Be like you should read this. This was inspiring to me These people genuinely do not have that sense that you develop over years of, you know, scrolling And if you're a young guy watching the video you're a young person watching the video Like that sense is genuinely be the only thing you need to sit down in front of CDN 2.5 And keep prompting something over and over until you get something that you think is funny Because if you think it's funny as a 14-year-old to doom scrolls Other 14-year-olds will find it funny and you will have had a video that the 40-year-old on Facebook would just never ever ever ever have been able to make I think that's great advice, yeah, and I'm realizing now you can also just look up a company Go to their Facebook ads, metal library, whatever, see their longest running ad And then remake it with CDNs Of course, yes, and sell to their competitors This is this is good stuff, Roy I mean, do you think getting rich is just painfully simple in 2026? If this were the 1800s and you wanted to get rich First of all, you have to pray that you're born in America Second of all, you have to pray your ass is not black Second of all, or third of all, you got to pray that your family has the money to send you to college Fourth of all, you got to pray that you're not fucking doomed to be some coal miner for the rest of your life Because your father wasn't your grandfather was before you and they don't know anything outside of that And they would fucking beat you and kick you out of the house If you weren't going to be participating in the coal mining industry There are so many loopholes that you had to go through that are literally just Chance by genetic lottery Right now, it is true, it is objectively true There are more young millionaires now than ever You could have got lucky on some fucking crypto coin back in, you know, like four years ago And you wouldn't have even had to be 18 years old You could have fucking KYC'd using your moms Identity, you could have put 20 bucks in it And you could have fucking flipped this 20 bucks into millions of dollars And there genuinely are 14, 15, 16 year olds that I've done this before And perhaps not painfully easy, but getting rich right now compared to the 1800s Is both painfully easy and is painfully simple You have the entire knowledge of humanity Essentially at your fingertips not just with the internet but with AI Because I guarantee if you ask AI how can I make $10,000 this month The AI will come up with at least one solution that is somewhat viable And the only difference between the version of you that has made the money And the version of you that is not is that the version of you that has made the money Actually tried it And this is just such a different thing than it was back in the day Where if you didn't start the fucking carpentry business that your entire village relied on Then you were making it out like genuinely You can just type the right buttons on your laptop and you will become rich And there's an infinite wealth of advice waiting for you That you don't even have to fucking watch anymore Because you can just ask AI to summarize the videos for you And it will genuinely tell you the correct answer to do. A kid online could entirely in chatgbt.com have found this video by searching what are, you know, like the recent videos on how to get rich with AI, summarize the video, figure out how to perform the steps of the video, set up an automation to do every step except sitting in front of CDAN 2.5 and waiting for, you know, like, like, they could be the good videos to come out. And you could have done this all on chatgbt.com with fucking like a week's worth of time. And I just truly don't understand how in any point in human history, it could have been more, more easy. The ways to get rich are like, uncountable. The ease of most of these methods are uncountable. And the average laziness of your competitors is just higher than it's ever been before. If you're just not rich right now, or you're not very close to getting rich, or you're not trying something that is a very good chance of making you rich, then I genuinely would say, it seems like you don't want to get rich, buddy. I'll just say as a challenge to the viewers, if you can make a viral video with me and Roy at this podcast table right now, can just be any part of the conversation. Just use CDAN 2.5 and it said you $1,000, if it gets 100,000 views, million views. Sure. Million views. I'll send them $1,000. I want to ask, are you hiring a lot of people at your startup right now? Because I'm curious, like, if AIs kind of making founders think differently and not wanting to hire people, but just figure out how to automate it before we need to hire them. Does that make sense? Yeah. I really think that the way we operate the company right now is very different from any company that I've seen and the way that it's most similar to other companies right now, but different from, you know, established companies is that we have a shockingly small amount of engineers. There are two full-time engineers that work at the company and this is, I would say, the average amount of engineers that I see at most Series A, Series A, Series A startups. These startups with, you know, products that you've heard of that you use have a shockingly small amount of engineers because it just doesn't take that much. You can write the same quality of code now with a completely novice engineer or honestly as you could with a completely senior engineer just because the coding models have gotten that good. So I would say firstly, we have a very shockingly small number of engineers and it is a team that I'm not super interested in growing. Second, I would say we have a very large product suite and I would say this is something that we do that I don't see other companies doing. We operate with, at this point, there are seven software products that exist under the cluely corporate entity and one of them is the cluely desktop app. There's seven products that are maintained by two engineers and almost every single one of these products makes over a million dollars a year and it is crazy that we are allowed to do this because now you really, you're able to spin up a product that would have otherwise taken three months to six months to develop with a team of 20 engineers. You can do this in the free time of the afternoon of an engineer today. This is something that I don't see other people doing. I think even right now, there's so much value to be captured in the people that don't understand you can watch out these apps or not willing to watch out the apps. There's competitors that aren't willing to compete with you because they're still single focus on their own product that I think people don't actually realize. You could just spin up seven products that can make you a lot of money if marketing correctly. We could probably do fucking 20. The third way I think we're different from other companies is that we hire an astonishingly high number of creators. We have at this point, you know, and this role really did not exist five, ten years ago, but we have creators on retainer that we pay for the performance of their videos. You make ads for us if you add to well, you get paid. At this point, we have, I want to say, over a thousand people that we hire in this sort of capacity that are just making videos for us and if the videos do well as ads, then you get paid. We probably have the capacity to hire ten thousand more. If there's ten thousand good creators that make profitable ads for you, then why would you not? You could hire a hundred. You could hire a million creators to do this as long as the ads keep working. I think this is something that I don't see other companies doing. They have not. Most people just are not willing to tap into the power of creative quantity, which is something that I think we've always been forwarded in. The average critter at your company are they more interested in this AI video content creation than making the videos themselves like what are creators saying about it, or you just finding a different series of people to create that AI type of content. This is something relatively new we're trying. They have video stuff we've gotten into over the past month or two, and it's largely been internal with people that we have in house at the company. The thing is, other companies are so far behind in advertising and marketing material they haven't even tapped into the idea that you can hire 100 creators to make organic UGC videos where they're just talking to the camera and that a great ads for you. Most companies are not doing this much less trying to invest in a thousand different AI TikTok accounts to see which of these can generate a viral trend. Right now there is so much money to be made and so much low-hanging food for us from literally just having creators make content for us organically. Do you have a beat to be consulting side where you offer that as a service to? This is a super niche opinion I have, but I think marketing is just one of those things that doesn't really scale. Ultimately, there are only so many eyeballs on the internet. There really are only 7 billion people in the world, and even within any sector, if you want to be the marketing studio, if you want to be the marketing guys that a toilet paper brand can come to, surely this toilet paper company could not come to you as well as all of their competitors. Surely not every single one of them could come to you and expect proper returns. At the end of the day, marketing is a zero sum game where there's the fixed share of people, fixed share of eyeballs, and you have to be the first to capture attention, eyeballs, interesting compelling videos. You've got to be the first as opposed to all of your competitors, and it's not one of those things. For example, payroll, if I develop a more efficient process for payroll, then everybody can enjoy the extra five hours that they have to spend on being not payroll. For marketing, it really is not like that. Marketing is one of those zero sum things where you have to be strictly better than your competitors, and it's not that everybody can just enjoy an increasingly larger pie. Ultimately, it's not that if ads become 10 times as good tomorrow, the consumer is not going to spend 10 times as much. There's a fixed budget for consumer spending, and the only thing that changes how it's distributed. I really don't think that there's a generational company to be built out of doing a B2B marketing consultancy. Quick question. Are you someone who struggles to pay attention while a football game is going on? And you're practically doom-scrolling on your phone for 90% of it. 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Again, that's code Jack, to get your first $150 in lineups if you win your first $5 lineup. Prize picks. America's number one sports picks app. But anyway guys, back to the podcast. The school year has just started 20 million students are enrolled in college. How many kids graduating college this year will never find a job? There's an exact number for this online, but I wouldn't be surprised if this number was anything around like even 40%. I really would not be surprised if it was one and two, one and three college graduates couldn't find a job. I think increasingly there's less jobs for people. I guess I mean, like never, so a lot of people talk about the idea of like they're not being able to get a job out of college, but like do you think some people will just never have a job? Of course, some people that that's a question I haven't thought of, but the more I think about it right now, more I realize like there's probably a huge group of people like this. Some of the focus I know in college are, and I want I want to Columbia for a further while. So I, some of the smartest motherfuckers that Ivy leagues are the laziest, most incompetent pieces should ever, and I would never, ever, I wouldn't hire them to fucking shine my shoes. Like this motherfucker will stay in bed, doom scroll, if it's shine my shoes at eight, at eight a.m. This guy's not pulling up to fucking 10 p.m. So I, I have pretty low faith in the college graduates of today. And if I had to put a number on the college graduate, the percentage of college graduates who would never find a job in their life, I wouldn't be surprised to feel something like 15%. Hmm. How about five years from now? What do you think that'll be? Five years ago, we didn't have Chatch B.T. and today Chatch B.T. can functionally do the work of almost all blue-collar labor. So if you had to extrapolate five years from now, then I'd say the number of college students who won't be able to find jobs, that's, that number is probably upwards of 90, upwards of 90%. I would say. So for the average kid today, would you advise them to drop out of high school? But the only reason to stay in high school is to enjoy the social life of high school. I think even if it were the case that you told me, humanity is going to be extinct in five years. The economy will collapse and everybody is going to be plugged into these matrix type simulation that is going to feed us a consciousness that feed us a reality that is not the reality we experience. But you know, like an optimized version, even if you told me that was going to be the reality of the world in five years, I would still tell high schoolers to stay in school because ultimately, I think humans at our core, we are primal creatures. We are driven by biological desires, like sex, socializing, and, and friends and, and, and, and truly being, being lonely is. is one of the worst feelings in the world. When I graduated high school or after I graduated high school, I took a year and that entire year, I spent my mom's house in my parents' house and I did not meet a single person in this entire year. And this was just one of the most brutal, worst experiences of my life. I've been poor, I've been like canceled online, I've been shut on for so many things. And there's just no period in my life that was ever more painful than me sitting in complete isolation. And I think the risk with dropping out of high school, even if you could make millions of dollars, there are the majority of people won't. The majority of people are going to drop up high school and live lives of complete and total isolation. And I think this is the worst fate that you could ever doom a human to. I think when you're in high school, you have the chance to be in a place where you're kind of forced to socialize with other people. And if you want to start a business in high school, you can do it in your free time outside of high school, but I really think loneliness is one of those things that is just the worst possible human experience. - Yeah, there are guys listening to this podcast right now that literally haven't had a meaningful conversation with another person in weeks. Their entire social life is online. Do you think AI is making men lonelyer? - Certainly not. I think this is, I think COVID did a lot of damage to society and it forced everyone inside, forced everyone not to talk with each other. And I think this is actually one of the reasons why I think the college environment is just not what it used to be. What used to be college was a very bustling, very social place, there's a campus, there's a commons and you would go out and you'd be able to talk to people your age. But nowadays, you ask about anybody's college experience. At least of the people that I've met, they have a core group of friends that they met at orientation. It may be three or four friends and that's all the people they'll really ever talk to you during their entire college experience 'cause people are glued to their phones. And I don't know if AI has made people more glued to their phones. In fact, I would say AI is probably one of the least contributing factors this. This is really just social media plus COVID. It irreparable damage to society. Many people content and normalize the fact that you're never gonna talk to anyone. You can just spend your entire existence online. And really humans are primal creatures. We're not meant to sit on our phones all day. You're meant to be digging around with your friends. Which is really a large reason why I built a company that I have. A huge primary motivating desire for me to have a company was so that I could spend my days digging around with my closest friends who are in my age group doing things together with them and building things with them rather than working under some fucking 30-year-old Indian manager who I'm never gonna have a single thing in common with. Like the socializing is, I would say the single most core part of human experience and the thing that took it away from us is social media and COVID. I would say AI has, honestly, I would say AI has zero to no factor in contributing to male loneliness. If there is, or just loneliness as a society, I think everything can be traced back to, or at least the 80-20 of all of this can be traced back to COVID and social media. But I do think it's probably, that is probably one of the biggest problems for a generation. - That's an interesting take. I want to ask in the ways that some people claim that AI is leading to loneliness. There are guys right now paying $20 a month for some type of AI girlfriend app, talking to it every day, telling it things that they've never told a real person. Many of these apps print, they make a lot of money, have millions of users, but why do you think men are turning to AI girlfriends in 2026? - I'll say these apps print. One of the biggest ones is character AI, in record time they shatter through $100 million of annual revenue run rate. If you look at the actual, the actual world and $100 million of paid users sounds like a lot of users. If you look at the actual world, Facebook makes $54 billion a year. It's completely like AI girlfriends and AI companions. It might seem like a big thing in the media, but it really is completely dwarfed by the presence of social media. But to answer your actual question, why are men turning to AI girlfriends? I mean, what is it? 50% of men from 18 to 30, haven't had sex in the last year. And how are you supposed to have sex when you are, how are you supposed to talk to a girl when all you know how to do is fucking look down on your phone and not talk to anybody all day? But if you go a modern college campus now looks so different than it did 10 years ago, 10, 20 years ago, you look at videos of colleges in high school from like fucking 19, 19, like the 1900s and like 2000s. People are talking, people are communicating with each other. You go to college right now, you walk around, people are glued to their phones, they're not talking to each other and the rate that they are talking to each other is just infinitely smaller. There's really no way to meet people outside of like dating apps now. I believe not now it's like dating apps are the most common way people meet their partners right now. And you know there's a million problems with dating apps that but the most primary problem is this is not how humans are meant to interact with each other. And what problem were you thinking about? - I mean of course, it's like you know if all you can do is look at a picture of someone, then all you're going to be attracted to is their physical features. And this is why in cells and like looks maxing in the black pill is so huge. It's just like if I'm a girl, but if I was a girl, I would only be swiping on fucking 6, 4, 200 pound fucking quarterbacks 'cause those would be the guys sending me likes. So you know like what is it? 20% of you know like there's some crazy statistics like 10% of guys receive like 90% of the likes or something like the brutal high cut offs. I think dating apps are you know like this is just not how reality was. The reality of the world was that when you were back in the village, you know like and you were some fucking five foot six lumberjack, you know like the prettiest girl in the village would have just like thought you know like fuck it. I like like this guy is better than the other fucking four dopes in my high school class. So I'm gonna get with this guy, you know and there's like a relatively consistent pairwise bonding of mates, you know like a girl and a guy would get together because they're the one of only 10 girls in guys in their village at the time. And now it's just like you know like social media has made, has extremified and exaggerated everything. And now girls are walking around the fucking double f-cups because they think that's what the guys want and guys are walking around you know like spending all their money's on luxury cars and lorps 'cause that's what they think girls want. And you know girls are getting flown up by basketball players. Guys just think every single guy around them is some six for four chat and they're demotivated. They don't want to talk to girls. In almost every single way social media has made it harder and you know like has made people less willing to go out and talk to someone. If I was living in the fucking 1950s and I knew the only people I had to compete with if I wanted the popular girl was the fucking quarterback, then I feel pretty good. If I knew I was competing with goddamn Shaquille O'Neal then you know like maybe they're on the towel, maybe I'd hit up character ad, maybe I'd start up an AI girlfriend too. Do you think an AI girlfriend is better than no girlfriend? That's an interesting question. Honestly, this is probably a very unpopular opinion but I'd say probably yes. Only because I believe that AI is here to stay not going anywhere. And the hope is that you know like like the reality, the present day is bleak. These guys who don't have girlfriends right now, it's not like they're magically gonna watch some fucking motivational speech tomorrow and just go randomly find a fine, find a nice girl and settle down with her. At this point you know like their lives are going one direction and people just don't have this willingness to change that much. So realistically a lot of these people who are virgins and don't have sex right now are just going to continue to be virgins not have sex in the future. And you know like saying ah just don't get the AI girlfriend, just keep approaching what I mean. Like this advice is just not gonna work on them when you've been fucking like trapped in your parents house. You've been in need for the last 10 years. Haven't fucking kissed the girl your entire life. Like you're not gonna listen to that and settle down. You know, oh I guess today's the day I'm gonna go up and talk to a girl. Like that's just not how the world works. And obviously the AI girlfriends of today are bleak but my hope for the future is that you know, one day AI gets good enough that and hopefully it only gets good enough to the point that it can coexist with humans and maybe the AI girlfriend can provide a perfect level of companionship. Maybe all the AI girlfriend does. Maybe a much smarter, better AI girlfriend. My hope is that that AI girlfriend tells the guy, here's people like you that wanna meet you. Like here's an event in the area, you should go meet them and maybe encourage them to socialize or maybe it just replaces the human function of socializing entirely. But in the complete present day, is it better for some guy, some 30 year old who's never held a girl's hand to have an AI girlfriend over a real life physical girlfriend. I would say honestly, even in that case, probably yes, that guy's not gonna get better. And to restrict him of a joy when you know he's not gonna get better, I think that honestly is just more cruel than letting him have the small pleasure that he might derive from the AI girlfriend. - Yeah, that's interesting. It's kinda like, would you rather have someone be in like a relationship with an extremely evil human or like no human at all? It's like there's an argument for isolation being worse than like some level of connection. But I wanted to ask, if you had 24 hours to use an unrestricted version of fable, no safety filters, unlimited credits, what would you do with it? - I'll be completely honest. I think the safety team at Anthropic is doing a good job. I don't really hit the safety limits as often as I hear some people online do in reality like we're not really developing bio tools. I would say try and develop a cure for cancer and I would let it run indefinitely and I would say do not stop until you do and I would see what it comes up with. But in reality, in my day to day, I'm a software founder, I code software, this is kind of what fable is built for and it's not like I'm coding malware. So I really don't run into safety issues like this at all. If I was particularly dangerous individual, then I'm sure I'd have a lot more to say, but you know, I'm not-- - What could you do if you were a dangerous individual? Because the US government banned fable when it initially came out for I think it was two, three weeks and then they re-released it. You talked about bio weapons earlier, like to developing bombs that kind of thing, but what's the difference in this model that makes it dangerous? - I mean, the pure difference is really the only difference is the intelligence, and that sort of is the overwhelming difference between every single model which is more capable than the other. And right now, for some arbitrary reason, I think in my opinion, arbitrary, the US government decided that fable was dangerous enough that if hijacked, you could probably just tell it like slash goal, figure out how I can do the most damage to America, the United States of America, and it would come up with 10 very solid plans to like do nuclear bomb level threats on America. And I have no doubt that fable is capable of doing that without hallucinating because it's just more competent than the models that came before it, but I suspect that if you just had complete safety off and you had a version of, you know, Chatsch PT 5.5, like I want to tell you what the exact cutoff is for a model to be able to do that with, like, and propose solutions with any degree of success, but I mean, fable for sure could do it. For sure, unrestricted fable, slash goal, eliminate the Chinese from the world, like, you know, a giant, giant China. - That's interesting. - Do you think AI companies benefit when their sentiment online saying AI's going to kill us all? For sure, there are AI companies that benefit. Definitely not all of them, but, you know, you have people marching outside, open AI's door, saying, you know, stop AI development right now, this instant, and that's one less engineer that's working on developing the model that's going to kill every other application layer company. So for these application layer companies, like, they love it, you know, they might get a few eggs, they don't have them in public, but, you know, like, the grand scheme who cares, like it's one extra day of revenue of waiting before the model swallow up your product, is like, you know, for a lot of these companies, millions of dollars, so all the more power to them, and I'm sure they love it. I'm sure the Chinese companies building AI tools are having the time of their lives hearing about the protests happening outside the open AI office. Really, the only people that don't stand to benefit from this mass public, this interest in AI, or the people that are hurt by this the most, are just like the leading AI providers. And in particular, I would say, open AI, 'cause that's shadowy T is really the thing that people know. - Do you think they're hurt by it though, or like I would think that there might be an argument for it helping? Like, imagine, for example, you said to me, Jack, clearly he's gonna be the platform that kills the world. It's like that would be the one I plan to invest in, you know what I mean? - Sure, yeah. Have you thought about that argument that maybe that sentiment itself is a sigh-up? - Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of speculation online that maybe Anthropic had planted the whole government banning a fable and, you know, like, just to pump out the valuation, you know? Like, one day I'll be high enough to tell you definitively, or maybe I just won't speak to you at all, but you know, like, maybe one day I'll know, but not honestly, I don't know. And I really think in a lot of this stuff going on is, I think a lot of the obvious stuff is definitely premeditated, but a lot of this stuff, you know, like people just have no control over and people don't really know what's going on. It's just whatever, you know, whatever DGT feels like doing today is the top trending story than using the public sentiment of the day. So. - Well, you've built a $100 million AI company, thought you would add, and on the front lines of ever advancing AI, other founders, CEOs, investors in your space, particularly billionaires, like Zuckerberg, Altman, Teal, are allegedly building bunkers in secret. Why do you think AI billionaires are building bunkers? - I think, you know, this is really like, the most likely Doomsday scenario for AI ending or causing human extinction is that, you know, someone figures out how to develop weapons of mass destruction and that person is not, you know, like a national government who can be trusted with that sort of thing. If there is a national government who can be trusted with that sort of thing, and they're just gonna, you know, like, you're gonna have nukes in the backyard of some fucking Iranian crazy fucking Afghani terrorist, and, you know, it's GG, GG world. So in that case, like, of course, and all that takes is for one persistent motherfucker to jailbreak something like Fable, and have the persistence to actually go out and the resources to develop something like that. And in that case, really, it is GG. - Are you building a bunker? - No, not at the moment. I think, yeah, I was just like, if I got to worry about the fucking zombie apocalypse, when, like, everyone's walking around, like, God, I'm radiation pillowed, like, I'd rather just die, bro. - It's a fair take. You went from being a broken, living in your parents' house, major first dollar last year, and now I've been in rooms with A-16Z partners, LP summits in Vegas, billionaire group chats. Is that right? - Sure. - What's one behavior that every billionaire you've met hasn't common? - I really think a lot of these people, especially nowadays, are much more normal than you would think. And I really think there are so many paths to Rome, in this case, Rome becoming a billionaire, personally, that there just is no playbook for this sort of thing. You could become a billionaire, you know, by, like, starting your own, crypto thing, and crypto, like, probably not actually starting your own cryptocurrency, but you could have had a few lucky wins in the stock market and just been some sort of Warren Buffet-type billionaire. In that case, like, you really wouldn't have needed to do anything. You wouldn't really have even needed to start a company on your own or have learned that particular skill. You could have just been a very smart and intelligent investor. You could be a billionaire by starting an AI research lab of your own, in that case, you would need a completely different set of skills. I mean, of the people that I've met, I'd say most of the billionaires that I've met are on the younger side, and they are, like, almost all AI billionaires, and I would say for all of them, it's shocking how normal they are, and it makes sense, too, because these AI companies, the valuations of these AI companies have skyrocketed, like, we've never, ever seen history, and these billionaires are being minted within, you know, like, years of their company's form, like, within five years of starting their company out of their dorm room, you know, it's like, billionaires are being minted out of thin air, and how to say, "For these people, conversations have had with them." They genuinely just seem like your normal college senior at, you know, like, they're probably a cut of intelligence above them, but, you know, like, they're, they're wearing the same t-shirt, it's not like, some fucking secret $500 note, no brand t-shirt, it's genuinely some unique t-shirt, they're not shaving, they clearly woke up, they got fucking drooling their mouths, they're talking about hose, and, you know, like, it's like, it's just, at the end of the day, some 24-year-old kid. - That's fascinating, and you don't notice, I guess that would be the claim that the one behavior is just actually doing shit. - Yeah, I mean, of course, you don't, you don't get to be a billionaire by sitting on your ass, but I would say there's so much money flowing in this world right now, that if you pick the right space, you're a competent individual, you pick the right field in AI, you pick the right job, you pick the right company to build, you could literally wake up, you know, in three months to a $400 million contract from one of these research labs that just, you know, king makes you, and just, just, just, just billion, billionaire makes you out of nowhere, and really all you did was, you know, be clever about where you shot at, what you did, and it, there's just so much movement of money in the world in AI right now, that all you have to do is get pretty lucky, and perhaps this has been the case since, you know, like for the entirety of the world that all you ever had to do, was just pick the right field and get lucky, but I feel like this is true now more so than ever, and the timelines have been so compressed, just doesn't take seven years of, you know, like growing pain to become a billionaire, you know, like if you're really lucky, it might take fucking eight months. You were talking earlier about this idea that we'd be plugged into a simulation of sorts, or, and a lot of people talk about this, like idea of the matrix and how neural link links with AI, this kind of thing. Do you believe for currently in a simulation, and do you think we'll soon be in one, if we're not already? - This is probably one of those crazy opinions that I have. My current understanding of the world is that, the way that things have gone from me in my life are so strange and so fortunate for me to be in the position that I am, that I probably think I'm in some sort of game, like the game Roy from Rick and Morty, where I actually am the main character of some show that some alien is watching, where he has decided to spawn into my life all these blessings. It's shocking to me, if I step back and think about it, why am I even, how am I possibly in America, when all the odds say I should be some fucking rural farmer in the rice villages of China? How am I possibly, how do I possibly have the intelligence that I have, considering that the regular expectation is that I'm some fucking real farmer in Kansas? How do I possibly have the ability to build companies, and how is it even fucking worth? How is it possible that my competition is this week in the modern era? How is it possible that I'm just able to spawn in all these views on social media? I feel like the way that my events, the events in my life turned out, have just convinced me that I am built for greatness, and I'm not just built for greatness, but I'm built to be the human of all humans. And this definitely sounds like I have a God complex, and I'm admitted, I do. This is an understanding of the world that I've had since I was probably in the third grade, that I probably am the only real existing human, or at the very least, I am the main character of some show that some anime character is watching, some alien is watching, and it is my duty to give them the most entertaining show, and if I were to be a bum, then it would just be, what's the point, this is all just a game anyways? So yeah, I do believe I'm an association. - I wrote this down for you, and I cannot believe I've been asking this question, but it's a fair question. Do you think an AI God would be a good idea? went back in time and chose you to be the person to bring it back into existence? - I don't think that's the case. - You think it's the case for anyone alive today? - If there was an argument to be made for anyone, it'd be the big bro at Elon Musk, but I mean, I don't really think that the simulation that I am in right now was generated by that of some AI God. I just don't view it in that way. I think if you were to view, you know, like the end state of true recursive superintelligence, the most bull case of AI as being a consciousness, like comparable to, you know, like the Christian God, I just don't think anybody would do that. I don't think people consider things like that. And for me, the simulation that I consider myself to be in is created by an entity similar to that of like a religious deity. I feel like this is getting nuanced and just falling into a semantic thing. But I will say no, I don't think the sole purpose of my existence is to further the development of AI. For that reason alone, I'll say no. - Do you think AI is more worshiped now than the Christian God? - Worship. I don't know if people are worshiping AI. I think there's people who, I guess if we define worship as actions oriented around a number of times thought about throughout the day, level of importance associated with it. - Certainly. - In that respect, I would say I worship AI more than any sort of religious deity. I don't believe in any religion at the moment. And the amount of times I think about AI is like, almost every waking hour of my day. Like that's all I do at work is I just sit there and prompt models to code and design for me. So yes, I would say, well, are there more people like me than there are religious devotees? I would say the intensity of AI worshipers by the definition that you've given me is stronger than the intensity of or in the intensity and quantity of the most fanatic religious devotees. I don't think even priests think about God as much as some of these AI people think about AI. And I don't even consider myself like really one of those people like that are hugely engrossed in AI. But I think about this every waking hour of the day. - That's fascinating. I mean, if you consider like the eschatology of all the religions and the number of people trying to bring about those various eschatologies versus the eschatology of AI, which is super intelligence, recursive superintelligence specifically. Like there are, there definitely seems to be more energy going toward that thing than like, I don't know, the full horsemen at the apocalypse in the Bible. - Horse, yeah. - So that's an interesting take. What do you think are the spiritual effects of choosing to be poor? - I think I'm really not the guy to be talking about spiritualism or religion or like the higher order meaning of life. I think for me, I really structure my life around my biological primal desires. And I think this is something that everybody wants to. When you're a kid, the most fun you'll ever have is going outside and playing fucking make believe with your boys and playing in the dirt and socializing. And when you're a teenager, the only thing you'll ever think about is like trying to crack the popular girl in your school. And the most fun you'll ever have is going on two man with your boys and like socializing and looking for sex. And outside of that, maybe it's like some sort of competition with your boys. I've said this in the last podcast and I've said this in every podcast I've ever been on to date. I really think that the core essence of my being and the core meaning behind my existence is really just to do the things that primarily we're designed to do, which is live in these small tight-knit communities, socialize, almost every single hour of your day, work towards competitive goals, like hunting big giant animals with your tribesmen. The equivalent for that for me is working on this difficult company with my closest friends and you know, like having a girlfriend wife or you know, if that falls through, you know, like a million baby mommas. But I really think like I am not someone who was grounded in the pursuit of spiritualism, the pursuit of some religious ideal, some higher ideal, like I respect the people that are. But for me, I think life is very simple. We are biological creatures. We are our entire brain circuits are designed around core biological desires. And I think we should just like the best way to live life, the most fulfilling way to live life is to fulfill those desires. And you know, like as close as a way as possible to that as close as a way that we can in a modern day. In reality, I think the most fulfilling existence for me if I were to say like my spiritual ideal would be to go back in time and fucking 2000 BCE and live in a tribe with my boys in some fucking African village and just dig around and not have ever experienced technology or even fucking fire. I think that is the most fulfilling experience a human can ever live. And I strive to like my version of spiritualism is trying to model my life to as close as that of the fucking caveman who could only fucking blabber and grunt. I think choosing to be poor nowadays and considering my ground framework for, you know, like spiritual, what spiritualism means to me. Choosing to be poor is the equivalent of the caveman choosing not to hunt. And I would say, you know, that is if you're a caveman and you're choosing not to hunt, like what happens is you get presumably you got banished from the fucking tribe and you got left to die. So 'cause you're not doing your core duty. If you're choosing to be poor in the modern day, if you're choosing not to acquire resources for the betterment of your tribe and your close friends and family, then you are like this is one of the most core biological principles of your life. You're failing to do that and I would say, you know, your existence is probably meaningless. Brutal. Did the blueprint for what Clificular did with the black pill and like his whole marketing thing change how you think about marketing startups? I think Clificular was an example of a modern day trend in the attention economy that has gone as far, that goes as far back as like Donald J Trump from 2016. And that is in reality the way the social media algorithms work is that the most controversial content goes to the top. That's just how it is. So when you have Donald J Trump, you know, and people really don't care about the deeper meaning behind things, people really don't care to fact check all of your arguments and see who's the more rational debater. DJT won in 2016 because you know, like he was the more outlandish person. He got on social media and people thought, you know, that gave him the opportunity, the spotlight to show, you know, even like a fraction of his rationality. And modern day people are so fucking murdered and lazy and stupid that they'll never even think to double check any of this to think about who might be the better leader. You know, it's just like, well, I saw this guy and some of what he said resonated with me, so I'm going to vote for him. And the same thing you see exactly the same thing happening with like Nick Fuentes, the reason why his podcast was at one point would have been like the most viewed podcast in the entire world is 'cause he was willing to, you know, like do the things that were controversial enough that put him on the top of the social media algorithms before anybody else. And sure, it might be the case that there is some better thought out right wing philosopher with the exact same ideals but it's more like better spoken, more, has even better ideals, you know, is better thought out. But the reason Nick Fuentes gets the attention that he does is because he's willing to push the blinds that that that rises to the top of the social media algorithm. I think the same is even true of myself. Like I was the only one in probably all of tech at the time who was willing to push the blinds that I was at that that that that that I did. And it generated me the millions of dollars that I'm making right now, like this is something, my whole story, the origin of my entire story is when I publicly use social media to bait Columbia University into kicking me out of the school. And this is something that I probably think has never been done in the history of humanity. This has never been done someone intentionally baits an Ivy League school or any college for that matter to kick them out for the sake of marketing a company at theirs. Like this has just never been done. I was the only one in human history who was willing to push that button and capitalism rewarded me as such. And I think the same is true. Donald J. Trump, Nick Fuentes, Clivicular, Roy, I think these stories are all the same and you take these stories are all the same. The people who are willing to push the blinds to get them to the top of social media algorithm get to bring whatever rewards, you know, like attention gives them. And maybe the end reward is just attention and certainly all of us have to have gotten that in generous doses. I'm going to test this one with you. If it's not good, we'll just, I might skip it. But I have a special segment for you. I'm going to give you a situation that someone is in and I want you to give me a sentence for what each of them should do, okay? To be successful in AI or just the world. To be successful in the world. Okay, buy my own metrics. Yeah, okay. A 45 year old accountant who just got replaced by AI. Who just got replaced by AI, I would say your a simple sentence. Reinvent your life from the ground up by chasing the women that you always wanted to chase and completely do something that upends your life. And when you're in this moment of change of internal transformation, then go look online desperately for ways to make money online with AI, build an AI app that is based around your life experiences that you have and try and market it with organic marketing. That is a lot of stuff. I feel like a sentence is not sufficient for what I would tell this guy in reality. What I would tell this guy is you're in a period of life where your past 23 years of experience has surrounded to literally nothing. And at this point, what you need is you need to instead of being fucking depressed, you need to find a win, you need to find something that makes you happy, something that makes you feel like you've accomplished something. And in reality, if I ask any single 45 year old, I know that the thing that they would say they're guilty pleasure, the thing that they've always wanted to do, but we're not able to do is bang some 18 year olds. So go fuck. and try and do that and once you do that, once you're in that period of change, period of like, you know, like, fuck, I just did something crazy that I've always wanted to do. That will genuinely give you, you know, like the motivation, the drive, the conference, to be like, you know, maybe this new life won't be so bad after all, maybe it was a blessing in disguise that I got to be replaced by AI. And in that state, that's when you will be the most motivated, the most driven, the most focused, and most able to do the best work of your life. So go out there and do the best work of your life. Well, that's AI starting a plumbing construction company. I wouldn't even recommend AI to be the place that anybody goes. I don't know his exact life circumstances. If it turns out that this guy is the fucking goat at plumbing and I was 14 people with broken toilets, go be the fucking best farmer you can be, just instill some change and look for an early win. - I love that. I think we'll just skip the other people. I think that advice applies to all of them. I want to give you the chance to re-friend that idea a little differently. - Sure. - And you might have a different take on this, but what do you think is the harshest truth men learning life way too late? - Life really is that simple. I think people spend all their life chasing games that were designed by other people and bent by other people when in reality all you ever wanted to do in life was exactly what you wanted to do as a kid, which is go outside, play with your friends, and run some two man's with your boys. - Got it. At the end of every podcast, I asked people what the best piece of advice they've ever received was. I'll change it for you a bit. - Roy, how do you get so unbelievably ahead in life that everyone wants to have kids with you? Everyone wants to be you, and your name is the last name uttered in all of human history? - Yeah. I'll tell you how I hope to do this, because I haven't done this yet, but I think you've actually described the life that I hope to achieve. I think in the era that we're in and the society that we're in, it is clear that capital is sort of the equivalent to power, influence, and fame. If you want to achieve anything, you need the most amount of capital. So I will accumulate the most amount of capital that I will accumulate more capital than anybody else. And I will do that by figuring out the skills that I have that are five, six, seven standard deviations above the mean. Right now, I believe that skill is getting attention on social media, and I believe that this is a skill that no other business man and no other founder in the modern era, who is striving to make as much money as I am also has. So I will build businesses revolving around this skill that I am uniquely good at. And I will consistently try to build businesses in the biggest opportunities that I think are possible. I will not settle for a business that will only generate me $10 billion a profit in the year, because I don't think that's enough to be the most capital-accumulated man in the world. And once I've reached a certain terminal velocity of capital, I'm going to then use that capital to pursue not just the biggest markets for my unique superpower, my unique abilities. I want to pursue the biggest markets in the world. Right now, I think anybody can look at the world and realize that the biggest opportunities in AI, but I don't have that terminal velocity of capital yet. So from now on, what I'm going to do, I'm going to build these businesses around the power and abilities that I've developed, these businesses will then generate me enough capital to reach terminal velocity, at which point I will then further use that capital to invest in companies and build companies that are in the biggest markets in the world. Once I've done that and reached the pinpoint of capital, like the world's richest man, the whatever moniker is given for the man was one, the game of society, which is capitalism, then I think I will have done it. And the measures that I have taken to get to the top and the way that I've gone to the top surely will be enough of a story for people to remember me in history. The challenge itself is worthy of a lifetime and will certainly take a lifetime and to get to that pinnacle, I think you will have needed to have lived a life worth everyone talking about. - And if you were speaking to the 80 year old version of yourself, maybe the one that has accomplished all the things that you just described, what do you suspect you would warn you about right now when you're still chasing more? - In my pursuit of truth and life optimization, I've certainly made many mistakes in life. I've probably taken, I've done at this point, three or four surgical cosmetic surgeries to improve the way that I look. I spent tens of thousands of dollars on clothes and I burn almost all the money that I've had on trying to do things that would improve my life. I've taken almost every drug under the sun, maybe not every drug under the sun, but I've taken a significant amount of drugs that I've almost certainly have affected and permanent health damage to me. I've done all this for the sake of improving my life and reaching the top, I am hypercompetitive and I will do what it takes even if it means sacrificing 45 years of my life to do it. I'm completely happy and content to die at 30 years old, knowing that I have done the most that I could have in my life than to die at 80 years old, happy and surrounded by a family and kids. I really think that I will do whatever it takes to win and I think in this journey, if I hit the age of 80, which I don't even know if I will, if I hit that age, almost certainly I will have made a very, very big mistake in this pursuit of asymmetric upside, in this pursuit of things that other people are unwilling to do, risk that I'm uniquely willing to take because I'm just more competitive and want to win with another people. There'll almost be something that I've done that result in permanent damage that I'll just regret more than I will have wanted to win. And I think I really don't know what that is yet, but I'm certain the 80-year-old me would know exactly what it is. And maybe he's sitting there and his kidneys are dying because he took one too many steroids, maybe he's sitting there and his fucking, you know, like maybe Reddit true tide is not all that it's cracked up to be and this guy's fucking sitting there and his pee is green. Whatever it is, I'm sure he'll have something good to say to me and for now, I really don't think though that the warning means much. I am at the most ambitious and most competitive point in my life and I really will do whatever it takes to see the top of whatever ladder I'm climbing right now. - Have you talked much about your steroid usage? - I've talked pretty publicly about, you know, like different drugs that I've taken. - What's the most interesting drug you've taken that you haven't talked about? - The most interesting drug that I've taken. I will say the drug with the most significant effects on me was definitely Reddit true tide. It's a pretty common drug though, but I've experimented with testosterone. I've experimented with Anivar, Winstrowl, Cambodal, Clenbuterol. I've tried all sorts of different things. I've been on completely vegan diets. I've been on carnivore diets. - I've been on Intem. - Intem? No, I haven't. - Or the patch? - I haven't, I haven't. I don't smoke 'cause I think smoking is gay, but outside of that, ultimately smoking does, there's no asymmetric outside to smoking. There's no positive, significantly positive outcome, but significantly positive outcome, one cycle of roids might just be, you fucking have your complete dream physique and the positive health benefits of all the muscle completely outweigh the negative consequence of the steroids and you would never know unless you took it. And it's things like this that I'm just willing to do that other people are not willing to do. When I got my second paycheck, I gave my first paycheck to my mom, but when I got my second paycheck, I spent the entire thing on fake clothes from China. And to this day, I just am very willing to take financial, physical, any sort of risk at all, if it means getting closer to the path to ascension. And even now, I know that there's mistakes that I've made. I've taken risks that just didn't pan out, and I'm certain that by the time I made it, I will have made at least one big risk that will result in something that really, seriously changed the trajectory of my life, even knowing that, knowing that there's, there's that path of constant coin flipping is going to end in some sort of demise. I won't stop because what if it all goes right? - Beautiful. Well, everyone, this has been your guest, Roy Lee. This is the Jack Neal podcast. I appreciate you coming on, where can people find you? - On Instagram or Twitter, both I'm underscore Roy, underscore Lee. - Perfect. - And what's your company website? - Cluelet.com. - Awesome. - See you guys. - Thank you.