AEE 2669: What's the Difference Between Older and Elder in English?

This is an All-Ears English Podcast, episode 2669. What's the difference between older and elder in English? [MUSIC] Welcome to the All-Ears English Podcast, downloaded more than 200 million times. Are you feeling stuck with your English? We'll show you how to become fearless and fluent by focusing on connection, not perfection. With your American host, Michelle Kaplan, the New York Radio Girl, and Aubrey Carter, the Isles Wiz, coming to you from Arizona, and New York City, USA. To get real-time transcripts right on your phone and create your personalised vocabulary list, try the All-Ears English app for iOS and Android. Start your seven-day free trial at allyoursenglish.com/app. [MUSIC] On today's episode, we answer a listener question about the difference between the words older and elder. How do you know the difference and which is more commonly used? Find out today. [MUSIC] Have you ever listened to native speakers and thought, "I understand the words, but I still feel slightly lost?" That's because real-English conversations include more than vocabulary, their speed, their connected speech, their cultural references and casual phrases. Your brain has to process all of this in real time. If conversations sometimes feel overwhelming, it may simply mean you're ready for the next level of training. Find out your exact level with our quick free fluency quiz. Go to allyoursenglish.com/fluencyscore. That's allyoursenglish.com/fluencyscor. [MUSIC] Hello, Michelle. How are you? Hi, Aubrey. I'm doing well. How are you? I have a question for you. How do you feel about getting older? It's an interesting feeling. I mean, I still. It's bittersweet, right? I do feel more confident in myself. I feel like I've had more experiences. I'm stronger. I like that piece of it, but obviously, I don't want to get the sense to be old. No one wants the poor health that sometimes comes with getting older. There are a lot of downsides, but I love that to think about the positives as well. I was just listening to a podcast about Toni Morrison's novels, and they were pointing out that a lot of us read one or two of her novels. Maybe all of them in like college. Before we had a ton of life experience, she was talking about how so much of those novels is so much more meaningful after you have maybe had children or lived some life experience. Maybe you've experienced loss or love, and she was like, go back and read them again. They're going to be so much more meaningful. So now I'm excited. I'm going to go back and read all of the Toni Morrison novels, and I'm excited to experience them again now that I've lived some life. So there's some works to getting older. For sure. So we actually have a question about the word older. And this is from YouTube, Zachary from China. Send this to us. So I'm going to read the question. So here we go. Hello, I'm Zachary from China. Ever since my friend recommended your show to me, I've been checking for updates every morning as soon as I wake up. The content is just so amazing. Oh my gosh, I love that so much. I love the idea of our listeners because I do that with podcasts sometimes. If I know they release a new one on Monday, I like first thing Monday morning, I can't wait to check and listen to the new episode. And I love that. Listeners out there have the same experience for allers English, and our other podcast that is so fun. Thank you for letting us know Zachary. Yes, exactly. Yeah, thank you so much. So now Zachary says, I can't quite tell the difference between older and elder. In my mind, it seems like I can use older to describe anything that's a bit older. And I'm not sure where elders should be used. Would you mind helping to explain this? Okay, yeah, great questions, Zachary. Thank you for listening. And thanks for your questions. This is a good one. So yeah, older and elder sound very similar. And they have some overlapping meaning, but older is used much more often. So today we're going to explain why that is. And we will describe the meaning of each and how to use them naturally. But first, we want to remind you to hit the follow button, right, Aubrey? Yes, exactly wherever you are listening. Hit follow right here on allers English. And we also want to give a quick shout out to some other listeners who left us a review on Spotify. So we're so grateful for Zachary for listening. And for all everyone out there listening, especially if you have ever left a rating or a review, we read them. We really appreciate them. So I'm going to shout out some names here. Saddam mode. Let me flip through here. Some of these, unfortunately, are written in Arabic or Chinese, a language I'm not able to read. So we thank everyone who has left a comment. Some of these names I'm not able to read, but also, Iago Castro, Saddam, Luis Soriano. And then we also have Beto, Yusef, Orin's Row. Thank you all for leaving comments, reviews, and ratings in Spotify. We're so grateful for all of those. And yeah, leave us a rating or review wherever you listen. And we will try to give you a shout out right here on the podcast. Absolutely. Love it. All right. So let's get into this. So older and elder can both be used to describe something or someone that's older, but older is much more flexible. And elder has some more limited uses. Wouldn't you say, Aubrey? Oh, yeah, we would never, I wouldn't call my phone elder, but it is older. It's like an old generation iPhone. The battery doesn't last very long. It doesn't have the very good camera because I'm refusing to upgrade until it actually breaks. So it's an older phone. But I could not call it an elder phone. So this is going to be interesting to dive into when we use them. So first, older, older is an adjective. It can be used to describe people, things, ideas, or time. It's quite flexible, right? I might say my older brother. This is an older house. And it's sort of relative. I'm saying it's maybe older than the other houses on the street. Right. But then with brother, I'm just saying he's older than me. So it's always in relation to something else. Right. Exactly. Exactly. An older way of thinking, older traditions. So let's talk about how we can use it in a sentence. So it can come before a noun. So for example, my older brother is visiting. Or do you have older siblings? And it can also come after a verb. So she looks older. He is older. And what about with then, Aubrey? Yeah. This is really tricky. We do not use it with then, right? So-- Wait, older. Oh, I've jumped down to elder. You tell us, Michelle. OK. OK. OK. So it can be used. This older can be used with then for comparison. So for example, he is older than me. But let's-- I'm glad you cut me off, because that is a really important distinction. Of course that is. Yes. We're comparing two things. My phone is surely older than yours, Michelle. Yes. My TV is older than my friends, right? We're always comparing things when we use the word older. And that is one of the main differences between elder and older here. So let's dive into elder, where I had jumped ahead. So thank you for saving me. You're like, wait, wait, wait. I was like, wait a second. I'm like, correct information here. That's OK. I haven't said that. Elder. Elder is different. It's an adjective, also meaning older. But it's much more rare and much more specific. The context we use it, right? We only use it before and now. So I could say my elder sister-- this is a little less common, but I could say this. My elder sister is so kind. And this just is an adjective, meaning she is older than me. Yeah, exactly. So yeah, you're not going to use this after verbs. And as Aubrey mentioned, you're not going to use this with then. But when can you use elder? Yeah. So we only use it when talking about people. An elder member of the tribe, right? And it's used most commonly with family. My elder sister, his elder son-- this is when it's most common-- it does sound very formal and archaic. Yeah. It's not nearly as commonly used. It's actually often a title for a religious calling, a religious position. In some churches, they'll call someone an elder in their-- priesthood, an elder in some kind of position in the church. So you might hear it that way. Associated with religions as well. Yeah, interesting. Yeah, so it sounds pretty formal or archaic and just not commonly used. So when in doubt, use the word older to describe things that are a bit older. So again, older sister and elder sister, they're correct. But elder sister sounds too formal and just not very natural. So I would stick with older. Yes, I agree. You might hear this in older TV shows, for example. Don't say elder TV shows, only about people. But you might hear someone say-- and then, of course, we have older-- it's really mostly about TV. shows really that you would hear this, but I agree. I wouldn't use it much currently in conversation because it just sounds a bit formal. Yeah, exactly. Many English learners focus on grammar. They want their sentences to be correct, but fluency isn't just about being correct. It's about sounding natural, choosing the right phrase, responding quickly without translating every thought in your head. That's why someone can know a lot of grammar rules and still feel uncomfortable in conversations. Real fluency comes from understanding patterns, tone, and natural expressions. Our free two-minute fluency quiz helps you discover your level and what skills will move you forward. Go to allhearsenglish.com/fluencyscore to take the quiz right now. That's allhearsenglish.com/fluencyscore Okay, but we will see elder and other situations. As an noun, it's an older, respected person with some sort of leadership role in the community. That goes along with what Aubrey said, right? The church elders or tribal elders, village elders, community elders. Using it as a noun, it's not super common, but you might hear about community elders, but only when talking about those specific communities in a formal way or reading older books, maybe watching older shows. It's interesting. It's not always about age, which is strange. For some of those church leaders, sometimes it'll be a young person. They're like, "Oh, my name is Elder Smith." There's nothing. It's like, "But you're not old. That's strange." It's just like a title in something for a religion. Don't let that confuse you. It still does seem old-fashioned. That even is coming from older traditions. This is interesting. One of the ways I use this most commonly is there's old-fashioned phrase. Respect your elders. Listen to your elders. I still will say that sometimes. Maybe a little more teasingly, if my kids are not listening to me and I'm like, "No snacks." They'll talk back to me and respect your elders. Listen to me because I'm mom and I'm older and I'm the person. Definitely respect your elders. You'll hear that one. You also might hear elderly. This is an adjective or a noun. People who are older, like senior citizens. It's more polite and formal than old people and more common than elder. For example, the most common in English, the way we'll hear elder is this elderly as the adjective or a noun. Respect the elderly. It is so much more polite. I feel much more comfortable being like, "Oh, we're going to go visit the elderly at this nursing home instead of the other alternative," which would be like, "We're going to go visit some old people. It sounds so harsh and brusque." We really avoid saying it. For example, he helped the elderly man cross the street with an adjective or the community provides special care for the elderly. That's a noun. Should we do a role play? Yeah, let's do it. You and I are friends here. I just went to visit my grandma. Here we go. How's your grandma doing? She's doing well, but she's definitely getting older. We're starting to think about extra support. That's tough. What are your options? Either she moves in with family or into an assisted living community. I've heard some of those places are actually pretty great. They really take care of the elderly. Yeah, exactly. I want somewhere she can really thrive and feel genuinely respected. Of course. I think older generations aren't respected enough. Some countries really value their elders and see them as a source of wisdom. Exactly. I want to place that really embodies that attitude. Do you know what this reminds you? Michelle, have you seen the movie "Remarkably Bright Creatures?" It's new on Netflix with Sally Field? No, I want to read it. I want to read it for you. Yes, I haven't read the book yet. I need to read it, but I highly recommend it for everyone out there. Maybe read the book first and then watch the film. It's different. It's a very different film. It's right in the beginning. This octopus is narrating, but it's really about these people, a woman who works at the aquarium. And it's a lot about this. She's getting older and she's trying to decide whether to check herself into assisted living. She doesn't have children. It's a lot about, like, do we respect our elders? It's here in the United States, which sometimes does get a bad rap for not respecting others, especially someone who doesn't have grandchildren that love them and are taking care of them. How are they supported by the community? How are they building relationships and friendships? I highly recommend that film if you haven't seen it. Yeah, remarkably bright creatures on Netflix. I want to read it. I want to read it. I want to read it. I will. I will. Let's go through the role play here. Yes. So, hey, let's talk about my grandma. I said she's definitely getting older. And this is interesting because we try to avoid calling someone old and just saying like she's unrolly. We would say she's elderly, but we will say this like she's getting older. She's getting on in years. Like, they're these nice ways. Instead of saying she's getting old. This is more kind. This is more polite to use off these other phases. And then I said they really care of the elderly. I think it's a take care. Take care. Oh my God. Hello. Take take care of the elderly. The elderly as a noun. Exactly. And that, yeah, this is important. If you are looking for an assisted living center, you would like to hope that all of them take care of the elderly, but I know we've seen in films sometimes that that's not the case. So you, of course, we would always want to like look into a place and vet it to make sure. It's tricky. Yeah. And then you said, I think older generations aren't respected enough in our country, right? Some countries really do. I've talked to a lot of our students in open conversation club about this. You know, a lot of them, parents will live with them and be more of a part of their lives. And in the States, that's not quite as common. Yeah. And then you said, some countries, oh, I said, some countries really value their elders and see them as sources of wisdom. They should, right? So much life experience, so much wisdom. I loved chatting with my grandma, Lovah before she passed. She was such a source of wisdom and had so many amazing stories and had lived so much a life. And so I appreciate that when I learn about a culture that does value elders. Yeah. And we should. We definitely should. Absolutely. So guys, if you haven't already, check out episode 2595. Do you find yourself loving English? So listen to that one. And then for takeaway for today, simple, when in doubt, default to older, right? That's going to be more common with more flexibility. But now you have some of those phrases, right? Respect your elders or just to say the elderly or the elderly man, the elderly woman. So we really went through it today. And that was a really great question. Thank you to our listener for that question. And Aubrey, I will see you next time. Yes. Awesome. Thanks guys. See you next time. All right. Bye. Thanks for listening to all ears English. Would you like to know your English level? Take our two minute quiz. Go to all ears English.com/fluencyscore. And if you believe in connection, not perfection, then hit subscribe now to make sure you don't miss anything. See you next time.