A Soft Heart, Hard Boots and Ten Seconds of Courage

Season 2, Episode 20, Carrie Shales with Leanne Bolton, a soft heart, hard boots and ten seconds of courage. When we know who we are, we know who we are and I think it's so important just to know first and foremost that we are children of God, that we are significant, we are secure, that we have been chosen by him. So I think my encouragement is let's just be open to maybe when we sense the spirit is speaking to us. Let's not overthink it, but let's step out because actually when we do step out we have a story. But when we don't step out we have no story. When Peter stepped out on the waves, even though he started sinking, he still had a story to tell his children and grandchildren, but the disciples that stayed in the bow, they didn't have a story. They were to still witness to Peter's story. Well hello and welcome back to Carrie Shales. I'm Catherine Grimes, I'm your host and it is beautiful to have you listening in today and joining me as we explore more inspirational stories of faith. I am really excited today to have in the studio via Zoom a beautiful lady that I was able to meet back in January this year and since then learn more about her amazing life and the way that God has been on the move. So hi Leanne. Hello Catherine. Lovely, lovely to have you Leanne. So Leanne Bolton is lead pastor at Life Community Church in Lemmington Spa. She's been based there for 14 years and she's experienced joys and challenges of repurposing a local church alongside her husband Dave. Leanne is passionate about everyday evangelism, equipping God's people to grow and creating spaces for women to encounter God's presence through silence and retreating. I love that Leanne. She's born English and Italian, born in the Black Country, married today for 22 years and a proud mum to three teenage children. Leanne enjoys Pilates, colorful clothing and drinking coffee. Hello Leanne. Catherine, so good to be here. Thank you so much. It's pleasure and I'm loving your colorful pink earrings today. It's a good choice. Thank you. It's the best colour personally. So with your English and Italian heritage, I mean tell us whereabouts from Italy do you link back to? Yes, so my mum's family there from Fodja, which is in the south of Italy and yeah, mum was born there and then she came over to the UK shortly. After World War II, as a child with her parents settled in the UK but we still have family in Italy, my sister lives out so I'll in fact be going over there in a couple of weeks and just love all things Italian, especially the food. Oh, who could blame you Leanne? Yes, certainly a place to gravitate towards, is not, yes. I love Italy. So Leanne, your bio is very multifaceted and it's clear that you've got many different roles going on. Usually with carry shells, we like to start right at the beginning with your background and your childhood, but today we're going to start from a different place. Today, rather than jumping in to talk about what you do straight away and who you are, I'd love to consider that different question. Can you tell us who you understand yourself to be as a woman and in Christ, the specific sense of the spiritual DNA that God has placed in you? What an amazing question to start off with. I think many of us may have heard that saying, when we know who we are, we know who we are. And I think it's so important just to know first and foremost that we are children of God, that we are significant, we are secure, that we have been chosen by Him. And then when we grow in that identity that I know who's I am, it helps us to know more who we are and what we do and how we serve can really then slow out of that identity that I'm his child, I'm his daughter, I've been called. He has significance for me, I'm secure in him. But Leanne, what about for you personally? You've talked about a general sense of us as women, really embracing our God-given identity, but let's hone in on you, tell us about you. What's God revealed to you? Yeah, just how much he loves me, how much he loves each one of us, that I'm his daughter, that he has the best plans for me. So for example, even when I walk through challenges like all of us do, I will often remind myself that God, you said you have good plans for me, plans to prosper for hope of future, you said you're Emmanuel, you're God with me. So even right now this might be difficult, but I declare that you're with me and just knowing that on the apple of his eye, does that mean I always get it right? Absolutely not. Does that mean at times I still sin and mess up? Absolutely, but just knowing that I'm his child, it just is all wonderful. He's with me now, and ultimately, when I leave this earth, I'm going to be with him forever, that he's preparing that home for me. So that can keep us going on the difficult days, on the darker days, knowing that he's with us. Yes, yes, definitely. And Leanne, then take us back a little bit then, tell us about your own first personal encounter with Jesus. How did you yourself come to know God? So I grew up with mom and dad, mom was a follower of Jesus. Dad wasn't at that point that he never stopped us from going to our local church, etc. And mom would take us each week and read Bible stories at home. And mom just said, you know, Leanne, this is what I believe for ultimately one day, you need to make your own decision. I can't make that for you. And as just a young girl at seven years old, really, I just knew I love Jesus. I want to follow him. Why would I not want to follow him? So in a very simple way, I gave my life to Jesus around about seven. And then it was just a real journey of following Jesus, you know, having to make harder decisions as a teenager, where maybe a lot of my friends were doing life in one way. And I knew I don't think that's the way Jesus wants me to do my life. But through God's grace, I was able to influence my friends and many of them were able to come to church and some gave their life to Christ. And it was just a gentle journey of one step after the end of that following Jesus in a very simple way. And you know, you today, Leanne, are a church leader alongside your husband. So that must have been a journey in itself. But before we unpack that side of things, I'd just love to give the listeners a little bit more insights. So when you and I were discussing things a few weeks ago, before we recorded together, we had a real sense that for you, as your key spiritual DNA that God's entrusted to you, you know, there's three key words, aren't they, here, Leanne? So you're a leader, you're an evangelist, and you're learning to walk in the prophetic. So can we talk about you as a leader? As I've said today, you're a co-church leader with your husband, based in that fantastic community in Lemmington Spa. And the church comes under the assemblies of God bracket. So looking back over your life, can you identify that leadership journey that God has taken you on? Tell us what have been the real standout moments for you? Yeah, it's a great question, Catherine. I think I'd love to encourage a soul that the most important person that we ever get to lead is ourselves. Before we look at leading anybody else, whether that be our family or our church community, or maybe we're in a leadership role in the workplace which is wonderful, leading ourselves is our greatest responsibility. So I'm on a lifelong journey of learning to lead myself. What does that mean? It means constantly keeping myself in check, you know? What's the wise thing to do in this situation, Leanne? What's the person, the person that you want to become? What would they do right now, Leanne, in this situation? How would they lead themselves? So I am constantly examining my own lives just to be the best leader of Leanne that I can be. And then I believe that authentically out of that we can better lead other people around just that way, influencing when we're working hard on, I need to lead myself first. I don't need to do that with the grace of the spirit. Yeah, so I mean obviously very much along side that sense of I need to lead myself, it's in collaboration with the Holy Spirit and an obedience and submission to him. Yeah. So, today then, as a woman in church leadership then, I would imagine it's not always been easy for you that that leadership journey you've learnt to lead yourself and that is an ongoing challenge and privilege. But let's talk about the fact that historically women have not always been given space to thrive in a church context. So for you, now that you are actually in that leadership position, I wonder whether you've encountered some sticky situations. I mean, tell us what spiritual convictions have really anchored you when you've faced a sense of resistance, misunderstanding, miscommunication or perhaps even being underestimated in your role. Tell us about that. Yeah, absolutely. I think it's a great privilege here being a woman in leadership that, absolutely as you said, Catherine, not always easy. There's been many times when myself and my husband have been together in a ministry contact and my husband has been referred to as the pastor, but I'm just his wife. And, you know, at times that can feel a little bit diminishing in terms of my leadership. But God just really helped me to navigate that with grace and at times, you know, I've just laughed it off and thought, you know what, it doesn't actually matter. And I look to encourage every woman in leadership that's listening just to say, you know, God is the one who calls you. And therefore, God is the one that will open doors for you that will give you opportunities. God will make space and God promotes. And so I think as women in leadership at job is to keep a soft heart and it's just to keep following the Lord. I think when we allow a bitterness or any type of grudge to get into aspirin, that can be a foothold then that we don't want the enemy to get in, but just to keep a soft heart and say, God, your promote, your make space, I'm just going to keep following you would be to my greatest encouragement. So you're saying then Leanne that when those moments come where perhaps you are tempted to feel, oh, that was a bit much, how do you respond in that situation? How has God taught you to maintain that soft heart? Yeah, I mean, a one really funny situation, Catherine, it happened just two, three years ago, myself and my husband, we were invited to a cow service and the leader there had asked my husband to speak an evangelistic message and Dave actually suggested, you know, how about EFLEAN? You know, she speaks, you know, she do a great job in that setting. So anyway, we went along and I was excited to be in that context. And I'll never forget the moment when it came in the service for this dear leader to introduce me. You know, he got a pen that you could see who was very nervous and he said, well, everybody, I'm not sure what you're all going to think about this, but we've got Dave and Leanne here and Leanne, she's actually a minister as well and she actually preaches as well. Like I know, I'm not sure what everyone's going to think about that, but you know, so she's going to come and share now, aren't you, Leanne? And sort of there was a tentative applause in the room and I thought, wow, what a way to be introduced to the platform, but anyway, I got up and I delivered with passion, the message I'd prepared. And at the end of it, I sat down and this dear leader came to the stage again and I wanted, I wonder what we're going to hear now and he said, well, everybody, I mean, I can't believe it, but that was great. It wasn't it. And with the maize, I mean, that was really good. And I saw one of the best. And then you look back at me and on the way home, we got in the car, but you know what, we just laughed, we just barely laughed for a long time on the way back saying, wow, I mean, what a story, what a memory. But you know, God gives us the grace and he makes the space and I could have took a grigmy heart from that night. I could have got bitter, but I love that dear leader and I'm blessed him and it's part of our growing, it's part of our journey. Yes, and human so powerful, isn't it? Fantastic tool, we can use to keep that godly perspective. Talking then, I suppose more about, well, let's first of all acknowledge because it's really important that it isn't a sense of the church's patriarchal, you know, it's not that there are men out there who are wanting to belittle women in leadership. Actually, the worldwide church, you know, is on a par with Jesus teaching and Jesus radically changed the status of women. So just tell us a little bit more about what you've learned, Leanne, in your theological training about how Jesus has empowered women to speak as much as men. Yeah, I mean, actually just third-castrian Jesus was incredible because he turned the tables in a culture where women were looked down onto the point where they weren't even considered a witness. Their word wasn't even a witness. Jesus welcomed them, you know, welcomed Mary right to his feet to learn to grow. It says, you know, that the women, many of them supported Jesus in his ministry at the cross, the women they were there and get this. I've been thinking about this Catherine a lot this past Easter, but who were the first people that received the news of the resurrection Jesus? Appeared to the women like that blows away. We're still telling the story of the resurrection and that wonderful appearance came to women. I believe that was intentional. That wasn't coincidence that God in his sovereignty planned that. So we see all through Scripture just the space that God makes for women. And my heart really is just to see women released into their calling and into their ministry, not because they're women, but because of the gift that they carry as women. So you know, I love just seeing gifts in even in embryonic stages. We have fantastic men, women in the life of Alok, which are just seeing their gifts and saying, come on, you can do this. I cannot take a step. Why not try that? Maybe there's a gift, a spiritual gift, just a natural gift in there. And I think when we're doing that, we're really living and leading in the way that Jesus modeled and in the way that Jesus wants to just to release that gift in women. So Leanne, you've obviously got now a weight of experience of what it is like to be a woman in the leadership sphere, in the church specifically. And I imagine that that really brings attention between a sense of being that woman, where gentleness and that soft heart is there, but also at the same time as you say, having authority, having strength. What does that tension look like for you? Yeah. So it's a real balance at times, isn't it, in leadership, I'm sure, for all your listeners that in leadership know that we need backs of empathy to journey, with those that we lead in through the good seasons, the difficult seasons. So we need that empathy, but then at times we just need that strength as well, just sometimes to call things out, sometimes just a bit of pain or a spotlight over maybe things that need to be processed and journeyed more. So it's having the gentleness, but having the strength as well, sometimes to go there. And to lead even in the difficult spots with people, but I think as women we have so much to bring into that arena of leadership as women, many of us are very discerning, when nurturers at heart, good old soul, we want to protect and we can also bring a real strength, you know, one of my favourite leaders in the Bible is Deborah. And we find doing the book as judges, what a woman, you know, she was under a tray and passed all the occurrence with the people as they came and they shared with her, Deborah, this, this, this, what should I do? She was able to give that wisdom, that direction, that empathy, I'm sure, that hook. Yet then we see another side of Deborah where she was courageous, she was not afraid to speak the mind of God to bring that direction. So she's just a great role model, I believe, as women and how she needs grace and gentleness, but also at times that we need to lead with real courage, with real intentionality, not to be scared to go even to difficult places because ultimately God's going to tell us and those of leading to where he wants us to go through the way that we lead of this. So if you're a woman in leadership, keep going for it, keep going for it, I encourage you to the journal, I often journal even lessons of leadership so then I can look back and I can learn God, how do I need to grow? What do I need to start doing? What do I need to stop doing? What do I need to tweak slightly in my leadership so it's better? I'm just encourage every woman in leadership, just keep learning, keep growing because we need you, we need you in every sphere you're leading in. That's beautiful, thank you for those insights. It just reminded me as you said that Leanne, that one aspect of what you do and we talked about that briefly in your bio is that you create spaces for women to encounter God's presence specifically through silence and a rhythm of retreating. Can you tell us just a bit more about that because we live in such a frenetic world, it's constantly about harrying and running and rushing and getting that to do list done, isn't it? But the joy of stepping away from that rat race as we tasted a little bit in COVID some years back, the joy of doing that and actually intentionally retreating, how do you see that practically outworked then in your church community? Yeah, I'm so excited about this right now, Catherine. So men and women, but women particularly, you know, carry so much, we are multi-taskers, we are often always on the go, our heads are full of so many things. And just a couple of years ago, we were privileged to have Spatical during that. I did a retreat all by myself, I went to wait for four days, absolutely loved it. And just thought out of that, I had a real desire, Lord, I'd love to create spaces for women to come away and to withdraw even for a short period of time. And just to be with you and just to hear your voice and just to cut off from the normal rhythm and business of the world. So out of that real desire, we did a ladies at day retreat where we went to a beautiful place in the consorts. And we just did one day, so we kept it very simple, just from Tantil, six, we'd have some time together in worship and fellowship and eaten. And then we'd have periods of time where I encourage the women to go find a piece of grass, find a bench with your Bible, with your notebook and just sit with the father, sit with the son, sit with the spirit, enjoy fellowship in with the Trinity and just see what he wants to reveal. And that first time was phenomenal. Every lady just heard God's voice, there was a wrestle for many of us and just start off with because I encourage just put our phones away, we're going to sit, you know, that's difficult and we're not used to that. But when many of us came through the wrestle initially, just the reward and what we received from the father was incredible. And we're just really seeing God minister to us in that place of just, we're drawing of that little bit of solitude, that silence. And God is filling us and not often saying, you know, we can't pull out of an empty cup. We can't keep giving if we're dry on the inside. And so those times when we just intentionally come away, sit with the father, he fills our cup. So then when we go back into the busyness and the pace, which that's the reality we can't win away from there. And we thank God for that. We have our cup has been refilled. So we can pull out of that. And again, I guess it comes back to that identity. Yes. That when we know who's we are and we're listening to the voice of the one that loves us the most and has called us. Then whatever we do out of that encounter is going to be so much better, so much easier, so much more joyful. And that's what we all want, isn't it? Because I do believe aspirates a yearning for that time to withdraw and be with the one who loves us the most. Yes. Yes. I wholeheartedly agree. And I have to say Leanne just literally in recent months, I really feel God's been speaking to me about that regular rhythm of retreat even once a month. If I can do it once a month between a school run, whatever it is, take a day off work, whatever it is, just actually that pays such dividends in, as you say, the freedom, the peace, the rest that is just needed to lift up our souls again with all that busyness that we're holding. And you mentioned it as well there, that sense of we often are multitasking. We as women carry so many different roles in our lives. Maybe we're a wife, maybe we're mum, maybe we're daughter, maybe we're care, or maybe whatever it is, maybe we're worker, there's so many roles, but actually our key role above all of them is to be God's daughter. And you know, that's what's so precious, isn't it? Hi everyone. Did you know that we're now a charity called Carry Shells Media and we're excited to launch our brand new website, log on to Carry ShellsMedia.com and you will find all our podcast episodes as well as an introduction to our fabulous team. Want to share your own stories of faith on a Carry Shells episode? Well get in touch via our website. There's even the chance to become a Carry Shells supporter and find out more about upcoming events. You see everything we do at Carry Shells Media is you funded and we can't thank you enough for your incredible support. Every gift matters and you make Carry Shells happen. And now let's get back to the episode. So going back then to your own sense of daughterhood in God. Leanne you talked about being a leader, being an evangelist and walking in the prophetic. So let's skip now to that next section talking about what is it like for you being an evangelist? This is something that doesn't derive necessarily from your role as church leader. This is simply who you are and what gets you really fired up inside. So give us a glimpse at your heart, Leanne. Why do you get so excited about what you see as evangelism and how does this get out worked practically for you in everyday life as Leanne? Not just pasta, Leanne. Yes so I think Catholic really comes out of just a real authentic desire. I love telling people about Jesus because it's a little bit like this. If I didn't know Jesus I would really want someone to come and tell me about him so that I could start to experience the life that you and me and many of our listeners are experiencing. So I feel like it's just a real responsibility that hey someone once told me I need to pass the baton on. I need to go and tell someone else so they too can get to be a part of this incredible good news. I think when I live in, we're living at a cultural moment where people are yearning, they're yearning for that hope that we only know that Jesus can bring but they may not know that Jesus is the answer but they've got a lot of questions and every month there's a church community we go to our local park with just a very simple questioner and sweets and lollies and we seek to have conversations and I think Jesus is all about having conversations with people and so we just go out and we're just interacting with people and it's just a are you spiritually curious survey questions so we're getting them to feedback and every time every time we go out just the people were meeting and the conversations were having and they are thanking us at the end of those moments thank you for coming out here thank you for telling me about this and particularly with the young people that were being with they've not heard the good news they've not heard that Jesus loves and that he dies for them these rows again and at the end of it they are thankiness they are saying we've not heard this before they are very open and I just want to encourage all of us every single is know that God is on the move. Tell us Leanne about a specific story because when I spoke to you a few weeks ago remember you telling me about an encounter you had led by the Holy Spirit stepping out in faith talking to a stranger who you met in the supermarket tell us about that. Yeah little while ago I was in my favourite supermarket so I was in there and I go out of my way and we can all do this so easily just to always say hello to all of the staff there you know they worked so hard for us and just always you know thank you appreciate you and just over the months because I shop at the same store like many of us maybe and I have really got to know many of them and this one particular day there was one of the staff that I often just say quick hello to and I felt the Holy Spirit say go and tell him that his mom is going to be okay And that's all I had, just a flash of revelation, often that's how the Holy Spirit speaks to me. He doesn't give me merch, he just gives me a tiny bit. And then he says, "Are you going to do something with the tiny bit Leon?" So I had a little bit of a wrestle as I was in the Chris File. Yeah, but I was rather fast-wired. It's not even about him, it's about his mum. And I just felt the spirit say, "Are you going to do it or not?" And I've just come now to a season, Cassie, and where I'm like, "Let's just do it, because let's not overthink this." Okay, there's a great book called "The Ten Second Rule", I can recommend it. And it's literally about to step out in ten seconds, because we can overthink ourselves out of so much of the spirit. So I went over and said, "Hey, good to see you. Thanks again, just serving me." And then I just said, "Look, I don't know whether this just sounds a bit out there, but you know that I follow Jesus." And I feel he's put this thought in my head to tell you that your mum's going to be okay. And then I just paused. And he looked at me, and I could see him really processing it, and he said, "Well, it's really funny you should say that." He said, "Because last night, me and my mum were having dinner, and she's not doing good. She's really struggling in her work. She's actually just facing some billion, and just, it's not good. She wants to leave. She doesn't know what to do." It's actually really funny, you should say, that he said, "But I'm going to go home, and I'm going to tell my mum that." And I was able to find out his mum's name and said, "That's, you know, I'll be praying for your mum." Anyway, I didn't see him for probably about another three or four weeks. And the next time I saw him, I just said, "Hey, how are you doing?" And he said, "I'm so glad I've seen you." He said, "You know, I told my mum that." And from there on, things really started to change. Things started getting better in the workplace, and there were other fresh opportunities for his mum to start looking at. And my mum just wanted to say, like, a massive thank you, that you gave her that message from God. And I was like, "Yeah, that's great. I'm so pleased. I'll keep it in my prayers." So, a tiny, just a small seed, a small conversation, but who knows now where that is going to go on? Or this young man and before his mum. So I think my encouragement is, let's just be open to maybe when we sense the spirit is speaking to us. Let's not overthink it, but let's step out because actually when we do step out, we have a story. But when we don't step out, we have no story. When Peter stepped out on the ways, even though he started thinking, he still had a story to tell his children and grandchildren. But the disciples that stayed in the bow, they didn't have a story. They were just still witness to Peter's story. So let's step out and have those stories that are just going to encourage and impact lives for Jesus. I love that. More than witnesses, participators. Yes. That is powerful, Leanne. That is powerful. But there may be some women listening who go, "Well, do you know what? That's okay for you, Leanne. If that's what makes you tick, brilliant. But I'm just not like that. So it may be that I need ten seconds of courage, but actually no, that's just not my thing. I'm just not like that." So how would you encourage Leanne, each of us, no matter where we're at in personality, maybe introverted, maybe extroverted, maybe somewhere on that scale? What would you say to really enable us and help us to exercise that muscle of what is effectively the prophetic, isn't it? That you're talking about hearing the voice of God and then acting in obedience to what he said to you. So how would you empower us? We're here, Christ and Catherine. So I would just say, just start small. So we can all do something. We can all start small. So ultimately, if we strip down the prophetic gift, what is it to prophesy? It really is to encourage. It's to build someone or identify. So what we say to those in our local church is, "Basic, we can all encourage. We can all do that." So your starting point may be that you just look for opportunities to encourage people. It may be those that you work with, those in your family, those in your faith community. How can you do that? Well, you can actually put a spotlight as it were on something that you see them doing, which is so good. Maybe you have a friend and she's just so good at baking cakes or so good at writing or so good at helping people budget. So you can just speak that over her and say, "Hey, I've noticed that when you bake cakes and you bring them along to your office or to church community, you bring so much joy to so many people." So I want to say, "Well done. Thank you. Please carry on baking this cake." So what you have done there is you have prophesied over your friend in a really simple way. You've not used any weird words. You've not gone strange in any dimension, but you are starting to prophesy by encouraging. And then it's a little bit like if we go, "I don't know if any of your listeners lift weights. Apparently over 40 ladies, this is something we should do." Oh, do. Hold on. I've got my child. I'm nodding, Catherine. So I brought myself a set of rates, but I didn't start with the 5 kg because this is a whole new well forming. I brought myself a 1, a 2.5, a 3, a 4, a 5. And I started just with some simple 1 kg exercise and then you know how it is. You get a bit strong on your lap. Okay, maybe next vehicle, do the 2.5 and then you just build up and it's a little bit like that with the prophetic. In fact, I think it's a little bit like that with any spiritual gift that we start small. We don't go in and try and pick up a big 5 or 10 kg because we're going to do damage to ourselves. And it's about learning the technique and there's techniques in the spirit of how to use and operate these gifts. I've start with the 1 kg. Just go and encourage somebody and then maybe your next step can be going encourage someone that you may find out a little bit harder to talk to. Maybe it may be that colleague that you sort of try and avoid at the water machine because they're just a bit prickly. Or you're just not quite sure how to start a conversation. Maybe your next step is push yourself. Maybe go and encourage that person. I really appreciate it when you help me be that part of the project. I think you're so good at that. And what happens then is I found Catherine for all of us. The Holy Spirit starts to loosen atong because often we're just a bit muted. So I find that when we encourage it's an easy thing to do but our tongue starts getting loose. And then as our tongue starts getting loose one day, you may be encouraging and sitting. You could give you a bit more and you say a bit more to that person and they're like, wow, that's so good. I really needed to hear that today. And then our tongue starts loosening so then you're going up from the one to the two to the three cages in the spirit and you're just progressive on a journey. No one wakes up as a prophet. For example, we're talking about the pathetic village just a journey over many years of walking with the spirit. Taking the small steps, I love what Martin Luther King said, you don't have to see the whole staircase just to take the first step. Take the first step, take the next little step and I promise you a year down the line, two years down the line, you'll look back and you'll say, I'm growing a higher up staircase. My guests have been used more, my confidence is growing a little bit more and you will have a wonderful journey that you start to embark on. That's beautiful. So I mean, would you say then, Leanne, I suppose in correlation with that obedience choosing to take that step that actually then that heightens our ability to hear God more clearly as well. Have you found that in your experience listening to God's voice, what does it sound like for you? 100% Catherine, you are completely on the nail. It's a journey of just learning to tune ourselves and more to God's voice. Again, I think to circle in back to our times when we're retreating and we're with God. We're just wanting to intentionally learn to tune in because as we've said life is so frantic and then. so many freezes that are just prevalent in our world, but it's that art, it's that intentionality of tuning in. So for me, how I hear God's voice is nothing flashy, under-think-lambarance. Sometimes I just get an impression, for example, I'll look at someone and I'll get an impression. Something's off, something's not right, but I don't know what it is. So in that case, I'll just go over and even sometimes people I don't know, I see them. And for example, again, in a shop or might just say, how you're doing this product's quite good, isn't it? And then you just store somebody in our church be how you do in HSI Weekend. And then as you start a conversation, the Holy Spirit can start to just drop more revelation. They may say something, actually, my back is really, really bad this week. And then it may be, ah, maybe that's why God wants me to encourage them to pray with them. So follow impressions. And then sometimes it may just be reoccurring thoughts. So patterns are very important, just a track, and to see is there a pattern? It may be a reoccurring thought that can't leave you, that won't leave you, that, okay, God, do you need me to do something about a you're asking me to launch this business or to go and see this person down the road that I keep thinking about. And obviously, his word, his scripture, will speak to us. And again, that's why it's so important to regularly be in his word and reading, because that will speak to us. I've never really heard God's audible voice, occasionally I've had some dreams, but that is more rare than regular, or they're on asking God for more dreams, but just following those niches, following those impressions, and then God just, I have found personally, just opens the doors and starts moving from there. - Yes, yes, definitely. And as you say, it just comes back, doesn't it, too? Really learning to tune in to the sound of his voice, as you say, just tuning out of all that other noise around us, literal and mental, and listening, really listening. So Leanne, it's been really exciting to hear the passions that God has put on your heart there. And I know that in addition to that, you do have other roles as well. You do actually have the role of being a wonderful mum and a wonderful wife, and you love that. So looking back, Leanne, at the years you raised your kids, let's talk a bit more about parenting alongside faith and pursuing Jesus. You know, it can't be denied that it was hugely challenging doing that alongside your work as a church leader. So tell us about the earliest years of your children being part of the picture, and what sustained your faith when demands probably fell overwhelming. I'm sure at times it felt like the balance was not there. Yeah, brilliant Catherine. So just a little bit of context. And so myself and my husband, we were an asked to come in, take the reins of our church when our children were five, three, and I was seven months pregnant with a third. So on paper, I was like, God, we are not a good choice. This is crazy. And you know, we really trusted our leader who had invited us to step into this small, you know, but I said, like, are you sure? Like, is there sort of, there's better people than earth like this, but he was like, no, no, I want you, I want both of you, Deleana, I want you to try this. So we trusted him again, I think just submit it into a good leadership. It is so important, isn't it? So with his cover in, we stepped out. And I just knew I said to God, okay, God, if this is going to work like our kids, they've got to be like the centre of this journey with us because this isn't about Dave and Liam being called to lead and redirect to local church. This is about our family. This is about the Bolton, the five of us being called. So that was always our heart, that it wasn't just about mom and dad being called, it was about the whole family. And God was so, so good because I was anxious, you know, how our children are going to be. We were going into a context where there were only two of the children where they're going to have friends, how is it going to be? So I kept throwing it back to God. And I think particularly as mom, so we just have to keep throwing things back to the father don't we say, okay, you're going to have to help me, you're going to have to give me a grace in the wisdom. God was so good, so good. So I, you know, we really created an environment for our children to start serving, and not just our children, but all the children in the life of the church. Now many of them are now teenagers. And we obviously have a new wave of children. So as a result, I've just wanted to create that atmosphere, you know, our eldest plays three instruments, our middle child works in the children's ministry, and our youngest leads worship. - Wow, Leanne, what have you done to these kids? (laughing) - So we don't pay them each weekend to do that. No, it's just, it's just they have discovered their gifts, and then all of our, many of our children and young people in our church, they're some of our best media operators. - Yes. - Because, you know, we know our kids are switched on. They are so clever and that this generation has so much to bring. So we really did see it to get them involved. And then I guess it's just asking God for that grace, you know? God gives you grace for your space. If God is calling you to every listener that's listening today, if God is calling you into a certain arena, he will give you grace for it. He won't send you, and they're not equipped here, but he will send you, he will equip you with his grace. That grace may look different in different seasons, which it has for me, but he will definitely equip you. And I read this the other day, which I love Katherine. It says this, "If God sends us on stony paths, he provides us with strong boots." - Oh, no. - And I just love that because there's women, there's many stony paths that we find ourselves on, but the encouragement is he's gonna give you the strong boots. To walk that path, to walk it well, and just to see his hand upon your life. And finally, I just say, sometimes you've just got to give it a go. So, Mima has been used to say right at the beginning, what's the worst thing that can happen? The worst thing that can happen is we give this a year, and we're like, this is not working. And we go back to our sending church, someone else picks up the pattern. That's the worst that can happen, but the best that can happen is that by God's grace, we're able to put the church on a great pathway and see God's kingdom come and thank God, we've seen the latter because of his grace. - Yes. And as you say, you've really seen the community grow, the church family grow, you've got more children now as a whole. That's very exciting to see his faithfulness in response to you stepping out. So, let's take it just one step further than no analogy, no pun intended there. Sometimes the world really can underestimate the roles that mums play specifically Leanne. And I know that you are especially passionate about really getting mums to understand their value to know how they are cherished and know, how God has appointed them to that role, and that it's precious, that it's weighty, that they are impacting the future generations. So, would you agree, first of all, that the world underestimates that? And in your experience, can the tensions of family life actually diminish a woman's self worth? For you, looking back, where there's seasons where, you know, you were stepping out in leadership, you were caring for your children, where there's seasons where you did feel, God, I just can't do this. - So, first of all, I just want to say to every mom, especially that's listening of maybe under 18, it's like, you are phenomenal. You are doing an incredible job. And being a mom is just an awesome responsibility. Maybe at times, maybe at society, can paint the picture that maybe just be the mom, is that good enough? Question mark, do you also need to be doing X, Y, Z to feel like you are enough? Maybe that can be a question that some of us wrestle with, but I just want to encourage that being a mother is such a valuable role. In fact, we all know that. children grow so quickly that we only have them for this short little window of time and what we invest in them, it will remain with them for the whole of their lives. What does the Bible say? It says train a child in the way it should go and when it is older it will not return from it. So that period of training, of investing in to our children is so good. So moms, you're incredibly incredible, keep going. I'm passionate about being a mom and it's such a valuable season. So one of the things that I found out particularly when my children were in prime school is it's such a unique season. Like the people that you meet in that season, the moms, the dads, the carers on the school room, the different social things that you find yourself in birthday parties, the sports days, all of those things. This is such a unique season and I want to encourage every mom, even every dad that might be listening just to actually view this season as a ministry. View this season as a ministry that does have an expired day that always comes a lot sooner than what you anticipate. Because the relationships and the opportunities that God gives you in that season, particularly when I'm a children younger, is phenomenal. So for me on the school run, I saw that as valuable as what I was doing in terms of leading my church because of the influence that God has given me in that season of my life. So maybe sometimes we need to view it with a different lens rather than God get me through it. It's like God let me just make the most of it. Let me make the most of these years of these seasons because it is absolutely wonderful. And so yeah, my encouragement is just just make the most of it because it does go so quickly. Yes, it really does. It really does. And it's precious, isn't it? Yes. So you've talked a lot today, Leanne, about that sense of spaces in our lives, those spaces for God's grace to come in and to change us and teach us and transform us. Looking back at your own adventure with God, with faith, what for you have been the most difficult points? What have been your real sense of God? This feels like a black hole. Like a South Catherine, just a few years ago, I also lost my father. He had cancer. And although he received treatment, it was quite a short battle then until he went to be with Jesus. He gave his life to Jesus much later on. But we thank God for that. And it changes dynamics, doesn't it? Of so much when you lose a parent. And I think then it's just that challenge of really just, so I'll click a God, what does, what does this season now look like? You know, I haven't got a father. I've seen my mom, he's now with her. That brings the whole set of different challenges. And I think it's an ongoing challenge, isn't it? To Lord, just give us the wisdom again. Give us that grace. Give us that strength in that. So that's been particularly one challenging situation, but I'm sure you can testify to you casting a many of our listeners that have lost loved ones that we, we see a side of the Trinity of the father, the son of the spirit in our pain that we do not experience when life is great. Yes. And we have all the yeses and we have a sunny day and what on the mountain top? We see a new side of the Trinity. And I think in some of my most challenging moments, knowing my father was going to go and then the other side of that, the loss is I would often say to God, don't, don't waste the pain. God, I don't want to waste the pain. Like what you're showing me now. I want to be able to have others in the future. Like I want to have a deeper sense of empathy. I want to know the Trinity more through this. Don't waste the pain. So I'm sure, you know, all of us who are listening have got challenges of different dimensions. But in it all, I want to encourage us that God is, he's still working and he's still got the best for you. And he doesn't want that pain to be wasted as it were. He's going to bring something really good and something really beautiful on the other side of the pain. Yes. And I think as you say, this brings us full circle really. But going back to your heart as a woman who wants to share Jesus with others, you know, whatever circumstance we go through in our lives, it gives us empathy. You know, it gives us the opportunity to reach out to others who might be suffering in similar circumstances. And it just deepens our heart, doesn't it? It gives us a greater sense of what is God's heart for this world. With the brokenness around us, we can be people of hope. Just thinking back to our conversation then, I'm thinking so, you're encouraging us ultimately to have that soft heart, those hard boots and a good dollop of courage. Yes. I love that. Yes. I believe it was Jackie Polynjah that said that we are to have a soft heart and hard feet and a soft heart to his spirit, to the things that he is speaking to us about and hard feet because life can be difficult. Things aren't always easy, but those are hard feet. And remembering that any stony past is sending us out, he'll give us a strong boots. Yes, those strong boots. Yes, but thinking brilliant. Well, Leanne, it's been amazing to listen to you, to hear your wisdom, to hear your words. You know, it's clear that Jesus is utterly the centre of life for you, but he's given you such a lens of wisdom. You've shared so many gems with us today, and my prayer is that all of us will be empowered, equipped, encouraged, inspired and challenged, actually, to recognise what God has put in us as individuals, but also to embrace those opportunities around us to reach out and say, "Here's Jesus. Do you want him?" So, Leanne, would you close in prayer for us today? Would you wrap up this conversation in prayer for us? Absolutely. Thank you, Catherine. Yes. Yeah, Father God, we thank you that you are here with us, that you have been listening to this podcast with us. Father, firstly, I thank you for every month that's listening, and I ask that you would continue just to pour your strength and your wisdom into every month that she would see her life in this season as you see it, and she would become the woman that you are shaping her to be in this season, and that Father that we read together be raising this next generation of boys and girls. That know you, and that do great things for you. I pray for any mom that is lonely, that she would find new friends, for any mom that is sad, that there would be avenues of joy to pour into her life. And Father, thank you for every woman that you have put in that sphere of leadership of influence, would you bless them, would you give them strategy and wisdom, and favour with they continue to grow with their daily rituals, bring life into their life and through their leadership. And for those of us that just want to do more, but we don't know where to start, reach your help, that's, reach your show each of us that next step, that one small thing that we can next do to serve you, to serve our community, to serve those that you love, that there will be stories in the months and years to come from every listener of what you are doing in them and through them for your glory in Jesus name. Amen. Amen. Thank you so much for listening in to Carri Shales today with me, your host, Catherine Grimes, and our beautiful guest. And a big thank you to all the women who make Carri Shales podcast possible for your generous support, you know who you are, and we are eternally grateful. A big thank you goes out to David Campion of Open Sky Media for editing and producing this episode. And this is where you come in. If you have enjoyed listening to this episode, please help us by growing the Carri Shales community of women of faith. You can leave a review or a rating, pass the stories on and look for the stories in your own life as well. Thank you and look forward to talking with you next time. [BLANK_AUDIO]