313. A Crime in the Digital Age - The Murder of Bianca Devins

- You're listening to an ONO media podcast. Hey everyone, welcome back to the podcast. This is Murder With My Husband. And I'm Peyton Morelin. - And I'm Garrett Morelin. - And he's the husband. - And I'm the husband. - Well, well, well. New merch. We got new merch. Got new merch. It's live. Yeah. - We did take pictures in the merch. - We took pictures. We like, we like every drop, but we took pictures. We're trying to be better at content when it comes to that. So we took pictures. So if you want to see what you would look like before you buy it, you can see what we look like with it on. - Here's the issue. Our merch has become so redundant because it's all good. So it's like every single drop. I feel like I'm like, no, this is like a really good drop. Like it's really cute. It's really trendy. It's good fits. We've made sure they're good quality. How many times can I say over and over again? You know what I mean? - Yeah, we're, and we're trying to get better at content. Let's be honest. - Yeah. - The goal for us. I'm also having a horrible day, having a horrible day. So if you want to go buy merch, you can go buy merch. I don't know. I could, I'm sorry. It's fine, I'll be okay. That's my 10 seconds. Thank you for listening. Thank you for being here. Truly, we love you guys and we appreciate the support, whether you're listening on audio, or whatever platform you're listening on, or whether you're watching on Netflix. We love the support. We appreciate it. Thank you for allowing us to do this. We're glad that it's entertaining for you guys. And let's get right into this week's case. - Our sources for this episode are bbc.com, USAToday.com, ziracuse.com, lawncrime.com, courtlistener.com, wktv.com, CNN, The Guardian, Washington Post, Rollingstone.com, and CBS News.com. Just a warning, this episode contains discussions of suicide, suicidal ideation, and the sexual assault and murder of a minor, so please listen with care. Nowadays, many of us share our entire lives with the internet. We celebrate our little wins, our adorable families, our happy vacations, but some people share their losses too, whether that's a post dedicated to a lost pet, a tough time we're going through emotionally, you're even more struggling to just make ends meet. We turn to the internet for support and for understanding, but what we don't ever expect is for our own deaths to be shared on social media too. And I'm not talking about an obituary or an old photo or even a true crime podcast. I'm talking about your very last breath, the exact moment when life comes to an end. It's not something anyone should have to see or experience, not the victim, the family, the friends, but in today's case, one young woman's life wasn't just taken from her. It was broadcast on the internet for everyone to see. And the battle that was fought after was something that feels so dystopian. It makes you wonder what the world is coming to. Because when death can just be exploited on the internet, it raises the question, is anything in this world truly off limits? So today I want to take you to Upstate New York to a town called Utica. This is about an hour east of Syracuse where in 2019, we get to meet 17-year-old Bianca Michelle Devins. Now Bianca spent her entire life in the Utica area, but unlike most teenagers, she actually isn't that eager to get out of Dodge. She's super close with her 15-year-old sister, Olivia, and her mom, 35-year-old Kim. Now Kim got pregnant with Bianca when she was Bianca's age, a 17-year-old high school student. It happened just a few months after she had met Bianca's dad, Mike. But for Kim, there was no question whether or not she wanted to raise this baby. She always knew that she wanted to be a mom. She figured, OK, even though I'm 17, now is my chance. So Bianca was born on October 2nd, 2001, and her sister, Olivia, came just two years after that. And meanwhile, Kim and Mike actually tried to make it work until 2010. All of this wasn't easy for Bianca's mom, Kim, though. She filed several domestic incident complaints over the years. And when Mike started to take his aggression out on their daughters, Kim finally drew the line, and she let him go for good in 2015. Now, it definitely opened a wound for Bianca as she came into her teenage years. She felt abandoned by her father, but it also made her closer with her sister and her mother. At the same time, though, Bianca found plenty of distracting hobbies that helped her grow into her own as her home life was kind of going through this. She loved the band Nirvana, manga, and anime, and making art. The kids in her school said she was a shining light. One kid who was always bullied in her Earth science class said Bianca was the only student who was actually nice to him and spent time getting to know him. She dedicated her free time to helping counsel other students who were overcoming mental health issues. And through that, she realized that she actually eventually wanted to get into psychology, mainly because Bianca had struggled herself with mental health issues in the past. Horting her mom, Kim, Bianca first showed signs of mental health issues back in middle school. Kim said it was during that time that Bianca began losing interest in all activities and was no longer the extroverted kid she used to be. Suddenly, Bianca had social anxiety became more of a loaner at school. That was when she could be convinced to go. Her mother said she'd developed some separation anxiety, which then around the age of 13 turned into depression. And by that point, Bianca had been seeing a therapist for some time, but things get more complicated when she switched from private to public school in ninth grade. That was when Bianca's behavior became more erratic. She would come up with stories about her ethnicity and background that weren't necessarily true. She would talk about being on the autism spectrum though she had never been diagnosed. She became extremely triggered by loud noises and shouting. She would sometimes just not respond to friends for weeks at a time. And eventually, Bianca was finally diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder and then borderline personality disorder in 2018. She got this after her anxiety got so bad that she was refusing to leave the house. But as a result of that isolation, Bianca had found communities in other ways. Primarily through means that didn't require her to leave her home, meaning she had turned to the internet for social connection. And it was there that shy sweet Bianca started to play with her identity. She created profiles on Discord, 4chan, Reddit, Tumblr, and Instagram where she grew modest but not unimpressive amount of a few thousand followers. And eventually, she found her aesthetic and cosplayed online with colorful makeup, brightly colored hair in this combo of emo anime goth style. The term used to describe her in a lot of the sources was an e-girl, which can have a derogatory or sexualized context. But for Bianca, I think it was just a form of expressionism, a way to bring her art into her style. And through this, Bianca actually amassed a larger following on 4chan. This is what's known as a more male centered site that can attract what people online call orbiters. And these are users who have a somewhat parasocial relationship with girls like Bianca. Does 4chan still use, do you know? - I'm sure. - I don't, I don't. - I mean, I never used it. - Like, Reddit's already 19. - Reddit's already crazy enough. Can't imagine what 4chan looks like. - Well, you have these orbiters, orbiters, who have this parasocial relationship. These orbiters are also known to be obsessive and they sometimes have a history of threatening the young women on these sites with violence, stalking, or other threats, which was how Bianca came to have a love hate relationship with this community. In a way, she had found some acceptance and in other ways, she found real life danger. For example, when Bianca was just about 15 years old, she met an 18 year old on 4chan and the two eventually started dating. But there was at least one incident where he sexually assaulted and drugged Bianca and then actually published a video of the assault on Discord. Now, if you were listening to this and you were like, this is insane. This is dark parts of the internet that like fully exist. Like. - Oh, it happens all the time. - Holy exist, there are full pages of guys who post videos of the sexual assaults they commit for other guys who they trade videos for their own wives like there's full forms of like men who Film their wives without their wives know of your own wife is that's kind of nuts and then they all just share it So that's nuts. I know this might be sounding wild to you But when Bianca entered into this world, this is like Not that outrageous normal to that. It's normal to the people in this world correct And again, like I said a lot of the people orbiting this site Are not necessarily there for the for good reasons Now after this happened Bianca and her mother actually went to the police to report the crime But then this boyfriend threatened suicide and Bianca was like that's it I'm not going forward with the investigation Now whether or not that video was removed from discord. I don't know, but I can tell you this It was an omen of what was to come and it also didn't help the circumstances surrounding Bianca's own mental health after that she began telling counselors that she was experiencing suicidal ideation and then she was admitted to a psychiatric facility for the next month And Kim said Bianca really seemed to like it there. She felt like it was helping But when she wasn't in the facility, things were difficult for Bianca and her family She ran away from home on more than one occasion Sometimes to be with that same ex-boyfriend who she was still like in a toxic somewhat relationship with At one point she was even placed under a person's in need of supervision hold and given an ankle monitor to wear under house arrest But then she found a way to cut it off and then run away again So it's safe to say that into her teenage years Bianca had really taken a Turned down a treacherous path and I think a lot of teenagers explore and rebel and try to figure out You know who they are and what they want but Bianca's especially Just seemed to be really intense and kind of maneuver into some dark places By the fall of 2018 Bianca was back in treatment working on her mental health again And when she came home in February of 2019 It seemed like Bianca was on a great path. She was excited about finally graduating high school that spring She was planning to stay nearby for college hoping to attend Mohawk Valley Community College That's just 15 minutes away from her house and again she still wanted to go into psychology For her it was important to keep close contact with her family have a place where she could come home to when she needed it But everything changed for Bianca when that April or main right before her graduation before her life was finally Going to turn around for the better she met a guy on Instagram He was a 21-year-old lift driver from the Syracuse area Named Brandon, Clark Hey Keep in mind Bianca's still in high school Brandon was also someone who was chronically online But he'd also experienced his fair share of trauma as a kid according to some sources When he was about 12 years old his father held his mother at knife point for 10 hours Because he believed she was cheating on him After that Brandon's father was sent to prison while his mother was arrested on separate charges Causing Brandon to be in and out of foster care But when Bianca finally met Brandon in real life after meeting him on Instagram and introduced him to her family He did seem like a put together young man despite the fact that he was 21 and she was still in high school Kim said he was charming in polite he spoke to her candidly about his experiences in the foster care system Bianca really seemed to have found a good friend in Brandon You know, they shared a lot of interests from anime Online world to the same type of music The only thing that worried Kim at the beginning was that Brandon seemed to have pretty strong feelings for Bianca And she didn't necessarily return them Bianca is insisting to everyone that they're just friends But Brandon is openly calling Bianca his girlfriend Okay, interesting Everyone says Bianca was clear with him about being platonic she was getting ready to start a new chapter in the fall She was wanting to go to college They were saying she was just a little scared to Have another guy in her life to be tied down before she's really trying to take this next big step Brandon is aware of this, but it doesn't seem to matter to him He hoped he wished that Bianca would change her mind Which was why he went to great lengths to try and win her over He would drive her and her sister anywhere they wanted to go even though he lived about an hour away with his aunt And he would buy them alcohol because he was 21 You would stay out all night with Bianca if she wanted even if that meant that he would miss work the next day He even got not one but two tattoos Dedicated to Bianca. Oh, no, this is Oh, no Brandon just really seemed like someone who had A huge crush on Bianca Is it more than a crush? Yeah But I mean, it's also just like everyone around her is like oh, this guy just loves her how sweet Like it wasn't like they were red flags going off this guy's obsessed with her. Yeah, it's controlling her Should be going up, but maybe it's because he isn't controlling her. Yeah, it's more like he just has a really big crush on her You know what out of her So when Bianca asked him if she could go to a concert with Brandon in July of 2019 just two weeks after she graduated high school And was like yeah go The concert was set for July 13th and Bianca was extremely excited because this was the first show her mother had given her permission to to go to alone In fact, Kim said that she felt more comfortable knowing Brandon was gonna be with Bianca because He was kind. He had earned her trust by that point. She knew that he would take care of Bianca So that afternoon Brandon picked Bianca up and they headed towards the city for what was gonna be a long At least four hour drive and as the night wound down Bianca texted her mother that the concert was over and they were gonna start making the long trip back Now Kim probably went to sleep shortly after that thinking she would wake up to find Bianca at the breakfast table tomorrow What that was not the case Instead around 7.30 a.m. the next morning July 14th There was a knock on Kim's door And it was the Utica police Who wanted to know if Kim had seen her daughter Now at this point Kim's like okay, so Bianca didn't come home I Know I haven't seen her the cops are here her heart is racing She just assumed that maybe Bianca had just broken their agreement to come straight home and had maybe like stayed the night But now Bianca's cell phone was going straight to voicemail and then police are like okay, well, we need to tell you why we're here They said earlier that morning they had received a flood of 911 reports because around 6.03 a.m A message was posted to Bianca's discord account. Okay, remember. She's very active on here. She has a mask Some followers. It's a pretty a pretty heavy group and this message read sorry f-word Earth Got it. You're gonna have to find sorry furs. Oh, thank you. You're welcome You're gonna have to find somebody else to orbit Remember orbit is like someone you follow you're obsessed with you Have a pair social relationship with Are they saying that she posted this or it was posted to her account? They don't think she posted it Well, no, but it did it. Sorry. I'm saying did it come from her account. Yes. Got it. So obviously Yeah, okay. Well, here's the thing the message had a picture with it like a post and the post is a picture of Bianca With her throat slashed and her face covered in blood Oh My so the police show up hoping this is fake. Oh, that is like this was just an online stunt oh But then her mom's like, yes, she never came home. No, she's not at her phone's going to voicemail We don't know where she is and now this picture. It probably is real. What is wrong with people As her friends started wake up that day and check their social media I mean, yes, they're all into this online world, but that doesn't make murder. Okay. You know what also doesn't mean that they're in the killing exactly So the image and the caption does begin circulating many did think it was a prank, but others were like No, this is way too far. This is pushing the boundaries. We're calling police to like check him on her But as officers are speaking with Kim There is another call coming in over the radio 911 at the emergency My name is Brandon the victim is Bianca Michelle Devins. I'm going to kill myself So dispatchers are like, okay, what's going on like they try to keep Brandon on the phone to pinpoint his location To which he says quotes. I'm not gonna stay on the phone for long because I still need to do the suicide part of the murder suicide Okay, but he called 911 Eventually though, he reveals where he is on a dead end road actually not that far from Bianca's house. So a team of officers rushed to the spot where they find Brandon still alive. He has a knife and a gun. He's threatening himself and he does start stabbing himself. Oh my gosh, dude. In the neck. He had like a tarp under him like it was set up. He lays down on the tarp and then he takes a selfie on the tarp and posts it to social media. The caption of it says like ashes to ashes. But as Brandon's doing this surrounded by police, but you have to understand the reason police aren't rushing in is like this is a like a like a standoff kind of because he does have a gun and they're they are worried he's going to hurt himself, but also that they don't know the situation no idea what's going to happen. You have no idea. And so he lays down, he's surrounded by police on the tarp, but police have also noticed. And this is another reason they didn't rush in is Brandon is not alone on this tarp. This green tarp that he's laying on now has like a patch of dark hair sticking out from under his head. Oh yeah. So Bianca's bodies there as well. And here's the thing like there like is this personal life is this a hostage. Is this beyond like they know they're not really sure what they're doing. What they're dealing with either way they move in. There's a struggle. They do get Brandon in handcuffs. They remove the tarp and underneath they find a body of a young woman. And of course it is 17 year old Bianca devins. And before Kim can even hear the news of Brandon's arrest her daughter Olivia sees the photo circulating online. You have to understand the police did not show which which why would they're like you don't need to see this photo and I feel like this does happen a lot with social media now where. Yeah, there'll be a photo that no one should see where like parents find out on social media before anywhere it's just. It's hard. It's really hard. There's so many cases. I mean, if the Gabby potato cases probably one of the most I guess talked about social media cases, anything with like the Idaho case and everything, well, I was just going to say with the Idaho case like someone just requested to get the crime scene photos released which is a right like citizens do have a right to request it if it's available. But the issue is is they then take those and they're not posted on like, you know, some true crime. They're posted on TikTok and you have family members who are on TikTok and are swiping and then you see the and listen, this is a this is a hard situation because it's it's it's hard. It's hard. Citizens do have the right to understand what's going on around them. Like you we have the right to understand what other human beings are doing. Yeah. But at the same time, there is that just thinking about someone else, thinking about in this case, the police didn't show her mom the photo because there was no need. They explained there was a photo post online. She looked like she was in a there like not a good situation. We're wondering if you've seen her. But then her sister Olivia gets online and sees this photo of her dead sister before they even know what's going on like they don't even know that he's been arrested. Yeah. It's hard. I mean, I know there's so many gray lines everywhere. I mean, I think it's part of it is why like when we do these cases, obviously partly for an attainment, but also to bring awareness. And we try to be as respectful as possible. It's just it's hard. It is. It really there's there's a lot to it. I mean, but you have like news. You have your news sources and you have articles and it's just what's it's part of the world and social media these days. Well, here's the deal. We can't live in a world where everything bad is kept secret. Correct. No, because that's not safe for anyone. Like everyone needs to understand the dangers out there. They need to understand what people are capable of. They need to understand how to look for red flags, psychological things. Honestly, this is just an unfortunate situation like like I said at the beginning, no one, no one should ever be scrolling TikTok and see a picture of their dead. Correct. That's horrible. That's not absolutely horrible. Horrible. I mean, even in the Idaho for everything's blurred in these pictures. And I'm not saying that that makes it perfect, but it makes a difference. It does. It makes a huge difference. It does. Obviously, you're going to haunt this sister, but with Brandon now in custody already being charged with murder, the question isn't so much a who'd done it rather than why. I mean, he's he's he clearly did it. He clearly said this was a murder suicide. He murdered her and then was going to commit suicide, but called the cops first. So I don't actually think he was wanting to commit suicide. We're wondering what happened leading up to this moment while it turns out there is so much more to the story. It was clear that Brandon was way more into Bianca than she was into him. And like everyone in her life said, it seemed innocent enough. It seemed like he just had a major crush on her, but here's the thing. Like I said, she told him their relationship was purely platonic, which might be where things started to fester for Brandon. I mean, immediately she rejected him, not even like a, oh, let's just stay and see immediately she was like, no, this is platonic. There's a difference between liking someone and being enthralled in, enthralled with someone's life and so on and so forth and liking what they do and their content, like these celebrities that have actual like stalkers where they think they have like a right to their lives or they get so obsessed where they already get into their houses. It's dangerous. Yeah. And it's crazy. And it's obviously what happened here to an extent and it's pretty wild. So Brandon invited Bianca to the concert offered to take care of her. Maybe he thought, okay, this concert are one on one alone time, alone time four hours away from her home in the car together. Maybe he thought this was a chance to like make it more than platonic for her. But instead she proved to him that he definitely wasn't the one she was interested in because during the concert Bianca met up with another guy. So he invited her. She said yes and then told another guy, hey, I'm going to be at this concert with a friend because she's clearly told Brandon, this is platonic. So the other guy comes up. Yeah, I mean, it's kind of all it pissed them off and yeah. Does this suck? Yeah. Welcome to life. Welcome to life. Welcome to life. If you can't handle being told no, go back to preschool. If you can't handle a little rejection, I don't know to tell you exactly. So this is another person that she had met online. This guy, his name is Alex. Now Bianca had had a crush on Alex for a while. She was like, I just like him. He's perfect. I'm literally in love with him. So Bianca was looking forward to that concert, not just for the music and definitely not because she was going with Brandon, but because she knew Alex was going to be there. During the show, she introduces Alex to Brandon. This is how platonic she thinks this is. She comfortably is like, hey, this is my friend Alex. And after Brandon disappeared to get rolling papers, he returned to find Bianca and Alex kissing Alex said that after this point like when he saw he came up on them kissing, Brandon became cold and nasty to them. But when Bianca got in Brandon's car for the long ride home around 10 p.m., things got much worse. Bianca texted Alex because she was picking up on Brandon's like cold behavior and said, I think he saw me kiss you. So she's clearly like, oh no, he's upset like she's picking up on Brandon's behavior that like he's upset. And now she's texting Alex being like, shoot, like I think that I hurt his feelings, which became clear when Brandon picks a fight with Bianca in the car. He tells her he felt like she had used him to get to the show just to meet up with another guy. Eventually though things seemed to kind of calm down because apparently Bianca fell asleep on the long ride back. But when they get close, instead of bringing Bianca home to her house, Brandon turned off onto that dead end road, he then fixed his phone like up on the dashboard. Just record and then woke Bianca up and sexually assaulted her on camera in the car when she thinks they were just going home. Okay. Oh, this is horrible. Now in total, he made five videos this night and each video lasted about a minute or two. So he didn't just keep the camera rolling. But then about 30 minutes later, he takes another video. And this time he's accusing Bianca of basically being unfaithful to him. And then as the video is rolling, he begins stabbing her as she's begging for her life in the car. I can't like this stuff. This is like, I would say this is probably why I hate true crime. Like, I just cannot comprehend what is wrong with him. people. Like I cannot comprehend it. I don't care. Honestly, I don't care. I don't care what you have going on in your life. I don't care what's going on in your mind doing something like this. I just, I don't care. Like I just don't comprehend it. You're a horrible person. Here's the thing. Like we've seen people, you know, video or take evidence of their crimes. And a lot of time is just for them to revisit their crime, right? Like sure. Yeah. He wasn't even videoing these things just for himself because the second, like from there, he begins posting to all of his social media accounts to all of his sick and gross dirty friends. One story showed a photo of the New York State through way with the caption. Here comes hell. It's redemption, right? Shortly after that, he posts a blurry photo, which I think went to his feed that showed a bloody torso. I also would say that I brought, I mean, it could be wrong. It's probably, he's probably watching this type of content. 100%. This is what I'm saying. This is like a, this is something he's sick and twistedly into. Yeah. Like it's not just like, oh, let me just do this. Like no, it's a thing. He's watched it. He's just find an episode of Law and Order SVU that has to do with the dark web. And you'll realize that like, that's not like, no, I know, but even they cover things about like these twisted groups online. And then he posted the image on her discord. It was very clear beyond cause dead body with the message, sorry, efforts, you're going to have to find somebody else to orbit, which is just like grow like the disrespect on top of that. He then continued posting to Facebook, Instagram, Snapchat, other social media sites. And after that, he made phone calls to his family saying goodbye. He called his grandmother left her voicemail, called his brother in Alaska, his aunt who he lived with at the time. And then like, pretends to kill himself, but calls police first to make sure that they all pour me. Let me call my family. Find myself. Get out of here, bro. Get out of here. Like the, I just, if it's don't feel bad at all, I'm not going to say what I was going to say, but like, he clearly wanted the cops. This case is kind of pissing me off. He wanted the cops to intervene. Like he wanted to walk the walk and make it seem like, I could, yeah, I see what you're saying. But like, he had zero plants too. I want to say, he's trying to make himself seem like a victim at this point. Yeah. After his arrest, Brandon was brought to the hospital, treated for his wounds. And the following day, he was formally charged with second degree murder. However, the more investigators dig into Brandon's life, they more they realize, which is kind of like what Garrett was talking about. This was not a spur of the moment decision. This wasn't a murder of passion done in the heat of the moment that he just like came up with in his mind. This wasn't second degree murder. This was well thought out premeditated, planned, and Brandon was a lot more disturbed than he ever let on. So early on in his arrest, Brandon began writing letters to a vlogger from prison saying that he had blacked out after the concert. He had no memory of what happened that night. And this might have been on the advice of his attorney. So he could try make it look like he was insane. But the reality was there was evidence that Brandon had been planning this before that day ever came. So the blackout excuse doesn't really work for starters. When Brandon was texting and saying his goodbyes to people, he told his aunt that there was a will in the top of his dresser. What 21 year old has a will? Investigators also learned how truly obsessed Brandon was with Bianca. He had searched for images of her repeatedly online. Definitely to the point of stocking, he took screenshots of all of their conversations and like save them in like a folder. As I mentioned, he got tattoos for her. What I didn't share was that he got the first one just a week after they met in person. When he went to a graduation party, he like showed all our friends. He was like, look, I got this for her. And I mean, now looking back, that seems like ownership or power like some type of I have this and you don't think. But according to a jailhouse diary taken from Brandon's cell, he got extremely mad at Bianca about a week before the murder when he saw another guy show up on her phone. He was the ex boyfriend who she tried to like take that case to. And after this, Brandon is like, are you cheating on me? And she's like, we're not in a relationship. Like I'm not cheating on you. Still, as a way to make Brandon feel better, she then added him to her discord server, which meant he then had all the time to go through her complete history on discord as well. And that's when he saw there were a few guys who had been asking Bianca for nude photos. And investigators think this is when his obsession with her really escalated. Brandon realized he had a lot of competition for Bianca when he had access to her discord and realized like what was happening over there. And he decided if he couldn't have her, well, then no one else could either turns out he had also done multiple internet searches before Bianca's death on how to kill someone. Oh my god. Quote how to choke someone out. How do you hit the artery to kill someone? How do you stage a hanging? And then two days before Bianca was killed, Brandon had made a list in his notes app on his phone for how he would stage a crime scene, which police noted in their report when they found Brandon. He had spray painted a phrase at the crime scene that read, "May you never forget me?" And bought that spray paint and put it in his card days before. Yeah, I mean, so it sounds like he's going to get charged with first to be murdered. Police later learned this was a phrase actually from a series of Japanese comic books that he and Bianca loved called Pun Pun. Brandon also had a Bluetooth speaker at the crime scene when they arrived and it was playing the same song on repeat over and over again. And this makes me sad because it's actually a song I like. It's called Test Drive by an artist named Joji. And the song's basically about someone who is more invested in a relationship than the other person. And then there was the fact that Brandon had planned to tape Bianca's murder so he could post it, watch it back on later. Now, thankfully, the actual murder video didn't make it onto the internet. But when police discovered the video, they discovered that Bianca fought back. She fought back hard. So with all of this evidence, prosecutors are like, yep, we think we have enough to get a conviction. The only thing is in the state of New York, they would still consider this a second degree murder even if it's premeditated. Turns out New York doesn't use first and second degree murder in the same way that other states do. Their first degree murder is reserved for more specific situations like killing a police officer or a judge or multiple victims or terrorism. But before they can even get to court, there's another battle that the family and lawyers have to fight. And that is social media themselves. Now, unfortunately, the image of Bianca after her death spread like the plague across social media platforms. And even after Brandon was locked up and charged, this image continued to circulate. Why? Because Instagram was extremely slow to shut down Brandon's account. And again, this was on his Instagram account 2019. I'm surprised they weren't a little faster, but I feel like that wouldn't be the thing now. I feel like they're pretty fast at that stuff now. But I mean, that was seven years ago. This is like a dead body. But it got true. Unblurred. I think people think like Instagram and other these other social media websites were for some reason when they nothing they just started in 2019. It's been around for a bit. But they didn't think like no one would do that. No one would actually do that. No, people would do that. So it took close to a day for them to remove his profile for violating our terms of service, which then removed his posts. And in the meantime, both he and Bianca, like both of them had amassed thousands of new followers. And like Gerard and I were talking about, Brandon began receiving public praise from men who agreed with him that she deserved to die, like publicly saying this that she led him on. Oh, I already know the type of people they are. And then just even after they removed the account, I mean, screenshots, screen grabs shared to different platforms. Like it's it's already everywhere, even though the account is taken down, the damage have been done. After that, images of Bianca's death had spilled over from mainstream social media to the fringes of the internet places way less regulated than Instagram. Because if you comment that on an Instagram picture, your comment is most likely going to take get taken down. But if you comment this on a darker site, well, they're going to just like encourage this conversation to keep going. So a lot of Bianca's friends as well as complete strangers began reposting happy images of her to try and like when you search her name push these images away, but that didn't stop trolls from sending those disturbing images to Bianca's friends family and even her own mom. Many of them were, I guess what you could say like in cells essentially like they just have their own little community and they thought that this was so funny. And while Brandon doesn't necessarily like openly be like, oh, I'm an in-sell, he did become a mascot for this hate-fueled community after Bianca's death. Like they were like, yeah, this guy is amazing. All of which brings up a much larger conversation. How do you even police this? Which is kind of what we were talking about earlier. No, we've talked about it in another case where we were talking about freedom of speech, but at what point does it, because we were talking about how what point is it just like harmful and effective to someone's like mental health and the sense that it makes them kill themselves. I think this is when we were talking about how, well, case was it word, he convinced him to commit suicide. Right. And we're talking about at some point, like, is it freedom of speech or we just, is it just full blown hate speech and it's just not okay? Like, yeah, we need regulation on this. Correct. It is, it is such a sticky and here's the thing. Sites like Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter who like, you would say are more, well, they're right. They're regulated. They're regulated. They do use human moderators. Correct. But like, how do you even monitor all of this? Like, even on those sites, you then get to the darker sites? How is this even possible? Instagram alone has three billion users a month. That's over a third of the world's global population. And if Instagram takes a day to remove a picture of a dead body, imagine how other sites who don't have that much power. So unfortunately, this is why a lot of it works on an honor system. You have to trust other people to flag it, hopefully get it to their attention sooner. Right now, there's nothing immediately stopping people from posting something like this. Like, when you go to post, there's not something that like can immediately flag it and not post it. At least in this case, the person responsible was caught quickly. Though at first, Brandon was pleading not guilty to second degree, murder charges, but on February 10th, 2020, right before his trial was set to begin, he changed his plea to guilty. And then in June of that year, right before his sentencing hearing, he changed it back to not guilty and his motion was denied. He was sentenced to 25 years to life and will be eligible for parole around 2044. Now, Bianca's family is working to make changes regarding content on the internet. Obviously. Gosh, it really is such a, it's, it's a never ending battle. I feel like then that included actually helping the state of New York pass Bianca's law in December of 2022. This law criminalizes the posting, sharing, and publishing of personal images of crime victims with intent to degrade harass or glorify. So there's an intent behind it, right? Like, this isn't for information. This isn't for case study. This is an intent to like, degrade this person, harass this person, glorify, like, praise someone for their acts. And then it's not just a poster. If you share it, if you share it, you can get charged, which I think is a good, like, is a step in the right direction. Well, I just think majority of it, like majority of, like, all of our stuff we post, we, like, we blur it. Right. And I think it should be blurred for a reason. Like, you don't need to see the unlearned versions. No, like, we just, we don't. We don't, as humans, like, we don't, honestly, we don't really need that. No, we were meant to have that. I don't even think we were meant to have social media, but hey, here we are. Yeah. The family has also set up a scholarship in Bianca's name. It will go to students who want to follow the same ambitions. Bianca did pursue a degree in psychology and helping other adolescents overcome their mental health struggles. And we have provided the link. But before I end the case, I did just want to say I clearly covered Bianca's history. I covered that she had struggled that she had gone down a darker path on the internet. She had stumbled upon forms that allow people to have this pair of social relationship be obsessed with you. But in no means does that mean that she was like, yes, murder me and publish it on the internet? That doesn't mean that she was on murdering forms. That doesn't mean that she was on the dark web. I mean, she really was just basically being an influencer in a different space. And so I don't want any of it like, well, when you mess with this kind of stuff, it's like she wasn't messing with that kind of stuff. That is our episode for today and we will see you next time with another one. I love it. And I hate it. Goodbye.