837 investor lending, 40-year loan terms, changing property managers, selling to a developer + more

Hello and welcome to this property with John Pigeon and Rachel Kruehn. Today we've got some deep dive into some important topics, Rachel. Wow, AMP 40-year loan. What is that all about? Property management? How do we choose a good one? How do we keep a good one? Should we flick one when they're doing no good? Genuine savings versus gifted deposits in these times where the baby boomers have got all the money, and can they pass a bit on to us? And then apartment buildings are getting snapped up by developers. If we're one of many owners in there, how do we approach all that to get the best outcome for oneself? That's a lot to cover. It is a lot to cover, so we better get into it. Hi, I'm John Pigeon, Founder and Director of Invisage Property Buys Agency. And I'm Rachel Kruehn, Founder and Director of Sphere Homelands. We also support this podcast. This is a show for Australians that want to make smart and inform property decisions. And to be kept up to date with the ever-changing lending landscape. We would love for you to join the discussion in the Australian Property Tag Facebook group. Thank you so much for joining the show. We are glad you're here. All right, this is definitely your wheelhouse, Rachel. Yeah, well, we have been talking about this for a while, which is in, obviously, the budget announcements on the 12th of May came out. And very shortly after in June, the banks changed their serviceability calculators to take out negative gearing. So, and it's really important to note that investors are slowing in the market, not because they think properties of bad investment. They've got a lever that's slowing them, which is borrowing capacity or serviceability. So when you took the negative gearing off the calculator, and I'll just give you one example, which we've talked about a few times the last few months, you know, a first-time investor that was living at home with their parents, went from being able to borrow 750 to 550. And for your average investor, you know, that might have a small mortgage and they were buying their first investment property, they might be a pre-approved purchase of 700. And suddenly their borrowing capacity became 600 overnight. And negative gearing is the lever that is impacting their borrowing capacity. Yes. So not what I'm hearing is, not the fact that you can't get a tax return because of the budget changes. It is the fact that we cannot or we're borrowing capacity is less than what it was pre-budget because negative gearing is being removed. That is right. So I think at the moment investors are recalibrating. They're trying to understand what the new normal looks like. Yes. And banks are doing some things in the background too. And we spoke about this just a few weeks ago that I said, I think banks will start to pull some different levers. You know, we can't have negative gearing in our calculators, but we want to lend money and we want to lend money to investors. What levers can we pull to be able to do that? And since we spoke, there was last week, AMP came out and they've said, well, we're going to do a 40-year loan term. And then West, the West Pat group have come out. So obviously West Pat covers in George and Bank SA, they've come out with another policy. They said, well, we're going to take 95% of rental income into account in the service in calculator. And these are just the two first little shots from banks. I believe more will follow. But I wanted to chat about the 40-year loan term today. Let's do that because banks are in the business of lending money. And when they can't lend money to the majority, what do they do? Yeah. They find a way. That's right. An example I've been using a little bit the last few weeks in my calls with clients have been, when I think it was about 15 years ago, the appra got involved with responsible lending and they said, well, we actually want there to be a sufficient exit strategy. This whole exit strategy thing changed. So at the moment, it's negative gearing. But we go back 15 years ago, it was, well, we don't think we should be lending to a 40-year-old for a 30-year loan term if they don't have enough super. And suddenly, all the banks went really hard and fast with exit strategy. No, if you're 42, you need to have a really detailed exit strategy. And then in time, it loosened different banks interpreted it differently. And suddenly, we're doing 30-year loan terms for six-year-olds again. So if I knock on A&P's door today with a 40-year loan request, are they going to assist me knowing that I'll be 89 when I pay this loan off? You've got to understand that this loan is not for owner-occupied. This is for investors. And you've got to think about investors borrow with the intent of holding property. Their intent, generally, is to hold that loan for what it is for the next 10 years. So it actually makes sense for there to be a 10-year interest-only period. So the 40-year loan terms one thing, and that's a pretty exciting thing for investors. But I think the bigger part of that change is the fact they're doing 10 years interest-only without reassessment. Which they used to do. Like every bank. Do you know, I've got clients in my portfolio that I did 15 years interest-only for that are still on interest-only and that have actually not had any issues. I think all the stuff in the changes that have happened in the last 15 years, I've had clients that I set on 15-year interest-only terms that have felt none of these changes because they've not had to refinance. Where other investors have had to refinance, and we all know, as investors, every five years you need to reset your portfolio to pull it back out to interest-only as long as you've got a home loan still. Yeah. And it's called responsible lending. I get it. But yeah, early 2000s, it was just interest-only. There was never a question of when that interest-only expires. It was just forever and a barrier. Yeah. And stuff like this gets into the media and I've already seen people, I've seen so many commentary about people going, "Oh, first home buyers, this is going to be, have the banks make more interest in time?" This isn't a product for first home buyers. And I actually, rightly or wrongly, I think investors are who should be able to get that longer loan term because their goal is not to pay the debt down. And they're getting some sort of associated income from that asset too. That probably comes into play with the bank's comfort to give that 40-year loan out. That's right. And you think of yourself as a bank. Now, if you could choose as a bank, am I going, "What's going to be more profitable for me?" A first home buyer that pays their home loan down over the next 20 years, or an investor that actually wants to keep their home lending the same for the next 10 or 15 years, the banks make money from investment lending. They definitely want to keep that on their books. So a couple of questions for you, the expert. Will other banks follow suit? Well, I personally think they will. I think there'll be some 10-year interest. So if they did the 10-year interest only term, the reason they can't do that with a 40-year loan term is under-responsible lending. If you do a 10-year loan term, you now have to show that you can pay that loan off in 20 years if you did a 30-year loan term. So I don't think anyone's going to be taking out a loan for 40 years. But people are going to be able to have 10 years without reassessment for investors. Now, AMPs, the first, that's a bold move. Others, I believe, will follow. If you look over at the US, they have 40-year loan terms already, but they have it for first home buyers. And that's a very different thing. So I don't want people to get mixed up with what this product is. It is for investors, and it will allow investors to have a little bit more of their serviceability back. So I did a quick example. Like before that example, I just, not rant, but just look at it and say, hang on a minute, I'm a first home buyer trying to get into the market. The government screwed me over with their budget changes. Affordable living is no longer there. It's hard to save money. My rents are going to go up because there's less investors. Now you're giving investors a free kick to say, well, now you can get 40-year loan. But I can't. I'm going to say two things to that. One, so many first home buyers are investors. There are so many first home buyers that are investors. So we use that example at the start, that person living at home with their parents, rent investor, buying their first property, they were actually the hardest hit by this budget. And the reality is with affordability and house prices, so many people need to buy their first as an investment property to ever get a foothold in the market. That's the only way in. So this one, this will help the first home buyer in rent investing, not living in it. And there's the other person that I'm talking to the first home buyer. So 70% of people buying their first home to live in. That's still the majority of first home buyers are going to live in that property. You have a moment in time and we are here. We've been talking about this for a while. There's been a huge competition in the market for the last five years, even longer, where emotional first home buyers have been beaten to the exchange by savvy, non-emotional, cash heavy investors. The investors need time. This is going to take a while to recover. This is just the first change that's come out. I don't think investors are going to really flood the market again for some time and maybe never to the extent that they did. This is the first home buyer's opportunity. Don't waste this moment in time. So you're saying the 40 alone term is good for the first home buyer, as long as you're not going to live in it. As long as you're not going to live in it. But I think this product coming out, it's only going to be one of many. I think what first home buyers need to think about is not thinking that property prices are going to halve. They're just not. I hope that I'm going to say that then it's going to happen, but we have a supply. Obviously nobody knows, but we have a supply issue that hasn't changed our retraction. in the market in Australia has happened. I just don't think I don't want people to think what's going to be another 50% down. And I'm going to wait for the market to come down like, this is the opportunity for first home buyers now before the investors have their, I guess, their things loosened like they have with every other policy. - Yeah, go. - All right, so, hit it. What is it going to look like the 40-year? - Okay, so I just, it is not huge, it's not huge, but I just want to give an example. And this is probably your average first-time investor, not rent investor, it's going to be a little different for rent-vesting. But the first, the average first-time investor, we've got a couple on $100,000 each a year. They've got one child, no other debts, they've got some good equity in their own home, and their mortgage is $350,000. And that is a very standard first-time investor. They pay their mortgage down a bit, they've got a $350,000 mortgage, they're both on $100,000, they're buying their first investment property. - Yeah. - Pre-budget, that couple, and I've taken some liberties here to work, I'm assuming a four and a half percent return. Pre-budget, that couple could buy for $890,000, a new investment property, or an existing investment property, pre-budget. Negative gearing came out of the calculator in June this year. That same couple could borrow for a property worth $650,000, and I'm assuming they're borrowing 100% plus costs using the equity in their own home. So what we had was post-budget from June, that investor needs to make a choice. You're a first-time investor. You need to choose, you can borrow $890,000 if you build or buy a new property, or you can buy an existing property for $650,000, and that's the real world. That's what people are making decisions on. The 40-year loan term came out with the 10-year interest only period, which is also a nice thing for that person to know that they won't have to have any sort of refinancing for 10 years. They can set and forget. They can now borrow $700,000. With AMP. With AMP and the 40-year loan term? Yeah. So that's taken them from $650,000 to $700. That's not a huge increase in purchase price. No, so $890,000, so this is all with AMP as an example. I'm using AMP as an example because they're the first to come out. There will be different banks will pull different levers. This is just the first. Okay, so $890,000 down to $650,000 back up to $700,000 with the 40-year loan. Yep. Obviously, that could still go to $890,000 if they'll buy a new property. Yep, but yeah, that's a little bit, uh-uh. If that's a word, $700,000. You can say, ooh. $700 probably doesn't move the needle a bit, but it gives them a little bit of wiggle room if they're in that $650-ish market. And at the end of the day, there has to be some recalibration. There's not going to be like it was before. There's going to be this hard line of, this is what it is now, and there's going to be slight increases to that. So if I was an investor right now, I just want to be exploring all of my options. Yeah. And I think more changes will come. So yesterday morning, I actually don't have a new calculator for this. So yesterday morning, I got an email saying the Westpac group have made some changes to the way the percentage of income they will use in their calculator for affordability or serviceability. So before, and some banks use 80% of rental income, the Westpac group are pretty good. They actually use 90% already. Already, yep. But they're now using 95%. Yeah, well. So if something is renting for $500 a week, they're taking 95% of their figure into your income when servicing a proper. And I saw a few chats when this came out and people were saying that's irresponsible because you actually don't get 95% of the income of a property because we have all the costs in running. But it was actually a few years ago that investors already had a hit where on top of that 80% or 90% of rent that the banks were taking, you actually had to put the running costs in a separate living expenses calculator. So that 95% of the rent they're using, that actually doesn't account for that supposed to just account for vacancy. The costs of running the investment property go somewhere else in your living expenses. So investors that haven't just had this budget as a hit for affordability has been a, it's like been a death of a thousand cuts. There's been a few different things that have held them up. And is it fair to say that banks like Westpac will change their policies based on how much market share they want for a certain type, i.e., we're going to give 95% to investors because we want more investors on our book. - Well, everyone or all the banks reported such a slow down in not just investor landing but all lending in the last quarter, they need to keep the likes on. - Absolutely, pay the bills. - So they've got to pull some levers to get those people back. They also need confidence back because first home buyers who really in my opinion should be flooding the market right now, they're probably the most impacted by all these headlines. So they're even more cautious. So everything needs to get moving for the people to be able to take that opportunity. - Yeah, and we'd love to hear from first home buyers that are trying to get into the market. But I think they'll wrap against it before May, weren't they? Because of lack of affordable options for them to buy. - Yeah, and actually one of the credit analysts from our company bought a property on the weekend. So he just exchanged. It's really exciting. He used the help to buy scheme. I'm gonna get him to come and have a chat with you on an episode. I'd love for you to talk about what he's done. But it's really funny. He's been looking for a really long time but every time a property came up, it was gone. And he's a perfect example. It took him 10 days to get his government spot on this help to buy scheme. But because there's no investors out in the market, he had the time. He had the time to go to the agency. I actually need a 10 day cooling off period and here's all my conditions for exchange. And the agent went, okay, that's fine. Why did he say okay? Because there wasn't five other people trying to exchange. So there are winners in this market and he's one of them. - Well, it's taking action when you can do it, right? So I feel there's a lot of home buyers just sitting still at the minute as well. Okay, that's interesting. So the 40 year loan with A&P, Gandy here says that other banks will follow. And then the 95% with Westpac up from 90, because some banks, like, I don't know if I'm making this up, but it sounds good, like 70% at one stage. - Yeah, they've been really cautious. And some banks still do. So you have your investor banks that you know we're trying to get investor market share and you have ones that actually don't want too much investor business. So it's, you can tell by their policies who wants it. - Yeah, and that, again, it comes back to a great mortgage broker in your corner, their strategic, not only across these policies, but can look at someone's situation and think, yeah, outside the square, I'm going to go over here because I know that's going to work for the clock. - Yeah, interesting stuff, okay. - This is property is brought to you by Sphere Home Loans. Sphere Home Loans is a mortgage broker that helps our listeners all around Australia. So if you want to get into your first home sooner, looking at upgrading an additional property or want your current mortgage reviewed, just search Sphere Home Loans or click the link in the show notes. And their dedicated brokers will be able to help you wherever you are. If you are, however, after personal financial advice, don't get it from a podcast. If you would like help based on your own personal situation, head over to moneypodcast.com.au. Click get help and we'd be happy to introduce you to one of our trusted professionals. That's moneypodcast.com.au and click get help. - So a non says how often should a property manager inspect and report back to you? And there was another question very similar that I'm going to ask at the same time, which is when is it worth switching property managers? And how do you do it without drama? I think they're very similar questions. - No, I'm once drama in their world, right? - No, I'm not sure. - Ask Lane how often. - Yeah, true, so property manager inspections. I think first of all, we've got to revert to what does the state allow us? - Yeah. - Like if I've got a property in WA, by law, there is a minimum, sorry, a maximum amount of times that my property manager can enter. - Yeah. - The building for inspections. So first of all, work to that. But generally, I'm a bit divided on this one. Because like you would say once a quarter, or once every sort of six months, but it really does depend on how the tenants going, like they're paying rent on time, does like are we smelling a rat? Like it's a little bit blizzier. But in the first year, I'm more inclined to get them out there more often just to make sure that the tenants, the real deal. - Yeah, if I had a long term tenant in a property, let's say a tenant of three or four years, I would not want my property manager going in four times a year. I feel that's a bit of an satisfaction. - Yeah, and some states don't allow it. So it might be every, I think three times a year is probably the norm. - Yeah. - So, but probably the new tenant, you want a little bit more often. Now, you just to make sure that it's like the. - And you South Wales, I think it's, like a lot of the property managers do do four times. Do you know, I actually asked my property manager to stop doing so many inspections, on the property. Because that time I had to rent a house and they came in every three months, I found it a huge invasion of my privacy. I thought every three months, especially when I kept the place perfectly, why are you coming back in another three months? Yeah, and things can change very quickly. We know that, but if someone wants to burn it down, ruin a room, get someone that's illegal in there, they can do that in 24 hours. Yeah, so I guess it's anytime between two and four. Months? Two and four times a year. Two and four times a year, I think. But I would be looking at how long is my tenant been there and what's their history look like? That's right. Early on, I'd be just, yeah. But they haven't been there in a year. Let's get on to it. Oh, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. They're definitely doing it worst case every four to six months, for sure. And what about when is it worth switching property managers and how do you do it without drama? So can I park back at the initial part of it first and then lead into this? Yes. I think a property manager in some ways is an admin specialist. Let's call it that. They collect the rent, they pay the bills, they just make sure everything's rolling okay. And then they'll basically go out to inspect the property and take photos. They should take videos. I like the videos because it's real time. And they should give a really elaborate overview of what your property looks like with you at not having to be there. So if that's not happening because I've heard of reports where property managers will go out, tick the boxes, send that form back to the landlord and say, yep, everything's all good. No photos, no videos, nothing. It's just a tick box. Worst case we need to have photos, but ideally photos and videos for me. So that's probably the standard that you would like to adhere to. If we're seeing any red flags in any of that, because let's be honest, sometimes the property manager can feel as though they're working for the tenant, not the landlord. Yes. And so I understand where the property manager is coming from. And the property manager can change hands very quickly. So Rachel could have been my property manager and now John is and now Bertha is and now Wayne is like, no name's coming into my head. I'm not the property manager. That's a tough job. Well, yeah. And it may be shoots. Did the amount of turnover they get in that space, right? But I think if you say you've got to be involved in the situation, like property investing in generally is a pretty boring life. Hopefully it's boring. But you should be checking in every time they've done a inspection. You should be double triple checking everything that they've done and just go back to them with questions just to confirm, yep, everything's all good. Because what's on the surface might not be underneath. Then if you decide, right, when is it worth switching if I haven't actually if I'm not happy with this? And I know there's a guy in this building that also runs a podcast that has been unhappy with property managers in the past. And I know you have personally as well. A lot of it comes back to the personality of the landlord. I was like how much personally victim I know not at all. It's like how much am I a control freak? How much do I want more information? How much am I worrying about nothing over all those sort of things? But I would not hesitate if I saw major red flags. I read rent wasn't getting chased up or I realized that that something hadn't been attended to that I'd asked them to do three weeks ago with repairs. Yeah, because it's a reflection on the landlord. And it's easy for the property manager. And I'm not downing property managers at all. But it's easy for them to say, oh, the landlord hasn't got back to me. The landlord got back to me. But it was I didn't respond to it in time. So I think it's the efficiency and the transparency of the property manager. So if you wanted to change property managers and having done this, I'm going to explain the process. It's actually a very easy process. So I'll give you the example. I had a great property manager for years managing several properties for me. And that business was actually sold. So the business and these people really looked after their clients and had great staff and retention of staff, they sold to probably a bigger business. And that bigger business, I don't think put the same care into property management. I think they're more of a sales business buying rent roles. And they're staff that we're looking after property management turned over quickly. They were inexperienced and I had a really tough time. I contacted the new person that I wanted to go to. I had actually clients of mine that would give me great feedback of another real estate. And I said, I actually called them and said, because I've never changed. I've been landlord for years. I've never changed real estates before. I didn't know what to do. So I called the new real estate. And I said, look, I'd like you to manage my properties. Can you tell me how to go about it? And they said, sign this authority. We'll do the rest. It was easy. And if I didn't even get a call from the business that it was getting turned over from, that's how lack of detail they had. They didn't even call and try to retain it. That being said, before I made the change, I reached out to the principal to say, this is what happened. This is the thing that was overlooked. It was huge. It was an oven just, they were going to replace the oven. And there was nothing wrong with it. And I said, yeah, this is what happened. I want you to know about it. He never even resplied to my email. So there's a level that, you know, some people get really upset about little things. You're upset about this thing that was an oversight. But then you've reached out to the principal, which I think is the right course of action. I think the owner of the business, and I would always want this, should have the opportunity to respond. I'll try to fix it. But if not, you call the new real estate that you want to go to. They take care of everything. It was the easiest process of my life. I should have done it sooner. Yeah. And generally speaking, that can be Middle East. You don't have to wait for the. Absolutely not. They write to the tenants. And if the, if the property manager hasn't been good, there's no one that's going to be rejoicing more than the tenant because a good property manager is good for the tenant as well as the landlord. Yeah, absolutely. As a tenant, right? And I've been a tenant when I was rent-vesting. So I've been living and breathing those shoes in those shoes. How invasive is it for the property manager to come through when I'm living in that place? Well, everyone's different. I have got, so I'll rent-vested like you did. But when I had that house fire a few years ago, and I had to rent while I rebuilt, that year that I rented as an adult with my family and I'd own my property for a long time. I'm used to living in my own home. I found it very invasive every three months. I just, that's why I called my property managers and said, how often you inspect your property four times a year? Absolutely not. Twice is the maximum. I found it really invasive personally. But I think everyone's different. But if you take care of a property like it's your own and someone's been out every three months in a year and nothing's changed why we're doing it every three months. Yeah, it's not overkill. But yeah, we're 2026. Maybe there's some technology that can eliminate us from going in there at all, but maybe we could just do a video like we do with the valuers now. Maybe we're good. Who knows? All right, this is a quick one for you, Rach. Genuine savings versus gifted deposits. Does it change what a lender will approve and how to first home buyers navigate the genuine savings rule? So genuine savings is open to interpretation. So I'm going to explain traditionally. So what most people think of when they think of genuine savings. And it used to be six months years ago, but then it became three that you have to show the bank your saving statements and that you've accumulated that savings genuinely over a period of time. So some banks are still six months, some are three months, but some major banks now look at rent as genuine savings. So you could be gifted the funds today, but hey, I've been renting a house for the last 12 months and you give your rent ledger and say, well, that's my genuine savings. So even though it did a positive gifted, but rent is genuine savings, there's another major bank more recently that have said, do you know what, genuine savings is the day your parents gifted it to you. Really? How major is major? Major, the biggest, the biggest one, the biggest. So you know, that's genuine savings is the date hits your account, but you have a good letter saying, I'm gifting my children their deposit. They will tick the box to say that is genuine savings. So genuine savings has changed and you know, evolved a lot. You're okay with that. Like if, if mum don't give the money today, you're okay for the banks to say you use it tomorrow. I would always be okay with that because the rigorous tests of service ability and the buffers, we're not glending people money that they can't afford. Why are we making them wait this token three months? Especially in the market like it is now. I think three months could be huge. Three months is huge right now when we're talking August, you wake up and it's November. That's right. So get in when it's right for you and you can, but I wouldn't be hanging around waiting for genuine savings. No, sir. Now, someone's asked a question about apartment blocks and I thought this one might be good for you. I certainly would not know where to start here. My apartment building, it's a small number of units, has been approached by a developer. Along with our neighbours, I think the terms proposed are an 18-month settlement. They're offering double the market value for my unit. Is there anything I need to look out for? The contract number one. What's in it? What's the fine print look like? Double value sounds huge. Yeah, well, when I think about that, Rage, the developer still thinks there's meat in it at double the value. So what am I missing when it sounds too good to be true, sort of type statement, I think. So come back to the individual for a minute and I would say, well, where are we going to sell before this developer came to our door? Yeah. What is this? We're living in this property. Do we need to now find a new home to live? If I've doubled my money or getting double for what, then what I thought I was going to get, then I can probably find a new home easy enough. But how disruptive will that be to my life? But the big one is in the contract. What are the terms and conditions? Like, 18 months is not tomorrow. So what can change? Like, I would imagine that the developer would have a get out clause to say, if they change their mind in that 18 months, then they can walk away, Scott free. It's maybe a first ride of refusal or something like that that they'd be selling. Yeah. And developers love options. They love to give themselves options. And I would want to know much if you didn't sell for 18 months, thinking you were going to up size. Yeah. And you didn't. But they, because you're in this contract, you're locked in. You can't get out. But what if they could get out in 18 months and you might have changed your strategy based on something that didn't come into fruition? Correct. And that's what I'm hearing here. Our maybe completely wrong. But that's maybe something that, well, not maybe we do need to check and get professional advice on that. Where would you go for that advice? We just go to a lawyer and get a lawyer to who specialises in these types of contracts to look over it with a fine tooth comb and say, right, what am I pros? One of my cons. What do I need to look out for? What am I top five warning signs or red flags in this if I do sign on it? And obviously, everyone's got to agree with this or majority within their part of the building. So we all need to get together. And we might establish a team lawyer that has a look on our behalf. But I would still like to get independent advice apart from the group as well. But yeah, look exciting potentially for someone, but the developer, yeah, you don't offer double the price if you can't see terrific outside. Yeah, maybe there's more value to the developer than there is to you as an individual owner. Therefore, it's worth that to them. Absolutely. And it does happen quite often. It's just, yeah, that the longer that settlement period is, the downside for the, for the owner existing owner because that waiting game of when do I get my money? Yeah. So if there was a get out clause for the developer, what would your advice be? Would you go into an 18 month contract if only one side had a get out? And this is where I ask the situation of the owner is to say, well, what is your plan? If you won't think about selling, well, 18 months can go by if the developer pulls out, well, no, love loss. I was going to be here anyway. So there might not be a downside, but that's what you've got to understand. So don't just look at the dollar signs. The developer might be doing this for 10 other apartment blocks as well. Yes. And I would think if it was me personally, if there was a get out clause for the developer and not me, I would think if this wasn't on the table, what other plans would I have? And does this impact any of those negatively? Yeah, absolutely. I think it's, you know, been interested to see how many is in the block, doesn't sound like it's more than maybe four, six or eight or something like that. Interested to see what the others are thinking because their naivety might be rolling at the moment where they're like, oh, let's all get together and let's sell this thing. Whereas others could be, no, I've lived here for 30 years. I'm not moving, like, I'm going to be standing my ground. From what I'm hearing from you, the devil is in the detail. Understand everything in that contract before you make a decision. Hundred and ten. You've got to know that when it's an extremely attractive offer that's better than the norm, you've got to ask why. Yeah. We've got through a fair bit today, Rach. What's your key takeaway from all of those questions? Oh, the key takeaway is people are getting on with it, aren't they? They are. There's a lot less questions this week about the budget and a lot more about, okay, what does this mean for me? How am I moving forward? Yeah, like it's been a rollercoaster year for a lot of people, including everyone. And a whole heap's changed, but as much as things change, a lot still remains the same. Like when you look out there, the fundamentals are still there, aren't they? And banks always find a way, as you've mentioned with the lending changes, and investors will always find a way. And those that are really keen on getting into the market for the first time, you'll find a way. It's just where there's a will, there's a way. And the opportunities will present if you're looking. That's right. I think that investors, no matter what the headline is, no matter what the tax changes are, budget, whatever issues you're going through borrowing capacity, I think we always take it back to your strategy. And I think that your strategy shouldn't change. And I was only reading your book very recently. I have read it before, but I went back and read it again. And I think we need to go back and do the eight point strategy again. Let's do that. Yeah. That hasn't changed in a hundred years. It hasn't changed. And I was reading it thinking I read it post budget again. And I thought we need to redo the eight point strategy. Yeah. All right. Let's do that next episode. All right. Well, that's a wrap. Ladies, gentlemen, and everyone else hope you've enjoyed those questions today. Head across the YouTube if you're not already there. Click subscribe because that's really important in our lives. If you enjoyed what you listen to today, feel free to pass it on to friends, family or anyone else. Until next time, I'm John. This is Rachel and this is Property. If you're looking to buy your first home, you need a strategy. Whether you're buying to live in or for an investment, my book, the Quick Start Guide to Your First Property is for you. And if you're serious about building your investment portfolio, I've got a book for you, sort your property out and build your future. Both our books are available wherever good books are sold. You know, right now might be a window of opportunity not seen in a while to make your next property move. In the wake of the budget changes, the property market has cooled and a lot of people are sitting on the sidelines feeling worried. But here's the thing. When everyone else is nervous, that's often exactly when the smart money takes action. If you're looking to buy your first or next home to live in, now may be the time to do something about it. That's where John Pigeon and the team at envisage property come in, they're buyers' advocates, which means they're in your corner, working for you to find the right property at the right price. Reach out to the experienced team at envisage property today. 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