*laughs* I got a spider! My ear knows it's wrong, I guess! I'm going to tell you. There's something looking yours and he goes, "Oh, I'll tell you what I will tell you." You have a dog ear stuck on your eardrum and I was like, "I do?" *laughs* Can we get it out? He goes, "I can't. He'll be fucked with it." *laughs* Oh, we should. So now I know there's a dog in here in this eardrum. That's pretty stressful. I call my sister to tell her as you go, so. And he's spiraling out. I go, "My middle sister, she was wrong with her, and she thinks she's having an aneurysm." I said, "Why?" Her hair hurts on her right side! *laughs* Her hair! *laughs* *outro music* Oh, did you bring your whiskey? Oh, no. *laughs* We'll just look at it. Oh, we can tell. By the way, I'm going through a fucking thing. *laughs* I can't even tell you. I wish I knew more about you personally, because I know a lot about you professionally. And I feel like that is what, like, people know the most of your story. It's got to be weird having your story told to other people starting at what the age of 12. Yeah, 9 or 10, even. 9 or 10. Yeah. Permission to party world tours in full swing. Avoid scalpers and go to Berberberg.com to get your lowest price tickets. *outro music* I really don't know where to start. I have so many questions. I have to say what I said to you backstage at in Mexico. I saw you when you were a child. *laughs* It's pretty wild. I think it was the moon on Tennessee Street in Tallahassee. I think you were with government mule. Does that make sense? Maybe so. We did their first tour. My solo band was out with him. Yeah. And all my. So I was in a band in college. We were really in the music. The widespread panic was my gateway band into like becoming into music. Sea Brown was my song. Like, you know, it's like I met. I got really into weed and widespread panic at the end. And Sonic the Hedgehog at the same time. I was into Sonic and weed at that point probably. Well, maybe not at 14. I saw you at the moon and everyone was like, you gotta see this guy. You gotta see this kid. You were a child. Probably the same age. I'm 53 or 47. 47? 47? Yeah. So you were much younger. Yeah. And I watched you play and I was like, and I played guitar. And I was like, whoa. Yeah, I remember the moon really well because that's when my uncle would come out to see my band. And, you know, he was. He was kind of a mythical figure to me too. I would see him maybe once a year around Christmas time. And then I'd hear the stories from my dad of going to the film or to see the almonds or Watkins-Lin or some of that stuff. But I'd only see him if we were playing Tallahassee or kind of on the road at that point. So that was always a big deal. And I remember George Clinton lived behind the moon. And he would just pop in. It sounded like a kid. It was just a wild time. And I remember that club owner for some reason, Scott Carzwell. It's one of the things you remember. Because when I was a kid, I think at 12 or 13, we played for the governor. A lot in childs, we played the inauguration. And then a few years later, I was touring a lot in Florida. And there was some other young kid playing. And they shut him down from playing shows because he was under age. And the mom was like, "What about this guy?" And so then they started following me to the shows and shutting him down. No way. Yeah, and I remember we had to. We had a law change in Florida. Because we were like, "We just played the inauguration of the bar." Like, "How does this work?" And so I remember Scott Carzwell because I think we got shut down on the moon one time playing. So there was a whole period of getting chased by the cops playing gigs in Florida. It was just strange. How. This is a stupid question about how much better are you today than you were when you were 12? Some ways not at all. I listened back to some of that stuff. And you know, when you hear your early stuff, you cringe. But there's some of it. And I was like, "Well, I'm still doing that." Some of it came out kind of fully formed. And then, you know, then it evolves and changes along the way. But I think like intonation and tone and some of that stuff were kind of there out of the gate. Which is just kind of uncon. Those are the things where you feel lucky because it wasn't because you worked hard for it. And just like. I listened hard, you know? That music meant a lot to me when I. I listened before I played. So then when I got an instrument and somebody showed me open tuning or how to get a good sound with an amp, I remember. I just remember the feeling of, "Oh, this is what I was hearing." Like this is. I can almost get that Duane Almond sound or that Elmore James sound. And it was kind of an epiphany. I'm curious. I think everyone listening to this is going to say that I'm either still looking for my thing. I wish I could find my thing. Or like me, I found my thing, but I found it at a later point in my life at like 26. Yeah, I found 25, I found my thing. What's it like to find your thing before you know what a finding a thing is? Well, I was lucky because I've stumbled across it and it was there. But then I met people along the way that made me realize just because you've found it on me that you can't lose it. You really have to do something with it. And for me, that was Colonel Bruce Hampton. That guy is amazing. That guy is amazing. I've listened to you talk about him. And I kind of just. I literally was like, I could do it. I could do a podcast with you. And just have you tell stories about all the people you know. Man, we should do it on Colonel someday. Can you tell everyone who he was? So he's a tough one to explain. He's one of those people where you meet one in your lifetime. For him in the Southeast at home music scene, Colonel was just kind of this musical guru. He wasn't necessarily a good player or singer or anything. He was a vocal stylist. He was like Zappa but not quite like Zappa. And he was the craziest person in the room but never touched a drop of alcohol, never did a drug. Everyone just assumed he was just out of his head. He was just that guy naturally. He was from the beginning, like he. Duane Alman got him signed at Columbia Records. Just because he. I mean he had his Hampton grease band which is just kind of a freak show in the very early days. And Colonel was so proud because it was the second lowest selling double record in Columbia history. The first one was a yoga record where Colonel was like. Like that's the kind of stuff he would wear proudly. But he. Like all those bands from the Southeast came through him. I mean widespread came through Colonel. Fish came through Colonel like everybody. Aquarium rescue unit O'Teal, me, Jimmy Herring. We were all in Bruce's band at one point. But he was just a. He was a trip band. When I was 12 I met him. And he just. He immediately. If he saw something in you, he would. He would latch on and he would help you figure out what that was. And for some people, it was destroying their ego. It was pointing him in the right direction. Like he would take a musician and just break him apart. And they would just kind of rebuild themselves better. For me it was just kind of. I think I was 12 or 13 when I met him. And he just kind of made me realize like if you're going to do this, like you're already going to do it for the rest of your life. But like what are you. What are you going to do with it? And it would be. When you're at the right age, 14 or 15, he was like I think you're ready. And he'd go by you John Coltrane record or. You know, drop the right book on you, drop the right music on you. He was a trip, man. And we were on stage with him on his 70s birthday when he passed away. It was passed away at the Fox. Yeah, on stage, third song of the encore at the Fox Theatre. Just a total. Total intense moment. But his life was. I mean that's just a. Over the top. Just like biblical way to go out. But it's just. His life was even bigger than that. He was a total character. But somebody needs to do a proper book on movies. A movie for sure. A movie would be great. He was in Slingblade with Billy Bob. Was he really? He plays the songwriter genius in the band. It was just him being him. Wait, there's some great footage of him along the way. Yeah, one of a kind, that guy. Do they. I mean, music's changed so much that like. Is that a thing that could even exist anymore? You know, I wonder about that. Think about that with young musicians that are coming up. I mean, I even feel for myself. I was able to cut my teeth for 15 years on the road. Up to 300 shows a year at a certain point. And there may be where people taping it. But that's like tape traders. It's not like the next day you're on the internet. I mean, anyone. Literally, I brought up a band to my brother-in-law the other day. And he goes, "I think I saw them in nugs." Yeah, it's wild. And then he passed on to me. He's like, "I'm not a fan." And I was like, "But hold on. Hang on. That's just one of their. One show. Yeah. And so, yeah, I feel like things are supposed to. You're supposed to have a chance to pay your dues, cut your teeth. Maybe in front of a crowd, but not in front of the whole world. No, that's the whole thing. Not everyone's ready for prime time. Yeah, that's the whole beauty of doing stand-up the way I got to do it is. I did it for, you know, $1,300 a week at. For I do it, you know, what, probably 40 weeks a year. And no one was there. Yeah. And you learned. It's the best. And you learned. Yeah. And it's. I think I was more of an artist than than I am today. Yeah.
about that stuff too. I think about when we had time to even, we went through phases of, you're like, all right. Let's see how quick we can run out. People run out of the room. (laughing) We want to clear the room with music. - That's crazy. - How far out can we take this yet? So we can get people to start leaving. Or just like, how far can we push it musically? Just 'cause, you know, and when I was that young, you start out, you're playing one way out. You're playing almond brothers tunes. Then you become kind of a little bit of a freak show. And they're like, let's go see the kid play this. And so then when you start making your own music, maybe you start taking little turns. You're playing instrumental music. You're playing a cold train tune or a sun rot tune. And people are wanting to hear this other thing. And you start going, well, I think I'm just gonna, definitely not do the thing you're here to hear. - Definitely. - It's gonna so push against it. - So that became a huge part of it. - Can I tell you who I feel like is doing that now? And I have no shade. But I will say, I hope this comes out correctly. I really love the dude. My wife's, one of my wife's favorite artists, Storzel Simpson. - Yeah, totally. - Like he, and I know you know him. - We're the same birthday. Actually, we met the same time, me and you met. - Yeah, at Mexico concert. And I saw him at Red Rocks. And I have to say, everyone was cosplaying Yellowstone. Everyone had cowboy hats on. - It's incredible, yeah. - And belt buckles. - Yeah. - And he came out and new balance sneakers. - Yeah, no, he's a punk in the true sense of the word, in the best sense of the word. - In the best sense of the word. And I come, man, I'm a very bunch of people pleaser. When it comes to material, I want to make sure everyone has a good time. And I, maybe I'm not an artist. I don't, maybe I'm not, maybe I am whatever I am. But I love artists and I love that he came out and like, he looked like he was playing for like 10,000 maniacs. I mean, like, he didn't look like Sturgel Simpson in the way that people wanted it to look like. - Absolutely. - And by the way, he played, if he played a song, they wanted to hear, he played it a different way. - Like Bob Dylan style. - Yeah, and I enjoy it because I get it and I go, I hope that he's seeing what I see in this audience. And he's like, a lot of you are here because you saw me on dot, dot, dot. - Yeah. - And you think I represent your values. - Totally. - No, he's, yeah, he's somebody I admire greatly because of that, because he's fearless, man. He's like, he's gonna do what he's gonna do. - Yeah. - And come along for the ride, if you like, if not. But yeah, he's incredible that way. There's a saying you said, and I love this. I wish I had a band. Am I start a band just to have fucking people to play with? - He should. - I would love to have a band. Just have my family sit behind me and I tell stories about that. And it was based on the fact that all the Allman Brothers are gonna be buried in the same grave. - Yeah, wow. - In the same, in the same cemetery. - Just insane. - I've never even heard of anything like that. The fact that it's actually happening is really something. I mean, I was talking to, I was doing an interview, it's John Coltrane's 100th birthday or it would have been this year. So they were doing a documentary on him. And we were talking about that, like his great quartet was Elvin Jones and McCoy Tyner, Jimmy Garrison. And they had that thing that the Allman Brothers had where there's an interview with Elvin. He's like, to play the way we played together, you had to be willing to die with a motherfucker. And you're like, that's how they played. And that's how that original Allman Brothers was. And they weren't even necessarily friends at the end, but they're still getting buried together. Because that three year period was so profound for all of them that it was just like, that was it. Like they've stared right into the sun. And it was never gonna get any more intense than that. And it's a really wild thing. I remember when Greg passed away where at his funeral, which is at the same spot in downtown making that they had Duane Allman's 35 years before and ended up being a Paul Bear, which I wasn't expecting. We put him in. We get in the limo behind the Hearst and we're rolling down the road in between this spot and Rose Hill Cemetery. It's probably two miles. There were tens and tens of thousands of people along the road the whole way there. People just hanging out, listening to music. It was a wild scene. And you're like, this is an end of an era down here. Like this is like Duane's already in that gravesite. Greg's on his way. And like the reverence of that whole, like people came from miles around. I remember seeing footage of Muhammad Ali and Louisville when that happened. And you're just, for miles, there's just people along the road. And when I saw that for Greg and we were sitting in the limo behind Dickey and his son and Dickey looks at him. He's like, well, I guess it really meant something to some people. And you're like, yeah, man. It meant a lot. We're like, you don't really know until you know. But that was an intense day, man. Because it really did hit that, like this is the way I felt about it. I grew up in it. And it was this powerful to me. But you're like, oh, this is, it's hit a lot of people that way. So they were, they were different. And then you roll into that, that spot. And it's Duane and Barry Oakley, who died a year after Duane Ahman. And then now there's Greg. And then my uncle is there now. And then Greg and Duane's mother, her ashes are there. So it's a pretty intense sight. I can't think of any other, any other band that's done anything close to that. You know, those days when you just want to check out for a little while, you've had a long week, your home, you're finally ready to relax. And then you realize, oh, I'm out of stash. It's the worst. All of a sudden, you get back in the car driving the smoke shop, hoping that they have what you want, standing in line. It completely kills the vibe. Thankfully, we don't have to do that anymore. That's why I use everything for 20.com. They've got all your essentials in one place, legal THC flower, edibles, vapes, pre-rolls, concentrates, glass, accessories, pretty much everything you could need. Plus, they carry all the major brands you already know and love and trust. The best part is you can order everything online in just a couple of minutes. And it'll show up fast and discreetly right at your door, no driving around, no wasting time. 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It's like who cares? - Yeah. - But I also go, how do you not know who this is? - Yeah, how did you not dig back? - Aren't you interested in who's joke you're doing? - Yeah. - Because you're definitely borrowing that from somebody. - I'm watching a lot of young comics and I go, you're doing this, by the way, that's been done. And no one seems to care at this point. Everyone's like, it doesn't matter. Like back when Rogan and Mencilla, this is a very comedy in database ball. But Rogan and Mencilla had a big battle in heat. And some of the idiots online would be like, yeah, Mencilla's doing Bill Cosby, but he's doing it better. - Yeah. - And you're like, there's no doing it better. Bill Cosby wrote about this recently, the mencilla Rogan Bay. - The performance team going through it right now with tax evasion and allegedly, I don't want to get sued. But to me, it's a type of sacrilege that you don't, there was a comic performing with a shirt off on stage and he didn't follow me. And I went and I was like, that's fascinating. Like I wanted to say, like, you do know that I, I was the guy that did that right now. - I'm a, it's not my thing. You can have, everyone takes your shirt off, but like, how do you not, no one said something to you? - No, I think that's a, I think that's going through music right now and everywhere. People think they created the wheel and invented fire. - Which is not how it works. - It's so, I mean, I know, I would be shocked.
if anyone right now, I'd be shocked if anyone, I mean, look, I don't know who knows how to read music, but like, it doesn't seem like that is important. It seems like just doing this to a drum machine. - Yeah, yeah. I mean, you can sit in your room and do it all yourself, which is a wild thing. But I mean, I really feel like not knowing where it comes from or revering where it came from and given the proper paying your proper respects along the way. I mean, it's, if there's no roots, it gets top heavy and it's not gonna last all that long. - Wow. - You know, it's like, I was on the road as a kid and you're playing with some of your heroes and the whole time, you know exactly where you stand in this chain and you know that the best I can do is hold up my end of the bargain. Like, and then at some point, you get old enough and you hear people and you go, oh, wait, they're coppin' my shit. Like, I was always a youngest guy in the room forever 'cause I started so young and then at some point, you're definitely not. It's a weird feeling. But then you realize out, you know, that you feel like, all right, I've held up some part of the bargain because your heroes are, especially if you have the right heroes, they are the best that ever did it, you know. When you think about, I mean, and then what we were talking about earlier is like being able to cut your teeth and not have everything out there immediately. I remember being really liberating, we found this, like this old bootleg of Richard Pryor like in a club and it wasn't all that funny and I was like, holy shit. Like, that's like, yeah, it's like here in cold train when he wasn't good or something. You're like, oh, so everyone has to go through it. Everyone has to, like, you have to hone your craft. So yeah, I think that's lost on people that there is a curve to, you know, you don't come out of the gate that way. Some people do, but if that's a rare thing. Well, I did a show, I did a, I did two shows in this city. I won't say the city just, yeah, I did one. It was the, I guess the hockey arena, which was a ton of people and then one was a jump in set. Yeah. And for maybe 75 people and I bombed, I bombed, but it was jokes, I'd written the new jokes that I wanted to try. Yeah. And someone came up and said, that was rough to watch. And I was like, well, I can't even enjoy that. Yeah. Don't you want to see me try? Yeah. And another Colonel Bruce Hampton quote, he was like, he's like, I don't want to hear anybody that's good all the time. Like, then you're just lying to me. Yeah. He's like, there's certain musicians, like their grandmother can die or they could win the lottery. They play the same way. That's like, I want to, if you're having a bad day, it's okay to hear that a little bit. Well, and also it's like, I think that part of the joy, and I'm so curious about so many things. But there's so many nuances to your actual thing you do that fascinate me that I'll get to. But I'm so interested in the creation of it, of the like, how do you not repeat yourself? How do you not? Like, because that's where I'm at a little bit where I go, well, if I don't want to, like you said, when people come and they expect to see what they want to see, you don't want to let them down. But at the same time, how do you grow and try to do new stuff and make sure you're not doing what is the thing they came for so that you're not boring yourself? Yeah. I mean, we deal with that every night. And we have a 12 piece band. Okay, then stop right there. Let's, let's, let's, I got to get this question off of that call. Why not make it a 10 piece and save a little more? We, we, we, we think about it all this time. I mean, you know, I know what the overhead is. You have a 12 piece band. You have 12 people that tore to you, I'm sure. Yeah. Right. And I'm only guessing that based on the size of the, of the, of the semi, or the, all the crew buses. There's 20 something of us on the road. Okay. Sometimes. So there's a, you are a man of the people like you are. You are easily, you, you know, it's tedesky trucks. You only need two. That's true. I mean, luckily I grew up in Jacksonville, Florida, we bought our house in 1999. I'm there. And so, you know, we're like, we're going to, as long as we can keep the note paid. But we could, we could be doing other things for sure. You clearly, like, okay, so 12 I go, this is where I was like, and I'm just doing overhead. And this is where I'm so shallow, I was like, that's 12 people. You guys got to live in buses. I'm sure I'm going to stay in hotel rooms. I'm sure you guys have a fly up to me where the bus is. And then, and it's got to be you and, and Susan are the, are the band leaders. But I guess you are, but I guess both of us, both of you. And then, how confusing is that in, in your monitors to your 12 different instruments? Well, we may ensues in the front line, we, we don't use any monitors. We're like, old school, we're raw dog, but the horn section, a few of them and a few of the background singers use it. So ever we can eliminate a monitor blast and more sound, we, we tried to, but so you simply move around the stage to hear what people are doing. Yeah, and you have a monitor for vocals and other things, but I, for me, early on, and this is probably just from playing in clubs for so long and just blast and amps, like, I, when I hear it to any of your monitors, like, it's just, it pisses me off, it's really, so yeah. And then when, with my solo band, the last few years, the band was trying to use them. And everyone just, everyone played so differently. Like everyone, cause you get your mix exactly how you want to hear it and everyone starts playing soft and like it, like it just, everyone lost their edge and, and now I was like, you got to take those things out. Like this is, this is going to break up, I can't play like the drummers aren't quite hitting this hard and like, there's got to be, if it's improvisational music at all, there's got to be some struggle, there's got to be, you just have to have that and you have to have when it's time to go and you're putting your foot down and needs to feel like a freight train is about to run you over it. Like it's, it's probably not great for your hearing, but it's the occupational hazard. I've already chalked that one up. That's the ticket. Can I tell you just how to make extra money, a $5,000 ticket, right? Sit on stage. Sit on stage. It's powerful up there. And here what it sounds like. So, I mean, there's a fan of music, I love, I love specifically what you and Susan do, but what, that genre, I guess that was created technically by the almond brothers, is what everything I like. Yeah. I feel like it's southeast rock. It's like. Yeah, it is. You know, they were, they kind of, they started that whole thing. It was like a first interracial band in the southeast, like, I mean, that's, hang on. And that was, I mean, let's just, everyone stop because I think you hear that and you go, oh, that's cool. Yeah. That was not too long ago. 1969. 1969. Yeah. Yeah. That was hard. I was, I was about to be born in three years. My wife was already born. I feel like. No, it's like just a few days ago. It's crazy. Just a few days ago. It's crazy that that was like, that was not a thing. And you're talking about, that's when people openly shared their racialist views. Oh, yeah. Like, they were, they were club owners are like, oh, you didn't tell us, James was going to be here. Yeah. Like, they were like, they're like, well, where are you going to? You're guitar techs. Yeah, they were like, well, you're not playing tonight in the band because they, they were raw dog. They're like, well, where are you going to kick your ass? You got two choices or you can just pay us and we'll bounce. But this is happening. Like it's, they're, Jamo has some incredible stories, man. He's the last man standing from the original band, but he was an Otis Redding's band at 18. Otis Redding. There's, I really want to go through and this is like such a disturbance to this interview. But I could go through every artist you mentioned and go, can you tell me like, well, let's start with Otis Redding for me is such a tragedy. See, I think you only put out one album, right? Yeah, maybe, maybe a few, but his, he died in a plane crash. Yeah. And I think it was Cedar Lake, Iowa. Yeah. Yeah. And his, the Bar Cays, which is a great, great soul band, but he was just about to take off. I mean, if you, if you want to, if you want to enjoy a Sunday morning, get a cup of coffee, get your pool and play tenderness. It's the best. It's the best. I mean, you can't beat Otis. He's the best. And also making Georgia. Yeah. A lot of music from there. His widow. Can we make him recently? Yeah. It could use a revamp. The downtown area is not too bad if you go to two bars. It's an old southern town for sure. It really is. The crispy creams. Nice. If you drive just outside making, you're going to love there is an Otis museum, though. There is. And there's a bridge when you walk to it and they have a statue of Otis and it's just playing his music, which is kind of incredible. If you catch it on the right day, fall and make it. I drive through, I drive through making every now and then. And I lived at the making Coliseum. I lived at that hotel for like a month, two years and a half. Oh, yeah. I know that hotel. I know that hotel very well. And I actually said to myself, I can't imagine one day that I could be able to fill the making Coliseum. And then I filled it and I was like, it's the true. And I should have bigger gold. But I, that right by that hospital, right by that, I walked there every day. I drive by that so much now when I was living in Atlanta. Yeah. And I know that spot well. Like when that's where everyone stayed for Greg's funeral. That's where like that hotel right there by the Coliseum is pretty wild. Yeah. It, it is a strange thing when you, because we've been in this so long that.
You maybe had goals when you started that you blow past without even realizing it, you know? Michael, I'll tell you my, I really do find it absolutely insane that I'm sitting across from you because to know that I was just some college kid that dug music and was open to hearing about new things and then to see you as a child on stage and then I always go back to the idea that if someone grabbed me and said, pulled us a sign and said, one day he'll be sitting on your couch and you'll be talking to him about all the questions you want to ask. And I would be like, what are you talking about? And there'll be a lot of people listening to it. Yeah. It's insane. There's no way. Your brother, your brother freaked me out. I mean, your brother is like, I remember getting attacked. You know, widespread was like my, my introductory band. Yeah. I got a text from someone and they're like, heads up and your brother was wearing my vodka backwards playing drums for, um, for, for, for widespread and I went, what the fuck is this? And they're like, it's widespread. And I went, no, I know what it is. And I didn't realize he was my go between the right spread for a very long time until he did red rocks. He was like, he should come out. That's awesome. And I was like, I was so caught off guard, yeah, it's, it's a, it's a crazy thing. We get to, we get to live pretty surreal life. I mean, I was named after the Derek and the Domino's record. You were, that was came out in 1970, right? Yeah. Susan was born on the day the record came out, which is pretty wild. And so that, so we were in, we were in London doing Albert Hall for a few weeks on that Clapton tour. And my dad was going through some, some stuff at home, so I flew him out and we get there and Eric invite. He's like, why don't you bring the family out to like his, a state outside of London where he lived with Patty Boyd where he lived with Leila and my father is a ruffer from Jacksonville. I see he's sitting there having to you with Eric Clapton, like named his kid after that record. I'm thinking, how did this, how did this happen? You know what? It's what universe. I know there's one person going, wait, this is a great interview. I don't know who this guy is. But he didn't do any introduction, he plays guitar, I guess, he knows the almonds. So wait. Okay. So let's start. Let's do, and maybe I may have to move just to the front of the interview so that people know what I'm doing. So your, your uncle played drums for the almond brothers. Yeah. But your uncle is before your uncle, you're just regular people. Yeah. I mean, my dad, Ruffer and Jacksonville, Florida lights get cut off about once every three months. Like he was, they had a good time, but they raised this, they raised as well. I would not change it for anything, but it was not a, it was not a glamorous beginning. So that's, so your, your great, your great uncle was a pitcher, I know, yeah, uh, Virgil Trucks. Virgil Trucks. Yeah. And then, and then your uncle is in the almond brothers and then at a certain point someone realizes you can play the guitar pretty good. Yeah. So my dad had friends from that early era with my uncle and Jacksonville that were all musicians. And so my dad was in, into music, um, couldn't play at all. But, um, so when I got a guitar at nine years old, like at a garage sale, he, he showed me, he played, he, he played like enough to, to sing bread tunes to my mom, like growing up. And then, and then, uh, but that was it. And so I, in my days, that was every Rose Houses. Totally. I felt so many tits because of that one song. You only need one or two tunes, man, panty droppers. I can't imagine how much ass we would have gotten with you a Florida state. Hold on, hold on. I'm in my buddy. Derek coming in closes, deal for me. That's right. Oh, I'll meet you up. I know. Do you know Brian? I'm sick. Incredible. How belly is the first place I ever did stand up? Dude, that place is intense. It's gotten so much bigger. It's wild now. Keep going. So Jacksonville, Florida. I had to root for your, your, your, your uncle is in the band. You play guitar. So my dad realizes that I maybe had a talent for this. So he calls this guy that used to be in a band with my uncle's. A band called Trucks. And there's this great guitar player, Jim Graves. And he comes by and starts giving me lessons. And he's like, why don't you come, there's an open mic at this place called Applejax when she comes sit in. So I went and sat in with him. And that was just kind of the beginning. And then the next week I was playing with the blues band there. It was like a weekly gig. And then they asked me to, they were doing a show in Toronto, Toronto Jazz and Blues Festival. And then at like nine years old, you just kind of on the road every few weekends, just kind of popping up for a few tunes. And it just, it just kind of took off. But that small club was amazing. It was probably a hundred and 150 people. That's all John Lee Hooker there, Met Coco Taylor there at nine. Like, there was the rent, like the, the blues scene then was, they were playing for 50 people, like guys that were huge in the 60s. And then had careers after that, but the 80s were just a dead time, late 80s, early 90s. Music was not in a great state. So yeah, you see buddy guy in this club, you see those, those guys, so pretty intense. I got, I got lucky there that I was still around when there was just old, drizzled musical veterans playing and I got to cut my teeth with them. So that was kind of the beginning of it. That's crazy. And then, and then your brother's how much younger than you? He's 11, 12 years younger than you. Yeah. So by the time he's born, you're already in the business. Yeah. And me and my brother David named him. Are you serious? Yeah, I remember. I was like, because it was already, we had two D's, we're like, what about Dwayne? I was, Dwayne was my hero. So I guess we got to name my little brother. Wow. This episode is sponsored by Bluetooth guys. What do women want and need? I don't know when the vibe is right. A good, consensual, dick appointment never hurt. Be her rock with Bluetooth. They're sponsoring the podcast and sponsoring your bedroom performance. And with their new arousal boosting formula, you're going to get turned on mentally and hard, physically, bricked up in the brain, bricked up in the body. It's the best way to be when your brain is on and you're ready to perform. You bring the thunder. It's so much better than when you're like, ah, sure, I'll do it. Bluetooth Gold is better sex in a tablet. 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[email protected]/go/brt when your business is smarter with square. Get started today. This is a dumb question, but like you're born in, where we born in 79, so like I'm trying to think of the band that comes out that all your friends like that you as an artist have like the mock arena. The first time you heard the mock arena, were you like, I don't really, it doesn't, I don't respond to it. So by the time I was, yeah, middle school, all of that, that was, I remember. Limp biscuit. Yeah, vanilla ice was like a thing then. And I'm getting rides to high school with with my friends in the back seat. I have to listen to what they're listening to. I'm just,
It's early in the morning, and you're, I don't know, you're like, you're already a little sick. Yeah. It's filling ill. So that's stuff. I could not connect with my friends on music at that point. Really? Yeah. Because at that point, I'm, I'm listening to Hall and Wolf and Bobby Blandon. It's just like all blues and maybe Hendricks, but they even, then kids weren't listening to that either. Like Hendricks is like, old people shit too. Yeah. That's crazy. So I had to live a double life, like, and I would only play on weekends for the most part. Um, they kind of knew I would come and go, but they, no one cared. Like, I remember that show entertainment tonight. They, uh, they did a special where they flew down. They filmed me in middle school and they're, they're following me around school that day. And, and everyone was like, why are they following this nerd? Like, no one, like, no one knew I played. It's like, it was just, they just saw that, like, I wasn't around a weekend. They, I don't know what they thought, but it was, uh, so it was kind of really through high school. It was just kind of this secret life you lived on the side. Like it, and at that time, I'm, I'm getting to do incredible stuff. Like, I'm out, I'm out, like, for me, living my dream, I'm, you know, playing with my heroes and then you get back to school and everyone's like, could care less. I can't imagine playing this kind of a new album, driving the high school back then for a bunch of kids that are into vanilla ice. Yeah. No, I wouldn't, I wouldn't dare. I was trying to just fit in just enough. So what came first to chicken or the egg? Do you think, do you think there's a party that could have been regular? Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, like, do you think there's a, there's a party you that could have, like, had you never found that guitar? Yeah. And then Jacksonville, who knows how that would have turned out. Buddy. I mean, Jacksonville. I don't think people understand Jacksonville. It's not Florida, really. No, it's Georgia. It's Georgia. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's Florida. Yeah. So like, no one in Georgia would ever claim Jacksonville because they're Florida people. Yeah. No one in everyone's like, you ever, my wife's from Georgia and she does not like the fact that I'm from Florida. Yeah. And her whole family was like, but Jacksonville is so different than the rest of Florida. It totally is. And I love it. Like I, I mean, I still live there. Like I love it. But it, yeah, it's, it's, it's rough around the edges, which is why I love it. Yeah. I feel like a, I feel like there's a lot of soul there. And if, and if you find the right pockets, it's, it's just a beautiful place. And it, it doesn't feel like everywhere else. No. You can get dropped there and you're like, I'm pretty sure I'm somewhere in Jacksonville. And it's wide, man. It's like the largest area of any city in the United States. Like DuVal County is massive from end to end. It's like 70 miles, like, and it's just neighborhoods. But yeah, you, it's a, it is a, you can get in trouble. DuVal County. You get trouble there. Well, how are you in the Jags showed up? I was, I was young, but I was a football head. So I've been going since year one. Really? My dad had season tickets in the beginning and then we took it over. So we're, we are diehards. And funny enough, they, this is before our new season. And they, they flew my wife down to sing the kickoff party because Tom Kaufland original coach was from Boston College, and she was a big artist in Boston. So really? Yeah. My wife played the Jacksonville Jaguar kickoff party. I got a key to the city before I met her. Holy shit. And then she played this show down at spring and the blues as festival. She, she, she won this like battle of the bands with her first band. And like the big prize was like a little bit of cash and you get the headline, spring and the blues in Jacksonville. Like everyone's dream. So she, she plays there and it's the Jacks Beach. And I remember she, she was like, that place freaked me out. Like the crowd is insane. And they were, they were in their hotel room and all the bands had, um, it was overlooking the ocean, but the balconies connected. Said she was laying in bed and this woman came through her, like through her outdoor window, smoking a cigarette. I was like, oh, how do you sound? I'm so good. I knew Duane. Oh, she's smoking a cigarette. It seems like I am never coming back to the sound again. So we met. She tells me that story. I was like, oh, you're coming back, you're going to live there for 35 years. It's, it's pretty funny. Her, her origin story with, with our city is, she loves it now. Jacksonville is, uh, my favorite fact about Jacksonville is that was supposed to be Florida. That was what, uh, flag or stop Jacksonville was like, they called the first coast. Yeah. And they were like, he was like, this is Florida. Guys, this is where we'll be coming is Jacksonville. That's right. And one winner were all the orange trees exploded. That's right. And he was like, fuck this. I'm going to my him. I keep plowing a train kept going is Henry plant stopped in Jacksonville was like, it's got to be better. Stop. I've never read a land remembered. No. Oh, why? But you lost me at red. All right. Well, audio book. I'm not a reader. Dude, it is. I'm not a reader. And I also will never understand Johnny Coltrane. Like, there's like, no, but this is the most Florida book because it's about that time period. And it's just some, it's a hit family from Georgia that just starts making their way down. And it it paints this picture of Florida that did not know existed like right when people were just showing up. And it is incredible, man. I would I'm fascinated by all of Florida. I think as I get older, I listen to documentaries to go to sleep. And I listen to one on Collier County, just where Naples is for anyone listening. And the guy Collier came down and just bought, he was an advertising magnate and he just bought all of the county so that he could run it. Yeah. And then he did, but he never lived in Collier, kind of lived just outside it because he didn't want to live in the place that he was running. And that was a huge port. They were running straight from there to Cuba. Yeah. Yeah. And he, as a matter of fact, what he decided to do is because he wanted to have the other coast too. So he paid for the Tammy Amy Trail, the, what a bright above Tammy Amy Trail is now technically what alligator alley was for us. Yeah. But it was, it was the first rendition of it, which is an incredible road to drive because if you've never seen an alligator, they actually are there and they cross the street. They're massive. Yeah. They're massive. It's quite something. I tried, I used to do a bit, I never worked anywhere, but about how tough people from Florida are that we are the Australia of the United States. Yeah. That's true. We have so many things that could kill us there. Florida man's real. We have alligators in our backyard, babies, moms and, and if people aren't from there, they're like terrified. They're like, what? They're fine. Yeah. It's just an alligator. I mean, we, you don't name the big ones because you're like, if, if we have to get rid of her, I don't know. I don't want to have a relationship. My parents have alligators in my, in their, in their lake. Yeah. And you see their eyes. Yeah. And, and they have a flashlight. You can find them with their eyes. Oh, yeah. I mean, cottonmouse, rattlesnakes, uh, copperheads, you walk where you step. I said the other day I was not reaching for a hose. I said, I've never once casually reached for a hose. I never just put my hand into a cold up hose like, no, that's not something you would do. And I'm, and as my, as my entire life, I look where I step. Yeah, you have to. You have to look where you step. Yeah. My daughter, I list had the funniest thing. I don't, I never, can, I never can articulate how hard it made me laugh or how funny the moment was. And I think it was because of her eyes, the look on her eyes, but we were in, we were in Hawaii. And the guy was going off the trail and he was telling us stuff off the trail. And Isla was like panicking like her eye and she was like, isn't he worried about snakes? And I went, oh, they don't have snakes in Hawaii. I don't know how she said it. It made me laugh so hard she goes, well, that's all you need to know about these people. And, and I was like, that's it, like, she just defined all Hawaiians as like no wonder they're so relaxed. That's amazing. Relax, not soft. Yeah. Just relax. Yeah. That's incredible. That does change the way you go about your business. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, it's crazy to think that there were, there were animals and let's not even let we're just glancing past lightning and hurricanes and tornadoes and and Florida man. And Florida man. It's unreal. It is insane. You know, it's like I remember there was a, a woman Kimberley Kongden and she moved from Florida. She was like, and she casually said to me, and once again, I never do it justice, but she grew up in Florida and she goes, isn't it crazy like people get freaked out when you drink and drive here? And I was like, I was like, I know what you're saying. Don't say that to anyone else. I mean, I remember drive through liquor stores when I was a kid, those bars and you drive it and you're like six pack, just a handle of old granddad, I remember my parents grabbing those. I'm sure they were partying. The bar. You can drive through. It would be a barn. You can drive down the center of it. Totally. Like what do you need? It was ice cold in there. Oh, I mean, it's like, and my, my relationship with tobacco is strictly Florida. It's like I've someone's like, we ever chewed tobacco and I was like, yeah, freshman year car, I school. It's the first thing we did, started with Hawkins and moved our way into Copenhagen. It is kind of a right, a passage. Yeah. Others red man totems. I miss them so much. Absolutely. Levi Garrett. I miss tobacco more than out of all the things I missed. That was my favorite vice. I miss that one somehow. Did you smoke? What was your relationship with drugs and alcohol and everything? Early on, I was way more serious in the beginning. I never really smoked cigarettes. I mean, if drinking, I would smoke occasionally. Always enjoyed, like, always enjoyed good booze.
And I never would smoke weed or do any drug or drink before I played though. We've always had to be sober on stage. I'll have a beer on stage or like a sip of whiskey on stage, but that's not until we're like in it. But yeah, I've always, I always took that path. And then around a little before when I joined the almond brothers, maybe because their logo is a mushroom, I was like, well, I have to figure out what this is about. Yeah. And that's the only drug I would ever recommend to anyone. That's the only one. But again, nothing's for everybody, right? But when I got far enough into that gig, like a decade or so, and I felt like I knew the catalog inside and out, I was like, I could, I can eat a few caps of mushrooms and play this music. And me and Jaymo the drummer would, we would get into that. He called me, it was young blood, and then when I wasn't young, it was just blood. So now it's like, hey, blood tonight. Maybe they're not. I was like, I'll put a few on your floor top. Is it going to get about halfway into the show? Like you just feel, you're like, oh, we're getting to that place. I'd turn around and look and he would just, just big old grin, big old gut laugh. I was like, oh, yeah, we're there. So those were those were good times. I missed those days. How old were you when you started playing with the almond brothers? I think I joined, joined at night team, but I think the first gig I just turned 20 because it was Red Rocks. I think, I just saw the date, the other day we were there, like June 12th, June 13th. It was two shows at Red Rocks. I met Susan a month later, joined the almond brothers, and then Kofi was in my band for 20 years, joined like within a few weeks of that. So it was a pretty pivotal time. Wow. But I remember the first show at Red Rocks. I had done, I mean, I grew up listening to that music, but I had never bothered to learn all of it. When I got the gig, obviously dug in hard that all my homework, how does that, what's that look like doing your homework to learn the music to you? I mean, I was just listening to it. I wrote charts. I listened. I just dug into the arrangements. I wanted to make sure I, and then I would go back to the furthest back to the beginning of versions I could find, like original versions, versions with the way in if possible live versions, you know, but then that first show, we rehearsals were great to the first show. We get first set, pretty good, we get into the second set, it just, at some point it just goes, it's just going off the rails, like not a good way, and I just cannot figure out what is happening. And like, we get done with the show and it's just, you can just tell everyone's like, that woof. Even my dad has seen me since the first time I was on stage, he's like, what, what was that? Was that you? I was like, I wasn't me, man. I was like, then my uncle butch comes up, and he goes, well, now you know what I'm doing. You know what it's like to be on stage when Dickie Betz eats a bunch of peyote because that was his tradition at Red Rocks, was whenever they were Red Rocks, him and a few of the guys, some psychedelic, they would just, they would go in and it was either magic or what happened to me. But of course, like, it's a sold out show and everyone's like, it's got to be the kid. It's got to be that 20 year old thing, no one would suspect the original member. So that was a, that was my dip in the toe into the water in Red Rocks. So it took me a long time to decide that I was going to take that chance on stage. Wow. Our friends at Zippx toothpicks are back sponsoring the show, but now they've rebranded to Z-Pix, toothpicks. 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So last time I was there, they had your plaque up, I think is you sign fields up there. Yeah. I think, now, maybe it's widespread is up there. Warren's up there going up the government mules up there because he did New Year's there for years. Yeah. Yeah. And I said to myself, you know, it's interesting with my career, I was in such, I never made decisions. I just kind of listened to what everyone said and so they like, you know, you did this and now it's time to go to a bigger venue and it's such a sexier thing is to have played that. I mean, you easily could have just, you can easily just go in and just do the garden, make the money, make probably more money and then walk out that something about, there's something about that setting up shop. And you know, and that's one of the things that from playing with the almonds for so long that you learn, you're like, this is a special place. And then the, the relationship with the audience is totally different there. Like those, that audience knows, they know the great shows that have happened there. They expect a certain thing and they know that you're going to take chances there that you might not, if you're doing one show, if you're doing 10 nights and you're going to dig deep in the catalog, you're going to play stuff you've never played. I mean, I can think of, like some of my favorite nights ever in life and especially in music were on stage there. I mean, Clapton came out and said him with the almonds, which never happened. Like it, Dwayne played on the Layla record and Dwayne passed away and there was never really any connection out.
After that, so that was a pretty intense one. I remember, leave on Hell on stage. So we had three drummers, Taj Mahal. They were doing the wait. I just remember Greg singing this verse and then Taj, that was just epic stuff, man. Like just legendary shows at that place. And the audience was just, I mean, it's the best there. The last show we did with the almond brothers, which was everyone knew it was gonna be the last one. That standing ovation at the end of the night was one of the most intense things. And then the band came out front and it was a hardcore evening. But it felt like church in there, like on a good night. And the reason they set up shop there is 'cause it was the closest thing to the film or east once the film or it was torn down, which was their home when they played the beat and they're like, oh, this is it. So that's a special place. - Yeah. - Yeah, and it's almost all comedy now. Like there's not a lot of bands anymore. - No, well, I mean, it's really is set up wildly for concerts. - That's perfect. - It's a great comedy theater. - Yeah, it's perfect. - I just recently was like, I gotta figure out a new way to tour. 'Cause I don't, I'm not, I don't know, I just, I lost the, not lost. I just, I don't know, I just got disconnected from the routing, I think, that makes sense. - Man, so when COVID hit and we were forced to not tour, what's interesting, if I'm not mistaken, you'd toured your entire grown life. - Yeah. - And then right before COVID hit, you were like, I'm gonna take a little time off. - Yeah, we, we, we, we, we, we plan to be able to pay the band for half the year. - Yeah. - And it saved us from like, 'cause we had already prepped for that. - Yeah. - But we, no one prepped for 19 months, right? - You literally, you must have felt good one month then, you're like, I gotta be honest with you. - I really did. - You're like, I, how do we call that one? - Brilliant. - And then six months, you're like, okay. - No, and then it got tough, but then, and then we're like, uh, shit, like we're, we have a big overhead just sitting at home here with, you know, band, and we're trying to keep this thing together. And we're like, yeah, we're gonna have to start getting rid of some of these toys. (laughing) We're gonna, like, trim down. But it was a good exercise. And like, what's important to you? You know, what, what matters? But the one thing that it did do is it, I had never been home for that long ever. And not with our family or two kids, like, it was, it was an intense time, like, but incredible. But then when you start touring again, it feels different, like, 'cause you didn't know what it was like to not do that. And then you start seeing, oh, we're gonna be out for how long? That never, like, even registered with me. We just, we went. And so, we're trying to figure out that new relationship with touring now, you know, where, and none of us are getting any younger, it gets harder to tour and bang down the road and do what we're doing. So you're trying to figure out the ways to do that as an adult. (laughing) - My favorite touring ever was during the pandemic. I created outdoor touring as driving movie theaters. And I, that was my most connected to touring I've ever been, because I was at home. I had the same panic I got to get rid of things. I didn't, I didn't need to, but I didn't know. I didn't understand, I still don't understand money. - Yeah, I really don't. - Me neither. (laughing) - I luckily, our son is, he works at Fidelity's super smart. 'Cause he full ride, Florida State University. - You show 'em at the Florida State. - Oh yeah. - Oh, fucking hell, what is that? - Yeah, him and his wife, so, in front of-- - Oh, for real? - Yeah, so pretty, pretty amazing. I saw the Knowles thing on the way. - Oh yeah, yeah, I'm hardcore. - Yeah, in my Uncle Butch, he was, he was Knowles. - Really? - Yeah, lived there most of his life. And then he got a, he went back to school. I think in the '80s, for percussion and music. - Really? - And then opened up a studio there that, he, he was always kind of ahead of the curve to his detriment with business stuff. And he poured all this money into this incredible studio outside of Tallahassee. And then everyone was like, what major touring rock band is gonna like, yeah, let's roll the Tallahassee, like in the woods, like it just didn't work. So it, it went under, but then the university bought it and they still use it for their, their film school. - Oh really? - So yeah, Butch Trucks started that studio. - Oh, wow. - Yeah. - Um, I forgot what I was asking you about. How did we get to Florida State? - Touring? - Oh yeah, not understanding. - Oh, yeah. I mean, I, I feel like it's a strength almost. - Yeah. - Like because I panic, I panic about money. - Yeah. - I think people probably think I, I think when you make money, people think it changes you. I doesn't change you if you never knew money in the first place and you don't understand money. - Yeah. - And like to this day, I have no idea how much money I make and I don't know what's making money and what's not making money, I follow the thing that I like the most. - Yeah, yeah. And I'm similar that way. I mean, I definitely grew up in a situation where, I mean, I don't think my parents have ever had a credit card or shit, but I'm still the same. God bless them, they're great at a lot of other things, but this is not one of them. But so yeah, my relationship to, when I was first on the road, I mean, you went years, when you're playing clubs, there's no, you know, no one's making any money. You're just making enough to get to the next gig. Hopefully the band gets paid. And there are years of just like you live off of per-dem, once you're like a big enough operation to understand what that even is. (laughing) - I just found out I got to be in for my TV show. - Right, that's an exciting. - I go, wait, wait, where are you money? - And they're like, what do you need it for? And I was like, well hold on, it's funny, right? - I like having it. - Yeah, I, wait, who gets it? And they're like, your business manager. I go, give it to me, I want to blow it. Don't give it to him. - I remember when I first joined the almond brothers, I was still living on my parents' couch 'cause we were just traveling nonstop. And I had never made any cash. So I was, I had a guy that was working with me, this lawyer from Carolina. And so he, all the checks were just going to him. And for a good year or so, I didn't even check on it. 'Cause I was just like, I am killing it. I'm safe in every penny. Of course, that's like the one time you just get drained, like Leonard Cohen's, like I got taken to the cleaners. - Are you serious? - Oh yeah, like my first year and a half of salary from the almond brothers, like down to nothing. Like this dude got in some trouble, was living some double life and just writing checks himself. The state bureau of investigation gets involved in like 20 years old, 21, coming out interviewing me. They have some fun in Carolina. 'Cause I guess lawyers are famous for ripping people off. So there's a state fund. I got the maximum, they gave me 100 gay back, which didn't cover it, but I learned my lessons. I was like, oh, you have to, yeah. And I didn't have anything to lose yet. And so it was the right time. I was very lucky, 'cause I got dinged up hard, but it didn't affect anything. So it was pretty wild though. You're like, oh, you do have to pay attention some. - Oh, I would, my biggest fear is that I would get, that I would happen to me. 'Cause I go, I think I made all the money I'm ever gonna make. I don't think I'm making anymore. - But suddenly. - I think I was like, I hope, like it happened to Dane Cook. - Yeah. - Is he got his brother, his brother. - That's, yeah. It's always. - It's always somebody close. - I mean, just, and then they said, give us the money back, and you don't have to go to jail, and his brother's like, I'll just go to jail. - So I'm just gonna ride this out. - And then like, what he was like, I'm good. I'll keep the money in, go to jail. - Oh, that's incredible. - I mean, what a fucking, I mean, you know, Dwayne, or not Dwayne, Dane never really talked about it. - Yeah. - I think, if I'm not mistaken, Dane, I'm sorry if I, I won't even say anything, but I think Dane is about to publicly speak about it somewhere. He does, he, okay, okay, I thought he'd know if he told me that or he has a Netflix series coming out. - That's intense. - I mean, it's such a betrayal, but it's so easy to do to guys like us because we don't care. - Yeah. - It's not why you're in it. - It's not why I'm in it. I love money. - Yeah. - I love money. What was, I had a, I never really had, I've always enjoyed Fame, I've always thought it was really fun. And recently, I've noticed that it's, and maybe I never paid attention to it before, but it really is encroaching on private space. - Yeah, yeah, that, that sneaks up on you. - Yeah. - I mean, I think in some ways, me and Sue are really lucky because we're kind of in that sweet spot where it's not, depending on where you are, people will come up and say hi and get, get in your grill a little bit. - I did that to you. - But the most part is people that like really, the music means something. And so it's respectful and it feels honest and legit. It's not, like Fame when it gets to a point where people, they just know who you are and they don't even know why. Like that's, that I would, that would be tough. (laughs) - Yeah, yeah. I mean, yeah, I just recently have noticed that like there's certain things you can give up really. And like privacy, even with like doctors, it, - Yes, absolutely. So it's a wild thing. - It really is. - By the way, we're back in the show. I wish we could share what we just shared. It was the most vulnerable celebrity, god's, celebrity, get. - Definitely. - If you wanna talk about fucking, (laughs) so what bands came out when you are,
say like 20 to 27, which I'm guessing is like college age. But what bands came out that you went, ooh, I like that a lot. And because you are like the fact that you say names that I know that I'm like, I know them, but I know I never really listened to Coltrane. And I know that that is like a very pivotal. And I wanna talk about the Coltrane. So I wrote this song down that you got. But like I wanna know like, like when Dave Matthew shows up and you're like 25, or do you probably 20, I'm guessing? - Yeah. - When Dave Matthew shows up. Do you hear it differently than I heard it? Do you, and I all respect Dave Matthews. I don't wanna, like do you hear like tricks and go, oh, I know what he's doing, 'cause Dave's a brilliant musician. - Yeah. - And but he's also, he's not someone that ignored the people before him. - Yeah. - No, I mean, I love what a lot of those bands did. I was such a music snob at that point. And so like down, just multiple rabbit holes that there wasn't a lot of stuff that was contemporary that was all that interesting. Like, and I respect them and some of them. But then, you know, there were a little later on, bands like The Wood Brothers and groups like that that I loved, or bands we'd run into on the road, like Los Lobos, which I think is one of the great, unsung American rock bands. And they're 50 years into it and it's still just burning it down. - Los Lobos. Los Lobos was a band I found in college that I was like, I was like, well, it's a Mexican jam band. - From East Los Angeles. - Yeah. - And that's crazy to say Los Lobos. I just thought about them last night. - 'Cause we toured with them a few times. And we had such a blast on the road with those guys that we were like, we got to run this back. We got to do it again. Like days off, cookouts down the days off. And they're just salty there as people, but have seen more than anybody. And so they, two of those guys met at an almond brother shoot with a whiskey a go-go and they had Polaroids with their kids. Like, yeah. - Really? - Yeah. But they, they did a thing like they were fearless. And we talked about Sturgel earlier, like just being able to pivot, just like following their muse, not caring what anyone thinks. They, you know, La Bamba came out. And like that, like the biggest song in the world. They had the number one song in the world. And they followed it up with just like this, esoteric, just rock record. Kiko, which is just incredible. But it was, it's not what the label wanted them to do. They're just middle finger. Like, no, this is what we're doing. And they, they're a fearless band, incredible. So much fun. - Did you ever have like an internally like pivot where you're like, I'm really getting into. 'Cause I know you're into and I'm curious. Not, not why. I'm curious. Like what would be the, the step for the average listener right now to go to, but I know you're really into like, the Indian, is it Sitar? - The, the Sarod, which is like the brother to the Sitar. - And so what is it about that, that you're, that, that you dig? And what would be the, what would be the album that the average person listening right now could buy and then go, well, that is fucking cool. - Well, with that instrument in particular, it's just, I think it's my favorite sound of any instrument. And then like the stories behind some of these musicians, like Ali Akbar Khan is the guy for Indian Classical for me. And like his father was one of the last like, proper court musicians for like Rajan and they were, you lived music 24/7. Like you, he was like, I've had friends over, like I need you to write me a piece for tomorrow night. And this is what you did. So this was like the greatest musician and he passed us down to his son. And stuff that would seem way over the top by today's standards, like making your son practice for 14 hours a day for 20 years. Like just, but what that does is that you turn into Tiger Woods. - Yeah. - But Ali Akbar Khan, his music is just, it's incredible. He started a school in Northern California in like the late 60s. He's the first one that brought Indian Classical to the United States. But the sound of his instrument is just, it's one of the most pure things. And his whole thing was like, this is not entertainment. This is not like, this is, this is how you get closer to God. Like this bike, this like his whole, and that was Cole Train's thing too. It was very, it was a very spiritual pursuit and it wasn't, it wasn't all this other stuff. And so whenever I need a hard reset, those are the places I go. Ali Akbar Khan's son came out the other night in Berkeley and he plays, and he's got the thing, man. And it was, it was really intense moment because you're in the middle of the Greek theater. I don't know, five, 10,000 people. So Rock Show. And then he comes out with a serode and we bring it down to a whisper and the place just goes like dead silent. And he plays the most incredible stuff. Like it really stops time for a minute. But his father's one record that came out, I think in the early-- - You're getting it right now, go ahead. - So it's, it's just signature series volume two. And it's Ali Akbar Khan, A-L-I, A-K-B-A-R, K-E-G. - I got, I got Whiskey Myers the last album I've had. Ali, A-L-I. - Yeah, and then A-K-B-A-R, three words. - Ali Akbar. - Khan. - I said, of course. - But he's, he's quite something. - And it's called, it's called-- - Like signature series volume two, I think is probably the one. - Jesus, he's, yeah, volume five, volume six. - Yeah, there's a million. - There's a bunch, holy shit. - Yeah, it's intense, it's no joke. - I'm just getting essential. - That's such a great thing on Apple. I'm still an Apple music. - I am too. - I'm like, I'm such an old man. - It took me a while to have Spotify, but I'm just against it and principal for so long. - Yeah, my body released it. We should play Pat McAfee's album and have you break it down to the movie thing. - It's incredible. - It was so funny. It's like, I, I don't know the right way to say this. So I played it and it's way better than I thought Pat McAfee would ever be. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - I mean, that would love. I hope Pat sees this. - Yeah, yeah. - I texted Pat and I was like, well, this is really great. It's very Pat and you know, and then, and then you listen to music and you realize music competes with all music. - Yeah. - And you're like, well, wow, this is really hard to put up against the Beatles or like Eric Clapton or the Almond Brothers or Tadesky Trucks or like it's widespread panic or Wilcoe or name insert band here. When you put out music, you're competing against all music and the field is huge. - Yeah, and it's wider than ever, right? - Yeah, and then when you look at comedy, you're not competing against that much. It really aren't and that's the crazy thing is I feel like comedy is genuinely such a new art form and that it really was started in the past 30s to now. But what we know is traditional comedy, my person I was listening to it with was like, well, as we had this conversation and I played songs where I was like, I was like, it also competes with this and it's such a, it's almost, you should applaud anyone that puts out an album 'cause you're like, wait until you're high in the ring. - Yeah, no, it's a brave thing to do and it's hard for a lot of people to like certain musicians who'll put out a record have a certain amount of success and then they're just paralyzed by it 'cause then you're like, what's the next thing? And it has to live up to what you did and does that whole thing if you have your whole life to write your first record in like a year to do your second play. And so it's hard to like, it's hard to live up to your own standards sometimes. But I feel like you just have to be willing to cut these things loose and then people are gonna react the way they're gonna react and then you move on. And even though you are competing against other things and some ways you're not, like if it moved somebody, then it does and if it doesn't, what are you gonna do about it like you, you have to just be able to kind of plow down the road and keep rolling. But you do wanna, I mean, if you're at it long enough, you do wanna leave a few moments, songs or records along the way that you hope stick with people or that mean something to people or that affect people. I think that's one of the things you hope for. - Well, that's what I said to you is that like, with comedy, I understand what I do. I understand kind of what I do is you allow people to disappear from their problem and just giggle for a little bit. - Yeah. - And that's really, I really do find it important. What's crazy about what you do is, I don't know, I wonder if you see it the way I see it 'cause I don't know if you, I don't know if, what I get from what you do is what you mean to do. I really think clean. Like when you play, I watch you and then I write in my head, I write and I think I'm closest to my dream state where I'm not attached to anything. - Absolutely. - And I think it's really beautiful. When your wife sings, I am near-brought to tears. And I feel like I'm probably closest with like, I mean, she's just got such a powerful voice. Could you have fallen in love with someone who didn't like music the way you like it? - I don't know, actually, I mean, probably, but it was a big part of it. - Yeah.
I remember that you guys met yeah and in the time that we met I remember I had just got an out of a relationship few months before I met Sue and I was out on the road with my solo band. I was like this is really fun being single on the road. I was like never again I was like unless I meet somebody that's listening to me. Hell you jackson and I just had this impossible list of music. I was just such an asshole list of music and then I met Susan and out like this is back in the day where you have this these huge CD books like 96 discs in the folders. Whoa. What a crazy moment. Hold on stop. No one knows what you're talking about. There was like a you would have like a trapper keeper. A hundred percent. At what? case logic. And you would flip through it and you could see who you were dating. Yes. You get the coringo. Wow. Ace of Ace, huh? Totally. So so we're on we're on one of the tour buses and flipping through these discs and I'm like oh I think I stepped in it. I remember calling my band John Rico or old drummer who since passed away I was like man I think I might be in trouble. And so another funny story from that that tour. Her solo band at the time was a double trouble Stevie Ray Vaughan's old band the room section and they knew Greg from the like the hard party and days like the hard party and days and I was on a bus with Greg Almond and Oteel. And uh Jesus Christ. So they would not let Sue come right on the bus or like hang out on the Greg Almond bus because they just thought it was like to generate party. But that's just you Oteel and Greg Almond. Yeah and Kirk West was one of the road managers and and so but that bus at that point Greg's like plain and sober. He's got a little toy poodle and like it's just it's not a party at all. It was boring as fun. We had a good time, good conversation. But so I had to win over Susan's band like I had to like court her through double trouble so I could hang out with her. They were just not having it. But I appreciate it that they were looking out for. At so point I wonder if my wife's got my wife's got good. Let me just say good music taste. Although she's going through a while a lot. That's more of a set place. But I said to myself my wife saying Mark Noffler, uh, Dyer Straits. Yeah. I started playing it one morning and my wife knew all the words to uh I think it was uh money for nothing. Yeah. And I thought to myself I couldn't be married to woman. It didn't know. This is gonna work out. Mark Noffler. What do you like I'm curious? You've been on the list of 100 greatest guitarists of all time. Probably you're in tire life. What do you think about other guitarists? Like what did you think about Eric Clapton? I mean Eric for me was one of the first touchstones you know. So that I mean he was was like being yeah. That's why I started playing was I felt the same way when I first met Greg and those guys like these are mythical characters. You took a minute to adjust where you could feel comfortable being in a room and not feeling like oh that's that guy. We felt that about norm. McDonald. Oh yeah. A little bit like he has that presence. He is the best. He was so funny. I feel like Bill Hicks would have been my guy. Bill Hicks was. I mean I would have loved to have met Bill Hicks. Yeah. Bill Hicks was the first one. You know when you talk about the way when you talk about music I feel like that's the way I found comedy. Yeah. As when I found comedy I went well now it's time to dive deep and figure out what all these guys did and I remember listening to a Dick Gregory album driving across alligator alley yeah and driving from the last time I want to say the last time I did coke. I know I did it since then but like we were in we were in the West Palm Beach for New Year's Eve and I bought this all these albums so I was really that's why I was turning 20 I just turned 26 and I was like I'm gonna get on stage a hundred times this year all right goals every birthday I have and I was like I'm gonna get on stage a hundred times and I was like I'm gonna be obsessed with comedy this is my thing is it there's all to do and I listen to a Dick Gregory album and I was like and I was like whoa and Bill Hicks was one of those ones who I was like I got all those albums so comedy and a key a key of E minor or whatever. Rantney minor. E Rantney minor. Arizona Bay. Yeah. I bought all those records. So we I had a bill was one of those where like certain musicians do this thing where you're like you you would never the same after you hear Bill Hicks like he was he was one of those guys and Sue Sue has been good friends with Willie Nelson and his family for a long time and now I was coming home from a tour in Japan with my solo band and she was meeting me no we were playing Hawaii on the way back and she's meeting me in Hawaii and she's like yeah I'm gonna pick you up we're gonna stay with some friends and I was like I'm I'm gonna be jet lagged I'd like to just go to a hotel say trust me so we get there and it's Sue and this and this really nice lady and they drive me to the house and and her name is Annie she's like if you just want to get some rest go ahead I have no idea where I am I wake up in the middle of the night jet lag just walk out in this house and it's we're in Maui I see the beach and then Willie Nelson just comes wander now do I've never met no idea I'm at his home and it is like kind of you know can I get you some breakfast Erica I was like that'd be great Willie Nelson just the sweetest man make you feel like you're at home he had this gambling then next to his house called Django's Orchid Lounge it's like this old like Orchid growing a barn that he turned into like his man cave just incredible like a poker table and dominoes and chess and Willie as sharp as a tack he will like playing cards with that dude as serious business yeah he's no joke but at some point we're there for three or four days and I knew he lived in Austin and I was like did you know Bill Hicks like you because I figured Willie's politics and Bill Hicks like they would just be right in line and and he's like no I'm not familiar with him and I was like oh we got I got to play some of his stuff so I'm I'm there with Willie is wife and one of his kids and Bill's stuff gets like pretty raw oh yeah if you pick the wrong track and so I was like brand knee-mine I was I think that's one of my favorite records they they pull it up online and they just see this one track it just says save Willie and they just click on it click and immediately I go like white like oh shit I think I know what's coming and Bill Hicks saying any artist that if you if you if you do ads or you do any of that this is about he's like you are off the artistic roll girl period like you and a story he's like except Willie knows that and then he goes on this rant about Willie he's like this dude was so high he forgot to pay taxes for 15 years he's doing these Taco Bell ads and he's just cheering into Willie and I've been Willie tells I've known him for like 48 hours and I'm thinking does he like he think like this is me being a smart like check this guy and so like that thing ends and I it's it's like maybe the most stressed I've ever been like pass out standing and then afterwards Willie's just he's gut laughing and we see him six months later he's like man I've been listening to Bill and I was like so we're cool right but that's not me trying to fucking be a smart ass I promise oh that's so great for you epic but yeah if you go listen that uh that Bill Hicks track and then think about listen to that with Willie oh my god all right we got our clip we got a clip about the Bill Hicks sucking Satan's cock totally the rush limbaugh clip oh my god uh that is fucking hysterical I'll tell you the best thing what Willie Nelson ever did is his son Lucas yeah we're on tour with him now he is the sweetest yeah fucking guy there's like you know there's very few people that uh that you meet that hat like first of all there's no pretense there's no he doesn't he's just a regular person yeah really honestly very talented yeah and uh I'm not a sober guy and I but if I'm not drinking I'm you know I don't know and I'm not and I get turned off by sober people sometimes yeah they rub me the wrong way because it's a little preachy also very Bill Hicks when he's talking about non-smokers he's like I would stop smoke if I wouldn't turn into one yeah the most annoying son's eventually just preaching about it but uh Lucas doesn't party and yeah and he but he's okay but he just yeah and by the way he just casually was like did not that so nice about it yeah but like and also caring and like because I wasn't drinking I think when I was with him yeah and he was like you know not not like he just was talking to me like a regular person yeah and saying hey if you ever want to talk like it was the sweetest yeah I he's very intentional that way yeah yeah we we've been out on the road with him for the last few weeks we played San Diego with him last now I think he's flying out here soon to go be back on the road with his dad is what 93 now pretty hardcore yeah and so he he shows up and and whenever his pops once them on the road and needs him he's there him and his brother Micah pretty incredible but what what a lineage man really I mean your lineage is pretty fucking insane I mean you know I mean lineage is in music are pretty cool yeah it's uh but what families got you think got the craziest musical lineage that's a tough one man I mean we were talking about Ali Akbar Khan earlier it goes back like a thousand years in their family music crazy smoke weed
right now. My brain is not a super safe place. And so like I can all I can say when I have panic attacks is like, thank God, it didn't smoke weed tonight. Yeah. It's almost, I almost think that my brain is better on weed because then I go, well, at least I know this is a drug right now. Totally. And I know this will go away. But when you're sober and you're going through one, you're like, this is real. Yeah. Yeah. I hear you. I mean, I wish. I mean, it's like, you know, being on the road, like I see why it spins people out. Like you could, I mean, you're going through that and you're what in the middle of an eight hour bus drive and you're bunk. Like that'll spin your ass out. My first sober panic attack ever. And I mean, I had them when I was chill out as a child, but like my first sober one, I was, I was not partying and I was on tour. And I was in my bus. And I was and and I realized I was having, I figured my throat was closing. And I was like, well, it's crazy. I wonder what I took today. And I was like, nothing. Yeah. And then I went, oh, this is a panic attack. And then I went, oh, I'm going to make a drink. And then I was like, I'm not drinking right now. Yeah. And then I was like, wait, I'm going to take a pill. I was like, oh, wait, I'm not doing anything. And I was like, I got to deal with this. And I just sat there and dealt with it. Yeah. And I was like, this fucking sucks. Yeah. And then I, I'm ready to get done with them. They were, I had, I had the part of the worst one of my life two nights ago. Like then I've, then I've ever had my entire life. And if I told you, if I told you what it was about, you would laugh absolutely, hysterically. I'm thinking about doing it on stage. Yeah. But it's, but it's never what it's about, right? It's like it's, it's just, it's the feedback loop of, it's this feedback loop of like, yeah. I mean, I, I can't even, it's so fucking ridiculous that when I told, I couldn't tell my wife what it was. Yeah. She wouldn't, she wouldn't, you know what it is, she told you. I couldn't remember how to y'all. That's a trend. And I felt like I had a y'all, but I didn't know how to do it. You think I think I'm broken. This is it. So bad. And I was in the bathroom going like, and like, googled how to y'all. They have some good advice. Get bored. Like I'm trying to stress out to be bored. My hands are sweating right now. And I'm like, that's incredible. I was like, are there any tips on yawning? It's like, watch other people y'all. But then you're like, this has to be the first time this has ever happened to anyone. I call my sister the next day. I'm like, do you mean Santa? Because it kept going. It happened for like 30 hours. That's incredible. 30 hours of, like, I'm here. Are you okay? I'm not. And then when I told my wife, she was, I mean, this is very real. She had to, like, she took me to the front yard at 2 in the morning and had me walking in a blanket and going, okay, this isn't real. Tell me what's real. And I was like, this is real. But this non y'all is also real. I can't do it. What if I never y'all again? I consigned myself to life. No, whatever, no, whatever, things about how I think we should. It's incredible. And then I'd start to y'all and I'd go, like, here it comes. And I go, don't think about it. I fucking bailed me on. Oh, man. It's got to be a pill for that. I was like, it was like, what was it? And then I told my sister, and my sister goes, I think this may run in our family. I was going to say it's in a red it's airy. I'm like, oh, why? She goes, at least your tongue's not too big for your mouth. What? Because my tongue is too big for my mouth. She, my tongue doesn't fit my mouth. I can't think about my tongue. I'm like, I'm too busy dealing with yawning. That's incredible. Tongue reduction. My sister called this my other sister by driving to the fucking ear nose and throw a kite to see about my yawning. I'm going to tell you, you know, I'm looking yours and I'm going to go, I'll tell you what I will tell you. You have a dog ear stuck on your eardrum and I was like, I do? Can we get it out? Because I can't. You'll be fucked with it. So no, I know there's a dog ear in this eardrum. I call my sister to tell her, and she goes, well, and he's smiling out. I go, well, my middle sister, he was running there. And she thinks she's having an anger. And I said, why does her hair hurt on her right side? Her hair. I mean, I can't tell you is like, so I can't smoke weed tonight because I don't want to eat y'all. I'm going to say for it, I'm not smoked tonight. I can't, and what sucks is I haven't been partying. And so I was like, I just want to start partying. It didn't happen when I was partying. I was like, I cannot wait to go to the show tonight and drink and have a beer and just go, I can't do it now. I hope it happens for you. I'm waiting. I'm waiting passionately. If I heard you yell, I'm going to know why. You be shocked how much you've noticed people yawn when you're not yawning. Like my dog's yawning, my daughter's yawn. You definitely notice if you're on stage in somebody else. It's personal at that point. But for you, it won't be, I'll know it was. If I begin, you'll be like, oh, no, you're like, let me slow it down. It's like dreadable. Oh, get bored. I'm, yeah, get bored. And I was like, and they're like, open your mouth and say the word leather. And I was like, leather, leather, not working. Doesn't work. And then, so any tips on the dog hair? I have no idea. I was like, so now I just take a shower. I was like, what? And he was put water in the air and pull it out. I was like, got it. And then I drove. And then he was like, that's probably just making you dizzy. So I've been dizzy lately. So I have a dog here on hair on the inner, I mean, life fucking sucks. It doesn't mess around, man. Yeah, it doesn't mess around. I remember we were cleaning out some stuff in the studio not long ago. And I found this birthday card from my uncle who since passed. And now it said, and when I got this card at the time, I was young enough where it didn't mean anything to me. I read it now. And it said, it said, in the words of Reson Roland Kirk, who was an avant-garde jazz did, it said, in the words of Reson Roland Kirk, it ain't going to get no lighter. Love Uncle Bush. And I was like, at the time, I was like, ha, but it doesn't get any easier, man. It keeps coming. Life keeps coming. It's funny. Sometimes you have a, when you're having a really good day, those are when, that's what I get worried. You're like, what's like the shoes, what are the shoes about to drop? My God. It's, it's, it's crazy how, you know, and then the idea that someone would ever criticize an album or comedy or anything you do knowing that someone's dealing with whatever their silly thing is. Yeah. And then they can take them out of it. It's so, it's, it's so beyond me. Can you talk to me about Johnny Coltrane and the, and this, like his, okay, because I would like to, like there's a band I got into that I got, I told you about Wilcoe. So Wilcoe was the first band I discovered that, you know, like when, when I saw you, I got into you because someone said you got to see Derek Trucks. You were a still a kid. I got in a car with these guys. And we drove to see you. And I was like, wow, this is pretty incredible. I think then I started going, I'm going to, I'm going to follow government. Mule. I knew that everything was kind of, I then, I then was, I was introduced to fish. Yeah. I would never understand how brilliant fish is. If someone had said, check this out. Yeah. And then, um, and that's when I got into Wilcoe was because of that. And then I got into another band, Goose, because of, they were playing the, they were playing the Red Rocks the night after me. And that was the band I could go watch. So I had a year to get into them. Yeah. So I got into Goose. It's fun to get into a band. But what's really cool is when someone says, I, this is the guy. And Johnny Coltrane seems to be that for you a little bit. Yeah. And you said, I, and I, I, the sexiest thing I've ever heard anyone say is like, I remember the, the night I got it. Yeah. And what is that album and what is that song and what is that, what is that that I'm missing? Well, his catalog is pretty wide. And he went through a lot of periods. Like, we talk about star joy, he's just like just peel on your skin.
you're a new artist, like over and over. So with him, I guess it's kind of finding what hits you at the right time. There's one record called live at Birdland. There's a tune called Afro Blue. And that one, you'll understand the intensity of the band. It sounds like for me, it's like the almond brothers whip and post that film or East, like it's just blazing. They sound like their hair is on fire. Like the drummer, Elvin Jones is just dropping bombs, McCoy, Tiner. But there's this moment, three or four minutes in, where the piano solos and it'll feel like it's going on for a long time. But it starts building up. This intensity builds up. And Coltrane comes in on playing soprano sax. And it's one of the most intense 10, 20 seconds of music ever. It sounds like a martial amp. It's about to blow up. Like it's just, it's fire, straight. Like, so I think that one would move you the my favorite things record. Like just that melody. Yeah. Pretty incredible. He did a ballad record when everyone was like, Oh, that's all this dude can play as like out. And then he just dropped the most beautiful ballad records of all time. Just because he could. I think those three are probably good ones to jump in. If you should have a podcast. No, I'm being serious because because just like your knowledge of music, your knowledge of the greats and your knowledge of like what people should know about music. So this kind of bizarre that we get in the music, it seems like a lot of people seem to get in the music right when they start listening music and never go backwards. Yeah. I got lucky enough to be born in Florida. So I think there was no way you weren't going to catch everything. Yeah. And again, it's running into the right people at the right time. Like, and I was always, I would always ask when I'd meet heroes or musicians that I looked up to, like what? What are the three records that change your thing? Or like what? And you'd get some pretty amazing tips along the way. But Colonel Bruce again going back to him. He was always, he was always nudging you in these directions. And then it's fun to try to listen back to the very beginning because you, when you hear certain artists, you hear Hendrix and you go, Oh, Albert King came from Hendrix or Hendrix came from Albert King. He tried to dig back as far as you can go. Like, well, where did he get it from? And then at a certain point, it just the recorded record stops, right? Like the 30s or 40s as far back as you can go. The coolest thing ever, you, I remember, I don't know where I heard you say this. I don't know where. I heard you say this. That Paul Allen bought Hendrix's catalog. He bought his record collection. Will you say it? Yeah. So, yeah. So Paul from Hendrix's apartment in London where he, like this last place, he, he bought his record collection, the whole set up. And then he had somebody at it in his team put every record under a microscope and look at which albums had the most wear, which tracks on which album that the most wear and put it in an Excel spreadsheet. And he sent it to me and you look through it and you go, that's like most of it was exactly what you would think. But then there was like a few classical records in there. Him holds like a symphony of the planets was one of them. There was a Robbie Shankar record. There was some Indian classical. There was a lot of Bob Dylan. There was a lot of Beatles. There was a lot of Albert King. It was like, but it was, it was really fascinating. You're like, "Oh, this is what Hendrix was getting high." Listen to it. It was pretty badass. Yeah. And then I thought, because I love Paul. I got to know Paul pretty well. And it was a great guy. I was like, that's what you do with crazy money. I mean, you also map the human genome and you do all the great things he did. But that would be a fun side project. I'd be curious. What's your top 25 most played on Apple on Apple Music? You know how you can go to like your, yeah, this is going to make you sad. You ready? I'm going to do mine. If you go to, if you go to playlists and it goes top rated, no, recent, top 25 most played. Yeah. I'm not going to, I'm not even going to see what it is. I'm going to hit, I'm going to hit play. I'm not looking at what it is. This is my most played song. You ready? You know what this is? You know what it is? You never heard this song. It's early almond brothers. Are you serious? I swear, man, I have huge gaps in the record. Hold on. They're from Florida. Oh, are they? Yeah. I don't know the word time and time again. Yeah, yeah. Creed? Yeah, it's having a new of them, but I don't. Obviously. I swear. So this is Mark Tramani. I was in a band with Mark Tramani. Yeah. Okay. So now we'd love to hear a year of take on this guitar. Here we go. Let's hang on. All right. Here Mark Tramani. Ready? I mean, that's satisfying. That's a good time. Junkie. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, of course I know this dude. Yeah. All right. Here you go. Is that good? Is that good? He wrote this when he was like 22. No, you're killing it. Air guitar champion. I know this song a lot. This song fire has been the fuck up. They were telling me the same time I was at Florida State. Okay. That's that's number one on my okay. I got hang on one second. I got a show that I have some musical taste. Okay. By the way, if you enjoyed that very much, by the way, but I have to create definitely cannot have told you what it was. That's crazy. Okay. This is another song. I just want to show you that I have some taste. I got a look. Hold on. Do you know this is? Oh, yeah. Oh, that's beautiful. Oh, that's that's cruising. I have no, I fucked my voice up. I'd be curious when you listen to when you listen to music when you get on a plane. I mean, it all depends I go down just different, different rabbit holes lately. It's been like old Jamaican music. Just like Lee Scratch Perry era just for for the groove of it. Can I tell you what I just got into was Jamaican. I wanted to find out the beginning of Scott. Yeah. Yeah. That's stuff's incredible. Yeah. It really is that same stuff. And then there's this record we were on tour with Ziggy Marley last year and his drummer, his name is Santa Davis, Carlton, Santa Davis. He was he played on a few Bob records. He was he was with Peter Tosh when he got shot up. He has a bullet in him from that. But it's just the most beautiful chill human being. He sat in with us a few times and it was one of those things where you're watching somebody play and it looks like the simplest thing you've ever seen. But somehow like the colors in the room have shifted like his groove was so deep and unique, but not complicated. And you're just like, how was how does this feel so different? Leave on helm did that too. Like he just he played so simply. Yeah. But it just no one can make you feel the way he did. But he Carlton Davis that drummer, he he turned me on to that bunny wailer record called Blackheart Man, which has made the same year as the first Bob solo record. And it's it's basically the the wailers and backing up bunny instead of instead of Bob. But it's an incredible record from that era, which is kind of a lost record. Yeah. But I think for the for those rostas, that's like one of the touchstones. I would love would you buy and playing something? I can try. Yeah. A little something. And then real quick, scroll back. I want to you your my daughter's obsessed with Sierra for L right now. Yeah. She's she's she's actually my wife's playlist. Sierra for L is high on the list. We listen that record a lot. It's a great I don't know. My daughter plays her in the house. Yeah. It is. I have to say this. It's wildly diverse considering Sierra's sound. Yeah. It's totally does that. Is that a fairer? It's very singular. Her voice. Yeah. Her voice is very singular. But the song the the album is very diverse. It's I like her a lot. She's really great. We had dinner with her and Lucas Nelson. Cool. At Sun at. Yeah. They were on the road together for a bit. Well, we had that we had it at a at a grateful dead thing for Bob had right before we passed. Gotcha. And then. And I definitely creeped her out. I was like whatever. But Sun's Hand in Soul August 15th to the 17th of 2027 in Miramar Beach, Florida. Wow. Yeah. That's been crazy. And you guys are on tour right now on the fall all through North America. Yeah. We in the year in Japan for a few weeks, which will be exciting. The Miramar Festival has been a lot of fun. We had a he had Bonnie rate last year in Taj Mahal and Los Lobos with brothers. I mean, the Taj is such a stud. Yeah. It's incredible. It really honestly that I feel like I'm like I think I saw.
Taj Mahal at in New Orleans at jazz festivals, that makes sense. Yeah, absolutely. Maybe you should go to jazz festival, not even knowing who was on the bill. Yeah. You can just watch some incredible fucking. Yeah, there were some lineups along the way there, like Epic. Taj is one of those guys that is hard to believe he never was bigger than he was. I mean, he came around, I mean, I think Dwayne Amas started playing slide after that Taj Mahal record. Jesse Ed Davis is the side player, full-blooded Cherokee, which is like super rare in the blues world, but he was, he was a, there's ever been a racist in the blues right now. So he was an assassin musically, but Taj was just incredible. Like he influenced a lot of people, but he's kind of got lost in the mix in some ways. I mean, he's a legend, but when Taj is still doing it, which is really wild. Wow. And there's a, there's a great bootleg of the almond brothers from Dwayne Amas on the microphone. You can tell he is high as a kite. He has been part of it. Yeah. He is talking fast. But I guess, I guess Taj Mahal either had just played and he's, he's like, man, they've great Taj Mahal. That's, that's not just a man. That's a lesson in how to live. And I think about that quote a lot for certain people who I'm like, that's, that's how you do it. I tell you do it. But yeah, think about that Taj quote quite a bit. You really should have a podcast because I could, I, every time you say something, I kind of wish I was listening to music with you. We'll do that sometime. But please, I want to, like, I, we're Florida, man, we should, we should definitely come to the swamp. I would love that. Yeah. And then you'll see just what a pussy. I was like, well, there's a, there's a good record collection down there that a recording studio is fun. It'd be a good hang. I bet. We bet. And then we have like a quarter mile walkway through the swamp that goes down in it. And it was maybe two or three in the morning. We're walking them down there. And I'm thinking, I can't let this dude fall in. That's like, I can't be the reason. Halfway down. I was like, this is maybe a bad, but he was a trooper. One time I took, I don't know, this is, I don't know why I hear a story and then I think of a story and then I want to tell the story and it has no relation to the story. One time I walked my daughters down to the beach in Clearwater and there was no moon out and it was dark as shit. And I put my daughter Georgia down in the sand and I, then I did something and I turned around together and I couldn't find her and I was like, whoo, this is bad. I was like, I wish I had thought this through. And then I was like, and she was too young to talk. So I was like, Georgia. Yeah. And then I found her. There's no fear like losing it, losing your child in the wild. That is a, that is a real panic attack. I mean, we, we had one when our, when our son was, I don't know, six, seven. We were in New York City for a beacon run and he was, he had a fever and he had one of those fever dreams. He woke up left the hotel room. I just heard the door shut and just sleepwalking. I hear the door shut, jump up, run out. He's already nowhere to be found in the hallway up and down the elevator front desk. Have you seen a kid? He's like, what? He ended up walking outside, back in, found him like on some random floor in the hotel wandering. And just totally fever dreaming and then he sees when he snaps out of it and he was like, where have you been? He's yelling at me. I was like, holy shit man, like that's a fear, that's a, that's a waking nightmare right there, man. What a crazy life for your children to have been on with touring parents for their entire life. Yeah, I mean, they were, they grew up on tour buses until they were in, they went to public schools. So once that, once they were in school, we had to, you know, adjust our schedules and, but up to that point, they were really touring either with Sue or me or both of us. Did they ever have a problem with your old fame? No, I mean, I think they had a problem with us being gone. You do miss way more than, like, if there's one regret in life, that's what it is. It's an out on that stuff. You don't realize this happened until it's too late, you know? Oh, yeah. And so that's, that's the thing that sticks with you. But also they had an incredible, incredible upbringing. They had, I mean, some amazing, amazing stories. I mean, I remember, I remember seeing, walking on the bus with Charlie when he's maybe four or five years old BB King and BB's like, hey, Charlie, you know, you, you know, I am like, yes, sir, your BB King and BB pulls out $100 bill at the end of the two of them. That's like, give me that, I'll, I'll swap you out with a different one. But just like these, just these moments with like heroes, you know, that our kids got to, they got to know them. And they knew them, not like we did where we were like, revered them and then it takes a minute. They just knew them as like, friends of their parents, they were like, would hang out with them, like way more relaxed than I would. Yeah. It's kind of an amazing thing. It's crazy that my daughters are like, that was comics. Yeah. They're like, hey, do you know this guy, Joe Rogan and I go, yeah, Joe, they're like, that guy with the chickens? Yeah. I go, yeah. Totally. They don't say they know him just from being around them. Yeah. Uncle Joey, they didn't realize Joey Diaz was like, they'd never seen him do, they didn't know he did stand up really. They just knew he was like a loud character. And then, I mean, they knew Shane Gillis would Shane wasn't famous. Yeah. And so they, I mean, it's like, it's, I remember we would go, I went until like a dozen super balls with Paul Allen and and we, I took my son and who's a little numbers crunching badass and like knew every player on every roster from fantasy football, like nine or ten. And we're sitting next to Paul, who like owns a team, but didn't grow up with football. So he's listening to Charlie talk and he's like, really interested in this. It's easier to talk to a kid than like your GM because you don't want to feel like you don't know. And then the next few years, I would get an email from Paul, he's like, Hey, just a thought exercise. As Charlie, who he thinks we should drive, I was like, I will ask my ten year old, that's absolutely willing. I would give him a list back. And he's like, it's pretty close to what I'm saying. And then for years, he would do that, but they had that, my kids had that relationship with him. Yeah. My daughter is a, she's with animals. She's like a, she's just a whisperer. And we were, we were with Paul at his place in Idaho, this crazy ranch, and he was talking about this one horse they had that no one could ride because it was just too aggressive and it bucked him. And my daughter's like mad or 10, she's like, we're like, bring him, bring that horse. Like I want to see it. And he's like, if you guys are okay, I'll bring the horse or like, I'll trust her, bring that horse down. And she's like, she got on that sucker, wrote it around the ring. He was, it was pretty incredible. And he's like, get that, no, there's not a problem with the horse, it's a problem with the rider. But yeah, it's funny when your kids grow up around people that no one else would talk to them this way. And they're just, I, not disrespectfully, just they don't know the loss of fame. Yeah. The loss of like, yeah. All right. Which is a good thing. Yeah. I thought I would have thought my daughter George would have been here. Well, let's, let's, let's, what, I don't know what guitars we have. I don't know. I gotta get you out of here. You have a show tonight. We'll be at that show tonight. This is my wife, Leanne. You. Hi. How are you doing? I'm very good. She looks very nice to meet you. She'll be. She'll be at your show tonight. Oh, cool. You guys coming? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Can you do, okay, this is going to be a weird, weird, okay, weird, ask, okay? Yeah. Yeah. Thank you for the guitar. Can you do an impression of your wife upset at you? I better not. Mine would be, you know, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. You know what's funny? If she was here and upset with me, I could do it right back. Really? Are you serious? Are you serious? Yeah. Like, instinctually, I could, I could do it. Yeah. But I'm not going to dial it up. Yeah. Totally. It's, it's, it's going to start at some point anyway. It's, it's like the delta stuff is more of that, like, it's vocal, but it's, yeah. It's a nice guitar, like a 335. It's almost like someone just gave his wife to a porn star. That guitar is going to back to Christian and be like, you don't blame me the way he did. She'll still like you. What's, what's, I mean, I, I, you, I just watch, you play with it and it's, it's so interesting to watch. Well, I have a unique style because I, I think because I started young and didn't know what I was doing that I learned a lot of things just sideways. So I'm playing an alternate tuning, opening, which, like, all the times, which is not usual in no pick, you know, that's the other one. Yeah. And that's because I just feel with the slide, it just sounds better and then I got tired of, like, dropping picks back and forth and just learned everything this way. But then I think it just gives you a different approach. Most guitar.
players, all the pentatonic stuff is in a box. And with, and this tuning, everything is like real linear. It just makes you think different without. So what's standard for me, sounds unique. It was just by chance. Just, so I think the alternate tunings probably helped like find my own thing earlier. Really? Yeah. So it's just, just a different approach. And then by that point, it was too late for me to learn how to actually play such as if it's like, I can't really play in standard tuning. I mean, I can, but I sound like it's my first week. I just never do it. I mean, I haven't done it in years. So, yeah. So it's all alternate tunings. I mean, I'd probably figured out, but it would, it would take a minute. So that's an open E right there. Yeah, which is just an E chord. And we were, we were in Bentonia, Mississippi not too long ago. And it's like the last surviving juke joint, it's called the blue front cafe. And there's, they've, there's a certain style of Delta blues, like this Bentonian style, like hard time killing floor, skip James is kind of the one people know. Yeah. But there's a guy there that's like direct descendant from that music. And, and you walk into this place. And it is like little Debbie is for 50 cents that have been out for two years. It's like hotter inside that outside. Yeah. There's just guitars all over the wall that are just in whatever tuning they happen to be from. And then I heard this guy was there sometimes. And we've stumbled in. And it was just him, maybe his niece was there. And then he just sits down and starts playing and being Sue walk over. And he doesn't know us from anyone off the street. He's like, grab a guitar and play it all. And he starts like, it's like keys of the kingdom. This stuff I've been listening to forever. And he's like, showing you how to do it. Like it's showing me this other tuning that was because it's the Bentonian tuning. He called it. And, but it like he explained these things that were, he's like, you know, most people would play it. Like the old blues, like he's like not a Bentonia. Like you you lock that G. It's just such a different older sound. Just old delta, like melodies. But he was, it was like all these years of listening to this music. And he's just, he's just like, here it is. And he didn't know us from anyone off the street. It was an incredible moment. And he goes, you pick this up pretty fast. You might be able to, because I was like, I've listened to a lot of Christmas. It was a pretty incredible moment though. He said, if you if you're out playing like that, somebody's going to go, oh, that boy has been to Bentonia. I was like, I hope somebody says that to me someday. That would be a big moment. But yeah, tonight will be fun. I can't wait. I absolutely can't wait. It's going to be a blast. Yeah. We've seen you play several times. Cool. We've seen you in Mexico. Oh, yeah. That was a trip. That was a trip. That was a trip. So first time we really met and hung with Sturgeon too, which was a blast. Yeah. We became fast friends. He's I've done man. They're the best him and his wife are incredible. Yeah, that was a crazy. That was a great. And it's so funny, because I think they were like, you know, playing with Bob tonight is Derek Trox, Sturgeon Simpson and Rick from Goose. Do you know any of them? Yeah. And I was like, all of them. It's for you. All of them. I'm like, I'm obsessed with all of them. They were just in town. Goose was the last night. Two days ago. Yeah. I was I was off and you tall, but Susan went to the show. Oh, yeah. She had a blast. Yeah, I I was in Florida flying back. And yeah, we're we have a big week at the Greek this this week. But tonight's our night. We're going to go to dinner first. Nice. All I got to do is my day, my day is over. I'm going to work out. I will not override therapy, which should be a pretty heavy therapy. Let's just say no one will be yawning. I was going to say, well, if you yonder in that that's incredible. I can just be in the background and just just drop some. You're like, wait, who's side of the on? Oh, God. It's incredible. And then we're going to get a yon out of them tonight. That's my mission. I yon, I yon yesterday. I kind of yon a little bit. It goes, you yon, then I went, I don't think so. I didn't count. Then go. It's incredible. Leather shut up, Leanne. I made five things. He's like, you realize that you're yawning. She's yawning. Like, I'm so tired. I'm just showing off over there. Just showing off. Yeah, she's popping wheelies. And I don't even have a bike. Popping wheelies. That is a natural time beyond. Yeah. Oh yeah. You shocked how much people yon when you don't yon. What's even more crazy is that here's what started it the day before my buddy and I were together and he goes, man, you're yawning a lot. No way. I am. And he goes, you don't realize that? I was like, no. He locks you up. And then I was like, and then I was like, he just jinxed my yon. It's kind of friend this. Yawning is a reflex. And then I started going, oh my god, I'm losing my reflex. I must have CTE. I have the early onset of Parkinson's or dementia. Oh, hold on. Shut up. Shut up. Shut up. I'm trying this. I am because you have anxiety, dude, breathing better. He was taking the cheapest fucking breast. He's like a goddamn worker just. Yeah. And then I'm holding it going to the bottom of the ocean. I'm going like this. I'm turning blue. When do we exhale? And then I'm like, come on, I gotta breathe in again. And I was like, I'm having a panic attack. I gotta keep breathing. Yeah, it's a lot to live up to. It's like a great box breather. It's a fucking breathing. It's a secret. I got fucking whim harm next to me. Breathing like a fucking like a sail. I was trying to have your back, man. I did try everything I could to help you. It's my daughter Georgia goes, like yesterday, casually goes, how do you think that would have happened if it was the other way around? And I said, what? She goes, mom and I had a panic attack. I go, and what was I doing? She was like, and you had to take care of her. And I was like, all right, wouldn't have happened. We wouldn't have called you, honey. Do not bring up your thing. No, I can't. No, I can't. Oh, God, that were both of the fuck. No. I think what you would have done when we got babe, hey, babe, you know what, babe, I got to work out at seven. I can't be. Can we wrap this up? Oh my god. That's what we go. Yeah. We marry the right one. That's right. You marry the one you get. That's true. I'd love to go through her fucking catalog of she's her bands right now. Why? You know, come was her number one for a pretty great. Yeah. And Sturgels of really how my list right now. He's high on my list. I love that dude. Yeah. He's great. I love the new record. It's not what I expected at all, but it's it's awesome. Oh, is that though? Is that I Johnny Blue Sky, Johnny Blue Sky, the the one he played at, never mind. I'm going to stop talking. I start I start ideas. And then I'm like, I'm like, wait, can I ask you about your whiskey? The heck yeah. Back pocket whiskey. As pocket whiskey. That's pocket. Yeah. Can I see? Are you bringing these here to leave? Because I am going to start drinking again. I would love to see one. Well, definitely leave them. Can I we run as we'll talk about it? Yes. Was this is ask pocket whiskey? This is great. It's fun. And maybe my brother get to go. Your brother is. Well, my other brother, your brother, Dwayne. He's great. I got it. And we did a barrel pick together with Dwayne years ago. Did you really? Yeah. But me and my brother, David, who's three years younger than me, we've been just collecting whiskey like and the deep South traveling 15, 20 years ago. You can find all this dust dust the old bottles of whiskey. And that kind of became. Sturgels of whiskey is now what is I'm a big fan of I'm a little low Q when it comes to whiskey. I'm a big fan of Jack Daniels. Jack is a Tennessee whiskey, but it's essentially bourbon. Yeah. So our drummer, Isaac Edie, his great great-grandfather was Uncle Nearest, which is the first master distiller for Jack Daniels. So he's like, he's part of the Jack lineage, which is pretty wild. I haven't had whiskey in so fucking long. But we have like we just do these releases when we me and my brother will get find old booze and put high-end juice in small bottles. The a 15-year over there you should crack. Which one is this? Oh, yeah. Well, I have to leave this this this was Jack before they this is the Sinatra era Jack.
like 1980s really because they change the recipes somewhere in the late 90s and, uh, if yeah, it's a buddy of ours who has an amazing old collection. He, uh, he brought some, some, what he calls Sinatra, like Jack Daniels. How is it different? It's, it's a, yeah, it's a different proofing different recipe, but it's, you really taste it. Oh yeah, it's, it's, uh, it's superior. Can I tell you how beautiful this is? It's so fun. This is, you know what this is? This is a solid yon. That is a good yon. This is, this is a solid, like, hey, don't let, let's let the world drip away. This is the perfect amount of booze. Yeah, this is the perfect amount of booze for a great evening. And, and you, we may or may not snuck one through TSA the other day in our back pocket. Really? Yeah, we're like, how do we just got that some of it? That's amazing. And you can definitely, definitely snuck them into some NFL games. Make sure there's no metal in the, in the caps. That's pretty good. That's a brilliant, brilliant, good and a golf bag. But it's a good excuse for, uh, for me and my brother David to go on the road. They all bottled in the shot. That's it. We don't do anything better. I love that. I love that. And I, because, you know, there's nothing better. Like, when I was, and that is what? This is like 1980s Jack Daniels. We got, give that a smell. It's different juice. Super fun. That's what Sinatra was buried with. I haven't, I haven't tried it in quite a while. It's been two days. And which for me is, but I went like six months without booze. And then I've been measuring it. I've been measuring it. And then when I have my, what are we doing? Nothing. I hate her. I hate her. That's how you know it's a good relationship. No, hold on. Hang on. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. I have a great question. I wish you wise to see you're so bad. How many glasses of champagne or in a bottle of champagne? Would you guess eight? Thank you. This podcast is over. We, uh, you're, uh, your ass pocket whiskey. Hang on, don't just shut. You're incorrect. Is that wrong? Well, if you pour a four ounce glass. Hang on. No, no, no, no. What game are we playing? It's eight. It's eight. If you pour a four, I guess four. I had four glasses of champagne. And I said, eight ounces each. And I said, I had, I had, I had, I had, well, no, I said I had a couple glasses of champagne. So you drank a bottle. It's a bottle. And I said, no, it didn't bring a bottle. You did. It was a couple of glasses. So he's, uh, he's, uh, he's, uh, no, no, no, a bottle. I was a waitress for eight years. Wait, how big was the bottle? Well, now that's not, now that's not fair. Now you're not playing fair standard bottle of champagne. So he called me the day and I opened a soda and I poured into a measuring cup. Yeah. Because he said it's four ounces. This one. So I pour four ounces showed in the cup. Yeah. Poured into champagne glasses. Not even half full. And I went, so is this what you're drinking? No, it was a full and I was like, hey, and that's eight ounces. And so I mean, to me, for I was thinking eight, like half glasses. I don't believe it. I don't believe it. Imagine, I mean, you usually don't pour on the top. Yes, you do. I was like, I was like, yo, yo, keep it going. But we're going to get married. Let's go. I'm, but I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm in the head. I started drinking before I fly now. And, and I go, I'll allow myself a little champagne. So his measuring is very liberal. My point is I've been drinking less. Can we agree to that? Yeah. Then I ever drank in my entire life. I feel like if we could even count the number than we're doing pretty well. Yes. Thank you. But this is from history because he has that. You see that 32 ounce cup right there? Oh, yeah. We have two. Yeah. And I had two. And he had two drinks. Two drinks. So 42 ounce. It's a lot of. Yeah. No. So yeah. Liberal men. We've maybe had this talk with my wife. She, or she's had it with me. I can't wait to watch the old T totaler carpet bagger. I can count my drinks tonight. He had two back pocket. I go, this isn't even a full bottle. This is a pocket. This is a little bit of whiskey. This is barely a sip of whiskey. This is a golf course on whiskey. Well, at least I can sneak it in my carpet bag. I mean, I wait. I can't wait. So the, the four of us get real close. And we spend a weekend together. And you just lean over to me and go, how do you fucking do it? How do you fucking do it? I don't think so. I mean, it's like she's, it's like, it's like she created the the ounce and she's trying to make money every time you pour an ounce. That's eight ounces. That's eight. That's six ounces. No, no, no. Should we talk about the conversation we had after that about facts? No. No. I don't know what, I don't even know what you're talking about. Because she's a dogless thing. I'm not listening now. I feel really bad for Derek. He's got a show tonight. And then he's going to, he's going to be up on stage one. It's eight ounces. I'm measuring it out tonight. I hope you, oh, thank you for coming. Man, I honestly, I, uh, this actually makes me feel very comfortable. Oh, absolutely, the best way. I'm so glad you are exactly who you are. And because I said, I said to Dwayne, we, I, we went to Red Rocks and he was like, you know, let's do a shot of tequila. And I was like, great, you know, it's the manager for widespread Lopez said, uh, I forget who it was. I'm so bad with names. Everything blends into one. Uh, he, we, that's where we went to go get a shot. And I said something about the owner of the moon. And he said, you know, that guy is really important to the cultivation of Southern music, because he really kept, he had some really nice things to say. No, he kept that place open with a lot of places folded and he kept having bands. Yeah. And, and I said to, I said to your brother, I said, yeah, I met your brother, but I think I creeped him out. And he went, no, you didn't. And I went, no, I'm pretty sure I did. And he was, no, no, you did. He was probably just in the middle. He was, he was probably thinking about a set or something. Yeah. He was like, you guys would get along really well. Really? Oh, yeah. And I was like, oh, cool. And then I mean, I feel like, I know, I'm so fucking pumped. I know this has been a blast. I'm so excited for the show tonight. And I can't wait to have, you know, eight ounces of champagne. Let's do it. And then hopefully give a big yon half an ass pocket. That's the champagne. Dude, thank you for doing this. Thank you guys. Appreciate it. [Music] This episode was brought to you by The Machine.
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