In this conversation, Billy Strings opens up about his life, blending nostalgia, humor, and deep vulnerability. He starts by reminiscing about his youth in Ionia, Michigan—house parties, local characters, and the tragic loss of friends like Kevin Clayton to drug overdoses, which shaped his understanding of addiction and mortality. He also shares a lighthearted story about his father scaring him as a child with a wolf mask, stemming from his love of old monster movies.
A major focus is his recent leg injury, sustained while skateboarding backstage after a show. He describes the break, the surgery, and a bizarre ketamine experience that left him feeling frozen in another dimension, as well as his decision to give his pain medications to his wife to avoid falling back into addictive patterns.
The emotional core is his mother’s death from a methamphetamine overdose. Billy recounts finding her stash and his shocking first instinct to save some for later, illustrating the power of addiction. He honors her as a beautiful, psychic, and whimsical soul who loved music and lived a wild life. He also reveals new information about his biological father, who died when Billy was two, possibly murdered via a hot shot. Listening to old recorded tapes has helped him realize his father loved him, challenging his childhood resentment and deepening his grieving process.
Today's guest is a three-time Grammy award-winning musician and songwriter his new album so much for goodbyes is out August 28th And he's on tour the rest of the year. You got to go see him if you can you got to see him live We film this up in Grand Rapids, Michigan at Mackinac Harvest Studios We want to thank Michael and his team over there for the hospitality. It was second to none and so was this conversation This is one of my favorite one of my favorite chats ever So grateful for his time today's guest is mr. Billy Strings Dude, good to see you man. Yeah, you too. It's awesome, bro Yeah, thanks for coming through with the old stomping grounds, man. This is it Grand Rapids Yeah, glad to have you in Michigan. I grew up like I don't know half hour 40 minutes away from here over in Ionia and me were but yeah, Grand Rapids we used to come over here a bunch when I was teenager and party and It's a good good city Would you guys come like on a like a Saturday night with like your proms be here like was it like that kind of place or was it like Was this like go into the city. Oh, yeah, yeah, I never went to prom You didn't know I Actually didn't want to yeah, yeah, I don't know. Were you like one of those kind of like anti like like because there is something about prom That's kind of like establishment. I think especially when you're in high school kind of yeah Yeah, I just wasn't my vibe and I had a girlfriend at the time. I really pissed her off that I didn't want to go I think she ended up going with like Dylan Youngstrum or something. No, yeah, Dylan freaking Youngstrum. Yeah, what the heck dude? Either way, well, I was in band with him. Dude, he couldn't even make first chair. I know Yeah, fuck that's crazy, dude. Yeah, she was pissed But I understandably so I was like what kind of like what an asshole thing like no, I'm not gonna go Like whatever. Later on. I'm like man. I was a real dick Yeah, but what was the reason behind it? You don't see like a guy that doesn't have like a reason in kind of behind this Proud. I just want to go dress up and I don't really dance and what they're not gonna be playing good music anyways, and yes Yeah, kind of like seemed like Not my scene, you know, yeah I think it's hard to go from kind of like picking like to the window to the wall, you know to the sweat comes off off the ball Yeah It's kind of crazy that that's the music that we like feed of the kids like from the window to the wall to the sweat comes off the balls or whatever I remember that was always on like need for speed back in the day the video game and Yeah, it's crazy on a nostalgic that music is not like all that like Rick Ross and young GZ and stuff like that It's like you hear that and it brings you right back to like those parties. Oh Yeah, dude Yeah, there was just something about like all those young parties do when you would show up at a party bro And like somebody had like a fence on the side of the house You would open the fence and go back into the party or go into the house party and Somebody's just parents were unfortunately out of town like all they done is like Driven to see your mom's sister like two towns over and they had no idea that their insurance was at risk Yeah around here. I mean, I think everywhere kids are partying but around here. It's there's nothing better to do You know, so yeah, we always just It's all that's all that life was about is like where's the party? Yeah, yeah, dude And then there's something like to just drive around and look for a party and for like four hours and people would just make up parties Dude, I I would always make up parties of a dude. There's a party. It's like seven miles out that way and people were fucking drive out there And we'll just sit there like yarn and things or whatever like in the parking lot and just die laughing Just knowing that like everybody was headed out to something visible fiesta. Yeah I mean, I missed those those days though like I look back on it now and everybody like Pulls all their cars into a field and burning pallets and just like, you know somebody's got a keg and it like Around here it always ended up in a fight at the end of the night It would be like once people got drunk enough and then somebody finally would it would pop off and then it would like the whole place We're just erupting everybody would be fighting. Yeah, that happened all the time. Oh Yeah, dude. I think it's have to end either like in a fight or dessert. I feel like Yeah, that's kind of the American way. Dude our shit was somebody would always some fucking Some little like summer school junkie would throw a like a WD-40 bottle into the fire. Oh, yeah That's a good move and then it would just be it would be like 30 seconds of like Viet Nam. It would be like It would be like watching hacks all rage like really fast, you know Um, and that was always that was always kind of how it went Did you guys have some people in town? Do you guys have any like characters in town that were like sort of like um Like local celebrities in the sense like that was like the guy in town that was like this thing or something Yeah, a lot of those different cats and for different reasons, you know, one of my dear friends uh Darren page. He's no longer with us But he was like super popular, you know um Good-looking dude. I think he was like on the football team and everything and Everybody loved him, you know, and he got into like drugs and shit and it sort of drug him down. It was weird to see because like You know, it was kind of like the kids that were from a more stable family maybe would Go down the wrong path and they wouldn't necessarily know how to handle it Where I come from like a family that was like full of drugs and I've always been real careful, you know, because I saw it but I think kids that were more like sheltered or something sometimes those are the kids that were like end of overdosing or You know going to prison or just like taking it way too far. Yeah Yeah, they get loose. It's like suddenly like they have no cookies and suddenly they get they just wander in the damn, you know They just wander like in the Kebler's tree or whatever, you know End of this in their goon and bro. Yeah, and then there was uh folks that were You know famous for other reasons. There was this guy one of my best friends ever. He's also dead um From an overdose Kevin Clayton One of the craziest motherfuckers I've ever known in my life, dude just Absolutely nuts and uh hilarious and would What he like how is he funny just He was funny. He was just funny man. He was always like You know just trying to get high and he would go to like like jail or something and get out and go back to the same old shit and He like, you know He's just a fun person to party with. He was nuts. Yeah, he was always like come on bro Get let me get 50 bucks. I want to go boot a cool, you know, and He was like one of the first people I ever smoked with and stuff and uh boot a cool Yeah, that means like bang and oxy. Oh dang. Yeah, I thought I meant go down on somebody Come on bro. Let me get 50 bucks. I want to boot a cool and uh It's a fucking nuts dude one time we were at Over at my mom's house and it was when that game skate had just came out on Xbox the first skate and I was just like me and Kevin and my brother And another friend of mine and uh I wasn't drinking. I was just I didn't feel like it that night. I was just hanging out. I just wanted to play my video game And so I got this brand new Xbox and I'm sitting there playing and um Fucking Kevin and my brother they got this for some reason they had a Mountain Dew bottle full of Southern comfort and like a bunch of other shit But they were drinking this full two liter of fucking soko. Don't ask me why it was in the two liter bottle but it was and then uh So as the night went on they got more and more hammered and Kevin come up to me And I'm sitting on the couch and he put his arm around my neck and he kind of put me in a headlock and I was like dude stop Like I'm not in the mood, you know, yeah, I hate it when people do that. Yeah, sometimes I don't like this around the holidays or something And we're gonna get something afterwards, but if they're just doing it for no reason, I don't like it anyway But yeah, he was all drunk and you know Put me in a headlock like this and I'm like dude stop, you know, I'm not in the mood and he fucking squeezed harder So I'm like dude stop and then I'm like fuck it I just start hitting him and I'm hitting him like this and we kind of break up and then uh like I'm sitting there on the couch and he kind of tries to go at me and my brother Is like right there. He's like that's my little brother. You're not gonna fuck with him and Kevin tries to get up off the couch Every time Kevin got up my brother grabbed him by the face and sat him back down so then Kevin swung at my brother and uh they started fighting And they they were going from one end of the house to the other and I was moving furniture and everything I was like you know because they're gonna tear my mom's house. Oh yeah, yeah, you know bad fight happened You got to get the shift robe out of there. Yeah, that's the first where you got to move that dinner table All that and then they'd go I'd move that and then they'd go to another room Anyways, they knocked my Xbox clean over those little AV cables stuck right in the TV and broke off You know, I'm like damn I can't play my game anymore So they ended up Kevin ended up on top of my brother like this and just hitting him And I watched my brother's eyes closed and his head just started. I'm like dude. He's done Like he's done. He's knocked out and he kept hitting him And so I just picked up this
his full 22 ounce steel reserve and I hit Kevin in the head and I knocked him and the bottle didn't break it just went boom and then he's going and then they're both sitting there laying there knocked out on top of each other and my brother woke up and he said what do you do you killed him and then did you think you killed him I don't know I heard him he was snoring grunting and then yeah and then so my brother woke up he's like you fucking killed him and and I'm like dude this is crazy and and then Kevin woke up and he's all disoriented and he's like what the fuck what the fuck was I doing and then he sees my brother and he's like I was kicking your ass and they just went right back at it dude I got the hell out of there I was like fuck you guys can fucking kill each other I don't care so one of my friends picked me up we went down to over to my friend Benji's house or whatever but then Kevin he fucking left my house that night from my mom's place and me were all the way to his place out out on like stage road or something or nickel plate I can't remember but it was a long ass walk seven miles in the blizzard and he fucking he walked all the way there and one of his shoes and one of my brother's shoes and then he called me I you know I got to where I was and I went to sleep and then five o'clock in the morning I got a call from Kevin and then he just says I'm like fuck answer it was his dad's home phone hello and he just says wait until I find you a little bitch I'm gonna beat your head and do an oblivion and he hung up like god damn it now Kevin's gonna beat me up and then the next holds a grudge huh yeah he was nuts dude and then the next morning he called me said bro I'm sorry let's go skate and then I met him down at the skate spot and he had a big old fucking goose like that sticking off his bald ass head because he just had his head shaved because he just went to boot camp oh shit everything like was a big like like sometimes people get hit in the head and then they look like the like growing another head it was like a cartoon shit it was like a you know big ass fucking goose right there you know like one of them I don't know on looney tunes or something oh yeah dude or like that power slap you ever seen that power slap thing oh my why do people do that dude dude I don't know have you been to one oh yeah I've been there dude I've been there it's it's like it's I mean it's to me that just seems so like dude the craziest part of it to me well first of all one time this guy had this big like he'd almost like sprouted another head kind of like like he was looking like he was gonna be on Abby and Brittany you know or like a some like you know cut like a conjoined twins TLC type of thing you know and then somebody and then he yeah look like he was like sprouting another head and somebody drawn another face on this big thing that was growing so that was pretty dope dude one time I saw a guy after the fights he was in the carpool line I'm like dude you just you were just like slapping like like I don't know if you're safe to just get into it into an uber whatever you know it was bananas dude but those people really love it I think the thing about it is like this one thing I learn about some sports we may look at it like it seems insane but it's just if somebody likes it yeah there's that one new and where it's like people from Tonga or whatever or people from Hawaii are just running at each other and hitting and like running right into each other you see that one dude you know I'm talking about trevin yeah it's just like it's kind of like speed dating I guess well it's like well it kind of reminds me of like jousting I guess right yeah I mean new sport unlocked yeah this is what it is oh my god he's like ram man from master of the universe yeah yeah oh dude this is the sport I mean that's like them rams them big goats when they head body each other yeah that's what these boys are doing and it's like bro and they have women doing it too but this is just what I started to realize was like to the competitors it's a sport so it's like that's where I kind of started to meet sports it's like some things I'm like ah because at first for UFC I was like some of this I don't know if I like but now it's my favorite because I realized those people they just it's their thing well yeah I mean and I feel like there's at least you can defend yourself you're not just sitting there being like okay hit me as hard as you can yeah getting like brain injuries you know or what's that like CTE or whatever yeah CTE everybody's got it I guess for some people have it yeah I don't know yeah no I mean I love UFC I think it's just it's a it's like an ancient I mean combat is in you know nature's violent I think and it's like hand-to-hand combat is like one of the oldest things there is it's the most like you know kind of like natural thing you can do so it's sometimes even though you know I'm not like all about violence or whatever but I'm just saying like it's a great sport it's kind of like yeah what's what's more sport than two men like you know or women are just two people like going after each other and trying to kick each other's ass you know yeah it says here wrestling is generally considered the oldest hand-to-hand combat sport grappling is a near universal human practice and predates written history the earliest surviving depictions of organized wrestling date to ancient Egypt around I reckon it's sort of like them gladiators or something you know yeah bro like a modern day version of that yeah dude and then you know it's not always I mean these people get hurt and sometimes you know there's crazy bloody brawl like you know for a script and Stefan Bonner kind of fights but then there's like I saw you at the at the paddy fight on TV they showed you a little bit I was watching that oh you were like choked that guy out in like minutes everybody's okay yeah you know yeah that was quick that was just like Kevin Clayton trying to do it to you and I count man we've all got our own like you you know what I'm saying we all have like our own moment of attachment a little things yeah but no dude the craziest thing about the paddy thing was so usually the fighters come into the ring they have about a one minute inch or like probably a 30 second walk and then there's like 30 seconds by the cage where they're checking them to make sure that they don't have any knives or whatever and then they let them go in yeah but for paddy they had to go I believed anyway they had to go to a commercial break for Paramount so he just had like three minutes with his music yeah and they I'd never seen that before so he just starts like just doing the yeah he's got the whole place doing the baddie daddy yeah and and the place just it turned in like kind of a rave it like oh yeah that was the energy it needed so by the time his fight started in a way I think even if you were a fan of been watching the knee you were suddenly a paddy fan is because you've been doing his move yeah and he's vibing also man it was so dope that is such a what a what a house like to just be in that sort of mindset before like you know you're gonna yeah fight just to be like dancing and happy and hyped like you know back when I was in high school or whatever and I was getting into fights it was always a lot better if it just popped off all of the sudden and I wasn't expecting it the couple times where I was like okay meet me down here and we're driving down there and I know I'm gonna get in a fight soon that was like the worst like the adrenaline and just it was like you know it's like terrifying yeah because you know you're gonna get into it soon and that you're building up it's all this extra energy and then you're like you yeah people are giving you strategy whatever goes away once you get hit in the face yeah dude some guy in a wheelchair kept giving me strategy to fight and I'm like that's fine dude but it's like you know I'm saying I'm happy to listen to you but now it's just like it was just too much at that moment I was just like god this seems like not the best home and um you know my brother dude I was watching to fight with him who's that guy uh oh I don't I shouldn't say this he'll kick my ass yeah I don't know we did not say it my brother my brother said it like that cat Cosmont guy whatever oh Hamza Q may have yeah yeah I was watching a fight with him and my brother's like that motherfucker looks like the nutcracker that was like holy shit dude bring it off it's pretty bad oh wait you know I think it's Islam maybe looks a little let me see oh he I think he has a nutcracker type of beard yeah Sean Strickland will protect us dude if things get bad but he does that is kind of a nutcracker type of beard dude you were talking about uh you were talking about uh oh what happened to Kevin Clayton uh he OD he he was a you know he struggled a lot with with substance abuse he he was into heroin and all sorts of shit man around that time it was like you know meth was really kind of tearing everything up there was a big epidemic really and then that oxy cotton too everybody was robbing each other's grandmas and shit and you know their own family members and stuff just to get them pills and and uh yeah Kevin he got into that stuff real bad and I remember he was texting me too and sending me messages online rather and saying man I he knew it was coming he was like I'm losing control and I was like bro you got a you're the only one that can put your hands on the wheel and steer yourself out of this you know and he's like I can't you know and not much longer after that I heard that he OD he just his stepmom found him in the bathroom like filming at the mouth and shit and it was terrible man but he was also man he was a great skateboarder he was just fearless um he would fling himself down these huge stair sets and not give a fuck if he got hurt he was he was just one of the nuttiest people I ever met and um like I remember he got out of prison for like a couple years, and he grabbed my heart.
my skateboard and did like a switch hard flip first try. It's like, you haven't skated in like years and you just did a switch hard flip first try. Like what, you know, he's just, he's crazy man. Everybody around Ionia that grew up in those years, like he's sort of a legend, you know. Oh yeah. Dude, there's something amazing about being like a local legend dude. Like we had a white guy that could dance in our area and people, and you knew his name for like 40 miles dude. And it was legendary dude. This guy was, I'm not going to say his last thing just to protect his anonymity because, but he had dude. He was just like, he was a legend. When you were growing up, that's all you want to be in. Like you maybe go to one high school football game and he would come out with a band and he was like the white guy and they gave him like this magic stick. You know, like this like baton? Yeah, yeah, baton dude. But it was like the king baton. It wasn't like the one that like, there was always that one girl in band who threw it up in the air and she had on like, there's really thick glasses. And you were like, that bitch is going to fuck it. You know what I'm saying? That thing's going to take somebody's like a wig off, you know? But he, but he had like the biggest baton. He would come out and he would just take it to another level, bro. And it was like, I don't know, you need heroes like that. You need like local legends. You need like like, yeah, you need legends like that. Just to build hype to be like, I want to be like that or just create stories in town. That was always the best. Yeah. We had all. Oh there's all those smoothies. Let's bring them in. And we could do what cheers actually to Kevin, man. Oh yeah. That's a green one they had. Oh yeah. Thank you. (laughing) That's Grand Rapids green, man. Oh yeah. Thanks dude. To a toast, man, yeah. To Kevin, bro. Kevin Clayton, bro. Yeah. Yeah, dude, we had, I'm trying to think, oh, I remember they had a guy in our town who's probably, we were kids, he was probably like 30. And he would ride on, he had a bicycle, but it had a babysit on the back, right? And it was empty. And he was always riding around. And later on, I found out he had like a, he had like some mental irregularities or whatever. But he, when we were kids, somebody said that he was, he had married a man and that his husband, he had married a very small man in his husband, he passed away and so he'd ride around like just on this bike with this babysit on the back. And that's where his husband used to sit. And so we were kids, it was just this lower. And it was like, oh, man, that's a gay, like a gay gentleman that lost his husband or whatever. And it was like this kind of like, kind of romantic, sad sort of thing. And he would kind of pull up and he'd always be in the distance of like all the ball games and everything. Whoa. He'd just be in the distance. He'd be like 40 yards away from everything. In fact, if he had a memoir, I'd call it 40 yards away from everything. Wow. And he would kind of sit over there and people would be like, dude, his husband passed away. Years later, we finally, it was like a kind of like a mentally, like a guy who had like some mental issues or whatever. And his mom had gotten him a bike and she just got him a bike that still had a babysit on it. (laughing) But when you're a kid, you don't say anything, there's just like everything can have a little bit of magic in it, you know? And like it's like, it's so exciting. You ever hear about this guy called Mole, man? Mole, man? He's in like Pennsylvania or something. No, I've never seen him. What's he up, you know him? No, I don't know him, but dude, it's like this cat. He's like, lived with his parents and he just has been collecting like, I don't know, stuff forever. And he's been building these like structures out and his mom's like backyard. Like in the, there's like a documentary about him. And he's like built these tunnels and like all these like little house structures and stuff. And he just lives out there. And so I don't remember how long, I don't know how long ago the documentary was made, but in the film, they were kind of worried about like what was gonna happen to this cat when his mom passes away and is the people somebody gonna take his property or how's he gonna keep doing this? 'Cause he's in here. Yeah, like man, he's a wild cat. You ought to watch this film. Mole, man. Mole, man dude. He's, you know, that's a local legend right there around his area for sure. Oh, that's true. Everybody's got to know about the Mole, man. Dude, Mole, man, let me see another gander at him. Oh, hell yeah. Oh yeah. He kinda has, he looks like he took a hit off a cigarette forever. (laughing) You know what I'm saying? Fuck yeah, Mole, man. That would probably be an interesting person, maybe to go talk to too. Yeah, dude. You should try to link up with Mole, man. And see what, see what he's all about. But he's, he's built like several houses. And what? Just in the backyard, like, and he'll just go, say somebody's like tearing down their house. He'll go and grab like some of the window sills and some of the whole drywall and shit. And he'll take it over to his place and he just stacks everything up. I don't even think it's like nailed together. See, it's just, it's just fucking all stacked up. Yeah. Damn, that's just figuring it out. Yeah, he's a, I guess ever since he was a little kid, he's just like building stuff like that. It looks like one sneeze at fucking remodel of that thing though. (laughing) You know what I'm saying, dude, one afternoon of allergies eating, he's gonna be living in a studio. That's wild looking though. But just like, it almost is like, dude, I was just gonna say, it's almost like a bee. It's almost like a beaver. Like just collecting things. It's like a bird that makes a nest, dude. When you see some of these bird nest, they go in there and there's like all these little things that the bird has found from around the community that they just put in there. Well, like at my house out the back window, there's a lot of like wildlife. We have this little pond. And so there's ducks and geese and they're always getting into it. And groundhogs and we got this little muskrat that swims across the, he's always got a big piece of grass in his mouth and he swims across the pond. He's cool as hell. But yesterday I was hanging out with my dad playing guitars and we saw two of them fucking affiliated woodpeckers flying across the, you know, right there and they went up on this tree and they were both doing that shit. It was like, who are they affiliated with? Oh, they were, and what does it mean affiliated? I don't know. I think they're probably in like a, like a duet. They're like them in the cartel or something, I reckon. (laughs) Oh, that could be the damn new Brooks and Dunn, dude. Yeah. That could be Dan and Shay. Who even knows what's going on anymore? Yeah, and they're just, wait, do they do that? They come in pairs? I think it was a male and female. Oh, a couple. Yeah. Oh, she probably wanted to go on vacation or something and he probably didn't want to take her. Yeah, they were up there getting all of them larvae out of them, out of that bark. Oh, it says right here, yes, pulidiate, pulidiate, woodpeckers mate for life. They form permanent monogamous pair bonds and stay together year-round and fixed home territories that they defend from other woodpeckers. If one partner dies, the surviving bird will find a new mate. You can learn more about their habits via the Cornell Lab of Ornithology. Holy shit. So, math crazy would animals do that shit. I saw something the other day where a fox, it's like something about like if a female fox dies, the her old man will just like not ever like get another lady. Huh, he's like, he's just gonna mourn his babe forever. That's honorable, huh? Yeah. But if like the male dies, the chicks just like, ah, fuck him. Welcome to Atlanta. Yeah. You know, it's just, it's changed so fast, dude. It's that time. Price picks is America's number one sports picks app. The app is really easy to use. For player picks, just pick more or less on a few player stats and lock in your lineup. That's it. Rather, just pick teams. Price picks has that now, too. Just pick the winner, spread, or total on any game or fight. Price picks is available in most states, including California, Texas, and Florida. Plus, you can even follow me on the app at the Ovan. Tail my picks with one click and follow your friends, too. Best of all, play your first $5 and get $150 in lineups. If you win, just use code Theo when signing up. 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Was there a funeral that you remember going to, like, you remember the first funeral you ever went to? Yeah, my grandpa's funeral, I think, was the first one at least that I remember. Were you like surprised that people, like, I remember I went to a funeral for the first time and even though I had known like, like, we knew that my friend's brother had passed away, but when I went to the funeral, I didn't, I don't think I really registered it. Like, and they went to the funeral and like, it was like, oh, and it was just like so. It was, I don't know. Yeah. I remember thinking it was so much. It was so much. You know, it's falling, dude. And I just wanted like my tear, like, I was like, it wasn't even my family. It was just like so crazy to think that like this part of that that's part of it. Yeah. And I'm I, I remember wanting to be my tears. My tears were like going into the cracks in the fucking floor. And I was like, God, that's, I just want to crawl down in there. It will, it just feels like it's so like, I don't know. I was just like, it hurts already. The fact that you're gonna not have to be here one day. Something about it already hurts. Yeah. I think that's how I felt like when I was young for sure. Yeah. It's it's tough to think about. I mean, nobody, nobody wants that. But it's kind of the only thing you can count on really. Yeah. I remember thinking it was really like for I was first time I saw a dead body, I think, was my grandpa's. And I remember like, I think my aunt, maybe my grandma and stuff was like, you know, kissing him and stuff. And I remember just kind of being like weirded out by that. Like, whoa, you know, kissing that dead, my dead grandpa's body. That was a freak. Yeah. I mean, I would, I'd be like, damn, I didn't know whether that was possible. Damn, he must have really had it. Yeah. No, he was, he was bad ass, man. Oh, if somebody's, yeah, I think yeah, if I'm laying there, I want somebody, my friends that come up and tickle me or do some little things like that, you know, maybe sneak a pill under my tongue or something or give me one hit of LSD at that point. Yeah. Because if I die sober, man, then I, that's what I want. And I don't know if that's crazy to announce whatever. But yeah, if you come to my funeral, you're welcome to slide a little hit of the sun under me. Yeah. Yeah. Help you with, you know, good journey. Yeah. Good luck out there, brother. Yeah. Let's make it. Hey, make it rip, bro. Do you have your, how's your leg? How's the leg going on? I know everybody asks you. So it's great. Um, yeah. I mean, it's, it's healing up pretty good. I've been doing lots of physical therapy and shit. Last time I saw you, I was on crutches. Now I'm just kind of rocking this, this guy. Oh, yeah, that cane, baby. Yeah, really walk a dude that bitches height. This is wife got you that? Yeah. Cause this is the cane that Lawrence Talbot had on the original 1941, uh, universal motion pictures, the wolf man and Lawrence, uh, Larry Talbot. In the beginning of the film, he's working on his dad's telescope. He just comes back to, to England or wherever they're at. And he's working on the telescope and then he, you know, comes over and he sees this girl in her window and she's putting on her earrings and stuff. He's peeping Tom and that shit. Yeah. Yeah. And then, uh, so he sees her and, and then he, he realizes she works at the antique shop. So he goes over there and he's like trying to talk to her. And then he, he really doesn't know what he's looking for. She's like, well, what are you looking for? And, uh, he said, well, what I'm really looking for is a walking stick and he picks this one up. He's like, this one's pretty cool. It's got a dog on it. And she's like, that's a wolf. And, um, so he goes out on a, on a double date with this chick with her friend Jenny and she sees this, uh, fortune teller in the woods that's actually played by Bella LaGosi, who was like the original Dracula. Oh, yeah. And, uh, LaGosi was like that. Yeah. The wolf man, this is called. Yeah, man. And he was a peeping Tom. Yeah. Yeah. Hell yeah. Hell yeah. That's how he found his girl. And then, uh, but anyways, that, that fortune teller sees Jenny in the woods and he's looking at her palm. He's reading her palm and he sees this symbol that star with a circle in it. And then he's like, you guys got dip, like, you know, because he, he, that's what happens is the wolf man sees that symbol in the palm of his next victim. And, um, so then, you know, they're, they scudaddle. And then all of a sudden you start hearing these big howls and shit and this wolf is attacking Jenny and Larry beats the shit out of that wolf with his cane because it's got a silver head on it. Silver bullets, you know, silver can kill a wolf or wear wolf. And then he goes home, he gets bit in the process and he goes home. The, the old lady drops him off and then, you know, they, the cop show up and he's like, man, you know, the fortune teller was found dead in the woods. And he's like, I'm telling you, I killed a plain old ordinary wolf. And, uh, so anyways, this is the Larry Talbot cane. I'm a big fan of all those old monster movies, like my dad gets to watch him with me when I was a kid. Yeah. And I just, I was really fascinated with the wolf man when I was little, like I wouldn't go outside if there was a full moon. Really? Yeah. Cause I knew he was out there. Dude, just lurking on his tippy toes with them. Thanks. Yeah. And, and dude, being scared as a kid, bro, remember how scary it was when you think of how scary it was when you were scared of something as a kid, dude. The dark, bro. Yeah. Yeah. Bro under a bed to get out of here, bro. Yeah, monsters in the closet or something. Are you think something's that some shadows you see the, um, like when it was nighttime and we were driving in the car with my parents and stuff. And I was looking out the window. We'd be driving past a forest. And I used to call them woof assist trees. Cause I, like, I knew the wolf was out there and like in the movie, he's like, looking behind these trees and shit and they're all like oily black. And like, I just always, whenever I saw like the woods at night, I was just like, I knew the wolf man was out there. I believed in him. Oh, dude. I remember thinking that like, I would have, oh, that's him. Yeah, that's Lon Cheney. Lon Cheney, Jr. Damn, he's like that. He looks like he used to play for the Minnesota Vikings a little bit. Like my buddy Steve Setsler. He's got that look. So I remember we would watch those Jace. We watched Friday the 13th with our older brothers and then our older brothers would just go dip and do some shit and just leave the younger brothers. Oh, like, the craziest thing you can do is watch a scary movie with your younger brother and then just dip because that kid is fucking scared out of his ankles, bro. I remember me and my friend William just sitting there. We sat back to back to we were so scared. And we stayed up for as long as we could. Yeah. We put every light in the house on except the one of my mom's bedroom and then we put a towel in front of her door so the light wouldn't go in there. And we had, we were like, we are not losing this plate. Like just everything was fucking traumatic, dude. And you'd hear a car go by and you'd be like, that's Friday crook. It would always be something that was so intense, bro. My dad when I was, when I was little, there was one night because he, you know, he's the one that showed me the wolf man and shit when I was, I don't even know, fucking five, six. And so I remember there was one night where I was, I was up in my room and I was playing with toy cars. And I was probably supposed to be asleep and I probably had, you know, school the next morning or something. But I was in there playing with my toy cars and shit. And my dad had this wolf mask and he went outside and I had a window that went off to the back porch and he, you know, I'm sitting there playing with my toy cars and I, I heard a noise and I looked around and I was like, what the fuck was that? And I was like, what the fuck was that?
You know, and I went back to play it and then I heard clearly a scratch on the screen of the window And I looked up dude, and I saw he was wearing that wolf mask and it fucking dude. I freaked you dad did that yeah He scared the live and shit out of me and I I ran out of my room like down the hallway We lived in this little trailer. Did you know it was him the hell no? I mean, I thought it was a wolf You know and I ran and I ran like I jumped from like the hallway All the way over to my mom who was laying on the couch, and I just landed right on top of her and I was screaming crying My dad came in the back door just laugh, and he's like it's a mask. It's a mask, you know Oh, and I'm just like oh, dude, I Man, I must have been funny, but what would you do that? It's scary dude. He still talks about it Bro, yeah, I guess but I guess yeah, maybe it looked dude. Maybe you're like I'm gonna scare the shit out of this fucking kid You don't say no who knows what parents think because all you have to do is have two beers and be like, hey, I think I'm a scare my kid Next thing you know, you're doing it. Yeah, I'm never maybe it's like He's put he's supposed to be in bed, but he's in there playing with his toy cars. I'm gonna go, you know, oh Yeah, but he just scratched on that that metal screen, and I'm like I heard it the first time I was like what the fuck was that and then second time and he like moved into the light with that mask. There is I Was so terrified god dude. Yeah Yeah, dude they we had we called they called it like haunt people go haunting in our area And it was that that was like peeping times a lot of peeping times in our area So you'd see people out there almost on the circuit or whatever like people would like hit like it was just like a lot of peeping times You know they busted a lot of dudes in our area. They had a lot of pedophiles in our area because they used to have this this law where If you was up pedophile Um, and you might I don't if you believe in him or not. I believe in him believe in what? Pedophiles. Yeah Like do I believe they're real? Yeah, I'm pretty sure they're real. Okay. All right. Same. Unfortunately, same. Yeah, but the problem was dude They would have to come to your door that a law if they moved into the neighbor that it come to your door But all of our moms worked in our neighbor like that. You know, I'm saying like a lot of it was a lot of single parent families and the moms work She'd have a pedophile come to the door He'd like have to let you guys know my pedophile. Oh, yeah, it would just be us kids answering the door like it was the worst shit It was the worst idea That they'd ever come up with dude Yeah, because we I remember three different pedophiles or P files people call them because if they're in a hurry or whatever But I remember three different P files would come and be like hey I'm a I've just have to let you know that I'm registered and then I'm in the neighborhood and we're like and we just be standing there Do you just kids? Well, I reckon that was like, you know, probably the early days of the internet and stuff and long before that like database Oh for sure. This is just when yeah, so that's what they had to do is they had to go kind of out themselves Yeah, well they had an organism before that they were just working freelance or whatever I guess you know before they you know Had him all registered up, but anyway, let's just object Yeah, so what happened take me through the anger take me through a little bit of the of the injury So are you better is it better now? Would you say? Yeah, it's definitely getting there I mean, it's it's stiff and it hurts a little bit, but yeah, I was just man I grew up skateboarding and it's always been one of my major loves out you know outside of music and I Think you know the last little bit. I've been playing a lot more music than skating But I was on tour and I was skating a fair amount Remember we went through Tampa and I went through the skate park of Tampa there dude. I've been there. Yeah that indoor building Yeah, bro that place is bring that place up. Yeah, what's it called skate park of Tampa? Dude this was one of the neatest things work. Thank you so much for reminding me about that today They let us just come and watch one day and watch all the guys skating. Yeah, yeah, they have a big contest every year Tampa Pro and when I went this last time all the pros were there warming up and shit Yeah, I was gnarly. It was cool to go see him skate, but I was skating and you know I Don't know and like in these arenas that we play I mean, you know It's like you get to the back door sometimes like just the walk to the green room is like a far-ass walk, right? Oh, yeah, dude, so no you have to stop and even get a snack. Yeah, so I Had been using my skate like I would get off the bus and I would just bring my skateboard and I would like slap down Also, the concrete is always so smooth in there. Yeah, it is pretty slick and a lot of the concrete in those places kind of slick Yeah, so it's really nice on a skateboard super smooth So I could just like push twice and like be all the way around the whole arena and like you know into my green room or whatever But I you know, I'd been skating a bunch and We finished this show in Charlottesville I think It's the John Paul Jones arena and dude, that's a great spot. Yeah, been there. Yeah, so we finished there That town is great. Yeah, it's a UVA is yeah, and yeah, I was lucky that I broke my leg there. They had a great Medical team there, you know like that the hospitals are great there and And oh, yeah, you break that bitch up in Syracuse. There's something. Let us wish that bitch was better You know, I mean it kind of risk I was crazy so like I mean It was really weird. I was all excited after my gig. We just Finish the last song it was this big hide and seek jam and we just spanked the crowd and And I was all excited. I had all this adrenaline from the show and My board was sitting there we walked off stage. We're getting ready to do an encore and so I just grabbed my board I did like a couple bonuses and then I went out just right backstage and I just kind of flung this back 180 And that's like it's a go-to trick for me. I've done it millions of times and I've never broke my leg, you know and But the thing is it's like I wasn't like focused and I wasn't really skating I was just like flinging tricks and I wasn't like thinking about it and so and it was dark and I had brand new like sticky shoes on And so it was weird like I did this back 180 and I kind of slipped out and then when I put my foot down My body kept spinning and I sort of like sat on my foot and and my my shoes were brand new So like there's the bottoms was sticky and it just when I put my foot down my toe stayed right where it was and the rest of my body kept moving So I just heard it snap. Oh Dude, yeah, I could hear it over the crowd like screaming and it was just I mean, it sounded like a two by four snap and a half And I'm laying on the ground and my guitar tech comes up Toby. He says Dude get up and I'm like I just broke my leg and he's like nah, I'm like look at it It's fucking it's pointed 90 degrees to the left Yeah, and he's like oh shit and so I laid there for a minute and Nobody was like moving me or anything so I'm like fuck it I just got up I'll do tenet Dan my ass out of there, you know I just scooted on my ass back behind the curtain they came they cut my pant leg up could you tell it was broken? Oh, I knew it was broken immediately I mean I heard it is like and the fact that it was like pointed the wrong way It's like yeah my leg is fucking broken. Did you try to fix it yourself at all? No, no, I didn't fuck with it But I I scooted out of there and then the the medic came and he kind of cut my pant leg up and they took me and they put me on this stretcher And then I called my wife and I'm like yeah, I just broke my leg She's like what you know, I'm like I was dicking around on my skateboard, you know, and fucking slipped out and somehow I broke my leg And all the like pros I've talked to and stuff. They're like even Tony Hawk Jamie Thomas all these cats They're just like man. That's how it happens is like some stupid little trick like it's always like some dumb thing But so I'm sitting on the stretcher and the guy comes up and he's like we're gonna give you some fentanyl I was like no Like I was like no like it don't you know how far I've come yeah, you know, I was like fentanyl like you know And he's like and you know one of the guys is like dude the roads are pretty bumpy around here You're gonna want that it's like all right fuck it So they gave me fentanyl and ivy it like took the edge off, you know Yeah, and at that point I was starting to like go into shock and I started sweating, but I was freezing and It started to hurt because it didn't even hurt when it happened It just I heard it and I knew it was broken, but I had so much adrenaline Didn't even fuck hurt. That's wow dude. Was that a pretty just that whole experience? You got to be pretty wow because like Adrenaline is just like a crazy drug that God gives you But you can't just get it whenever you want. Yeah, it was it was wild. I mean I knew my leg was broken. I just I just couldn't even feel it at first I just my leg was pointed sideways and I'm like oh man, it's busted But it didn't like hurt until that adrenaline started to wear off and then it was like oh And then it's kind of started coming. I'm like oh shit here it comes and then they gave me that fentanyl They hit you with an ivy. Yeah, and they were doing that and morphine back-to-back fentanyl would work better, but it only lasts like 10 minutes, you know And then the morphine would like last longer, but it didn't help as much But then so they got me there and they they gave me a red carpet man. It was like, you know, we got a You had a police escort. Yeah, police escort. You know, they're like we got a high-profile patient, you know And so they man, I they brought me in this back door. They closed off the hallways. There was nobody in there They wheeled me right into the x-rays immediately. It was fucking cool. And then did you feel like a movie kind of yeah? I mean, it was just nice that I didn't have to sit there with the broken leg in the emergency room forever Yeah, oh yeah for sure and shit. Oh, yeah getting a little bit of treatment Yeah, just do not just sit out there and some of the guys call fit on your fucking leg or whatever
It's fucking yeah, sometimes using you to fucking sleep on your back and shit, but our healthcare system is fucking crazy, just people like, like trying to heal each other like religiously and shit in the lobby's a lot of these hospitals just got crazy, you know, people rubbing pepper jack on each other's fucking necks and shit like, and just people just like thinking up shit they can do because they got to wait five or six hours to get in there to even get a fucking hug, you know, totally. So I was lucky to get in there and they x-rayed it and stuff. And I mean, I can show you the x-rays are pretty, pretty annoying. But when I saw you in Austin, you showed me a picture that was crazy, you look like they fucking turned it into a day in violin. Yeah, that was that one you showed me. Well, that's yeah, after they, you know, the surgery and stuff, there's one in there like right after it happened before it was even set and splinted where it looks really fucked, but yeah, do turn it into a violin, dude, what if you had a violin, dude, and you made it wooden and you put some strings on the side of that bit. That metal bar on there could work as a whammy bar if I ever got it taken out. That's what it looks like. Yeah. But dude, the craziest part about the whole thing was, so I get in there and we get it x-rayed. Yeah, that's the one that looks really screwed. That was before it was set and splinted. So it's what they call a distal tib fib spiral fracture. And it's, it means like, it's broken like pretty close to my ankle, which made it worse. If it was broken in the middle of my leg, they could just put a rod down there, screw it, and like, it'd be a lot better. But because it was so close to my ankle, it was, it's a bitch of a surgery, like, you know. And so, but dude, they are, they x-rayed it and they're like, okay, we're going to have to set it and splint it before, because I don't, I'm not going to get surgery till the next morning. So they had to get it straight and then, and then put a splint on it. And so they needed me to like, not be in the room, but they couldn't put me under anesthesia. So what they did is gave me this huge dose of ketamine and it was insane. It was like one of the most like crazy psychedelic experiences I've ever had. I mean, they dropped me straight into a K hole. Really? And take me through some of that. Take me through the K hole. Was it like, was there a layover? Was it just straight there? Was it direct flight? Like, were you getting emails? Yeah, direct flight. I mean, it was, it was immediately, everything just folded in on itself and like, language and everything kind of made up all these molecules. And I could still hear the doctors talking a little bit, but they were using now this alien language that I couldn't understand. And I was frozen in this like, white space and time. And I went down into this other dimension. It was like when Matthew McConaughey is trying to move the, you know, book on the shelf. It was like, I was trapped behind layers of language and um, fuck, that's a good description Billy. Yeah. And I was, I was there and I knew I was there, but I just, there was nothing I could do. And it felt like I turned into like computer code or like, I felt like I was the, the microchip inside of an iPod sending signals, but, you know, um, and it was, it was wild. I felt very much like an inanimate object. Yes. Dude. That's what it felt like. Dude. Yeah. I felt like I was playing hide and go seek, but I just, I never told, with myself, but I never told myself that we started the game like I felt like I had fucking, I felt like I would never find my shoes again. That's what I felt like. And I also remember feeling like I was like something very small that had fallen behind a piece of furniture. Yeah. Right. Sorry. I just had, like, you were making me do that. Some of those thought you just had were freaking bananas. Yeah. It was like I was stuck in this frozen dimension and I was just kind of like, well, I guess this is life now. Yeah. You know, I guess this is, this is where I'm at and it, it sucks because I think I'm dead, you know? And I just was like, well, shit. And I was kind of like, well, whatever. I guess I'm just, there was nothing I could do because I was paralyzed in this state. Yeah. I feel like you ever see that ball in the back of your throat kind of that's there. Yeah. But you just see like every once in a while, you kind of get a glimmer out of it through your whole life. Yeah. And yeah, I felt kind of like that. I felt like that but I'm like an animal somewhere at a zoo that had been closed for almost 2,000 years. Right. That's it. I felt like that long forgotten. Yes. I felt like, you know, like these sunglasses that are just sitting here, but nobody knows that they have a soul and a brain, but they're just, they can't say or do anything because they're just frozen in these glasses. But, you know what I mean? Yeah. So then when I started to come back to, that was hilarious too because I, I guess I started coming to, there's this lady's face right here and her face is all distorted and she's talking to me in this alien language. And I looked at her and I'm like, who are you? You know, and, and, and then I look over here and there's this big tall man and a white shirt. And I was like, Uncle John. And then my, my wife said I was talking all sorts of gibberish about like the inside of an apple core and that like this has all been predetermined. Like, this was all, you know, thought out and this was like part of the plan, you know, everything. You had the wizards tongue. They call that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. For a second there, I thought I was. And then I was also speaking complete gibberish, not saying real words. Yeah. But that, you got it. Yes. But then I, that's fucking, you do welcome to New Jersey. Yeah. The doctors were running around doing a bunch of stuff to me and I just like, I was like, I didn't know what was going on. And I was like, I thought there were aliens like, fucking with me, you know, like trying to probe me or something. And I was like, fuck you. Yeah. Like I just told him that. I was like, wait for my ass. Whitey. I was like, I'm sorry, you know, I didn't mean that, you know. And then, oh, yeah, there's nothing crazy than being on drugs and being an asshole and apologizing at the same time. Yeah. Right away. I was like, fuck you. I'm sorry. You know. And then they put this thing on, I mean, it's great. You're the best. Yeah. What do you call it? For your blood pressure. Oh, yeah. That cuff. Yeah. That cuff. It fills up. So I'm laying there. I'm all fucked up. And that thing fills up. And, you know, probably because of my guns. That thing popped right off, right? The Velcro came undone and it went, it goes pop off my arm and I go, my butt popped. You know. And I just, it felt like my butt cheeks like blew up with air and then they popped like a bubble. Oh, yeah. And my butt popped, you know, and my wife was like trying not to laugh, but I was saying some crazy shit. And then they brought me upstairs and I was in a lot of pain all night long because they started giving me like delaudits and hydrocodone just orally and it wasn't doing anything to the pain. I just laid there and moaned and groaned all night. Dude, that, but that seems crazy that they, and did they have to go over with your wife if they were going to give you all that medication? Like who approves that once you're kind of like? Yeah. My manager was there. My wife, my security dude, you know, okay, so there were people there at least like keeping tabs on you. Yeah. Okay, Ben. Yeah. I think my, my dude Jim, he wrote with me over there and then my manager used to, yeah, you know, Jim. Dude, he's awesome, bro. Yeah. He's a great guy. Yeah. Then the next morning they fucking took me down for surgery and they, before they gave me a nerve block, which was the best thing ever because it just, it's like an epidural for your leg, it just drenches all the nerves in lidocaine. So I didn't feel nothing then for the first time since it happened. I was like, oh, it just felt so good to not feel it. Damn, you were like lemon him in the 2000s and you like, you're like a Marshall nothing matters. Yeah. For sure. That's crazy, bro. And they gave me this once. Yeah, I can't remember what it was called, but it had me so chilled out. And then like, God, dude, it sounds like it's, this is kind of the worst thing to say. He didn't recover, but to fucking say like, yeah, using the, using drugs like in a hospital like, it was a proper care. It was a freebie. Yeah, it was a freebie, dude. Yeah, it was. It really was. I mean, and I, except for the, except for the, I mean, I sort of enjoyed the ketamine, but it was also terrifying because I thought I was frozen in a, oh yeah, that's just horrible. Different dimension, you know? Yeah, you're like, nobody's ever going to come. Like, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. I thought my brain had fried and I, you know, it was like, you took a glass of water and poured it on a television or something. It was like, all the, you know, my brain just fried. But man, the thing that they gave me right before surgery, I don't know what it was, but it had me so chillin' and I was finally just getting some rest and some relief. And this, and then my oxygen kept going down. So my thing started beeping. So I'd start chillin' like this and then it'd go beep, beep, beep, and then this lady would come in and say, I need to take a big, deep breath for me. I'm like, you know, I take a deep breath and then I chill a little bit and it goes beep, beep. And she's like, I need you to breathe. And I'm like, I am breathing. You know, like, just leave me alone, I'm like, I'm fuckin' chillin' finally. You know? God, now that I'm chillin', you're comin' in here makin' me breathein' shit. Cause I guess I was so chill that I wasn't even breathing. And I was just, aww. Yeah, that's one of those breath diggers, dude. It was good, whatever. Chicks like that, they just want to fuckin' all they care about is you filling your lungs out, dude. Oh. They're all those fuckin' just as lung diggers. But yeah, probably the smartest thing that I did coming out of the hospital was I gave all my pain meds to my wife. And I said, you divvy these up, you know, you're in charge of this. Like give me my pills when I need them and stuff. Cause I know myself too well. I'd be like, oh man, one of these is good, what, wonder what two's like. So then, yeah, start high, number whatever. Yeah. I fuckin' start boo for them. I don't care what I do. Crush one up and snort it or somethin'. Yeah. But snort it with my ass, brother. I'll get it. You know what I'm sayin'? If I had to, like, you know parachute? If yeah, what's it called a little bit?
- Parachute? - Oh yeah, low parachute, bro. If they, yeah, yeah, dude. I'd send somebody behind enemy lines. You know what? I'd send one of them behind enemy lines for sure. But yeah, I can't trust myself, can't trust myself. - And I'm, you know, I've just been around a lot and I know myself, I'm an addict. So I was like scared to, you know, beyond that stuff. Anyways, but I had to take out, they gave me delaudits and then I was on this, what is it called? Gabapentin was like the nerve pain thing. And then there was another-- - I just saw a lawsuit about Gabapentin. You may be able to be part of this. - Or that shit gave me vertigo, like a motherfucker. It was crazy, dude. But yeah, I weaned off it in like, I weaned off like everything in like two weeks. And then I was just on like, I'd be profiting and stuff. And so, it's pretty good. - Two weeks, two weeks is a long haul. Let's read it really quick, is that new? - Yeah, June, is it related to dementia? - Sure. - But, dude, I'm just gonna tell you just-- - 'Cause I'm telling you this shit gave me vertigo, like weird brain shit to wear when I'm laying in bed. And I roll over like this, next thing, you know, I'm spinning. You know how when you get way too drunk and you're spinning and you can't fucking hold, you know, that's what it was doing to me, dude. And like, one of the first times that happened, I laid back in bed and I moved my head like this. And I was like that, 'cause I thought the bed was falling down into the floor. I thought I was gonna slide off the end of it, you know? - Fuck yeah, I know what you're talking about. Dude, when I was like 13 or something, I fucking, the dude left the garbage on door open at our fair one time and my fucking legs were hanging out of that bitch, and dude, no joke, bro. I walked sideways for probably almost 11 days after that, dude. I just like, my body just could not adjust to what was going on. That thing would, that thing fucking remix my little ass. There is currently no nationwide class action lawsuit or multi-district litigation for these cognitive claims. The allegation lawsuits are being investigated or filed individually alleging that manufacturers failed to warn patients and doctors about potential long-term neurocognitive risks, such as mild cognitive impairment or dementia tied to repeated use for all flavor conditions like back or neck pain. Anyway, I just, that just passed through my brainosphere the other day. You know when the bathroom has two handicapped stalls, so you don't feel so bad taking one of them. Or when you wear last year's summer shorts for the first time this season and find a $5 bill in the pocket, that's a power move. Just like how hiring Morgan and Morgan is a power move. Morgan and Morgan is America's largest injury law farm. 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BetterHelp has an average live therapy session rating of 4.9 out of five, based on over 1.7 million client session reviews. The reviews are updated every day with hundreds of people saying how much they love BetterHelp and how helpful it's been to them. BetterHelp therapists have at least three years and 1,000 hours of hands-on experience. They also hold all required education training and certifications across a range of mental health specialties. See the reviews, see what stands out and see if BetterHelp is right for you. Visit betterhelp.com/theo. That's betterheelp.com/theo. - Just a second ago, you mentioned addiction. When you talk about, you know, when you say, I know myself, I know I'm an addict. What is that kind of addiction? It feels like it's almost this shadow that has its own game plan or something. Addiction is kind of a weird thing. I think a lot of people don't understand it and I'm not saying that I understand it totally. I know that I have addiction. I know that I struggle with addiction. But I think it's just interesting to think about what it is, you know? - Yeah, it's an illness. I mean, I think some people are lucky enough not to have it. I think, you know, people who can go out and have a couple beers with their dinner or a glass of wine with their steak or whatever. It's like, man, yeah, that's amazing. I wish I could do that. - Yeah. - 'Cause I'm like, we need to like get a bottle of whiskey and finish it and, you know, we need to go on a mission to get more after that's gone. - Oh, dude, I'll fucking, if I come to your house and you give me a glass of wine, I'm gonna fucking get an eight ball. I'm a sell, I'll sell your front porch on eggs. - Yeah. - You know what I'm saying? I'll sell all your fucking windows out of your house. Your little (beep) - You wanna know? - And I'm gonna take that out. - Yeah. - But you wanna know what's crazy is that? - It just, yeah, it's just not gonna end well, dude. - So after my mom died and I was in Australia, when I found out that she died from an overdose, I was in Australia and two of her, I still had no idea what happened. I was like, was it an aneurysm, a heart attack? Like, what the hell happened? And then I got her autopsy and her paper's back and it's, you know, her death certificate and it said, "Methymphetamine intoxication." - Right. - Was the cause of death. Like, holy shit, you know? - 'Cause that was a surprise. - Yeah, big time. I mean, I had no idea that she was using again and stuff. So it broke my heart and, you know, I've been dealing with it. But as soon as I got back home from Australia, I went straight over to her house and I went up in her bedroom and I started digging through shit and I found her stash. And I found all these, you know, pipes and, you know, little bags and vials and stuff and all that shit. But dude, the difference is like, this speed was different than the stuff I was used to. Like back when I was around that scene, living in Ionia and it was that epidemic at that time, it was being cooked in this area and it was like, Sudafed, like, shaken bait, kind of, country bumpkin sort of crank. - I knew you were talking about just like that homemade shit, kind of. - Yeah, it was like white powdery stuff and you, you know, put it in a pipe or a light bulb or a foil and just jank 'em or whatever. - Not exactly. - Not exactly. But yeah, I know what you're saying. But I'm just saying, like, it's like a localized mixture. It's like a local recipe, but it got the job done. - Anyways, this shit that I found after she had died when I found her stash, this was straight crystal glass and I had never even seen shit like that before, right? I had heard about it and everybody's seen breaking bad and shit but I'm looking at it, I got this vial and it's like half full and I'm like, damn, and it just looks like broken glass in there, like shards. - Really? - Yeah, and I, you know, I'd never, - Did you look at anything like that and we just brought about a picture here? - Yeah, I mean, I could also, I could send you the pictures of it. But dude, you want to know what the first thought that went through my head was? It was like, man, I should just take a little bit of this and put it aside for like a rainy day. Yeah, you know, 'cause I don't, where the hell else would I get some? You know, I don't know anybody anymore or whatever. That's like that attic, you know, coming through. It's like this, literally the stuff that I'm holding in my hand killed my mom and my first thought is I should take some and just hide it, like that way, if I need it someday, yeah. You know, I'll have it and yeah, it was just, that was a crazy thought, you know? And I just ended up, you know, getting rid of it. I got a hold of my buddy, my friend Alec, who's a police officer, I went to high school with growing up and I called him and I was like, man, can you have one of your boys come just grab this stuff? Like I don't, I don't want to put it in the trash can 'cause I'll go digging back through there later or my dad will or something or somebody will or I just needed to get like actually dispose of it, you know? And so my mom would have hated that. She always told me, don't even speak to the police. But, you know, man, another crazy thing too is like, that's a good definition of it. Yeah, I mean, that's how bad it is. It's like, like I said, this literally killed my mom and I'm thinking, man, I should just take a little bit. Yeah, put it aside, nobody would know. We, and also thoughts like for a rainy day. Oh, yeah. I would be like, let me keep some so I can scrap book it. I'm not even joking, that's what my brain would do. So I can like have like a, if I, you know what I'm saying? Like I'll think like, let me keep some for like a memory. Like a, you know what I'm saying? Like, but yeah, but there's a part of my brain that's like, man, I don't know, that's just a good. I'm sorry to hear that, we had texted kind of around that time. - But man, and I appreciate you reaching out. You know this guy.
I, you got a big heart. I mean, you stayed in touch with me through all that when I was in the hospital with my dad. You kept, you know, kept in touch and you offered to come walk my dog when I broke my leg like, man, you're good dude and I appreciate all that, you know. - Well, thanks man. You're the probably, you're one of the realest guys we've ever, you're one of the realest people I've been around. I don't know how God gave you that gift to be so real. - I know. - I'm just starting to hear about your mom, dude. - Yeah. - She loved you, bro. - Did she? - Yeah. - Oh. - Yeah, she loved you, man. - Where did I met her somewhere? - Did you? - Yeah, I met her somewhere. I'm trying to think if it was at a show of you. - Yeah, probably. - Was that a lot of your shows, right? - Yeah, she came to so many shows like, I would be in fucking New Orleans or Seattle or Texas or somewhere, dude. And she would just show up in my green room. I'd be like, what are you doing here? She's like, oh, I hitchhike down with so-and-so. And, you know, can you get me a hotel room? - Really? - I'm like, holy shit, mom. I'll sleep on the bus. You can have my room. - What was her spirit like? Tell us, let's, if it's okay with you, let's just think about her for a second. - Man, she was a hard to explain. She was a beautiful, beautiful soul. And I've never met anybody else like her. That's for sure. She was born in 1960 on Halloween. - No way. - Yeah, she's a Scorpio. She was like, she was always kind of like psychic and always had this intuition. Always, even though she was an outlaw, she like never, you know, she skirted around the law and a lot of different times, like, just, but yeah, she loved music and she loved art. She was an artist. She made a lot of art. - Oh, love music, huh? - Oh, yeah. I mean, I remember being a little kid, like, a little kid and she would like show me all these, you know. Do you know who this is? Oh, this is, you know, Led Zeppelin or this is, you know, Pearl Jam or this is a, she used to play. She did like backwards masking where she'd play the record backwards and find like secret messages in it. And she was playing me when I remember being just a little kid. She was playing Revolution number nine backwards of the Beatles white album. Showing me how it says, "Turn me on, dead man." You know, and I'm just like a little, like seven years old or something. It's like, "Mom, what are you doing, you know?" But yeah, she was amazing, man. She dealt with a lot of trauma in her life. I mean, I think she had a wild upbringing anyways. I mean, when she was. - Is that a picture of her when she was young? - Yeah. - Aw. - Yeah, when she was like 16 years old. - Bro, go back to that one picture. Look at what a curious, but also kind of mysterious young ladies. - Yeah. - Yeah, yeah, she, but witchy too. - Like, she's just something, there's something different about her, man. Just like she came from like another realm just to audit humanity. - Yeah, she, I mean, she definitely did. She was tapped into some shit that we will never really know about. And it was always crazy too, 'cause like, man, she's got so many crazy stories and I would hear these stories and I wouldn't even believe 'em, you know? She's like, "Oh, I was hanging out with those dudes from below, like, down in Miami and shit." They had, you know, they were breaking out lines this long and they were, you know, they had boats full of money. They didn't have anywhere else to put their money so they just would buy a boat and just put it on this boat and park it in the marina, like just with full of cash, you know? And then, you know, things, just crazy things. And I would, I would not believe her, right? Because these stories would be so insanely just like, whatever, you know? And then, you know, like, she used to hang out with like, all the bands she would get backstage. She's got, you know, picture, I got pictures with her, like Leonard Skinnerd and, you know, all these old bands. She said, one of those bands, what was that band? 38 Specialer or some shit like that. One of these bands had a damn chimpanzee that would ride on roller skates and bring drinks around. Really? Who was it? That's what she said anyways. And I'm like, "Okay," you know? And then later on, she seems like such a gypsy woman. Yeah, she was, man. Later on in life, there would be somebody, you know, show up, one of her old girlfriends or something. Debbie, remember that time we were partying with the band and they had the chimpanzee and I'm like, "Are you shitin' me?" You know, and it would always be like some story that I did not believe in. But just crazy shit like that, man. She's had a wild life and it makes sense that she would go out like that because she's not gonna go out in some boring way. She's not gonna get sick and drag it out. She's just gonna, and that's the other thing about her is she would be there and like, you're partying and you're hanging out and then it's like, where's Deb? Like, she would just leave without saying a word. And like, that's how she left, you know, is how she always did. And it was a, you know, now that I've had more time to process it and just been in a lot of therapy and stuff and like, I mean, obviously it still tears me up. I'm like grieving a lot in my dreams. I wake up like suffocating in my sleep and I just like, my mom comes to me and I, but it's never like a sweet like beautiful thing. It's always like a really painful and I wake up and I'm just like, not breathing and I'm like, I'm crying so hard in my sleep that it just wakes me up and my throat hurts and my head is throbbing and I'm, and so I feel like I'm grieving a lot in my sleep or something. But, well, she seems so whimsical. It's almost like the only place you could even touch her is in your dreams in a way. She's just seems like such an ethereal type of creature, you know, even here you talk about it, man. It's so wild that she loved music so much and that the thing that she created was a musician. It's just kind of like, yeah, like, I don't know. It's kind of, it's pretty cool. Yeah, you know, sometimes our mothers go through a lot, I think, and we don't realize it, you know, because a lot of moms don't, they don't really share all that with you. I think, well, I think that was a big part of her, you know, addiction and stuff was, let's see, I mean, she had a crazy upbringing anyways. My grandpa was always drinking, coming in, smashing up the house and just, it was just a wild place to grow up. And then, you know, she was with my dad, William Apostle, and he died when he was 35. I was two years old. And that was only a couple of years after her sister was murdered. So her sister was her best friend and Mel, who's now free, you know, on a fucking bass boat somewhere. He killed my aunt Carla with a 45 point blank, close case, fucking, you know, and my mom, you know, there was that, and then a couple of years later, my dad died of an overdose, or, I mean, that's what it was, but also there's a lot of, like, kind of word on the street is, somebody actually gave me a hot shot, like on purpose. So, like, that's the crazy thing, too, is I just came across all these, my cousin Patrice. She just found all these old tapes that was my grandma Apostles from her home phone back in the day. And it's the first time I ever heard my dad's voice on these tapes, you know, and it's just really crazy, the shit that they were all doing back in the day. Everybody was in and out of jail. All this crazy shit going down. Was it voice mails and stuff like that, leaving on a message machine? No, it was like, my grandma had her own phone tapped and every single phone call would just be recorded. Sorry, did that just open the door. Yeah. And perfect for your life. And what a gift now that she had it in a weird way. 'Cause I can hear my, you know, I can hear my dad calling his mom kind of from jail or something bitching about, you know, whatever, this and that, or I need some, you know, need some money in my commissary. I gave my shirt away to this one guy or whatever. 'Cause he was like that, too. He was like kind of this Robin Hood type. Like, he would go in, my dad, he would go in and some store, Walmart or something. Back in the day, there was them hyper color shirts. Yeah, and you'd blow on it and it would change colors. Yeah. So he would go in and like steal a whole rack of those, like just come out with the rack and put it in the car and then he would like drive around, lancing and like give him away to the homeless people and shit. To the fact that homeless are out there. Wrapping hyper colors, yeah. Wrapping hyper colors. Yeah. Those were the shit. Bro, that's so wild. Yeah, I've always heard a lot of crazy stories about my dad too. He was, I mean, they were all nuts, dude. Just fucking wild bunch, you know, hillbillies. And my dad, like, there's this one story where he worked at a cable company for a while and ever, even an eldriger, whatever. I don't know. I was some kind of, but they made cable like long cable. No, I'm talking about like T for TV. Okay, bet. So even when I was a little kid, my grandma always had free cable. It was just hooked up. It was like wired in. And my dad had did that when he was back.
when he was alive, and it's like he would, he climbed up the telephone pole or whatever, and he's got the case open, and then everybody on Fairfield Street came out of their house and was looking 'cause their TV got shut off or something, and he's all up there on that pole. He's like, "Do you have HBO?" And they're like, "No." And then he's like, "Well, you will in a minute, "just go back inside, you know?" So he hooked up everybody on Fairfield Street's cable for free, like after he worked for the company, shit like that. He was like Robin Hood, bro. Bro, we could use him now to take care of these flock cameras. That's what we could use him for. Man, one of the craziest things, too, is that I'm coming to terms with and learning and stuff like that, is just hearing him talk about me and my brother and stuff. When I was growing up, and he died when I was two, I always thought, "Oh, well, he loved heroin more than me." And I was kind of like, "Well, screw him." I got my Terry, that's my dad, he raised me up, he taught me everything I know, how to play, and everything. And I always kind of had this chip on my shoulder about my real dad. But it's just not the case. I mean, he did love me and my brother, and he did try his best, and he was trying to, you know, get his life straight and stuff. And it turns out there's a pretty good chance that he was kind of murdered, you know? Like, somebody shot him up with like, you know, a hot shot, is what they used to call it. Would people do that to people like they didn't like who they knew were struggling with addiction sometimes? Is that a common thing? It's a way to murder somebody with, you know, it just looks like an overdose. Yeah, and I think that was happening a lot back then. I mean, the guy who supposedly did it, Steve Rogers, he died the same exact way months or a year later. And I think his old lady Martha might have shot him up like that, because she loved my dad, you know, or whatever. And, but I think there was a lot of that tip for tat stuff going on back then. And, yeah, it's crazy to learn about and hear in these tapes and stuff, 'cause there's also tapes of my mom calling my grandma Apostle, talking about what happened. My grandma Connie, on my mom's side, calling my grandma Betty, on the Apostle side, calling and telling her what happened to her son and stuff, like, you know, apparently he, like, collapsed in the driveway and, like, they, you know, Steve Rogers was like, "Let's get out of here." And, you know, Martha's like, hell no. And took him inside and was trying to do CPR and everything. And, you know, so hearing all this stuff is really, I went down a bad rabbit hole of it when I found all these tapes and I started listening to everything and I just, you know, it's like I'm trying to put these puzzle pieces back together from 1995, you know? Oh, it's like a serial podcast. Yeah, I mean, it's just, but it's like my dad, you know? Yeah, and then-- You have to go down it. Was it a lot of hours of tapes? There's a lot of them on there, yeah. I haven't even listened to all of them yet. But there's also just, like, I always thought the least side was crazy 'cause my grandpa, for instance, he was an outlaw race car driving, you know, bringing moonshine up to Michigan crazy, just crazy bunch. And he hung out with, like, riffraff from, from Lansing and stuff, like all that. His whole crew was just like, like, crazy, dude. Crazy. There's this guy named Art Schaefer and he's still around. And Art Schaefer was like a klepto. And he would hang out with my grandpa. You know, he was-- My grandpa hung out with, like, the outcasts. You know, he would be friend these guys. There was this guy, Billy Strubel, who was mentally challenged and there was Art Schaefer and there was Hillbilly Pete, who had a big beard and he always had a big 40 wrapped up in a paper bag he never really said much. But Billy Strubel was always like, you know, helping my grandma mold the yard and stuff and he was always real proud. Guess who molded the yard, Boomer? I did it. I did it, you know. And I was like, hell yeah, Billy, he always smelled like coffee. Yeah. And, like, bad, like, bad kind of stinky coffee. But then Art Schaefer, he's total klepto. And so there's this great story of him. My uncle worked at this place called Crystal Ray. And they had events there and stuff. And so they had all these, what was it like? Turkeys or some ribs or something in the freezer? We was like a little, like a convention center type or like a place like a hall people would go and have like. Exactly. Like a VFW kind of like a hall. They were kind of like bingo there and stuff. Maybe bingo. Maybe a, yeah. But my uncle Billy, he worked at this place. And so, oh, there were stakes is what they were. Big old stakes. And so they were going to have this event when they were going to cook all these stakes. And Art Schaefer was good friends with my uncle Billy. And he found out there was all these stakes there and he went and stole all of them stakes. And so he had them. And my uncle Billy, he said the next day or something, he said, man, he was sitting there with Art and he knew how to draw it out of him. He said, man, Art, man, it's a nice day. I mean, I sure wish we had some of them stakes that come up missing, man, I'm sure they'd be good. And he goes, they are good, you know, he snitched on himself. Yeah, he said, they are good. Bro, my buddy Antonio the other day, he freaking, he had some bad zins that he bought off the internet, like like a bunch of cans of them. So he went and sold them to like some gas station owner, like some like kind of small gas station. Whoa. No, and they were bad. But then what can such an idiot, two days later, he went to that gas station and bought a cans of them. Because he was just going to buy Zanzi, bought his own bad zins back. Oh my gosh, really like expired or something? I don't know, they were just fine. I think they were boot like when he bought off the internet or something like that. Oh, like fake? Yeah, I think he got them on Etsy or whatever. Got it. But when bitches would you fucking get for getting zins off of Etsy? Yeah. Man, I was on those things for a while. I just kind of last couple of months or whatever. I got off them damn things. Dude, it's like we spend so much of our lives trying to get off of some of this stuff. No, I'm just on coffee. Yeah. And I quit smoking weed back in December. What made you want to quit? Dude, it was like kind of on my mind for a while, like wanting to quit. And then there was two like real big moments. First, what happened is I was leaving to go to the grocery store to go get some groceries and just get some shit to eat. Yeah, dinner or lunch. Yeah, just some stuff to put in the cupboards, you know? And I walk out to my truck and I'm just like this. I'm like, oh shit, I don't have my vape pen on me, my weed pen. They just frisking yourself. I'm just like, yeah, exactly. And I'm like, oh shit, I gotta go back inside and get my pen. And I'm just like in my mind, I'm like, really? Do you really? You can't go 20 minutes to the damn grocery store without weed. And so it just made me feel kind of weak or something, right? It's like, man, you can't do anything without this. Like you really need to smoke weed every five minutes, you know, and then a perspective kind of. Yeah, just like maybe, you know, I was just going on the groceries. I'll be right back. I could get it in 20 minutes. Yeah. You can't go 20 minutes without it. Well, that's what's interesting. That feeling of that moment, like whenever I, it's like, if I can just let this moment pass for 30 seconds, I'm gonna be fine. Yeah. But this moment feels like I'm never gonna have that again. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's just like, I need it, you know, so. So that was kind of weird. And then the straw that really broke the camel's back was, my son was sick. He had the flu or something. And he was just a little guy, river, river. Yeah. He was just a little guy. And he was the first time he really ever got sick. Like, you know, he was throwing up. And it was like two days of this. And he was just like nursing and he was sleeping. And I was just like, okay. He kind of seemed like he was in like a pretty good spot. And like, I was like, are you guys good? Like, I'm gonna go upstairs and work on some music in the studio. And my wife, yeah, he's sleeping, you know, he's good. He's just nursing and sleeping. And so I'm like, okay, I'm gonna go upstairs and I'm upstairs and I'm working on some music. Of course, I'm hitting my pen, you know, and I'm working on music and playing on pro tools and shit. And then getting high, you know. And when I came back downstairs, my son had gotten worse. Like, he was like lethargic. Like, we couldn't even get his attention. We had to bring him to the hospital. And that was the last time I smoked right there. It was like, I felt like such a, you know, my son is sick and I'm upstairs getting high. Like, yeah, like a commercial almost. It was just, yeah, it was just like, man, I'm done with this shit. And I just like, threw all my paraphernalia away and just, I just quit right there. - Fuck dude. - Yeah. - Does it feel different now? Do you feel, do you, what are some things that you can notice since you quit smoking? 'Cause you probably smoked it for a decent amount of your life. - Dude, I smoked every day since I was like 11. I mean, - It's hot. - Dang it, dude. I mean, by the time I was 12, I was like scraping my bowl to get high. You know, I was like, you know, looking for roaches and shit. Yeah, it's just, I've always smoked weed. The only time I ever quit was when I was like 19. I got DUI. They put me on probation and I couldn't smoke for that whole year. So I was just doing acid that whole year. - Yeah. - But, oh, dude, cocaine helped me quit vaping at one point. (laughing) - Oh, that's a, that's a different one. (laughing) - So you know what I'm saying? It's just the way that.
something's kind of worked out. - Like I said, now I feel like I'm just drinking so much coffee. It's like I gotta have something. But I've always wondered about it too, because I grew up, I mean, dude, when I was fucking 10 years old or something, dude, we were like sitting in a field like huffing rubber cement until we heard mystery music in our head. Like I was like, just a little baby, you know, like trying to get high. And, you know, like I said, by the time I was 12, I was full on stoner kid, you know, and fuck. And whatever. So it's like my whole life I had, I had always had something like that. And so I've often wondered like, what is life like without like drugs and getting high and drunk and stuff? Like what would it be like to just raw dog life? You know, like, and it's actually hard, you know, but it's, it's, dude, it's not as hard as like, you know, I feel like drugs and shit cause a lot more problems than they, than they medicate, you know. - I think a scenario like that with the kid would probably, yeah, would make you have to about face, maybe just even that moment. It's like I just can't, I can't risk this. I can't risk being high in case something happens to myself. - No, and also like, I grew up, you know, in an environment that was very pro party. - Yeah, I remember we talked about it last time we were podcasting. - Yeah, you know, beers, music, people smoking weed. Even the whole culture around the music I grew up with, not necessarily the bluegrass side, but, you know, the Beatles and the grateful dad and the, you know, Hendrix and all this, you know, LSD and trippy psychedelic stuff is all, it's all cool, you know. It is until it ain't, you know, until it, you know, it's fun at first and then when it starts to take over your life or gets too much, or you can't stop, or you, you know, you overdo it, that's, yeah, it all starts fun in games until somebody gets hurt. - With something about being a dad that you think has been kind of surprising, dude, is that been like a totally crazy adventure? - Man, it's the best. I just-- - I met your son in Austin. - Remember, dude, I met your son and the governor of Maine. (laughing) - That lady Janetville, dude, she was rockin' bro. - Yeah, that was a good hang. I'm glad you swung by. She was rockin' and they had that pimento cheese spread over there. Dude, who is that? The sum-- - Summing off. - Yeah, she's my business manager. - She's the, no joke, since she's, might be the nicest woman that I've ever met. - She is. - Just like being helpful, like she just like wants to be helpful. - Yeah. - You know? - Yeah, that's what she does. I mean, she helps me with everything on the daily. Everything. She's like my business manager, but I also, you know, she helps me with like my doctor's appointments and like my, you know, every single thing she helps me with and my manager bill. - Yeah, she was so nice, man. And then we went to your show and Stephen Wilson Jr. was there, dude, and I got to meet his son, which was awesome. - Oh, wow, his son was there? - Yeah, his son was there. And his wife was there. So that was just great. That was so cool, dude. And I got to see you guys meet. You guys, I don't think it, I think you guys, it kind of passed, but it never gotten to meet each other. - Yeah, that's where I met him. That was what, was it far-made? - No, it was. - No, it was. - It was really it's 4th of July. - Yeah. - And when his kids were there, Micah, I got to meet, and his wife, I got to meet, too. She was there. - Yeah. - She's, if Micah's the shit, man. - Yeah, dude. I think we're gonna try to go to far-made. - Oh, yeah. - Yeah. - You should, man. - But yeah, dude, that was so great. Just seeing you and Stephen Wilson, you get to meet each other was cool, dude. - Yeah, he's an interesting cat, and he's got such a cool style. I think he's found his own sound, and it's cool because he doesn't sound like anything else that I've ever really heard. His guitar playing is really interesting and really cool. - Yeah, he feels like a little bit of a time traveler or something, but I don't know where he's coming from or where he's going, but it's kind of nice to see him pass by, you know. - Yeah. - He has some sunglasses, too, that he just made me a pair of like, kind of, I think he kind of came out or maybe did like a collab with some sunglasses, but pretty cool stuff. - Yeah, what's something about being a dad that kind of surprised you, or does it feel like a surprise at all? Maybe like to somebody like you who like his head so many types of feelings, and like kind of traversed so many different moments of highs and lows of life, that that's not as big of a surprise. It just sort of feels like I think like life moving on. - So the big one for me, I mean, besides just I would fucking rip your esophagus out for him if I had to, like just feeling that about somebody like I would kill someone for him if I had to, or like, you know, like I love him that much that I would filet you right here. - You know? And that's awesome. - That's crazy to just feel that love. And so it's like a new kind of love, like as it is, it feel like, 'cause that's interesting. - Truly, like, I would take bullets, like, you know what I mean, I believe you. - I believe you. - Yeah. And I've just never felt that before. - Right. - I would die for him. Like I would do anything to protect him. - Huh. - It's just a crazy feeling. - Does it feel like a part of you, or does it feel like a new, like does that question make any sense kind of to you? - Yeah. He does feel like a part of me actually was so funny as the other day. He had this, like, little booger, and I, like, picked his nose, and I, like, grabbed this little booger, and I was like, wait a minute, like, I have boogers. He came from my balls. Now he has boogers, like this is still sort of my booger. - Yeah. - You know what I mean? - Yeah, dude. - Like, this booger was once in my balls. - Yeah. - Yeah. - Like, wow. That's so wild to me. - Yeah. - Oh. - Yes. - And then I, like, rolled it and I, like, flicked it. - Fuck yeah, dude. - You know? - Yeah. I love that, bro. Fuck a kidney stone board. We also knew shit. - Yeah. - Yeah. - Yeah. - But one of the-- - It's crazy. - One of the beautiful things about-- - Yeah. - My thinking boogers aren't even just mine. - Yeah. - Now, yeah, he's got everything, shit, piss, puke, boogers, and, you know, tears and everything. But man, one of the big, like, things that I felt like a shift and is that, you know, music has always been like the most important thing to me. It's like been my-- the way I've survived. It's been my social currency. It's been my survival tactic. It's been my coping mechanism. It's been everything. And it's always been the most important thing to me. My guitar is my best friend. There's nothing that comes before that, you know. And I used to be so worried about the music, like, even just on stage, where I'm so concerned about playing well, singing well, performing good, probably because I don't want to go back to where I was, like, being poor and not having food and just living in squalor and kind of having a shitty life and, you know, - Get the uncertainty of it all. Yeah. And just like, you know, when you don't have food, it sucks, you know. So I think ever since I started, like, making money, playing music, or just making a living off of it, you know, like, I'm like, oh man, I have to-- every time I step on stage, I have to just kill it. Otherwise, like, I could go back to that. Right. Like, the pendulum is there every single time. Yeah. Dude, I feel that same way. And it's like, I'm always, like, running away from, you know, I'm never, like, running toward success. It's like away from poverty. And I'm scared that this is all going to go away and I'm going to end up in some trailer of smoking foils again or whatever. And so I have strangled the life out of the music before because I've been so concerned about playing well that I'm playing hard and I'm thinking, and I'm, like, trying to lead the band and I'm just, like, all this, you know, crazy stuff and it's like, man, that's not really the way to go about it, you know? And at the end of the day, we're just playing music here. It's not the end of the fucking world if you play a wrong note or you forget a couple lyrics or whatever. Dude, nobody cares. Nobody's going to get hurt. It's not a big deal. But to me, it is. Like, if I have a bad gig, dude, I'll be depressed for days, you know? Yeah. Or something. It just happened recently, really. Dude, who's your therapist, man? I told, I want your therapist. Well, her name is Dr. Okay. She's in Nashville. Is she? Yeah. Dude, because some of the stuff you're saying, it's like exactly like, I've just felt sometimes like in my life, dude. It's like, I feel like, like one little thing goes wrong. It's like, it's going to, like, everything depends on me. It's not true. But it's like, and it's not everything does like, like, like, like, I'm some kind of God or something. But it's just like, dude, you're famous, man. It's like, but it's like everything has to go this way or I can't even explain it exactly. But everything feels like a lot of pressure, you know? Yeah. Yeah. Because you got all these eyes on you. Well, have my own eyes on me. It's like, I won't like my, I fucking, I'm under my own microscope, you know? Yeah. But it's like, yeah, it's just like, I don't know, I just, I don't get myself enough room to breathe in there where it's like, hey, man, we're having a good time. It's, we're having a comedy, you know? Yeah. Yeah. It's like, we're making laughter. And at a certain point sometimes it's like, you almost start to lose some of the laughter because you're, it's like, you're squeezing it too tight. Yeah. Everything feels so life or death kind of. Sometimes.
like sometimes you have to allow yourself to bomb, you know, to have those, like, to have those better shows. They can't always, they can't all be zingers, you know, and you have to just realize that. And so that's kind of the beautiful thing about it is like when you're truly improvising, you're not always going to do it. Like the ball team doesn't always win, you know, like the Red Sox don't always win, even though they just did like 14 in a row or something. Yeah. Yeah. And I just went to like, yeah, one of my first ball games out there. That was pretty cool. Yeah. Who was pitching you remember? No, I don't know. I don't know enough about that stuff. But I brought my son to that. It was cool. But man, what I was getting at is like, when I had my son, when he was like brand new and then I started going to play gigs again, like all of a sudden it's like, I don't give a shit if I play bad. I don't give a shit if I miss a few words. And instead of like strangling the music, all of a sudden I'm singing and playing. As long as they're okay, I'm free to go play and sing. As long as bare and river and alley are good, man, then I can go play and sing, right? And I'm not only strangling the music less, which in turn, I'm playing much better and singing better. I'm singing from a place of joy in my belly. Yeah. I'm singing, you know, and I'm playing guitar free from the restrictions of fear. And I'm truly just letting it go and I'm not playing out of desperation. Yeah. And I'm actually playing because it's fun. And I, you know, I get to go play. And I've just realized that I mean, I play and sing much better now. And I always also every time I'm playing, I have this little cosmic listener that I can just look out in the crowd, but I can picture river's face wherever he is in the world. And I can sing to him. He's my little guy. Really? Yeah. And also, when I walk out the front door of my house to go get on the bus and go on tour, now I have a reason to provide for my family. I'm on an actual mission, not just to go stoke my ego and to go, you know, like, oh, to go play and try to whatever, keep doing this music thing that has always been the most important thing. It's like, no, it's not the most important thing. I am a musician that's what I do. That's my job. But it's not the biggest thing in life. My family is. And that actually makes me play better because I'm not squeezing it so hard. And now I'm actually Lucy Goosey. It's like, when you look at a cheater run, if you watch it on slow-mo or something, it's like they start and the faster they run, the looser they get, right? I mean, they start looking like a spaghetti noodle. And that's kind of how I feel my life is going right now. It's like, I'm looser now and I'm just kind of more flowing with it. And I attribute so much of that to my son because he's the only thing that is really, truly life or death like important to me. I mean, all of this stuff is important. My music is important. My fans are important. My career is important. So what a gift he is. Yeah. But it's not as important as River. Yeah. So it's nice to have something that trumps the music that's more important than that. Do you think you needed something like that when you're looking at your life now, like you're even able to see that? Because as you're saying that, I believe it's like it's kind of funny because it's like, yeah, man, like sometimes you get tired. Yeah, and some of the stuff you made me just kind of brought up some emotions. I think there's something nice. I always feel something when a dad talks about his son. I think there's something about that that like, you know, all like, I don't know. It makes me feel something like that. I absolutely love it. Before I came over here today, I was working in the garage. I'm building him a little table. Like yesterday, I went to Home Depot and I got like a bunch of lumber and stuff and I'm building him this little table for him to play with his monster trucks on. And there's like this big ramp that comes down and they do a loop and they, and I saw this me and him watch these YouTube videos. It's called our time for adventures or something. It's like this guy that just basically plays with these toy monster trucks. He's like, let's go racing and like River loves it. And dude, I love it. It's like, I sit there and watch him. And you know, he just races these monster trucks. And so I'm building him like one of those tables like that. And that's what I was doing before I came over here this morning. It's like working on this like table for my son. And you know, just stuff like that. It's like, like yeah, like that, you know, like that table. Oh, sweet. And it has these like little things. You let's go of them and then they ramp. So I'm like building one of these for my little dude. And so you can have like a cool table to play with this monster trucks on. He loves monster trucks. Oh, it's so fun, dude. Yeah. Do you almost get to have some childhood moments that you didn't get to have through your son, but you almost have them like in reverse psychology. Does that make any sense? Yeah, you get to view the world again through these kind of more innocent eyes and more curiosity. Which is an amazing thing, you know, because I grew up really quick. I mean, I like I said, by the time I was 13, I was I moved out of my mom's house. And I was, you know, I look at a 13-year-old kid right now. And I'm like, oh my god, I was like homeless at that time. Yeah, sleeping on couches, you know, like holy shit. I didn't really have. I mean, I had a good childhood for a little bit, but then it got things got kind of rough and feel like a lot of my childhood. I had to grow up too quick. Yeah. You know, yeah. It's a great way to put it. So yeah, I just, man, I love playing with with my son and like just, you know, his little toys and watching like cars or whatever. Like he loves lightning McQueen. Yeah. And dude, I've watched that movie so many Dan times. It's so good. That's kind of nice. You get to do that and go back and have those moments. Yeah, do even when I think back when I was like 14, I moved out and live with some other people. But before that, for like about a year, I would go to school each day and I'd stay with it like a different friends family or something. Yeah. So it'd be like, I'd be at school and all day. It's fun. I didn't think about this. So just now all day part of my day was, how am I going to convince somebody at school today to let me stay over there? Yeah. So sometimes it would get to like fourth period and shitty like, fuck, I've already exhausted a couple of options. Dude, I'm gonna fucking have to say with somebody. I don't even know, dude. And sometimes it would get a little weird, bro. Like there was like two days, two nights I stayed with one of our janitors families. We had a vice principal used to sleep in his trunk, the trunk of his car during fucking recess. And I'd go over there. I'd go over there and I see him get in there a couple times. So one time I mentioned that to him like a little bit of like, not like bartering like trying to like threaten to snitch. But a little bit of me was like, dude, I fucking know what's going like. I don't know if he was smoking. I didn't know what he was doing. But just the fact that he's over there sleeping in his trunk, I think he didn't want that information out there. And his wife worked at the other school and said, let me go stay over there for a couple nights. But I'd always remember I had this big backpack and it had all because it had all my stuff in it. Like it had my change of clothes. It had my toothbrush. I just had my stuff. So it was like, you know, I forget about Sonam's like, I think you're right. Just growing up quick. It's like the other stuff that you're thinking about that other kids aren't thinking about probably, you know. In a lot of ways, I'm grateful for it. Do you think, do you think like, so say you're a dad that doesn't get to be there as much as he wants for his son, right? Like maybe you like heard from listening to some of your dads, like tapes and stuff from the voice mails and the conversations you had with your grandmother, right? Just this is all kind of a hypothetical thing. Or say you're the kid that didn't get to some of the experience he needed, right? Or some of the nurturing and like, or just like the connection that he needed, right? Do you think that like as a dad now, like you think it matters which side of that equation you're on or either side, you can get the healing from one side. Like, is there a little bit of healing you think for like the kids, like a young person out there who maybe didn't get some stuff? If they are able to apply themselves as a dad, do you think that there's some healing, like in some of that, in the dad side of it? Does it make any sense? Sorry, I'm kind of yelling. I feel like some of that stuff gets me kind of animated. No, man, I think like does it make sense to you when I'm asking you? Yeah. And I think I am trying to like maybe heal some of my childhood through being his father. Yeah. And I think as he gets older and older, I will be able to do that. You know, just I want to like be present. That's part of the, you know, another part of the reason I quit smoking dope and stuff. You know, I just want to be there. I want to be there. He looks at me with these big, clear eyes. I want to be clear, you know. But yeah, just like it's a way for me to kind of, you know, redo my childhood and stuff. Now, there's this other thing that I have, it's like this experiential density, like because of the hardships that I've been through. And even as a young man, a teenager, a young kid, I am able to have this perspective that I feel like a lot of people don't have. And I have this kind of like terminal uniqueness in a way that's like I never feel like anybody would know what it's like to be in my shoes. Like what I've been through, what I've seen, the life I've had, you know, the trauma that I've dealt with, you know, because it's much more than just, you know, having parents that were on drugs. I mean, I was molested when I was a child. I was, you know, fucking sodomized before I was, you know, seven years old or something.
And so there's a lot of shit and I live on this island that I feel like nobody would ever understand what it's like to be me, right? And so I think that's more of the negative side of it, but the experiential density I think is kind of like I can use it as a positive thing where it's like I have this perspective. Like most people, like, you know, or not most people, but a lot of people, you know, they grow up and their parents feed them and they buy them a car when they're 16 and everything's fine. And like, man, I didn't have any of that shit. You know what I mean? I had to figure it out for myself and I have this perspective that a lot of, you know, by the time I was 15 or whatever, I was more of an adult than my teachers, you know what I mean? And so one thing that I've kind of considered at one point was my wife and I, we were looking at houses in Nashville and we ended up just staying where we are and we're gonna like do a renovation and stuff. But we were kind of house shopping a little bit and you know, I was looking around at these different houses and they're all like, I didn't want any of them 'cause they're all like on an acre and a half and they're like tall and skinny and it's like, man, I want to live in the country. You know, I don't like this shit. - Yeah, I want to live in a bunch of stairs. That's just some of this houses feel like a bunch of stairs. It's like, where are you, I want to stay? - Yeah, like you look out the window and you can see your neighbor, you know, washing their dog or whatever. - Yeah. - And it's like, but as we were looking at these houses and I was looking at, you know, there was a couple that we were kind of thinking about and I was like, man, is my son gonna be a kid that grows up in a house like this? - Hmm. 'Cause I grew up in a moldy meth house, you know, that didn't even have a furnace, you know, we just had like a wood stove that always went out. - Yeah, dude. - Oh, I'm living room with fucking sinking, dude. We'd have to have my mom's boyfriend would come and spray like this kind of foam under the fucking carpets that kind of even it out. - Oh yeah. - That's fucking retarded, dude. I think our whole side of our apartment complex was sinking. - Yeah. - But no, judgment. - Oh, you told me about your balcony. - Oh yeah, people fucking kept stealing it. (laughing) - The balcony would just fall off or whatever. - What the heck, dude, people would kept stealing it. Bring the bitch up one more time, dude. Right there. - That's the balcony. - Yeah, it was. (laughing) They put Christmas lights where it used to be like, "Bitch, we know there was a balcony. There's still a door there." What the heck? Dude, we would come up and somebody would have stolen our fence 'cause there was a front gate in front of the apartment and then there was a balcony and people would steal it and they would-- - How do you steal a balcony and for what reason? - For the wood. - Just for the wood? - Yeah, for the textiles. - Oh my gosh. - Yeah, and they would use it down at their joints. - That's such a strange thing to steal. - Yeah. - A balcony? - But I think it was easily like. I think we didn't ham right in good or whatever. - They could just remove it really easily, I guess, dude. Throw it on a flatbed and get the hell out of there. - I think from not a flatbed, people would fucking just run down the street with it on their backs. Because the three blocks away, somebody would have a new baby crib or something made out of half of it. (laughing) - Dude, we fucking thought that neighborhood was "Buh, Nana's dude." - Bruh. - Oh, yeah. - It was fucking banana. - I like to go check that place out sometime, dude. You're hometown? - It was cool, dude. - It was sick. And I like to go up to, I own you sometime too. We're close. We wanted to be able to go up today and see some of it. But next summer, we're gonna have a better plan and I'm just gonna come and do a trip in Michigan. I wanna go to Sharla Voice so bad. - What about Sharla Voice drawing you there? - I just heard about it. It sounds kind of magical. I wanna go to Traverse City. - Traverse City, I understand, but like, I mean, Sharla Voice, too, it's a nice place. Don't get me wrong. But I just feel like Traverse City would be like the more destination. Sharla Voice is like a smaller place like outside of Traverse City. There's like water there and marinas and stuff like that. But I guess I just can't imagine it. Dude, we went into Lake Michigan yesterday. Dude, we took a ride on a boat in the Chicago River. And dude, it was the cool, one of the coolest things I've ever seen through the city. - Oh wow. - It just, if you ever get a chance, honestly, it really is. 'Cause I just couldn't even believe it. And I was like, oh, I've never gotten to go like on a boat through like a middle of a city kind of. I know you can do that here in Grand Rapids, but it's just like, you know, Chicago's just a, it's a bigger entity there. - Kinda like reminds me of like Amsterdam or something, there's all those little canals. - Oh yeah, Venice and Amsterdam. Oh yeah. - Oh yeah, Amsterdam has a ton of them. Dude, what about, what's at Island Place with the dunes you've ever seen that place? - Sleep in Bear Dunes. - Is that cool? - It's very cool. - Yeah, dude, I heard about that. - Yeah, it's a beautiful place. Michigan has some like, damn near tropical like paradise, like look at that blue water, dude. There's not water like that anywhere. And it's fresh water. - Bro, that's what I'm saying. Like even when I got into Lake Michigan yet in Chicago, guys, like we went all off the coast a little bit, I never knew it existed like that. Like I knew the lakes were there, but. - Yeah, we gotta keep it a secret, bro. We shouldn't even talk about this. - Okay. I don't want any more people. - Some stuff dude, you want to keep it a secret, but we went to that field of dreams baseball game. - Where was that at? - Dyersville, Iowa. You've ever seen that movie, it's an old movie. - Yeah. - Yeah. - So we went to Dyersville. - Oh, I saw a video, you ate a bunch of peanuts. - Oh yeah, dude. - I ate like six bags of peanuts. I ate almost 400 peanuts. - Well, each peanut has like two, sometimes three. So you might a 800 and something. - I don't even think about that. - Yeah, I don't even think. - 'Cause each peanut, a peanut has two nuts in there. - So if you ate 420, you may 880, do peanuts. - Fuck yeah. I don't even think of that. - That's fucking close to 1,000, bro. - Damn, fuck you. - You don't wanna say it, bro. - Dude, next time break 1,000. - Yeah, you're right, you're right. - Yeah. - Yeah, I'm gonna run for Mayor of Chicago now, dude. If I can eat that many peanuts at a ballgame. Dude, the guy came over to sweep up the nut shells like four times dude. They were fucking birds overhead, like fucking, they were pests that we created so much like, probably usable material for nassonship. But it was that, dude, that was just a great experience. I just love them, I don't know. I love them Midwest. I love the people. I've always heard about, yeah, there's some of them. - They come out of the corn? - They came out of the corn. - No way. - Yeah. - One came out of the closet, like dude. Dude, one day, yeah. - That's epic. - And you even, they had a corn like built up to walk up to and and stuff like that. And I got to meet Patrick Renna, the guy from Sandlot. He was the great Hambino in Sandlot. And then, just got to see some of the players. They had Joe, let me think Joe Mauer, Scott Roland, Lee Smith, the Hawk, Andre Dawson, Joe Ryan was there. - Yeah. - And the twins, they gave me a new hat too. - Nice. - Yeah. - So I see you've been rocking that Detroit hat pretty heavy. - Dude, yeah, well, because one of the nicest, or like one of the dopest squads that ever came out to see me, like the guys that ever came to see me play were some of the Tigers guys came one time to see a game. Rodgers, school, school bull, carpenter, just some of their different pictures came out. And it was just awesome, dude. And they like, we're just, it was like probably two or three years ago. And there was like a little, they were younger. And just like, their energy was like, they were just fucking like ecstatic, but they were all like really nice guys. - Yeah. - So that was just a good experience, dude. - Oh, it's sick to see that old English D out there. - And then here I am in Michigan, which is kind of crazy, like the things you kind of like maybe, I didn't know that I would be here today, you know? - Yeah. - And getting to spend time with you, dude. Dude, thanks so much for just kind of thinking about some stuff. I, I wanna ask you, I want you to see if you can tell me this story. I know you got to meet Bob Dylan, right? Can you tell me that story? You do not wanna tell it? - Sure, you can. - Yeah. Yeah, so we were on tour with Willie and Bob. And this is one of my favorite stories, dude. - Yeah. And, you know, I don't take this for granted, you know? I remember when the thing first came to me, the offer, it was kind of put to me in a way that was like, okay, well, we could go do our own tour and like probably make a lot more money or we could go on this tour as an opener, but we're gonna be able to go tour with Bob Dylan and Willie. And it's like, dude, we're going with Bob and Willie. Are you kidding me? Of course. And so every night we played with them, me and the band would like finish our set, we would hurry up and go back to the green room, like, you know, have a snack or whatever and then like get right back out there, get our good seats, sometimes just on the side of the stage and watch Bob Dylan play and then watch Willie play. - Oh. Now, and so it was just, every night was just like, we watched them intently every night because like I said, we do not take this for granted. So actually, I need to rewind a bit to tell you the story about Bob Dylan. Somebody had told me, T-bone Burnett actually told me. - He lives in Nashville. - Yeah. - He swims with Jeff Bridges. - Yeah. - Yeah, yeah. - I love Jeff. - Dude, ain't crazy hard. - Yeah. - Such a good movie. - Yeah. But so T-bone's like, hey man, Bob Dylan's like a big fan of yours. He keeps bringing you up and stuff and I'm like, what? You know, it's crazy. And then my manager says that one of Bob's people, one of his managers or something, kind of just told my manager, Bill, the best way to get a hold of Bob is to run.
write him a letter. He likes letters. So I was gonna write him a letter. And I remember I was staying at St. Cecilia in Austin. And I walked in the room and they had this really great paper there, like this stock paper. And I thought, well, this will be cool 'cause it's from like a hip hotel and it's nice paper. I'm gonna take this paper. This is what I'm gonna write my letter to Bob Dylan on. And then I never did a whole year past. I procrastinated. And then the next year past we're doing Austin City limits or something, I was in Austin again. And I stayed at the St. Cecilia again. And I walked in that same room I stayed in last time and I saw that paper again a year later. And I go, man, screw this. And I just set my backpack down in my luggage. I grabbed that paper and I went straight up to the cafe and I had a coffee and some eggs. And I sat there and wrote Bob Dylan a letter. Just basically saying thank you and just thank you. And telling him about how I loved the way Doc Watson used to play his songs and stuff. And so after that, I had heard that Bob was excited about this letter that he got from me and stuff and I was like, okay, well, I don't know what to believe, right? And we get on that tour, we play like couple gigs and we're open and for Bob. And then one night after our set before Bob goes on stage, well, that was when I sat in. Actually, the first time I met him was at the Hollywood Bowl and I was standing backstage after his set and my security guy Jim was like, here, stand over here. And I just thought, like I was in the way, like they were gonna move some road cases or something. But no, Bob was coming off stage in this huge Northface parka. And right as he was walking by, somebody was like, hey, that was a great set, Billy, and he stopped in his tracks and he was like, Billy, and he walked right up to me and he was like, man, thank you for the letter. And I was like, man, thank you, Bob, for the music, you know? And he shook my hand. Oh yeah. And with his hand. Yeah, with Bob Dylan's hand, he shook my hand. And my hand is like tingling right now, just talking about it. Every time I talk about this story, my hand starts tingling. That whole night, it's like vibrating. I shook his hand and I looked him in the eyes and he said, you know, thanks for the letter and I told him thank you for the music and then he walked away. Did he have a good hand? He was, yeah, it was nice little hand. And that whole night, my hand was just tingly. Like it was, it was like I touched a magic crystal or something, you know? And so now, every time I tell this story, it does the same thing. But later that night, I was like, it's either like some crazy, beautiful energy. Like he's just got this magic or it's like, you know, some leftover Bengue or something is what I was thinking. But then so like the next night on tour or yeah, a night or two later, we played our set and I'm sitting in the green room and then I was like smoking a bowl or something and this lady walked in and she's like, Bob wants you to play with him tonight. And I was like, what? And she's like, are you too stoned? And I was like, no, I'm not stoned enough, you know? So I'm like, okay, fuck you guys. It's happening. Bob asked me to sit in. So I'm like walking out to my bus 'cause I know his band, they all wear black and stuff. So I was like, I got a black shirt. I can put my hair in a ponytail, get a little bit more classy. - Black and up a little. - Me dark and out. - Yeah, to get a little bit more classy than whatever t-shirt I had on. - Right. - You know, I'm fixing to play with Bob Dylan. I want to go put a nice shirt on. - Yeah, yeah. - And pull my hair back. - Oh, yeah. - And as I was walking out to the bus, I saw him. He was walking right toward me and he just came up to me and he said, you know, let's do all along the watch tower. He's like just, you know, I've seen the first verse and second verse and he'd play after the second verse. You know, and then he walked away. Like he didn't say hi. He didn't say thanks for playing or nothing. He said, let's do the watch tower. Play after the second verse. - This information. - And then on this way to the stage. And I was like, oh my, man, this guy means business. - Yeah. - So I went to my bus. I got my nice digs on, and then I was texting my mom and dad. And I called my mom. I was like, you're not going to believe this. What did she say? - She just, she was always over the moon about stuff like that. She called me her dream weaver is what she called. She's like, who are you going to play with next? Because so many of her heroes I had met and played with. Or, you know, mom, I just met Eddie Vetter or, you know, mom, you know, not going to believe this, David Grisman or, you know, Del McCurray and all this stuff. And then more Lee Wood Matt. - More recently. - Stevie Nex. - I've never met her. But that'll be a crazy collab with you guys. - Yeah. - Anyway, I was like, I was like, I'm getting ready to go play with Bob Dylan. She's like, what the fuck, you know? Like, who, who are you? Like, who do you think you are? Just like, I don't know, he just asked me to play. So, so yeah, I'm your son. So yeah, I go out there and it was amazing. I mean, we, we played. The cool thing about that too is that whole tour. That was my favorite song that they were doing. I mean, I love all along the watchtower and of course Jimmy Hendrix's version, but they had this cool arrangement of it. And it was like such a hip version of it. And I just, that was my favorite tune that they were doing. And that's the one he asked me to play on. Just like, wow, you know, and so yeah, he sang, sang the second verse and then he kind of looked over at me and I played, passed it back to him. We had a little musical conversation. And then I, that was it, man, I played with Bob Dylan. It was like, holy shit, you know? And I walked off stage and I go in the green room and like, my whole band is like so excited. They're like making toasts and shit like, you know, especially my bass player Royal has like just been in a huge Bob Dylan kick the last couple of years. We just couldn't believe this happened really. Shout out Royal. Yeah. So then we're sitting in the green room and we're all just like, oh my God, that was amazing. And then Jim, my security guy, he comes in and he says, hey, somebody wants to say hi and in my green room walks Bob Dylan and he sucked the oxygen out of the room. It was like everybody just like fell silent and like couldn't breathe. And then he was like, man, you know, thanks for playing like that was awesome and I go, man, thank you for having me, man, I'm such an honor to play with you, you know? And I was like, I wanna introduce you to my band, you know, this is Royal and Billy and stuff like that. And then I, you know, he just like turned around and walked away. I was like, what? No way, dude. And then a couple of days I was busy Bob, dude. Dude, he dipped, he was like, and then just left. And then, and we loved it. I thought it was amazing. Oh, it's fucking almost, probably almost, it's even better. That's the most lower shit you could do. Dude, he just littered. I was like, I want you to introduce you to my band and he just turned around and left. He was like, wow. Yes. What a badass. And then so, he yes, dude. A couple nights later, he sent me a message through one of his managers and it just said, you know, thanks for playing. Like, I think you're great. And he said, like, my friend Jerry Lee told me a long time ago, he said, you're gonna be around for a long, long time. And I just, man, I like, was in the back of my bust, like reading this and just cried, you know. I mean, this Bob Dylan kind of pat me on the back. And so, first of all, it's unbelievable, dude. It's such a great story. It's like, I can feel it, dude. It's almost like, I'm like, yeah, dude. One of the craziest things is that the few interactions I had with them, which was like three or four over the course of a couple days. And I talked to him and I looked at his face and I spoke directly to him and I looked in his eyes. I can't picture his face. I can't picture, I didn't see the skin. When I think about him, what he looked like, all I see is these deep oceans of blue in these deep, concerned, concerning eyes. And this like white light behind them. That's what I picture when I think about, what did Bob Dylan look like to me? All I can see is these, the deepest, bluest eyes with the most concerning emotion in them. And then this like aura of like white light. That's what Bob looks like to me in my memory. - Yeah. - I can't remember his face, you know. - Yeah, like it's almost something that's almost like, maybe from another realm or something. I think God's concern, like shows up in our eyes, I think. So maybe he just has a lot of like concern from you.
other side, you know? - Yeah, and it's not a paranoid concern. It's more of like, a compassion and a, like, like a love, like from an elder, you know? - Yeah, maybe like a kind of semi-aggressive entry kind of. - Like a, some kind of musical grandpa, you know? - Yeah, dude, Bob Dylan bro, wow. - Yeah, yeah, it's a trip. - And then like, a little while after that, I got to play and make music in the studio with Edgar Winter. And he was like, one of my mom's favorites, you know? Him and Jeff. - Edgar Winter, and who else? - Yeah, while Johnny Winter, his brother. - Johnny Winter, bring him up a petrol. - You guys, let me get a gander at him. - Yeah, they look like, oh wow. They kind of look like Targaryens, man. They're albino. - Yeah, you look a little. - You look a little. - A little bit, you know, you see it is? - No. - But Johnny Winter is one of the best guitar players to ever live, man. - Oh my gosh. - He's one of the best, little skinny, scrawny albino dude, and he played with muddy waters and all sorts of stuff. He was one of the best blues players ever, man. Played with the slide, played, you know, acoustic, everything, but he's the man. And then Edgar Winter, you know, you've heard like free ride, take, you know, that's his jam. And then you remember, so Edgar Winter had a huge hit that was an instrumental song called Frankenstein. You remember that? (humming) (humming) That's Edgar Winter, man. And the cool thing about that is that. - You get to talk to him? - Yeah, no, he's actually become a good friend of mine. He came and played with us at Bridgestone Arena when we played, and we were in the studio for like a day or two, working on some stuff for his record that's gonna come out at some point. But yeah, Edgar Winter is one of the sweetest, sweetest people. - Wow. - And Johnny's alive too. - He passed away, when did he pass away like 2012, or maybe a little bit after that? - 2014. - Yeah, 2014. - Oh, they're sweets, huh? Well, no, he, that's where he died as in Switzerland. They're from Texas. - Oh, yeah. - Yeah. - Yeah, he was on the road. - Wow. - I think he died in his hotel room. - Oh, yeah. - That was my, that was my mom's dog right there. - Really? - At least she loved him. - I'm gonna have to listen to some of their music today in honor of her dude on our ride later. - Yeah, listen to like just the self-titled Johnny Winter album from 1969. And then for Edgar Winter, listen to White Trash. Like, it's just some of the funkyest stuff you're ever gonna hear, man. They got this one tune, it's the first track on the record called Give It Everything You Got. And I remember I was, I was tripping hard on acid one day and I was down by the river and I slipped and I fell down this mud bank and I landed like way steep in the water and I was just splashing. It was also October in Michigan, it was kind of cold. - Yeah. - But I, I got out and I climbed back up the bank and I was soaking wet, but I didn't feel wet. - Oh, yeah. - 'Cause I just, I think my brain was wet. - Oh, yeah, 'cause you were having a good time. - Yeah, I was already tripping and so I walk home and I'm sopping and you know, I walk in my mom's back door and she's like, what are you doing? I was like, well, I took some acid and I went and fell in the river. She's like, oh, you're on acid and she drops the needle on Give It Everything You Got. She put that record on for me to hear and I just sat there in front of the speakers and I listened to that. And when the song ended, I moved the needle back over and I listened to it again and I listened to it again. I just, I was in this loop of Give It Everything You Got. There's these crazy saxophone solos and everything's pan stereo and it goes right to left and it's just, dude, it's, it's so good. That whole album is good. And there's a couple tunes on there called, one called Fly Away that I can hardly listen to without crying 'cause it was one of my mom's songs and it really reminds me of her. - That's called, and that's the Johnny Winner's album? - That's the Edgar Winter album called White Trash. - White Trash. - Yeah, and then the Johnny Winner record is just, it's just called Johnny Winner, yeah. Dude, what a crazy pair of brothers they must have been. Could you even imagine? - Oh man, they were, they were really musical, you know, and Edgar's, he's amazing. I wish I would have been able to meet Johnny, but you know, I've, I've listened to a lot of his music and I just love him dearly, I mean, gosh. So, I feel so lucky to have been exposed to good music like that from my parents, you know, they, as far as I'm concerned, man, they listen to good music and they taught me about it, you know, and so that's the thing is like, when I was in middle school and stuff, I mean, I don't know what kids were listening to back then. I wasn't listening to that. I was listening to, you know, John Lennon or whatever. My teacher's always thought I was kind of like, who is this kid? Man, he's like wearing a Jim Morrison t-shirt, you know? - Like what's he doing, yeah. - Yeah, like how does this end? - And I'm like going to the library, like, trying to find books about like Janice Joplin and stuff and I'm just like in sixth grade or whatever. - Yeah. - Some of my teachers thought that was really cool. The ones that were like around in the '60s and stuff, the older cats. - Yeah. - I used to get like, almost want to say like, special treatment or something because of that. 'Cause like some of my teachers that were old hippies that were like, man, this cat's sick. - Oh, dude, yeah. If you're a teacher, if you're, if you're into something that they're into kind of, or they think there's something a little bit different about you, I think it makes sense that a teacher would be like, oh, this kid's cool. There's something going on with this kid. I'm curious to see. Like we had this teacher in a misplash and she was cool, man. She was like our poetry teacher and we'd go in there and it was like all the misfit kind of kids were in there. And you'd have like, you know, people that were extra lipstick on different parts of their face and shit and like, (laughing) and we'd go in there and we got to write poetry. And it was kind of this weird group. Like, we're not weird, but it was just like this, like, I don't know, it was this group of, it was just different than the norm. And it was like a place where it felt like, okay, I could share how I feel. There wasn't any other place in school really to do that. Like in regular school, you know, like, let sure we're talking like one-on-one with a buddy. But just like to go in there and write poems and like, think of things together. And you go in there and like, they'd have a lot of like, some kids that were in kind of like, I don't wanna say school, shooty, garb, or whatever, but just like, you know, we'd have like kids wearing like, I'm trying to think of mom. It'd be like sometimes like, trench coatie or less like. - Big combat boots. - Yeah, combat boots, dude. We'd have like, Doc Martin's, right? And the higher the Doc Martin, like kind of the, like, it got to a level where it was like, normal, kind of wild. And then it's like, and then like, someone was like kind of perverse or whatever. - Yeah. - Like way up to the thigh. - Yeah, like way up to the cootery. But you know, it was like, damn, dude. - You definitely ain't no hood hopper. - We ain't no rancor. - But it would just be like, I don't know, and then you'd see like, they'd have like a hippie girl in there who never wore a brawn. That would make you fucking go to class every single day, bro. 'Cause you could just, if you closed your eyes, you could just hear her tits. (laughing) You know, like it was just that age. But we had that much hormones. When you were in high school, you could just close your eyes. You could just hear somebody's tits, dude. - Yeah. - Fuck. - Yeah, they sound so soft. - Oh, welcome to Ohio, brother. Yeah. (laughing) - I just feel like that's the most Ohio thing ever. - Dude, thanks so much, man. I'm excited about your new album. Can you just tell me like one or two things about it? I've read somewhere that it's an honor of your mother. - Yeah. You know, I think a lot of it, you know, I was writing when shortly after she passed and stuff. So yeah, it's kind of dedicated to her. And it's kind of an interesting thing. I mean, I kept wanting to call it so much for goodbyes. And I just, I was thinking about that for a while and because I didn't get a chance to say goodbye to my mother. So that's kind of how I thought about it. It was like, well, so much for goodbyes, you know. I guess I'm not gonna get a chance to say bye. And when I brought it up to my manager, I said, I think I'm gonna call the record so much for goodbyes. And he was like, man, that's cool. That's like, you know, 'cause it's not really goodbye. It's just like farewell for now, right? And I was like, oh, that's not really how I was thinking of it. But yeah, that's kind of more positive thing. - Yeah, like so much for goodbyes. Like it doesn't even, that doesn't matter. - Yeah, 'cause it's, you know, she's still kind of with me no matter what. - Oh, I'm sure she's hitchhiking, dude. She might have just got tired of kind of rocking from this galaxy. She might have just be hitchhiking out there. - She's probably in Sedona somewhere and some, you know. So she probably can nest it up in a wind chime somewhere if I can live in it up. - Yeah, totally. - You know, yeah. But I do believe that when we think about other people, when we speak their name out loud, when we make music for them, when we pray for them, I believe that people can feel all of that. - Yeah. - I don't really even doubt it, because it just feels so bigger than us. - Yeah, you know, right after she died, I kept, there were so many little things that I would feel, you know, like, just these like, certain animals would come around or whatever, and like a dragonfly, or I'd see a doe with like two fawns and I'm like, man, it would just break my heart, you know what I mean? It's like, that's my mom and that's me and my brother. Or whatever, you know. And for a minute there was like pissing me off. It's like, I don't want a fucking dragonfly. Like I want my mom, yeah. Like fuck that dragonfly.
fly. But now I look for those things, a cloud or whatever it is just the way the breeze feels. But my mom, she was an amazing artist. She would constantly be calling me saying, "Hey, I took this hub cap and glued this to that and I made this little alien battle and I did this." And so she always made this stuff. And this was actually the piece that she was working on the night that she died, because she was always going to make the next record cover. That was kind of our deal. So this thing that's in the frame with the hand and the little crystal ball and stuff like that, it was unfinished. So we kind of filled the back in with some portraits and stuff like that. But this was the last piece that she was working on. And it kind of, and cap, it really, and it gives her essence of just kind of how she was. I mean, she was, she was like a million little things all glued together and very aerodescent. So that's the art that we chose for the cover. And she got to make the record cover, like she wanted to. So stoked on that. And yeah, the songs I think a lot of them are about just kind of what I was feeling at the time. And you know, there's a tune on there called wrestling and angel. There's one called still I crash, which is like pretty much me exactly. I think I wrote that like a days after she passed, just like me speaking to her, you know, talking about how I just feel like I'm, I got to learn how to walk all over again. You know, I feel like a baby deer and my legs are all wobbly. And I'm just trying to learn how to stand up on my own this time, you know, without her. And it's a, you know, so it's a pretty, a deep record. But there's some good stuff on there. You know, there's some blue grass on there. And that mill town flood, that's like a real, there's like some real characters that really were from me. We're back in the day and stuff. Really? Yeah. Yeah. I grew up in me or Michigan, which is like, yeah, remember you're talking about that. Yeah. It's like 600 people that live there, something. And nowadays it's kind of like a little, just a tiny little town doesn't have that much popping. But back in the 1800s, it was like kind of popping, you know, like there was like this whole little strip and they had these gristle mills and saw mills and they would float the logs down the Grand River down to the sawmill and then they'd chop it all up and then when the, the rail road came through there, then they could put all that lumber on the railroad and ship it out to, you know, Milwaukee or whatever. Yeah. And so it was a hustling, a hustling little place. There's this guy named Darwin Lyon. He was the station agent at the Grand Trunk Railroad's Montrose station, which was later named Muir. But yes, so he was the station agent there in Muir and this family, the Blanchard family was like some of the first people that like settled there and started, you know, making shit happen. And so I like used some of those characters and then kind of made this sort of fictional story about some actual non-fiction characters, you know. So I like that tune. I think that was a cool thing. I just, I've been infatuated with like the history of the area of, like, you know, just the Grand River Valley. Well, I knew you have a cot, you have your, uh, freak fare. Is it freak-fest? The Ionia Freak Fair, yeah. Yeah, Ionia Freak Fair. And that's something you're, you started, right? Yeah. Yeah. But I just think it's awesome to create something that people from the area can be a part of, you know, like, um, man, I've been trying to do this for years. I've been wanting to bring a festival to my hometown for a while now. But yeah, we got a bunch of good bands coming, uh, you know, Green Sky leftover Sam and Sierra Ho. Michael Cleveland and the Flame Keeper. Yep. Lindsay Lou. And then we're going to have like a, um, this tent where we're going to have some metal bands. Bane, Kryptop, C, Flesh and Blood robot, C you next Tuesday for the Fallen Dreams. Some of these bands I used to run around with, uh, back in the day when I played in metal bands and stuff. Oh, full cord. Yeah. Dude, that's so cool, bro. What a great thing to just bring to your area. Just a great week in a music. It's going to be sick. That's like in two, that's like in, uh, freaking two weeks. Yeah, man. It's going to be awesome. Oh, yeah. Yeah, dude. Thanks so much, man. Just for catching up today and stuff, for inviting us here, like, just to be in Grand Rapids. Like, um, it's cool, man. I'm remember when I came here, uh, we did a show here, and it was great. I actually have a friend named Paul that lives here that I just realized on the way in town. And you know, if I'm going to be able to get to see him, but I love you, Paul. I remember when I used to work here and I was dishwasher. He and I was on bus boys at this restaurant. And I found a, uh, Abbey Road cassette tape. It was the first time I'd ever heard the Beatles. And I put it in my, uh, in my, I had a 84, four desk where I put it in there. Do not listen to that for probably three years, dude. Yeah. I just saw your film bus boys. Oh, you saw it? I loved it. Did you? I left my ass off, dude. So I didn't know you were in that actual bus boy at one point. Oh, yeah, bro. I was in the trenches. Dude, I was one of the first bus boys to use creatine regularly. I was, man. We fucking did a good job on it. Bro, there wasn't a fucking dish. Dude, I'll say this west of the Mississippi. There wasn't a dish that I couldn't, that I couldn't fuck with. Yeah. I was fucking good, bro. I was good. I loved it so much. And then I think I got caught up in drugs that brought me down a little bit. I wasn't really like that, though. Like the, the servers were like, oh, hot shit. Oh, yeah. Like they were good looking and shit. And they would all fuck or whatever. And you couldn't, you like, they looked at you like, you couldn't even hold their condoms or whatever. Oh, man. It was just so trash, dude. Dang it. I know. But yeah, dude, and we had a dude, bro, we had this dude named Todd. He was, he was like part of some work release program there in Arizona. That's why I did it at. And he would fucking be, they had a chain, he would be chained like this fucking pizza oven that he was over there working. But they had like a six foot chain that he couldn't leave like the area or whatever. Dude, our freaking chef got busted for buying illegal shrimp. One day, like the, like, I guess the food and beverage, like if you go high enough in that department, someone get guns or whatever, because they came running in, bro, kicked open the back door. They had everybody on the ground, and they like busted the place for like buying illegal shrimp. Camaronus. And I was like, what the fuck is going on? Wow. But yeah, bro, thanks for checking it out, dude. It was a, it was a, it was crazy to make it, dude. We went through so much. Yeah. But I think I would do something fun again like that. Dude, he should. That's awesome, man. Yeah. I love that. We did it all ourselves. Yeah. Yeah. And to make a film with David Spay is probably a, oh, dude, dream come true, right? I can't even, I mean, we all grew up on fucking Joe dirt. Oh, dude, he shot, he did Joe dirt. I think they did Joe dirt too. And they shot it in Covington, Louisiana, which is probably enough to town that I grew up in. No, sure. Yeah. And then years later and I, he became friends and he's shooting a grownups three right now out of New Jersey. But did I used to love just, how just mean everybody is to Joe dirt. It's such bullshit. Like the very first scene, he like pulls up and you know, the guy's like, why don't you just drive this piece of shit off Cliff and do us all a favor. You know, and then Kid Rocks like such a dick to him. Deflap or fuck it. Yeah. Yeah. And the crazy part is is that them knowing each other is one of the reasons that I even got to meet Kid Rock. So it's just, it just, I don't know, life's the weirdest thing, isn't it? It is weird. Isn't it the weirdest thing? I mean, yeah, it's, I feel like my life definitely is, but I feel like probably everybody feels that way. Yeah. I think it's true. I think if you get out and try and just push yourself into life that there's like things happen. Yes. These pathways they connect and there's, there's all these circles that eventually you run back into the other side of that other circle or something. Yeah. Dreams get weaved, man. Yeah. Dreams get weaved, dude. If you feel comfortable, do you want to play a song for us on the way out? Sure. Is there something? I want to ask you too. I have a couple questions really quick. We have a quick segment that we do with Mountain Dew since you brought it up so many times. Can I ask you one or two questions? Yeah. All right. What should I give this try, bro? Yeah. It's sugar free. I haven't had Mountain Dew in fucking years. Probably a test. Hell yeah. It's good. Wow. It's been, that's a blast from the past. Not even Baja. Oh, yeah, regular. And when they came out with code red, dude, and people were like, this is for Valentine's only or whatever, like rich people or whatever. Yeah. Code red is like fucking, that's like two and five gone. Yeah.
It's good sugar. Don't even have to worry about it. That zebra sugar is kind of a vibe too. Same feeling no sugar It actually just tastes like Mountain Dew. Yeah Did you ever go to summer camp? No, I never went to summer camp. Um, I don't even know I Didn't know there was an option But I did one time our school When I was in like sixth grade, I think took us to like this like winter camp and that was like, you know, we were all like sledding and shit and I remember me and Mike Borton and Travis Rogers were always trying to go like sneak over and see these girls in their cabin and shit I remember like who was it back in the day Marissa Smith and a conrad and uh, like Risha Renucci and stuff Renucci girls were times bro. I don't know him, but I just know I could only imagine and I like to imagine Yeah, I had a big crush on Marissa Smith, but I was too shy and Just way too shy, bro, dude. I had a freaking crush on this one girl This one girl Amanda, dude, I had the fucking biggest crush on her this girl. I had a crush on her, dude And I only only think I could do I drew pictures over on my wall at home all the time And my mom got so pissed you know my mom ended up spanking me pretty bad for at one time Well, and it was so sad because I was like I like loved her so much And then I would just end up getting like spanked for it or whatever or beating or whatever I'm gonna say beating because you can't say anymore, but we used to call it beating So but time yeah winter camp never yeah, winter camp. That's kind of what it was, but a couple of my friends My friend Matt and my friend Brennan just dropped their kids off for summer camp just recently Yeah, and so they're they're out there having fun. Yeah, dude I wish I'd have gone to summer camp. We we went to like YMCA summer camp, but everybody got really bad allergies I think the field they put us in was like the world Yes, it was like it was like a right on the edge of a pine forest and like the whole thing was just so much pollen and people You try to play kickball, but like two minutes into the game people couldn't see or play it like it was people Just standing around the sun dude. I remember this one kid is out of you to get so bad He would just put his hands straight up in the air Almost like the cops were like the cops were getting him or whatever But dude it would be so bad and then we had to eat these hot lunches because there was nowhere to keep our lunches cold So we'd eat like these like just like baloney and cheese like and it was just like you would just sweat all day And then your mom would finally come get you like in the beginning You would be excited and at the end you'd like please mom come get me and they had one kid who was kind of like mentally challenged Whatever but he would do he would moonwalk all day And in the morning everybody's like you're a loser by the end of the end of the day Everybody's just like watching him day. It's oh yeah If you were doing a road trip this is the last question I if you were doing a road trip what small town Would you go to or would you suggest someone go to? Oh I have to think about this for a moment. He has a nice one in Michigan. I Know there are but is there a nice one that you suggest? I mean Oh like I mean there's so many small towns around here like if you drive in any direction You're gonna find like these tiny little towns that have been there for ages But they're just tiny like there's one called Sparta You know greenville belting and stuff, but honestly I own you as a nice one. I was gonna say Mewer You know, but that's I'm obviously biased, but that's okay. It's a beautiful place I mean it's the Maple River runs through there and it's it's a tiny little town. There's there's some history there There's not much there you might get all the copper wires stolen out of your vehicle or something they need it Yeah Village Amirah right there showed to me Well, dude my town Covington, Louisiana is a small town But dude I went back not long ago and I was just walking around downtown. It's great. Yeah, there's a lot of like nice like First of all, there's a lot of great people and it's it's changing and I didn't I didn't know if I expected that when I was growing up There like it's always been a place with like great storytelling and just like Like kind of mystery and stuff like that an intrigue, but it's turning into like the most beautiful little town Village Amirah right there That you right there Billy that is yeah stop they put this sign up that says No home town of Grammy winner Billy Strings It says 2021, but they need to put three time on there now. Let's update that sign Mewer I'm gonna donate to the coffers over there Mewer, so they have enough money to update that sign dude No joke. We're gonna reach out to the We're gonna reach out to the city council over there and see if we can't get that you know updated That's awesome. We could buy the you know village market and turn it into a titty bar or something. I think that'd be probably a good venture Oh, yeah, as long as we keep someone like the produce section or something. I mean, I want people to be able to get fresh stuff Hell yeah, you know, yeah, cuz I'm not saying the cities won't be friends, but you know, it's TBD man. Yeah, I mean It'll be something there might be some kind of pirate-esque kind of things going on. Yeah Yeah, dude Yeah, you want to you want to play one on the way out first, but you don't feel like after that. We can also just call it a day Yeah, I'd love to man. Would you really do? Yeah, let's go Heck yeah, dude Yeah, man Let's see I was thinking about this tune because we were talking about the village market and Kind of made me hungry. Yeah, yeah So maybe we'll go get something to eat after this, but this will get us in the mood. All right Oh Shoulder up the gun and whistle up the dog shoulder up the gun and whistle up the dog off to the woods for to catch a groundhog Oh Run here sell with a snickering a green run here sell with a snickering a green ground hog grease All over her chin over on home Run here sell with a 10 foot pole on here selling with a 10 foot pole twist that whistle I've got his whole old ground home There's meat in the covered in butter in the churn meat in the covered in butter in the churn that ain't ground hog I'll be done. Oh There's a little piece of corn bread laying on the shelf A little piece of corn bread laying on the shelf if you want any more you can take it to yourself Don't eat up the meat and save the hide eat up the meat and say the hide the best damn shoestring that everyone's tied I'll look at the fillers are about to fall look at the fillers are about to fall they eat till the bitches won't button at all Oh
♪ ♪ The shoulder at the gun in the whistle of the dog ♪ Off to the woods for to catch a groundhog ♪ Oh, groundhog ♪ ♪ Oh, groundhog ♪ Oh, groundhog ♪ Oh, groundhog Let's go! Groundhog, baby. God! You think they're good? Would you try one? Yeah. I would too. Got a hog in it. You know, it's not probably wild, you know. I'd go in it with a bacon mindset, probably, to be honest. I'd hate that. Yeah, I'd bet they're nice and greasy. They kind of get off easy, though, having a hog in their name. Yeah. And not being like a costed for it, you know. Not being put in that place. Well, yeah. Thank you, dude. Thank you, man. Appreciate your brother. Thank you. I appreciate you too, man. Thank you so much. Of course. Anything else you want to talk about, anything else you want to play? ♪ ♪ I could try one off the new record. Yeah, if you feel okay, but don't feel like you have to. Let's see. Well, you know, I was talking about me, and how I just get kind of obsessed with that place and just that whole Grand River Valley there. And you ever go driving through your old hometown and just like look at your old haunts and just kind of get flooded with these memories? I'm one of those like real nostalgic types. Oh, I love nostalgia, man. Yeah. So I have this tune that's called that. It's called "I'm One of Those." ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ I'm looking for the place I used to live. I've been driving, I've been down this road. Trying to bring back old memories for one reason or another. I let go. I'm one of those I'm looking for the town. Where the river used to make a bend. But it's been too long, and I'm a fool to try to find that place again. I'm one of those. Yes, I have too much time on my hands, I'm one of those. I could not find a place that I could land, I hope you don't. But if you do, you'll probably understand that's how it goes. I'm one of those. ♪ ♪ I've got a thing for shuffle in the day. Leaving town in the cover of the night. And I've got ties that might need, if I don't, I know I'll end up in a fight. Now could I go back to the place I loved to dwell? Where we sang our song and passed the jug around. I let go of those that wander back across this road, I'm strolling down. I'm one of those. I guess I had too much time on my hands, I'm one of those. I'm one of those. ♪ ♪ Oh! ♪ ♪ Let's go! ♪ ♪ It's hard for folks to see through my disguise. I'm not home, but I can still pretend. And if I went left Ukraine, I might have to circle back this way again. I'm one of those. Guess I had too much time on my hands, I'm one of those. I'm one of those. ♪ ♪ I'm one of those. ♪ ♪ I'm one of those, man, dude, that's magnificent, bro. Thank you so much, man. So much for good vibes. So much for good vibes comes out August 28th. Yeah. Dude, that's so exciting, man. Dude, I'm one of those, man. I'm one of those. Sometimes I spend so much time in the past, I'm out of stone, you know. But at a certain point, you start missing out too much. Yeah, no, you got to look through the windshield, you know. Instead of in the rear view all the time. Yeah, they said that's why it's bigger. Somebody said that. I don't know if they said that. Yeah. Oh, yeah. You like nicking your hand and giving everybody kisses? Yeah, this thing. This is the best day I've been on in a wildest. ♪ ♪ So much for good vibes. That's out August 28th, man. But your mom's beautiful artwork right there. Yeah. What a creative lady. What a creative family, man. You know? I don't know. What a creative family you're a part of. ♪ ♪ I kind of think I'm the first one I did. Cocaine Blues. Cocaine. ♪ ♪ There is this little one that I could add on there. Even just for fun since we're sitting here. All right. ♪ ♪ I've got the blues. Those Nashville blues. I've got the blues. The Nashville blues. I ain't got no hair. Ain't got no shoes. These people here. They treat me fine. These people here. They treat me fine. They feed me beer. And they feed me wines. I've got the blues. I ain't got no hair. Ain't got no shoes. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ I'm going back to Arkansas. I'm going back to Arkansas. I'm going to stay right there. With my own paws. I've got the blues. I've got the blues. ♪ Those next few blues, I ain't got no hair ♪
♪ In a mushroom ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ I've got the blues ♪ ♪ Those Nashville blues ♪ ♪ Ain't got no hair ♪ ♪ Ain't got no shoes ♪ ♪ So much for good vibes, man. Ain't got no hat or shoes there. He don't got no shoes or no hat. He don't even have a collar on it now. Oh, what a pleasure, man. Dude, Billy, thank you so much, bro. Thanks for coming. This is, man, just what a gift today to be able to just sit and spend time with you to kind of go through whatever's been happening in your life. And you just share stories so well, man. You're just like, I don't know. You're like a poor, you're kind of like this connector piece to the other side, man. And it's nice. Thank you, man. Well, I appreciate it, and I'm glad. I'm glad you're doing this road trip, man. And was able to swing on up through my stomping grounds a little bit. It's kind of nice to have you here in Grand Rapids, man. Yeah, we appreciate it, man. And, uh, yeah. And good luck with, uh, freak fest. Yeah. Yeah. Um, yeah. And good luck with, freak fest and, um, belly strings, man. Can't thank you enough, dude. All right. I can't thank you enough. Keep your stick on the ice. Yeah. Don't let your meat loaf. Watch your top, not. Keep it greasy side down. Yeah, greasy side. Oh, I think both sides are greasy. But we'll do our best, man. Feeling bad by midnight? Come home. Yeah. Stay out of the tall weeds. Yeah. You're a gift to this world, man. And you're a gift to us today. Thank you so much, brother. Thank you. All righty. Now, I'm just floating on the breeze. And I feel I'm falling like these leaves. I must be corner stoned. Yeah. I'm corner stoned. Oh, but when I reach that ground, I'll share this piece of mine. I found I can feel it in my bones. But it's gonna take.
Podcast Summary
Key Points:
Billy Strings discusses his upbringing in Ionia, Michigan, including teenage partying, local legends, and the impact of drugs on his community, with several friends dying from overdoses.
He recounts breaking his leg while skateboarding backstage after a show, the painful surgery, and a vivid ketamine-induced experience during treatment.
He details his struggles with addiction, describing himself as an addict who cannot trust himself with substances.
He shares the emotional story of his mother’s death from a methamphetamine overdose, his discovery of her stash, and his initial thought to keep some for himself, which he ultimately disposed of.
He reflects on his biological father, who died of an overdose when Billy was two, and recent discoveries of old tapes that reveal his father’s love and possible murder, along with his mother’s wild past and family history.
Summary:
In this conversation, Billy Strings opens up about his life, blending nostalgia, humor, and deep vulnerability. He starts by reminiscing about his youth in Ionia, Michigan—house parties, local characters, and the tragic loss of friends like Kevin Clayton to drug overdoses, which shaped his understanding of addiction and mortality. He also shares a lighthearted story about his father scaring him as a child with a wolf mask, stemming from his love of old monster movies.
A major focus is his recent leg injury, sustained while skateboarding backstage after a show. He describes the break, the surgery, and a bizarre ketamine experience that left him feeling frozen in another dimension, as well as his decision to give his pain medications to his wife to avoid falling back into addictive patterns.
The emotional core is his mother’s death from a methamphetamine overdose. Billy recounts finding her stash and his shocking first instinct to save some for later, illustrating the power of addiction. He honors her as a beautiful, psychic, and whimsical soul who loved music and lived a wild life. He also reveals new information about his biological father, who died when Billy was two, possibly murdered via a hot shot. Listening to old recorded tapes has helped him realize his father loved him, challenging his childhood resentment and deepening his grieving process.
FAQs
The album is set to be released on August 28th.
It was filmed at Mackinac Harvest Studios in Grand Rapids, Michigan.
He broke his leg while skateboarding backstage after a show in Charlottesville, Virginia, when he slipped out on a back 180 trick and his body twisted on his foot.
He described it as a terrifying psychedelic experience where he felt frozen in a white space, turned into computer code, and thought he was dead or an inanimate object.
He gave all his pain meds to his wife to manage, because he knows he is an addict and feared he would misuse them.
Kevin Clayton was a close friend of Billy Strings from Ionia who was known for being crazy and fun, but he struggled with substance abuse and died of an overdose.
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