If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, with your hosts. Salta Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. Almost downloaded Fitness Health and Entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pumping. Today's episode, callers called in. We got to coach them live on air, but this was after an intro. Today's intro was 60 minutes long. Now in the intro, we talk about muscle gain and fat loss and fitness and diet. We also talk about current events and family life. Look, if you want to be on an episode like this, here's what you do. Submit your question to nplivecaller.com. Now this episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Caldera Lab. Today we talked about their hydro layer. There's compounds in the hydro layer that will hold thousands of times more moisture than other compounds. In other words, you put this on your face and it's very hydrating. They have other skincare products. Go check them out. Go to calderalab.com/mindpump. Use the code Mind Pump 20. Get 20% off your first order. The episode is also brought to you by Keon. Makers of high quality high class supplements. Are favorites? Are there essential amino acids? 40% of which are losing. You need the amino acid, losing to be that high because that's what triggers muscle growth. It's the losing. Without high losing, you're wasting your money. Go to getkeon.com. That's getkein.com/mindpump. That link will get you 20% off. We also have a brand new workout program. Maps up or lower. It's a four day workout split. We have male and female version in there. Workout demos, exercise demos, new coaching videos. And you'll get live coaching with our personal trainer here at Mind Pump Coal. Sign up, get 40% off. Go to maps, upper lower.com, use the code launch to get it 40% off back to the show. All right, real quick. If you love us, like we love you, why not show it by rocking one of our shirts, hats, mugs, or training gear over at Mind Pump Store.com. I'm talking right now, hit pause, head on over to Mind Pump Store.com. That's it. Joy rest of the show. There are six fitness truths that 95% of people get dead wrong and listen. They're quietly sabotaging your results. We're going to talk about them right now. Let's get to it. Oh, dead wrong. So these are the top six fitness truths, or say, myths. Right? We're going to talk about what the truth is. But these are the myths that people still believe that really messes them up. And I'll start with the first one, which is you don't need to train five or six days a week to get to build muscle or get jacked or get strong. Not only do you not need to do that, but most people doing that would get worse results than if they strength trained maybe three days a week or two days a week. Yeah. So this is still a common thought. I guess it's just the more is better. And I mean, we're always talking about, you know, like over training is one of those things. And two, we kind of a little bit of a bias because of the type of person that's listening to podcasts already. That's an avid lifter. Sure. So, you know, but like the comments sent like I've talked to a few of my friends even still and they think that six days a week is going to get you to move the needle the most. It's the confusion around what you can tolerate versus what is ideal. Right. And I always talk about how the why this is so difficult is because it's really the only thing I can think of that we deal with that more doesn't serve us. You know, the more you study for a test, the more you work hard at your job, the more you push your education, rewards us for doing for doing more. And unfortunately, when it comes to body composition change, losing body fat building muscle, more is not there's there's a there's a right dose. There's an optimal dose. There's a less optimal dose. And then there's a bad dose and it's a spectrum and more and unfortunately more people more people tend to go with the ins of the spectrum that they do nothing. Right. And then they decide to do something and they do so they do everything they can tolerate or handle thinking that that's that's going to get them to their goal faster when in reality. They land somewhere in the middle of that spectrum is what would be optimal or ideal and for most people that's about three times a week. And most for most people so people get confused with the difference between working out and being active. So I think that's part of it. We're told that we need to be active on a daily basis, which is true. You need to move on a daily basis. If you work out two or three days a week that doesn't mean that you're not trying to move on the other days. And you could accomplish that through walking or other types of activity. Basically, you just don't be sitting for most of the day, which is what most people these days tend to do. So that's number one. So what we're talking about is a workout. We're talking about training. We're talking about strength training. And strength training is all of it. All it's doing is it's sending a signal that telling it's telling your body to adapt. But part of that signal is sent or a lot of that signal is sent because of the stress that the exercise will work out is applying on your body. And your body has a limited capacity for adaptation and for healing. And so, and by the way, they're both, although there's a crossover there, part of the healing process from damage for lack of red term from exercise is adapting. But adapting is also separate. In other words, you can work out and heal and work out and heal and work out and heal. But never give your body the ability or chance to adapt. You're not going to progress. Right. Adapting is getting stronger. Adapting is building muscle. Now, the data on this is very interesting. Okay. On healthy college aged males. That's what these 99% of these studies are done on healthy college aged males. Here's what they find. Three days a week of strength training will give you 85% of every possible result you could ever wish to accomplish from strength training. In other words, think of the peak strength, peak muscle building benefits or end result you could accomplish. 85% of that can be accomplished with just three days which by the way is normally way beyond what most people even want. It's way beyond it. And it doesn't mean you get there slower. That's the potential. Yeah. It doesn't mean you get there 85% slower. It just means that's your ultimate potential. But here's the other problem. We're looking at when you look at studies like this, healthy college age males. Most people who start strength training, number one, are not healthy. They're out of shape. They're just starting to work out. Number two, they're not college ails. College age. They have other stressors. And so two or three days a week becomes ideal. And more than that doesn't get them more results. It actually takes away from the fact 90% of the time when we talk to people listeners of the show or callers or we work with clients who come who are like, "Hey, I've been working out five days a week in the gym and I'm struggling. We cut them down to three days a week. They all get better results." Yeah. Every time it's so crazy to me, even when we put them on less volume, like a 15-minute protocol, it blows their mind. Because there's just a start. Again, to your point of everything else works that way. You put more work in, you get more return from that. But we just don't account for recovery as being like a massive lever in this entire process. And so to space that out and allow your body to really not just heal because then what, we're not making progress, we're kind of at the same spot. But now adapt. And so to have that, it's really a science to it that people disregard. Well, and if you're listening and you're already somebody who's training six days a week, also in South said this, but I just want to reiterate this, that when we move people from six days a week down to three days, it's not like we say those are the three days sit on your couch and do nothing. It's like, yeah, be active. In fact, what normally we ended up doing for someone who's already been training five six days, it's like, we just replaced that hour of training in the gym with walking. Like, go walk, go walk, be active. Walk to mobility. Yeah, do something, do stuff to be active. We're not incurred, we're not telling somebody who's already got momentum in the gym six days a week. And it's like, oh, you need to stop training and eliminate three days and do nothing. It's that's more than enough of a stress signal from weightlifting to build muscle and to lose body fat. You don't need any more. So let's do this three days a week and then the other two or three days a week, let's do this other thing that's more recuperative mobility or mobility walking, things like that, maybe yoga depending on the person, right? Those types of practices will probably better serve 90 plus percent of the population that is trying to get in shape. Right. Next, this is another fitness truth. Cardio is not the best way to lose fat, and especially not the best way to lose fat long term. As a form of exercise, cardio of astroactivity is healthy. It boosts endurance and stamina. It does those things very, very well. But it is actually not an effective way to lose fat, especially when you compare it to another form of exercise known as strength training. So in the data, and they've compared them head to head everybody. Okay. So this is not like this is us guessing or just based off our experience. When you look at the data, when people are on a restricted calorie diet, one that induces weight loss and they combine it with exercise, strength training results in all fat loss, cardio results in fat and muscle loss. So the weight on the scale actually is similar. So the weight loss looks similar. Cardio will actually help induce muscle loss, which your body wants to do when you're in a subcalorie diet. Strength training keeps the muscle. So to say differently, the best form of exercise for fat loss, just pure fat loss, strength training. A lot of people think it's cardio because cardio makes you sweat. And it does indeed burn a lot of calories. It shrinks you overall, mass down to that point. So that's misleading for a lot of people because they get excited about the weight on the scale. Right. But however, we haven't teased out.
how much fat and actual muscle you've lost as well. - Do you guys think, I mean, I feel like this is getting better, the messaging around that. - Totally. - Like, the camera we were getting there. - Yeah, I remember when we first came out, we did this, in fact, this was some of our first viral clips and episodes that we did, you know, almost 10 years ago that where we said things like cardio sucks for fat loss and oh boy, we would just-- - Yep. - Wow, everybody, people would be in the comments. - Oh yeah, that one used to piss everybody off and then we'd have to go and explain what we're talking about. I do feel like I see more fitness influencers preaching this message now, which it wasn't until just not that long ago that I think you heard this. I think it was still known as a good strategy for this. - The best evidence for this, for what you said, I've observed the same thing at 'em, but you're like, okay, where are the objective? Is this objectively true? Or is this just us noticing what we're noticing? The best evidence of this is the footprint of big box gyms now has changed. - Sure. - So the number one goal that somebody has when they sign up at a gym is fat loss. That's everybody's goal. Weight loss, fat loss, right? Everybody wants to do that. And so now the big box gyms with the footprint used to look like was a majority of the space was dedicated to cardio equipment. Because everybody want to weight loss, everybody want fat loss. So it's lots of cardio. The footprints are changing. They're swapping out cardio space for strength training space. So yes, the message is starting to come out. - That's a good point. - And the data does support it. Next up, your metabolism is in broken. It has more to do with your habits. Now I do want to say this, like you can have a metabolic rate that's making it more difficult. Your metabolism adapts to your behaviors. But it's not broken. A broken metabolism literally would mean that you die. - Yeah. - It would mean that your body doesn't work. So metabolism is a word that encompasses a lot of complex processes in the body. And to put it very simply, it's how your body takes food and turns it into usable energy and what it does with that energy. Okay, and that's a very super ultra simplified definition. But it's very, very complex. And your metabolism can adapt in different directions. You can encourage your metabolism to speed up, to burn more calories. You can encourage your metabolism to slow down or to burn less calories. And unfortunately, a lot of people's attempts at weight loss really don't take this into consideration. And what they experience is a metabolism that adapts downward, which results in a really frustrating plateau. And it typically looks like this. Like I want to lose 20 pounds or 30 pounds. I lose 10 pounds because I'm doing all this activity. I'm doing all this cardio. I'm cutting my calories. And I've lost 10. But now I'm stuck. And so then, what do I do now? I know, let me do more activity. And let me even less. And then they lose another five pounds. And then they're in this place with a like, okay, I don't want to work out even more. And I can't eat even less. I'm already so little, how can I maintain this? My metabolism must be broken. No, it's not broken. The things you did encouraged it to push it to adapt downward. And now you're in this situation where you're fighting a very efficient metabolism, which is very, very difficult. Yeah, I don't like this one because it implies like there's something wrong with you. When in fact, your metabolism is working great. It's doing exactly what you told it to you. And I think that's so important to distinguish the difference between that because you want to be at a place where you take responsibility for what it's doing. Otherwise, you won't learn from your mistakes from what you've previously done. It's like, yeah, your metabolism is really slow, not because you genetically have a slow metabolism or it's broken. It's because for a period of time, you have continued to under eat calories, overtrain the body. And so it's adapted in a manner that is going to survive. And it's actually working really well to do that by slowing the metabolism down. The exciting thing is you can absolutely change that by creating different behaviors, which should be things like strength training, feeding the body properly and building muscle and change that. So it's a really positive thing. And it's your metabolism working incredibly well. But I do think that a lot of people, I don't know if that's a, like a victim mindset that we tend to have where it's like, you want to defer the responsibility of like, I'm overweight because I have a confusion, you know, too. Because things aren't working out, but like, yeah, you're not pointing to the fact that what you're presenting your body environment wise is what it's responding to. And so, you know, if I'm burning an excess amount of calories, I'm not, you know, eating enough. But, you know, if I'm not strength training and then eating protein, like, you know, I'm not sending that anabolic signal. I'm not telling, you know, my body, I need to, you know, build up muscle to resist this force that I'm constantly facing. And this is like a habitual thing. I'm facing this. Now, I'm facing the opposite, which is like, now I'm in a bit of famine. So now my body has to store this energy and it's in preserve it. And it's doing what it's supposed to do. No, well said, it's, it's, I get why people say this because I think it's confusing. Because to them, all the evidence points in the direction of, I've got a metabolism, doesn't work. Because before I was doing no exercise and before I was eating, like all kinds of food. Now I'm doing cardio four days a week for 45 minutes. And I've cut my calories really low. I'm like eating, you know, frozen meals, right? I'm eating on this plan and I've lost this weight, but I've plateaued. And it's like, why can't I lose this last 15 pounds or last 20 pounds? It must be broken. Not only that, but does that mean I got to keep doing this for the rest of the rest. I got to eat this little and move this much to keep it off. And it's not. So you can, you can move in the other direction, the other direction looks like this, building strength, building muscle, eating a high protein diet. Okay. Those things move the metabolic rate in the other direction at the very least, prevent some of the downward adaptation that comes from a subcalor diet. All right. Next up, protein timing matters way less than total daily intake. So sometimes there's a lot of emphasis and I think this is supplement companies do this. And this was especially true back in the day on when you needed to eat your protein and how important it was that you ate it, maybe around your workout, whatever. This makes a little difference, like a tiny difference. The total protein you eat for the day is what makes the big difference. This is like 99% of what you're going to get for protein. Now protein timing matters in the sense that what helps you get your total protein intake to where it needs to. Yeah. That's when timing matters. How you can digest, synthesize it, all that. That's right. I would make the case to it where it matters and what we speak to is, like for example, you're timing it when you decide to eat it first in your meal. Exactly. And so if it changes good behaviors. Exactly. Right. So this makes a difference. Timing it around a workout to hit the anabolic window to get the bus muscle building effect from it is. It was where the test wasn't marketing. Yeah. This doesn't matter. This is putting hairs the difference on this. But learning to target protein to start your day off with a good high protein meal. It's not doing anything magical other than it's going to almost certainly set you up for success with hitting your protein versus you not like you skipping a meal or not hitting protein in the morning. It makes it difficult for that. More behavioral based. Totally. Then it is what's doing to your body scientifically. That's right. 100%. Next up, flexibility work is useless. If you're weak, you don't want to be weak and flexible. That causes problems. That's a risk, a high risk of injury. So mobility is a term that some people confuse mobility with flexibility. But the way we define mobility is having strength and control within a particular range of motion or a ideal range of motion. Flexibility without strength is loose and injury prone. Think of a one year old. Like a one year old that you can bend them in all kinds of different directions very weak. Put some weight on a one year old. They're themselves hyper mobility, which is a term that describes people lots of flexibility without good strength. There's some of the most injury prone people on the planet. So if you're like, man, I'm tight. I need to go focus on being flexible. Your best bet is to do strength training in good ranges of motion and challenge ranges of motion, increase those range of motion with strength because strength is what gives you stability. The flexibility component without strength is instability. Yeah. And to be fair, mobility is considered strength training, which, you know, it's active flexibility. This is active passive flexibility and I think those two, like some people don't know the difference between the two and to really have that ownership and be able to recruit within certain ranges of motion and have it be useful. So, you know, I can take myself out of these positions and, you know, be active in recruiting these muscles in that position. You know, that's valuable. And then, you know, that's pretty much the precursor to then loading it. And then we're going to load it and we're going to get stronger in that position, which is, you know, that's all the value. But flexibility itself, if you're not addressing that your week, yeah, you're leaving yourself vulnerable. I think the most important point to be made to this right here is the person that I think of that still falls in this trap is somebody who has decided that they are going to make a change, get healthier, get fit. And their midlife, they have some chronic pain and tightness and stiffness. And so, their logic is, oh, before I start to, I know I need a strength train, but before I do that, I think I'm going to take yoga classes and stretch and really work on my flexibility before I go lift weight.
'cause my hips already bother me, my low back already bothers me, but what they don't realize is a lot of that chronic pain is due to weakness and instability. And one of the best things to combat that would be to strength training. Strength training is going to build that strength, that stability, that resiliency. And so I think there is this myth that they need to go stretch and loosen up 'cause they feel first stiff and crampant first. - No, here's the truth. So a lot of people don't know this. The reason why your body gets tight, the reason why your shoulder gets tight, or your hamstrings get tight, or your hips feel tight, is not because you have muscles that are like rubber bands that are cold that need to be stretched. That's not what's happening. Your central nervous system controls the flexibility of the muscles. If I rip the muscle off your body and place it on a table, it would be, I'd be able to move it no problem. Your CNS, your central nervous system, is telling those muscles to stay tight to create stability. So when you're weak, and you have instability because your muscles aren't strong enough to support particular range of the motion, the CNS tightens the muscles up around those air activates. And it keeps them tight. It doesn't let them move much. And that's where the tightness comes from. So tightness comes from weakness. - And that's also where a lot of the chronic pain comes from. It's right. - That tightness ends up being tightness and it's pulling on the hips. It's pulling on the back. It's pulling on the knee. - And then you can't move right? - Yeah. And so then you have this chronic pain. And most people interpret that as, oh, I have all these tight muscles and I have chronic pain. And so they sign up for yoga because that seems like the logical thing to do in that situation when in reality, what you're saying is, no, it's because you're weak and unstable that you feel this way. And the best thing that we could possibly do is that sign up for a yoga class. It actually would go get strong lifting weights. And that will solve most of these problems. - That's right. And last, the real fountain of youth is not an appeal or a shake or a supplement. It's in the weight room. So all exercise done properly improves longevity and improves quality of life and all the data supports this. So as you get older, if you stay active in your exercise versus your peers who maybe don't do those things, your quality of life is significantly higher. But among all of the forms of exercise, one of them really makes a big difference with this and it's strength training. If we had to label a form of exercise as the fountain of youth, it's strength training. What happens as you get older? You lose muscle mass, you lose strength, you lose bone mass, you lose mobility and stability. You see people falling. You also get what's called insulin resistance because so higher rates of things like diabetes, metabolic health starts to go down. One form of exercise directly combats that. The other forms of exercise help with all of that, but strength training directly combats that. How? It makes you stronger. So your muscles get stronger and they get a little bigger. Your bones get stronger as a result. You have improved insulin sensitivity 'cause muscles are very insulin sensitive. You're less likely to fall because now you're stronger. And if you do fall, you're less likely to break something because things are much stronger. So strength training is the fountain of youth if we had to label a form of exercise. Muscle is the organ of longevity. I love that, I love that because I think that's exactly what that represents. And so yeah, lift weights don't focus so much on all the supplements and pills and shakes and the latest fad that's out there. Go to the gym two, three times a week, get strong and you'll live longer. That's right. So Adam, I was gonna ask you because you were just talking off air how are you using? We did a commercial a few weeks ago on Caldera Labs HydroLayer. Yeah, so I didn't realize, I always felt guilty. So that I wasn't using that. I was using the base layer, which they come in in a similar bottle, but they're different. Yeah. So the HydroLayer is literally to improve moisture. Yes, yes. Really like it. I love, still love the base layer too, but it's like a thicker cream. Yeah. It's more like a, like a, like a, like a, like a paste, but it's kind of like a creamy. Yeah, where's the HydroLayer? I know, it's so funny listening to us try and talk about men's face cream stuff like that. You could tell, I mean, you could tell how genuine it is because we like it seems to know nothing. Just know that I like it. It more works. Yeah. And, you know, like I couldn't even tell you the scientific difference between the base layer and the HydroLayer, I can tell you the difference of the texture of it and how it feels. And it's the HydroLayer is much more moisturizing or makes my skin feels really good, especially with my dry skin, my psoriasis and stuff that I'm always constantly battling and dealing with. And I just started using that. So I've added that now to the rotation. The HydroLayer was not part of it and I really like it. I don't know if you've done it, Doug, if you were already on the-- Yeah, no, I just started. I just got my first jar of it probably a week ago. Oh, you too, then. Okay, cool. So I don't feel so bad that I was the only one. That's the one that, that's my wife's favorite one of all their products. Yeah, it does hydrate. Yeah. So sometimes you put things on your skin and they make it feel more dry. Yeah. Actually, you like really makes it feel-- Yeah, yeah, yeah. I actually, I relevant all over my face and head. Oh, yeah, yeah. So it feels really good. So I'm a big fan of that too. I'm putting on my head soon. Yeah. I was on the sun the other day. It's our buffing day. And I'm like, now I'm starting to have to put a hat on, dude. I'll get a sunburn on my head. Which I've never done before. Oh, God. Oh, I'm close, dude. I've seen videos of myself, you know, when I'm doing like-- So especially-- That's the hardest thing. Well, see here on camera here, you see from me from the front, so I can't tell. But I do-- you know, I have this series I do called to his kingdom with Dylan. And that one, you see me from all angles, because I'm working out. And there's times when I'm like doing like a bent over fly or a row. And I'm like-- And he's like, and I see it. And I'm like, oh, wow. That's it. There's no hiding that at all. Oh, no. I'm old and bit to-- That was it for me. That was all it took was the team shooting video. I mean, I had-- Because like you said, I see this stuff. Right. And you know, I was like, oh, I'm fine. And then it was a shot like that. It doesn't help too a lot of times are shooting you with underlights and things like that camera just just-- Like, oh, man. I remember getting mad at everybody for not telling me. Really? Yeah, because I don't feel like anybody was telling me back there. I wasn't teasing you back then. No, I wasn't until-- I think it was after I started admitted and talked about it. Then it was like-- I don't know if it's a story. Yeah, then it was fair game. Lay into me with them. And I'm like, I was mad that nobody said-- I was really mad my wife. From was like, you let me walk around like that. It's fine. You know, it's something. Yeah, I see all of that. The best thing's not losing a single nothing. I mean, it's short now, but like-- That was intentional. It was so mad. It was covering all of that. Yeah, I know. Such a blast. Waitin' until-- Blast for me, bro. I mean, I'll ride-- I go through periods. I'll probably go through a period. I'll do my hair a lot more. But I'm waiting for it to just turn completely white. That's my goal. I don't think it will. I think it's just going to stay kind of great like that. It's pretty great, dude. My dad's kind of-- You know, it's-- Is it white? Yeah, it's like-- It shifted. Yeah. Oh, wow. It's full of hot. But then white doesn't shift to quite a bit later. I imagine you're going to be-- Yeah, you're going to be gray silver for a long time before you go all white. You know who I just saw in a show? I just saw a show with him. His Richard gear. And he's all white now. And I never seen him all white. He was always-- Oh, he's gray. Yeah, he's always been gray. Like, he's always been-- He's got to be in the '70s now, right? Yeah, so-- And I think that-- Like, wizard status, dude. Yeah, I'm looking forward to it. Yeah, see? Yeah, see what he looks like now. Like, he was always gray, right? He always had like good gray-- he was like that gray-- and pretty woman. So pretty woman. That's what I see. Justin's hair is like that. Like, he's got that. That good salt pepper mix, you know? Yes, it's peppery. Yeah. But he's white. It's white now. But it took all the way till now till I seen him like this. Where he-- how old is he, Doug? 70? Maybe more. I'm seeing. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah, he's somewhere around there, right? He is 76. 76. Oh, wow. He's still doing shows, too. I just saw a new show that he-- All of the people we did, we grew up watching, you know? They're all in their 70s, dude. Exactly. It's crazy. What's the best of slow now? He's in his 70s, right? He might be 80. No, no, no, no. He's not? No, he can't be. Is he mid-delay? 70s? I think he's 79. Bro, 80s. Bro, that's 80s. That's 70s. My boy. I know. I can't listen. I'm not-- I'm not going to jinx. OK, but she's got-- man, when that-- because he's like a hero, mine, dude. Something happens to-- The RL-78. That'll be the RL-78. So the RL is almost 80. Yeah, that'll be-- Arnold was a hero, mine, for a long time. And I still think he's like the epitome of the American dream, literally, like immigrant success, all that stuff. Yeah, stories. But he said some stupid stuff. He's really rooted. He really rooted, very close. And he drew it for us. Oh, God. And he has-- do you follow him enough to know if he backpedaled from that? No. He never really-- He really doubled down. They never really came back. I get a vibe that RL-7 just kind of says what he thinks he's supposed to sometimes. Fortunately, he's in with the politicians. Yeah. He'll just say things a little-- Now, he can't-- because he's a first-generation immigrant, he can only go so far in the politician. Yeah, he was governor, and I was about it. That's as high as you can get, isn't it? I don't think you can be-- No, he can't be president. I know he definitely can be president. I don't think you can run in Congress, either. I think you can, yeah. Yeah, I don't know how-- I'm Congress? I think you can. I think it's just president. It is only a president. Oh, OK. Yeah. So maybe he'll do that. Maybe that's what he's-- Yeah. You think so? Yeah, I think he's done. I remember when his workout partner, Colombo, died, remember that? You know, he died. He drowned. Oh, he drowned. Yeah, did he find out swimming super far? Really? And then he ended up drowning. Something happened. That's weird. I know. That's not a super sad-- Yeah, a super sad. Was it how old was he, do you remember? I want to say he was 76 or 75 when he died. Maybe we'll find out here. 78. He was 78. And he died by drowning. - except for a medical emergency while swimming on the coast of Sardinia. - Oh, was he doing like a legit?
and then had like a hard time or something. - I mean, 78 and swimming is like a legit swim. - It was really sad to hear Arnold talk about Franco after he passed the ball. - Happy, really sad. - Do it like exercising like that. - Exercise like that. - It's hard to go like that. - Hey, what did you think of? I sent you over a list. - Oh, pull it up, that's from the five luxury purchases. - Yeah, so Sam par has a group that I've been a part of for several years now. If you've been listening long enough, you've probably heard me talk about the Hampton group, which is just a collection of all founders and CEOs. And he's done some really cool stuff I like. So I follow his podcast and some of his content still and he's talking about stuff. And yeah, I do, I like a lot of stuff he's done it. And he's now, I mean, he's got this massive Hampton's huge, right? It's worldwide. And it's got, so he's got this great tons of data of, and everybody that's in there are very successful entrepreneurs. So he's got all this collection of all these very, very successful founders. And so he gathers a lot of good data from all these different owners and founders and companies. And one of the things he recently ran was like, he ran this, basically this article, five luxury purchases that actually worked the money. - So it says he interviewed 80 or 80 founders ranging from, and they're worth from 10 million to 4 billion. - Yeah. - And here's what they said about what they regret, or don't regret. - Yeah, basically it's what they're, what the top five ways of using their money. And so he had a even deeper, this is a piece of, I read the whole thing, especially really cool. He's like, he had interviewed all of them. So I actually went through, I mean, he showed me when he was doing this, he actually had me look at it before he posted it and shared it publicly. And it was really cool. I got to go through like each individual, one of these millionaire and billionaires. And they had a breakdown of their total money expenses, and they shared with him like, what they spend it on, all the, and so that's, he's collected all that. And then he's distilled this post down to the five things that's actually worth their money. But the way he got to this was actually very thorough. It was like a very detailed, personal report from every single one of these founders, how they spend their monthly money. And it's ranging from people, their net worth is from as 4 million all the way to $10 billion. - Well, let's see what it says. So number one is buying back your time. So every hour spent doing stuff you hate is an hour not doing spent time with your kids or building the next thing. So one founder said hiring a private chef changes life because he stopped thinking about meals three times a day. So this could be a housekeeper, chauffeur or personal assistant. Okay, so this makes a lot of sense. So like an example of this would be doing, like you're like mowing your lawn. - Great landscaping. - Like landscaping. So you may think like, well, you know, I'm gonna spend money on hiring someone to do that. But the real way to look at the value is, what well, so would I do at that time? If that's four hours every Saturday. Are there things I could do that are more valuable? So let's say you're building a business, maybe I could spend four hours building my business instead of doing my yard work. Or maybe I could spend four hours with my kids or whatever. So just an example of that. - Yeah, no, I really liked this. And I wanted to hear you guys's opinion and take on all of it. Because what you'll find, I mean, again, these are like, uber wealthy people. And this is like things that they consider luxury things that you spend your money on. And what you'll find interesting is cars, watches, things, none of those, and did make the list whatsoever. And number one is buying back your time. And I would have to agree with that. I would agree that, you know, one of the things that I have valued the most about making more money is the ability to make that decision. Now, everybody has that luxury, right? So luxury to be able to have the decision of like, I don't wanna mow my lawn. Like some people have to mow their lawn in order to do that. And making a decision of, oh, I have an extra income. Or I'm certain to make more money. Oh, I go buy a fancy luxury car or I could drive a modest car and actually have somebody now do my lawn. And I think that's the good takeaway from this is, you don't have to be uber rich where you're in a position where you make it to choice to not drive the BMW or Lexus or whatever. And maybe you drive the Toyota or the Honda, but now you cover somebody to handle your landscaping. And I think that's the cool takeaway from this is like, 'cause I know some people might look at this and be like, well, I can't connect and relate to somebody who's worth 10 million or four billion dollars. But it's like, no, we all make trades and decisions as you, whether you're somebody who makes, you know, under six figures beyond that or millions of dollars, you're constantly trading your time, money, and all those things. And so it's like, how many people do you know still might be mowing their lawn or doing things within their driving a car that's really expensive? And it's like, yeah. Yeah, and I think that's the good takeaway from this is that, hey, as you climb the ladder financially, as you get older, mature, and better at skill that whatever it is that you do, you'll be faced with this decision. Hey, I can now drive that fancy car, but here's, hear it from all these people that have been there, done that, and they're telling you like, listen, this is a better place to invest your money. - Number two, personal trainer agreed. I think this is the best. - I thought this was really interesting to this made the list. - Yeah. - Well, it should, listen, we know this, we trained a lot of the clients. - We do, but I thought this was fascinating coming from this, but I'm surprised. - It's me too, that I thought this was really interesting coming from just a bunch of millionaire billionaires out of a list. These aren't like, this isn't isolated to health and fitness people or anything related to us. This is just like, and so I think this is actually a really, this is different. 20 years ago, this does not make the list. 20 years ago, so this isn't getting highlighted. - No, but here's the thing, like, we talk about this all time on the show. Better health and fitness makes everything else better. So investing in ways to improve your health will make the rest of your life much better. And save you money. Here's the thing, being fit and healthy saves you money. If you look at things like medical costs, loss of productivity, loss of quality of life, and what that could potentially cost you, it's a wise, it's a wise investment. And people are figuring this out. - Yeah. - The next one is a dream house. Now they said they liked their dream house because it helps with dinners, reunions, and a holiday. So basically, design your home for connection. - Yeah, so you're bringing everybody to you. - Yeah. - I mean, you heard me talk about that. - I'm, yeah, subscribe. - This one like super resonates with me because, and I love that. So it says number three, dream home. And then in parentheses has not, but not for the reasons you think. And I think that's so true because if you would have asked me in my 20s, what my dream home looks like, it doesn't look like the home that I live in. The one I would have drew a picture of in my early 20s would have been this massive over-the-top type of place. And really when I look at what I've distilled down to what now is my dream home, it's for those exact reasons right there. It's been designed in a way. It's been curated on hosting my family and friends and barbecues and hanging outside, inside, and music, like I've thought about a lot of that stuff and not neighbors on top of me. And like that stuff wasn't things that I thought about when I was 20 going, oh draw your dream house or describe your dream house. It looked a lot better. - Well, house that promotes connection and social interaction makes a lot of sense. When you look at how valuable it is for quality life. - Well, I'm too to have it be the destination for my kids' friends to want to really hang out and connect and I get to know their friends really well that way, their parents. We have them over. So there's a lot of value in that for me. Like back to the first point of it we're like buying your time back and all that. I want to wrestle with a little bit. I totally subscribe to it and I like having the flexibility and being able to have people do the remedial stuff or the tasks I don't want to do. But also, because of where my kids are at in terms of their age, I find a lot more value in having them do hard work. - Oh no, which is less. - But it's like you have to actually manufacture that. Which is rough. It's like one of those things. I want to just have the last-capers. But I'm like, well this is an opportunity. I need to go out there and do it with them to instill this in them. And that's not everybody's cup of tea. But I've just found it makes the household energy much better and everything else. And it's two is teaching them some life lessons at the same time. So I juggle with that though, 'cause I'm like sometimes obviously we all want to break and all that too, but it's valuable to me. - So I think there's a middle ground to the point you're making or a way to kind of have your cake and eat it too. So what I do in that example. So not only do we have people that take care of the cars but I also have landscapers, but I also still do both of those things. - Yeah. - So there's times where I will opt out of not having a car washed and I will take Max outside and him and I will wash. - Yeah, it's a beautiful sunny day. Him and I, it's a weekend. I know the car needs to get cleaned. And it's like of course I could have someone go take care of it for me. Like I do sometimes on the, sometimes. But today is a day where like, oh this will be a good opportunity for me to do that. I have landscapers that are on a schedule, but then there's times where I'm like, you know what, I need a power wash, the backyard and clean and all I notice those shrubs are overgrown. I'm gonna go trim them myself. And so I think the luxury of having it outsourced that I can choose to do that time and I can choose to do it with my son or not. So it's like, I don't have the stress and the pressure of to keep up, keep all of it all the time. But then I can also dip in and out because I think what you're saying is extremely valuable to show your kids that were to do it yourself. And then we've talked about this before too.
like I even think about from a movement perspective, I make that decision sometimes. Sometimes it's actually not even about my kids. - Yes, to the cardio. Yeah, I tend to enjoy that more. - Yes. - I don't want to get my car and go to the gym, just go walk on a treadmill for an hour. Why don't I just go wash the car for an hour? I'll burn just a little. - This is a lot more examples of mundane stuff that you get like a house cleaner. And you know, there's all kinds of stuff that you can do that you really don't want to do. Like that's nice to, you know, buy back your time, not like. But the personal training one, I just stay there for a minute. I'm so impressed that that's made a list. I think that's such a cool thing to highlight that we've now come to a place where even, because when you guys say that when you were training people in your 20s, because we trained very wealthy people when we were young, a lot of times that they didn't have trainers. I mean, we had a few clients that were like that, but they were the anomaly. Like a lot of them had to go away from them being productive. - Yeah, there was a very small percentage of CEOs and founders and people that were higher up, where it seems like it's very invoked or trendy or they're more aware. - This year? - Yeah, they're more aware of the ROI. Oh, I'm way more productive when I do that. - Oh, all the clients I had, the back half of the last, you know, I don't know, 13 years of my training career were very successful people. And they would tell me, this is in my budget. I budget this in my monthly budget because it brings me so much value. They would tell me it's all time. It makes me better at work. It keeps me healthy. It makes me feel better. And it was just a part of their, like, you're more-- - Expensive. - Yeah, there's so many benefits too. - Now, the cool part is if you're somebody who's already a health and fitness person and you don't need any motivation or discipline or accountability, you can add another fifth to this list because you don't have to pay for a trainer to do that. But if you're somebody who needs it, the accountability pays itself out. I think most people would value for working with it for at least six months. Then it says, "Experiences." I agree with this 100%. I think the memories you make with experiences are so much more valuable than things. You know, going on trips or adventures or experiences where you're learning something, I think that's so valuable. - Memories last so much longer. - They do, they do. - They do, they do. - They did like this. I don't know if it was a survey or a study they did on this, but even the way our brain remembers things, like these things, they stick. Like I think, I saw this thing and it was about kids, the most memorable things that a kid could do is like going on a camping trip. Like it'll trump the expensive toy you bought there. - Oh, big time. - Yeah, big time. - They won't remember that, but they'll remember the summer camp thing that they did in third grade or something crazy like that. And so I forget what the, like I said, if it was a survey or a study they did on it, but I remember reading it and I was like, oh that's interesting. And then I thought I did the exercise myself and thought, oh you know what, that's so true. I definitely remember almost every memorable camping trip or camp that I went to, but ask me what I got on my seventh birthday. - I know. - And I'm like, I have no idea. - I remember like one gift. - Me too, like yeah. - It was like my first Jordans. - My name was Nintendo. - That was it. - Oh yeah Nintendo. - Only because I cry because I didn't get it. - Yeah, that was a big one. - Can I tell you why? - Let me tell you why I remember it. I remember it because I thought I was gonna get it for my birthday. I didn't get it. And I didn't say anything to my parents. I respected my parents. My dad worked real hard. I knew, you know, it's like, but I quietly and silently was sad. And I remember my mom, 'cause like what's the matter? Why are you so sad? Why are you so sad? And I kind of got teary, you know? And I was like, and I let her, I kind of told her it at one of you know. And I was like, I think I was gonna get it in Nintendo. And like 30 minutes later my dad comes up and he's like, let's go, we're going to the car. I'm like, why? I was like, I'm gonna take you to get it in Nintendo. It was that my dad did that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What's number five, Doug? Yeah, number five is flying private or business class. Well, I'll tell you what. I can get down with this. You guys know where I stand. It's really an illusion. I feel like I, I feel like I converted you guys into this. I'm gonna sell, listen, I'm gonna give you, I'm gonna give everybody a story because flying can be, it can suck. It can be stressful. It's all stressful. It can be stressful. It's tough, whatever. And I get it, you know, you wanna go somewhere. It's how you get places, totally get it. We got invited, when did we go to London? 2023. We got invited in 2023 to be at this like really big event. And we splurged and I'd never done a first class flight. And I'd flown international before. That was my first as well. I never, international can be brutal. Like you're sitting in that chair the whole time. I'm not a young kid anymore. It's a part of the sleep. I, that changed my life. I was like, this is if I could travel like that. I'm really ruined, yeah, ruined it. Now I'm not gonna be traveling like that all the time, but I can see why this made the list. 'Cause it changes the experience. Well, context matters here too, right? I think any of us could tough out a regular flight. Sure, sure. But what I think of what you find in a list like this, that's really called. The volume, exactly. The volume of flying. Totally. Most of these people, the volume of flying that all of us do now. Yeah, if I had to fly to Europe like three times a year. Oh, and I had a big company. That would be an expense for sure. Yes. And so I think that matters. Because you're right, a lot of people get lost on this and not connect to this. It's like, and let me tell you, if we flew one time a year, I would give two shits about tuffing out one flight. But the, and we've had different years where our flight volume is very high. And then it went, it's like, but it's, we fly a lot compared to what I'm sure all of us flew the rest of our life. And so when it's a regular thing of your life and you have to do it a lot, you just encounter a lot of everybody's probably in their life encounter to shitty airport experience. When your volume is high, you experience that a lot. A lot of them. And so it's like, man, and then also when you're, when you're flying for business, it's an expense on the company. And so when you're an entrepreneur or a founder, that's an expense that comes off the top end. Whether you fly coach or first class, it's like, you're no matter what, it's getting expense on the company. It brings your taxable income down, which is how I think I remember really getting you guys to convert over that direction. It's like, listen, the difference out of your pocket when you really think about it, 'cause you're gonna end up paying some of that over to the government tax wise. So then this is why this ends up making a lot of sense. It runs an expense on the business. If you have a high volume of it, then oh yeah, it makes it a lot better. So can you pull a Keon's all their different products? Because we've talked a lot about their central amino acids, which I would say is probably one of their best products, because I've said this in past podcasts, for essential amino acids to really work, they have to be high in losing. Losing is the trigger that sets muscle protein synthesis and motion, that's the muscle building that you get from essential amino acids. And you need your essential amino acids, it'd be at least 40% losing, which Keons is, they list everything. But they have other products too. They have a Crateen, is one of them. And I believe they have a really high quality fish oil as well. So if people are interested in really, really good supplements, Keon is like super, super high quality. - They do have good omega's. - Yeah, I use those. - Yeah, so I actually use those. - Okay. - Yeah, yeah. I'm big on their omega's. - I like their omega's. What else does the say they have protein? - Yep. - Oh good. And they have the amino acids, essential amino acids, both powder and calcium. - I like the capsules. Just because it's-- - You just throw five in there? - Yep. - Yeah, so I'm a big fan. I don't know if what's more popular for them, if they sell more of the powder or not. But I like the capsules. I find it easier to carry with me, and then I could just, with water, throw them in my mouth and it's, or whatever I'm drinking. I could be drinking anything. - I like them when people are in a cut. I think when you're in a cut, it makes it much, it makes it really, it helps preserve muscle. - Well that, and then because GLP ones are so popular, I think it becomes, I mean, when you look-- - Oh, that's a necessary. - Yeah. - Well, that we coach on GLPs, we're like, you're gonna use a tool and your toolbox. - Minimize that muscle, totally. Did you guys know, I got a fact for you guys, did you guys know that there was a strong man competitor that got banned? - You got banned. - From competing? Because he was too dominant. - No way. - Yes it is. - No way. - Yes it is. It is true, Bill Kazmire. - I've never heard Bill Kazmire. - Bill Kazmire. - I never knew he was banned. - Bill Kazmire was banned because he, you destroyed the competition too much. - Not, not. - Now I gotta say this, my opinion, I think that was a stupid decision because they would, I think it's, when you have somebody that dominant, it only gets more views. I think they had the wrong idea. But that's literally why they banned him. Is he was too good. - What are examples of, can you, is this the 80s or 90s? - It was 1982. He was 29 years old. This was like at the peak of his career. By the way, I'm gonna tell you guys, just how this guy's, it's just the machine, right? He held world records in powerlifting along with strong man competition. He was 6'2", 300 or something. - Yeah, I remember 340 pounds. - He was a use of. - Okay. Do you know how strong he was in powerlifting? By the way, this is before double ply, triple ply shirts. This is like single ply powerlifting. Do you guys wanna know what is left, this lift floor? 660 pound bench. 900 pound squat, 880 pound deadlift. That guy right there. - Just a moves well-rounded, just in the hospital. A month ago, how's he doing? - Was he really? - Yeah, she, that, over the rights, is that what one month ago Bill was, - It doesn't say, does it say? - Yeah, I'm pulling it up. - He's 72 years old. - Yeah. - He's 6'2", yeah. - Was he see what, like, how the fuck is it, like, right though? - How many is, he did lift at a thousand something pounds in the competition with one of those, like, it was at the one with the coins. - Yeah. - Yeah. - So, did I ever tell you guys when I met him? So let's see, he's 72 now.
So this must have been, I was, let's see, maybe 12 or 13 years ago, this is right. Maybe a couple of years before we started Mind Pump. So let's see, 72, so that would have made him how old, 60? So he's about 60 years old. I went to the Arnold Classic event. This is the bodybuilding show, but they also have the big fitness event where you're here. For people who don't know, there's a huge convention center and they have arm wrestling and powerlifting. Powerlifting, it's like this huge strength event type of deal. And there were two things that stood out to me. One of them was this, I'd never, I forgot the guy's name, don't remember him. Skinny Black dude had an arm wrestling table and a line of people lined up and he might away to 160 pounds and he was just beating everybody in arm wrestling. He just kept going through everybody. It's pretty crazy. Then I remember there was a booth with Bill Kazmire, 60 year old Bill Kazmire and people were taking pictures with him and then he was taking frying pans and you could hold the frying, like a legit frying pan curling them like with one hand, he would grab it like this and roll it up. 60 year old man with his fingers. Crazy. That's crazy. So I'm just baffled by the fact that they kicked him out of the sport that he was dominating. Is there a difference? Is there any sense? What does that happen in any other sport? Well, I was going to bring up what you don't see is someone getting kicked out, but what you do see in sports. Which is a rule. Yes, they just do rules. And I was trying to go, "Where are some things going?" I know Formula 1's done it. I know race sports have done that where they've changed like, "Okay, you guys can't have an engine bigger than this." You guys can't do this with the. I mean, I think it was Wilts Chamberlain when Goldtending came around because that wasn't a thing before that, I believe. I think that was what his was. I think we started doing that. I know that. So there's been basketball. There's been many things that they've had to change because of a guy comes in and then just almost too good. Yeah, like he's just standing at the hoop and he's knocking at the ball. Can you get it? Yeah, Goldtending means. So when a ball is on the downward part of the arm, you can't hit it out of the air. Otherwise, these seven foot guys would just stay right at the rim and just volley it out. So that's what he was doing? Yeah, so is it. It was 1961 to stop him. Yeah, because he could stand. For effortlessly catching and tipping. Yes. Because he was so tall and long that he could just stand over the hoop and the right for the ball. Just taking out of the air. So now you can't. You can get it on the way up, but you can't get it on the way down. Was he. Was he for his time in comparison to other. Was he the most dominant basketball player of all time? Well, he's the only one that's ever scored 100 points in a game. That's what I mean. So like, obviously, because people do this with sports, they'll take a past person and try and place him in a modern game. That's not fair. That's not fair. But while he was playing. Oh, yeah. Was he the most dominant that we ever. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Like nobody's ever been that dominant in basketball. Yeah. Very, I don't know who would be comparable in that era with. No, no, no, no, no, not in that era. I mean, if we define that by points scoring, that's it. No one's ever scored 100 points. You've had some get close with 70s and 60s. That's so crazy. But 100 points in a game is just. What is that say right there about. What are you looking at? That was. So Wilk Chamberlain. So this is Wilk Chamberlain on Michael Jordan. The difference between you and me is that they had to change the rules so I couldn't dominate. They changed the rules for you so that you could dominate. What did they do? What did they do? I don't know. You're hitting Adam in the heart right now. Oh, Jordan's a boy too. That's a. Is that really a point? Jordan's. You said it was stupid. Apparently that's Wilk Chamberlain. Yeah. Wilk Chamberlain. That must. That's a tongue-in-cheek type of comment like that. I don't even think that will. You got a lot. You know I love about those old 1960s, '70s basketball guys. Why are there shorts so small? They were short shorts. Bro, like things were hanging out bro. Bro, like don't be jumping on their. They chuck tailor shoes and everything is wild with these. Remember that guy? Do you tell the story you guys about? So in high school we had those. We had like shorts that were from like 50s to 60s. So our old high school it was like. Oh yeah, I mean you know somebody who went to school when we went to school is. I'm sure of his experiences where you have school. It didn't have a lot of money in budget. And so our basketball jerseys and shorts were from like the 50s and 60s. And they were like tight. So they were skin tight and super short. And so. And then when the school got a little bit of money, the first team varsity got the nice stuff. And so when you were a freshman and sophomore. You had to keep the timing. Yeah, so listen to this though. You do. So this is what happens to me. So freshmen, sophomore year, we get this. Then we get to. We get to get to get to the JV and varsity and we're finally going to get the new awesome uniforms, right? And so we've already been wearing the Daisy Dukes list. Up comes this freshman. I'll never forget. This kid named was Derek Schaefer and he was like six, six, 300 pounds as a freshman. And so because he couldn't fit in any of those clothes, they gave the freshman class our varsity jerseys. And we had to go back to the. Oh my god, I remember. I remember being angry for a year. I mean, my buddies and I, they all play were so angry. And looking forward to four and not over. Oh, we were so ready for like the cool, long, you know, comfortable shorts. I just picture you in high school with a tiny. Can you probably skinny kid? Oh, very skinny. Oh yeah. No, I was. Yeah, they did. I was short too until junior senior years. So I was skinny and small. I was only. I was five, three and about a hundred and. How long were you five, three, four? I was a freshman year and then I was like five, six, five, five, six, five, eight, sophomore year. Junior summer is when I. When I sprouted all the way to six foot. And then I grew even after high school. So I kept growing until I was. Even at a high school. But yeah, I was. I was. I was six foot as tall as I am now in ninth grade. Boom, done. Oh, wow. Yeah, I got tall and that was it. Done. Yeah. Like ending. Oh yeah, I was short. When did you say. Yeah, I was like five, ten and then it was junior summer same where I sprouted six and then it just. So my brother was like you. My brother, we thought was going to be a little guy and then suddenly he's a giant. Yeah, you would have thought I was going to be very little because I was short and skinny. So I looked like I was going to be super small. Which. I look back now, which is. I always tell stories like I was never like this gifted athlete. I always had to work really hard. I mean, I was small too. So I was like, I got bullied around in sports and but it was really good for me because it made me have to. I always. And I was. I'm also young for my class too. So that adds another way. So I'm young for my class. I was small for my class. But then by the time I got older, then I really like sprouted and grew and then later I filled out, but it took me a long time. High school is funny like that. Like you'll see your buddy come back after summer and he's got like a mustache. Dude. What happened? He's with my youngest right now and his friends. He's like, he just all of a sudden sprouted up and he's got this little stash. Really? Yeah. All his friends like, "Hey, let's see your favorite ever." Oh my god, I forget that he's like a young kid. Yeah, your boys have really grown and changed in the last year too. I've seen them really, really this year's growing. Yeah, they look so different to me than just a couple of years ago. I mean, they. It's funny to see too when they grow. Like their feet and hands will get big first and just look awkward as hell because things don't grow evenly. Yeah. Oh my god. How are you with them because they are turning into little men now, like challenging you and all that? Yeah. Yeah. It's like I'll still wrestle and we'll pick fights and just to get some energy out. Yeah. I think what's new with that is more of like I'll say something and they'll try and make fun of me, which is new. Yeah. Yeah. So I'll clap back. I'm like, okay, you want to go down that road and then we start getting into it. But they're just trying to like, you know, press the line and like make jokes at my expense and you know, that's new because it's. You're used to being cool, that. You used to be the cool that. Yeah. Now, it's like, you know, they're trying to kind of. Yeah, yeah. Check me a bit. I get teased constantly, but that's because I have a 16 year old daughter and 18 year old niece. And so they're like teenage girls and I think this is, you know, they like to do that with that. They like to tease. And it's flying. So I don't tease them back. Yeah. So I let them, you know, so they tease and they'll joke around. Yeah, I feel like from the girls that come, it's like. It's fine. Yeah, it's cute, sweet, it's funny. It's fine. Oh yeah. Or with you, I feel like it's a part of manhood. It's a part of like. There is a part of feeling out, you know, like I'm becoming my own man. And so does it ever. Do you know. It shows up like this. Like I'll be, you know, sitting on the couch and like, "Hey, pal, before you go to your room, like, can you, you know, take the dishes and put them in the dishwasher and listen to these like. Oh yeah, because you know, some about me being lazy on the couch and like, I should do it myself kind of a thing. And I'm like, and I just get up like, what'd you say? They're like, "Ah, they're like, end up going to do it." You know, but some say, "Excuse me?" You know, like, "I'll end you." But it's, I know it's like, you know, they're just trying to press me and see what they're doing. Oh, it has to be that that's just. Are they, are they any mood because I obviously have teenage girls and mood swings are just come with the territory. Do they have? Because boys can get that a little too. They have big moods. I guess like, usually it comes with the struggle of like, either something at school, they're not performing well in or something, you know, like for their sport that they can't overcome. So it's not just random. It's not random. Yeah, it's very much nothing happened. Do they. What's happening? Yeah, do they, do they, do they? Both your kids, the question for both of you like that, because I, you know, I'm still young right so we're still turning seven years
old right now. So the one thing that my son is, I mean, he's been such a saint, he's so easy. But there's for sure, if he is tired, hungry, or has come from his grandma's house, or like, can get in like a mood. Yeah. And sensitive. And if he doesn't get his, like, he's, then that, like, you can see this side of him that you just, he's, so I'm so used to this kid being so consistent, that those three things throw off the consistent, the perfect storm. It is. It's just, and it, and what it shows up like is like a emotional over just the dumbest of things for no reason. It says, like, what? Why? What? What do you? Like, it's, it's like ridiculous. What, and it's, and I always have to remember remind myself, oh, that's right. Like, he was over at Nana's house last night. They stayed up till 10 o'clock at night. So I'm getting a combo of both. We're tired today. And we just got done being, being told, never being told no all day long. You know, so the fact that you're being told something or no, like all of a sudden, you're going to, like, that's not like him to be that way. So do they have tells like that? Or I'm just thought of, you know, the main thing that I usually now, now I'm learning that this is really the core of it is that they're scared. It's something that they're scared about. Like, for Ethan, like, because I kept teasing him and pressing him on getting his license because like, you know, he hasn't been putting all the work in with driving the car. I'm trying, we're trying, Courtney and I both are trying to get him to drive and get more reps and, and, you know, and he, and he just seems so like a luf about it. And like, ah, you know, like, I know, I know, like all this like false confidence. And he, his personality is very much more like, you know, like portrays all this confidence, but inside, he's really scared. You know, and I've just started to pick up on that. Okay. So I just need to be a little more like, hey, bud, let's go for a ride. You know, like versus versus tease. You know, like, tease them about, yeah, exactly. Yeah. I'm trying to just did my strategy with that. That's interesting. There's a sure fire way to wake up ready to go to the gym feeling fresh. After a night of drinking, it's with Zeebotics pre alcohol. So this is a pre alcohol probiotic drink that's the world's first genetically engineered probiotic. Now it was invented by PhD scientists who wanted to tackle rough mornings after drinking. So here's how it works. When you drink alcohol gets converted into a toxic byproduct in the gut. It's this byproduct, not dehydration. That's to blame for your rough next day pre alcohol produces an enzyme and it breaks down this byproduct in the gut. So remember to have Zeebotics before your first drink of the night. It lasts for about 18 to 24 hours. Drink will responsibly watch how you feel the next day. Go to zbiotics.com. That's ZB IOT ICS.com. Slash mind pump 26 use the code mind pump 26 get 15% off back to the show. Our first caller is Philip from Ontario. What's happening? I do. Hey guys, this is insane. Cool. How can we help you? You guys are a long time. So this is really cool. How are you? Good. How can we help you? So yeah, I'll just do like what everybody else does. I just read my email. Make it to try and make it short and sweet. So yeah, name spill 35 from Ontario. I've been a listener. It says over two years, but I've actually been doing the math and it's been closer to five. Now I love the show and you guys have changed the way I look at a look at health and general fitness. So I've always been a big guy a six foot two. My heaviest I was 330 pounds and at my lightest I was 185. When I was a little younger obviously, but still just before I found you guys I went from 330 to 225 on all the wrong ways, fasting, cardio, and I wish I knew now what I knew then like, which kind so much better. But anyway, so I've been bouncing between 220 to 230 pounds, just recomping as I go. But the reason why I'm writing into you guys has nothing to do with my metabolism, just to kind of use a backdrop basically. But two summers ago when I started figuring out everything about metabolic health and you know, exercises that were for that metabolic health, I knew that I had to start doing the bigger compound lifts and getting into that. So went into the squat rack, started learning how to squat, deadlift and all that and progressed pretty quickly. Got my deadlift eventually up to 405. My squat I was progressing rather quickly, I would say too quickly. I got up to 225, which is a lower number, but I don't think I had the greatest of form. But one day this is again two summers ago I went down to the squat and when I was in the hole I felt the pop. And on my way up, I thought, okay, I finished the rep. And I was like, okay, I'm just not going to do any more walk away. By the time I walked over to the dumbbell rack, I couldn't walk. Everything it seized up, it took me four days to feel like I could walk without looking like I was crippled. And it's never been the same since. So I got an MRI after waiting for one year, yay, Canadian healthcare. And so I found that I had a moderate bulging disc between L5 and S1 with a severe narrowing of the left forearm nerve where I felt the pop. So it's kind of like in the iliac crest area. Now some days I don't notice pain at all. Like I'll wake up, feel bright eyeed and bushy tailed. And then other days it's like even, you know how when you roll around in bed you engage your core. That like this past Sunday, it sucked, kept me up all night, like just discomfort. So I've done physio with somebody I trust. I see a pain specialist who does bio-facial release or a specific type of form of it. And I can still deadlift some days without any issues. Now I know a lot of people have bulging discs and never have an issue, but or symptoms, but I seem to do. And I know there's a weakness going on somewhere in my hips. I don't know where it is. My physio therapist has said that I have an amazing external and internal hip rotation in terms of flexibility. I feel like it's tight, but he's saying that no, you can move really well. I've tried to do 90-90s, but I can't get my seat bones all the way down to the floor, so I don't feel like I'm doing them correctly. So in my email I've also stated like if the pain is in my hip, it's not in my lower back and if it's in my lower back, it's not in my hip. I've been sussing that out over the last a while really paying attention. I don't think that's the case. I've debated on hiring a coach to kind of go through some movement exercises. And something I didn't really list in here is I kind of have a struggle. Because I was always the overweight guy, I've come to realize and after listening to you guys for so long, like Sal, I think you'll emphasize with me on this, is the addiction of going to the gym, working out, lifting, and I had this drive to get jacked for a while now. And it's a big goal of mine, but I think I really need to change my focus here this summer. What I want to plan on doing is going to like a three day a week, almost like a full body routine within my limitations because I try and avoid the pinching movements because of my hip and that bulging disc. Though I know it can be worked on. So the idea would be to work out less. I'm currently working out six days a week. I would go work out three days a week and then the other three days still go to the gym and basically become like the mobility guy, trying to focus on mobility. So that's kind of where I'm at right now. I want to see if strength training properly with the right mobility techniques would help this. That's pretty much it. You're on the right track. Yeah. I think the reason why you're still dealing with this issue is because you're doing a little too much with your workouts. So you can have too much volume, too much intensity, frequency in the short term, but it can also just be cumulative. What that means is you know six days a week you do fine for a while and suddenly start to notice pain and issues. And that's because stress becomes cumulative over time. So this is why athletes will do things like de-load weeks or they'll do a whole cycle of lighter training. And it's not because the training was too much before. It's because the training becomes too much over time. Does that make sense? So I think you're moving in the right direction. I think the difference between the days you feel and the pain and the days you do has probably more to do with systemic inflammation. Agreed. And that's when you're starting to see the issues. Now could there be some movement issues or some imbalances there? Yeah, possibly. I think going to a physio is a good idea. I think I would look at the pelvic floor. This is an area that man often don't even look at.
for strengthening. I would also look at strengthening core bleaks with rotation. I would look at strengthening the hip flexors. Those are all areas that support kind of where you're talking. I think a great routine for you would be symmetry, map symmetry. And I think following map symmetry and skipping the last phase would be a good idea for a couple rounds. And that's going to get you in the gym in an appropriate amount. You're not going to be in the gym six days a week. It's an appropriate amount of exercise. I believe it's three days a week. And then in between, I like mobility and movement on the days in between. That's why I want to get carried away with like too much intensity on those days in between. That's why I would have put him towards performance. I like to, because map performance is programmed out that way for him already. It's not as semi, it's not as unilateral focus, but it's still got unilateral work and it's got a lot of things that there's two phases in performance. I'd be, I wouldn't want him in like phase one, I think, and maybe the last one. Do you have, what do you have for mobility, Phil? Do you have any structured mobility or none? Unfortunately, no. The finances of all benefits. I just want my first kind of a soul. Symmetry has got mobility. It has the mobility sessions. I don't believe it's in phase two. There you go. Symmetry's got the mobility in there as well. So symmetry will give you a workout plus the mobility. And it's going to be unilateral for, I would say, a couple cycles. Yeah. Phase of Symmetry is bilateral. Skip it twice. So you'll be going through about four months of pretty much all unilateral style training. Modify if you need to, but I think you'll be okay and allow your body to rest and recover. Because I think it's tied to inflammation at this point. Yeah, I agree. Your thought process is correct though. I mean, this is what Symmetry is going to be like for you. It's going to be three days of like, strength training in the other two days of mobility type focused. And so that's what I would be doing. You know, two of the biggest correlates for chronic pain art. No. Stress, poor sleep. So my sleep is locked. I get like nine, like 85s, 90s on my sleep scores, you know, eight hours of sleep every night, at the same time, wake up at the same time. Get locked. My point with that wasn't to point to your sleep, but rather to point the effects of cumulative stress on the body. So lack of sleep is a real clear one or poor sleep. And I think six days of how long you've been doing six days a week for? About two or three years. Yeah. You know, six, six days a week consistently is like without taking lots of time off, without doing periods of time or you're doing two days a week. That is too much for probably 90 something percent of people. Yeah. And like, I mean, I'm probably wrong in stating this, but I do know that I spend a lot of time in the gym, obviously six days a week, but I also take extremely long rest periods because I do emphasize and focus on on like the strength component of it. So everything is a minimum of three minute rest periods, if not five, if not more, depending on the type of lift, right? But even for like a simple, simple exercise, like bicep curls, I'm doing a long, old, of like three or four minutes. Yeah. I think I'm getting stronger and I don't do too many reps or too many sets. So, um, but you've been doing it for a long, you've been doing it for a long time. Well, in what you're describing too is incredible for building strength, but that does, that does damage the body, right? So if I lift heavier, if I give longer rest periods and I lift a heavier weight, I do more damage to the button. It's good damage, right? It sends the signal to build muscle. So you're doing the, the right thing. But when you talk about what Sal's talking about with the cumulative stress, that's not doing you any more or less favors. I mean, it's still, that's still considered a lot like that's not, uh, so let's say you, you, you circuit trained where you never rested and you just went all the way through, you can argue that that's equally as much stress on the body or maybe even less than what you're doing because you're able to load more because you're giving your rest periods. So the load that you're able to put on the body, even though you're giving the rest periods, you can put a lot of load, which puts a lot of stress on the body. And again, feel free to think of it this way. It's cumulative. So it's fine. You got away with it for a while, but now you're noticing like paying come back, you know, on and off. It could look like a little, this is what it looks like for some, for people with cumulative stress, progress stalls. I get a little stiffness. Some days feel better. Some deals feel worse. For most men, your age, you know, good health, everything's good, typical guy, eating right, all that stuff. For most guys, three days a week is the fallback with strength training, appropriate strength training. And then you'll have sprints where you do more. Perfect. For most guys about three days a week is, that's kind of where you're going to be out most of the time. I mean, the other, the other option of programming is a 15, 15 style symmetry. And then the other, the other rest of his hour is spin on mobility. That's the other option. So you do two lifts a day. So every day you're still lifting weights, but it's only two lifts and then you're doing mobility. You're doing 30 minutes of mobility, which I don't know what you want. Try your matches. Yeah. Cadence a bit better. And probably go ahead. Yeah, sorry. I think I'm going to lean more towards 15 symmetry because the way my schedule works with work and I'm always driving into the city. I've got long commutes and stuff like that. I'm always near the gym. So yeah. Yeah. And then if I didn't want to work out on one day, I could just combine two of the 15 minute routines on one day anyway, right? You could just start back up when you're, you know, where you like. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I think that, so yeah, I think 15 symmetry and then focus a lot on the mobility. So I think that'll really serve you. That's so extreme. The other direction, right? Of really, really reducing the volume there. If you start feeling really good in the first few weeks, that's like your clear indicator that you just, you'll know pretty quickly. Yeah. You'll know within the first few weeks because you'll feel stronger, you'll feel more energy. You'll be like, Oh, God, I think I think just starting to feel better probably by month, one or two, less pain. Mm. Okay. This is not at all the right. I figured that you guys were going to say I was thinking something like maps prime or something like that. Like it's a movement issue. That's what I was just assuming. Here's why there could very well be that also, but here's why I'm not going hard in that direction because I still think you should do mobility. You saw a physio. Yeah. So, and their experts at identifying movement pattern issues and they did say you got good, you know, external motion both ways. Yeah. So, there's no glaring issue. Otherwise, a physio will be like, Oh, yeah, here's your problem. Yeah. And then based on how much you're working out, like this is super common with people who are really consistent with workouts who have like kind of an issue that can pop up. Sometimes it's a knee or a back. You know, you don't have a, like you said in your email, you don't have this, you think massive bulging or slip disk was kind of minor, some narrowing of the nerve, but it's just a constant. That's right. It's irritating. And sometimes you're like, I don't feel any pain. And so that points to you just kind of your red lining a little bit for too long. Maybe not hardcore red lining, but you're just too consistently, you know, pushing the limit. Okay. So, on the topic of symmetry, there's no mobility stuff in symmetry, right? It's just the, it's just the main exercises. So are there mobility exercises that I should be doing for my hips that would benefit? There is. Yeah. There's some in there. So symmetry actually like in between we have these frequency builders. And so we did add in like trigger sessions for metabolic and also the mobility sessions from performance. So what I would do is take, you know, pull from the, from the performance mobility movements there. Anything hip related, you know, hip flexor, you know, anything you can pull from there, I think would be very helpful. Yeah. The thing too is because symmetry is unilateral at that in and of itself is correctional. What are what what movements does the physio have you doing right now? Do they have you doing? So I haven't seen that physio in a while. So I've been seeing that the pain specialist now because I'll be honest like the physio. So I tore my super spinatus eight years ago and she helped me back from that injury amazingly and now I can push 200 pounds overhead without any issues. But doing the hip rehabilitation just didn't really like we kept treating it but the movements and nothing was really working. So I kind of just stopped. Shame on me, but you know, such as life. But the pain specialist was the one who said like, yeah, your, your external hip rotation is just amazing. Now the one thing he did say was that the muscle, I think it's the IT band. The one that connects down to the outside of the knee is he said it is the tightest and hardest IT band he's ever seen in his career. I have zero discomfort from it. I don't even notice it. So I don't know if that's also an indication of something. But I T band. So IT band techniques can come from instability or overwork. Overwork. Yeah, so runners I get that's probably yeah. And again, like I said, I think it's this, I think so when somebody's doing a little too much for a little too long, like in your case, and it starts to kind of compound, more work is not the, yeah, not the solution. So more mobility work might be like the best thing for you. Yeah, I've seen people with like pain and they just, oh, I'm going to do more mobility, more mobility. It's worse because they're actually doing more when they need to do less. Okay. That's why we'll know pretty quickly putting you on a 15 protocol at that. Yep. Use Justin's advice. Take the stuff that's in there that's related to hips.
don't overdo it just every day. And then in a couple of weeks, you should already start to feel better and like you're moving in the right direction. That'll be a really good sign that we're on the right path. - Okay, okay, cool. - We'll send that over to you, Phil. - I, I much appreciate, guys, that's, that's amazing. Thank you. - Check back with us, too. I'd like to hear from you in like a, give us like a month or two of you of doing this and let us know how you're doing. - Yeah, maybe we'll have you back on here with going on. - Okay, cool. Yeah, how do I reach, do I just, say me, say me, yep, say me. Say me, Marl, just let her know. And a guy said they wanted an update on how to do it. - How'd they can know, don't get to us. - Yeah, we'll reach out to you. We'll make a note. We'll see if we can have you back on in 60. - Okay, cool, cool. Yeah, again, like just before like at the end here, I really, really hope that the general population gets your message and it becomes, it becomes the norm. I preach you guys all the time. I think my wife is sick and tired of keeping you up all the time. She's working out, you know, same thing six days a week and she's, she's going crazy, but she's loving it. So, but yeah, okay. And I forget who the cycle path said that, you know, you put jam on the bread first and then peanut butter. (laughing) - That's the only way to make a peanut butter and jelly sandwich, bro. - It's jam burst. - He's still, he also pee sitting down. Remember, forget it, that's the, that's the work. - Adam, I'm with you on that one. - Ah! (laughing) - That's worse, you make a peanut butter sandwich. - He's a happily married man, that's why. - Remember to clip that out and put you in the category. (laughing) - Right off, Phil, we appreciate it to support brother. Thank you so much, dude. Okay. - Thank you, thank you guys. - Thank you, thank you, appreciate it. - Take it easy brother. - All right. - You too, you too. - You know where a lot of confusion comes from when people hear, - Peter or Jelly? - No. (laughing) - When people hear, you know, the value of activity, the value of daily, the value of daily, is they confuse daily activity with workout. - Uh huh. - So when you're lifting weights, you're working out. I'm in there to send a signal. But that doesn't mean that I shouldn't do daily activity. - Right. - And people confuse the two and they're like, what do you mean I shouldn't lift weights six days a week. I'm supposed to exercise every single day. No, no, lifting weights is like, that's a hard stress. - Yeah. - For most people, what it's gonna look like for most of the time, especially as you get into your 30s and beyond, is you're gonna be lifting about three days a week is what it's gonna look like. - It's ideal. - Yeah. - That's what it's gonna look like most of the time. Maybe you have little sprints where you do more, but most of the times about about three days a week, that's where you get the best results. That doesn't mean you're on active every day. You should definitely move every single day. And that could look like walking, it could look like stretching, it could look like swimming, it could look like lots of different things. But the lifting part, six days a week is too much. - Tronic. - For pretty much everybody. - I feel like we should, I'm trying to picture what it would look like right now. If we design this, like almost like a wood page printout, and like a perfect routine. - Well, no, no, no, like we showed like, here's your stress bucket, right? And like a strength training workout is like a rock this big. You know what I'm saying? That goes into that bucket, it's a good rock, but it fills up this much of your bucket. - It's a big stress. - You only have so much. - Yeah, walking, little tiny little pebble, right? And like walking takes a pebble out. - Or high stress at work, big rock. And so we could give people this idea. And once that bucket is full, I don't give a shit of a lot of its full of stuff that you would consider good, it's full. And anything over that is over stress. And then your body is gonna start to rebel and do things like this. And so understanding how to bounce that out, because even like when he was repeating back like, no, I listen to you guys on how you talk about a strength training. And so he's doing the right protocol for building muscle, absolutely giving yourself three minute rest periods. But then you also gotta know that when you rest for three minutes, that now allows you to load the bar a lot more, which pushes the body more, which is more stress, which is good, 'cause that's what builds more muscle, but that doesn't make the rock any smaller. The rock is as big if not our ear. - But the irony which you caught was like, he's trying to find another thing to add to solve the problem that's already a lot of things that we need to get rid of. - Yeah. - And you know, by the way, pro bodybuilders back in the day would take three months, four months off a year. Ronnie Coleman, most people could consider the greatest Mr. Olympia of all time. After he'd win the Mr. Olympia, did nothing for two months, you know, working out, nothing at all. For a full 60 day, that's the body fully recovered. - He'll know, he'll know we're on the right path when, 'cause I'm glad we went to the 15 route, because that's even reducing his volume even more. He should notice, he should feel, a couple weeks he'll feel better. - Oh yeah. - Yeah. And if you feel better after a couple weeks of us reducing that much volume, that's what you needed to go that direction. - Our next color is Farron from Ontario. - Farron, how you doing? Farron. - I'm really good. How are you? - Good. How can we help you? - Good. Well, I feel like it's my turn for a show and tell because I was on three months ago. And I wrote on and was asking for your advice on how to build the lower body that I wanted. And you guys recommended me to increase my calories, build the body I wanted through muscle mommy. So this is my check in for, I completed that. So I can read off my stats and I'm really proud of what I accomplished. I had a lot of fun. - Yeah. - And then if it's okay, I want to share my biggest one with you, which is actually a little bit of a qualitative story. So when I called in at the end of March, my weight was 132 to 134. And I was eating 2200 calories and I wanted to build my lower body. So through increasing my calories, I went up to 2400 in April and May and got to 2550 to 2600 in this so far in June. My weight is now 135 to 136. I'm still eating 150 to 160 protein. My waist stayed the same and my hips increased an inch. My glutes got an inch bigger. So that's a proud of myself for that. And I had a lot of fun because I'd never done five by fives before. I'd always trained like with a little bit lower weight and higher reps. So I got my squat from 80 in three by 15 to 100 by the end of phase two and then 135. - Whoa, yeah. - Yeah. And my dud lifts, RDLs went from 100 to 160 with my sumo squat or some sorry sumo dud lift. And I increased my hip thrust from 150 to 210. - Wow, look at you. Awesome. - Yeah, I was really, I had so much fun. Like in the past I've just been concerned about, you know, I don't know, the wrong stuff. So it was really fun to work on getting stronger. But the soran most kind of proud and a silly way to tell you is embarrassingly, like over the last two years as I've been working on my fitness journey, I felt like I would reach my goal when somebody told me I looked like I worked out. I just wanted somebody to tell me like, oh, you look like you work out. And two weeks ago, I was driving in the car with my kids, I homeschool, so we drive around to different activities quite a lot and I feel like we have our best conversations in the car. And my 10 year old son is getting to the point where he doesn't quite think I'm cool anymore. But we were driving home from a birthday party and he got a bookmark in his loot bag and it had a picture of this woman super hero on it. And he said, mom, this person looks like you. - Yeah. - Oh, like really? And I looked at it and she looked like nothing like me at all, he's like, yeah, I was like, well, how so? He said, she's strong. - That's wonderful. - And so I finally realized that the positive feedback I was looking for was actually coming from my 10 year old son. - Yeah. - So anyways. So I'm writing back in because I wanted to ask you guys, I'm like so bought in and I'm so motivated to continue to work hard over the next six months and just get stronger and see my body continue to change. So I wanted to ask you guys, if you were coaching me for the next six months, what would your roadmap look like for me? Like what progression would you recommend after muscle mommy? Should I stay at my current calories or continue to increase? What's like the highest leverage changes do you think I could make or continue to do to just continue on the happy trade that I'm on right now? - Because you mentioned that you really hadn't done any like five by five and that was your real first experience. There's two things that come to mind right away. Either one, you could totally run muscle mommy again. I think you would be a great candidate for someone just to run it right back and probably even bump your calories in other 100, 200 more calories. Keep going in the direction you're going. Or if you're interested in trying something like a power lift, maps power lift would be a really good program or maps strong. A lot of our female clients love maps strong. It's a lot of post-ear chain focus. So a lot of glue, a lot of hamstring. So if you like stuff like that and you want to develop, continue to develop the lower body, those are two great options. But you could totally just run back what you just did because that was so fresh and new for you. That's the first time I'm really doing it in a calorie surplus is the first time running five by five. The only other way I would push you in a different direction was if you gave me feedback.
of tightness or pain or anything going on with your body, like that you have or imbalances. If you don't feel imbalanced, you don't feel any joint pain, you don't have any issues like that, then I would stay the course you're doing right now. - So I'm gonna encourage you, by telling you something that you could have done better. And this is gonna be encouraging, okay? So my scrub, dog, it was scrubbed for stats again, 'cause I wanna point something out here. So your weight barely changed. So 132, 134 to 135, 136, like it barely changed. But you gained an inch around your hips and your waist stayed the same. This tells me that you actually got leaner while you built some muscle. - Yeah, yeah. - Which tells me that your calorie bump wasn't enough. - It would hire. - You would have got stronger and seen even more muscle gains if your calories are closer to 2700, okay? Now this is encouraging, by the way. Now I get it, you know, when people reverse diet, go to the little apprehensive, they don't wanna go too fast, I'm afraid of whatever. And you made phenomenal progress. But this is encouraging, 'cause I'm like, oh my gosh, we got some just still in there. - Yeah, you're like at the beginning of the upward slope of progress. Like we bump your calories again, go to Maps Power Left. You're gonna see some crazy gains. I mean, your strength gains were amazing. You're gonna see that again. Which is gonna be even crazier, because going from 80 to 135 squat, going from 135 to 170 squat, you're gonna see some crazy muscle gains in your lower body. So there's two ways we could approach this. And it really depends on how, and you sound very motivated, just why I'm gonna present this to you. You can follow Maps Power Left, bump your calories again. I'd go up to 2650, 2700, and have some fun with it. Option two, if you really wanna have a good time, we'd be actually higher a coach, who could take you through the whole six month process and work with you every single month, and modify and change as you go along. 'Cause what may happen, which is what I'm gonna suspect, if I was working with you, I think we got a lot of room in your metabolism. I think if we bump you up to 2650, probably within three weeks, I'm like, "We're going up again." And then again, we're going up again. And you may be one of those people that gets up to 3000 calories, doesn't really gain much body fat and just builds crazy muscle in a metabolism that gives you ridiculous flexibility. So those are the two routes that I would go. So I've worked with a coach before. We talked about it last time. She was actually really, really great. So I did really enjoy the process. And actually the only reason I stopped working with her was that I decided to sign my kids up for a homeschool program that then I paid for instead of paying for coaching for myself. So it's a potential, but I think it would depend on what the cost is 'cause my kids are thriving in the environment that they're in now. So I can't pull them out just from my own personal needs. But I have a question about strong and about power left. So when in phase three of muscle mommy, when I was doing the overhead push press the first week, I had never worked with, so I only just started working more well in February. And I had only been using it for lower body lifts. So when I was using it for upper body, I noticed it's a skill I'm not used to. And so when I was doing the push press, I kind of tweaked my left shoulder a little bit and it was causing some issues. So I didn't push press for the rest of phase three. I just did regular dumbbell overhead presses because I felt like it was more comfortable on my shoulder. So I think I'm a little bit hesitant to try to lift a lot of weight overhead with a barbell. I think you need to. - That's a perfectly fine modification. - Yeah. - It will be bench pressing. Impressive. - Okay, that was fine. - Yeah, it will be bench pressing in power left. Yeah, overhead isn't a big emphasis in that program. So I mean, besides just your regular, it's not gonna be a push press. - I really like even more now putting you in power left based off what you just told me too, that this is your introduction to a barbell lifting. It's the ultimate. Like if someone wanted to learn how to use the barbell, - That's the one. - It's the power lift is the training program I'd put them on. And it's gonna get you good and proficient at that. And you getting really proficient at those core lifts with the barbell is going to get you really strong, which is gonna carry over to the results if you want. - How long ago did you go up to 2550 with your calories? April, May. - I don't know. - That was 25. - Two weeks ago it was around the beginning of June. They were trending and up. But yeah, more consistently, two weeks. - Yeah, I like going up 150 a day. It's not a ton. So nothing to worry about. 2700 maps power lift. I think you're gonna be blown away. Yeah. - Okay. So I have two more questions if that's okay. If, like what strength benchmarks would you have in mind for me like to evaluate kind of whether the plan is working because I've, because I knew I've seen progression in all of my lifts every week. And so I'm kind of used to that. And I know that that will slow down. So what? - Any, any strength gain is positive. - Yeah, don't get in the trap. - Don't do that too. So I would never give you a number like that and potentially set you up for being let down for something that could be great still. Like getting stronger anywhere is positive. - Yeah. So I would expect slower strength gains, but you've only been doing this for 90 days with the more bell. - Yeah. - You've got yourself some more consistent strength gains coming up. So you're still gonna see some pretty good consistent strength gains. I wouldn't expect to gain every week. That's what, that don't get caught up in that. But I think by the end of the program you'll see some clear number difference. - And we say don't expect it, but that could happen. - It could. - Somebody who is not proficient in barbell lifting and is just really getting good at it, that alone, they will get it. And then if we also give that person a calorie surplus and they're dialed in everywhere else, oh my God, you absolutely could keep getting stronger like that. But none of us would ever say that to you because if also you had a week where you're like, "Hey, I think it's stronger this week. "Did I am I not doing good?" It's like, no, that doesn't mean you're not doing good. - I would be great, you know? - Totally. And I'm just like, the reason why I said that, and I think you're okay with this 'cause of what you told me about your overhead press, is if you get carried away with having to add weight to the bar and you start to ignore little nagging, you know, kind of pain and stuff, don't do that. Like make sure you're form a technique, but it sounds like you're really good with your technique and you pay close attention. - Yeah, and this is part of the process too. Like when you start really moving the weight fast, that's a whole other skill. And I think that this is a great process for you to then really adapt to barbell training, get strong, get consistent with that and be able to stabilize it properly and adjust. And from there, then we can look at stuff like, okay, we can get into like moving the barbell a little faster and like some lifts that will complement that and then your body will respond at another level with that. So this is a great time for you to really just adapt to the barbell. - Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if you gained a few pounds of muscle by the end of mass power lift. Like three, three, four pounds of muscle, I think would be, I wouldn't be surprised if that happened. - Yeah, that sounds exciting actually. - Yeah, you're on it, you're on it, great. - Okay, my. Oh, can you still hear me? - Yeah, a little bit, you're waking up a little bit. We can hear you. - Hello? - Yep. - Can you hear you? Can you hear us? - Okay, so my guess is, yeah, can you hear you? - Mm-hmm, okay. - We're delayed, let's wait a minute. - Okay, my last question was just about, okay. - Hello? - We can hear you, we're just delayed. - Is it really fast? You wanna be able to, maybe you can reconnect? - Oh. - Okay, okay, I'll just ask my question then, and then I'll see, I'll listen to it when your answer comes through. My last question was, I've heard you guys talk about the concierge coaching, which would be like a once a month check-in thing, and I'm pretty dedicated, I'm really good at following through on plans. Do you think that that might be something that could benefit me as I continue to progress through? - That's what I was just. - I think that's what Sal was suggesting is that. That's what would be perfect for you, 'cause you are already doing great on your own, just having someone to check in and make modifications once a month will be perfect for you. - That's right, yep. - Okay, great. I used to work as a nurse, so I love data. I love seeing how the body responds and tracking data and doing all of that stuff, so to have somebody coach me through the process, and then I can follow through for a month and check back in. - Yes, sure. - We'll have somebody call you and say that that's ideal for you, that's what Sal was suggesting right there. That's perfect. - Okay, perfect. Okay, thank you so much. I had so much fun, and I would have never done this if you guys hadn't suggested it. I would have just kept spinning the hamster wheel, and so I am super happy, and just, yeah, my mood, my energy, my outlook, I feel like I have so much more to give to the world now, so thank you so much. - You got it, and I'm sorry. - I'm just gonna encourage you, it's gonna get better. - Yeah, it's beginning. - It's gonna get better. - Oh, okay. - Yeah, yeah, excited for you and your coach. You guys are gonna do great. - Yeah, and I think that's one thing, like you guys, but the coaches in general don't realize that what they're doing is that people who get stuck in this spot, they dedicate their lives.
so much of their brain space to focusing on fitness and like getting meeting their goals and how much they're eating and all this stuff and it's taking away from all of the gifts that we're given to give to the world. So you guys free up space for people when you get them in these these I don't know I don't know if I'm making sense but you've just you make free that piece for me to be a better person. That's it that's you you actually summed it up really well. Yeah thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. All right. Thanks guys. You got it. Take care. Okay. Bye. Yeah when I looked at her stats, uh wait barely changed. Waste didn't change. Hips went up an inch. She actually lost some body fat and built some muscle. Yeah. Yeah. She's in that perfect sweet spot. And just so people listen to this is what women will freak out over this. But let's say you're in this process you're trying to build and you do gain a little bit of body fat because you might uh through a surplus and let's say your waist goes from 26 to 26 and a half but your hips go from 30 and a half to 40 or 40 and a half. That's the ratio. Yeah. You look you actually look like you have a smaller waist because people freak out on my waist grew a little bit that might happen a little bit in a surplus especially for kind of lean. Yeah. But if you built more muscle you you look better and then you got more metabolic flex. Yeah. Yeah. Well highlighted was she could have jumped right to where she's at now from from the jump and maybe we'd be up even higher calories maybe we but you know it's sometimes uh some it worked out great because this is new to her and so you're in yeah easter easter in nicely now she's bought it now you can tell her. Go to 29 and she'd be like okay I trust you that's right. So sometimes it's okay to take someone so like this because it does it gets buy-in in that trust and then now they're like okay I get what we're doing. Yeah. Our next color is Ben from New Hampshire. What's up Ben? It's happening dude. Hey, how can we help? First of all I just want to say I'd love your show. I'm super consistent whenever I listen to you guys right here we've been listening for about three years now and we help me make some great gains. Yeah so to get into my question you know I've kind of always been that skinny kid growing up went to college at I'm 62 I was like 150 entering college. Really hit the gym, hit that unlimited meal plan was balking up. Made some really good gains especially in the last couple years I'm up to 2.30 now and so what I'm thinking is my only time to start cutting a bit. I've really never tried to do a dedicated cut in my life so before I really dove into it I wanted your advice how should I start oh I'm sure I'm not losing too much weight and whatever your advice is. Start with so how you've been listening to podcast for a long time. Yep. Have you heard sound I talk about this this challenge because this was us right skinny guy trying to gain weight our whole life and how the most challenging part for you will be the psychological part because being the because in your head you're still the skinny kid who's trying to get big and then when you start to cut to get shredded and you're gonna think you're losing muscle when you're probably not so I just want to start with that that before we get into like the like do this do that type of stuff is like know that there's going to be a period where you're going to be like I'm definitely losing muscle this is not working and you're going to want to bail and I just want to encourage you to see it all the way through you can always get it all back it's really easy to put that what once you got into this point weight wise it's easy get it back and so just see it all the way through I had to tell myself that I'm just committed to going this way even but I still believed I was losing muscle all the way there even though I knew better I still believe that and you just have to trust the process I just want to start with that before that's the big one yeah that's the big one so so I'm reading the rest of your email this is going to be kind of simple this will be a simple cut for you the hard parts with what Adam said but what we're going to what we can do is actually very simple and you'll see yourself lean out real nice you'll stay strong you might even build some muscle through this process and here's what it's going to look like because I see here that you eat out pretty regularly and there may be some other habits there that you could probably clean up because you're you've never really worried about being too heavy and literally it just looks like this clean up your diet and what does that look like specifically whole natural foods yeah prep your meals that's it whole natural foods hit 220 grams of protein today that you are getting from whole natural foods if you just do that you'll get leaner yep yep you'll get leaner consistently and still eat when you're hungry but just make make the whole food choices done not not eating out because eating out will will mess up that signal and you'll overeat but if you eat whole foods I bet it'll naturally drop your calories five seven hundred calories and you hit your protein you know like two two twenty a day consistently whole natural foods you'll be great yeah by the way if I when I do this because I eat pretty healthy most of time but if I switch from eating out to eating what I make I drop two percent without even trying yeah it just comes off and I'm already sitting kind of lean so this is easy so I would get rid of like any liquid calories that you have so soda or anything like that I get rid of like garbage snacking that kind of stuff and eating out and you just do that for like two or three months and you'll see yourself get leaner I would I would I would a good idea while you're doing this if you want to like continue going down this path because I think that'll take you easy the first four or five percent I think you'll get four or five percent leaner just doing that like relatively easy and then if you're if you track the calories while you're doing that's to kind of know where you're at then to keep that progress going after a month or two and you start to slow down a little bit you just reduce the calories by five hundred or increase steps in activity and then I'll just keep it going another month or two do you know how many grounds approaching you reading a day right now do you track anything yeah so that's the really the only thing I do track but I kind of do it more like mental math at the end of the day rather than answering something into an app I just don't love tracking all the time um but I usually make sure if I'm if I'm not at like 180 by the end of the day I'll add an approaching change so I make sure I'm usually always up to that like 220 I'm gonna I'm gonna make a little prediction here Ben because it's kind of loose with how you're doing it when you prep it's very consistent because you know what you're making yep you know what you're making so I bet if you consistently just through your own prep hit 220 grams approaching every single day clean up your diet I bet you you'll get I bet you want to have to do anything else yeah I bet you'll slowly yeah that's the form yet a physique that looks more muscular just through getting leaner and you might even build yeah the hardest part will be staying consistent with it and then trusting that you're not losing muscle because what will happen is it'll put you in a calorie deficit right away okay and so that'll already put you it but that'll also pull that glycogen out of that muscle which will make your muscles look a little bit flatter and smaller and that will mess with your head but you didn't lose muscle it's just they're depleted they're depleted and now you're you're now you're cutting into fat storage which is where you want to be to lean out so just get that out of your head that you you know you look worse so you don't like it like accept it and just keep going and then you'll see you're gonna you're gonna lean out just just fine just by simply making your meals it's gonna be all based on your own consistency with what we're saying that's it yeah whether this goes fast or this takes you a long time will be how consistently you do what we're saying now on the psychology part and like for how fast should I be weighing myself not a week once a day if you want once a week now if you want once a week but honestly if you're consistent with what we just said I think if you don't weigh yourself you're better yeah you'll see it in the mirror dude you'll work out you'll take your shirt off and be like yeah what's up what's up what's up what's your daily activity what do you do for work I work I sit a lot I do try to get outside I've already got three walks in today so I probably get around you know 708000 okay I hike a lot too so sometimes on a weekend I'll you know I'll go do a 10 mile hike like it's nothing so I'll ask another question I usually typically eat more on days where I you know do a 10 mile hike do you suggest trying to keep those calories again if the advice is literally if you're making your meals and you're hungry eat you more of them yep eat more of those yeah don't do this because sometimes what happens when people do a like a long hike is they'll do a long hike then they'll go eat out any garbage yeah don't do that which is which is probably what you do most people do that so yeah if you cut that out and just it's what you made and you just eat a big portion of it you find yeah you'll be fine that one another are you better you familiar with the concierge program that we do no you might be a great candidate for that is you just you meet once a month with the with the coach and so they're making subtle tweaks and so like as you have questions through it like as you're going and then they'll just tweak the program or tweak the diet as you're going through if that's something that interests you I can have somebody call you and they can talk you about what that would look like because you sound like you kind of know what you're doing you've been good you've been trying so this is now the advice we're giving you is great it's just having somebody who's gonna get a customized it to you every single month that's something you're interested in I'll have somebody call you that sounds perfect okay cool oh yeah that's you're you're you're too great dude yeah yeah appreciate I'm gonna keep it up all right Ben appreciate it this one when I so I when I went from just eating as much as I could and a lot of it was garbage to tracking protein and going how to hold natural I got leader but I also built muscle yeah so I was like eating a lot of calories my protein was tonight well that's always what happened I still this day on that way yeah it's just naturally when I find it very rare that somebody who isn't like tracking or making their foods consistently hits protein what they do is they they what's like what he said he guesses and then he adds a shake yeah yeah and so you're what ends up really happy when you start tracking you realize like oh shit I was under eating protein and I was over-consuming these other foods and simply just making your meals and making sure you hit that protein kind of just balance is everything out nicely our next color is Liz from New York hi Liz hi you're so cool how can we help you um okay so I am a very long time listener of the show I've been listening to you guys since 2017 so all right I bless you
I was there through it all. - Yeah, you hung in there. - You're right. - You're not. - You're doing it. - After finding you guys in the middle of my fitness journey, you really gave me direction. You helped a lot in my form and become really well-versed in a variety of exercises. So really appreciate everything I've learned through following you guys and all of your programs. So my question I'll start off with the general gist. I wrote in wondering, how would mind pump coach a woman to work out to optimize their health and lower stress while trying to get pregnant? So I can delve into a little bit more about myself. I was married to my husband in October and we just decided that we wanna start trying to start our family. So to talk a little bit more about what I do, I'm five, five, probably about 135, guessing on the body fat might be like 26%. I made a switch about three years ago from working out on my own. I had run a static and then strong and then I started a hit strength style class. Generally I would do about four to six hit classes a week, a couple cycling classes, ran about 20 to 24 miles and I average about 20,000 steps a day. - Wow. - So very active. - Yeah, you can see that. - Don't eat a lot during the day. Generally you could say kind of an old mad diet, do like a small breakfast and then one big meal. There's nothing outwardly off or anything in terms of hormones, doctors and obviously my friends and family who are less into the fitness world just think it's all great. But I'm curious what your thoughts are in terms of creating maybe a less optimal environment for trying to get pregnant. - Are you still present? That's present? That's how you're. - So two weeks ago I got told I have a, I have hamstring tendon opathy. So I've actually had to stop running. And I've had to stop the hit classes as well. - What do you think we're gonna tell? Yeah, you've been listening for Sadi. I already knew what we're gonna say to you. - Yeah, but I want you to tell me. - Yeah. - Yeah. - Stop the running. - Yeah. - Probably stop the cycling. Switch to some slower form of strength training. - Yep. - Eat more. - Yeah. - Yeah, yeah. - You're on point. - We're done. - Yeah, yeah. - We'll talk you later. - Yeah. - No, so check it out. So here's a deal, okay. It's much harder to get pregnant when there's a lot of stress being thrown at the body. It could be emotional stress, it could be physical stress, and you're doing a lot. You're doing a lot. I doubt your body fat percentage at 26% by the way. - You do here. - Yeah, you're probably in the low 20s if not under. And so you're gonna actually have to gain some weight. And you're gonna have to really reduce your exercise. And I'm also gonna challenge you like this and just present this to you. Liz, pregnancy, first off, let me ask you this, how important is this priority for you? - Examiner one. - Okay, okay, good. 'Cause we're gonna have to change a lot of things to make it happen. But I also wanna let you know that during the pregnancy process being pregnant, postpartum, for somebody that's so in-definit, it's very challenging. And so this is a great time to start to kind of make peace with it because when you're pregnant, it's gonna feel like your body's not yours after you have your baby. And what the hell, it's still not mine. And it's like two years later where you're like, I think I think I'm back, type of deal. And for somebody who's so in-definit and in their body and knows how to perform and what their body's capable of, it's very, very challenging. Okay, but if you let go of it, it's not so challenging. But if you try to hold on to it, you're gonna be in for a really bumpy ride. So it's gonna look like this. This would be the strategy. You're gonna need to gain weight and you're gonna need to stop working out a lot, like a lot. - Yeah, it should be like mass-15. - Basically, your body needs to be like this wonderful, pleasant, like ready to host life, environment. And I'm talking to you, right? If I was talking to somebody else, that might be different advice, but for you, it's mass-15, walking 10,000 steps a day, no more. - And you get in the stress levels down. And your goal is to gain 10 pounds before you get pregnant. - Yep. - So bumping the calories. So going away from this, - Do you know how many calories you're eating? - She's one meal a day. So you can't be higher than maybe 1,500 to 1,900 at the highest. - She's the way. - Yeah, I would say probably the morning, it's like, I don't know, a 250 snack, maybe something's very small and then it's just dinner. So probably, I would say probably around 1,500. - Yeah, overall. - So you're gonna need a breakfast? You're gonna eat a lunch and then you're gonna keep eating dinner. Follow maps 15, don't let yourself go more than 10,000 steps a day and that's it. - Now the beautiful part about this is if we reduce down to a maps 15 and you eat properly like that, she'll probably put some good muscle on too. Your body will probably respond. - Yeah, but I'm just, - You're a gain, you're a gain, you're a gain. - You'll gain good weight. - That's definitely what's gonna happen, but I'm setting you up for gaining weight. - Yeah, it doesn't matter. - It doesn't matter what weight it to be honest with you. - I've had a few female clients like you who are like a couple of them were ex-athletes or just fitness fanatics and we literally had to be like, we're gonna gain body fat. - That was Katrina. - Katrina was that. - By the way, Katrina did not feel lean. That was the hardest part for her was she's like, I don't feel like I'm lean at all. - She had to purposely gain body fat. - And the doctor's like, you need to put on body fat and she's like, this is so weird to me. This is not, this is not lean me at all. And so yeah, we had to stop a lot of the training and really reduce it and eatin cheeseburgers and doin' things to put on body fat. And so that's what we had to do before she got pregnant and she did not feel lean at all. And being honest, like, Siena, I didn't look at her and go like, oh, she's to way too lean. I even with all my experience, I didn't look at her and go, oh, she looks way lean. But it's just to highlight the point you're making that, it's amazing what you have to allow your body to do to allow a life to come in there. Like if you're gonna grow a life and you have to be in this environment that is calm and not stressed and has a good amount of body fat on it and then the baby will feel like I can grow in this optimum environment. And if it doesn't, if it's stressed and all those things we're doing, hit, running, cycling, those are all stresses. - Lots of steps. - Yeah, and then under, and then doing it in a low calorie environment, it just exacerbates all of it. And so no baby's gonna wanna grow in that environment. - So, and just, and by the way, there's always, of course, there can be lots of different reasons why this is a challenge. But you did say cycle is regular, hormones look good. And so this just seems pretty clear. And the amount of working out you're doing is crazy. Like you're doing a lot. - Yeah. - Yeah. - I knew that deep down, I knew you guys would tell me. - Yeah, yeah. - But, and here's the deal, I'm gonna help you, I'm gonna encourage you some more. Give what we're saying three months. 'Cause here's what sometimes a person will do. Is they'll listen, they'll try it for a month, they don't work. - Yeah. - No, give it a good three months before you go back to the fertility doctor and say, okay, let's look deeper because they cut all these things down, I increase my calories and now I wanna see if there's another issue. But give it a good three months of a shot. - Well, I would, I don't know where you're at personally in your financial situation, but I would really push you to get with one of our coaches just because, just because of how difficult this can be. - Yeah, I am worried about my adherence. - Oh, a hunter. - Yeah, this is not easy. This is not easy. It's not an X's and O's hard, right? I don't think it's like a, you don't understand when I say do this or do that. It's the psychological piece and having somebody remind you Liz, you're doing great, stay the course. And so if you're open to that, I would like you to work with one of our coaches. - Yeah, I would definitely love to, you know, please talk and I'll know. - We'll have someone call you after we get off and then it'll present to you what that would look like. But I think that would be, if this is a serious priority to you and it is the number one priority, I think it'll be more than a worthwhile investment is to do this. And you don't need it forever. It's to get through this process, get you pregnant and then you're good. - Either way, you're gonna get mass 15. And then if it works, will you please let us know and message us? - Yeah, yeah. - You'll be the second to know. - Yeah. (laughing) - Awesome. All right, Liz, we'll have someone call you. - Thank you. - Looking forward to it when you get pregnant. - Thank you so much. Appreciate it. - You got it. - Yeah, that's a lot. She's doing a lot of stuff. - Running, 20,000 steps, hip-laces, lifting, oh dude. - You know, it highlights, that'll damp, by the way, that'll damage a man's fertility too. It's just not as sensitive. A man's fertility is not as sensitive. - Well, you know, it's tough when you take someone like that, especially when all her markers aren't showing it yet. It shows you how resilient the body can be sometimes. You know, 'cause. But. - You think her hormones would be, yeah, take it. - I mean, she's only 32, she's still young. She's still young and still resilient. You keep going down that path. I literally had a client. And this isn't necessarily the advice that I would give the people, but for this client, it was appropriate. She was getting her cycle. Hormones look good. Exathlete. We reduced her activity. Two months later, it's not happening. She's working with a fertility doctor. She's like, I don't want to do all the fertility stuff. And I'm like, you got to get fat. She's like, what? I'm like, you got to start eating some burgers and stuff. - Yeah. - And so she did. She started eating, 'cause she just wasn't eating enough. She wasn't, and so she started eating more, that kind of stuff. And what's crazy is that you're saying that. And I'm telling you, this is what Katrina, and what Katrina was not eating a super low calorie. I didn't look at her and think she looked really lean, like too lean. - But she had to purposely go try to eat a lot. - But she had to purposely go to her body.
go gain body fat and we had to go out and do that and we - We know that reserve. - And it was such a good experience for me to see that firsthand in my wife because I can only imagine if you're somebody who doesn't feel like I'm not lean, I don't feel lean and I'm already eating good amount of calories, I don't, oh, and Kishin doesn't train like that. It's not over-trained and so it's like, but it's like you just need to be at a even higher body fat. Your body has the sense that you're in this plenty. - And there's plenty. - And that there's, it's a spectrum, not everybody's the same. Some people need to be at an even higher body fat percentage than other people. Some people get pregnant at 20 or 21. - Yeah, but some people need to be in the mid to high 20s. For that to happen. - That's usually my experience. - Yeah. - Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. It's my puttmedial, see you there. - Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB
[email protected]. The RGB Superbundle includes maps and a ballac, maps for performance and maps aesthetic, nine months of phased, expert exercise programming designed by Sal Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels, and performs. With detailed workout blueprints in over 200 videos, the RGB Superbundle is like having Sal Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Superbundle has a full 30-day money bag guarantee and you can get it now plus other valuable free resources at mindpumpmedia.com. If you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five-star rating and review on iTunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support And until next time, this is Mindbomb.
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