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all of hollywood's worst secrets inside that mustache um i'm getting a hot flash should we
sit down i think we should thank you yeah last night someone oh my god another fan
i'm not talking about like my one of my fans i'm talking about someone as a fan because they're
also having hot flashes and someone had one last night hand fans this means nicole i think we have
to start making fans yeah oh also oh there it is i got tissues this time right now nicole's like
more merch we have to make did you guys meet nicole at merch this is her first time in texas
yeah so be really nice to her really nice to nicole we need to we need her to stay
we need her help very badly oh wait am i first tonight i'm pretty sure i'm first oh okay right
i'm not sure no yeah i went first last night
no but it's not about but it's about the stories it's not about that and then we just have a full
fucking fight in front of you i am 50 sure i'm first tonight well you know what when the slag
show starts we'll know for sure shit it is me okay okay great it's georgia yeah yeah yeah yeah
oh but first you have to tell them about this part oh that's right that's right um if you are
new here if you work at the bass theater and you don't know what the fuck is going on right now
if you're a drag along someone's friend um we welcome you this is a true crime comedy podcast
now that is not a thing most people have heard of before georgia and i grew up um we've had our
traumas we've had our times and the way we learn to cope is through humor and we also learn to cope
by reading and rule books and looking at websites with fucked up horrible things that happen to
other people on them and empathizing and wondering and making plans and so that might be a combination
that's upsetting for most people we just want you to know if you're concerned we do not think
that murder is funny we think we're funny and other than that if you don't like it you can get
the fuck out we also we also realized today after 10 years of touring that we never told you guys
that we don't know each other's stories yeah i mean people who listen all the time know this but
right we it when georgia tells me this story right now i've never heard it it's not like she sends it
to me and i read it or anything it's as new for me as it is for you and our um the people we work
with will tell you how fucking annoying that is for all of them to have to keep they have to have
two meetings like separate meetings with us don't even mention the and you know the slideshows yeah
you if you're the one who gives it away it's not good look what happened to steven
right that's why steven's at the premiere the 50th anniversary of jaws and not here tonight
sorry sorry you can't be here with these insane women these ones not these ones that yeah no one
else the holidays are right around the corner which means people are about to do a lot of
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first goodbye all right yeah let's do it okay okay so this one
this one it got pitched to me and i was and it's a weird phenomenon kind of ghosty story
and i was like that's really weird that you're pitching it because i've actually witnessed
this phenomenon myself uh tonight's story is uh it's a classic texas texas texas
texas texas texas story all right karen it's a dark night in 1883 okay you love it and 23 year
old robert reed ellison is driving cattle to a ranch on mitchell's flat just 15 minutes east
of the newly established what the fuck well you know what it is we didn't do our vocal exercises
yeah yeah i love new york i need new york i love i need you new york i didn't do my vocal exercise
of taking a beta blocker so that's what's going on here she's just out there on the edge that's
right established newly established railroad in the town of marfa texas marfa yeah oh next
reviews on marva i love it while heading through paisano pass he spots a car that's not his car
a series of strange glowing orbs on the horizon.
The flickering white lights move too quickly to be a campfire.
And it's the only explanation the cowboy can think of.
It's like a. Jesus?
Jesus.
Jesus Christ himself?
No, it's 1883. They didn't have that yet, I don't think.
It's kind of a newer thing, yeah.
I'm not a Bible student.
When he goes to look to see what the hell it could be,
he finds no signs of, like, a campsite,
of what could have explained these orbs.
There's no people, there's no ashes, there's no footprints.
Obviously, it's not the headlights of a car.
It's 1883, guys.
Other settlers and railroad workers report the same sightings,
mysterious multicolored orbs hovering the desert
just outside of Marfa.
Cattlemen drive their herds to the railroad.
They use the lights as their guide.
And when they see the lights, they know the stockyards
are just 20 miles away, and they do whatever you do 20 miles from a
stockyard. I don't know.
Cowboys ride into the mountains overnight to try to find the source,
but the lights always vanish before they can be tracked down.
The vast, open desert makes distances deceptive.
Sorry, what, what, what?
Distances, deceptive.
I said. Deceptive distances. My new band.
So catching the lights is impossible.
More than a hundred years later, these same lights still appear sporadically
on the southern horizon between Alpine and Marfa, and yet these glowing orbs remain
as hotly contested a phenomenon as they were in the late 1800s.
This is the story of the Marfa ghost lights.
Wow.
I've never heard of that.
No?
No.
I have sat on a truck hood, is that what, how cars go, and seen them myself.
Are you serious?
I swear.
And they're not fireflies?
They're not fireflies.
Okay.
I want to, let me actually, let me explain them.
What if I solve the Marfa ghost lights tonight?
Oh shit.
With just a very simple. With just a very simple suggestion.
It was just two fireflies.
Just two fireflies hanging out.
Well, real quick, the main sources for this story are articles from the History Channel,
Visit Marfa, and the Texas County Reporter, and the rest of the sources can be found on
our show notes.
And then I went onto our email, where we have thousands and thousands of emails from murderinos,
and someone from Marfa explained what they are perfectly in a way that I clearly can't
do.
So, Kay, a murderino, said, "Here's the best description I can give of the lights. They
usually present themselves like this."
"They usually present themselves in groups of two or three, sometimes splitting apart
like a cell, and then merging back together.
It's like a teenager with a red light, you know, laser light."
Cat toy thing?
Yeah!
Yeah, I guess.
Like a cat toy.
But it's not.
And then they move unexpectedly in a way that can only be described as dancing, and they
can appear in all sizes and colors, and most importantly, they appear where there has never
been a road.
And Kay says, "We have spent many nights sitting on the porch, drinking wine, and watching
the lights dance."
"And playing against the desert landscape."
And it is like something you would see out of, what was that, Unsolved Mysteries.
It's just really weird.
They're like kind of blurry, and then they're not.
And Kay's not scared.
She's not scared.
No, no.
It's just like lights.
It's just lights.
I think we have a photo of them.
Unless it's your photo.
Yep.
Ooh!
So they like, they ping up and around, and they dance, like they do dance.
It's really cool.
And we're sure that's not a Jaguar?
1883.
I don't think so.
I mean, yeah, it looks like, they go really erratic, so there's no, it wouldn't make sense.
Did you take this picture?
I absolutely did not.
Okay.
Okay.
So, as most of you probably know, Marfa is a little town in West Texas, about an hour
from Big Bend.
It is a tiny town, and it's really artsy, and fun, and cool, and they have a great vintage
dress shop.
It was originally founded as a water stop.
And, and freight headquarters for the railway lines during their westward expansion of 1883.
And that's the very same year Robert Ellison records his first sighting of the flickering
lights.
So, before ranching and the railroad become big business, Marfa and the Big Bend region
are part of a wide-ranging network of indigenous travel routes, hunting grounds, and spiritual
sites.
The Mescalero, Mescalero, excuse me, Apache, are telling stories of ghostly campfires,
possibly belonging to their ancestors, on distant hills around Marfa.
So, way before.
Ancient.
These, we came along, and we're like, "We saw a thing."
They're like, "No, we saw a thing."
Yeah.
First.
The lights were sometimes said to guide the spirits of the dead on their journey to, or
to warn the living to stay away from sacred or contested lands.
in some Apache tales, the moving lights are interrupted. Nope. Interpreted.
Similar. You're fine. Thank you. Interpreted.
This is the fucking menopause tour. It certainly is. I don't know what to do about it.
Right? It's like, it should be brought to you by Estradiol, not Uncrustables, but
so I don't, I don't do self-care. What if Uncrustables were the cure for menopause
and that's, this is how it happens. We discover it. That would be problematic
on many levels, right? Yeah. In some tales, it's either living or supernatural and they travel
across the plains at night and the lights vanish. If someone approaches just the same,
the same, like it's the same lights, I bet. Probably. Another story follows an old Apache
chief, Apache chief who goes to a place called El Paso and he's like, I don't know, I don't know,
he gets separated from his people as they travel long ago through the high Chianti mountain
country. And legend has it that the chief still roams the hills, lighting fires in hopes of
signaling his lost tribe. So there's all these like tales behind it. Okay. Some Pueblo stories
describe it as wandering stars or dancing lights. And to the indigenous people of Marfa,
lights in the desert at night, especially those that moved, vanished or changed colors,
were unquestionably a sign or a message with natural spiritual world.
It was only in the 20th century that white settlers decided to investigate them
scientifically. And start coming up with all kinds of theories. So in the early 1920s and 30s,
the Marfa lights are a popular topic of curiosity among ranchers, but also with travelers along the
newly erected U.S. Route 90, your favorite. That's a good one, right? So fast. Feel me,
just ignore it. Okay. Some early observers think that the lights could be mirages created by the
temperature, you know, what a mirage is. And because it's so freaking hot in the desert.
It's quite hot here. It's hot here. It's hot here. The desert's intense heat during the day,
followed by cool nights. They think it creates layers of hot and cold air,
causing light to bend, which it does. Yeah. Because we're, you know,
we're scientists. That's what I've always said.
You've always hypothesized that. Constantly hypothesizing. No one will listen.
This bending of light could cause distant car headlights, campfires, or other light sources
to appear elevated, distorted, or flickering, much like mirages that you always see on the
road to Las Vegas. That's right. In that one video. Cheryl Crow, thank you very much.
This is weird.
We have glasses of water tonight. This feels dangerous. I feel like we're like on NPR or
something. These aren't, these aren't plastic. These are, no, these are absolutely crystal.
Smash it. See if it's, smash it. But of course there weren't roads and cars then. So that doesn't
make any sense, right? Yes. Thank you. We said yes and no at the same time. Who knows? But we
don't know. So, ironic. Another early proposal is that the lights are products of big, shiny
mica bed. Mica or mica? Mica. Mica. Yeah. That's my nephew's name. I should know that, but
it's not spelled the same way. So don't, I'm not a bad auntie. It's also my favorite L'Oreal
lipstick from the eighties. Remember mica? It's kind of shimmery purple. We got mica
lipstick. We got legs. What else we got? We'll keep naming shit. Don't you worry. And so
like maybe it's mineral deposits, that sort of thing. Then on the non-scientific side of other
people believe that the lights are will of the wisps. Have you heard of that? Like, yeah. You're
from the country. Is it a country thing? I was lying. Sorry. I don't know why I did that. It just
felt like I was, I was supposed to. Is will of the wisps something to do with like fairies or like
a natural? Atmosphere. Let me tell you. Atmosphere ghost lights that appear at night, especially over
the swamps and for in folklore, like that great album, they are often described as mischievous.
You set off the Swifties. That's genius. Genius crossover. I was in the car with my
little younger nephews the other day and they couldn't stop talking about Fortnite. And I was,
I was like, Oh yeah. And I put Fortnite on and they were like, this is not what we're
excited. And they're like, who is this lady? Will of the wisps. Yes. Will of the wisps. They're
scientifically, they're, they're mischievous or malevolent spirits leading travelers astray is,
yes. So exactly what you said. They're like, come over here into this weird Prada store
out in the middle of nowhere. It's crazy. You won't believe it.
Scientifically, will of the wisps, will owe the wisps. What?
Yeah. You have to pronounce it like that. Um, are usually explained by the oxidation of,
you guys know this gas is produced by decaying organic matter, like swamp gas. You know what I
mean? Sure. But both of these theories have been debunked as West Texas desert conditions are
typically too dry and lack the organic matter to produce significant. Are there scientists here?
Humidity. I think there's a scientist right there. Hey, science. So you're basically saying
no bogs in Texas. We don't get to have.
That is a country song. There's no bogs in Texas.
Yes.
She got it. We will hit every audience like clap trap button. We can in a theater this big,
we don't give a shit. There's no shame. I mean, if you don't know, there's no shame in this podcast
by now. You're new. You're new. You're brand new. Thank you for coming and giving us a chance.
Sorry. And sorry. And we're sorry.
Also, it could be St. Elmo's fire. It's a great movie.
Yeah. Just somebody playing that way in the distance is like, wait a second. Is that Rob
Lowe playing the saxophone or a willow the wisp? Yes. Then the Roswell incident happens UFOs. We
love them. That happens in 1947. And locals wonder if the Marfa lights, finally, we get to
spacecrafts and aliens. We love them. I think you do. I do. That's right.
Due to their unexplained movement, obviously in glowing appearance, many UFO enthusiasts claim
that the Marfa lights are aliens monitoring the earth or using it as a secret landing spot. But
like, it's really obvious. They're not hiding it. It's not like secret, you know? And also if
they're monitoring us, fucking do something. Right. Like seriously. Right. Let's stop. Stop
the auditing. Fucking step in. Yeah. It's like very, the cutest aliens. They're like, well, you
know what I mean? They're doing something adorable for hundreds of fucking years. Or it's like. Yeah.
They're flying over us being so adorable. And they're like, ew, what are they doing to each
other? Why are they like this to each other? Seriously. So I'm going to go with UFO. I don't,
but it is fucking weird. Like, like not every night, but almost every night, these twin little
and sometimes more lights. So it's always two or more? Yeah. Or just two. Okay. I saw two,
everything I saw was two, but people have said they've seen more. Okay. Um, and it's just so
mysterious. So, and then in, um, July, 1957, a writer named Paul Moran writes an article called
the mystery of the Texas ghost light in Coronet magazine. I love that one. I love trumpets and
I always have. And this spreads the word about this phenomenon in tiny Texas town in a tiny
Texas town. Why'd you say phenomenon like that? I don't know.
Cause I was like, what if you say this douchey, you don't know it until this fucking moment.
I've never said it like in front of a fucking audience.
Phenomenon. Right. Wait, can I tell the story about Jackie Beat making the best joke of all
time? It was my first writing job. There's an amazing, uh, drag queen named Jackie Beat,
who was one of the staff members. You might know her. And we were trying to write jokes about
the John Travolta movie phenomenon. And somebody pitched a very terrible,
terrible joke. And Jackie goes, Oh, come on. And I was like, well, I'm never going to say
anything funnier than that. So, um, so in 1971, minimalist artist, Donald Judd visits Marfa and
decides to relocate their buying buildings and land for large scale art installations. And this
is kind of when Marfa starts to become the Marfa we all know and love. Have you guys been to Marfa?
A lot of people have.
you yeah is it like your like summer vacation road trip with your parents and you're like i don't
fuck it i mean this is embarrassing i like that you're like have you guys been to marfa
have you have you 2 000 or 3 000 people been to marfa i don't know i i'm from like southern
california and i've never been to catalina like that's fucking weird why i don't know what's your
problem i don't know but so like marfa to me reminds me of like if you haven't gone you just
don't go it's like a very specific place to go to it's it's not like you're driving through to
somewhere else and end up there right
It doesn't lead to anywhere?
Yeah, it's very specific.
That's the first time an audience has in unison said one answer.
That's so true.
It doesn't lead to anywhere?
No.
No, we hate it.
We had to go for field trips.
It's scary.
Thank you.
Let's not give individual opinions about Mark.
You already said no.
So this dude, Donald Judd, goes out and it changes the landscape of Marfa, attracting
artists, photographers, and writers.
And at the same time, the University of Texas researchers conduct studies on the Marfa lights.
You can cheer for your college.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
The fighting.
We're bulldozers.
We haven't done that one in a long time.
I was thinking on our way here, like driving through.
College campus and being like, for two girls who dropped out of college, this is pretty fucking cool.
Yeah.
Can't kick us off campus.
You could.
Yeah.
I don't want to challenge anyone.
Okay, so the University of Texas researchers are conducting studies on the Marfa lights.
And now visitors are coming from all over, staking out informal viewing areas to find the best views of it.
So people are finding out about it and it's getting exciting.
And I think the air turned on and I really appreciate it.
Breathe again.
Yeah.
It's become such a hot topic that the El Paso Times reports, quote.
Really?
It's that good?
I love this newspaper.
Snap.
Some people, they say, quote, some people in small towns fight about which town has the best looking women, which town has the best football team.
Or which town has the most to do after school.
Or 7 p.m.
But down around Alpine and Marfa, the people fight about whether the lights are caused by something natural or if they're caused from little people from somewhere else, end quote.
That's very biased writing right there.
They clearly chose the first.
Oh.
Is it caused by something natural or.
Little people doing this and that.
It's a little condescending.
I think so.
Yeah, no, I hear that.
Who was that writer?
Just call them on the phone.
El Paso.
Someone from El Paso Times who's been lost to history.
Oh.
But we have.
There he is.
So as car traffic.
Little hat with the press card right there.
Oh.
One of those cigarette, cigar, cigarettes.
I got the story.
As car traffic increases, skeptics continually suggest, they won't shut the fuck up, that distant headlights are refracting in the atmosphere.
They're not.
I bet you they're not.
They're not.
Unless they were on stage coaches.
I'm going to go ahead and say, no, they're not.
Distant lanterns refracting.
Right.
No, it's not.
This explanation obviously doesn't work.
And also the lights change colors.
The single light splits into a bunch of different lights.
I mean, it really looks like someone's having a campfire behind the mountains and sparks are coming off of the campfire.
But it's huge.
But like big and they're having a lot of fun doing it.
It's cute.
It's actually kind of cute.
Finally, a campfire can have fun.
A cute campfire.
I miss my cats.
Okay.
Thanks a lot, Marfa.
I did almost start crying when someone had one of my cats on their shirt last night.
I know.
Okay.
In the early 80s, a physicist at University of Texas at Dallas.
Yeah.
His name was also Donald.
Uh-oh.
They fighting.
No, no, no.
He's squabbling.
Pitchforks.
Yep.
That's right.
Donald Bicknell conducts controlled observations in the area.
Includes that most lights correlated with car headlights and ranch lights from miles away.
Other people are like, no, dude, you're wrong.
And it's just, you know, I keep telling you guys over and over again.
It doesn't make sense.
It doesn't fucking make sense.
In 1890.
Nope.
In 1987.
Different.
Different.
I caught myself.
The town launches a now annual Marfa Lights Festival.
Because anything that happens, we need a festival about it.
You have to do a festival about it.
We insist.
Yeah.
You see a corndog on the ground?
It's the corndog festival.
Corndog times.
Where enthusiasts share their experiences seeing the lights at storytelling sessions
and local ranchers, artists, and residents lead guided trips.
So Marfa's population is around 2,000, but thousands of people come to town to try to
get a glimpse.
So the locals fucking hate it.
I hear you.
So I do think they probably don't aren't big fans.
It's actually a big destination for art and your favorite activity, glamping.
Glamping.
No, she doesn't like it.
When you started that word, I was like, what the fuck could this be?
Glam something.
They've been referenced.
The lights have been referenced in a song by the Rolling Stones and on TV shows and
shows like the Simpsons.
King of the Hill and tripping out with Allie and Georgia from 2013 on the cooking channel.
We went to Marfa.
We had this show, my friend Allie Ward and I had this show where we travel the country
and we eat food at little places and trip out over.
We're going on a trip.
Get it?
And we were like, Marfa, let's go there.
And it was really fun.
And we saw the lights and we wore vintage dresses and that's it.
Incredible.
Thank you.
Good job.
Thank you.
And you can find it on the, you can find it on the, you can find it on the, you can find
that episode in the depths of the internet.
Real, real deep.
If you really look, if you want to look.
They'll find it.
They'll find it.
In the early 2000s, a group of gifted and talented high school students.
I don't know why I laughed at that.
Because we've always laughed at them.
Yes.
Because we weren't them.
And so we're a little bitter.
We're very hurt and embarrassed and ashamed.
Yeah.
And they can, they, they convinced the Texas Department of Transportation to build a new
building to build an official viewing center.
And in 2003, the Martha Mystery Lights Viewing Center opens and thousands of visitors come
every year.
I think we have a plaque.
What?
To show you.
Oh.
Well, well, well.
There's a plaque.
And that's the viewing center, that RV right back there.
Come on in.
Giddy in.
I love that.
So a group of gifted and talented students went and they're like, we'd like to speak
to you about a viewing center right now.
And it actually works.
It worked.
It did work.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Nerds.
From 2004 to 2008, a Texas State University study uses spectros.
Texas State.
Yeah.
Oh, no, no, no, no.
The.
Fighting.
Raging.
Alcoholics.
Oh, that's right.
There's a My Favorite Murder cocktail here tonight.
Oh, shit.
Are you guys okay?
Was it good?
Was it good?
How are you?
She's holding her empty glass up now.
You got a lot of cups being held up.
Nice.
This is going to start to be like a Jimmy Buffett concert and I can't wait.
What's a Jimmy Buffett concert like?
I truly don't know.
I'm not sure because I'm so stoned when I'm there.
Oh, God.
Busting my flip flop.
You know.
Got it.
They.
So, they use spectroscopic analysis, mapping light sources to vehicle locations.
Similarly to early studies, they find the lights.
Again, they're wrong.
Not connected.
It's not going to get.
Yeah.
There's strong evidence that most modern day sightings are a combination of man-made light
sources, mostly headlights being refracted into the air.
But we here at My Favorite Murder, they know.
We scientifically know better.
Yeah.
We scientifically nope that shit.
Yeah, nope.
But some local artists insist.
They insist on sightings in areas and times with no possible traffic.
And, of course, Robert Ellison back in 1883 certainly hadn't seen any cars in the desert
that night before Marfa itself became the place to be in 1883.
Hey, wait.
That rhymes.
Sing it.
The plaque at the Marfa Lights Viewing Center details that despite more than 100 years and
more than 75 folktales about their origins, the Marfa ghost lights remain a fascinating
unsolved mystery.
And that is the story of the Marfa Ghost Lights.
The Marfa Ghost Lights.
Yeah.
Thank you.
I just love.
It's, I just love the way they're just like, and then 40 years later, they study it and
they're like, it's cars.
And it's like, no, it's not.
We refuse.
Let me tell you how many times they studied it and said it was cars.
That's my story tonight.
That's very cool.
Now I want to see that.
They're beautiful.
They're really cool.
I like that people aren't scared of them.
They're like, I drink wine.
And if we're being attacked by aliens, so be it.
They like, um, whoa, they, uh, what's a tailgated, a phenomenon, right?
You guys love tailgating.
That's what I heard.
Sorry.
I'm in the transitional period to get ready for my own story.
It's your turn now.
I stopped listening to you three minutes ago.
I know.
I recognize the look in your eyes from my own.
It's this, oh, shit, oh, shit, oh, shit, shit, shit.
What's this gonna be like?
where I am? What am I doing? Okay. I'm here for it. Thank you. Great job. Thank you. I really
liked that one. Thank you. It was good. Guys, we've got to solve this mystery before the world
ends. October is the month when being scared is supposed to be fun. Terrified in a haunted house?
Sure. Your actual house? Absolutely not. Feel safe in your home with SimpliSafe. SimpliSafe
is designed to help stop intruders before they get inside. I recently got an alert from my camera
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out. I opened my camera and it was a big spider dangling in front of the camera, which was
terrifying in itself, but such a relief. And I love that I know that it works. Like it's so much better a spider than an actual person, but I'll be prepared. All the
answers are on your phone. You don't have to worry and sit there and wring your hands. Join the more
than 6 million people who entrust SimpliSafe with their home security. Right now save six
percent off with professional monitoring when you visit SimpliSafe.com slash fav. That's SimpliSafe.com
slash fav. And when you order, please write in my favorite murder in the checkout survey. It lets
them know that we sent you and it really helps support the show. SimpliSafe, ahead of crime in
real time. Goodbye. You know a favorite M word? Magnesium. Like the kind that's in Dr. Teal's
magnesium spray. Made from a proprietary blend of topical minerals powered by pure Epsom salt and
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magnesium spray online or in your local bath aisle. Goodbye.
Between work, school, family obligations, and the endless Halloween hustle,
it often feels like there's never a good time to slow down. The costumes, the parties, the planning,
it all adds up.
But no matter how busy life gets, even a small break can help us recharge, reset,
and actually enjoy the moment we're in. Because breaks don't have to be big to matter. They can
be the 15 minutes in your car before pickup or the two minutes while your little pumpkin ties
his shoes. The pause between one task and the next, when you finally get a second to yourself.
KitKat gives people permission to take the break they've earned and make it a better break,
a real break. Because when you stop, even briefly, you don't fall behind. You come back a little
lighter, a little faster. And when you stop, you don't fall behind. You come back a little
clearer, a little more ready for whatever's next. While the world tells us to keep going,
KitKat reminds us that the best time for a break is now. Have a break. Have a KitKat. Goodbye.
My story tonight is very different than the Marfa ghost lights.
It begins 111 years ago on, I don't know if this math is right, on November 12th, 1914.
Okay.
Sounds right.
Sounds right. A few miles south of downtown San Antonio.
Oh, they love it there. They love that river. Um, in a modest cottage once shared by two young
nurses, both named Emma. So one of these Emmas had recently got married, someone knows, and they
moved out. Um, but she came back to visit her old roommate, Emma. Um, so around four o'clock
that afternoon, they're having a visit and the newly married Emma runs to the neighbor's house,
screaming and begging for help.
And as she does two gunshots ring out from the cottage, the neighbors rush over fearing that the
other Emma has been shot. Instead, they find the single Emma seemingly in shock, bleeding from a
slashed wrist and kneeling beside the body of a dead man sprawled on the floor. When the authorities
arrive, they learned the dead man is one of the richest businessmen in Texas. He's also married
and this may seem a little lazy, but his wife is also named Emma. Yes.
That's right. Wow. Wow. So we're going to go Emma one, two, and three.
That's fucking right on the entire time. These are the first moments of a very Texas true crime
story filled with lies, love, murder, beer, and featuring the recurring theme of most of these
stories, an awful husband slash boyfriend slash side piece. This is the story of the murder of
San Antonio businessman, Otto Kaler and the three Emmas in his life. Wow.
I don't know this one. And I didn't know this one, as you know, because we didn't know each other's
stories. That's right. Everything's a wonderful surprise. The sources that we used in this story
today are reporting by the legendary Texas writer, Joe Hawley, money, murder, sex, and beer by Robert
L. Gulley. People love beer. And the rest are in our future show notes that don't exist right now.
At some time. Look them up when they exist. When they exist, please. And no sooner. Now,
let's start with Otto Kaler's backstory. He's born in Germany in the 1850s to a family of
humble means. In his 20s, he immigrates to the United States, like so many others chasing the
American dream. And he first lands in St. Louis. He gets clerical work at a brewery. And then he
stays for a couple of years and becomes a naturalized US citizen, which is what we do here and which is
a good thing. And we need it. And what the fuck are we doing? Right? Let me get off my soapbox and
start reading off this paper again. He also meets his future wife, the first Emma, Emma Benson. And
her family is also German. And they're named Emma as well. Every single member of her family. So when
Emma and Emma are in their mid-20s, they meet at an event thrown for St. Louis's German community.
And then I wrote, this isn't real, Das Mingelfest.
You have to throw that this year.
Let's do the thing again. Damn it. I have a new weird tick where I go like this.
I told her about her new tick and now she can't not do it.
It's really such a bummer. Oh, I also write Die Kinderjäger.
That was the other event name. It's just Kindergarten.
Who knew you were so good at this?
Well, I just looked up like, what's a German phrase for a party? And then I just kind of
combined all the pieces. German seems kind of easy to learn because everything, you know,
it's like kindergarten, child garden. Right. Pretty intuitive and user-friendly.
So the two get married after they meet, obviously, and they move to San Antonio, Texas.
So in the 19th century, San Antonio is one of the most diverse cities in the United States with one of the most vibrant German immigrant communities of the time.
Wow. Yeah. People are scared to clap for Germans, but we can clap for diversity.
It's all fine. It's all fine. We're a good faith situation here.
So not only that, but Otto senses that there's a real opportunity in San Antonio's booming beer industry.
And he is right. So he immediately lands a job at the Lone Star Brewing Company.
It's the National Beer of Texas. Hey. Yeah. So he works there and he does such a good job that he
gains the attention and respect of none other than Adolphus Busch, co-founder of Anheuser-Busch
Brewery. I bet he's German, right? A little bit. And he's also the co-owner of Lone Star Beer.
So the fact that he likes Otto is huge. Soon Otto's rising up the brewery's ranks. And by the time he's 30 years old, he's the general man.
And he's the manager at Lone Star. Damn. But they also had shorter lifespans then, so don't feel bad about that.
Yeah, don't compare yourself to Otto. You'll never feel good about yourself.
30 was like middle age back then, and now it's like not.
Yeah. Also, it's like he was running a brewery when he was 30, and I was like, I was just drinking a brewery when I was that age.
So all the while that Otto's doing that, his wife Emma is holding down the household.
While being a doting, devoted wife. So let's take a picture.
Let's take a look, Jesus Christ, at the Kahlers.
Let's take a picture of the Kahlers.
This is Otto and Emma one.
Hi. Hi.
And they're 30.
They're both 30.
Told you. It was tough times.
Tough times in the turn of the century.
Wow. Look, there was no sunscreen.
There was hardly any water.
They drank beer instead of water.
It was just beer.
And she's got one.
She's got one of those "don't remove my ribbon" necklaces, right?
We all know what happens.
Never remove my ribbon.
And they borrow each other's glasses all the time.
I was going to say, I like that they could both go as each other for Halloween.
Absolutely.
They might be the same person.
They could be, actually.
Wait, that's the big reveal at the end.
It's all one guy.
- You're an Emma.
- There's no Emmas.
- There's not a single Emma.
i love them okay so um the kohlers are live the kalers are living sorry about that they're living
comfortably and uh they're able so so comfortably that they plan a yearly trip back to the homeland
in germany that goes usually from spring so like from may to october yeah because you have to take
a fucking boat and shit yeah that's right to escape escape the sweltering heat so in 1886
on the kalers annual trip home auto buys a lager recipe from a brewery in bremen um he has to borrow
a bunch of money from his family to afford to buy this recipe better be good yeah he's like well he
gets this feeling or he's like i tasted that shit beer back in america and we're gonna we're gonna
change the game here
um so he is hoping that this gamble pays off so the next year in 1887 um auto has a falling out
with the higher-ups at lone star he jumps ship and he goes to work for the san antonio brewing
association we take a look at it right here this is look at it
that's i see the word ass does anyone else did anyone else just go directly to the word ass
that would be i'm a child if we fully produce this it would be like this
still and then that would all fade and it would just be the word ass up there
so auto does well here too eventually he becomes the president of that place and under his
leadership the association builds a state-of-the-art facility that soon begins to produce the lager
from that recipe that he bought and he names that um that lager pearl lager okay i haven't had it
i had a scheiner bach last night do you guys like that i don't know i don't know i don't know i don't
know if you guys like that okay i was like that could be a boo and i'm just gambling i'm like
rolling the dice of beer and you loved it it's good yeah it's really good did you get a in in a
big boot it's fun it's fun to drink out of shoes i think you're having a party
that's how i party um dirty dirty shoes so in no time auto's gamble pays off people fucking love
pearl beer one local san antonio newspaper writes that it has quote an excellent flavor and quality
it's that kind of compelling journalism that has gotten us through it also recommends quote when
you want a fine glass of beer try the city pearl that's an ad that's not an article pearl beer
becomes so big that before long the san antonio brewing association becomes the biggest brewing
company in san antonio
okay good job yeah great you didn't do it um they have about maybe they i mean actually you're right
i apologize i don't know what you've done in your life the san antonio brewing association has
1200 employees whoa that's a lot um and they make around five hundred thousand dollars yearly in
revenue which is about five thousand dollars in it's like 1918 or so it is
43 000 you've gone lower you've gone you've gone you've gone low shit that's the first time that's
happened yeah that's right inflation do you want to play this game or you're trying to sink it i'm
trying we're trying to retire this game you you are and i won't stop okay five million in 19 no
what is it 500 000 jesus okay i did the same thing where i was like somewhere else yeah it's in
today's money is 1.9 million 16 million it's so unsatisfying to like not even be close yes
but i think it's very grounding to be wrong i i am most of the time i don't need another
hey girl i relate uh okay so he's making bank but beer is just the start for otto kaler he buys
a luxury health spa a bit south of the city he invests in mining and rubber companies across
the border in mexico
he buys lots and lots of real estate and he reportedly serves as either quote president
or director of 15 different operations jesus take a fucking break for real go to go to that health
spa exactly so by the early 1900s and into the 1910s oh sorry i gave you the wrong year it was
in the late 18 probably was right that's the reason that's the reason that's why um so into
the 1910s otto and emma are now approaching their 50s and they are fucking dead
rich like crazy they have an estimated net worth of around three million dollars you want me to just
say it just say yes okay at three million then i'm gonna go is 54 million 96 million in today's
money i mean that's that's too much money i know it's a lot they're at the top of san antonio high
society they live in a large stone i don't know i'm just trying to get through this fucking thing
i'm just kidding
they live in a large stone mansion just steps away from the brewery so that thing like you
live around the corner from work also have you lived near a brewery they fucking stink yeah
right unless you like hops i used to live around the corner from the gap and i was always still
eight minutes late every single day they hated my fucking guts so much at the gap um
anyhow you're gonna say you could smell it on you
smell those gross jeans
stone mansion i told you about that it's really close to the brewery oh and in that stone mansion
emma entertains their elite circle of friends and acquaintances um she's also very active in
different charities you saw her with the choker she's out and about but then it all comes crashing
down around 1907 emma gets very sick with an unspecified illness and the next year
otto alludes to her illness in a letter saying quote mrs kaler is still sick in bed she has had
another attack the night before last which forced her to go to bed again is that an attack of i've
been poisoned probably or is an attack of i'm so rich now i'm just fucking lazy and i'm just gonna
lay my ass around no she was actually sick sorry so writer robert l gully sorry lady that's rude
robert l gully the writer tries to get to the bottom of of emma's sickness in his book money
murder sex and beer he makes a compelling case that emma might be receiving treatment for anxiety
depression or even headaches and the treatment she's receiving isn't very effective oh my god
what could it have been back then right just zapping the ever-loving shit out of you yeah
and like literal snake oil where they're like we brought the snake in you kill it we'll milk it
you drink it why are you still sick you're hysterical um one of her doctors is a man who's
is a man named dr lewis tallman or tall man and he's a very close friend of otto's one of his
regular golf buddies and gully's book suggests that he's a quack dr tallman's treatments include
spoon feeding clients milk and soup i can do it myself dude no no no i must do it for you and it's
not even working dr tallman feeds you dr tallman's uh he keeps doing it for you he keeps doing it for
you he keeps them on bed rest for weeks at a time that's not a problem and but but his version is he
discourages everything except for very small movements dr tallman can i have some more milk
and soup really quick before you go uh he actually he even restricts reading dude
can you just drink your milk just drink your milk
there's no tv there's no podcasting do not move you can't even like do a shadow puppet on the
wall too much movement this is all meant to neurologically reset the overwhelmed nervous
patient um but we do know from old newspaper reports that emma was involved in a car crash
in 1910 um there don't seem to be any surviving records to explain more about that accident
but we do know there's no way i'm going to get these pages apart
sorry this story's over i love you guys thanks so much
i gotta get one of those um rubber thumb things yeah um we need so many things we need a lot of
things oh so uh otto believes that emma needs round the clock medical assistance and he winds
up hiring a live-in nurse to look after her and this is the second of the three emmas got it
um so from here going forward otto's wife emma kaler is emma number one
okay and this woman who's the new nurse is emma doom key and she is emma number two okay
and then we just have a floating threatening emma three coming up in the distance
so emma number two emma dumkey emma doom key says it right there karen is a pretty brunette
german woman in her 20s who otto hires on the spot after meeting her on one of their vacations
to germany that meanwhile emma number one's like pardon me i just could you
step away from her please i don't you guys seem to be hugging and kissing a lot
stop moving stop moving you're moving too much i'm sorry sorry drink your milk more milk
Mm-hmm.
But little does Emma, number one, know.
We do.
I think I just said it.
Her husband, Otto, is sleeping with Emma, number two,
pretty much immediately after she's hired.
Look, sex is natural.
But it isn't just a physical affair.
This is Maren's writing.
Otto falls hard for Emma, number two.
That old guy that looks like he should be on a bag of oatmeal.
He fell so hard for a 20-year-old.
Oh, who'd have thunk it?
Oh, my God, that's crazy.
What a romantic.
Although their relationship is believed to be a consensual one,
it's very important to point out the power differential
in this relationship.
Otto's 30 years older.
He's one of the richest people in Texas.
She's a recent immigrant with no money of her own.
And Otto's the guy signing her paychecks
every week.
Sure.
And putting a roof over her head.
So it is true love for real.
Do you think it's more or less insulting for your husband
that she's on you with someone with the exact same fucking name as you?
Yeah, I think that's, it's passive-aggressive is what that is.
It is.
It's also lazy.
Yeah, it is.
Right?
It's like, I like Emma's.
Okay.
So all that's relevant because in 1911,
about a year into Emma, number two's nursing job with the Kalers,
she tells him,
she tells Otto that she would like to move out of the house.
Oh.
So, deep, deeply in love.
She is still going to be Emma number one's caregiver,
but she doesn't want to live in the house anymore.
So Emma number two moves in with a new friend
that she's made in San Antonio.
Also a German nurse.
She's in her mid-thirties.
Her name is Emma Bergermeister.
This is Emma number three.
Bergermeister.
Here's Emma number three.
Oh.
Oh.
Hey.
Hey, girl.
She looks, like, witty.
Doesn't she?
She looks like she could do a Jägerbomb.
Yes, yeah.
You know?
She's like, Emma two, let's fucking party, seriously.
We're just German nurses trying to get by in this crazy world.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Once the two are roommates,
Emma number two tells Emma number three about this affair
she's been having with the rich man.
It says she's been having with her patient.
And I was like, well,
that's wrong.
And I didn't read the rest of it.
Her patient's rich, uber rich husband.
So about a month into the new living situation,
Otto Kahler buys a cottage
and then deeds this cottage to the two Emmas.
So he gets a little love nest for himself.
He stops by at least once a week,
usually in the evening.
I don't know why.
And he typically stays for a few hours.
And before he arrives,
Emma number three,
oh, I don't know.
She just has to go for a walk and stuff.
She puts a stocking on the doorknob.
What were they?
She puts an old sack of grain on the doorknob.
And then she goes and just gets so drunk and blurry,
like, ugh.
Yeah.
Jägermeister.
Jäger.
Jägerbomb.
Jägerbomb.
This affair lasts for years,
during which Otto gives Emma number two
a monthly allowance of $125.
So how much does she get?
A month in today's money?
$5,000.
Very close.
$4,000.
So close.
I like it.
That feels better.
That definitely feels better.
There's no other job in the world
where you could guess numbers,
be a thousand off,
and have people cheer like that for you.
What a goddamn miracle this is.
We really figured it out.
We've really rigged the system for ourselves.
That's pretty sweet.
So that also seems to be an addition to the paycheck.
That she gets for nursing Emma number one.
Oh, wow.
She has to spoon feed that milk.
You got to pay for that.
Yeah.
And then he also gives Emma number three $50 a month
just to keep her trap shut.
And how much would $50 a month be, do you think?
What thousand?
$2,700.
Fuck.
See?
It's just like ups and downs.
Here's the thing, though, about me.
Yeah.
If you paid me $2,700 a month to not talk,
I couldn't do it.
Okay.
Could you keep. Can you keep your trap shut for this?
I'll try.
No, no, I can't.
Sorry.
You end up owing them money.
Can I keep a running tap?
I'm going to try it again next month.
I swear to God.
I'm going to be so quiet next month.
So we won't ever know if that $50 a month is hush money
or if it's more.
But Emma number three will later say
that this is around the time where she goes on a, quote,
long ride in Otto's buggy.
Uh-oh.
And those, the lights from the buggy,
go all the way to Martha.
And we've solved it.
Boom.
Here's the thing.
If you ever do a live podcast,
just keep bringing things all the way back around.
It's all checks.
It's all you have to do.
So on this buggy ride, Otto reveals his plan.
He's going to marry Emma number two
when his gravely ill Emma number one finally dies.
Jeez.
And finally dies is the phrase he used.
Oh.
I'm just kidding.
She finally dies.
This one, that one.
So Otto asks Emma number three,
please watch over Emma number two
until he is officially a widower and can propose to her.
All that's to say, that could be what the $50 is for.
I'm reading this like I've never read it before.
It's such a joy.
So in early 1913,
Emma number two meets a young German law school
they really love to keep to themselves, don't they?
A young German law school graduate named Martin Daschle.
They first cross paths as passengers on a ship
heading back to the States from Germany.
And by the time that ship docks in New York City,
they're engaged.
Oh, shit.
She's like, I really love him and I don't love that other guy.
Yeah, that's how easy it was.
Yeah.
Just a few weeks later on April 8th, 1913,
Emma number two,
marries Martin and immediately leaves San Antonio
to move in with him in New York City.
So she seems, you know, that's a good one too.
It's a great city.
Seems to have no problem leaving Otto behind.
So that's tough.
But that's not true for Otto.
When he learns of this unexpected departure, he loses it.
He was dead set on marrying Emma number two
the moment his wife died.
And he's the kind of man who's very,
very used to getting exactly what he wants.
So he starts dropping by the cottage
where Emma number three still lives.
And he wastes no time professing his love for Emma number three.
There's your solution.
He even tells her that he's willing to divorce
his current wife, Emma number one,
right then and there so they can be married.
And he says that he will have his lawyers handle everything
and they can just go on a big vacation
until the scandal blows over.
Great.
Any Emma will do is what this is called.
For real.
I was like, this is a combination of Newt Gingrich
and Ted Cruz, but let's not be political.
Not tonight.
Not tonight.
Not in Texas.
Some people love to leave town.
Here's the thing.
Emma number three tells Otto, hey, no thanks.
I do not want to marry you.
She says she will later say she was put off
by the whole idea and said, quote,
I couldn't think of leaving a sick wife behind to regret.
End quote.
Oh, she has morals.
Yeah.
Oh my God.
Yeah.
So what's interesting is that she, Emma number three,
is willing to have an affair with him.
Oh.
Yeah.
Got it.
So Otto goes back to his same routine.
He stops by the cottage once a week.
He doesn't have to go anywhere new.
Doesn't care.
He doesn't have to learn a new name.
He's right in there.
Simple, easy, sexy.
So it's going to feel great to be the third one.
Just like, well, whatever.
Eventually, Emma number three actually develops real feelings for Otto.
And she will later say, quote, I tried to keep my love down, but it kept growing.
Keep it down.
Keep it down.
Keep it down.
Off the couch.
Keep it off the couch.
It's like a dog.
I tried to keep him down.
Down.
Down, Emma.
But in May.
In May of 1914, which is about a year into the Emma number three Otto affairs beginning,
his energy changes.
We've all been there.
This happens right before Otto and Emma number one are about to go on their annual trip back
to Germany, which lasts for six months.
And unlike the previous year, he does not make arrangements to have Emma number three
join them overseas.
Big red flag.
So before the Kalers head over, Otto comes to Emma and he gives him a little bit of a
surprise.
He gives her two bank notes.
I'm sorry.
Emma number three.
He gives her two bank notes worth $10,000 each it $700,000 in today's money.
Okay.
Wow.
Otto explains this money is to protect her financially in case something happens to him
while he's abroad.
Like I stopped loving you like I just don't like you anymore.
But a more jaded person would say, this is breakup money.
Doubling is hush money, which would make sense since at the time.
the United States is heading toward prohibition.
so no stop it someone had someone had a specialty beverage outside
carry nations here ladies and gentlemen enjoy
um here we go otto is spending a lot of his time having to lobby lawmakers
about the sanctity of beer oh sure i forgot about that part right and all the emmas
yeah all the emmas so he's like going to the to the his you know his government representatives
and he's like we love beer we love jesus we love whatever thing you will make you believe that
we're good people and we can keep doing business right um he has to maintain the best image
possible for the future of the brewery of beer and all of his other financial interests so
trying to buy emma number three's cooperation and silence as he tries to crab walk sideways
out of the affair is very likely what this money is about but he makes a terrible mistake
do you want to guess what it is he forgot to sign the check that old trick he he just leaves and
ghosts her entirely and will not talk to her um he doesn't make a single attempt to reach out to
her he doesn't write a letter doesn't send a postcard okay yeah how many attempts were there
back then just write a letter i guess you could maybe try to invent the telegraph if it hasn't
been invented
already smoke signals i don't know you could just start a rumor and hope it gets to america
and this is when emma three realizes that she's been dumped and she is devastated and this is why
it is so important to keep context in mind when you're for example hooking up with a man you met
while he was hooking up with your roommate who when she dumped him immediately came to you and
offered divorce his sickly bedridden wife and leave town to avoid the scandal uh sorry
oh thanks thanks there were no clues she had no idea this was gonna happen
i thought he was amazing anyway emma number three is devastated and probably very pissed so when the
kalers return from their long vacation that october emma number three hires a private detective to
follow otto around oh i've never done that thank fucking god really no my friend and i have stalked
someone together but i didn't hire someone and i was 19 it was cute where where'd you have to follow
him where was he going uh just no it didn't really happen yeah come on no i mean yeah i was like oh
my god there he is with his girlfriend he didn't tell me he had a fucking girlfriend like that kind
of thing wow yeah like you know i'd go to dance clubs and stuff that i knew and then did you walk
up and be like willoughby did you do one of those i did yeah i mean we all did i just love that
she's hiring a private detective with basically his money to follow him around to bust him so um
it seems the pi confirms that those suspicions are correct because emma number three sends a
telegram to emma number two in new york city saying exactly that okay so he's got another
young emma on the line so this is an awkward scenario emma number two is also otto's ex-girlfriend
so gross sloppy seconds but
emma number three will later say that her friend emma number two simply quote felt sorry for me
which seems to be true because emma number two takes a trip down to uh san antonio to be there
for her heartbroken friend oh that's nice i know right yeah so now it's november of 1914 okay
what we're back at the we're back okay uh so it's not november 1914 emma number two has arrived in
new york city and she goes to the san antonio brewing association to see her old rich ex and
during this meeting she emma number two asks otto to stop by the cottage that night to meet with emma
number three and he agrees okay shortly after he arrives it all goes sideways according to emma
number three otto immediately walks into her bedroom tries to kiss her she pushes him away
because she's still so angry with him she hired a private investigator
to follow him around oh she's pissed this situation escalates to otto yelling at emma
number three calling her quote sick and crazy and emma i thought i thought that's how you liked him
otto um just a little bit of milk and emma emma number three yells back quote god will punish you
for all you have done and emma number three says that otto then grabs her and shakes her but she
manages to get away
and run into an adjoining room because that's where she keeps her gun oh shit and this is when emma
number two runs over to the neighbor's house screaming for help back in the cottage according
to emma number three who is the only one who ever gets to say what happened um she heads back into
that bedroom but now otto's standing there like with his gun trained on her and she's thinking
he's going to shoot her so she fires several times and 58 year old otto kaler
58
like 97 year old oh i'm sorry it's 58 year old otto kaler is shot in the head neck and chest
so when emma number three realizes that this man is dead she claims that she tries to shoot herself
but she misses and you'd think she wasn't a good shot but guess what i mean pretty good when it's
going this way
not that great when it's coming back this way a district attorney will later say quote your aim
was better at mr kaler than with yourself yeah that's right sir so emma number three grabs a
knife and slashes her wrists but emma number two and the neighbors run through the door right at
that moment they save her and when the police arrive emma number three tells them quote i am
sorry but i had to kill him wow she tells the police that to their face
a scorned emma yeah you know don't fuck with those emmas both she and emma number two are
arrested on the spot so after otto kaler is officially pronounced dead the authorities
decide that it's best not to tell emma number one emma kaler because they're afraid the enormity of
this situation will kill her immediately yeah there's a lot of details to find out at that
moment yeah they're like let's not yeah it's going to definitely inspire a bunch of movement that's for
sure
she's like what yeah yeah she's been so still for so long so still it's crack crack crack yeah
so she is not informed about her husband's death for an entire week wow yeah they just put it off
they're like i don't know i don't feel like telling her so since the kalers don't have children otto's
brothers from out of town and his business associates step in to handle his affairs and they do it very
quietly because they're not going to be able to tell emma number one emma number two is going to
because they're trying everything they can to avoid scandal because now everything is on the line
along with prohibition looming and the san antonio brewing association lobbying hard to protect its
business world war one is raging overseas so anti-german sentiment is at an all-time high
in america except for at this show that i have started tonight um so a shocking extramarital
love triangle murder involving a multi-millionaire beer executive where every player has a right to
a german surname is the ultimate pr disaster and not just for the brewery it's bad for anyone whose
business interests are tied up with otto's and he has many rich and powerful business interests
so the situation has to be handled very very carefully so two of otto's friends step in to
act as emma two and three's lawyers the dead man's friends are the lawyers okay right away they get
the charges against emma number two dropped and her involvement is going to be a big deal
in the whole saga is scrubbed doesn't sound like she had much involvement to begin with yeah she
just yeah she's she's fucked an old guy and she's like do i have to pay for this forever can i just
have my life she actually doesn't have to testify she goes back to new york returns to a quiet life
with her husband um and this is a huge win for otto's colleagues because they don't want any
salacious information affecting their bottom lines the next insane thing that happens is newspaper
reports from right after the murder claim that otto's friends and family do not want to press
charges for his murder wow so the problem with that is that you know on the scene emma three was
like i had to kill him i fucking had to kill him why you keep your mouth shut it talk to no no one
um so there's no avoiding it all powerful german connections aside she must stand trial and that
trial is set to begin on february 1st 1950
but and i have to say i do kind of love this she's a no-show
oops she lived eight minutes away and she's like i cannot go to my murder trial today
just don't feel like it let's get high listen to records
her lawyer who's an old friend of otto's stands up in court and reads a letter that she allegedly
wrote claiming that emma bum gardener that's emma number three has left san antonio
and
gone back to germany to serve as a nurse for the soldiers in world war one okay that's passive
aggression um it's believed that emma number three has been strong-armed into doing this to ensure
that she cannot testify the problem with that is that when she arrives in germany they see that
she's a naturalized american citizen and they do not want her and they send her back
emma number three doesn't return to san antonio right away though she goes to new york and lives
there for a couple years emma number two was like get this fucking bitch you are the craziest friend
i should have never made yeah uh all the while um emma number three is desperate to clear her
name so in october of 1917 about three years after after otto's murder she goes back to texas
gets a new lawyer good and return and turns herself into the police but there's now a new
twist in this twist filled case an emma filled case otto's widow the first emma emma kaler has
since her husband's murder made a miraculous recovery am i number one back at it yep all right
she's like wow i suddenly don't want to hide in my bed all day yeah it's so weird i suddenly don't
hate my life anymore and i
don't want any more milk we don't know how or why it's possible specifically but writer robert l gully
has posited that maybe dr tallman and his uh quack treatments was actually contributing to
her years-long condition with his you know milk and not moving and her health improving
quote may be attributable simply to the cessation of dr tallman's treatment so um
gully the writer also entertains the theory that otto knew these treatments weren't helping his
wife in fact he saw that they weakened and incapacitated her and his quote dalliances
contributed to his enthusiasm for dr tallman and his cures we think so yeah that's what we all we
think that's kind of what happened all the time anyway so on january 14th 1918 emma number three
fine her trial finally kicks off and it receives national media attention here's an
article about it so look there's otto emma number three there's emma number two right there number
okay that's her she looks haunted doesn't she she looks fucking over it she's like
why did i get these matching emma tattoos with this bitch it was fun at first but oh my god i
know i have em and she has ma and i don't even want to hold my arm up next to her i just need
to turn it into a weird sunday
sunflower or something because i don't like this yeah also i love that they in this article it just
included otto's mansion just like it didn't happen there they're just like he lives in this fucking
huge house look at this guy oh and the headline there it reads millionaire san antonio brewer
slain by pretty nurse in love mystery which grows deeper um it also claims that emma number three
is the one who shot otto because she believed he was going to shoot
emma number two which doesn't line up with emma number three's story so it's that's what the
mystery is all about anyway at this point emma number one knows everything not just the fact
of her husband's murder but then all the affairs emma emma emma emma which is hard enough for her
but then considering emma number two was supposed to be a very close friend of hers and someone
her caretaker it's a betrayal upon betrayal on top of grief with a little bit of shame because
we always got to do shame
and so when the trial starts emma number three makes a big impression in court
she's reportedly dressed in a quote plain brown
i'm so sorry i didn't really put that together she makes a big impression she's dressed in plain brown
but i think what they meant is she's got a black hat with a veil
and then on the stand she's a goth and on the stand she delivers what reporters describe as
the story of her life
a story of one of life's unfortunates there was too many ones and lives in there that's
much much too hard okay so emma number three's testimony is emotionally resonant and it's maybe
even a bit theatrical at times people in the gallery clap after she testifies that's not
allowed i'm not supposed to do that i don't know that at other times they audibly weep
um a brown suit what are you doing
with a black veil
in the end emma number three paints a very convincing picture of killing otto strictly
in self-defense and she closes her testimony by confidently saying quote i've never doubted i
would be acquitted mic drop and then she pieces out flips her veil up sticks her tongue out
and on january 21st 1918 the jury finds her not guilty
so she
she's not guilty
that's what we call manifesting ladies and gentlemen vision board say it see it live it
shortly after otto's death as emma kaler's health rapidly improves she gets into his many business
dealings including the brewery girl at so at first she isn't running the business but she
is its largest stakeholder and she has genuine say over how it's run but by 1921
she's serving as its president and by this point but this is what's cool so prohibition of course
gets passed but emma so she's like we have to keep this brewery running and we have to keep all these
employees you know like employed um so what she does is pivot the business away from beer she
starts bottling water juice soda ice cream butter and even a near beer they make like a lot of money
like fake beer non-alcoholic beer a drink called la perla so it's like a it's a little reference yeah
she promises her staff that she will not lay off one single employee during this very tense time in
the industry wow so when right pretty nice so when she has to she invests her own money back
into the brewery to keep it going good for her during prohibition most of the breweries in texas
go under not the san antonio brewing association
it's not the san antonio brewing association it's the san antonio brewing association
emma kaler keeps it alive and when prohibition ends they haven't missed a beat they go right back
to brewing beer and their pearl beer is immediately the most popular beer again oh my god she goes
right back love it let's take a look at emma and her beautiful uh pearl beer yeah
yes oh look at that pearl necklace oh yeah that
color is so beautiful
it costs a lot of money oh yeah good for her i think that dress everything it's she's clearly
dripping in diamonds and pearls and you're like hey y'all and we all drink this beer
i mean hell yes i mean truly from years of like god i wish i could get up and now she's like
give me that fucking beer right now so eventually emma turns the reins of the business over to her
nephews who take over the business and they're like oh my god i wish i could get up and now she's
taking over the brewery once she retires and it's eventually bought out by a little company
you might have heard of pabst on april 26 1943 emma kaler passes away in san antonio at the age
of 85 and don't applaud for that disgusting more than half a century later around the year 2000 the
san antonio brewing association shutters once and for all the production of pearl beer is halted for
about two decades and the San Antonio Brewing Association shutters once and for all the
and then in 2020 pabst relaunches it on a much smaller scale so you can get it i think uh not
long after the brewery i didn't look that up not long after the brewery shuts down a developer buys
the property and turns it into a commercial center now known as the pearl so it has shops and
restaurants and a farmer's market and the centerpiece of the pearl is a world-class hotel
that opens in in 2015
called hotel emma
can you look at that oh this is the lobby that's so that's the original yeah the stuff from the
brewery but that's in the fucking lobby you guys yeah i love it people get so drunk at the hotel
emma this hotel has done an amazing job preserving many of the original brewery features and as well
as its lesser known history um
today at the hotel emma you can order a cocktail at its gorgeous bar that honors all three emmas in
one glass it's called the three emmas and i'm like wow and the hotel's vice president of marketing
beth smith says quote grapefruit the texas fruit is part of the base emma number one the wife is
represented with a pearl beer with rose syrup emma number two emma donkey is represented with sherry
and emma number three emma bergermeister
is gin we have a little saying that one is great but three will kill you
and that's the story of the san antonio
Antonio Beer Titan, Otto Koehler.
Yeah!
Excellent.
Excellent.
That's a nice one.
Great job.
Thank you.
Wow.
Sure.
Your actual house?
Absolutely not.
I recently got an alert from my camera outside that there is, like, someone prowling around late at night.
And, of course, I got freaked out.
I opened my camera, and it was a big spider dangling in front of the camera.
Which was terrifying in itself, but such a relief.
Like, it's so much better a spider than an actual person, but I'll be prepared.
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Goodbye.
Magnesium.
Made from a proprietary blend of topical minerals,
powered by pure Epsom salt and natural dead sea,
it's designed to help you relax and get in the right state of mind for a good night's rest.
Dr. And when there's. Something this simple, you just spray it on your feet and suddenly you're asleep
and the next morning you're like, wait, what happened?
Goodbye.
The costumes, the parties, the plans.
The planning, it all adds up.
They can be the 15 minutes in your car before pickup,
or the two minutes while your little pumpkin ties his shoes.
Kit Kat gives people permission to take the break they've earned
and make it a better break, a real break.
You come back.
You come back a little lighter, a little clearer, a little more ready for whatever's next.
While the world tells us to keep going, Kit Kat reminds us that the best time for a break is now.
Have a break.
Have a Kit Kat.
Goodbye.
Do we have time for a home tour?
Let's do it.
Let's do it.
Not yet.
Not all of it.
I don't know how to do it.
I can't.
I can't.
Somebody say past.
Vince Averill, everybody.
Vince Averill is right here.
Hi.
I come bearing no anecdote tonight.
I don't have any anecdotes to share.
I'm just here to facilitate and make sure that the person you picked is lucid.
Right there.
Do your best.
Thanks so much.
Thank you, Vince.
Okay, we're going to tell you a couple rules real quick.
I know that everybody gets very excited about this part, but you should adhere to some rules.
We're going to do it.
Your hometown, make sure it's from Texas.
Please.
Please.
That's what people like.
The more local, the better.
That's great.
Also, don't be so drunk.
You can't tell your own story.
Don't read off paper.
Beginning, middle, end.
Make sure it's good.
Yeah.
And good luck.
And good luck, ladies and gentlemen.
You're just going to pick the hometown right now.
Let's see.
Okay, yeah, and the costume, whatever it is.
Come here.
What's your name?
My name's Erin.
Hi, Erin.
Is that a beaver?
Nice to meet you.
Thank you.
This is Erin, everybody.
Erin.
Nice to meet you.
Tell us about your costume.
Okay, so my story revolved.
I was wearing this costume when I carried a dead body one time.
Oh, my God.
You picked her.
You were pointing at her, so this is all on you.
Yeah.
Okay.
Is it like a reference to anything?
Well, so I thought it was a moose costume this whole time, but I think it's a reindeer.
I was going to go Bucky Beaver, but I don't think so.
No.
Okay.
So this happened.
You guys are just wearing pajamas, right?
That's kind of what you did?
Yeah.
No, I'm staying with my older sister like 15 minutes away.
I grew up in Austin.
Okay.
And she was like, oh, my.
I was like, I'm going to try to jump up, and I'm trying to say my story.
And she goes, and what are you wearing?
I really second-guessed it, you know?
But here you are.
But, okay, this happened in 2021, one of the two, like, big Texas freezes that we had.
This was, like, February 16th.
Ugh.
Y'all know what I'm talking about?
Okay.
So Valentine's Day of that year, my roommate, her boyfriend stood her up on Valentine's
Day, very sad, blasted Paramore through the entire house, was running around, and I was
like, go, Kelly, like, get it.
Yeah.
And then she kicked the step, and I heard a snap.
Oh.
And she died, and you had to carry her body?
That's terrible.
Unfortunately, that's just a small part of the story.
Okay.
It has nothing to do with her.
It has nothing to do with her, but that's a reference.
Okay.
Okay.
So then two days later, I hate, I hate, like, not control, you know, being out of control.
Yeah.
And I was planning on going to visit my twin sister in North Carolina, okay?
But all the flights were canceled.
So all my friends were like, we're going to go to a place that has power and warmth.
And I said, y'all go.
I'm going to stay overnight, and I'm going to be in the warmth, okay?
So I'm home alone.
It's freezing.
I started a fire, whatever.
Next morning, so all my roommates are gone.
I get this knock on my door early in the morning, and I'm like, what the heck is that?
I'm packing to get out of this place, you know?
Opens the door.
It's my neighbor, and she says, I think my husband's dead.
How old is she?
She's about, oh, Betty.
She was like, she was 78.
Okay.
78.
Okay.
Beautiful.
Wonderful.
She was wearing flip-flops.
And, like, I was like, and, okay, and so I wore.
Okay.
You know, all night, and there was no power, so I was wearing this, sweatpants, dolphin
slippers, a bomber jacket from World War II that I just got gifted.
And so I'm not thinking about anything.
So the first thing, I was like, oh, my gosh, come in, come in.
And I'm like, oh, my gosh.
I give her my dolphin slippers.
I give her my bomber jacket.
I'm thinking, like, her husband died overnight, you know?
And then she goes, so your roommate broke her foot?
I was like, Betty.
Like, what?
You said your husband's dead.
And so.
What happened was, I was like, oh, my gosh, it's right now.
So I give her that.
I said, I'm going to go over.
So I'm running over.
I feel like I'm in Fargo.
Like, I'm wearing.
Right now, since I gave that away, I'm a moose in sweatpants.
Yeah.
And I'm running across, and I have 911 on the phone on hold for four minutes.
Okay.
And I find him in a lawn chair in the living room.
And, like, he's still alive.
I couldn't give him CPR because, like, he was, like, a 6'2 dude.
And it would have been dangerous to put him down in the lawn chair and, like,
this kind of ground, you know?
Yeah.
And so I'm just, like, waiting there.
And finally, the.
EMTs?
Yes, that's what they're called.
They come in there, take, like, seven minutes to put on their COVID gear.
And I'm like, like, he's in there.
No, I think that's important.
That is important.
Yes, it was important.
Yeah.
And then Betty comes over.
So she has the dolphin slippers and the jacket.
And I'm like this.
And then the whole time, they're trying to save his life.
And she goes, like, I told him to go to the doctor.
I just said that.
And I'm just like.
She's mad at him.
Yeah.
And she goes, yeah.
But the thing was, when he died, she was making tea.
Well, you know, grief has all kinds of forms.
Yeah, it does.
It does.
It comes out in different ways.
Yeah.
How did you get to carry this man?
Yeah.
Oh, sorry.
Yes.
That's okay.
So along with the four minutes on hold, it was because of how devastating, like,
this time was.
Like, Texas homes and all that are not built for this kind of weather.
And so there was a lot of tragedy.
Like, the reason.
We called.
They didn't have any children.
And we called all these funeral homes.
So we're like, we need someone.
And no one could pick him up for, like, a couple days.
Oh.
It was horrible.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And we finally found one that could pick him up in, like, six hours.
But they finally sent someone.
And they sent someone that looks like the beautiful late actor, like, Leslie Jones.
Leslie Jones, who was on SNL?
Yeah.
Like, this tall.
She's alive.
No, wait.
Who am I?
Leslie Jordan.
Leslie Jordan.
Yeah.
Leslie Jones.
Leslie Jordan.
Also, an amazing.
You're going to wrap her.
Love her.
Wrap it up.
Okay.
This tall.
Okay.
To carry the big man.
Oh, yes.
Yes.
Yes.
And so he says, I'm going to need a couple able-bodied women.
And so we had to carry him.
Luckily, he was a veteran.
So we got to put the flag over him.
Yeah.
His name was Dean James.
James, a wonderful man.
- All right.
- And James.
We put him in there.
Well, good job getting in there and helping.
Okay, good.
She didn't kill him.
She was making tea.
She was making tea.
She just was mad that he never went to the doctor.
You know what you did?
You just earned yourself an Uncrustable, my friend.
Oh, my God!
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And a hot dog.
Amazing job.
He can be on track.
Absolutely.
Great job.
Great job.
Was it a donkey?
Donkey.
Wow.
You're not going to give this?
I don't know.
It got lost in the. I think you deserve this, too.
We have stress hot dogs at the merch booth,
because of course we do.
Great job.
Great job.
Unbelievable.
What a hang.
Yeah.
Texas, Austin, wow.
Thank you for two incredible shows
and our tour.
I mean, can I just say this?
When we very first started this podcast
and we very first went on tour,
our touring agent was like,
here's the places you have to hit
because this is where you have the most listeners.
And when he said Texas, we were like,
no, that's crazy.
And Texas was like number one.
We're like, they don't like us.
There's no way they like us.
We're from Los Angeles.
So we knew this tour,
we wanted it to be a little shorter than our usual
that are insane and never stop.
Right.
Right.
So we're, if we're going to come back to Texas,
sorry, we want to come to Austin.
So thank you so much.
We love this town.
We do.
Thank you guys.
We're just so happy to be here.
Thank you for being with us through all the craziness,
all these years.
It's been almost 10 years at this podcast
and we really appreciate all of you
and your passion and your love
and your wonderful anecdotes.
Stay sexy.
And go Texas!
Bye, Austin.
Elvis, do you want a cookie?
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
This has been an exactly right production.
Our managing producer is Molly Smith.
Our consulting producer is Kate Schellenbach.
Our creative lead is Allison Agosti.
Our associate producer is Tessa Hughes, and our editor is Aristotle Acevedo.
This episode was mixed by Liana Squalacci.
Our researchers are Maren McGlashan and Ali Elkin.
Email your hometowns to
[email protected] and follow the show on Instagram @myfavoritemurder.
Listen to My Favorite Murder on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Or watch new episodes every week on Netflix.
Search for My Favorite Murder, add us to your list, and hit the double thumbs up button.
Goodbye.
Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
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