The discussion centers on the transformative power of presence and fully experiencing emotions, particularly challenging ones, as a path to liberation and high performance. High-performance coach Finian Kelly shares a personal story about confronting deep-seated birth trauma during his son's delivery, illustrating how leaning into painful moments—rather than avoiding them—allows for integration and freedom from lifelong negative patterns. He argues that society conditions people to chase pleasant feelings and suppress discomfort, but true growth comes from becoming like the buffalo that charges into the storm. This practice of feeling emotions completely prevents the formation of limiting subconscious loops and is the core of creative flow and effective leadership. The conversation emphasizes that personal healing and presence are foundational to professional success, enabling individuals to lead from a place of clarity and trust rather than past trauma.
that's really what life is meant to be about is fully feel in this moment so we don't have to experience in the future. What if the edge you're chasing is found in your breath? In this episode of Max Live, high-performance coach, Finian Kelly reveals how presence, not treasure, unlocks creative flow, calm leadership, and deep clarity. For those building big lives, this is the pause that changes everything coming up next on Max Live. And all our negative belief loops are subconscious coding comes from that moment where we didn't feel safe or express to feel it and then unfortunately what we actually do then is feel it for the rest of our lives because trying to overt feeling it is actually feeling it. So it has this old flywheel effect and ultimately you wake up one day and you go I can't believe the life that I'm living and at the start it feels like you're not making any progress and then suddenly one day just like click and you've stepped into a different state of consciousness and you never have to go back and live that same experience again and people have these incredible moments because the breath when they get fully out of their mind using the breath they then are able to connect with their infinite heart of themselves with the vine part and suddenly they feel loved and they never felt before. They have spontaneous healings they have always experienced because they're connecting to the infinite power. Welcome to the Max Live podcast. I'm your host Ben Laws and today our guest Finian Kelly joins us and this guy is a guy that truly is a person who not only does what he says but basically like leads by example. I mean after having this basically hour and a half plus podcast with him while he's actually on vacation with his family in Panama, he prepares as his in his words actually preparing for a ski season. This guy brings in terms of what does it actually mean for like presents and why that is the core ingredient for actually winning and success and how this is leading so many Fortune 500 and big large CEOs to like greater clarity and consciousness that's allowing them to actually win and the winning actually starts personally so that they can actually win professionally. You're going to want to stick around to the end. Finian gives like a special one on one breathing technique workshop with us at the end. Again he's known as the business mystic and you're going to want to stick around to actually understand why. And remember if you like what you see you love what you hear. Remember to like and subscribe for more Max Live. I'm your host Ben Laws and today we have a you know I don't even know actually how to categorize our guest today. You know when we sit down and he shows up and he's got three buttons done on his shirt and he's like yeah just got I'm two weeks in Panama and he you know he doesn't I'm already getting the sense he doesn't actually just like hey do as I say he's actually I'm going to do as I do I'm not going to ask you to do something I haven't done myself. Welcome to the show Finian Kelly. Thanks so much Ben. I am very much looking forward to connecting because it feels like we're coming from a shared experience of really focusing on on an expansion and transmuting certain life moments into really powerful states. Let's talk about that because you know you and I in the green room we're just kind of sharing a background and and and you're sharing a little bit about kind of family and the fact of you just made the comment of like hey you know what we've just like every person probably almost every family is like live through some trauma and I was just talking a little bit about some of my like pivotal moments and for anyone who's been a listener of the podcast knows about my son Benny and his 16 days but why is it Finian that it sometimes takes these moments to really excavate the bullshit. Yeah well I feel like what it does is it forces us to feel and confront what potentially has been below the surface that we're not willing to explore. So I'll give you a very present example and your your incredible story around your son just triggered an experience that happened for me around the birth of my son and I just want to first honor you for having the courage to transmute transmute such a like painful and if there's the ultimate reason why you could ever become a victim of your life it would be what you're going through and the fact that you're here and you're sharing and you're growing and I you've created new life after that I just want to honor you because that's that's the true strength so thank you. I appreciate that thank you. So on on my birth of my son yeah birth of my son it wasn't mine it was it was it was it was my partners and we we went through I went through my own traumatic experience and what was really interesting about it ultimately we were having a natural very natural experience and 36 hours later we ended up in hospital because of some just some unfortunate things happening with the medical system that we didn't weren't fully aware of we thought we were prepared but we weren't and then she was forced to have a C-section and I suddenly found myself in the in this lone hospital room being handed my scrubs and I was just taken over I was just completely devastated emotionally distraught 36 hours and no sleep thinking we're going to have this beautiful experience and then suddenly I witnessed my worst nightmare happening out in front of me that this fear of the medical system really just misleading us and I was a complete loss and we ended up having I ended up being having I'll share how that I got around that I ended up being able to go in and witnessing the the birth of my son very present but I nearly missed the moment and what it was was I didn't realize that I had deep birth trauma in my in my subconscious from when my little sister who was 12 years younger than me was born when my little sister was born my mum was a doctor and she'd had all our previous children naturally at home but because she was an older woman now her colleagues convinced her that she had to go into the hospital system and the hospital system that effectively we worshipped the medical system completely completely messed up they did medical malpractice and they put her in a position position where she had multiple blood transfusions they infected with a bad blood we were told that she was going to die and although she didn't die at the moment we were told that she could die anytime and it was all through medical malpractice so here was an event where I was 12 years old very informative time completely low and thought my mum was going to die for the next 10 years also thought she was going to die it completely fragmented our family it was just a complete destruction and I didn't realize that that had such a big effect on me it was actually a memory I couldn't even access that's how big an effect it was so of course while I'm going through this birth trauma it was almost like the perfect play in order to happen to in order for me to face this and liberate me from that experience and it's unfortunate because ultimately my partner had to go through that experience my son was born in a new way but it couldn't have been any other way when you actually look back in hindsight it's just of course of course that had to happen and it ripped me and it put me to my like deepest place and for a moment there I nearly didn't I nearly missed the birth but luckily a friend called me at that time and said I know you would have had prepared for this like what are your desired feelings for this birth like that's what you teach everyone and I took a breath and took a pause and I went that's true I want to feel present trusting and connected and he goes well you have an opportunity go in and feel that and also you have a unique opportunity where you're going to be the first person to hold your son now like this is this is a different experience so suddenly I was taken into the hospital room sitting his organs are all out which is a pretty confronting experience to go into and then my son was birthed and I was able to lock in and I held his finger and he locked in the mind and I was just reassuring him the open desires and I'll never get that moment when he looked into my eyes and I just said hey buddy like you are safe you are loved and I'm so excited to go on this life it be something like that and I was taken over emotion I was able to present with Sydney and I was able to have this great experience with a couple of hours then the shame kicks in the shame of the experience of me going how did I like miss that I should be showing positive like how did I lose myself in that moment and I started going into a loop but luckily I've had enough experience with with those moments where it gets taken it takes hold of you I was able to reflect I went okay like clearly this is showing up because this is something you need to explore and liberate and I went into the deepest transformational period for a couple of weeks like the moment after the birth it was not bliss for us like it was bliss for the Sydney but it wasn't bliss for me because I was in this trauma loop wreak reliving the experience of my of my 12 year old self and thankfully I was able to be present with it and able to integrate it all and now it's free of myself and ultimately that can only mean that I'm going to be living a more expansive life and we actually had a therapy session last night we have a joint joint therapist and the individual as well and we're talking about this next birth and there's some trauma with my partner about the experience now and I had to let her really know it's like no the gift of the last experience is we don't have to worry about that this time like I am so fully present and open to her there's no fear like if we have to go into the medical system great like I've already faced it all it's not what I want and I don't want to believe in it but it's not going to have that hold over me anymore so that's the power of going through the the darkness and the trauma it actually liberates you creates you to a place where you're more open and more connecting and more trusting and clearly you're being able to do this because there's other people who have lost children and it just devastates it devastates families relationships and they never recover and then they miss actually being the parents to these incredible new lives that are coming through because of that trauma and and I know I know you're a better dad now because of it like I just I just know it I don't have to know you at all but I know that because I can feel your energy and that's the same with me it's it's it's a liberating experience where you you start disconnecting from this idea that there is even death it's just like it's all interdit all is and it couldn't have been any other way well thank you for sharing that story it's it's such a birth is such an interesting experience because it's I mean you're doing I mean think about you're doing like the most incredible value creation thing that I mean I even today to this day I think about how it goes from two cells and then you're holding your child and then at my 17 I'm looking or going we're talking about college and I'm just going it isn't like that it's it's a living walking miracle that all these things happen and I'm reminded of I had gone to see this speaker and I don't know who actually that can't remember the name of the speaker but he had then attributed this story to something else and he was talking about um he said you know he asked the question he goes what's the difference between Buffalo and cows and I don't know if you've heard this story Phineon and he said out in he goes in Colorado so many people and again this is where Phineon calls home is it in the canate or is in the Colorado Rockies and if you've ever been there it's especially in the summertime like right around what would you say Phineon one o'clock two o'clock starts to accumulate some you know some weather and then and then it then potentially if you're up in mountains that's where it gets a little interesting um but he said what's interesting about cows is that cows start to see that build up when they're on like the eastern sort of plains and they're all looking off to the west and they're seeing like the clouds he said cows actually start to turn east and start walking away from the the clouds and he said the interesting thing is that when you look at Buffalo they do actually the complete opposite they actually turn and start heading west into the clouds and the moral of that story that I took away from it I'm sure there's many morals to that story but it was that like the only way to like get to the other side is through it and because when he said basically what happens is that then that weather system moves over and actually stays with the cows longer eventually they get through it and what your story though what I find so impactful about it is that it's like these treasures like Benny was a treasure to me he and I had this experience and I've shared this on the podcast before but I had this uh-huh actually just February 25 about that I was explaining how Benny had made it through all these different tests and and showing negative and it had the same probability as like winning a power ball ticket and then hit me that I never have to play the power ball ever again because he's given me so much like like by the way IRS can't tax it at least yet right and um but that there's we have all these treasures and I think of column treasures that are just buried and there's just waiting to be dug up and that's what you're talking about like you got to go through the darkness is that these treasures are typically buried and you got to like and it bear and if you've ever dug a hole it is hard but why is it Finian I mean you do a lot of work right with you know founders in business that you know in CEOs and why is it that we avoid digging into what do you want to call it our our our past our presence our future our consciousness to like unveil these unveil these treasures because we've been conditioned we've been trained that we want to chase pleasant sensations and invert anything that feels uncomfortable like we literally stop kids expressing on how they feel like when they're when they're expressing something we say don't don't make that noise like oh you're you're affecting people but they're just actually fully feeling the feeling in the moment like I was just watching my son this morning for half an hour and he would go from one moment like doing a seeing playing next moment like just having this moment where he expresses himself with full emotion for four seconds and then the next second is just chuckling to himself and I went wow like he just felt energy flow through him expressed it and then there's no carrying of it in the future animals are the same if you look at an animal there's a great video that you can search on the internet where a hyena has been taken by a leopard and the the leopard has the the hyena in not the hyena it's a it's a one of their kudos or something like that has its neck in the experience and it's it looks like it's eating it and killing it and the animal plays like is in this place is like oh my god I'm about to be killed and then a lion or something comes and leopard sort of looking and everything like that and then eventually like runs off and you watch the the the animal it's left there it's not doing anything then it suddenly starts breathing really deep and heavy feeling the full emotion then it starts shaking shaking everything and then it bounces off and then literally just walks off and then the still leopard there there's a lion and it doesn't carry any of the energy of the past because it's fully experienced and if it did carry the energy of the past what do you think we'll be doing it just be constantly running and it wouldn't be able to live and experience life we just can't get away from these animals there and that's really what life is meant to be about is fully feel in this moment so we don't have to experience it in the future and all our negative belief loops are subconscious coding comes from that moment where we didn't feel safe or expressed to feel it and then unfortunately what we actually do then is feel it for the rest of our lives because trying to overt feeling it is actually feeling it and sometimes when we're young thankfully we have this protecting force the subconscious which literally goes oh this is too much for you to feel so I'm going to create a program and so when even the idea of a negative belief loop it wasn't meant to be let negative it was a survival loop but it becomes negative in the future when you recognize oh that situation isn't true anymore you have to then really feel it and if you feel it it becomes a positive belief loop or a thriving belief loop so going back to my example I had an awareness that this was one of those trauma moments that if I didn't fully feel this and integrate it it was going to mess me up forever every time I look at my son I would have shame about oh I didn't show up the way I wanted my relationship with my partner I would have shame that I couldn't be in that experience the event had happened there was nothing more I could do but if I didn't feel this you know where I go it would rip us apart so even though in that moment it was the most challenging thing I turned off technology for two weeks and I just felt and felt and felt didn't interact with anyone else it was the most loneliest I've ever felt to be honest and which is such a strange strange time because it was the most important moment of my life having a new son but I was so lonely but I felt it all so now I'm free of it like I don't have that experience and I able to tell the story without going evoking any emotion for me and thankfully now we have another child on the way and I can be more present in that experience so going back to your question it's just we think negative emotions and negative who are unpleasant emotions are negative it's just it's just energy and we need to feel it and if you actually look and speak to most people and ask about the hardest moments of their life they'll all go oh that was the most transformational moment and I am I would never give that back even all the pain all the suffering that's who I am today so if you know that in hindsight imagine if we came into the present and every time we started feeling that sensation that dark energy that that weather came in we became the buffalo and went oh my god this is my moment this is my opportunity I'm going to go deep into it because I know that a huge amount of growth and a huge amount of expansion is about to happen and it changes our ability to go into it doesn't mean it's not going to be hard like going into bad weather is hard it's challenging however we can put a smile on our face and go this is happening for me not to me you just have confirmed some like underlying sort of like sort of hypothesis I've had that that all we're doing in this whole life is we're managing energy time is a representation of how we allocate our energy right what we do to whom we do it with right for whom we do it for these were all just like basically energy management things right and then there's the internal mechanism but one of the things you said that I think is it's so simple that I think it's really hard so the question I have for you how does one feel the feelings you know I'm saying like because we can go oh well you just have to feel your feelings and it sounds so simple but I can tell you going through like Benny man there were like it is it is like it's it is like I explained it's like walking a ridge line from like one peak to one peak and you got two valleys right and and as you walk that ridge you're acutely aware that like hey if you don't stay present in here like you could slip to the best of like lack of caring or like just over consuming right of work or if anything else right and so how does one feel like I mean really feel in a way that allows them to like to honor the motions right whether it's shame it's judgment it's fear but like how does one do that it's a great question and I'm glad you actually bring it back to a tangible way because everyone just yes cis platitudes fill your feelings and some people don't know how to feel there's many entrepreneurial men leaders who have blocked the feeling part now the funny thing is they say they're a left brain thinking person they're analytical but feelings are running everything in their in their life they just not aware of it because the subconscious runs on feelings and the subconscious runs 95% of that daily decisions so that's just a little reference point so when I think about that is first you need to come present present to the moment and you are and when we're present we're not on our phones we're not thinking about the future we're not doing anything we're not doing any task we're literally just stopping and being still like that's something about being present then I like to engage the breath start working with the breath the breath is your friend the breath you'll notice that when something gets really scary or we confronted we stop breathing and it clams up and and it's very hard for us breath is the energy mover otherwise the energy just gets trapped into it so I just bring awareness to my breath and invite the feelings to come forward like actually go you know what I'm creating a conscious container rather than the feelings grabbing me at another time when I at least expect it and I it's too confronting for me I am coming present I'm leaning into the breath I'm bringing the breath I'm inviting the forward and then you have to actually hand it over to something else like you have to lean into faith you have to like connect with your higher self and believe that there's something part of you some part of you that can handle all of this and actually has been handling it the whole time through all your moments in your life like it wasn't Finian who was handling it there was something behind it that was just their present loving you and holding you and was never affected by no matter what the event was because otherwise we wouldn't have got to this place and when you go through that place you hand it over you connect to your essential nature you connect to the infinite part of yourself and it feels like a warm hug being held around you and go through that experience and then you'll be surprised if we actually create the space for it the sensation doesn't last as long as what we think like we it actually moves through us quite quickly and then we can get up and move away and then this feeling might come back again and we have to do it and I can sure as you know the grief it's like the rolling waves you you think you through it and then another wave comes but then what you start noticing over time is the gap between the sets starts extending over and over and over and then sometimes you're like well there's a big set coming through like I'm surfing in Panama right now and it was very chill yesterday and we're chill and we're just enjoying the sun's beautiful and it's suddenly out of nowhere like this massive big rolling closing set comes through of six waves and we just all destroy them runs gone and then it was clear again and if you got stuck in that sensation and tried to avoid it you're just going to be stuck battling if you just surrender and just float up and go okay I trust that there's going to be another period of break you can handle it and I feel that's probably the best way to start and and then you create more practices of stillness throughout the day where you can be present with it so it doesn't actually feel as threatening as feel as daunting it's amazing when you guide anyone through a breath journey or a medicine journey or whatever whatever space the thing that they are fearful of so much that they literally have been so fearful of feeling for 30 40 years it comes over them and often they laugh afterwards like there's actual laughter because they went I can't believe that was all I have to do right here was always like wow like really that was what I was so scared of there's something to that yeah I think when you accept and cuz I think you what I thought what you said earlier if any was brilliant like we are feeling human beings and when I mean the the science is there 95% of all the decision making happens subconscious and the subconscious is run off like feelings um you know with with Benny I just was really cognizant that if I tried to bottle it up it would burn me down it would like it was a matches waiting to be lit so I'd be the guy like you know I was coaching out in LA and you know neverly coming back east you know you gotta leave like ridiculously early but the benefit of relieving leaving early is that you you break through the clouds and you get these incredible sunrises and I just and I would be the guy that way if you turn look to the left like I just would have like tears like streaming down my face I mean just two days ago I was listening to this music and I was in the shower and all of a sudden I could feel a set of waves like coming and I think that Ben before Benny would have been like oh you know kind of like breathe in breathe out like just see it and just try to like you know in and you know and I had just like a I had like a really good I had a really good job and it was it was so therapeutic and but so people who are listening to this I have a question about shame but before we get there I think people are listening to this right you're in Panama you're surfing I mean if you're watching this on like YouTube you're like okay this dude looks this dude looks like super sweet and but you might be going hey we're talking about give it out like breathe and mastering your breath and it might be like woo woo but like that would be great if we were like maybe talking about like this was a granola you know like podcasts but this is dying for people who are living and looking to live a max life and so can you give some compelling outcomes of people who have maybe had that repressed obviously don't share what you can share but like when I think of a compelling outcome like hey they were this and but that people would have said that they were incredibly successful but really at the end of the day they're bankrupt and then after they go through like this sort of harnessing or releasing of this feelings that they're now this can you talk a little bit about that because I think people hear this and they're like well this sounds fruity like oh I'm going to sit down and I'm going to just invite my feelings to come out but can you can you kind of level set for like hey here's what's on the other side of this for you and here's how I know it works yeah I love what you said about the the danger of bottling it up I think it's poison that's what you literally do it's it's energy that if it gets blocked up and clogged up it's like a blood clot and then and then effectively poisoned you from the inside out and so often when a CEO comes to me very high powered multi-billion dollar CEO running publicly traded companies they're you know they've been the boss they're powerful the great and they used to being the alpha and and sort of bossing you around but with me as you probably can tell like I don't buy into that like I'm like cool like great I love your whole identity and personality but I see something different in you and generally what I will say to them is this is life or death like this is life or death if you don't face this you know the path of this like you literally your body is starting to shut down you're not sleeping you're becoming an insomnia you're stressed out either you will literally physically die or emotionally you will die and and what's the point like life is for living that's one of my favorite quotes life is for living and are you really living in expansive life so I put it into that frame set and I can generally tell like most people think they have a leadership problem or a strategy problem or there's a market dynamic in the company and I went no you have an internal problem that is creating all of this drama in your life and the only way to to really unlock this is to go inward and face these different experiences and what generally happens and it happens time and time again I actually had at a moment recently where someone I've been working with for a period of time got to a place that I hope they would but I never knew if they would because it was so deep and so heavy that I internally knew what had occurred but they had to discover it themselves and this this person is now completely liberated can sleep throughout the night like that's that's the issues thing here I can actually sleep is now connected to their partner and and their children again the sales results of their company has gone off the charts and they're working less than ever like that's that's another thing they they don't need to the before their work was because they didn't actually want to feel any emotions so they create all these different dynamics now they just get to be in their genius and and create and for the first time they actually feel a deep sense of peace and a sense of fulfillment and they're it's not that they've lost their edge either that's another common thing that people think they're going to I'm going to lose my edge I went no you have all those skills that you can drive still but now you have another energy of tapping into and you just get to play you don't have to do this so it it is the only way for the modern leader to do this like the demands of the the business world it's moving so fast so change so much change it requires humans to be more human than ever before like that's really if with smaller teams we need to make sure we bring out the humanists and the only way to do that is to feel everything and express everything and now that's one of my favorite things corporate like corporates like publicly traded companies and bringing me in to get to this level of work because I realize how do we unlock the humans more and we're doing breath journeys people are going into older states of consciousness and they're sharing all their vulnerability they're sharing the trauma because they realize actually that's how we combine and that's how we be focused on our geniuses and we don't have these un these negative belief loops coming up and inhibiting our success because they're there the whole time doesn't matter how much we don't want to talk about it they're they're running our companies so we bring that through and it comes very free so I don't know if that was tangible it's hard to share like like the actual real stories but it's like it generally is a process where it's oh wow like I feel better I'm like feeling healthier I'm able to lead in a way that is more decisive if I make decisions quicker which means that then I don't have to do as much I'm more space more space to create creativity my teams enjoy me more so retention increases sales improve and then also my relationship at home improves because I actually have a show up as an authentic human and the president of the experience so it has this whole fly will affect and ultimately you wake up one day and you go I can't believe the life that I'm living and at the start it feels like you're not making any progress and then suddenly one day it just like click and you've stepped into a different state of consciousness and you never have to go back and live that same experience again I think that was a great answer and I love that you talk about the humanist the thing that people have always feared about like AI is that it's going to take honestly if anything it's going to start to automate like like very wrote knowledge things that are like one to one to one to one like that's this very like we're trying to out human a like a computer based task but what I'm excited about all of this conversation because I think to your point like you are in there if you're if you're if you're not even already it's incredible demand even it should be more demand because I'm convinced that the next evolution of success comes from who you hire and their ability to be in their being right because I was we're human beings not human doings we're human beings and and I think that sort of like how do you feel your feelings it seems like such a simple glib thing to say but incredibly complex to do so do you think about like being like well of course I'm a human being but what does it actually mean to be right I mean how does that I mean how does that land I mean how do people be well the only way to be is to be here in this present moment and when we are in the mind worrying about the future for granted things of the past we're not being we're actually avoiding the present moment so the breath is always the precursor to being like when you connect to your breath you suddenly are here right now that's why my book I talk about circuit breakers the circuit breakers it's a chance to flick the off switch on the circuit and go oh I'm not putting all this crazy energy into the system I don't I want to protect the system I'm gonna take a moment with my breath to come back come back here right now and wherever you are when you do that you recognize you are alive you are safe you are taken care of and there's not a single problem right here in this present moment it's all a story about what could happen or what has happened and and that's it's a constant practice and it's literally for the first time every time you don't just get to work this out once like I have to come back to it every single moment because the mind loves to to take us out and when we're in that state you suddenly start and this is how I really guide leaders there's an intelligence that we access that is bigger than us it's how every creation that has ever come into the world it never came from us thinking it was a thought came through us thinking is just going over the same what we already know when we open up to a thought coming through a through an insight coming through us it's it's not us and that's where you speak to any great athlete any great musician author artist when they talk about like whoa like that was the greatest performance of all time or that was the greatest product of all time how did you do that they all say I didn't like I was just the vessel something came through me it's also why if you look in the entrepreneur world how is it that's nothing exists of a new innovation and then the exact period of like a couple of days period 30 different companies all around the world start the exact same company they weren't communicating they couldn't copy it is because suddenly someone accessed an intelligence that we all have access to through the universe of mind or the field and then once it's come into the conscious awareness of the human mind everyone has access to it because we're all connected and the more we realize that the more we'll stop getting out of this story that we need to be thinking people and that's actually really smart we need to consume all this knowledge no like there's a knowledge overload we need to create the space to allow the new intelligence to come through and that's what I feel like AI is definitely doing like it's almost activating the inner crater in everyone now like I used to not think I was creative because that was a story from a year three art teacher or something like that but when you think about every entrepreneur who's very creative I'm so creative look how I've lived my life now however one of the limitations a lot of the time in order to unlock your creativity is either money because it takes money to hire other people to do some of the skillsets you do or actually finding the right people now suddenly I can have an idea and I can iterate on AI and there's no cost I then have to have the right people and it does the bits that I'm not good at I'm not skilled at and then a creative creative endeavor can come through and it was really interesting even like I was reflecting back of my publisher has asked me to write a new book and I was reflecting back when I wrote my last one which is just a couple of years ago I didn't like like I was it was just coming into Vogue and the common thing I didn't really use it and now I suddenly like spent half a day not even half a day I spent a couple of hours like literally just downloading all my thoughts on different book concepts and then suddenly I like went on this journey just like iterating different ideas and that probably would have taken me months to to do it like now I have some like really distilled ideas that are clear to me and now I still have to go like create it and write it but gee it helped me it was an incredible thinking partner talking about space the book I read in the last year was called the comfort crisis and one of the things he talks about the biggest precursor to creativity is boredom and we avoid boredom like the plague like the absolute plague so I love that you're talking about creating that space and when you talk about like hey these possibilities I had someone recently tell me there's thoughts that you have and then there's like there's the existence of God but there is this little and in my brain I'm imagining this little thin thing going like thin layer going around like the the world and he said that there's something that comes from you there's something that comes from God and then there is something that comes from the ether and he goes I define the ether is like what is you we don't even humanly fully understand but it's like the possibilities there and so what do you feel like when someone an artist says like hey it comes to you like it just came to me like what is that what in your mind do you feel like that comes from so I've referenced it in my book I've called it the universal mind and it's this idea of it's it's almost like the library of consciousness that everything that has ever been created and ever will is already there like this idea of time and space it doesn't exist it's all here right now it's one unfolding of the now and it's it's the potentiality is all there we have to get to the right conditions for it unfold and unlock and that's why we're seeing so much innovation right now is because our conscious awareness is coming more aware so we're able to unlock the things that are that we couldn't see before but now we see and it's just our ability to actually like be open to it and see it and we know that because think of all the different belief changes you've had in your life where before you thought it was this reality and now you see reality very different did anything actually change or was it your perspective of the reality that changed like that that situation was already there um we just couldn't see it so that's that's how I I feel it and you could literally say that that is the the mind of God like that is that's sort of how I connect with it's this it's this source of energy this field of energy and physics has proven this now there's there's the universal universal field the unified field which is just a nipotent and it's omnipresent and omnipresent omnipresent and it's it's available to us and that is our role and CEOs like the most important role is they are the person who can have the space like they can't be if you have every minute of your day allocated to meeting and stuff you're just dealing with the familiar no innovations going to come through so one of the most important things I do in in CEOs calendars is create intentional space and it's a really hard condition thing because they're like but I'm the leader I've meant to be working harder than ever I went no you're the one who needs to work less because then the genius ideas can come through and we have to change the definition of work work isn't about time or hardness it's just about your contribution and each of us have different zones of genius that we need to be focusing on in contribution and and that's that's something which is confronting for people yeah so when you talk about space is there like an ideal so anyone who's listening to this right now if you go hey if you want to just have experience this how much space do you think on average people need to be able to have that sort of like to get to that like that that threshold like in in in uh flight we call that the V1 right you know and we got enough speed that where we can start to actually think about getting like and rotate off right we got enough speed to get lift how much space have you found on average that people who need to be in those creative space or people who may actually not need I'm going to take the back who want to be in that how much space do we need well it's a funny question is a question is a paradox even the idea that we need a certain amount of space is when our going through the limited construct with time like everything is unfolding in the present moment it's already here we do have to be aligned to it even the idea of manifestation you're not really manifesting anything you're just aligning to what already is so presence blesses presence and that can happen in the spontaneous of a moment so if you think of a flower blossoming like it's there and then suddenly it just blossoms it was that one moment one moment of potentiality that that enabled it so it can happen just even in a split second like you literally drop in for a moment you have a breath you may have a moment of insight obviously that odds probably improve the more regular moments you give yourself and and that's the the beauty of this when I start with people is like I don't focus on all you have to do hours I'm just every soft and just checking with your breath and start there and just feel see how that feels and then maybe let's go for a walk without listening to a podcast like remember when we used to walk without listening to something where the ego has got addicted to consuming information because it makes us feel good that we've done something but then we're not allowing anything new to come through it's why like Archimedes had the greatest insight while he was having a bath because he wasn't thinking he was just like soaking and relaxing and he was out of his mind and then some insight came through and it's Eureka I undiscovered the the the formula of buoyancy which I've been trying to work I've been using my mind for years to try to work this out and as soon as I got out of my mind the answer came to me so the construct of time is not about like what do you schedule don't schedule but it's about what I'm hearing you say I'm breaking me from wrong is that when you're talking with people it's about getting them from the past and future to be in the presence because when you're in the presence you can't necessarily be in your mind correctly and in the present moment you can then use your mind as a tool and you can direct it but the presence is why the magic happens so for example when I'm coaching someone most important thing for this to be successful is for me to drop into presence I have to get in a place where Finian gets out of the way and then when I'm in presence and I help the other person get in presence we are now in a joint experience and things will just start showing up and popping through and it'll be this really beautiful experience where I'll be like whoa that was a good one like it's like actually I'm witnessing the information to come through and I don't claim that that was me I was just a vessel in that experience to reflect something back and that's why I focus on returning leaders to presence because when we're in the presence we already know I never really help leaders like just like I don't tell them what they need to do I help them discover what they need to do sometimes I tell them what behavior they need to do or how they're hurting themselves and I'm like no you need to change this direction like I'm not a I'm not just a person who asks questions and just like leads it up to them like sometimes people need advice but ultimately the biggest things like they're the expert in their space I just need to help them trust their expertise more trust their own intuition and intuition is very funny because I actually thought about writing a book saying don't trust your first don't trust your intuition because a lot of what a lot of people think is their intuition is actually a coded program it's a fear based program and I share the story of think of all the people who are scared of flying their intuition is telling them don't get on the plane but that's not the intuition that's literally a fear based program like everyone else is fine on the plane however if a pilot who is flying for 30 years one day gets his instinct I shouldn't get on the plane I am yes follow that like don't get on the plane like that that's now not a fear based program that's actually intelligence coming through you so part of what we do a lot of the time start with is to help them train their intuition and connect to what is actually true and what is not true because most of us are running these fear based programs which are just lying to us like literally lies I love everything that you're saying one of the questions I have though in this where does love well we're talking about presence we're talking about beingness we're talking about you're creating space and consciousness where does love lie in all of this right because if it's an energy game right for majority of I'm gonna say my hope is that for all of us we were born right literally birth in the act of love so where's where's love where's love line that says those people are tapping into not tapping into avoiding maybe too much into I don't know if that's even possible but just throw them out there what where does that lie at least in your experiences great great question I feel love and presence could be interchangeable in words so when we drop into presence and we're just really there we're connecting this breath and we're dropping down into a deeper down into our belly and we're just feeling what is here that you'll start noticing a warmth starting to come over you and there's something which has been here with you the whole time supporting you guiding you protecting you loving you in that experience so the presence allows us to feel the love and then also when we feel love what happens we drop super into the present moment when when you're looking at your child and you're just loving on it you're just you're so present there's nothing else there when you fall in love with someone there isn't a care in the world you don't care about work in that moment you don't care about what's happening tomorrow all you're focusing on is this moment so that's where that presence and love is interchangeable and I used to say like returning leaders back to love but sometimes people unfortunately the mind can grab that that you're going to do it so now I go right returning them back to presence but it's interchangeable it's the same thing for me that's so rich the thing I think about with love then like the the the insidious equal opposite reaction is and you've talked about it earlier before and I wanted to recycle back on this is the word shame and I think that we all have it and we've all experienced it and it is it's just a real bitch to deal with because it is it's not fear but it's not not fear it's not judgment but it's a boy feels a lot like judgment and so how do you define shame and if people are listening to this today right and it could be just the simplest the simplest of things right like of a small what they maybe it's not that big a deal I'm just going to bury it how do people handle shame and reframe that like maybe maybe you may be even share for yourself like how have you reframe I mean you talked about your son but in the birth of that but how else like what how's that affected you shame in periods of your life and how have you I mean because obviously you help leaders but because you've had to redo it yourself yeah so I feel shame is when we're a fully identifying with our limited version of herself we've lost in the identity in the ego and it's a lack of love so what do I mean about that is when someone else does something in an event like and they does some form of act which maybe wasn't the highest form of their consciousness that hurts someone we we forgive them and we we let them go and and parents to kids are a prime example we're like oh no you don't have to worry about that but for us we don't let ourselves off the hook we beat ourselves up and it's okay to have some guilt like guilt is sort of an emotion where it's like oh all right that's a behavior I don't want to do again ask for forgiveness move on it's like it in that if sometimes it forces into a and you behavior that's going to be service more the shame is when we're in the loop and it's just a criticism it actually takes us out of action it stops us from when we're in shame we don't actually do the thing that will let us go like we don't say I'm sorry because we're at too much too much in a shame cycle we actually avoid it this is something which a lot of parents of my generation do they they they are now at a state of consciousness where they are aware that their behaviors that they did to their children we're not nice we're not we're not great but they're in so much shame that they don't want to face it they actually avoid it and they bottle it up and it kills them and the funny thing is if they just admitted to their children the children will just forgive them straight away and bring them back into the life without having everything they want it because that's trained for children we are forgiving machines we doesn't matter what our parents do like we we love them and it's it's such a sad moment right just went oh it we already know this you think we don't know this but we know it if you just admitted that you would be set free but that can't so the key with shame is we need to love ourselves and we need to give ourselves a break and recognize you couldn't have done anything else like it's it's literally of course of course that happened if you think about all the conditions that it happened in your life that was the moment like they were back going back to the birth story of course I behave that way that was all I knew I was a deep fear and once you start doing a course and you're a little bit kind to yourself and you recognize oh that's right you do have a finite version of yourself but you also have this infinite version of yourself that is here and the fact that you are feeling something means you want to grow and you want to learn from this experience that can be the moment of liberation the only way to do it though is to get out of your own identity and it's and it's a very challenging practice it's a conscious practice but I can promise you it's easier than the other path and that's that's what gave me the strength in that time to just focus it I didn't want to do it at all like I I wanted to just like bottle it up and just focus on being a great partner and being this experience but I knew facing this right now even though I was going to hurt my partner like I wasn't I wasn't in my bright loving energy like you can see my energy it's very powerful and when when I'm not like that it's also very powerful it's suddenly it's like a vacuum sucking energy out because people are used to it and I knew I had to do this because I didn't want it to affect me in the future and that's where you have to have such a love and respect for your life that you have the awareness for you like no matter what I'm going there I'm going to face this because I know from experience it just gets worse like it really does like one of the most stupidest sayings out there is that time heals things like if time heals things why are we all dealing with mummy and daddy issues why are we like compounding the situation time doesn't heal things time just actually gets it out of the conscious awareness into our subconscious and then it starts running our program the only thing that heals is energy like like you said like you had to like be in that experience you had to face it and now combine it with time and you put energy into it you start feeling a little bit freer there's a lot of people who don't put the energy in and time it just keeps getting worse and worse and worse it's such a simple formula that the word that's been fascinating me lately uh Finneon is the word simple because it's it's uh it's like an oxymoron like simple usually means clarity of like the most impactful things so there's not a lot of it so someone go well that's really simple kill it Finneon what you just said that is really simple but man that's complex so you talk about family and you talk about people around you your partner you know and you know partner Cindy and because obviously when you're excavating and you're bringing this consciousness to yourself right so anyone who's listening if they're going through this like it's listening to me like okay this is really great but none of our journeys are ever alone and so you like how how do you what sort of structure or advice or thinking about your thinking do you give to the people around those CEOs you know like how like what did you share with Cindy when you were like hey I am so jacked about like my son being born but man I am in I am just in a bad spot I mean how do you have it because I could equally see her going like seriously like seriously so how do how do we how do we bring our consciousness in and the empathy and grace around that so that others don't necessarily feel or become collateral damage of our excavation and of that like being in presence or or journey toward presence does that make sense yeah it does and I want you to let you know I'm not perfect at this I had a joint therapy session last night it's it's a constant work in progress however I do notice over time it gets better obviously communication is really critical but there's a few foundational beliefs that I feel we need to connect with in order to have the strength to be able to do this is one is what is good for me is also good for the other like that's that's very important if we if if we don't take care of our needs then we we aren't in a capacity to take care of someone else's needs so we do have to take care of our own needs first we then need to communicate what our needs are because if the other person doesn't know they're just guessing and that's unfair and it's very challenging and it gives them a chance to be able to express their needs as well and see if you can as a collaborative team how do we create a situation where we can meet each other's needs and it's not a compromise it's a creative endeavor there there are ways and unfortunately we have this conditioning that if I'm getting something it means you're not getting something that's that's not true at all there's there's ways where we could create together so so that's really imperative and really taking self ownership and recognizing that like this is your journey and not making it about them you can see that in conflict and relationships all the time it's you you you rather than I'm having this experience like this is my experience and I'm curious about what your experience is and ultimately if you do the like if you're really present with it and you're using it and integrating it then your energetic state shifts which has an impact on them as well so most of the time when someone says like oh I've got a relationship problem I go okay let's let's put that on hold and let's start like with you we start unpacking things and sometimes the dynamic shifts in the relationship as well and a lot of the time it's with the way we're viewing them like literally our reality is our reality so if you go to bed thinking about all the problems in your relationship great what are you doing more you're coding your subconscious to work with the universal mind to create more problems in your relationship and it's fascinating like this is something I encourage people to do you're in an unhappy relationship right now or you're struggling or anything like that try doing something for one month where you give your partner the benefit of the doubt and you don't complain about anything and you only compliment the positive things you don't even focus on the negative things after and do like a review each week on a rating out of 10 about how in love you are with your partner it will blow your mind what will happen you'll start giving tens after a while and you ask yourself like did your partner change or did you change like it's it's a really interesting activity this was something that happened in I was in a forum and they reflected back to me and they said you're speaking differently about her like you're speaking quite negative and it was that moment of awareness to go huh I am aren't I I'm complaining I'm being the victim of my life and instead I need to turn into creator energy and I just did that for a period of time and long behold relationship got a lot better what I love about that is it it de-escalates any type of power dynamic in there because you were actually claiming the agency because if you said this is a feeling game or subconscious is powered by the feeling portion of this and what you just said it was like okay well however they're being it's not in your agency but how you choose to view it run the narrative through your consciousness that's 100% again just to be clear this is the disclaimer I feel like if you're an abusive relationship all those other things what we're talking about is like a relationship where maybe it's either like it's it's stale or it's like you know the stress or like you've gotten down farther down that you've passed the honeymoon phase right so just to be clear we're not saying like hey if you're being abused yeah and the important thing here is is that sometimes I get people to own their decisions like you already know this relationship's over like owner like it's it's one of the other like what we can't be one foot in one foot out like you've got to be in the experience to give the greatest chance so either get out or go all in and and and really own it and and like give it a chance like most people aren't giving it a chance because they're fearful they're worried about well what happens if like I get left or I get a band and it's like well it'll just leave back to where you are right now like at least you have clarity and you'll have the chance to move forward. How much is the relational side inhibit the creative the joy the value creation the enterprise growing side of people personally it's a lot for me the a really stable loving relationship opens up creativity for me and it doesn't mean that has to be perfect all the time I just need to feel like the stability we can still have weather banging on the on the on the on the structure but I I need to know that we're stable and we can handle that weather and when we're in that place it's just a lot easier I can access the field more because I feel that sense of peace and warmth than love and I can just go create from that place and when it's one of the reasons why I always address the relationship because it may be the thing that's inhibiting you from like reaching your fullest potential they think about it like you are literally you become connected like you feel each other so how much energy is being drained by just the constant conflict or the the different states where you're not expressing yourself it's not very conducive to to a creative endeavor but then some people also it may create for them in another way like they may actually create because they're distracting themselves and we're creating and this is where we've got to be careful about it's not just all about creation either it's it's are you like feeling whole are you loving life are you living your greatest expression and sometimes people can get too focused in one particular area of their life and yes it looks successful on the metrics of a general society but if you ask them man they're not in a great place and that's why we've created this network called omya where it's where we're dealing with these people there's really high performing massive people who everyone else is worshipping the inside they they feel a massive hole they feel a lack because actually what happens once you have that level of success the illusion comes crashing down you you can convince yourself that oh I've just got to make more money I've got to do this and do that then it's all going to be good when you actually get all that and you've done it it's the worst feeling because you don't you can't trick yourself anymore you know that actually none of this will give you what you need or what you want and the only way then is to face yourself but most people don't know how to do that yeah I'm convinced that you can build a life that feels like a sunrise or sunset where you just then appreciation in awe and being aware of the fact is that that thing that you're seeing right now you're being seen and whoever else is seeing you're connecting with but you don't even know them and you'll never see the sunrise in this exact same way ever again and there's so much gratitude that can you talk a little bit more about the omya in your in your community that you're like you're creating or that you have created like just because so people because I think that people are going wow this sounds like amazing and they're going but I think like energy attracts like energy and if you don't necessarily have that energy and you're surrounded maybe by not that energy or people who aren't willing to like dive into that presence you talk a little bit more about like what what you're creating yeah sorry omya is a spice to really develop and help conscious leaders expand and what we focus on doing is putting a team of experts around you to help you develop your own consciousness so a lot of things we've spoken about today and making sure they're all speaking to each other because that's unfortunately what happens all of the time is we find a therapist a coach a medical person but they're all separate and they don't they might actually begin conflicting information so instead we put a team and it's we are working with you to to give you the greatest expression and sometimes it's right now what we need to focus on is your your health other times as well we're all in on your relationship right now I know we need to get you connect to this this infinite part of yourself so that's one element we develop your consciousness then we put you around other incredible people and put you in connection and different experiences with other expanding consciousness consciousnesses and then we combine those consciousness and then naturally it comes bigger as well so then there's another expansion and then we also have ability to provide capital and code best and invest along another another and if we create that environment we believe we're creating a self-supporting ecosystem where instead of operating from fear and scarcity we operate from love and abundance and we all can rise up together and ultimately the more we develop these leaders and those leaders can have the impact across their organizations and suddenly change starts happening quite dramatically and so that's that's what we're focusing with omia and then we also have another business called cascada which is a thermal wellness resort business and it's this whole idea of like we're creating the physical space where you can have some of those moments to reconnect with yourself actually like come in and merge yourself in water have no technology no talking just silence and have that moment of space in order for clear away the clutter create new insights and just feel good like our business is just helping people feel good like it's a really really nice feeling yeah well I think you're creating the the ambiance and any central ingredients for people to actually feel that presence or at least to put themselves in a position to give them a higher opportunity to do that which is incredible and and we're selling feelings for both of them like that's that's actually the hardest thing for like omia like everyone's always wanting like oh what exactly is it and I went like one it's ever unfolding like our commitment is it's just going to constantly keep expanded because we're dealing with the greatest minds it's cut it's going to expand that's our commitment but really like how do you describe love like how do you describe that sense of feeling like you ask anyone who's involved it's they can't describe it they go oh my god my life is so much better like I don't know exactly what it is but it's a feeling and similar with cascada is we can give all the different scientific health benefits of why to do this but ultimately when you walk out you don't know exactly what's happened to however you know wow I feel a lot better now than I did when I went in well they both sound incredible and at the at the end of the show here I want you to give some some information of where people can find out more about that you know you've talked a lot about like breath I've heard you probably say the word breath connect with breath it taking the breath this type of breath like seeing where your breath is and it is I think it's really interesting to me that everyone is especially when you're talking about cascada amya right they're like well what's the tangible thing like what's the tangible thing like what is that that like how many get from there we're always looking for if I do one plus one you know and this is controversial some people say it equals four or two but what's interesting to me though is that it really comes back down to this thing the simplest thing that is breath in again in your work and I think some of the people that kind of connected me with you were just talking about how you are such a master of breath work and I was curious could you actually talk about either the science behind it and then also could would you be willing to walk us all through like a breath work something that you could go hey when I'm talking about breath and connecting with breath you don't have to go look for it if you just listen to this portion of this podcast this is going to change your game the breath I want to give it through more of a physical experience so it can be aware of that so when when we start when we sit here right now you probably haven't been paying attention to your breath but we have been breathing because if we hadn't we would be dead like breath is here breath is the thing that we can't live without for the shortest amount of time it's why someone falls down we check their breath like are they breathing it's the first most important place so that tells me that there's an intelligence that's driving this breath without us having to do anything about it we think we have to like do everything but actually the breath is just happening naturally and that's happening by the subconscious it's it's guiding us and it tells us are we're walking faster we need to breathe some more so we can get some more oxygen into our blood cells and and this there's a gas exchange happening to the carbon dioxide which unlocks the oxygen blood blood into the blood cell and it opens up so there's a beautiful relationship happening what's also interesting about the breath though is we can bring our conscious awareness to it and we can start suddenly the breath was going to this pace and now I can start breathing really fast or I can breathe really slow so I have taken over the the automatic driving we think of a Tesla car the the Tesla can drive on itself that's what the breath is happening but then I can also go you know what I believe I can do this better I'm going to I'm going to take control and I'm going to I'm going to now drive this this vehicle and I'm giving that breath now that's really interesting when we think about it like what what else of our subconscious programs can we take control of like can we take control of the fact that I just ate food before and now it's being broken down by all these enzymes and going through my intestines and then I'm going to let it out in the bathroom later like it's very hard for me to take control of that there's all these different faculties which are running automatically by the subconscious for some reason we can do this with that breath and that tells me that it's the bridge between the conscious and the subconscious minds it's the way where we can actually bring a awareness into our subconscious and potentially use it to help us unlock what is in there and see if it's serving us or if it's actually hurting us because just just because the subconscious has a lot of intelligence doesn't mean that it's always serving us the subconscious is a basically a bunch of programs that have been downloaded to us on our hard drive and 95% of it has happened before the age of seven that mean the conscious mind wasn't saying this is what I wanted in me or not it was just literally running through absorption and if you're lucky and you're around really conscious humans you got a lot of good code but most of us around not many conscious humans and we got a lot of faulty code and that's just been running our life ever since and we think this is true but it's actually not it was just a bad code there's a bug so when we use the breath we can bring awareness to what's in the present moment breath drops us into the present moment where the subconscious exists that's all that exists it's all happening now there's no time or space in the subconscious and then we can unlock and go all right is this helping us and then we can actually use the breath to drive a lot of energy to unlock effectively that faulty code and bring it up out of us and the faulty code is unexpressed feelings that's that the crazy thing the way the code comes into us is through feelings that's well how the subconscious takes on direction whatever the strongest feeling is and if we didn't feel safe to feel something where we're younger we put in a protective code and then it just keeps playing over and over again so we need to use the breath to go you know what I'm ready to feel that feeling right now and then the code gets released out of us and then we can consciously now without at all to awareness put new code in the code of abundance instead of scarcity the code of love instead of fear the the code of it can be easy rather than hard we get to choose that's the amazing thing and people think they've they love saying things like oh that's just the way I'm hardwired no like all just that's the way I am no it's not the way you are like how is it that that person it is living a very different life like they've just bought into a different set of code and unfortunately this is one of the hardest things to reconcile because for like the everyday person who's going through a lot of hardship and a lot of challenge there's every reason to be to say well look at all this evidence this is why I am and yes that is true that is the reason why you are that but it doesn't mean you have to keep being that way because we are all given the same incredible intelligence we all have access to it's just that most people haven't been taught to read it and if you actually like open yourself up to and go I'm I can change anything in my life and I use the breath you can become anything but it requires a harder level of consciousness because you're actually having to do a lot of recoding and we know that because we hear all the great stories of people coming out of the slums or people coming out of abuse and whatever it is and they they become free of it to two people with the exact same experience one person got free of the other person didn't what's different they just didn't know how to act with the intelligence and they kind of victim of the circumstance and I want you to know I have so much compassion like doesn't just because just because you can doesn't mean what you're going through is not hard however if we keep leaving that and allowing the ego to identify with it we will never have the opportunity to get liberated we'll just keep staying in that circumstance so the breath is really the gift it's the moment to come back to presence and you can do it just by a calming practice just like doing a down-regulated breath or you can do which like your friend Benner's experience like a very upright regulated breath where we're using the power of breath and breath holds to get you in a place where you actually feel everything that you've been avoiding feeling and then go through a process of recoding and people have these incredible moments because the breath when they get fully out of their mind using the breath they then are able to connect with their infinite part of themselves the divine part and suddenly they feel love that they've never felt before they have spontaneous healings they have all these experience because they're connecting to the infinite power I so appreciate you talking about that because I think everyone is looking for the fix right it's like buying something getting more money maybe just jettison relationships to get like new relationship it it could be in terms of utilizing drugs to chase this elusive like uh-huh and again I'm sure that there's like some validity in some of these things but what I'm hearing you say the opinion is that you are caring around in your body the ultimate is you said circuit breaker they're ultimate transducer the ultimate reframer they're ultimate like presence finder right it's sort of like you don't need to go google maps you just need to stop in touch base with your breath yeah and that goes back to your idea of simple it's really hard for the mind to grab onto that the mind things complex things like what it was already here and that's the story of the alchemist like going everywhere to find your treasure to only find your treasure within it's already all here and and that's the whole mystery of life and see there was a part of you the chuckle because you get that there's a there's a knowing that we create all these situations all these dramas to recognize actually it's already here and this is the challenge is the thing we are yearning for is to not yearn anymore and the only way to year not yearn anymore is to recognize what we are like this whole search for God we already are that it's all here you just have to allow yourself to see it and feel it and remember it and it's so challenging because we'll just it's like the dog chasing its tail you know we all have these evolutions and I'm sure you still have this of like this idea of like trying to be there whatever there's like you know find trying to find God right it's this idea of being there and you know I spend a lot of time thinking about and I say like when I'm coaching my entrepreneurs is like stop trying to be there the perfect version of you all ready exists and I love I just but I love how you say it Vinnie it's like and you said like stop searching it's already here and the and I think when you actually just rep frame and reprogram and you 100% buy into the factors that it's already here yes and it's it's so hard I think about it because I'm in Panama right now and it's a common thing that we know how often is you start planning the next vacation and fantasizing about the next vacation when you're actually still halfway through your own vacation and and I'm like you're not enjoying this one like why are you focusing on home they were just constantly moving to the next thing and when you start recognizing that's already here what happens is you become the mystic you become a mystic because you then start going like you're you're fascinated with what's about to unfold it's it's it's not any of these like all right what's what's my curriculum today that's something I've been working on recently like what's my curriculum today like what's going to show up what do I need to work with what I need to explore with and things that then used to take you down for a long time like you still get ruffled by them infected like a wave crashes you but you you start laughing at them and you see it you're like oh and you move through that energy so much quicker that was a moment of recognition in our relationship last night we have out a few things recently that normally would have been a huge problem instead we were able to go huh this isn't this isn't it didn't really take us down for that long it was just thinking we're out of move through it was a wave and then but back back stable well I'm gathering from you and I still want you if it's if you're willing to actually do a breathing exercise like actually I guided one but it also seems like to me that you are asking questions that are really really simple what's my curriculum for today so if people are listening to this what are like two to three questions you go hey if you just start even just even thinking enough to even ask these questions even if you don't even spend necessarily time to like to consciously go I'm answering it but the fact you're even asking the question what were those questions that you would say hey if you just do if you just start asking these questions on a daily basis you're going to start to feel the presence so first in the morning is how do I want to feel today like just the simplicity of how do I want to feel what you're doing is sending an intention you're coming a co-curator with the life you're coming aware of what matters to you and the power of feelings are as you can achieve them in the present moment and I'll demonstrate in a breath of how you can naturally change your feelings very very quickly and what that does is like grounding in that feeling so like today I want to be present then naturally I'll come back to it throughout the day well how do I feel present well I've got a breathe I've got to not be on my phone as much and it starts guiding my actions of behavior so it's not my chance that the end of the day I feel more present I'm not just hoping it it's going to drive me so that's that's a really powerful one I do love the what is my curriculum like what's going to be my curriculum today there's something beautiful about it because it's like a curiosity and it's recognizing that I have no idea what today's going to be like we think we know what today's going to be that you have no idea and it makes you just go okay I'm exploring and recognizing that it's going to throw me off certain things but it's it's here for me and and I'm going to learn and then and then another one a more like deeper self inquiries just being able to like go in and go like asking yourself like like like what is thinking what like what is thinking right now like who like who is here right now like just asking these sort of questions where it gets you to go oh there's something behind the thing there's something behind the thoughts there's something behind the talker and and when we do that we recognize that there's a more infinite part of myself the reason why I really love your question finian specifically about what's your curriculum a friend of mine and a peer of mine Lee Brower who is part of like out if you ever watch the movie the secret like he was he was featured in there and he has this quote he goes enemy of thriving is arriving and what I love about your question what is the curriculum for today is you you are put your positioning yourself of to be a student of to be accepting of all the things that might allow you to actually excavate the treasure in your life and I think that it is such a simple question as soon as you said it I went oh man what an absolute absolute powerful question because especially for I think anyone you think that you've reached a certain level like I think about when I had my oldest daughter Ellie I was 26 years old you know I remember my 26 I was like I got shit figured out and then I had my next daughter at 39 and I realized that 26 like like I knew I felt like next to nothing and and so what I love is that you're already positioning yourself to be able to go what can I learn today that the presence can only teach come on hey I would love for you to walk us through that breathing exercise all right so making sure that this is not to be one while driving or doing something else so just just come back to it but you you actually can even when you're driving you could probably do this experience just don't close your eyes just just leave them open forever and else just close your eyes and while we're here I just want you to observe your breath as it is right now you're not trying to change it you're just witnessing what is the texture of that breath how fast how slow how deep how shallow where is it in your body just observing then also do a little scan of your body and just feel any sensations that might be there maybe you notice my left neck is a little bit tight it was a pain in my stomach once again just observing not trying to change it so we're going to do a bit of time traveling I want you to travel back to a time in your life where you felt a lot of fear it could be like me that moment where I was about to walk in and witness a surgery it could be when you thought your business was going under could be when you partner left you could be when you're stuck in a terrifying experience in nature whatever it is just trust whatever's showing up is where you need to go and I want you to go back and really live that experience like it's happening right now literally go back to that moment of time and I want you to bring all your senses alive what are you seeing what are you hearing what is smelling what are you tasting what are you feeling touching just bring them all alive right now I know it might be a little bit unpleasant but you can handle this you've already been up for just feel it all and let that feeling of fear wash over your whole body and now I want you to observe what's happening with your breath how is your breath changed and then also notice any sensations in your body maybe some of you even stopped breathing maybe there's a closed-over state whatever it is just witness that and now staying in that state for this moment I now want you to start guiding your breath so we're going to start guiding our breath in and out to account of five in and out through our nose so let's let out all our air and then inhale four three two one exhale four three two one inhale four three two one exhale four three two one inhale four three two one exhale four three two one just continue at your own count and just notice what has changed just with three rounds of conscious breath perhaps our body is relaxed maybe we're not caught up in that fear situation anymore we're just back in this present moment now I want you to time travel again and I want you to travel to a time in your life where you felt so much love could be love and peace whatever it is it could be that moment on your wedding day could be witnessing your child being born it could be just licking an ice cream when you're young you're just remembering or surfing such an epic wave whatever it is don't try to find the perfect one just trust whatever's showing up is where you need to go and once again I want you to relive that experience like it's happening right now bring all the senses alive and let that feeling of love and peace just wash overview just notice how good that feels just being completely in that experience and then once again notice how's your breath and how the sensations in your body just recognizing that in a few short moments we just shifted your whole state and now you're in a state of presence you're feeling glum you're feeling peace and there's a sense of possibility in openness for the rest of your day and whenever you come back you can open your eyes and come back to this present moment that was amazing so what did you witness then let's let's share this for the learning such I'm sure everyone else is experienced but I want you to be inquisitive like what what can you induce from that why did I guide you through that experience well I think the thing that I realized that I knew but like until you said it was when you said like time travel is that I felt like you treated it it was just a moment and not in existence and like it was just that simple like only time travel back to a time not hey this thing that's been like maybe eating at you the other thing I noticed was I noticed a lot of things in terms of like how like when it closed my eyes like the light that's kind of like if imagine there's a screen like there's like images that come up you know so when I was going back I had seen like this sort of like image of like a like a really dark sky that had kind of some rain coming down but it was like ominous looking clouds and then by the end of it I had actually forgotten about the clouds and it was this it was just and and it was so simple and it doesn't mean that that did it happen or didn't exist but I feel infinitely more present yeah yeah and that's that's the magic of it is we are not a hostage to our current state often when we're in an unpleasant space state what we are doing is time traveling over and over again and reliving this experience and why would we do that like it's it's it's we know if we go the mind can't tell the difference between it really happening or it's just happening in our imaginary state like that didn't happen to you whatever your traumatic thing right now but you got to feel it like it was so that gives us an indication that we do have choice and we do have agency and the way out of it is two things we can use the physiological experience of the breath just start guiding the breath like I think everyone would have noticed that when we went into that fear state the breath changed probably got shorter or more shallow or constricted and then when we guided the more relaxed breath it just naturally made us feel better and the funny thing is when we went to the love state our breath naturally started doing that anyway it started doing more relaxed so we can use a physiological to change the psychological but then we can also change the psychological experience we can just choose to time travel to another time which makes us feel better and and then actually we feel different in that experience and that may be the thing that you need to do in order to show up differently when you're having a bad day is to shift your state I also found that with the breathing is when I got to that fear state I actually became less aware of my breath in that when I was in that loving state that gratitude state I was really without actually even really being trying to be conscious of it I was very conscious of the feeling that was happening and so my guess is for people who are listening to this if something continually populates or repopulates their brain just doing that simple thing what that takes us and yeah yeah and you could even do a quicker that's the amazing because I have to guide you through you could just literally go I'm going to take a few breaths I'm going to go to that loving state and you're in it in 15 seconds that's that's huge it's it's so huge thank you for doing that that was what a gift what a gift and by the way it's not something you have to buy it's not something that you have to like go get a degree to do it was literally the thing that we've been born with I mean it's the first act of life and here we are Finian this has been an absolute joy to have you on and just uh I I know our audience is going to appreciate but I have deeply appreciated today just so clarifying and like so many different things and and really appreciate it going back to Amya cascada where can people find more information about that right because if they go oh hey I want to actually experience that you know what like I can't maybe get that in my either my own communities and or I don't have the team around me or you know I need to actually have this maybe you know they're just for me but to actually maybe change the dynamic or the feeling and energy in my relationship like where can they go find more information about those two projects you have yeah so the website for Amya is Amya dot life and then cascada it's cascada dot mayo or if you look on Instagram it's cascada pdx and cascada spelled C-A-S-C-A-D-A and I just highly recommend just like go explore that's and and the way I I feel the life unfolds is if you're listening to this and there's some form of energetic connection maybe this is the next step I'm not going to try to tell you just trust your own wisdom your own guidance and you may not be able to understand it or know why but there's something guiding you and maybe these are the places for you yeah we'll we'll be sure to put links in either the show notes and or in the description for both of those and then also if people want to read yeah you you mentioned you you wrote a book um number book where they can find it yeah so the book is called intentionality a ground great ground breaking guide for breath consciousness and radical self ownership and it's in all the bookstores amazon uh go on the journey and it will it will you'll get a very applicable playbook on how to go through a process of uncovering what's holding you back how to recode and then how to accelerate an extraordinary life and do you want to give us a little sneak peek of what you're thinking about writing so I've got a I've got two different lines I've actually sort of said them today one is around the parenting journey but not not as in parenting like I actually think parenting is quite easy it's everything around it that's hard so there's something around that and another one is the idea of like it couldn't be any other way like it's it's that compassion and god it said it's like of course that's happening that is awesome well Finney and one of the things I like to do uh with my guests um as we see our way out on the on the episode is to have you give either the what I call the last ripple thought question statement called action um what would you have our audience to leave with today so connecting to one of my favorite sayings life is for living how could you live more today so good that's so good Finney thank you for being here thanks for uh blessing like me with your time and and just your your beautiful views and and sharing your heart as it shows up today and then also just for our audience what a real gift appreciate you being here thanks so much Ben really appreciate you being a fellow father I'm inspired by you so thank you well thank you and appreciate you being here (upbeat music)
Podcast Summary
Key Points:
True presence and fully experiencing emotions in the moment liberates individuals from carrying trauma into the future, unlocking creativity, calm, and clarity.
Personal traumas, such as difficult birth experiences or childhood events, are opportunities for deep transformation when confronted and felt completely, rather than avoided.
Avoiding unpleasant sensations is a conditioned response; embracing them like a buffalo heading into a storm leads to growth and prevents negative subconscious loops from controlling one's life.
High performance in business and leadership stems from this personal work, as presence allows executives to operate from a place of trust and expansion rather than fear.
Summary:
The discussion centers on the transformative power of presence and fully experiencing emotions, particularly challenging ones, as a path to liberation and high performance. High-performance coach Finian Kelly shares a personal story about confronting deep-seated birth trauma during his son's delivery, illustrating how leaning into painful moments—rather than avoiding them—allows for integration and freedom from lifelong negative patterns. He argues that society conditions people to chase pleasant feelings and suppress discomfort, but true growth comes from becoming like the buffalo that charges into the storm.
This practice of feeling emotions completely prevents the formation of limiting subconscious loops and is the core of creative flow and effective leadership. The conversation emphasizes that personal healing and presence are foundational to professional success, enabling individuals to lead from a place of clarity and trust rather than past trauma.
FAQs
Life is meant to be about fully feeling the present moment so we don't have to relive unresolved emotions in the future. Presence unlocks creative flow, calm leadership, and deep clarity.
Negative belief loops originate from past moments where we didn't feel safe to express emotions. By fully feeling and integrating these emotions, they can become positive or thriving belief loops.
The breath helps individuals get fully out of their mind, enabling them to connect with their infinite heart and experience feelings of love and spontaneous healing.
Confronting trauma forces us to feel and integrate suppressed emotions, liberating us from their hold and allowing for personal growth and a more expansive life.
Like buffalo heading into storms, facing challenges directly is the only way to get through them. Avoiding discomfort, like cows do, prolongs suffering and hinders growth.
Fully feeling emotions as they arise prevents carrying them into the future, similar to how animals process and release stress, leading to greater emotional freedom.
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