471 - How to Finish Rich in ANY Economy with David Bach

I would say if you're listening to podcasts, it's not a coincidence. You came here because there's something that you're looking for, involving your money. And if anything we're saying sounds like, "Hi, I don't know. Maybe I should think about this. Don't know. You shouldn't think about this. You should make a decision today." David Bach, this man, has made such a difference in my life. So, back your very first book, "Smart Women Finish Rich." I believe it was published in 1999, that is when I got it. Wow. And I was completely, I was just a hot mess with money like most of us can be because it's not really something that we're taught in school. And my parents are amazing, but I just still had a lot of scarcity in me. And I was tons and tons and tens of thousands of dollars in debt. And that book set me on a path. And you know this, but I just wanted to say it out loud. To creating a level of financial freedom that I honestly never thought I could achieve in my lifetime. So thank you. I know you've done this for millions and millions of us, but I just had to say that because I never thought I could get to a point in my life where I never had to worry about money again. And you were a big piece of my journey. So thank you. It's really beautiful that we're doing this. Thank you. It still touches me every time you tell me. I'm still going to high five again, because I'm proud of you. I know how far you've come. And you should be proud of yourself. Because what you've accomplished on your own, you did it, right? Like the thing about books and podcasts, they don't do it for you. Right. You took the information and then you used it. Yes. And then you shared it too. Which is a beautiful thing. Oh, yeah. I love. I tell everyone about you in your books. Like I have been doing that for 25 years and I'll continue to do it. And that's why when you texted me, you know, again, David and I've become actual real dear friends. And so we text often and we'll talk about that as we get later into this conversation. But when you texted me, you said, okay, automatic millionaire 20th anniversary edition. I was like, yes. One more time. One more time, baby. So, um, you know, the world has obviously changed a lot in 20 years. And I know that your life has changed a lot. We'll get to that later. But what made you say that I need to bring this message out again in a fresh way? Well, I'll be really honest with you. There was a selfish reason. And the selfish reason was I have young kids. I've got a 22 year old who's going to graduate from college this year. I have a 15 year old. And I wanted this book updated for them and their friends and that generation. And so I really felt like I know this is going to be a lot of work. Yeah. But if I can reach my kids and reach my kids friends and reach my friends kids, then I can go help a lot more people one more time. Yes. And so I thought, let's do this one more time. This will at least give 10 more years of life to this message, to this book. Yes. It'll reach another generation. And the reality is things have changed a lot. Yes. You know, the world we are living at last time this book was updated was 2016, which we did a podcast together then. And I mean, the whole world's different now. It's almost been a decade. AI is changing everything. And we are living through time right now. That's really unprecedented. There's a lot of fear out there. But when you go to the good news, there's a lot of opportunity right now. And I think the thing that blows me away when I look at where things have come in 20 years is how much wealth has been created. Yes. Because when I updated the automatic millionaire and I'm going through all the data, I'm like, God, there's 24 million people now in the US Marie who are millionaires. And contrast that to contrast that to 20 years ago, there was approximately 8 million. So it's grown by 16 million millionaires in 20 years. It's almost a million millionaires a year. And it's like a hockey stick. The wealth in the United States is skyrocketing. And skyrocketing for two out of 10 Americans, which I talk about that. But it's skyrocketing because everything I taught in the automatic millionaire has been proven to be true. You have to own assets. You have to own stocks. You have to own real estate. Real estate has gone up fourfold in 20 years. And the stock market's gone up sixfold. I happen to be recording this with you today. The market yesterday hit all time highs. And it's also hitting all time highs globally. So we're living in this moment where assets are going up faster, faster, faster. And at the same time, six out of 10 Americans are living paycheck to paycheck. And there is a separation between the rich and the not rich. And I'm worried right now for a lot of people because automation is changing the game. I call this an automatic economy. And that automatic economy makes you automatically rich. If you're set up correctly, if you have the right system and it keeps you automatically poor, if you don't. And the reality is, if you don't have a plan for your money right now, then the greatest technology in the world exists to separate you from your money. And so there is this game of automation that you have to know how to play right now. Yes. You know, and I'm really happy that we're talking about this because I feel like in this particular moment, so many people, and I know folks from across so many industries, obviously the industry of online entrepreneurship and digital media, but then expand that out to actual entertainment. I know contractors, I know builders, I know designers, I know chefs, you know, everyone in all different kinds of verticals. And so many people are terrified, you know, prices are up, trust is down. And so many people feel lost in the sea of uncertainty. And so I'm so excited that we're talking about this because like you, I'm like, there's a lot of hope there's still so much that we can do. There's so many simple steps that you can take to take care of yourself and your family now and for decades to come. And it does not have to be complicated. That's one of the biggest, biggest things. Like, why do you think that when it comes to our personal finance, that so many of us can feel overwhelmed and stuck like a deer in headlights because we're like, I'm not smart enough to handle this. Marie, the answer is really simple. It's not taught in school. We don't teach people about money in school, right? If we do, by the way, it's a one-day class. So you go all the way through high school, you never learn about investing. Your parents are doing their best. They tell you get good grades so you can get a good job in a real. Now they say, get good grades so you can go to college. Now we're having a borrow 40, 50, 60,000 a year for college. So now you've gone to college. You don't even know anything about debt. Now you're told to go to college and get good grades so you can do what? Get a good job. And then at some point, you're supposed to learn how to do something with that money. You've come out of college. You're in debt. You're living paycheck to paycheck and everything's separated to take you from your wealth. You were never taught about money in school. And I can give you examples of this. If you have kids, if you don't teach them how to swim, they drown. It's tragic and it's true. Like when you've got a little kid, you start putting them in the pool, learning how to swim at two years old, three years old, because you don't want them to drown if there are friends house and they fall in the water. If you don't, if you're not taught how to ride a bike, right? Like I can remember teaching my son how to ride a bike and in battery park city down here. He did not ride a bike. Yeah. Right. I had to teach him how to ride a bike. Well, it's the same thing with money. Someone's got to teach you. Yes. And so it's not taught and so then it's trial and error. Then people are afraid and then people make mistakes. Then they feel stupid. Then they get paralyzed. Then they beat themselves up for what they've done wrong. You it's not your fault. The system was set up for you to be trapped financially. Yes. That's the truth. Yep. And it almost makes me mad that the automatic millionaire book was needed. Like when I launched this book on Oprah, at the end of the show, Oprah turned to me and she's like, they should teach you stuff in school. And I'm like, I know they should. Yeah. Because I said, honestly, I'm not teaching anything that you should have been able to get a high school and not know. Totally. And yeah, I mean, people who are in their 40s and their 50s and their 60s. And it's like, I never heard of this stuff. Yeah. Completely. And there's so much emotion wrapped in it too. I think that for most of us, I know myself included, growing up financially, it's like my dad worked really hard and non-stop. And my mom, who grew up in a really abusive environment as a child, she just, there was so much scarcity. There's so much not enoughness. And again, it almost doesn't matter what's in your bank account. Because I know even in current times, people that are earning well over six figures are still living paycheck to paycheck. And so it's almost like we can almost set aside how much you have the emotional scarcity, the fights about money. My parents got divorced over money. It's like that whole emotional layer gets a lot of us also besides even the, you know, just brass tax of what to do with your money. It's like, there's a lot that keeps us in a state of feeling afraid and feeling shameful and feeling also, I think in this world with young people, you're seeing social media, you're seeing reality TV, you're seeing all these displays of extreme wealth. And like, wait, I want that. I shouldn't want that. So there's a lot going on. I deserve that. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. So for anyone watching right now, who's like, oh my god, this sounds amazing. If they're feeling hopeless about money, do you believe now in 2025, 2026 and beyond, it is still possible for anyone to live rich and finish rich? 100%. I wouldn't be here if I didn't believe that. Here's what I really believe in the next 10 years. It can be the greatest decade to build wealth of our lifetime. I love that. For those who are set up with a system, right? Like, I say with this book, the automatic million on the back of this is wealth is not a secret. It's a system. Yes. And that's the truth, right? There are no secrets anymore. Yeah. It's about, that's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's about the system. But I think these next 10 years, it's almost, I think we're the beginning of a hockey stick. Like, even though we've had, like the last five years have just been insane, right? Like, if you've been in the index fund, and I give all kinds of examples in the automatic million, but like, let's just say you were in the, the Vanguard total stock market fund, okay? Just a boring generic, the greatest boring generic mutual fund that's probably ever existed. 3600 stocks in it. Last five years, it's average over 15% annual. It's an average over 20 years, well over 10% annually. It's just a boring index fund, right? It's great. So the question people like, well, now that it's gone up so much, did I miss it? And the answer to no, you didn't miss it. You didn't miss it. I mean, the markets pull back. That's what happens. They recover. But what AI is doing and it's transforming the world and it's going to take a lot of jobs away. It's also creating profitability for companies like we're probably never, never going to see again. Like, there's going to be a, there's a moment in time right now where businesses are about to get extremely profitable. Yeah. Now that will hurt some other people. But I'm telling you, every single day you're going out and spending money on everything, right? Yeah. Everywhere you go, you're spending money. Yep. You have to be an owner in those companies. You have to own stocks in the stock market. And we can talk about how you do it today to make it simple and easy for you. Oh, you have that all laid out in the book, not to interrupt you. But I also, I want to restate this because I can, I have developed the gift over 20 years of hearing my audience, even while I'm recording things, is you do not have to have a lot of money. You do not need to earn a lot of money in order to set up smart systems and build wealth over time to us to be clear. I think and thank you for hearing your audience in your head because what I would tell you is that today you can save your change automatically. You know, when I started doing this 20 years ago, the first original copy of the automatic millionaire, I had to list mutual funds that would take 50 dollars a month that I had to find the funds that could take that small amount of money. And the paperwork to set up an automatic investment plan was six pages. Yes. And if you came into my office to do it at Morgan Stanley, it took us 45 minutes. And then it took three weeks after we gave the voided check and you filled out six pieces of paper. It took about three weeks to automatically debit your account. Today you open your phone and I'm just giving example. You used to come in like acorns. Okay. Acorns is an app that you can save money automatically into a diversified portfolio of indexes. Basically solo cost. You can round your change up. So anyone's like, I have no money. Great. Round your change up. When you go shopping and you buy anything, the change can be rolled up into an investment account. And you can set up an account on an app like that in 10 minutes or less. So literally someone could get done watching this podcast and just go wait a minute. What? And go to an app and I'm just giving that as an example. And you could be investing in automating your pay yourself first account, which we're going to talk about. You could be automating your emergency account, which we're going to talk about. You could be automating your dream account. And if you don't want to use a company like acorns, I go through it. You could use Schwab. You could use Vanguard. You could use fidelity. You could use Coinbase. You can use Robinhood. There's no limit to how many companies are available now to help anyone get started automatically, easily now. Yes. And this is the best thing ever. So before we start to get into the tactics and how easy it really is, especially in today's age to do this, I want to start with a counterintuitive step to getting great with money. Because a lot of people, especially when something is intimidating or can be as intimidating as many conversations as like, okay, tell me what to do, how much you know, you start getting into the brass tax. But I want to talk about something that is important to both of us. You say this and you say your values can determine how hard you're willing to work to achieve your financial goals, how much money you currently spend, and how much money you will actually need if you want to move towards retirement. So talk to us about why it's important in any money conversation to start with our values. And how do we start to think through this? I spent almost a decade as a financial planner. Most financial planners start with the numbers. I never did. I started by asking my clients, what was most important to them? They're expecting me to tell them how their money is going to, I'm like, wait a minute, we got to step back. What's most important to you right now? Let's talk about your values. What do you care the most about? Let's design the rest of your life around your values. Let's look and see if the way you spend money aligns with your values or conflicts with your values. Let's look and see if the way you're saving for the future helps you get closer to your values, it takes you further away from your values. Once you retire, it's, I mean, once you retire, you have all this time on your hands, your values should be coming instantly. They should be clear before you retire. Yeah. But the moment you retire, that's when you get to start really living your values. Now, I want people to live their values before they retire. Yeah. So what I tell people is, you know, this is not complicated. You take out a yellow pad of paper and you write down what's most important to you. What's really most important to you, which is family, friends? I mean, I'm giving you examples, family, friend, health, security, freedom. And in previous books like smart women finish rich and smart couples finish rich, I walk you through what I call values based exercise and it's based on purpose, focus, financial planning, writing out your values, looking at what matters the most. If you're in a relationship or you're married, talking about your values together, then turning to the money. And the reason is when your values are clear, your financial decisions become easy. Yes. And that's the key because what holds people from making change is decisions. Yeah. Decisions are what change everything. Like at some point, you read smart women finish rich and you made a decision to make changes in your life. Yes. Everyone who writes to me with success stories, it's something happened. They made a decision, right? The difference between people who do and don't is simply a decision. When your values are clear, when you're clear on your values, you're almost like a magnet pulled towards your decisions. Absolutely. No, you need to make them. I also feel like one thing that has been really true for me for my entire career most of my life and I'm constantly revisiting this sometimes. And by the way, y'all, you guys know me, I live in New York City. At times in my life, I've lived in New York City in California, like two of the most expensive places. And I'm very cognizant of that. You know, like my account and I was like, really? And I'm like, yep, like that's just me. But my point is is that even living into very expensive locations for a part of my life and now just mainly in New York, I've always been someone who knows, like I don't really need to spend a lot in order to enjoy my life. Like I live quite simply. Yeah. I love cooking meals at home. I love doing really simple things that don't really cost much. I'm not really much of a close kind of person. You know, there's all these things. And I think that when you're able to get clear on your values and what really means the most to you, sometimes you can discover you need less than you think. Do you like? Well, I mean, ironically, first of all, 100%. The most ironic thing about actually reaching a point where you're totally financially free and you have a lot of money. Yes. And this, I think this is true for most people is once you're there, you realize you don't want anything. Like where I'm in my life, I don't, I don't, there's nothing I want to acquire. All I want are experiences. Yes. I want the time to enjoy those experiences with my friends and family. Yep. I want my health. Yep. I want the people I love to stay healthy, right? My mom still alive. My dad passed away last year. Like I want to give as much time as possible with the people that I love. Yes. And I don't care about stuff anymore. Yes. And it's just ironic because when I didn't have the money, I wanted all the stuff. I think that's part of our human journey that we go to and you think like, oh, if I could just have this, I could just have that. But I think tying it back to the values conversation. I also want to just tell you one more thing because having worked with retirees now for 30 years, the interesting phenomenon on it. This is true. Like when you work with people who retire, when you work with people of money, we spend really like from 20 to 60 accumulating not just money, but stuff. Then we start de accumulating stuff in our 60s, 70s and 80s. A lot of times people don't start to accumulate until they're in their 70s. The sooner you de accumulate, the sooner you get ready, it's just ironic. The sooner you get ready, your stuff as you get older, the easier your life becomes. I'll tell you, I have been, you know, when you and I have been texting for years now, I think it's been like five or six years. I've had this inner sense for myself of just needing and wanting to shed. And my friends, they, they all laugh at me. Josh laughs at me too. It's like nothing makes me happier than a good purge party. You know what I mean? Like if I'm going through my drawers and again, I don't have a lot of stuff. Like my friends, like, what the hell are you getting rid of? Like you're so minimal. I'm like, there's more to go because this feeling of freedom and spaciousness in this feeling of like and really for myself, not judging anyone else, but it just has become clearer and clearer. Similarly, what I value most is freedom, experiences, creativity. So it's like being able to quote unquote, invest in my dance classes or art or travel or again, making meals or hosting people. You know, all of which, again, it doesn't have to be, you know, champagne, wishes, and caviar dreams. I don't even give a shit about that stuff. Completely. But it's like, I'm noticing as the years kind of just, just continue to roll forward. It's like, wow, I'm enjoying less and less and less. And I think that that's, it's really important for all of us. So I know a lot of people watching right now, you know, some of you are going to be in that beginning stage of life where you're either in college or starting, you know, to get out on your own, like my steps on him and his husband, you know, they're right at that 30-ish mark. And I've been, man, I've been shoving David Buckfuck's in front of them. Like, since he was nine, like my steps, because my stuff sounds an actor. And I remember he got this big role on a movie. It was with Nicole Kidman. It was the first time. And you know, so he was like a teenager. Yeah. Even below like preteen when he first got this role. And you better believe that Mama Marie pulled out the whole chart from automatic millionaire showing like, do you know what I mean? If you save this and you're only 12 or 13, look what's going to happen by the time you're 40? Well, you know, it's actually insane. And last time I was with you, we did my book The Latte Factory. Yeah. Yeah. And it's the only book that my kids have actually, they read that book because that book was super short and they could read it. And so both my kids are like, well, I want one of these Roth IRAs. And the charts and the books started at 15 and James is like, Dad, do I have to wait until I'm 15? So I say, well, no, actually, you don't. We could start one for you at 12. So I ran the numbers for James. Actually yesterday, ironically. So James is 15. So he's, we funded a Roth IRA for him. Put him on the basically the payroll as a business, right? And and fund his Roth IRA and he has $24,000 at the age of 15 now in his Roth IRA. Now here's the incredible math on this, Marie. If he saves $20 a day. So he just basically keeps funding the Roth IRA at $7,000 a year. It's going to actually go up, right? Because they'll increase the amount you can put in. But if all he does from now until he gets into his 60s is save $20 a day, this kid's going to have over $10 million in his IRA account tax-free in his 60s. And that's $20 a day. And people, where's that kid going to get $20 a day? Please, trust me. You can, these teenagers can make $20 a day. And dad's going to help in the beginning. But what I'm really doing by talking about this and teaching him is I'm teaching him how to fish, right? Like I'm fishing first. I'm putting the cat, I'm putting the like the little rod in the water and I'm catching the fish and I bring it in. But eventually I'm handing him the rod, right? It's like this goes back to teaching your kids. Yeah. So and when I walk around him and Florence, I go back, I know we play this game. I'm like, okay, so tell me the difference between a Roth IRA and deductible IRA, right? And he'll be, okay, Roth IRA goes in after tax, it comes out, you know, I get a tax free. Okay, tell me about the deductible IRA. So that by the time this kid leaves for height, you know, college, he knows the difference between index funds and actively manage funds. He knows that he should have a Roth IRA or deductible IRA because dad has just talked about this all the time. Yes. And you know, this is, I know this sounds complicated, but you read a book like the automatic millionaire, you can teach this to your kids and so many parents have because the number one thing people who are older say to me is, I just wish I had started when I was younger. Absolutely. That's what most of us say about many, many things. So by the way, for all of you listening, like I reread this prepping for our conversation today, here's what I love about your work. First of all, it's so encouraging. It is very straightforward and simple and it's super, super, super actionable. Thank you. Like you're such an encourager. And as, and I like blue through this, you know, I mean, as, and it's just like, so if you're thinking about this and you hear anything that David's talking about with these different things, it's so clear. It's so simple. Anyone can do this and it would be quite fun. If you've got anyone in your life, even if they're not teenage, you know, age, kids, they can be in their 20s, they can be in their 30s. You might have nieces or nephews. You might have other people in your life who are just slung on like, dude, I need to figure out my money life. It's like, let's do it together. So I want to talk about one of the biggest mistakes we all make with money and fixing this really is the secret. Let's talk about automation. I mean, it's in the title, the automatic millionaire. And I feel like it really is at the heart of this book, this work, this system that can help people create financial freedom and they don't need discipline. They don't need willpower. They don't need to earn a ton of cash and they don't need to take a good jelly and months or years to figure this out. Yeah. Well, so first of all, why do you need automation? Because all the other stuff doesn't work. So what doesn't work? Budgeting doesn't work. Why doesn't budgeting work? Because budgeting is a pain in the ass. If you've ever tried to budget, I'm going to put this much money away for food. I'll put this much money away for coffee. And this is how much money is for my nails. Whatever your categories are, people will try and budget for a month or two. Most chances are married to somebody who doesn't want to budget. They fight over it all the time, budgeting, fights over budgeting can lead actually to divorce. I wrote a book smart couples finish rich. The number one cause of divorce is finding over money. So budgeting does not work. The other thing is discipline doesn't work. And I'm going to explain that. What do I mean by saying discipline doesn't work? You're too busy to do these things over and over again. I was at Morgan's daily nine years. I only had one client bring checks to me for more than six months to save an invest. Everybody else who saved they saved automatically. And that's that's why I just came from a place where I was at a company that just opened up a 401k plan. All right. And I said, you know what's scary? These single most important financial decisions most people make is the day they have that meeting. You know, they bring up pizza. They bring all the employees in. They go, great news. We have a 401k plan. The guy comes up in this case. It was a fidelity company. It was fidelity. And they do that presentation for 45 minutes. People are on their phones or eating their pizza. They're talking to their friends. They're not totally paying attention half the time. They're not realizing that one meeting where I sign up for my 401k plan, that one decision where I automate my financial life is the actual most important financial decision I may make in my entire life. And that one decision determines your financial future. And what is tragic is most people don't pay attention. And they often now do what is called accepting the opt-in rate and the opt-in rate. This has changed. It used to be you had to opt into your 401k plan with the secure act. This is like a part of the update. The new secure act is requiring most 401k plans, depending on the size of the company, to opt an employee in at a 3% savings rate. Now a 3% savings rate in technical terms, what that means is you're not saving enough money. Absolutely. And it means that you're saving less than 20 minutes a day of your income. So how much should a person who signs up for a 401k plan at work use? You need to be saving at least one hour day of your income. Now one hour day of your income is 12.5%. If you want to really make this a no-brainer, you save at least 14% of your gross income in that 401k plan. Why is it 14% because we have all the data now. We know when we look at who became automatic millionaires in 401k plans, we know what they say. And it's actually fatalities data. They save 14% and they became a millionaire in 26 years and they had that million dollar status at age 59. And the mixture of their investments was 75% stocks and 25% bonds. Most cases they used a target dated mutual fund. That is by the way what you should use. I talk about all of this in the automatic millionaire. So you should be maxing out minimum one hour day of your income in your 401k plan. You should be using a target dated mutual fund based on when you're think you're going to retire. So if I think I'm going to retire in 30 years, that target dated mutual fund is going to have a due date. It's going to say what's 30 years from now? It's going to say 2005. By the way, you think that's a long way away and you're going to go like this and 30 years will have gone by. Yes. And so that's the most important thing you do. Now the the tragic thing is that some people do things actually right. They max they put this percentage in their 401k plan. But they don't make the second decision which is you have to choose the investment because if you don't, it goes into a money market account or a savings account and earns nothing. It could earn 1%. There are people listening right now to me. I promise you who have 401k plans IRA accounts. They think they're doing everything right and their money's invested in nothing. And I meet these people every day and they go, what's he talking about? They will people will come up to me and be like, I read your book. I opened up my IRA account just like you told me, David. And it's a great. I always ask questions. Great. Where is it? It's a Vanguard fabulous. What's it invested in? What's in the Vanguard IRA? Great. Well, what do you mean? Come on. Did you read the whole book? Like, it's got to be an mutual fund. It's got to be an investment. I've had people open up their phone, go online and look at and they're like, it's in a money market account. Go fix that right now. So a couple other things I'll share because I just get the real nuggets in here. People are not all staying in jobs for 26 years. Absolutely. They're leaving jobs. Then these are the things that they do that destroy their life too. Do not cash out your 401k plan. You'll pay taxes and penalties. Don't do that. Then you also lose all the growth. Second thing is don't leave the money in my opinion at the 401k company. Roll it into an IRA account in your name or move it to your next 401k plan. Here's where the next mistake comes. People do everything right. If they work their way up, not everybody goes from zero to saving 12% or 14%. A lot of people start at three and then they move it to six, which is great. Then a year later, they move it to nine, right? They move like like like training for a marathon. A lot of people just slowly increase, which by the way, if you slowly increase, if you started at 1%, you would never notice the money coming out of your paycheck. If you changed it 1% to a month for one year, you'd be at 12%, you'd be in great shape. However, people do this. They change jobs. They move their money from one 401k plan over to the next, but the new 401k plan then opts them back in at 3%. And Vanguard just came out with a report saying that one thing is costing many retirees now $300,000 in retirement. So, you know, while all of this can be made automatic, what I've realized in the last 20 years, and this is why I think people are also like buying, going to buy by the update and keep hearing about this is everything's not always automatic for 20 years. If you change jobs, you've got to re-automate it. Absolutely. And re-examine the details. That's right. If you have, you know, I talk about paying your home off early, like a bi-weekly mortgage, well, people tend to refinance mortgages every seven to 10 years, or move. So then you got to automate the mortgage again. Yes. So, automation's great. I'd say, you know, do it once. You're done. Set it and forget it. And that's mostly true in less things change. Yes. Then you have to automate again. Yes. No, it's really, really important. I love it because you already answered one of my questions was what are some of the biggest mistakes people make when they try to automate their money, which is not paying, in my opinion, close enough attention to the details to make sure that they're really set up. And, you know, it can feel like you had a victory. If you're like, Oh my god, I enrolled in this thing or I'm doing the most that I possibly can. But I think in today's world, it's so important more than ever to really triple check yourself. Like I just am reflecting on life in general. How much more complicated it's become, how many more inputs we have coming at us on a daily basis from so many different social platforms and so many different ways that people can reach you. And I'm just watching in different projects outside of the realm of straight up personal finances where details get lost because so many of us are so flooded. So I just want people to hear this right now. It's like setting it up, it is set it up and check it. Well, and let me give an example to you said two things I really want to I want to make sure we hit them because they're so important. When you automate your financial life, you actually feel better instantly. So if someone watches his podcast, listens to us and then says, you know what, he's right. I'm going to pay myself first. I'm going to go open up an account and at least save something, whatever it is, $50 a month, $100 a month, $200 a month, the moment you do that, you feel better. I can't overemphasize how valuable that is because it's beyond giving yourself a pat on the back and having green juice. Okay, it's like you really feel better. People take all these vitamins. This will make you feel better than the vitamin. You feel instantly better. Second thing is can I just give him your phone for one second? Yeah. I'm going to use your phone as a prop here for those you're watching us. So these phones today make you automatically rich or make you automatically poor. I said that earlier because we're on these phones all day long. People click on things and decide to buy things and many of what we click on and decide to buy is actually designed to have us try it out for free for 14 days. And we tell ourselves, well, I'm going to use it. And if I don't use it, I'm going to cancel it. And we don't. And people have hundreds of dollars a month subscription fees for things they don't use. Absolutely. So one of the things I would tell you to help you find money, go through your credit cards, download stuff into an app that can show you everybody you're paying monthly examples like a company like Monarch does this or Y and B. These are apps that you can use to track all your money or just go to your credit card companies and go through the list. Who am I paying automatically? And then I would tell you this unless it's like life urgent, I would shut it off. Because first of all, when you shut everything off, they will start giving you better that are deals. So if almost anything you shut off, they've automated to try to keep you as a customer. Everybody wants the lifetime value of a customer. Nobody wants to sell you something monthly for one month. And they know, based on their business model, that most people it takes them six to eight months to shut something off. And what's fascinating about this is how much crap we buy that we don't use that we're paying for automatically and we stop thinking about it. When you buy something that's $30 a month, that's not just $30 a month. That's not just a dollar a day. That's $360 for the year. That's $3,600 for the decade. There are people who are still paying for services from 10, 15, 20 years ago that they never use. When my dad died, we had to do all this, you know, help my mom. And one of the things I'm like, mom, I'm going to the cable bill. I'm like, there's five cable boxes in this house on your bill. Where are these cable? Do you use cable boxes anymore? Because everything's plugged into the back of the television set. You're watching Apple TV. She's like, I don't know. They're just sitting underneath all the television set. They had been paying for cable boxes for God knows how long, but like all just the stuff. And I will say this. I know I'm on different tensions here, but like, if you ever buy something that you're going to pay for monthly, do and you use Apple, do it inside Apple. Use the Apple pay process. And the reason is Apple is the easiest way to shut everything off, right? Because I can open up in Apple, everybody I'm paying monthly and I can go, click, click, click, click, click and it's done. Yep. When you pay the company directly, they make it hard for you to figure out how to turn these things off. Oh, they almost make it impossible. I mean, you're talking about when your dad passed which I'm so sorry about like when, and you know, I've been going through quite a lot with my folks. I know. Trying to cancel their cable box. In Xfinity, you can go yourself. I have never lost it on a line more than with this company. They were like, is he dead? I'm like, my dad has dementia and they will not let me cancel. You know, they're like, well, he needs to show up. I'm like, good luck with that. Anyway, just that was so outrageous. It is so outrageous. I have never like Jersey Marie comes, you know, Jersey Marie comes out. I have not seen her come out like this. I was like, oh, Xfinity, you want me to show up on your doorstep. I, man, I gave them not even a piece of that. And then they wanted to bring the box back which is just going to throw the box away anyway because it's 10 years old. Just to make that point though, I think it is, it's so it's so incredibly important. I want to talk about folks who might be watching or listening right now and they're like, this all sounds good, but I'll start saving when I make more. What would you say to someone who feels like they're so already behind or barely getting by? And that is their truth. Obviously, we can go through the subscriptions, like that's one place. But even if they just needed a shift in their mindset, if they just need some encouragement outside of a tactic, how would you address that person? Here's what I would say. And I, you know, back in the day, I used to do a lot of speeches. And I would say on stage, let me ask you all a question. Let's just be honest with with each other for a second. If you go back in the office tomorrow and your boss sits you down and says, David, you're amazing. We love working with you. You've added so much value to this company and we want you to be with us for years. But we're going through a difficult time right now. And we're really sorry to say this, but we definitely don't want to let you go. But we're going to need to cut back your pay by 10%. It won't be permanent, but we're going to have to cut you back by 10%. Would you stay with the job or would you walk out the door? And when you say that in a live room of people, it's fascinating because you watch them think about this, right? And when they, when you talk about it, what most people will say is, I wouldn't walk out the door. I need the job, right? I can't maybe I'll go look for another job, but I'm not leaving this job. I need the money. Yeah. So how will you survive by giving yourself a 10% pick? You didn't actually give it to yourself. Somebody else gave it to you. And you and everybody says figured out. Yes. Wait, wait. There's a book here. Oh my God. Everything's figured out of well. This is literally what people say. They go, I'll figure it out. Yes. So what I would say to someone, because me chill saying this because it's so true is like figured out, yeah, figured out it's so much easier to figure out the younger you are. Yes. It's so much easier to figure out today. Today, while you're sitting here, you're, you're hopefully healthy. You have energy. You see a futures in front of you. That's the time to figure it out. Yeah. You know, I always say in our 20s, we hear about money in our 30s. We start to worry about it in our 40s. We start to get super nervous in our 50s. We hyperventilate. Right. And so every decade gets harder. And wherever you are today, today is your day to start. Yeah. You came here because there's something that you're looking for involving your money. And if anything we're saying, it sounds like, huh, I don't know. Don't know. You should make a decision today. At least make some decision. Whatever that decision is, make something. Also, you have to get leverage over yourself. In the automatic millionaire, I talk about the fact that people will work 90,000 hours over their lifetime. Some people more. So if you're a double income household, you're looking at 180,000 hours, maybe 200,000 hours. You know what sucks? Get to your 50s and 60s and having had spent all those hours of your life making money and you didn't keep any. Now you didn't keep any because again, the system was set up for you to not keep it. Who gets paid first? The IRS. They take the first three hours day of your income to taxes. Then you start to pay everybody else automatically. The whole key to building wealth is that you become selfish and you say, no, no, no, done. I'm paying myself first. Me, David, I'm paying myself first. Me, Murray, I'm paying myself first. Every time you earn a dollar, you pay yourself first. The first person who gets paid, who is it? It's you. I could save this for the rest of my life. It just turns out this is the end of my show. So literally pay yourself first. People should put this on their, you know, tattoo it like pay yourself first. Pay yourself first. Money comes in. Money should not just go out. And the problem is if you believe that you have to make more money to save, you will never get around to saving. I mean, I know I believe this by the way. I'm sitting here like on the pro, but the reality is I made all kinds of mistakes when I was young. When I was young, I was living paycheck to paycheck. I had credit card debt. I did all the stupid things you're not supposed to do. Then I made $50,000 a year, which was a lot of money out of college. And I spent more than that. And then I made $75,000 and I spent more than that. Then I made $100,000. I was on that rat race of make more spend more until I met the Mac Entires that the automatic millionaire book is based on. And when I met this couple that came in in my office earning half of what I earned, able to retire in their early 50s, that was the moment that changed my life. Can I be honest with you? You are too nice and it's costing you money because every time you say yes to someone's quick question or tiny favor, you're saying no to that one big project that'll get you the income you want. Watch this free 12-minute class and I'm going to show you how to double your productivity and escape the three toxic lies that keep most nice people stuck. Go to MarieForleo.com/freeclass or scan the QR code on screen right now. So speaking of stories and speaking of the Mac Entires and what's possible. The other thing I love about this new version is there are so many stories from people from all walks of life who have used this system to create their version of financial freedom and to get themselves out of that terrible sinking place of despair where they feel like they're going to be working their whole lives until they drop. So out of all the stories that have come in and I know even a new one came in that I'll read in a moment was there one that's in the book that made you just say this is why this is why I'm back here again doing this. Well yes there's a couple in here um and it's interesting how this all works for me because I actually think none of this was me doing this was all God doing. God gave me this message. God said you know I felt like I was put here to do this. This is my purpose in life was to free people financially actually so that they could then listen and use their God-given talents. That's why I think I did this work and there have been a lot of points in my life where I wanted to quit and there was a point where I'm updating this book where I was so freaking frustrated because updating these books is actually so hard and I was sitting there working at my desk doing the old school stuff that we do updating the man you know manuscript and I get I was in the process of needing to get testimonials and you know what a nightmare this is absolutely as authors we hate getting testimonials and I'm like I need some new testimonials. People I don't know and so I reached out to Tiffany, LH, the budgenista. I didn't know Tiffany. I knew of Tiffany but I didn't know her personally and so I sent her a message and I said Tiffany I don't know if there's any way you would consider doing this book if I send you the automatic millionaire and would you be willing to maybe give me a testimonial and Tiffany messages me back and she says yes I'll give you testimonial but I'm gonna give you more than that and so she sends me this audio file and she records like a seven minute audio file and she tells me how the automatic millionaire book totally changed her life and she walks me all the way through it she's like I was a school teacher making thirty nine thousand dollars a year I was living at home she'd been a teacher she'd even lost her job she was with her mom she was what they watched the automatic millionaire show with Oprah and she's like super depressed because she's huge and huge credit card debt and she's like I went down to the bookstore because everything you said on that show made sense to me and I'm like I think I can do this she went down the bookstore this is her telling me the story and audio she's like I got the book I started reading it she's like I'm a teacher so I'm a student she's like I'm like I can do this she's like I can do this and then she's like she starts doing it getting herself out of debt she's like not like can I do this but David I think I can teach this too she's like you know I'm a teacher and she's like the way you taught me you weren't condescending you brought me up that's how I teach she's like if I can get myself out of debt I can go teach other people like me how to do it and she didn't she's no multi-millionaire 20 years later she's a multi-millionaire and she's like David and I have an eight figure business and I've taught millions of people I was like sitting in my kitchen I'm listening to this story on her on my phone and I actually started crying in the kitchen because I was just like okay God I got it I got it so that story really touched me and and you know I sent you a story today that someone sent me and I read it on the car ride down here these stories that people send me have been the fuel that's kept me doing this work yeah and I love you saying that too because sometimes I think people see someone like you this is 13 books then right this is your 13th and you've had it's just it's insane the career that you have it's so beautiful and some people like oh it must be so easy it's like no dude it's hard it's hard to keep it going and I just really appreciate you for saying like there's been so many times and you're like oh I'm done and it is the stories that pull you back I want to quickly read this one that you texted me as we were about to film and this one is from Joe who says hi David I just wanted to reach out and say thanks so much for your books the impact they had on my life I'm very grateful for you and sharing your knowledge in such an attainable way I was a bit of a nerd as a kid frequently walking out of the library 12 years old with four or five financial books to consume most gave good advice but I always struggled knowing how to put them into practice when I discovered smart couples finished rich and the automatic millionaire it was like the light bulb clicked on in my head I've been investing on a regular basis ever since I've never had a super high paying job but at 35 I was able to pay off my house last year and now only about two to three years from being able to retire fully should I choose to plus I've had an amazing life of travel along the way I can't imagine how different things might be if I'd never read your book thank you for your very practical and helpful advice and that makes me almost cry too because it's like you know you don't have to have a good trillion dollar salary or necessarily you know obviously I'm an entrepreneur and that's something I've championed for a very long time for a lot of people but there's not one way to do this there are many many many different ways and it doesn't require like having financial freedom doesn't mean that you have to be a good trillionaire you know what I mean in order to have this beautiful life where money is not a constant source of stress and worry oh men and also you don't need a college degree yeah right like this kid started reading these books because he went to the library yes and started reading them at 12 13 and 14 yes um and it's amazing to think that this kid's paid his house off at 35 and could retire he's talking about retiring by the age of 38 yeah um there a lot of people listen is going man I wish I'd start earlier it's well just start now yes you know I'm sitting here with this huge stack of cash in front of me and for those those of you who are listening yes you can't see the stack of cash but for those of you who are watching McKenzie is this in the shot can you see the money in the shot can I just tell you guys there's like nothing I don't know guest on Marie TV has ever come in and just given like just put like a stack of cash on the table and I was like I like this can we have more this please you guys know how much I love money but please let's go back to it I'm like this makes it very happy so I'm not one of those people who shows off money and everything is at all but this cash is so this is actually you're gonna know what this is but guess what this is if you didn't know how much money you think I'm holding I honestly don't know if I would know I'd probably say five or six thousand it's 10,000 okay why did I bring 10,000 as a as an example as a prop to show everybody because the most viral post I ever put online is what does it take to blow ten thousand dollars a year and the answer is it's twenty seven dollars and forty cents so set so let that day a day okay so let that sit for a second why does it take to blow ten thousand dollars a year it's twenty seven dollars and forty cents now we're sitting here in New York I'm at a hotel where the cocktails are thirty one dollars plus a tip it makes me want to punch people I mean everything is so expensive but I promise you that there are a lot of people listening who are not saving any money or not saving ten thousand dollars a year yes and they're blowing twenty seven dollars and forty cents a day so if you started with how could I take twenty seven dollars and forty cents a day not blow it and invest it instead you could be a multi-millionaire and in the book and I'm act knowing I show the math on this now in the latte factory chapter I'm like you know twenty seven dollars and forty cents a day done for forty years invested you have over four point four million dollars if you're invested in the stock market and you earn over ten percent ten percent actually is what the number we used and you can go run your own calculations yes people like one I don't know if I can get ten percent okay fine whatever don't run your own calculation go to investor dot go I'll give you the website but it starts with the money and here's what I have hundreds here on top and I think this is really important to show people I like those hundreds by the way I like these hundreds okay so I'm holding four hundred dollars yes so thirty seven percent of Americans almost four out of ten can't get their hands on four hundred dollars in case of an emergency now if I add to this and I go five six seven eight nine ten and I hold a thousand dollars six out of ten Americans according to according to different research will tell you that they can't six out ten Americans can't get their hands on a thousand dollars in case of emergency purposes so we got to fix these things yes and no one's coming to fix this for you you know people I say no one's coming to save you but I think the people think someone's coming to save them when it comes to money I think we think presidents will come save us and governments will come save us and someone's coming to save us no one's coming to save us okay things are actually when it comes to anybody saving it's going to get worse so security is predicted and told to us now these are not like random rumors so security is in solvent in two thousand and thirty three that my friends is around the corner yes now when insolvency means it's not going to be gone but they're talking about having too lower your benefits by 20 percent your benefits also aren't that high right now they're like nineteen hundred dollars on average but there's thirty million Americans dependent on those benefits those benefits are going to come down Medicare Medicaid all the things are entitlement programs in America they're not going to continue at the same level so getting your financial act together is not a nice to do it's a half to do and the only question for you is do you do it now or do you face the consequences later and I always tell people like look do you have a plan for your money like what do you mean like like a financial plan are you paying yourself first are you saving money automatically and I go through all the things you have an emergency account have you done a will do you have life insurance like these basic things that you need to do well not not really I'm like so you have a no plan plan and people go what you have a plan it's called the no plan plan this is what most people have the no plan plan sucks yes because what happens is you you literally young people don't believe this and I didn't believe it either when I was young you snap your fingers and God willing if you're healthy in your life still yeah you're gonna turn around and be in your fifties in your sixties yes and I can tell you with somebody sitting here going into my 59th birthday pretty soon you're not gonna want to work as hard I know that there's some people on social media we're like I'm 70 I'm 75 I'm eating I'm never gonna stop working yeah but most people you're not going to want to work hard one one of the things that happens is when you're young you're like I can deal with anything then you and you know you're going to you guys you get a little bit older and you're like I don't really know if I want to deal with this anymore because you know what this is aggravating so I think I got done I think I want to go ski and you know go to cooking school take a painting class learn DJ like I got a lot of other stuff I think I can do no we're gonna we're gonna talk about that so first of all I love you that with the stack of money so yes please anyone if you want to be on MarieTV just bring me money I'm kidding but but this is awesome and I want to take this now because this is important because if we've gotten people over that hump of knowing they're gonna take action that they can find a way to save yeah now let's start to talk about just a handful of rules that I think you feel more empowered when you're more educated because then you're like all right great I can save $10,000 a year or $5,000 a year or 20 or 25,000 whatever that number is the thing is you can look at historical returns on money and you can go well if I'm in cash like the historical return has been two or three percent I'm in bonds the historical return has been between four to five percent if I'm in a balanced portfolio the historical returns have been seven to eight percent these are annual returns if I'm in a hundred percent boring generic S&P 500 stock fund the returns this is with reinvested dividends has been 10 percent if I'm in an aggressive growth portfolio the Nasdaq the annual return to been over 12 percent so when you build a diversified portfolio because I don't think people should necessarily be all stocks when you build a diversified portfolio let's just use like a targeted mutual fund and again or a balanced portfolio your returns on a balanced portfolio are going to I believe historically are going to come in somewhere around seven or eight percent which by the way is a very solid rate of return people get so caught up on these rate of returns and the most important rate is what you save the most important rate is already saving at least 10 percent of your income yes then it's what is your money earning because you need your money to make money for you that's how everyone those who are getting wealthier right now it's because their money is just compounding yep you know one of the things that blew my mind away because of this compounding growth is there's 44 trillion dollars right now in retirement accounts so one out of every three dollars in America right now is actually now in retirement accounts it's in 401k plans it's an IRA accounts it's in set by race it's in everything I teach in the automatic millier the money's now in these accounts and they've grown exponentially so 20 years ago there was 11 trillion now there's 44 trillion you know if you take this out another 15 years probably going to be the point we have a hundred trillion dollars of U.S. money in these retirement accounts which is almost like a number that is unfathomable to most of us to even wrap our heads around it's it's it's it's actually beyond and I you know we can talk I have this idea about something that should be done and and to change some of these things and because I've spent 30 years inspiring people to save and invest which is very important but but it's a two-legged stool it's a two-legged journey the first part of the journey is save and invest the second part of the journey is spend and enjoy yes now the problem is some people get the journey backwards they spend and enjoy first you do have to save and invest yes but once you get into your sixties specifically your sixties you know there's three stages to retirement there's the first decade in your sixties I call this the go-go decade you have your health you have money you have time you have family of friends that is the decade to enjoy your wealth many baby boomers and anyone who's listening right out in their sixties many cases they don't have a financial planner they are afraid to spend money yes now what are they most afraid of with the retirement accounts they're afraid of paying taxes so what's happening is that people are not taking I didn't I was able to do all the research when I updated the book using all the AI engines what I found out and I knew this intuitively as a financial advisor because when financial buyers run your plan and your plan included in my plan those plans when they do them they have you take your IRA money out last so they say Marie here's all your taxable money where we spend that and then when you in your case it's going to be 75 but depending on your age it's like for most people now it's 73 you Marie will have to start taking money out of your IRA account and it's called an RMD required mandatory distribution because the government realized well at some point we got to start getting this money out of this account so they created this RMD law worst phone call when you're a financial advisor when you call your clients and you tell them they have to take the money out they know it's coming but they still hate it why they hate it they don't want to pay taxes so it occurred to me as I updated this book that we should change the tax laws on IRA accounts and I have an idea which I'll be sharing publicly in a few weeks here and there'll be a website you can go to IRA flat tax.com I have an idea that if the government changed the tax laws on IRA accounts for people over the ages 60 and creating an eight year window so it would be you know it's a classic tax law maneuver creating eight year tax law incentivize people to take money out of these accounts give them a flat tax not an ordinary income tax could be 10% could be 12% could be 15% you know we ran analysis where we compared all the different rates what would it do and what it would do is a lot of retirees would take the money out earlier now what would they do with the money depends some of them might take it out and just leave in the exact same investments imported an taxable count some people might go out and spend some they might take more trips they might help their kids buy their first home which a lot of kids now need help buying their first home they might pay off debt they might use the money for healthcare needs like like you have a lot of people who are afraid to even tap their IRA accounts when they're retired for health care costs and again the number one reason is they don't want to pay taxes yeah so I think if we gave retirees 73 million baby boomers a break on their taxes on these distributions well what the analysis came back using again Chatchy BT Gemini perplexity we have a whole notebook LM on all this the research came back and said that it would pull for to trillion dollars in tax revenue wow and it would pull for another trillion dollars potentially an economic spending the bulk of that money would go into communities and it would give a psychological boost to retirees who need it who need it absolutely it would encourage people in their 50s to save more money because if you're in this case 53 all the way to 60 you'd have an eight year window where you knew well I'll just put as much money as I can in these retirement accounts because I get a tax deduction and then I can take it out at whatever the flat tax is that's amazing so that's this idea that I'll be sharing again I'm not going to I'm not not a lobbyist I'm not going to politics totally not running for anything I just think it's something that the powers that B should look at because I think it can help a lot of people you're talking about 120 million people I think could be impacted by simply creating a flat tax on IRA distributions for a small window an eight year window and then by the way if it goes great they could always renew it totally it would give people an incentive to get going really I love it I'm all I'm I when you first mentioned this to me I was like yay let's talk about it and and hopefully someone with the power to enact it will bring that to fruition let's also talk about the rule of 4% because I think that one of the other things besides not wanting to pay taxes I think folks that are kind of starting to near retirement and by the way you guys in a few minutes we're going to talk about money advice for people across ages but going back to the 4% rule another fears that people are going to run out of money so let's talk about the rule of 4% so interestingly coming right behind the RMD rule the RMD rule is basically 4% what is the 4% rule the 4% rule is whatever amount of money you have if provided it's not just sitting in cash it's invested look if it's invested in a balanced portfolio and you spend 4% so if you have a million dollars that means the million dollars produces 40 thousand dollars a year in income if you spend 40 thousand dollars a year in income and that money's growing at more than 4% well then you're never going to be using principle and the money's always going to keep growing and believe it or not a lot of people who have done well saving investing they're not spending 4% spending less now the balancing act with with what you spend and this is where the financial plan always comes in you don't want to say like if your portfolio earns 10% because the market went up 10% you do not want to be spending 10% right because the market's not going to always go up 10% so like this year my stock portfolio looked out yesterday I'm up 19% of my stock portfolio I'm not spending 19% the way I spend money is I'm actually spending right around 4% yeah and in fact it's you know literally I use the 4% rule when we do all of our financial planning as a family and what I've decided is going over here towards the way we spend our money is we're right now using that 4% rule now in five to 10 years maybe we'll we'll take it up a little bit but it's a great rule let's talk about money advice for people across the ages so again you've written 13 books on this incredibly diverse audience let's run through which books specifically obviously we want everybody get in the automatic millionaire that's what we are talking about however I think there could be some additional add-ons right like a little order bump for some people specifically so if someone is young and just starting out like college grad beginning of career all the way up to let's say like 30 early 30s automatic millionaire yes but is there anything else depending on like if they're a woman I would say you should read smart women finish rich just because it's so freaking inspiring oh thank you of course latte factor like any of the other books so I'm literally imagining how I've done this recently with my friends kids yes right because what happens is I go over see my friends kids I give them the automatic millionaire yeah then I often give especially young women not that not that the man can't read this too but I give them also the latte factor book the latte factor book is I give it to a lot of young people because it's a parable and you could read it in 90 minutes yes and all these life lessons are in a story yeah and so I know people who are young will really they read that book right but I would try to get them read the automatic millionaire first then I give the latte factor then I also give young women smart women finish rich yeah now I know that smart and finish rich for a 19 or 20 year old not every 19 or 20 years going through a full blown book like smart and finish rich because smart when finish rich covers everything right it covers your values your dreams your goal planning your career everything about investing I mean honestly smart and finish rich covers everything it's the first book I wrote yes everything I did for clients yeah it goes into life insurance health insurance it's a full-blown financial planning book it's really everything you need to know and it's pretty thick it's like a real book so that's great for women smart couples is a phenomenal book for couples yes especially newlyweds I mean a lot of people get this book out as newlywed gifts right you know you go to the wedding and you're like that's a great idea yeah there's a great book to start with I'm thinking for saying okay I'll get a great book to give to people who are getting married it's like winning season coming up and those are the four primary books because those books are the books are updated yeah those are actually my biggest best-selling books other than start late finish rich which is a phenomenal book yes that was a number one New York Times of the Sun book and I'm never updating it because that book needs so much updating I'm just not doing yeah yeah yeah let's let's the publisher give me that book back absolutely but let's talk about that for a second because I feel like starting late or just a midlife money reinvention you know so many people watching right now they're in their 40s 50s or 60s and probably some of them I can again I can hear them Marie I'm starting late they might feel like they they've got debt right now there's no savings they might be recovering from what is now known as a great divorce meaning after 50 there and there's significant other split where do they even begin like for someone at that particular stage and they feel like whether they are not starting at zero what's realistic what's realistic is you double down on getting going right so like what how how startly a finish rich came to be and I'll tell the story because it'll lead into what you need to do I was doing my one of my first book signings for the automatic millionaire Barnes and Noble uptown and it's great it's one of those you know great book signings rooms filled I'm taking questions I love taking questions book signings and I get a question this woman stands up and she's like David I love your books I've read smart win finish rich smart couples finish rich the finishes workbook I'm gonna go get your automatic millionaire book today but you haven't written the book that I need and I go well I get a lot of my titles from my readers tell me what you need and she says I need start late finish rich and everybody busted up so I go walking through what's going on with you and she's like okay well I'm in my 50s and I think she's been through a divorce and she's like you know I'm behind and she had was in a new relationship and I said okay well can you save $20 a day and she's like yes I can see can you get your partner save $20 right like so like take my little doll at my little thing out here can you save $20 that's literally what I said this 20 years ago but could you save $20 a day yeah if you and your partner can save $20 a day well let's take a look at what that would be worth in 15 years and then I ran the math for her and I think it was like half a million dollars depending on which you invest in quarter a million half a million dollars depending on what you should invest in so I was like you save $20 a day you invest it and get your husband or your partner to invest the $20 a day do at least that and she's like okay I can do that and it's important to keep it that simple right now if you're 50 and you are going you mentioned great divorce yeah there's a lot of other stuff you need to do let's go through them really quickly number one you need to new will you got to get your ex-husband off off all your assets people like oh no people leave their ex-husbands on as beneficiaries on IRA accounts on insurance policies so you need a new will you need a new healthcare directive you did you want your ex-husband being the one who decides what happens to you when you go to the hospital people don't update these things they get their divorce done they have the old will their husband's on their stuff they die assets go to their ex-husband you know so be a grown-up get an updated will done make sure the beneficiaries are up to date if you no longer have a spouse then the beneficiary should for sure be the kids right if you got kids so get the basics covered and stop thinking about it yes and what do you think in terms of like any mindset stuff and I think you just said it but it's like on the emotional side it's like let's how can we just drop the shame and just get started right it's like forget about the past we can't go back there it's like start today well start today and also people look I feel for people I people come up to you man are like I got divorced I look you know my husband left with there's nothing we had nothing to split up right by the way ladies you need to know where all the money is that's why you should read smart women finish rich yes because if you don't know where the money is and the divorce happens you do not get half never happens men always get more money in the divorce then you do if you don't know where the money is guys if you don't know where the money is it's a problem for you too you got to know where the money is okay so by the way do not go half off like half cocked in an angry fight and say I want a divorce plan your divorce in advance I'm sorry like this is stuff that people should really think through yeah but when people come to me like you know I am really starting over and I've had a lot of people say you know I am going to work I'm working if I can until my 70s and I'm like are you working now yeah I am do they have a 401k plan they do are you using it no start there yeah start where you are start where your feet are planted I will say this if you're in your 50s or 60s or 70s you have a job it's very important to get a job somewhere where there is a 401k plan and if there's not then you have to go open up an IRA account you're going to have to put away money for retirement yes I just I'm not trying to be a negative no I'm just telling you be like guys this is like like ultimately you have got to own the power that is you you own your own power you can do this and people turn their lives around by the way all the time it is never too late to start over you have people who have come through your program right your B school and they have come here in their 40s and their 50s and their 60s and there's probably some people in their 70s yes and there's no the only age that you can't start over is the day you give up you know my my mom lost my father last year my mom has moved if she sold her home she's she's starting over right she's 83 years old she's moved to a whole new community she's making new friends she's learning new skills she went out and bought a new car that drives itself because she's having a hard time driving but the car is driving itself and she's still learning she's still growing and I think like by learning from my mother through this whole situation my mom has lived life all the way through she's fully living her life right now I'm gonna go to Chicago and see her on Thursday meter at the airport you know she's flying in to see her family and see my son her grandson um you know I took my mom on a cruise every every excursion that was available she's like yeah let's do it you know we we went on an excursion in Alaska and we took the helicopter to the glaciers and my mom is walking around the glaciers with me at 83 yes and I just think don't stop don't quit on yourself too many people quit on themselves in their 50s and their 60s don't quit on yourself now let's talk about uh 50s and 60s and just this notion too which you talk about in this book and I'm so happy you do it this is one of my favorite topics from you is mini sabbaticals and uh excuse me sabbaticals and many retirements so you've been very open about this taking your first sabbatical at 46 and then again at 52 so I want to talk about one of the stories that you've shared with me which I love where you know you were in a room the coaching mastermind other high-powered entrepreneurs and everyone part of the exercise was like okay how are we going to 10x our business right and really look at kind of where you want your vision to go and what are we going to do to take this thing to an even bigger scale and um and then you had kind of an aha moment to uh to quote Oprah can you take us through that story and then just talk to us a little bit about and I have other questions of course about uh mini retirements and sabbaticals it's it's totally true story and I paid a lot of money by the way to be in that coaching program yeah uh which was a phenomenal coaching program oh most of them are I mean they get us to sit down and actually pause and think and plan yeah I've been in that program for years and so I had you know in this program we have these these forms that you fill out is a long forms like we're seeing at big tables and it's filled out and and the whole exercise was that day to look at how do we 10x our income what really needs to happen with our business to 10x and I had already 25xed my business from the beginning of this program so I am working on all the things that need to be done and I'm taking this out 10 years and then I asked myself a question what would I do at the end of those 10 years after I've hit these goals and I'm like well probably take a year off and I just do nothing I just you know enjoy myself and I start thinking about all the things I would do and then I was like huh I'm going to do all this work so I can take a year off what if I 10xed my free time now so I took I done like half the day had gone into this exercise and I took the form and I flipped it over and well everybody was working on their 10x program for their income yeah I started running out how I would 10x my free time and at the point I was doing this exercise my entire year was booked out so but the next year wasn't fully booked out so I started going through the list of things that would have to change in my life to not work the next year and you were about 46 at this point yeah roughly yes about 46 years old now I came home from that coaching program and I didn't say to my wife oh I've worked on this program to 10x my free time what happened was in bed Alicia said to me what do you want for your birthday and I'm like you know what I want for my birthday I want a year off and she's like what do you mean and I'm like well I she's like you mean you don't want to write more books like no number books what about do I did this today show everyone what about the today show no no more today show what about the speeches no more speeches what about your office and all the people in there well I'm like they can stay there but I don't want to go there anymore I want a year off and she said well what would you do I'm like I don't know I could wake up take the kids to school and then I could go to the gym they could meet a friend for lunch and I could pick the kids back up for school like yeah life like that that our life looks looks kind of fun yeah um and she's like huh all right well can we afford for you to do that this is a classic moment too I go you know I was thinking about if we if we cut back on some of these expenses and she goes wait I didn't say anything about us cutting back on our expenses I want to know can we afford for you to not work for year and I said yeah we can afford for not work for year and she's like then you should do it so um um and then the way the world works is everything starts to show up in your life to make that happen yeah I mean like literally I had this amazing try back a condo that was my office was in which I I didn't really think about selling it but it was on my list like what do I do with this big office you know because maybe I can downsize the office and move them in a smaller office I get a phone call the next day I have a buyer for your condo for my broker I got it's not for sale she's like I know it's not for sale but they really want your unit would you show it to them and I literally got a Roxanne I go here's the price that I want for this condo and so much more than than when it was what it should have gone for and she's like oh that's really high but they really want to see it she comes and she looks at that condo the next day and she says okay well here's what they want to offer you I'm like no no you didn't hear it said that's the price and they turned around that day and said okay we'll take it wow and so like one by one all this stuff just lined up for me and then I took that year off now I will say that taking the year off was the scariest thing I ever did I was terrified stop working because I had worked so hard my entire life you don't know if you can get off what happens if you stop right and what were you terrified of specifically like I'm sure it was many things well then I'll tell you the best way to answer this question is it came out of my son Jack's voice so you fast so you I've stopped working it's January first I'm about 10 12 weeks into this sabbatical yeah and I feel the best I have felt in years like I feel 10 years younger I'm sleeping again I'm sleeping through the night I'm I'm not stressed I'm basically glowing and bouncing down the street and so I am bouncing down the street like a little kangaroo and I'm here with Winnie the Pooh my son and Winnie the Pooh my son says you know I'm like ticker point one one one dad's all excited and happy taking my son to school is in fifth grade and and he says to me dad dad do you ever worry now that you're not working and you're not writing books and you're not going on TV shows and you're not speaking do you have a worry that you'll never be able to do that work again then that no one ever will do anything with you and they won't make it won't make any money and then and that that's just it I I just go like oh I'm coming from a fifth grader right I'm literally Winnie the Pooh with his wisdom like I'm I'm I'm walking him to school and I just go oh my god god okay that's funny I get it because literally it was like every fear that I had yes got voiced through my son yes so hearing him say all my fears out because those were all my fears yeah absolutely how will I ever get you know well I'll be able to come back with relevance and if it happens to be taking you're off and yeah um people you know what what happened was uh I got re-energized you know what happened is instead of like reducing my battery I replaced my battery and then from there I went off and became vice chairman of financial service company and then I updated four of my books and then I co-founded another financial service company and um um you know my last 12 13 years have actually been remarkable be impactful yeah maybe even more impactful in some ways than what I did before that sabbatical and then I took another break I went to Florence Italy and that was going to be a one year break yeah and you know we were going to go for nine months now I've lived in Italy for six years yeah no I remember that because I think I was coming on your show when everything is figure outable was just about to come out and you guys were it was like you were using the book to figure out remember there were like things with your visa process in your family and it was just like wait how are we going to do it to remember that oh my god do I remember that because first of all you were my last thing that I did before I moved correct supposed to move yes we everything was done apartment sold we up new apartment in Florence yep kids in school only thing missing was the visa we even had the plane tickets yeah and that was like a Wednesday and we're supposed to leave on a Friday I remember and um all came through we got the visa and everything is figure outable yeah everything is figure outable and um we got on that plan and we went to Florence and you know part of that was also I was writing the latte factor talking about Zoe Daniels taking these sabbaticals and the power of taking a break and I say in that book and I'm about to leave for Italy yes and you know what happens in life when you make these decisions is then things just your world changes right and I didn't know we would move there and stay there um but it's changed our whole life and change my kids life and so it's been six years now um and so I have a couple more questions on this like first what does your life look like now and then where there any want to call the mistakes but like looking back because you've you've made a couple big shifts like taking your office something that is so exciting and many people will never you think that they can do give them self the chance to do set it up so they actually do it but then this longer break and I want to talk about that as well is there anything that you wish you knew or that you you feel like oh God you know and we've talked about this for myself it's like what what lessons would you want to pass on before someone makes a big shift like that well yeah okay so first of all there was two years of planning that actually went into it yeah right like wasn't just like oh we should do this yeah there was a lot of planning involved and partially because the kids we were intentionally going when my son was going to be a sophomore in high school we felt that was the one year we could take him out of his high school here and then come back so there's a lot of planning I think planning is really important everything's easier when you plan it right and then the second thing I would say is you know we went there we moved into a furnished apartment right so everything's done and we went there each with two bags so all of our all of our stuff was put in storage from New York and the freedom that we had when we moved to Florence where we just basically brought our bags into this apartment unpacked and then started traveling that that the beauty of that first year was because we were so unencumbered with anything there was a lightness in their freedom to that first year that was just remarkable you know everything was exciting we were making all these new friends there wasn't things weighing down on us not truthfully that's kind of continued our life because we realized that our life needed to be about experiences and not stuff so somehow we have accumulated stuff in our apartment now but but the mistake we made was you put all our stuff in storage and we didn't think we were coming back in a year yeah I mean we thought we were coming back in a year and you know we're the classic thing where you stick stuff in storage and it just stays there yeah and then you just pay for it yes you're just like it's like burning cash and it's just hanging out you know and then COVID happened and prices went up and yeah and I would the prices would go up on the storage units oh my god people these storage units aren't saying and especially in New York yeah and I would say to my wife like get this stuff out of storage yeah and she'd say oh but I don't even know what's in there anymore and I'd say then just throw it all away and she'd say but there's a lot of stuff in there that's good and I'm like it's been five years and and and the bill and this bill would in the bill would be on my card and I'd see the bill and I get pissed yeah right of course and so every month I'd be like when are we getting this stuff either over here or getting rid of this stuff and eventually she moved it to her card so I would see it that's hilarious but then I'm like so I think the lesson is good less for you but storage man just get rid of the stuff we all the way ship the stuff over yeah and you know it just the stuff doesn't matter if you've got stuff in storage for two or three years just dump that stuff yeah yeah okay so that's really good so you know you mentioned in the book especially in the Q&A section like you've worked nonstop from 18 through your mid fifties and you're like now I'm done with that pace and I just I want to tell you how inspiring it is because first of all there are so many different flavors and ways to do life right that's the beauty and the magic totally of our world and I know for me sometimes I've found it like super super inspiring you know you'll see someone like I was watching that great series lived to a hundred David damn butiner right and there's these incredible like you know doctors in their 90s and you don't even mean they're like they have the purpose and they're doing that and like that's awesome and I'm like amazing praise mother fmb awesome and you're one of my first and only friends and colleagues who's like actually here's another flavor here's pistachio where it's like I have worked my ass off through this and I'm done with that pace so you wrote to me in our in our email exchange you're like this is my final round of podcast Marie this is it I am done after this book launch it'll be super emotional and special to do this show with you so I wanted to ask you how did you come to that truth for yourself like how did you know that this one was it and I don't know if it relates to the past six years of you being in Italy and really immersing yourself in a whole different lifestyle anything that you want to say about how you came to know this truth because from my knowing of you it's not a decision it is a knowing it's a truth inside oh now you give me chills as I think about this um you know the way this whole jury started is a long long time ago from me and it started because my grandmother which will kind of bring this full circle because my grandmother rose back who I smart women finished which is based on her story when my grandmother had a stroke she was 86 and when we moved her from Laguna Beach up to where we live in the Bay Area put her in a nursing care facility and she'd had a stroke but I didn't know she's gonna die and I just sort of thought she's gonna get better right and so I was in the hospital with her and I was finishing smart women finish rich and I was like grandmother of the books almost books basically done are there any more life lessons the books dedicated to you anything else you want to share with me that I should share and she said no you've got all my wisdom you know you're in great shape and I said you know do you have any regrets and she said no and then the next day I came to visit her I said grandma how'd you sleep she said terrible I said why and she's like as I was up all night long thinking about my regrets and then she went through them with me and she went through five she went back to age 17 sharing the five regrets and at the end of the fire and she because she had a stroke it wasn't easier for her to talk this took a long time to have this conversation and she said um the lesson in my regrets is not what what I why didn't it wasn't this or that she's like the lesson my regrets is that what happened is in my life every one of those points I came to a fork in the road and when I came to the fork in the road there was a little girl inside me that wanted to go take the risk and then there was the big girl inside me I was like no rose go the safe route and she's like I didn't listen to a little girl and she said so I always took the safe route so though so that my regret is I never let my little girl come out and play and she said so what I what I wish for you is that you let your little boy come out and play she's like that would be my lesson for you is when you get when you get to those forks in the road you let your little boy come out and play and she's like you're gonna have the big boy and it's gonna be the ones like no don't do that do this and you know it could be your parents it could be society just give your little boy the chance to come out and play and I drove back to my office and I parked my office was Morgan Stanley and I parked in the garage and I broke down crying yeah I broke down crying and I sat there and I looked in the in the rear view mirror and I looked at myself and I said okay I don't want to work a more understanding more I want to go dedicate my life to teaching at the time more women about money yes and I looked at the mirror and I said to myself my little boy said three years and you're out of here I just that was my thing I thought okay it's gonna take three years to set myself up to leave Morgan Stanley to go teach yeah and it took four and it's actually you know like amazing to sit here because my grandma said well tell other people this lesson right like listen to your little boy listen to your little girl and the automatic millionaire was my little boy is like okay we have to get out of here and we have to go to New York yeah because the time the only I didn't know I didn't have the book idea for the automatic millionaire when I was at Morgan Stanley I just had the idea I wanted to move to New York so I could do national TV because it was before podcasts yeah and everything was about television and I needed to be here to get booked yeah and be on these shows yeah and so if I didn't move to New York it was just so hard I was flying back and forth to go do these television shows like the view but today show wasn't having me on and I'm like I got to move to New York and so my little boy convinced my big boy we're not listening to you we're going everyone and try to convince me to not do this they flew me to New York to meet with the president of the retail division of Morgan Stanley who said me in his huge massive office David we really like you are you sure you want to leave and I said yes and they said you're sure because most people would like to be where you are right now you have the ultimate career at this point you're set and I said I'm sure and it's okay well if you're gonna leave them we'll hire you to go train all of our financial visors and then I took they took me on a tour around the country to do smart couples finish rich but I moved you without this book idea and then the idea came to me and and so my little boy was able to get the automatic millionaire out into the world because I wanted to teach millions of people to pay themselves first one hour day of their income and so I've listened mostly to my little boy these last 30 years yes but I've also worked my little boy it's ass off and what's interesting as you talk about listening to your soul is that what happened what led me to write a decide to update this book was a kind of like a moment decision I was like you know what I got all this money and I can buy back all my publishing rights it's actually how this happened maybe I can buy back all my publishing rights and I'll just give these books away because I'll go right and go I'll go do a deal and I'll go have make make this an ebook for like 99 cents like I already did the work let's get this book and more people's hands so I called my agent said buy back all my books and she's like what are you talking about go well buy back the books we'll update them and I'm gonna give them away she's like you're kidding me right I'm like no I'm serious so she goes back to random house and random house six months go on and they will they will not they won't even give me a number so then I say fine let's just beg them to buy back the automatic millionaire I will update this book and give it away how much you want to pay for I'm like well don't throw a number out get them to give a number and you know I'm gonna leave you here today and I'm gonna go have drinks with David Drake David Drake was my first publicist for this book he's now the president of Crown I've kept all my friendships with everybody so we're gonna I'm gonna go have a drink with him and he's like I love you I can't sell you this book back it's just I can't do it it's not my if I could if I could do it I would do it but I can't do it I boss is two yeah but we'll update the book with you if you want updating we'll put out in hardcover and we'll come behind you and go help you try to help you help a million more people so I was like okay let's do that so in the process of updating this book I'm giving you such a long answer to this question and the process of updating this book I forgot how freaking difficult it is to do these books and my little boy was like dude seriously seriously we were just in verbiage skiing for 78 days did you see how happy we were what are you doing to us and my big boy is like no no this will be good this is good like we'll do this work one more time and my little boys like we're done all right new stuff you got that movie idea you have worked on in the year go work on the screen play you want to take a painting take a painting you want to be a DJ anything but talking about pay yourself first this is your last chance to talk about pay yourself first we've been doing this for 30 years yeah let's do something new yes and I kind of say that in a way to like be joking and funny but it's true and I'm like okay I want to meet me at 70 being proud looking back on the next 10 years that I grew and did new things yes I know it's not that this works not important to me because it's still important is why I'm doing it yes but I want to find out what do I look like at 70 having done new stuff yes I love that so if I if I'm hearing you right it was a knowing it was your inner little boy and he said no this is this is it and I think I think it's really important to to talk about this because I've had so many conversations with so many people who are feeling that doesn't quite matter exactly their age like they're feeling like oh there is something about who they've been what they've experienced what they've done for a portion of their livelihood that feels like it's coming to a close and then for many you know some people don't know what the next thing is and I loved I went to this some incredible experience and there was this reminder that I had read and heard before but I loved how it was phrased and it was like the small self thinks the higher self knows and anytime small self thinks the higher self knows and you could sub in divine self creative self sole correct yeah anything that kind of aligns or resonates and I just found that to be so true for me where anytime in my life if I am going through pro con lists do you know what I mean like oh what do I think about this and I'm kind of you know jockeying back and forth it's usually my small self which is most oftentimes rooted in some kind of fear a fear of missing out making the wrong decision you can kind of go down the list of fears but the creative self the divine self the higher self it is a knowing it is a knowing that is undeniable there is no quote unquote thought necessarily involved and it is just so clear it's so undeniable and you must follow it no matter what you know it's it's interesting to hear you say that because also we've had some similar experiences because you thanks to you and thanks to Lewis house I went and did the doctor Joe to spend a week long intensive meditation program yes love doctor and you know when you go and you get really into meditation you go and you learn how to go really deep yes you actually start to learn that there's a bunch of stuff going on here right like like well there's just so much more intelligence and there's so much more there's so much more intelligence and there's a lot of conversation taking place and learning who to what what are you listening to yes and what are you thinking about and believing so that it becomes and putting out into the world yes we have so much more power than we realize yes and so I think learning how to go to that place because some people are listening to us and they have no freaking idea what we're talking about and I think the one the reason why I taught what top personal finance yes as I believe that the number one reason people don't actually get to the point that they're clear is that they're so stressed out financially all they hear is that monkey brain of stress fear and anxiety yeah which is looping and looping and looping and looping and looping when any human being is in scarcity in their sphere of survival it's very difficult even from like a biophysical standpoint you get really narrow you get really focused because that survival based and so and as a habit you can stand you can stay in survival based mode your whole life yes even when you've achieved success absolutely and I see this with a lot of my entrepreneur friends who are very successful they're still afraid to stop and part of that's going back to this whole thing with the ego right because the ego is like wait we did all this work to be who we are what do you mean you want to stop right this is why a lot of entrepreneurs can't stop or entrepreneurs sell a business and they got to go start a new business and they're not always happy yeah you know it's it's it's it's interesting phenomenon what makes people highly successful doesn't always lead to a high happiness level well I also think too there's a great conversation to be had around sometimes and I always use this analogy it's like a container was wonderful for when you were growing in it and sometimes you outgrow the container and it doesn't make the container wrong the container is beautiful for the time and space that it is and was and sometimes when you're growing and you're evolving you need to reach beyond for a new vehicle and that can be really exciting so tell me what you're feeling right now is you move towards wrapping up this part of your adventure and stepping into a new chapter like what are the emotions happening inside of you they're mixed you know they're honestly mixed and it's interesting because Alisha asked me this question yesterday because I'm on a high because I'm getting to see all my dear friends like you and I'm getting to this to me is like a going away experience but I know you like you know I'm blessed because I know you were real friends we're gonna stay in each other's lives it's me so it's meaningful to me all the relationships it's really meaningful to me that I can still do this work and I'm also I think for the first time super clear like non-done yeah you know like I even I'll be like when I see David Drake today and we're like you guys can put this book on paperback but I'm not updating it because the thing is when you when you hear I've done 13 books it's not even true what I've really done like 25 books because every single time I wrote a book and then it converted to paperback that book had to be updated again yes some of my books have been actually fully updated five times so there are a lot of these books the automatic milliliters on it's fourth or fifth go no it's more than that it's on the fifth or sixth go around yeah and the beauty you know the nice thing is because it's financial it does need to be updated um but sorry guys this is it go get the automatic millionaire and enjoy this book because I'm not coming back here in five to ten years so since this may be the last time that we hear from you on this topic what is the truth about money freedom and life that you want to leave people with and you want them to know oh wow what is the truth the truth is that you can be free financially on much less money than you think that's probably the greatest truth and the greatest truth is that money is just a tool it's all it is money's just a thing and to me what money is a tool for is to free you so again living in Europe's taught me like people have a lot less money in Europe but they're way freer you know when we talk about sabbaticals I'm like yeah in Europe they call that a summer you know I hear up people just take the month of august off like it's just a given yes and I think um we're really busy working really really hard in the United States but a lot more of us need to get more of a life in our life and when you use money as a tool to start freeing yourself I think you get the opportunity to get more of a life in your life and most of the important things in life actually don't take money you know that's the other thing you need money and some of those beautiful things in life have nothing to do with money at all you know when you come visit me in floridge still haven't visited me yet when you come visit me in floridge I'm gonna take you on a walk everybody comes visit me I take them on a walk it is a loop and everything they're like oh my god this loop is so beautiful and I take you up around you know through these beautiful areas and I bring everybody out of my kalangelo and I take this church in Miyato and you can see the view of Florence and people got this it's just amazing I go I know and then how often you do this like every day every day I do this block as part of my day and that that walk is free you know and so I think um your life if you don't have money right now there's a lot you can do in your life that really matters it's beautiful you don't have to have money to have a beautiful life but having money frees you in a way that you don't know about yet and that's what I want for you thank you so much for all the years all the books all the everything you're awesome I love you I adore you I love wait I want you to hear this back I love you and I adore you I can't wait I'm so excited for this next adventure for you thank you having trouble solving a problem or reaching a dream well guess what the problem is not you it's that you haven't yet installed the one belief that changes everything everything is figure outable that also happens to be the name of my instant number one New York Times best-selling book and I want you to get your hands on it today because everything is figure outable is not just a fun phrase to say the book is packed with wisdom and stories and actionable exercises that'll make you unstoppable get your copy at everything as figure outable dot com that's everything is figure outable dot com