#354 Wrongful Conviction: False Confessions - Tommy Ward Pt. 2

Hey, Portlandia fans. Carrie Brownstein and Fred Armason here. The Dream of the 90s is alive in podcast form. We're launching Podlandia A.O. Rewatch, our brand new podcast where we revisit every episode of "Portlandia" together, breaking down sketches, going deep on our iconic characters, and pulling back the curtain on how it all got made. And we'll also be joined by the people who helped bring it all to life. Guest stars, collaborators, and friends, including director Jonathan Chrysel, the mayor himself, Kyle McGlocklin, legendary musician Amy Mann, and many more. Kyle is going for it here. You fully improvise not just words, but a song about it. I thought you were all going to write a song. I remember you thinking that. Listen to Podlandia, A.O. Rewatch, on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? I'm sports journalist, Ari Chambers. Hey, what's up, y'all? It's your girl, Sam Jay. And we're the host of "Everyone Watches Women's Sports," a new podcast from "Together and I Heart Women Sports." We're breaking down the biggest headlines. Naomi Osaka showing out. Shout-out to you, Naomi. The viral moments. I've been obsessed with Koshan Rock's boxing journey. She looks good. Her combos are swift. And the stories everyone's talking about across women's sports. Because everyone watches women's sports. Listen to everyone watches women's sports. On the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Nick Tutorial. You probably know me from NYPD Blue, the longest shot, or Spike Lee's Black Plansman. And on my new podcast, "Delivering Happiness with Nick Tutorial," I deliver pizza to a new guest. I've shared a slice with everyone from Seth Rollins. What are you doing, my belt? To Bill Burr. I don't think I've ever met somebody. So exactly out of their mind is I am. And now, we even have more great guests coming up, including the great John Tutorial. It's called "Happiness, Delivering Happiness." And many, many more. Open your free iHeart Radio app. Search "Delivering Happiness with Nick Tutorial." And listen now. Welcome to "Runkful Conviction False Confessions." I'm Lauren Eirator. And I'm Steve Drizen. Today, we bring you back to Ada Oklahoma for the second half of our story about Tommy Ward and Carl Fontanau. When we left off last week, Tommy and Carl were sitting on death row after police turned Tommy's bad dream into a murder confession. This week, we'll tell you about some serious twists in the case, from the discovery of the victim's body to the revelation of hidden evidence that turned this case upside down. We'll update you on everything that's happened since the 2018 Netflix series, The Innocent Man, told Tommy and Carl's story. There's been some very good news for one of them, and a lot of hope for the other. Steve, for those listeners who missed last week's episode, let's tell them what happened. And it got ugly fast. Tommy told the police about this nightmare he'd had about Denise's disappearance. And over a nine-hour interrogation, police turned that dream into a confession. They even hauled in Tommy's friend, Carl Fontanau, and got him to confess, too. But here's the thing, these confessions were riddled with errors. They named a third perpetrator who had a rock-solid alibi. They repeated the stories that police fed to Tommy and Carl without adding anything new. These confessions were obviously false. Now, going into trial, the prosecutors have two confessions that are odds with the objectively noble facts of the crime. But they thought they had an ace in the hole. And that ace in the hole was a single fact that both Tommy and Carl had told to police officers, a description of a blouse that Denise Harrowy was wearing at the time that she was abducted, a blouse that it turned out was missing from Denise's wardrobe, a blouse, which even the police did not know about at the time they interviewed Tommy and Carl. But based on this one detail in their confessions, Tommy and Carl were convicted of murder. And remember, her body still hadn't been found when they were convicted. Nobody, no bones, no motive. Nothing but a description of Denise Harrowy's blouse. And they are on death row because of that. That's where we pick up the story. Three months after Tommy and Carl were convicted, a wake-up call arrived in the case that was built on a dream. On January 21, 1986, a man was walking through a field in Gurdie, Oklahoma, when he found a skull under some brush. Police found more human remains spread across the field, and dental records confirmed a match. Finally, they'd found Denise Harrowy. This discovery produced a new round of problems with Tommy and Carl's confessions. Denise had been found uncloat 20 miles away from where Tommy and Carl had said they'd left her. Her body hadn't been burned at all, despite the fact that Carl had said they'd set around fire. And the medical examiner confirmed. Even though Tommy and Carl had said Denise had been stabbed, that never happened. She'd actually been shot in the head. It's like they're describing completely different crimes from what happened to Denise Harrowy. Both Tommy and Carl's convictions were reversed on appeal, but not because Denise's body had been found. It was because the judge ruled they shouldn't have been tried together. Prosecutors went ahead and tried both Tommy and Carl again, this time separately, but using the same evidence as before. When the second trial came up, of course, they had found her remains. And everything they found at that crime scene at Proof Tommy's confession wrong. Nothing was right about it. That's Tommy Ward's brother, Melvin. He's been advocating for Tommy's innocence for over 30 years. And the car host was a high. I mean, how can you ignore that she was shot back at the head? And here you got two boys saying it was she was stabbed. She was never stabbed. The evening corner before it states that. But believe it or not, the second trials were Dejavu all over again. Just like before, the prosecutors relied on the fact that Tommy and Carl had both said Denise was wearing a blue-flowered, ruffled blouse. The police hadn't known anything about the blouse that the prosecutors insisted. That fact couldn't have been fed. Imagine you're a prosecutor. And you have to stand up in front of a jury and present them with a confession. They can't tell you what happened to Denise. Who did it? Or even where the crime occurred? That's what these prosecutors had to do. But they did it well enough, well enough to convict both Tommy and Carl a second time. When Tommy heard the verdict, he began to sob uncontrollably. You're all liars. He shouted at the prosecutors. I'm being punished for something I didn't do. I don't know. I still have a hard time. I actually thought it would be a hundred to second. Confessions are hard to get by. People still believe that why did you confess if you didn't do it? So their confessions were similar, but they also was off. I'm not a lawyer by any means, but I could not see how 12 adult jurors could just ignore all the other evidence. And that's what they did. Had to have. Tommy was totally convicted on his confession. Them confessions sunk him. This time around, Tommy Ward and Carl Fontenot were ultimately sentenced to life in prison. That's been 35 years ago, plus 35 years later, Tommy's still waiting to get out. Tommy and Carl went off to prison to serve their life sentences. Years passed, and their appeals were denied one after another. Tommy was a kid that he'd taken strays, for instance, and while I mean by strays, I don't mean to just stray dogs. Like one time he found a hawk that had a broken wing. He took that hawk and nursed it back to health and let it go. And then a wife, for years, went and saw him every two to three weeks. Mama would literally go see him. Even today, he calls me every week almost. In prison, he got into the cabinetry, and the way I understand it, he's very good at it. It built prefab homes there. And everybody that knows Tommy, everywhere he's at. Even in prison, everybody likes him. He's a good Christian man. He's honest, and he just nodding him to do what they claim he did. Tommy had befriended Carl Fantano when Carl had no family or home. He wasn't much different from those other strays Tommy took in. In prison, while Tommy worked carpentry jobs, Carl pursued a different kind of woodworking. He taught himself the lonely skill of building picture frames out of toothpicks and glue, even though he didn't have any photos of loved ones to go in them. What's up fam? I'm sports journalist Ari Chambers. Hey, what's up y'all? It's your girl Sam Jay. And we're the host of Everyone Watches Women's Sports, a new podcast from Together and I Heart Women's Sports. Because let's be real. Women's Sports is giving us way too much to talk about these days. So Kelsey Finler, she became the first female solo roeer to go from California to Hawaii. My first thought is like, what's up with the snacks? Like, what do we eat? What are we eating? The highlights, the rivalries, the breakout stars, the moments to take over your entire timeline. And the conversations that start during the game and somehow keep going all week, every week, were breaking down the biggest stories across women's sports. Naomi Osaka showing out, she beat. Savalinka. Shout out to you Naomi. You get the palm Naomi! You get the palm for that. Because we're not just interested in what happened, we're interested in why everyone's talking about it. Because everyone watches women's sports, listening to everyone watches women's sports. On the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Carrie Brown's seen in Fred Armas in here. You know us or rather, you know them. Tony and Candice, Nina and Lance, Spike and yes, the chicken. We've played a lot of iconic characters over the years, but today we're showing up as ourselves to tell you about Padleandia, AO ReWatch, our brand new podcast. Each week we'll revisit an episode of Portlandia from the very beginning, breaking down the sketches, exploring the back stories of our most iconic characters, revisiting the Portland locations you know and love, and opening up about our creative process. How did any of this get made? Why do we think that was a good idea? We're ready to talk about it. Guest stars, collaborators and friends, including director Jonathan Kreisel, the mayor himself Kyle McGlockwyn, legendary musician Amy Mann, and many more. You fully improvised, not just words, but a song about it. I thought he was going to write. Listen to Padleandia. AO ReWatch on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Chelsea Hamler from Dear Chelsea. Every week the news gets worse. The world gets crazier. And Yamanika is here to tell whoever's responsible you're the problem. If you come over here to play games, I'm going to check you. Okay. If you do some in the news that don't sound good, I'm going to play you. Join Yamanika Saunders as she breaks down the week's most problematic stories on our new podcast. You're the problem with Yamanika. Do you know I just found out who Sydney Swini was? New episodes weekly every Wednesday. It's part of my new network, The Dear Chelsea Network. If he got a bunch of women, then I should have a bunch of men. Do better or do less. So I don't have to do so much. So join Yamanika each episode as she answers one question. Who's the problem? I'm Yamanika and I'm out. Listen to you're the problem with Yamanika on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. [Music] While Tommy and Carl sat in an Oklahoma prison, words started spreading about this mysterious case that was built on a dream. Two books were written about it, one in 1987, and a second in 2006. This was a case that captured the imagination of an investigative reporter named Robert Mayer, who wrote a classic wrongful conviction book, entitled Dreams of Ada. And then none other than John Grisham wrote a book about this case. This was the only nonfiction book Grisham ever wrote, and like he told us in the last episode, even he couldn't make up a story like this. Eventually Grisham's book, The Innocent Man, would be turned into a Netflix series, which was released in 2018. Finally, somebody was taking notice of starting to believe in Tommy's story. I mean, it's even gotten so far where I get on Facebook, people on the other side of the world. I mean, Ukrainian and places, Italy, wishing Tommy well and believing in his innocent. It's just pretty amazing. While journalists were telling Tommy and Carl's stories, the two men sat behind bars for decades, both still insisted on their innocence. They needed post-conviction lawyers to take their case, but any new legal team would face a problem. No DNA evidence existed that could prove Tommy and Carl's innocence. How on earth would any lawyers go about exonerating them? It was a case turns out that was made for the organization that Steve and I are lucky enough to co-direct. The Center on Wrongful Convictions at Northwestern University Pritzker School of Law. The purpose of the Center on Wrongful Convictions is to identify and rectify wrongful convictions and other serious miscarriages of justice. Here's the co-founder of our Center, renowned journalist, Rob Warden. We thought that it was important to have an organization that would investigate cases in which there was no DNA, but there was other persuasive evidence of actual innocence. Now, these cases are much harder to prove than DNA, but they are no less compelling. The Center on Wrongful Convictions was a first innocence project in the country that was taking non-DNA cases as well as DNA cases. In 2006, when the Center had been around for about seven years, Rob heard about Tommy Ward's case, and he couldn't forget what he learned. We wouldn't even have had a wrongful conviction movement where it not initially for vibrant investigative reporting. John Grisham and I had a conversation about the Tommy Ward case when he was in Chicago. The thing that was so striking about the Ward font no case was that the dreams conflicted with known physical facts of the crime. So we have this evidence that the dream confessions are false and that quite clearly the ideas here were implanted in the minds of both Tommy and Carl by the police. The case probably never should have been brought. It still has immensely powerful evidence of actual innocence, and that's why the Center on Wrongful Convictions got involved. And we've been involved in it for the ensuing dozen or 13 years. Still fighting. Now here's one thing that fascinated Rob about the case, and about Ada Oklahoma. Turns out Tommy Ward wasn't the only innocent man from Ada who was convicted of murder based on a dream confession. Ron Williamson was a minor league baseball player who had been sentenced to death based on a dream that he described to police about the crime. He was exonerated by DNA. So this was an intriguing situation for me. Of the 12 known dream confessions in the history of false confessions, we have two of them coming from Ada Oklahoma. This small 17,000 person town. What are the chances of that? It's like a cancer cluster. What's going on here is that these interrogators were hell-bent on solving high-profile murders, and they were converting dreams into confessions. This was part and parcel of their arsenal of tactics to break suspects down and get them to confess. And they were getting false confessions. If that other dream confession was false, if Ron Williamson had been exonerated, maybe Tommy and Carl could be exonerated too. Our colleagues at the Center on Wrongful Convictions partnered with Oklahoma Attorney Mark Barrett to represent Tommy Ward. Carl Fontanau also got new representation. Together, both legal teams dug into the case of Denise Heroway's disappearance. And what did they find? Not DNA, but they did find evidence of innocence that was equally compelling. A whole box of investigative reports that had not been disclosed to Tommy or Carl's defense, 860 pages of secret evidence. And the contents of those reports talk about a dream come true. The discovery of this box is a development that occurred after all the books, after the Netflix series, and it's a development that blows this case wide open. The prosecution that turns out as we now have learned had concealed a huge body of exalpatory evidence, including evidence cooperating Tommy Ward's alibi that he had been at a party with a bunch of people at the exact time of the abduction and couldn't have been involved. In that box, there was also a full recantation from Carl Fontanau, which he wrote just days after he confessed. There were police reports showing that the only witness who put Tommy Ward at Maconnelly's that night, James Moir, had completely changed his description several times of whoever it was he saw. But what about that blouse with the blue flowers and lazy collar? That magical proof that Tommy and Carl must be guilty because their interrogators didn't know what Denise was wearing? In that box, the lawyers found a draft missing person's report written by the police but never actually circulated to either the public or to defense counsel in this case. That report described the blouse that Denise was wearing on the day she was abducted. It said that Denise Harrey was wearing a blouse with blue flowers and lace around the neckline. And that report was dated one day after Denise's disappearance. That's months before the interrogations. So the police knew what Denise was wearing before they interrogated both Tommy and Carl. And there was more. In the box, lawyers also found an undated report of an interview with Denise's sister, which is probably where police got the information for the missing person's bulletin. In it, she described Denise as wearing a button-down blouse with small blue flowers that had lace around the collar and elastic on the sleeves. These are the same details, the same words that ended up in Tommy and Carl's confessions. Not to play on stereotypes, but what are the odds that these two rough and tumble dudes from rural Oklahoma would have described a woman's lacy blouse using exactly the same words as Denise's sister? This eviscerates the state's case. The one fact, the blouse fact, that put these men on death row, we now know that the police knew about it before they interrogated Tommy and Carl. We now know that Denise's sister told them about it shortly after she disappeared. Now we know it must have been fed to them by the same police officers who fed so many other facts to them. The anchor that police claimed was the basis of conviction in both trial one and trial two, you got to pull that anchor up. Because remember, there's nothing else in this case. There's no other evidence. It was the one unanswerable fact. And now it's answerable. The confessions no longer convict Tommy and Carl. The detectives said they didn't know the description of their shirt until after Tommy's and Carl's confession. Well, we kind of have proof now that that's not true. These detectives got both of them to mention Odell Titt's worst name in there. They added the description of the shirt in there. It was just much these detectives' confession as it was Tommy and Carl's. I guess that's the best way saying that. So much for the prosecution's ace in the hole. Police had known all along what Denise was wearing when she disappeared. Tommy and Carl were innocent. I don't know why I don't understand law or anything. But here you have a blatant miscarriage of justice because it's their job to hand over all the evidence to, you know, the defense, but the prosecutor attorney did not do that. That's a violation of their rights. When you put this all together, there is just no question that Tommy Ward and Carl Fountain know are absolutely innocent of this crime and have been the victims of one of the most egregious miscarriages of justice in the history of the United States. The confessions of Tommy Ward and Carl Fountain know are worthless. There is nothing holding this case together at all. Based on these new discoveries, both Tommy and Carl filed petitions for relief. Tommy and State Court and Carl in federal court. Carl's judge was the first to act. In 2019, he threw out Carl Fountain's conviction. After 34 years behind bars, Carl was released on bond. He's finally free. I'm absolutely delighted that Carl Fountain know has been released. Of course, the damage that's been done to him can never be undone. Nobody can ever make this right for Carl, but at least he is no longer in prison. And when he was released, he was welcomed with open arms by a new community, a new family, the community of exonerees from the state of Oklahoma. But justice in this case won't be complete until Tommy Ward is free. We're very happy for Carl. Tommy's a very happy for Carl. Of course, it shows hope for Tommy because a lot of the things that the federal judge it come out with also falls under Tommy's case. As of this recording, Tommy's still waiting behind bars for his judge to decide whether he can walk free too. Tommy's been waiting for that decision for 35 years. And God, we hope it's the right one. What's up fam? And we're the host of everyone watches Women's Sports, a new podcast from Together in I Heart Women's Sports. So Kelsey Finler, she became the first female solo roar to go from California to Hawaii. Like, what are we? What are we eating? The highlights, the rivalries, the breakout stars. The moments to take over your entire timeline. In the conversations that start during the game and somehow keep going all week, every week, we're breaking down the biggest stories across women's sports. Naomi Osaka showing out, she beat, sub-alinka. You get the palm, Naomi. Because we're not just interested in what happened. We're interested in why everyone's talking about it. Carrie Brown, scene in front of our misin here. You know us or rather you know them. Tony and Candace, Nina and Lance, Spike and yes, the chicken. We've played a lot of iconic characters over the years, but today we're showing up as ourselves to tell you about Podlandia, AO Rewatch, our brand new podcast. Each week we'll revisit an episode of Portlandia from the very beginning. Coming down the sketches, exploring the back stories of our most iconic characters, revisiting the Portland locations you know and love, and opening up about our creative process. Why do you think that was a good idea? Guest stars, collaborators, and friends, including director Jonathan Kreisel, the mayor himself Kyle McLaughlin, legendary musician Amy Mann, and many more. I thought you were going to write a song. Listen to Podlandia, AO Rewatch, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Jake Brennan. And on the Discretsland Podcast, I explore the wild lives of rock stars in unbelievable true crime stories for music history. These are the stories you haven't heard. The kind you'll end up telling someone else. Like the time Paul McCartney spent in one of the world's most notorious prisons. Imagine that. Your Paul McCartney. It's 1980. You're an ex-beetle. And you're doing time in one of Japan's worst prisons, right there alongside Yakuza Gangsters and for a ridiculous charge. Or the bizarre crime Lady Gaga is accused of. Who is the artist Lady Gaga is being accused of doing the unthinkable to after allegedly stealing her music in style to become famous? And what about that time Blondie's Debbie Harry escaped a serial killer? The man who had given her that ride she barely escaped from was Ted Bundy. Listen to Discretsland on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I would guess Tommy would be dreaming about freedom now. In this case that started with a nightmare, there are new things to hope for now. Doors opening, chains being removed, family embracing you and taking you home. These are the things that all wrongfully convicted people hope for. Until finally, one day, those dreams come true. I have more hope for Tommy now than I've had in a long time. For 35 years of knowing that your brother is in prison for something he didn't do, you want him out. We want him out bad and he deserves to be out. If there's any justice in this world, he'll be out one of these days. Fifteen years after author John Grisham started researching this case, he still speaks with Tommy Ward all the time and remains a strong advocate for Tommy's freedom. Tommy Price for me was not Price for him. I would say Tommy Relax. I'm okay. We're about you, so that's not the kind of guy he is. He has a long prayer list and he keeps a lot of people on that list and Tommy would probably go to work helping people when he got out, when he gets out. This is an innocent man getting out of prison. That's what should happen. Hello, this is a collect call from. Comments for. An inmate at Dick Connor Correctional Center. You may start the conversation now. Hello. Hey Tommy, this is Laura. This is Steve Tommy. Hi. Tommy, how are you doing? I'm okay. It's the same with prayers that it's not where we come into an insight. We sure hope so. Can you tell us how you pass your time these days? Well, I've been trying to keep busy. I do a lot of things. There will be a hobby crafts service for Christmas presents or birthday presents. I'm kind of kitchen-like this, you're doing that. You've had so many ups and downs over the past decades that you've been locked up. Do you allow yourself to think about what you're going to want to do when you get out? Yeah, I like work and I'd like to open up my own wood shop. And I always thought of a lot of elderly people were back to go in and maybe lower their cabinets for them and houses and stuff like that. Make it like a wheelchair accessible where they can say it home longer instead of going to a nursing home. Yeah, that would be a pretty meaningful work to do. Do you get letters from people who have watched your story on TV or who read the books? Yeah, I have some lessons from everybody that has written to me on a paper that they do get. So it's getting on. A lot of people care, Tommy. And just from talking to you now, I can see that you deserve every one of those blessings and a whole lot more. [Music] Tommy Ward is now 60 years old. Will he finally be able to reclaim what's left of his life as an exonerated man? We hope so, Tommy. We support you all the way. Your dream of freedom is our dream too. [Music] Wrongful conviction falls confessions is a production of Lava for Good Podcasts in association with Signal Company #1. Special thanks to our executive producers, Jason Flom and Kevin Wartis. Our production team is headed by senior producer Ann Pope, along with producers Joji Hammer and Jess Shane. Our show is mixed by Jeannie Montalvo. John Colbert is our intrepid intern. Our music was composed by Jay Ralph. You can follow me on Instagram or Twitter @lorannyrider. And you can follow me on Twitter @sdrism. For more information on the show, visit wrongfulconvictionpodcast.com. Be sure to follow the show on Instagram @wrongfulconviction on Facebook @wrongfulconvictionpodcast and on Twitter @wrongconviction. [Music] Hey, Portlandia fans. We're launching Podlandia AO rewatch. Our brand new podcast where we revisit every episode of Podlandia together. Breaking down sketches, going deep on our iconic characters, and pulling back the curtain on how it all got made. Guest stars, collaborators, and friends, including director Jonathan Chrysel, the mayor himself, Kyle McGlockwyn, legendary musician Amy Mann, and many more. Listen to Podlandia AO rewatch on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. With the fam, I'm sports journalist Ari Chambers. And we're the host of Everyone Watchers Women Sports, a new podcast from together in iHeart Women Sports. We're breaking down the biggest headlines. Shout-out to you now. The viral moments. She looks good. And the video app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Nick Tertoro. And on my new podcast, Delivering Happiness with Nick Tertoro, I deliver pizza to a new guest. To Bill Burr. I don't think I've ever met somebody so exactly out of the amokers I am. And now, we even have more great guests coming up, including the great John Tertoro. It's called Happiness Delivering Happiness. And many, many more. Open your free, high-hard radio app. Search Delivering Happiness with Nick Tertoro. And listen now.