21 – Best Notes, Part 2

[Music] Welcome to Imbrave beat by beat, I'm Curtis Rutherford. I interviewed a whole bunch of different improvisers and then edited together chunks of those interviews to investigate different aspects of Imbrave, one piece at a time. This is episode 21, Best Notes Part 2. The first best note episode is one of my favorites. It feels like a good thesis of what this podcast is about. Lots of different advice from many different perspectives. There's also something about advice that great improvisers remember. It's like a built-in filter to take out the vague crappy notes. You know the notes that are just like, "Do more characters." The notes people sometimes give just to fill time or to feel like they're giving notes. So that question, "What are some of your favorite notes?" Has become one that I've continued asking each person I've interviewed. So here is Best Notes Part 2. First up is John Timothy. What is one or what are some of the best notes you remember receiving? Oh sure. I remember, oh, burned in my brain. You'll case me in my 201. He told me after some scene, "John, you need to stop acting like such a fucking cartoon all the time because you'll never be funnier than a cartoon. So you should stop trying and you should start learning how to be like a funny human." And the world shrunk to a small tunnel, a dot of light, and I shambled back to my seat because I very much respected him and wanted to please him in every way. And he was right, because I took 201 after four or five years of short form in high school in college. So I was like, "Oh, I'll show these people how to do this." And everything was like, "Yuck, yuck, yuck, yuck." It was huge and nonsense. And I appreciate that note. I think I appreciate it at the time, but it really did. It was the first time that I really started to be like, "I don't even really think I understand what he's saying, but I have to push in that direction because he's right." Like, I don't know what he wants from me, but I know he's right. The other one was, I had a couple, like, explicitly for improv or comedy or. Improv or comedy, yes, sure. One was, I was on a team out of my 401 and long story short, like, they weren't great. To the point where, like, I think during our first show, I had to initiate six of our eight scenes, not because I was stepping out to, like, do it, but just because, like, "Woo." No one did. And that develops that habit. So eventually, in some rehearsal with them, I started developing this bad habit of, like, trying to correct them and trying to, like, make things how I want them because, factually, I wasn't wrong, but there's little ego as you can, but, like, actually, sure, I probably was right, but it came off as, like, judgy, and it came off as, like, me trying to correct. And then, I think, eventually, it was Eric Dyes, like, during some group games, like, "Hey, you weren't wrong, but, like, why don't you make their thing work?" Right. Why'd you add that other thing? Why'd you add your thing?" I was like, "Oh." Because the answer was because I thought mine was funnier. Yeah. And that's the wrong answer, you know what I mean? That's, like, I got caught, and he saw it, and I thought it was being so smooth, but I wasn't. Yeah. What else? Oh, and then I just remember, Caitlin Bitsagai, at some point, told me that thing about, like, that there's no one whose job it is to tell you you're good enough to do the thing you want to do. And so you should just write the sketch show or put up the show or put the thing. Because I think a lot of people, especially coming out of college, or, like, you know, even, like, high school, are used to very real gates and very real, you know, like, well, once I accomplish this, then I will be qualified for this, and I'll have this certification or something. And I think it's kind of, people get whiplash kind of coming into, like, the real kind of, like, we're not rough and tumble, but kind of, like, very amorphous world of, like, comedy and, like, comedy achievement where it's just like, well, you just, people like a thing if you do it, and it's good. So why do, so just do the thing? And if it's bad, well, no one will remember it. So, then you know, maybe make a better thing next time. Yeah. One of the things my girlfriend will often remind me of is let them say no to you. Don't say no to yourself. Like, I will constantly, like, I'm not going to ask this person to do the podcast. I'm not going to ask this person to do the show or to do a show on the, because they're going to say no. And then almost always when I ask everybody's so happy to be asked to do anything or to help somebody else do anything. But yeah, the impulse is like, no, rather than just like, let me do it. And then it's on them. Yeah. If it's not the right time for this, yeah, show to exist in the world, right? Then whatever. Right. And then we get it. Like, I think it's endemic to the community because I mean, surprisingly enough, I don't think a lot of people got into comedy because they have incredibly healthy senses of like self and self-esteem, like, you know, develops as you get older, certainly, hopefully. But like, you know, it's like, everyone's kind of got a little bit of a chip on their shoulder about like, I don't want to put myself that out there. And I think the people who really succeed or people who kind of get over that are never really dealt with it, you know, because they just do the thing and they ask the thing and they get the thing and they, you know, keep moving. Yeah. That was John Timothy. Just do the thing. Start working on that improv form you wanted to try out. Email that person you wanted to collaborate with. Set up the group that you wanted to make. So many people are out there waiting to be asked to do something, but not actually taking the time to ask other people to work on the projects they have in their head. The people who succeed or the people who try, they're the people who actually bother to set things up and to follow through with them. So to reiterate, Caitlin's advice, via John, make your thing. Do whatever it is that you've been meaning to do or to ask because there's someone out there just a bit more mediocre than you are, but who has no compunctions at all about asking for what he wants on the other half of that. If people aren't asking you to do things, there's a good chance it has nothing to do with you. There's so few people out there doing the asking and many, many people just waiting to be asked. So, it pays off to be the person doing the asking. On the one hand, it makes it more likely that people will ask you to do things down the line because they will have seen you or worked with you in something, etc. But there's no guarantee that including someone in something you're setting up will mean that person will necessarily include you in their later project later on. And it doesn't have to. But it does mean that you'll get to create the thing that you wanted to create. That feeling of not being asked to do things never really goes away. You're always going to notice what other people are getting that you're not. Nearly every performer you see, if you mention his or her accomplishments, will brush them aside by saying, "Oh, sure, but I don't have this. Sure, I'm on Lloyd Knight, but why aren't I on Harold Knight?" Sure, I'm on Harold, but why aren't I being asked to sit in on more weekend teams? Sure, I'm being asked to sit in, but why not join weekend teams? Sure, I'm on a weekend team, but why not ask cat? Sure, I'm on Ask Cat, but why aren't I being asked in this show? And so on and so on and so on. I started this podcast in part because I wasn't being asked to do the UCB Longform podcast, which I thought was an oversight on their part. I mentioned the idea for the podcast to some of the guys on Sleuth, my old Harold team, and they said, "Yeah, that's a great idea. Do it, make it." And so anyways, stop waiting to be asked and start asking. What next is Beth Appell? By the way, she is going to mention a spank at one part of this. A spank is an audition show at UCB for an improv or sketch show in hopes of getting a regular run at the theater. Here's Beth. What is one of or what are some of the best notes you remember receiving? Well, with Harold, I think something that was really. it sounds dumb that this was eye-opening for me, but it was, with Harold, the idea of starting really grounded, and not acting super goofy or crazy or wacky. That goes along with justifying as well. It's like, "Okay, so you did pull directly from the opening with that insane initiation because your group is doing an organic opening where you just run around for no reason for four minutes, but you're not going to be able to play that scene. So you have to start more grounded. Starting grounded is a big thing for me." Another good note I got was from. So after I got taken off, Harold, and had auditioned a couple more times and still not gotten back on, I got the note of. You look like you're trying to win your scenes. That was probably the best note I've gotten, because in my mind, that's not. Well, obviously, no one goes into a scene thinking they're going to win it, but I was like, "I totally get how I come off that way." I get that it was just like, "Build your scene with your scene partner. Don't try to win it. Don't try to be like the funny part of it." And that also goes into. When I started, I was really hell-bent on like, "I have the idea for what the game is in this scene and we're going to play it, and I'm going to force you to play it versus. You don't know what I'm giving you, and so I need to change gears. I'm not going to win this scene." So don't try to win this scene. Was a good one. Nate Dern told me that. And try to think if there's any other good notes that I've gotten. I've one that I just remembered that I got from Will Hines, which was, again, he probably said this better, but it was something like, "Work on the middle of your scenes." Like he was like, You initiate well, there's like playing, there's like, oh, there's a first couple of moves, and then my scenes were just dipping. And he was just like, it was just the analysis of, you had set it up, it was fun, you were on board with your scene partner, and then adept. - Yeah. - Keep having fun with that thing. Keep exploring that thing and pay attention to that middle part of scenes. And I was like, oh yeah, I guess I only think of, initiate, and then find an edit. - And then yeah, and then at some point, in the future, you'll end the scene. - Yeah. - Yeah, another good thing was, oh, don't be a fun killer. I won't say who this coach was. - Sure. - You weren't in that Roshamon group, were you? - I was. - You weren't in Roshamon? - I was, I don't know if we were in it at the same, 'cause I think I replaced Mayor. I think we were in it. - I was in it the whole time. - Oh, okay, then yeah, we definitely were-- - I was a lifelong Roshamon. - Yes, okay, yes, 'cause I think I replaced Mayor, so I was in it like up through our one spank. - Yeah, which, that's-- - Which of course, we nailed, and people are still talking about the Roshamon. - This Roshamon is still running at the theater. So, do you remember, I don't know if you were at this practice, but we were doing scenes. The coach gave us an exercise to do, the coach we were working with at that time. He, it like, he like, just hung his hat, he like hit his forehead with his palm out of frustration, and he's like, yep, I wanted to see if I was right, your fun killers, you're all killing the fun. Just do the fun thing. Do you remember that? - I do that for that. - I'm gonna say that was Mayor. That was, that's how I remember. - You know what the first year was about. - That was when Mayor was still on and before I go, no, I do not remember that, but I don't doubt that I could have been that person. - Yeah, and then in group scenes, something good that one of my last Harold coaches said was just being positive. Just like find out what you like about the thing and do that instead of the negative. - That was Bethapel. Rashomon was such a fun form, and I really wish it had worked, but it always remained just a little too hard. There was always like one too many moving pieces that we let get in our way, and it kept us from just having fun and playing game. Maybe now eight years later, I should try returning to that form and see how it goes. Anyway, up next is Ashley Ward. What's one or what are some of the best notes you remember receiving? - One was the idea that like stick with the horse you came with, you know, like don't like be jumping on horses the whole time. Like don't try to have like four scenes happening in one. Stay on the path you're on. - Right, you're doing that scene, you've got your horse. It's, you know what's fun about this. - Yeah, don't keep jumping and trying out new ones and to see like, oh is this what the scene is? Is that what the scene is? Like stick to that thing and just keep doubling down, keep heightened, and keep like escalating what's going on to make it better as opposed to like trying out other things. Cause I think that was a thing I would do a lot, which is maybe why that's my, maybe I get on people because it's like, I see myself in them. - Right. (laughing) - That was definitely one. The other thing that I got that was really helpful was don't try and be someone else. In the sense of, I think sometimes it's helpful to like emulate if you're feeling really scared. Sometimes it's really helpful to emulate someone and think like, you know what, I'm gonna play the way Sylvia Ozil's plays. I'm gonna have that kind of quiet confidence and go after things in that way. So I'm not just good to like take that on, but don't take on that voice. It's taking on the attitude as opposed to your own voice is valuable and good and your experiences and what you bring to the table is why you're important. If you're a copy of a copy, that's not gonna get you very far. So I think that was really helpful. Like you are enough was the Martin Demott thing that like you don't need more than you. You're enough to like make it good and that was very impactful. - That was Ashley. I still have a hard time with sticking to that one thing. It's very easy to see the new fun thing to run for it. It's the same with writing. When you've revised something a hundred times and you change a joke just because it's new to you, but not because it's a funnier joke than what was originally in your script or whatever you were writing. You're just tired of the old joke because you've read it a million times. But stick with the first thing, it was funnier. Ashley also mentioned using your own voice and for a bit more on that, here is Jake Cornell. - I took a class with Keisha Zoller, which I think looking back was probably where things really started to, I don't think I clicked in that class and I don't think the notes that she gave me in that class, I applied during those eight weeks, but I think those notes were what led me to doing a lot of growth in the year after. The whole class was focused on playing with honest emotion, like really having characters that felt things in scenes and cared about what was happening and were reacting with emotion. And I remember I intentionally took the class, I was an intern, so I could pick which I could advance to the class I could take. And I intentionally took that class because I could feel that I was not a human. I would go to the back line after scenes and be like, "What?" No one acts out of it. What you just did was not human and not insane in a comedic way. It truly just was not a reality that would ever happen. - Right. - That improv, a hello, daughter, how are you? - Yeah, it was all about filling the scene with ticking the boxes and nothing real was happening and I couldn't break it. So I went to that class and she was so kind and patient. I remember so many times, she would push me and she would be like, "No, that wasn't real." I'd do it again and I still couldn't get it. And I remember her just very kindly looking at being being almost, you're getting there, but it's still not happening. And I was like, "Fuck." And I remember I think it might have been the last class, and this is the note I'm getting to. I was like, I was saying, I feel, I think part of it was my 401 note had been to play more characters and I didn't know how to do that. And so I think, and I was also still trying to figure out just how to do a scene. And I'm just saying to her, I can't figure out how to be someone other than myself in a scene and still act real and create everything around it. And basically I was like, "I can't do it in practice." I was like, "What?" I was saying. And I just, I remember, and this is probably like a very big bastardization of what she said because I've digested it for three years now and talked about it a lot. But the just of what she said, she was talking about when people do a community of $arte with like mask work. And she was saying there's two kinds of people with masks. There are the people who, when they put on a mask, they completely become someone else. They like, they're because their faces covered, they are self washes away. And they are able to completely embody a new thing. And then there are the people who put a mask on and that mask becomes a lens through which themselves is projected and like modifies it. And both are valid ways to play with a mask and choose. Like I think you might be the second where, and you need to figure out how when a mask is on, you can still be a human, still be yourself, but there's just a new perspective or a new twist. And that was what led me to understanding game. I was like, oh, it's not, it's just a lens that your character sees the world through that no one else is seeing the world through and you just can't let that go. And everything else, you can talk the way I talk, you can move the way I move. And, but in doing that and realizing, I think what I didn't understand was I was so focused on finding a game or finding the unusual thing that there wasn't a scene. And therefore there couldn't be a game because you need to have a reality, you need to have people who care about things, you need to have people reacting to then find out what is unusual. And I was so hungry for a game I wasn't doing a scene. And my characters had nothing to do. And so understanding, oh, it's about filling out the space and then just the one unusual thing, it's like, it's funny because the Quark Recon focus is so hard on game and in my experience, it's like, it's 3% of the scene. It's the most important 3% of the scene, but it's such a small part. Like everything else needs to happen and then that one little ingredient is the thing, it's like the catalyst, it's the reactor. It's like, you throw it in the potion explodes. But like, it was that note of like, you need to figure out how to live through these characters and then what is just the one thing that is unusual about them and just keep hold onto that. - So then in what ways do you kind of like bring that to scenes in which way and what ways do you tell other people like if you're coaching them, or that kind of thing to do similar things? - I think it's allowing it all. For me, when I'm doing it, it came from acknowledging that it was, or realizing that it was not gonna come from my brain. It was gonna come from my bones and it was gonna come from my gut. And then all my brain has to do is then like, think what does this feel like? So like making an instinctual choice when I come off the backline to hunch my shoulders a certain way or talk a certain way or react a certain way and doing that completely from the gut so that it's authentic. And then the improviser in me that's had all this training to then say, okay, this feels like this, or this is this and help to contextualize what everything is and then able to kind of move the scene from there. But I was trying to come up with the ideas in my brain first and then play them. And I needed to make choices and then react to my own choices. You need to constantly surprising yourself in playing like a real person. 'Cause in our day to day lives, we don't know what we're gonna do next. We just do it. And so I had to play that way as an improviser. I think the through line of all of my learning has been more about be as present as possible in the scenes and stop trying to brainiac your way out of the way. Yeah, just like live in the scenes and commit. The second that you bail and try to step out of the scene to contextualize it as like a smart improviser on stage, you're selling your scene partners out and you're thinning the reality for the audience. The audience is reminded that there are improvisers on stage not a scene happening. And it's such a bad instinct, but it's such a natural instinct. I wish that there was a way to address it earlier because I think I didn't figure that out until like two and a half years in. I was like, oh, like that thing you see sometimes of someone making like a really clever observation on stage isn't actually that helpful. It might make a laugh for a second and there hasn't maybe there hasn't been a laugh in five minutes. But if there hasn't been a laugh in five minutes, maybe live in the scene for two more minutes and then at seven, the audience is fully in this world. And then when they do laugh, it's like such, it's gonna be such so much richer and it's not gonna make anything harder for you down the line. Yeah. And a lot of that kind of like thinking we need to do that, I think comes from we tend to see a lot of, a lot of improvisers for a long time, especially we're like essentially like stand-ups. Yes. And we had that kind of like, oh, I'm a guy doing stand-up. Like not completely but a little bit of like, oh, something weird would happen. And I definitely do this and I kind of push other people to do this 'cause it's the way I see things comedically of like comment on that. Say that. That's not the only way though, but it tends to be that most of the way that we see on stage. Yeah. I don't think what you're doing there is necessarily bad or less like that other thing, but I think what the key is is, and this is the thing I really try to call it as a coach and I really don't like. And I think it comes from Poehaw largely, but it is perfectly great as the straight man or honestly another great note that you gave me once as a coach that I use that kind of offhandedly and it like cracked my brain open, whereas there's a thing, I remember Shannon O'Neal said this one's like on a podcast or something that like the same words don't work for everyone. So restating the same idea as a teacher or as a coach with different vernacular can help open it for me. And I think straight man, Crazy Man wasn't doing it for me. And you were one time think of it as actor comedian and I was like, oh my God. Like the Crazy Man is just the rest and he's like, truly believing the thing and the comedian is the one that's giving the context and I was like, oh, that makes so much more sense. But so I think if you are the straight man or the comedian, I think it really damages the scene if you are as the straight man flipping the reality or giving the context something that clearly the actor Crazy Man didn't believe to be true. That's a little, you're pulling the rug out from your scene partner a little bit and you might be making something really funny, but it's a lot of work to put on the Crazy Man then to now figure out, oh, that's not what I believed when I made this initial choice. Now I have to figure out what I believe now to make this choice true. I think if we've agreed on a reality and you as the quote, quote, straight man or the comedian are able to live just as much as an actor in that reality of that scene that we've agreed on and in the context of that scene tell me why is this unusual and funny? That is so valuable. That is the line. I think that's what happened is they, 'cause they look the same, that it's the same person standing on the stage and it's the same tone of voice and it's the same line delivery. But one is flipping our perspective on what we thought was true and one is just confirming the reality that we've been in for a few lines. Does that make sense? Yes. I've been waiting so long for somebody to just tell me that one of my notes was great. (laughing) But yeah, a big part of why I was thinking of it that way at the time was the like, oh, we just need to explain things to the audience. Yes. That's the goal of that voice of reason person is just to say like, that person seems crazy. This is why it's so funny to us. Yes. That was Jake Cornell. You have spent your entire life, whether you've realized it or not, developing your comedic voice. Every time you've said something funny that your friends or family have laughed at, your brain said, oh, let's keep doing that in that same way. So don't lose that just because on stage, you happen to inhabit another character for a bit. Let that character respond closer to how you would. Use your voice, whatever that voice is, on stage. It's a voice you've spent many decades developing. So don't throw it away. Up next is X-Mile. What are some of the best notes you remember receiving? Oh, that's good. Sebastian Cannelli, Cussing at me, which is so good. And let me be clear, he does not just go around Cussing at people. Him and I have that type of relation. Because he can actually got a fucking hold of it. You got to wait, you got to fucking wait. And we talk to each other like that. So he would never just go up to, I don't want you guys to think, oh, yeah, that's the man who Cusses. He's going around fucking Cussing at people. Like, he knows he can talk to me like that, because that's how I receive things that I want to stray forward. And, you know, so if you see me, just Cuss at me. [LAUGHS] But I'm Sebastian telling me to hold it to wait, because when Top Heavy really started jelling, and we really starting to be able to play with each other, we knew each other's strengths, and we started fucking with each other, and we would come out. And we just started setting up game real good. I got two excited. I was like, well, I know what the game is. And so I would come out, he was like, you got to hold those beat. And that's one thing, one of my grabs with the hair was like, fuck, I got to hold it for a second. You shit. I want to take it there. Nero. You know? And then when you know you up, you're on a team with such talented people that it's like, yeah, I have this idea. And it's going to fucking kill. But as soon as I do it, and then Beth comes out, it's going to be insane. You know? So that was one of the best notes that I got. Mad Chap, I tell this all the time, and I'm going to say when I get Miami, Mad Chap, first person ever, and he is improv king. Saw him, saw him, jewel Frank Mariahs go, Bridget, Holmes, single handedly, save every scene at Nurse Jam for a year and a half. Love those people. But Mad Chap, the first time that I was really myself on stage ever, when-- because I used to play Stepper Moms. I didn't know how much black I could give, because I would always be like, "Timmy, should we go to the store? We're going to get some milk, get some cookies." But my mom was like, look, we going to store for fucking baking and don't ask for nothing. I will pop your ass. You just stay right by the damn cart. Don't move. Pick up a pop tart. Pick it up. Pick it up and see what I do to you. And I wanted to be my mom, my aunties, that just be making me here. Test the apple, touch it, get the grape, rinse it off with the water, taste it. Are they good? How we shopping across restore? So the first time that I really was myself in a scene, it got such a huge laugh and such a huge reaction. And I was really me at Mad Chap after I got off stage. It was like, hi, because when you first find game as yourself, not when you find game, but when you find game and you do it as you. And he's like, ex, he was like, what you did tonight? Do more of that. What you did. And I looked at him and like, I almost went to have tears in my eyes when he said that he was like, you did good. You did good. And that was after like a year of jamming. And you know, when no one ever gives you a note or no one never compliments you and then they do, it's so powerful. So that note I got for him to say like just like, like, be you, be yourself. Sebastian telling me to hold it. I had a Taminec one time. And that was when Terry where there's, it was so crazy. Terry withers was my favorite. I literally, in my head, I was like, I need to make him famous. I should start, you know, telling people why isn't he on the level of will Farrell? This man is a genius. He's so funny. And he was my favorite. And he was like, guys, I'm going to be missing class. And I was like, fuck this. This is stupid. Oh, the fuck we're going to. I don't want to fucking stuff. And so we, I go to DCM and I see take it personal. And that really inspired me to go for it with improv because I saw Natasha Rothwell who was a queen. She's, she's black, full figure like me, hair like me. And I was just like, she is insane. And Anthony and Taminec was in that set and he did not have a lot of Mike. There wasn't enough. So he walks out with a handheld mic. And that's what he uses the whole set. And it was till this day the funniest shit I've ever seen in my life. And he kept, they like served him up a game where he was open. And he kept taking his work home. So he kept being on his mic, talking to his dead men. And so I saw this man and I was mesmerizing. And then the next day I was fucking pissed who we're going to get in walks in and Taminec. And I said, oh, baby, what? But he told me to, he felt in during that class that I wasn't being genuine. And he was like, do you think his friend, I was like, no, he was like, I don't either. So don't do it. Unlike Alex Dixon telling me she was like, she was like, ex, did you come out? Did you have a premise? I was like, no, she's like, okay, go back right. You know, sometimes I'm just like, I want to do a scene with Tam. So Tom, I'm like, Tom walks out, I walk out and I'm just like, what's going to happen? I'm like, what's going to happen? So yeah, so those notes, I think, yeah, some of the best notes I've ever gotten where people are on, oh, oh, Spowe telling me. She was like, ex, it was really funny, but you didn't play game. And I was like, oh, fuck. Like, because, you know, I, and I have to be mindful because, you know, this is not to be braggadocious, but I am very charming. So I have to be mindful to do the work because I could really get away with like just being charming on stage. And it's like, and not playing games. because then that's not serving the team. But I make sure to have both, especially on Top Heavy. We were so fucking charming. Those are the notes that we would get. We got you two charming. But no, basically in a nutshell, say you two charming because she was like, you guys had a lot of fun. It was super fun, but we need a game in these. Yeah. And Shannon is just laser focused on like, this is what the game could have been. This is the game that you guys played if you played it. Like she knows that so well and is so good at picking that out. That yeah, she'll just strip away any of the bullshit. But she-- She messages like right after the show, she did beat by beat of what the fuck we did. I was like, bitch, I don't even remember the pattern game. No, she's mama bear and we love. Yeah. Oh, anything you remember? You mentioned Terry. Anything you remember that you got from Terry. Oh yeah, just to like fuck the reference in due top of your intelligence. Oh, it's so simple, but it's just like in group games. Whatever the first person does is do that. Yeah. You forget that. I forget that. Yeah. Because I'm like, oh yeah, I'm like, let me set up the place. I'm like, he got, okay, cool. He's like, no, if someone's coming in and like, he ha, it's just, you need to just, he, all your ass. And to the motherfuckin' cows come on. Somebody's gonna say it. Somebody's gonna do it. It's just so simple. It's so simple. We make it hard. That was X speaking of Terry Withers. Here is Terry. My best notes ever receiving. And do you mean in terms of like a note that helped me unlock something or a note that maybe I didn't want to hear but was important for me to hear and took me years to work through? Either, I think it's very obvious. Either it's Yon. I remember very early on I was doing a scene with my indie team, Smirk. And I remember that in that practice, I'm pretty sure. I know I did the scene with Hunter. Pretty sure Jen was there. And the pretty sure Benjamin Apple was there. We were just getting going on doing sets and we were pausing too much. Like we were too much dead space in between scenes. And Kevin was like, don't worry about if you have an idea, just come out and improvise. And it was such a crazy horrifying thought to me. And I remember that that practice I came out and I said, I don't know how I got here. I don't know how I found myself alone in this field. And it was awful. Awful initiation. But it also felt the way I want to feel now when I improvise. It felt like I didn't know what was going to happen. And it was my subconscious mind was doing it much more than my conscious mind. It wasn't pre-planned. And it was a great note for him to tell me that I need to move faster, not have a plan. I guess that's a pretty basic note. But it was a big one for me. And he also suggested at the time that if I was feeling stuck in a way, a good thing to do would be to adopt a physical stance that's different than the one that I normally adopt. And that helped unlock ideas too for me. That was a pretty good note. In terms of a note that maybe I found challenging, I remember being on a team years ago that had a lot of really accomplished players on it. But I would think it's fair to say we were maybe coming at it from slightly different philosophies and what we were trying to do. And I remember getting the note from Kevin's brother will that I needed to be more patient, that I was starting scenes with people and bringing things into those scenes probably by the third or fourth line that would define a game, and set things in stone. And a lot of times I wasn't initiating those scenes. That blew my mind. It was so hard for me. It took me years to really understand that note that I was maybe ruining scenes by putting things because at the time I was like, why would I get that note? I'm putting funny things in my scene. Like I'm making funny choices or noticing something that's funny. Or I'm like, you know, I'm doing this is like, this is funny. Why would I get a note telling me not to be funny, right? And it was just the best note for me because I was too, I didn't have enough confidence and faith in my scene partner that everything was gonna be okay, right? It took me two, three years to really process that note and then realized, I'm ruining scenes all the time. All the time I'm ruining scenes because I'm like, this isn't like, I'm not like, if it's not immediately clear to me what my partner's going for, I'm pushing stuff into the scenes. And that was terrible. It was a horrible improvisation. Turned out terrible at improv. And I needed to be a lot more patient and a lot more open to the scene unfolding the way it was gonna unfold rather than trying to control it and, you know, guarantee some kind of home run. That three or four line cusp of a scene is exactly where it happens. Yeah. It's that moment of like fear of, we don't have a game yet. Oh yeah, it's all fear based. And that's what makes it terrible. It's all fear based because not only in my disrespecting my scene partner and their talent and their experience, I'm also scared and people who are watching and can see that. And that's the, I think maybe one of the worst things to do to an improv audience is to ever show them that you're scared. Terrible, terrible, terrible, terrible. Great note. (laughs) I really like, I don't know who coined this mantra, but I really like, remember, don't invent. I think that that was a really, really great, a great way to think about improv, make sure you bring yourself in, don't worry about coming up with some humbdinger of an idea. So what's the difference between remembering, as opposed to inventing a scene? I just mean that like when I started a scene and I'm in a base reality, I tried to bring things in from my own life and instead of concocting some fantastic story that is worthy of the scene, people's attention. Believing that my life experiences are interesting and that I don't need more than that. So I can be in the scene and sort of answer things quickly without being inside my head and taking a pause before I add info. So if I find myself in a tough spot or someone's asking me about why I did something that I did or where I was or if for some reason I need to talk about what a character's backstory was, I'm probably just gonna use something for my own life rather than twist it a little bit so it fits the scene, you know. That was Terry Withers and now here is Merchand Montenias. - I'm thinking of them in chronological order. Which is I think in 20 and Cape Zolinsky gave me the note, you make good moves or like you have good ideas. So just like act on them, which I think was like a nice thing get off the backline. - Yeah. - Because it like is a recurring note. I feel like versions of that note of kept coming up. And then in like 401, at the end of 401 when they send you like that email that's like here are your notes. Or I don't know if they actually still do that because now you see your notes. - Oh, okay. - And they didn't do that was what I took for a while. - Yeah, oh boy, changes. But the note I got was for Marion Carroll's and it was like you have a good eye for the unusual thing and awareness of reality. Which I liked also that he phrased it as like both of those as separate things. And then think of the boldest you played in class and make that your new baseline. And then he said make your moves confidently. And I think that last one is one where I'm like, oh, that's like a recurring always note. - Sure, yeah. - Where if I'm like in an improv, or if I'm like, oh, I feel weird after a show, I'm like probably I didn't make my moves confidently. - With both of those, I like how they were phrased in terms of the like, this is what we're seeing that you're already doing, right? Like that's always so helpful to like hear of. Oh, I am seeing this, I just need to do more of it. - Exactly, I think with any notes, I feel like I want them to be actionable ideally. But there are certain notes where it's like it's hard. I think especially if a note is based on someone's confidence that can be really hard to give that note in a way that will be productive. And with that for when especially I remember feeling like at the end of four when I was like, oh, I don't know if I'll get into advanced study because I didn't do very much in class. And then like I think there was one class which we had like a sub for it. But I remember there was one class I did basically nothing except contribute to a scene painting. And I left and I was like crying. So I was like, oh no, I'm definitely not gonna get in and I don't wanna spend more money right now. But it was like, oh, this is a really productive way to phrase that note. And then a variation on that was in my first advanced study Harold class, Abra Taibat gave me the note and she gave us all notes like in front of the class after having this perform sets where we were like paired with people who she saw as having a similar attribute to us. So it was like, I think our class was like a very character, high energy group, very like smart game move, like very game oriented group. And then my group was like, oh, very supportive group. And what happened in our Harold was that we did not do, we like forgot one of our beats altogether because two of the beats were so similar. And her note for me was like, she phrased it as like a compliment sandwich or it was like, you're a bundle of light and you're like very fun to watch. But also you, yes, you're seeing partners in a very supportive way without ever ending by not ending your forcing people to do a lot of work to like make up for all the work you're not doing. That last part I think is now my paraphrasing. But it was like, yes, [BLANK_AUDIO] don't end. And I remember being like, oh, okay, I see how that's happening and how that's a problem. She also told me I couldn't play low status for three months, which makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I got the same note at one point from Gillows' area. Just like he made us do scenes where it would be, I should be the low status character that I had just constantly like you have to now take status. You are like all these other people are the president or like and you are the genitive of the UN, but you have to be high status or whatever it is. Yeah, it's such a funny one because I that's like that's definitely what I still get. It's like, oh, be high status more often. And it's funny. I think anytime I've like put more pressure on myself to be high status, I'll like start the scene high status and lose it so fast. Yeah. And I don't always know why. Sometimes I'm like, oh, do I just like not like the idea of high status people. Yeah. I think we also do come in with our own like this is my comedic take or what I think is funny. And I think like some people think high status is funnier. Like some people do think they're like kind of underdog is funnier. Yeah. On my old loyalty, hot spur, Keaton patty would play high status so often that we would make him the lowest status characters possible. And he would still like always like literally one time it was like you like walked on to a scene and we need immediately labeled him as like, oh, well, this guy, look, he's got all his belongings in a pillowcase. Okay, sir, we don't need you. And he was like, oh, I've got my belongings. I have the deed to the four motor company. And he was like the owner of four like it just instantly high status. Just like you can almost see. Yeah, that's so funny. I like I think one, this is also a note that I got, but that I think I like to give to people too, which is if you're playing a low status character, especially if people are like really dumping on them, like let them stand up for themselves. Yeah. Like I think that was one that like Amy Goer like gave me that because I was like, oh, I think I was trying not to play high low status. And so I tried to play high status, but I just it was like something what she was like, oh, it made sense for that character to be low status. Why wasn't it? And I was like, well, I was told I shouldn't do that. And she was like, that's fine. You can be low status. But like I think it's like you want the character to stand up for themselves. And that's so fun to be like today's the day that this character's done. And that kind of character's so fun. And a fair amount of time, the low status character becomes kind of the voice of reason to where it makes sense where that standing up also then gives more push back against on it if the other person the unusual thing with the with the confidence part. So you mentioned that that is like a hard it's less actionable. It is more just kind of like, well, here's an aspect of you. Yeah. Change that. So how did you change that or start to like a change change that in your change? Yeah. I think that's a good question. Have you changed? I know. I think it's changed gradually and slightly. But I think part of it has been trusting my teams, which maybe isn't like I would rather that it come from an internal thing. But I think a lot of the times it's just been like, Oh, okay, I can make a choice because my team will support it. And sort of trusting that. I think another thing is maybe this is another one where I'm going to start with it sounding not as actionable. But like I think trusting that like whatever it is that I am bringing will be helpful. Like I think I'm rarely going to come in with like a fully formed character in my head unless someone has gifted that or it was like pulled from a premise. But so sort of trusting like, Oh, my honest point of view or my honest emotional reaction could be enough. And then letting yourself articulate it. Yeah. The team thing is it's the baby bird being thrown out of the nest. Like you need that team to like have that different feeling of like, Oh, yeah, this is this is what it feels like to be supported. And this is what good improvisers or great improvisers feel like all the time because they're with other great improvisers. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's true. And it's like it's funny because I think I've been on different teams where that manifests in different ways. Right now with like party city, it's like one of the easiest ways where it's just like, Oh, okay, I don't know. They're just so fun. And a lot of my friends, it's like, Oh, I definitely don't have to worry about whether or not we're going to have something weird in a scene like we will. Yes. So it's just like being like, Oh, okay, whatever I'm bringing will be fine and plenty. We will have plenty no matter what. And I think with other teams, it is just like, just like trusting that whatever your place on that team is will be helpful. Yeah. And then I guess within a scene, it is still also trusting because I think my problem wasn't ever specifically like inventing things in a scene. But I think a lot of times you'll see that where you're watching a scene and it's like, Oh, they don't trust that there's something in it. So now you wind up with like three weird things because we have to find something. Yeah. So we have to generate it instead of noticing it. Any other notes that you remember? These are two different ones, but I think they're related in my head, which one is I did like a Shannon Noneal ASI and her note after like a specific set was like, I had tried to play like a, I think some sort of like big jerk in a scene and really like struggled with it. Like that thing where I just felt like I was sucking the air out of the scene. And she was like, Oh, like assholes are people too. Like play them like they are real people. Like no one who is an asshole thinks that they are an asshole. Like they think that they are right, which I think is helpful. And then I feel like variations on that that I've heard have been like even an asshole cares about something. Yeah. It doesn't have to be the thing that's happening in a scene, but they have to care about something. Which keeps those scenes from the gay, the unusual thing just being asshole. Right. It's like asshole who cares too much about blank is going to be a lot more fun to play in a second beat than just like, Oh, we got to see more of this fucking asshole. Yeah. Because otherwise it's like, I guess I'm just going to destroy everything. Which also isn't even like, that's not the way it manifests those people. But that was one. And then a sort of flips or not flip side, but like a related one was Alex sticks in while coaching a team I was on. I think we just done a scene and it was like, it just didn't work for some reason. But it was like not any huge thing. Like huge, obvious error. It was just like, why didn't this work? And after it was like, Oh, I think I almost saw it in your face that like there was a moment where you realized the scene wasn't working and you shut down. And I think it was like, Oh, this is something that I do. Ever so often where she was like, if a scene's going well, you like pick up steam. And if you don't feel like it's going well, you like shut down. And that's one where it was like, Oh, that's a big problem. And I think I'll notice that also with that type of character. Yeah. Where it's like, Oh, I don't like this character. So I'm just shutting down on them instead of like doubling down and figuring out what their deal is and like reacting as them and stuff. You've mentioned the like not invented thing, the like observed. You put it in a different way earlier. Was it observed? I think like notice. Notice. Yeah, exactly. How do you push yourself more into noticing than inventing? I push myself to notice things through like listening, which is so broad. But just I think a lot of the times if a scene's, especially if a scene's like going very quickly or somehow feels weird, just taking a second to like take stock of what has been said because usually there's already something. And I feel like a lot of the time we blow past lines because we're like, well, we have to get out all the information. And sometimes I think that's like regardless of whether it's premise or organic. It's like, we have to get out all this information. And it's like you've already said some things that either hint at or reveal what is already true about the scene. And so I'm like, this is such a, it feels like a silly thing, but it's just like repeating what's been said. It's so important. I think even this isn't a monocene class, but Kate Zelinski taught the before and after, which is like two monocenes. So especially if you were the second one, I was like, you've got to remember so much. But she used the phrase like Aaron Jacksoning, which was if there's a lot going on in a scene, and you just need to sort of like impose order a little bit on it. You can just in character. Obviously don't break, but just in character like kind of pause the monocene and say, all right. This is what's happening. And you're doing this. You care about this. Yeah. And also the weddings about to happen. But which I think she used his name specifically because she's like, he's so good at doing that in a way where it's still grounded. The audience can kind of tell what's happening, but also they're just like, yeah, this is great. And we don't mind that this is happening because you need to get back on track. And that happens, like in scripted things, it happens all the time. Like I've been watching the Americans and those constantly like, okay, so just to be clear, we need to get this thing so that this, like they're constantly reiterating plot points because audiences are kind of dumb sometimes. Like, we'll forget things. There's even that thing of like in a soap opera. They're the first 10 minutes of it will just be rehashing what happened in the last episode, which is over the top. But like, it means you can jump in without having any previous knowledge on it. And you can go so much crazier. It's like, he just fell down an elevator shaft, but he was just keeping care of that giraffe last episode. Right. And because you remember the giraffe, like, oh, I know the implications of this fall. You can't keep care of a giraffe after that. They're too tall. - Let's do tall. You're not gonna reach that high anymore. - Yeah, but it was that thing of like, oh, give yourself permission to restate things that have been said, the audience isn't gonna mind that you did that. I think sometimes it feels clunky or it feels like, I think people get like self-conscious about it. I think I had a coach, I don't remember who it was now, but someone said something online so like you don't need to do things in the cool way. You don't need to be like super-slime, the cool delivering information, just like get it out. - Yeah. - That was Maritza, and now here is Kevin Mulaney. - One of the best recent notes I've gotten was simply relax your jaw and breathe. And this is from my physical theater teacher, Paola, Colletta, so she just seems like such a stupid thing. Like relax your jaw and breathe. And what was she getting at? When you are trying to conceal how you feel, you clench up, you close your mouth, you tense up a little bit when you're trying to conceal your emotions. And when you relax your jaw and open your mouth slightly and breathe, you look more vulnerable and you are slightly more vulnerable because you can't hide your emotions as much. So I got this note in this class, and I was just like, okay, whatever, yeah, all right. And so I started doing it whenever I didn't know what else to do. What I was in the middle of the scene, especially as an actor, and I'm like, I don't know what I should be doing here. You know what, I'm just gonna breathe. I'm gonna relax my mouth, breathe, and see what happens. And I remember specifically, I was in this play and it was a three handed scene, and somebody was doing a monologue, and me and this other actor were watching this person do a monologue. I didn't know how I felt about this, so I just relaxed my mouth and breathed. (laughing) And the other person, I don't know what they were doing, who was also watching this. And the director got on the other person's case and said, you have to make a choice. Like Kevin is making a choice about how he feels, watching this, and I'm like, I'm not, and I kept it to myself. It was like, yes, I'm making a brilliant choice here, and but I wasn't really. But I used that a lot actually when in just situations where it's like, I just need to kind of relax in this moment and sort of take in what's going on. - That was Kevin, and now here is David Bluffband. - This is a weird note, but I feel like it's a note improvisers don't really think of very often, but you don't have to do any scene you don't wanna do. (laughing) You, I feel like sometimes you improvisers think they can be pimped into games they don't wanna be playing, but if you think the idea is funny, then you can have a million ways to, again, it's all a pitch session. If you're gonna like an idea that strikes you, you're gonna have a bunch of different things to say about it. And if you don't like what's happening, make it so that you do. You don't ever have to be forced into playing a game that you don't think is funny. You have to make it, find something that you like about that you can like contribute to it. Otherwise, it's gonna, you know, obviously it's gonna be fun for you. - In classes, I feel like that happens a lot with you like trying to make this guy as racist or this guy as sexist or homophobic a game, and it's like that's not a game. - Not a game. - Not unusual, not unusual. - Not unusual, yeah. - And certainly not anything any of us want to play. - Right, so then you don't have to do that. Absolutely. - Yeah. - If you don't like, I have shows and practices that I regret not in a pathetic way, but just like, you know, I'm standing up for yourself in a certain way, I'm like, oh, you know what? I'm not gonna do this because I don't think this is funny. And I think there, obviously you should toe the line with like how stiff you are in that mindset. But like, yeah, what do you think is funny? Like what, because you know, it's obviously a tricky thing. If you like what your scene partner is giving you, then that's great. Move, go for it. But sometimes you shouldn't play racist robot Andy. - Exactly, yes. - If you don't want to play that. - Yeah. - Because I-- - The more fun game might be why was I created to be racist? - Why was I, right? I have been reading and learning. I am so conflicted. I was just like, yeah, like what you can really put yourself in that part and be like, I remember Chris Gether told me that is a note of like, why did you do that? He's like, I don't know. He's like, did you think it was funny? No. And why did you do it? And he's like, oh, duh. - Right. - Yeah. - What do I think is funny? And that's like, yeah. And that's a big, and that's a big, that was a big, duh moment for me. And that was like, I wish. It's such a weird thing that people get into that mindset and it's like, oh man, yeah. That's the best note I think I've ever gotten. - That was David Blubband. By the way, that term pimping is one that's been around for a while when you force your scene partner to do something. - It's not the greatest term for, I think, fairly obvious reasons. It also doesn't really get at why gifting is good, but pimping, which can seem similar, is bad. So here is my suggestion for a term to replace pimping. Demands. You can offer a gift to your scene partner, but don't make demands of her. If I say you have food on your shirt, that's a gift. You can add to that in any number of ways and fold it into whatever we know about the scene and your character and expand upon what we know. But if I say, oh, you're gonna eat that foot long sandwich right now, then I'm forcing you to do something. Same as if I say, sing the star-spangled banner or whatever. I'm making a demand. So instead, I should be offering gifts. So instead of saying pimping, I've started saying demanding. Up next is Lindsey Calleran. - This is a great note or a correction or something, I don't know how to phrase it, but I still use it a lot. There was a really brief period of time before I stepped down from Torco and when Sean Dixon was coaching us, and I had never been coached by him before. And we did this exercise where that I love to do now, but it's where one at a time, people come into a boardroom meeting and everybody's late and they're like, sorry, boss, I'm late because blank. And you say an insane reason why somebody might be late to something. And then they react to you, you land on a justification and then you enter the boardroom. And once everybody's in the boardroom, it just becomes a monocene where everybody's juggling their own game. - And every reason for being late is unattached to the previous one. - Exactly, yeah, they're all just different justifications for unusual behavior. I had come in and said something like, sorry, boss, I'm late. I got really, he would always tell you to like, don't pre-plan what you're gonna say, just like say something. So I was like, you know, sorry, boss, I was late. I got really into, you know, like the clouds looked really beautiful or something and I got really lost in staring up at the sky. And through framing, we landed on this justification that was like, I like to create like narratives in my head and us and create a wild stories that I think I've been my head and I live in my own like story world or whatever, something like that. And the next time I made a move, it was like a wild, dehydening and not in a good way. And Sean stopped the scene and he was like, Lindsay, what was your first move? And I was like, oh, my first move was, you know, this thing about the clouds and the sky. And he was like, yeah. So do you feel like this move heightened from the first one? And I was like, no. And he was like, great. Look around the space and make a move that heightens off the first one. And I thought that was such a wonderful note of like just remember your first move for a second. Like just keep trusted me to do it too. Like he trusted me to get it, which was, I've had some coaches that like literally will tell you what to say and do. And I can't stand it. - I find that so unhelpful. - It's so unhelpful. And it's, yeah, totally unhelpful. - It's not portable. From like doing test prep, I think a lot of like, what are the things that when I'm not there telling you how to do this math problem or this grammar problem, you're gonna remember. And it's always process. - Totally. - And that process of, oh, I did something funny. Let me think of that funny thing again. I can repeat. - And knowing that like that I can do it. Yeah, trusting that I would have the tools, if he just explained to me sort of what mindset to go into and then he trusted that I would do it myself. And then I just remember him also like joyfully laughing at that move, which like really made me feel like, wow, I got it. You know, I did it. That was a really wonderful note that I use a lot. It's like, are you, do you think you're heightening off of that first move or do you feel like you've maybe gotten less, less specific and more broad. Another one also connected to Tor is Brandon Gardiner, who was our long time coach. This was actually came from when he was, we would teach workshops on the road. - Okay. - And we were doing like a practice session with Brandon about how to lead workshops. And he was like, you know, people learn better by having a good scene and feeling what it feels like to be in a good scene as opposed to finishing a bad scene and being told how it could have been better afterwards. So this is more a note about what we're talking about. - I think it's like, I heard Kevin say the same thing. And I think it's like, can be any puller said it. Like it's like definitely like one of those notes that comes down from the top. Yeah, cause Kevin says something like that too. And I have found that as a coach, it can be intimidating. And that also, it also connects to like being a director and helping to facilitate a good performance out of somebody. Is as a coach, it is more beneficial to coach someone into a good scene through side coaching, but also like hands off side coaching, like helping them to find it themselves. They'll learn more from that I'll see you next time. opposed to doing a bad scene and hearing the note afterwards, which is something I don't think I totally understood until I heard that from the first time, for the first time from Brandon. And it's funny now, because the other day we were talking about the role of shame in note giving and that kind of thing, thinking of that note of, yeah, when you're in a bad scene, I know when I'm in a fucking bad scene, I don't need the side coach of like, this is bad. It's like, yeah, dude, we need fucking no. But yeah, just getting that prod and feeling that, oh, I was so close to a good scene, that's what I needed. I didn't need anybody yelling at me and saying, right, they literally only need like a push in the right direction. And then you can trust that they're going to find it. And like, I love watching that moment so much. That was Lindsey Calleran about that aspect of shame in note giving for, a long while there was this idea in the culture of improv that hard notes were good notes. Some people still talk about liking hard notes or not liking hard notes. Your goal as a coach isn't to say things nicely or meanly. It's to be an outside observer. Say the things the people in the scene may not have noticed and give them the tools to deal with those situations. Telling someone that a scene was terrible isn't a note if they know the scene was terrible. Of course, if someone is doing terrible work but believes it's the best, then yeah, sure, call out the bullshit. But if people know the scene was bad, they don't need to be told that they feel that you've been in bad scenes. You know what it's like. Don't berate them for it. Instead, tell them the point that the scene either stopped working or could have been saved. That's what they missed. I just hate that bullshit macho idea of good notes are mean and cutting. Because that's not how people get better at something. You can't get better at something by being shamed into it. Especially not for something tough as improv. The other part I'll say, not for coaches, but if you're on the other side, if you feel like, oh, I'm not getting the hard notes, you're probably missing the notes you're getting. Whenever people ask for those like, oh, I want hard notes, I want more personal notes. Those notes are already being offered after the ends of your scenes. If you have a good coach or teacher or even a decent coach or teacher, make sure you're really taking in like, what could I have done differently? What are they telling me I should have done? Make sure you're not discounting the notes they're already giving just because you're hearing it in a nicer tone of voice or anything like that. You're getting those notes. We're all constantly getting those notes. It's up to you to internalize them. Now here is Rudy Barons. I'm sure someone else has gotten this and mentioned it, but I tend, especially when I was starting I tended to play straight man in every scene. Kevin Hines gave the note of like, you know, be a straight man, but let it happen. Find a reason to let it happen. Even if it's as simple as, well, I do want to be cool. All right. And he, in like a couple of sessions, was like, take the candy. You're saying no to it because it's not, you don't want it, but you have to take it to let the scene move forward. That was very helpful to me. Oh, I've got the best like, kind of overall improv advice note that was like the mind blowing one. Becky Dresdale saying, listen to your scene partner, like you're listening to someone you have a crush on because everything they say has so much more meaning behind it because you're trying to figure out what they mean. So if they're like, hey, see you later, like, do they want to see me later? Or are they like writing me off? What is it? And that was like, oh, yeah, like, don't just take the words for granted. What is the intention behind them? And what is the improviser saying to you, not just their character? But yeah, that, I mean, I think I stayed up thinking about that for days. Had a teacher. I even want to name names, although it probably doesn't matter. It was Curtis Gwynne. But he was like, you see, he's a school. And all the school's going to do is teach you how to be good enough at something. If you want to be great at it, you have to like, work on that on your own. Like, we'll give you the tools to be good. No one here is going to make you really great because it's a school and that's what schools do. And that really resonated with me because I had just dropped out a college. It's like, I don't need school. Improv isn't school. Yeah. And then he was like, yes, it is. We talked about not worrying about the suggestion too much. I remember Curtis Gwynne being like, someone was like, but how do we make the suggestion work? And he's like, you don't. It doesn't matter. And then he like, I don't even know if this is a great note on how to do things, but it is a great note on how to not worry about what you have to do. But he's like, give me a suggestion and someone said like, business meeting. And then he just initiated playing golf. He's like, it's fine. It doesn't matter. You know, like it made me think of something and I did it. Don't worry about doing things the right way so much. Sometimes it's really hard to answer a question because you just want to say, just do it. Yeah. Yeah, like Ari Bukit is being like, people ask me, how do I get out of my head? I don't know. Just get the fuck out. Yeah. And all you can do is just do it until you're out. Yeah. There's no mantra or chant. I subbed for a Lloyd team a month or two ago and they were like, oh, we want to work on making more moves on the game. And it's like, great. Let's do a scene. I'm going to let it go seven minutes. Let's see how many moves you can make on this game. And even with like walk on, they made like two or three in a seven minute scene. And then so afterwards, I was like, wait, name a move. Like I just went down the line and had everybody name a move then I went down the line again and had everybody name another move. And they all had moves like they're all. It's a very funny team and they're all very good players. So they all instantly had like two or three moves at the ready. Just none of them did it. Right. It's like, how do you do this thing? How do you make more moves than a scene? I don't know. You just do it. Go out there. Yeah, especially if that's the goal. Yeah. And sometimes it's good to be like, I know a move, but I'm going to hold back because we don't need 10 moves in a three minute scene. Yeah. But yeah, just knowing that you have that is pretty important. Knowing that you could make a move or just being constantly thinking about it. Instead of thinking about like, how do I initiate my second beat? I mean, like, what's going on here? What could I do? It's like, you know, it's like better to have a move and not need it than to move and not have one. That was Rudy Barons. Finally, here is Catherine Mudeau. I have my like, old school student journal. I wish I had brought that. Like the old, crusty one with the old, like, student, um, past. Did you take a bunch of notes like in glass and that kind of thing? Yes. I wish I had. Oh. Yeah, a friend of mine did during classes and he was like the only one. And then afterwards I was like, oh, yeah, why don't I do that? And then I realized, I can't. I'm a doodler. Like I couldn't take notes in college at all. I had to memorize things because I would just like, uh, all I have is just drawings. Oh, interesting. So it looks as though you're furiously. And really it's just like, I'm shading and I drag it. And then I would go back like, I don't remember the story. That's so funny. What are great notes I received? It's hard because I just really started out as such an excellent level. So there was so many notes. And you don't even know the garbage notes. Other people are good at it. I remember a 501 we've got there where he told this was more of a compliment than a note. Well, not somewhat because I wasn't again getting off the back line. But he said, I don't think you realize how hard you throw down. And that like, because I didn't. And it was such a like nice thing to hear, not consistently by any means, but to recognize like, oh, when I'm good, it's good. And so just to know like, you can be good. Just do it more like get out there. Just get out there. What else? I still have in 101, we talked about giggling and breaking have never been able to fix that. I can't. It's very hard. I'm a breaker. Yeah. I sometimes am too. And it's tough because the thing I, my feeling is, the thing that makes us break is the thing that is making us listen and watch as an audience. Because like I will sometimes say something and I hate this, but I will laugh at my own thing because I realize I'm seeing what the audience is saying and fuck I such a sense of them funny. Yes. Or you surprise yourself or tickle yourself. It's not like, you're not like pleased. But you're enjoying like the, it's really, yeah, it's so bad. Yeah, it is. It looks not, it doesn't look good. Yeah. I don't have a good way. Especially because like, yeah, I'll be like on my team now. It's like, yeah, Kelsey Bailey or Nick Garcia or anybody will like say something so funny. And I just have to like, I'm going to turn towards the back wall and pretend I'm looking towards the sunset. Well, because yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm mad at that. Yeah. When you're like teaching or anything like that, are there any like, oh, this is a quote from somebody else that now I parrot overpeat to my students. Yes. I don't repeat it, but I had an aha moment teaching 101. So when I was in 101 with Bobby Moynihan, you do that thing in the curriculum where you discuss game and then forget it. You don't, we're not going to worry about it. And we had that session and I don't think this is in the curriculum anymore or if it ever was. And this took me years. He said, "You have two people facing each other "and finding game is them telling one another "what is on the wall behind you." - Oh. - So I'm describing what you're saying from that of you're describing what I'm standing in front of and we're telling each other what's on that wall and that's building the scene and finding our game together. At the time, it was like, oh, okay. Sure, describing the wall. But now it has like a very nice clarity. - 'Cause you're helping, you're doing things to, it is essentially like gifting your scene partner. You're building that up, but also our walls have to match. You can't have the Titanic behind you and I have a dinosaur or something. Like it has to be, oh, this is an office wall and this is an office wall, but whatever. - Yeah. - That's interesting. - And I'm not worried about this. I'm figuring out your wall of like making sure that you're in a good place of like, oh wow, you know, the sun, the sun's, I think there's forest fires 'cause the sky is really bright, you know what I mean? Like, okay, okay. Anyway, you are in front of an orange wall, which made me think of a sky turned orange by forest fires. Okay. - 'Cause you're very literal. - So, yeah. But I really like that a lot. I don't think that's ever been in the curriculum. I don't think so, no. I like that encapsulation a lot. Any other things that you feel like you, yeah. - Treating your performance as live theater and playing with, which is not our Google Fest when we improvise, but playing with a degree of integrity and as an actual actor and committing to your character, I was in a Neil Casey class and he said, our theater is very, so this was Chelsea. The theater is very small. They will be able to smell your bullshit from a foot away. And I love that. They were right there. They will smell your bullshit so fast. What are you doing? It's great. It's so great. You are full of shit. I don't believe anything you're saying. I love it. This is true. Just like, hacky, winky bullshit. - I'm doing improv. - Yeah. - My two pay. - Oh, no. - That was Katherine. - I highly suggest taking a notebook or something other than your phone with you to class and to practice. Take some notes. Keep them somewhere safe. You're going to remember your notes better and if you keep track of exercises and warm-ups, you're gonna be able to go back to that list years from now when you're coaching or teaching and have a much bigger bag of tricks to pull from. One of the things I started doing way too late was typing up lists of exercises I had. I wish I had done it at the start, but even so, having that was really great when I started coaching because now I have basically a six-page document of exercises that I like and a whole list of all the warm-ups I've ever done. It makes it easier to just go back and, oh, I want to work on more justification stuff. Boom. And finally, the notes that mean a lot now may also mean a lot to you in a couple months or a couple of years when you're trying to get out of a rut or break to the next level. It helps you both see how far you've come and how improv is really about constant adjustment. You're never going to be completely comfortable doing improv. You're always gonna find ways you can be better, which is kind of awesome. (upbeat music) That was episode 21, best notes part two. Please rate and review the podcast on iTunes and if you have any feedback for me, please send it to [email protected]. Also, if you want to support me and help pay for some of the hosting costs for this podcast, you can do so via my Patreon, patreon.com/actuallycurtis. Thank you so much to everyone who has done so and thanks to everyone who is part of this episode. - Hi, I'm John Timothy. - Beth Appell. - Ashley Ward. - Jake Cornell. - Hi, my name's X Myo. - This is Terry Withers. - I'm Ritz and Montanhas. - Kevin Mulaney. - David Blavband. - I'm Lindsey Callarin. - Rudy Barons. - Katherine Mudeau. - And I'm Curtis Reutherford. (gentle music)