2026 Update: Brandon

Pushkin. Little pieces of yolk that are stuck all over your beard. Nothing. That's total circumstantial evidence. You can't hang someone for circumstantial evidence. I did see Malcolm Gladwell exiting the studio strutting around with an egg salad sandwich poking out of his fanny pack like he owned the joint. So there's some circumstantial evidence you might want to investigate, you intrepid reporter, you. So hello, Stevie. Elaine, producer. Yes, of the episode that we're about to listen to. Brandon. Yeah, Brandon. I will say, and he doesn't even know this, he's not even going to know this until he listens to this. Yeah. One of my all-time favorite guests, I think. Really? Yeah, I don't know, he just had such a nice attitude. And I feel like the two of you had a really lovely rapport. Yeah, and it was like an example of how sometimes a small question can have like a lot of. Emotional impact and can just really echo through the years. Yeah. You know, with these updates, a lot of times I start off by saying that the subject of the episode has gone through a lot of changes. But in the case with Brandon, I will say that change seems like too slight a word. I would say that Brandon has gone through some transformations. Hmm. So here's Brandon. Yeah, it's a fun one. It is a fun one. And after the episode, if you stick around, I'm going to catch up with Brandon and we're going to see who Brandon has become since we last spoke. Jackie? Hey, Johnny. I have some good news. Yeah. Well, it seems like there's some interest in turning the Heavyweight podcast into a TV show. So I was just calling to see who maybe, you know, who you want to play Jackie. I was thinking, you know, maybe Rita Marie. Don, Don, Don, Don, no one's going to watch your show, babe. What did you just say? You heard me. Wait, I'm confused on two counts. A, that you would say something so cruel. Yeah. And then B, you would punctuate it with babe. You know, a lot of people believe in this project. Why would you laugh at that? A lot of people believe in this project. From Gimlet Media, I'm Jonathan Goldstein, and this is Heavyweight. Today's episode, Brandon. Right after the break. This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human. This is Jacob Goldstein from Business History. When the Internet arrived, most people used it to look things up. Others saw what it could really do. The same is true with ChatGPT. ChatGPT work goes beyond answering questions. Give it a goal, plus things like notes, files, feedback, data, or project plans, and it can help. Create a brief, analysis, deck outline, tracker, or workflow. You stay in control, reviewing the work, and choosing the final result. Put ChatGPT to work on your most ambitious ideas and projects. Get started at ChatGPT.com by selecting Work Mode. Available on Plus and Pro plans. If you love music and great artist interviews, check out Before the Moment, hosted by Niall Rogers. This new series follows Niall as he travels across the country talking with some of today's most fascinating artists about the moments that shaped their lives and careers. From hitmakers like Miguel to rising stars like Alex Warren, Niall explores the stories behind the careers, the songs, and the moments that changed everything. Because every musician remembers the point where everything changed, and this podcast tells the stories that came before it. Listen to Before the Moment, a Lincoln Original series on the iHeartRadio app, YouTube, or Radio. We spend hours deciding what to buy, but there's a split-second decision that can make or break a sale. Do you have the trust to hit buy now? Agentic Commerce is testing that moment more than ever. And that's where PayPal comes in. With 25 years of checkouts, 400 million consumer accounts globally, and the benefit of purchase and seller protection, all of which make sure wherever a purchase starts, it ends with trust. Built for payments, growth, and agentic. PayPal Open. Built for all business. Visit paypalopen.com. Purchase and seller protections on eligible transactions only. Terms apply. See paypal.com slash risk dash management for details. Yeah, we'll just roll in there and see what's going on. This is Brandon. He's 33 years old and wearing a suit and striped shirt. His wife, Megan, is in a sundress. And together, they're about to enter the new Palestine high school prom. Oh, mosey on up there, then. Megan is the school's art teacher. But tonight, she's chaperoning, with Brandon as her date. She introduces him to the other teachers. This is my husband, Brandon. Hi, everybody. Hi. It's a pleasure. At a certain point, they're interrupted by the announcement of Prom King and Queen. Hey, hey! It's your students! We announce the Prom King Queen! Congratulations! While Megan congratulates her students and makes small talk with her colleagues, Brandon wanders off and observes the kids. Some are dancing. Some are lined up for the photo booth. There are kids talking to teachers and others gossiping among themselves. But then Brandon's gaze lands on another subset. Those aimless kids, wandering along the margins, alone. They remind Brandon of himself when he was a teenager in his own prom. Brandon thinks about his prom a lot and the improbable path that led him to it, which began when he was just a little kid. Through middle school and junior high, I had a lot of bullying problems. That was kind of an easy time. There were a number of things that made him one. First, I'm like still a big guy now, but I was at my biggest in high school. Heaviest. Second, Brandon tried too hard to fit in. Like the time he shaved a Nike swoosh into the back of his head. I just thought, like, sports, that's cool. So it made your head look like a running shoe. Exactly. Yeah, I sat in front of this kid named Cyril and he said it looked like a hockey stick. And that was enough that everyone was like, that's a hockey stick. That is not a Nike swoosh. Finally, Brandon was a coda, a child of deaf adults. His family attended a deaf church and spent a lot of time in the deaf community. He says he was brought up with different social norms. Like volume. Like volume is not a concern around deaf people in a deaf environment. And then, of course, it is around hearing people. So what does that mean? Like any examples? Yeah, like school. Where it's like time to be quiet. I was just constantly talking to myself or just vocalizing my thoughts, you know? Then, in middle school, Brandon's parents divorced. There was less space for him, less attention paid to him. He drew inward. I think I wanted to put off a harder, like, you can't hurt me exterior than I really had on the inside. So wearing Hot Topic clothes, spiky things, black clothes, and trying to just like keep your hoodie on and get through the day. And for the most part, Brandon succeeded in going unnoticed. Until the spring of his senior year. Brandon was sitting at the back of a classroom during a free period, eavesdropping on a conversation from across the room. Some classmates were talking about prom, and among the group was a girl named Allie. She was going on about what a great night it was going to be, how excited she was. She had, like, long blonde hair with highlights, big features, like, big eyes. She had a big smile. Yeah, like, when she smiled, she looked really happy. And I think she kind of pulled me into the conversation by directing some of those questions at me. Like, are you going to prom? Who are you going to prom with? Brandon had no intention of going. He hadn't a girlfriend or any prospects for a date. And he was confused about why Allie was talking to him. to him. Brandon says they'd barely ever spoken. They were from totally different social worlds. Allie was in student government. She was popular and beautiful. She was just really well put together, clean. And you? No, that's not a word I'd use to describe myself in high school. I mean, like, I would, like, smell my clothes before I put them on in the morning. You know what I mean? Like, I got dressed from the floor of my bedroom. Yeah. And yet, Allie kept throwing questions at him. Why wasn't he going? If he did go, who would he take? Brandon answered in monosyllables, hoping she'd turn back to her friends and leave him alone. But instead, she rose from her seat and began striding towards him. Inside, I was, like, uh, like, inflamed. Do you know what I mean? Like, my heart rate was rising. With each question, Allie moved closer and closer until she was sitting at the desk in front of him. Facing him. Then, she did something that still flummoxes Brandon 15 years later. She just kind of outright said, take me to prom. Like, go to prom, take me. Let's go together. I immediately had questions. Questions like, why? Why me? What's going on? I guess I was skeptical this was some kind of trick. Hmm. You know? Why would you be asking me this other than to be able to tell me what's going on? you set me up for a punchline or something like that. But no punchline really came. So I just agreed. On the big night, Brandon met up with Allie and her friends for a pre-dance dinner at her friend Jen's house. He was in the fancier part of town. Brandon showed up wearing his rented suit with a corsage and a bright blue necktie that matched Allie's dress. Before leaving to the dance, everyone lined up for a group picture. Did you like just feel like saying, why the heck am I here? Like, what happened? Was this a mistake? Yeah. Yeah. I would have loved an answer to that question, but I would never have thought, couldn't fathom saying it, you know. Do you still have that prom photo that you guys took? No, to be honest, I'm not even sure I ever got it. So I don't think I ever even saw that picture. Hmm. What do you think you would see in that photo? I don't know. I mean, just imagining it makes me laugh. Yeah, why? It would be a line of, like, beautiful high schoolers, you know, and, like, me there. Just feels like if your eyes set on me for a little too long, that maybe you'd be able to see that I didn't fit in. Allie and her friends looked like the girls in those movies about prom. And those girls always had guys who gave them the time of their lives. For Brandon, a sense of duty kicked in. It felt like a huge responsibility. It was like, this is going to be a big deal in Allie's life forever, and I have a big responsibility as her date to make sure that I live up to this position. Hmm. I was really, really nervous. Did you guys, did you and Allie slow dance? I'm pretty sure. I feel like when I ask these questions, I feel like Hannibal Lecter. Yeah. Like I'm asking you these questions from a straitjacket in a cell. Did you slow dance? Did you slow dance? I do remember slow dancing because I remember thinking, like, it's funny that in TV shows and in movies, this is such a big deal, but it's just standing. Like, you're kind of just, like, stepping slightly. Yeah. Like, that's not hard. Like, I was in, like, a hip-hop dance crew and youth group, you know. That was hard. Wait, you were in a, sorry, repeat that? You were in a hip-hop dance youth group? What? Yeah. Um, so the church I went to was just, like, there were a lot of performances and, um, hip-hop dance. Mm-hmm. That happened. Did you ever at any point break out any of your Christian youth group hip-hop moves on the dance floor? Did you do anything, like, on the floor? Like, where you spin on your back? Or you didn't, you didn't want to ruin the rental? You wanted to get your deposit? Uh-huh. Uh-huh. At the prom, Brandon popped for the Lord and locked for the Lord. He made Allie's friends laugh. And it was right there on the dance floor, the place one might expect a high school boy to feel the most self-conscious, that Brandon felt most at ease. He was a part of a group. Of a group. It kind of felt like a resolution of what all of grade school was like for me. You know, I never felt safe enough to bring my true self into that space. But, uh, like, dancing around at prom with, your peers, it's like one of the most vulnerable things you can do. And it came out on the other end of it okay. At the end of the prom, Allie and all her friends headed to one of their classmates' houses for the after-party. But having never been to a house party, Brandon decided not to go. Do you remember saying goodbye to Allie? No. And then what happened after that? Do you recall speaking with her, seeing her in school after that night? I had to have, because we both went back to school. But I don't have any specific memories of talking to her again. Prom is supposed to stay with you for the rest of your life. And for Brandon, it has. But eclipsing the dancing, the music, the last night out with his peers, is a lingering question. Which was like, why me out of all the people that you could be going with? Maybe it was one of those situations where all of these people out there are thinking, well, Allie's taken. She's totally going to prom with somebody already. I'll have to ask somebody else, you know? And then leaves her without a prom date. If that was what was going on, maybe she just had a breakup. Maybe I was part of a charity case. So you want to ask her why. Why did she pick you? Yeah, exactly. I want to know that. Yeah, without her, I wouldn't have gone to prom. It would have just been another thing on my list of things I regret. I regret from high school, you know. But it's not on that list. It's on the shorter list of things that I feel went okay. Yeah, I'd like to thank her. I'm just nervous. Which is why Brandon has reached out to me. If you get nervous, I mean, I can always jump in. Sure. I've just assumed I'm going to be coming along to chaperone. After the break, I chaperone Brandon. Back to high school. If you're a music fan, here's a new podcast to check out. It's called Before the Moment, a new series hosted by the legendary Nile Rodgers. You know him as the producer. He's the producer, songwriter, guitarist, and co-founder of Chic. But in this series, he's hitting the road to sit down with some of today's most fascinating artists. From hitmakers like Miguel to rising stars like Alex Warren, Nile explores the stories behind the careers, the songs, and the moments that changed everything. Because every artist can point to that turning point, that moment before the breakthrough, before the success, before everything changed. Through candid conversations and personal stories, you'll hear what happened before the moment that made them who they are today. Listen to Before the Moment, a Lincoln Original series on the iHeartRadio app, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine Henry Ford trying to create the assembly line. He had factory plans, production schedules, supply information, research, and ideas coming from all directions. His team spent years studying how to make the process work. Now, imagine if you were him. Imagine having ChatGPT work. ChatGPT work can help with big projects that have lots of steps. You give it the goal, along with real information like notes, files, reports, feedback, and project plans. It can use approved apps, connected tools, and files to help turn all of that into something useful. A plan, an analysis, a tracker, a presentation outline, or a workflow you can keep improving. And you stay in control. You give direction, review the work, approve actions, and choose the right thing. Would Henry Ford have built the assembly line faster with ChatGPT? We'll never know. Ford didn't have ChatGPT. You do. Get started at ChatGPT.com by selecting Work Mode, available on Plus and Pro plans. Malcolm Gladwell here. My new book, The American Way of Killing, investigates America's gun violence crisis. Why is the richest country in the world plagued by such lethal violence? Through a series of stories, interviews, and archival tape, I confront one of today's most urgent moral dilemmas and examine why the U.S. has never quite understood its own problem and why you can't fix what you refuse to see clearly. Get The American Way of Killing at pushkin.fm slash audiobooks or at Audible, Spotify, or wherever audiobooks are sold. Before Brandon can ask Allie the question that's most important to him, he's been on his mind since senior year. We first need to track her down. Her last name is Schmutz. I'm just making. that. Brandon's part of a Facebook group for his high school graduating class. And Allie is a member of the group as well. Does that mean that you can have a better chance of messaging her through that group? I mean, like if I were going to use the group, it would be making a post for my whole graduating class. Might as well go big, like say, Hey, I'm just going to put this out there to everybody. Yeah. If you're not Allie, please don't read this. But Allie, I just want to say, Hey, hit me up. Here are my digits. Everybody else just lose this number. Maybe Facebook friend her. I could do that. Yeah. I'd have to change my name on Facebook. My name hasn't been my real name for a long time. What's the name that you operate under? Oak Tree. Just Oak Tree? Just Oak Tree. I can't even find you as Brandon. I'd have to look up Oak Tree. That's right. I was kind of playing with what kinds of words it lets me have as a name. Can you change your name from Oak Tree to Brandon? Probably a good idea. Then you don't have to start with a whole rigmarole about how like, my name's not really Oak Tree. This is Brandon, by the way. You remember from high school? And so the mighty Oak Tree sheds his leaves and his name. And the mighty Brandon sends Allie a friend request. A week later, Brandon texts with an update. Allie has accepted his friendship. Now he just needs to send her a message. Okay, so you've crafted something already? Yeah. Would you, could you read it? Sure. Yeah. Hi, Allie. Good so far? Casual. Okay, cool. Go ahead. Yeah. Hi, Allie. Maybe you'll remember me. We were prom dates. As Brandon reads me his draft, I focus, my keen podcast producer's ear. By my recollection, it was your idea for us to go to prom together. Now, let me pause. Sorry, let me hit pause there. Yeah. Like the way that you're underlining your idea. You're not actually underlining that, though. I did italicize it. It was your idea for us to go to prom together. Is that what you're saying? Yeah, it sounds accusatory out loud. Yeah. So yeah, maybe we'll de-italicize that part. Okay, keep going. Brandon tells Allie that he still thinks about their prom. He says he wants to talk to her about it. Would she be up for that? Okay, okay. Let's take a look at this here. Okay, so maybe you'll remember. As Brandon and I pour over the message, a worry suddenly pops into my head. I wonder if there's a way to work in the fact that you're married, you know? How about just, I'm married, but I'll just start with it. Hey, listen, I'm taken. Speaking as a married man, me and my wife were wondering, that is, my wife and I, we were wondering the other night after making love. Yeah. It's good to be doing good work, and I hope you're well. All the best. Once we've crafted the perfect message, Brandon readies himself to hit send. Should I go ahead and do it? Yeah, let's do it. Go ahead. Hit send. Enter. It's sent. Congratulations. Thank you. A week later, Allie writes back. She's willing to talk. So that's good. It's a positive response. I, um. Look at you. You're, you're, you're giddy. You're giddy with expectation. Yeah. Can you tell? 'Cause I keep wiping my face and touching my eyes. Um, would it be fun to do it on a video call? Sure. Sure. Yeah. Do you still have the suit that you wore to your party? To your prom? Yeah. I'll be like, I never took it off. Um, any things that you want me to, uh, bring up just kind of like conversationally awards or any upcoming projects that you want to promote or. No, um, keep it organic, whatever. Cool. Cool. I can keep it organic. Cool. If you're a music fan, here's a new podcast to check out, it's called before the moment, a new series hosted by the legendary Nile Rogers, you know him as the producer, songwriter, guitarist, and co-founder of chic, but in this series, he's hitting the road to sit down with some of today's most fascinating artists from hit makers like Miguel to rising stars like Alex Warren, Niall Ixley, and others. Explores the stories behind the careers, the songs and the moments that changed everything because every artist can point to that turning point, that moment before the breakthrough, before the success, before everything changed through candid conversations and personal stories. You'll hear what happened before the moment that made them who they are today. Listen to before the moment, a Lincoln original series on the I heart radio app, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Jacob. I'm Jacob Goldstein from business history. Now, imagine having chat GPT work. Chat GPT work can help with big projects that have lots of steps. You give it the goal along with real information like notes, files, reports, feedback, and project plans. It can use approved apps. Connected tools and files to help turn all of that into something useful. You give direction, review the work, approve actions, and choose the final result. Would Henry Ford have built the assembly line faster with chat GPT? We'll never know. Ford didn't have chat GPT. You do. Put chat GPT to work on your most ambitious ideas and projects. Get started at chatgpt.com. chatgpt.com by selecting work mode. has never quite understood its own problem and why you can't fix what you're doing. Hello. Hello. I'm getting a little bit of static on your end. Yeah, hello. Better? Yeah. On the day of the video call with Ali, Brandon and I get on early and wait. It feels like I'm getting back into the psyche of my high school self. I'm. Hi. Hi, Ali. Hi. How are you? Good. Ali smiles a big smile full of big white teeth. She's wearing a blue pattern blouse that matches the blue of her nails. I'll just tell you what I've seen on your profile. You live in Carmel and you have a baby? I have two daughters, a three-year-old and a two-year-old. Awesome. They're right here on my wall. Brandon and Ali catch up. The Midwest is just such a nice place to raise a family. It's recruiting. But there's like a sales element. And then, of course, the grandparents are here. Yeah, I figured that was part of it, being close to family. It's a huge resource. They're always willing to help. Brandon's question hasn't gotten any easier to ask since high school. In fact, it's gotten harder. After a pause of a few minutes or even a few days, one can feign casualness. By the way, why'd you choose me? But to ask after 15 years, there's no way to buy the way you're way through it. But eventually. So can I ask you some questions? Absolutely. I guess, first, like, what are your memories of me in high school? Yeah, so I was trying to think of this. Did we ever have any classes together? Probably not. Yeah. So we met senior year, right? I think so. Ali doesn't remember much. But one thing she does remember is that day in the back of the classroom. We were talking about prom, you know, as seniors do. And I think you had, you were like, not into going to prom, right? You're like, no, I'm not going to go. Yeah, I remember, like, you had to really spell it out. You were like, are you going to prom? You're not. Okay. Like, if you were, would you be going with someone? No. Okay. And then eventually you were like, you and me can go to prom. Like, why don't we go to prom? You know? That's funny. And then Brandon asks this question, sort of. Like, at any point, did you consider having. having someone else as a date? Well, I would have been totally comfortable going by myself. So I don't have any memories of thinking, like, I'm going to ask Brandon. And then if that doesn't work, I'm going to ask so-and-so. They're just kind of like, I'm going to ask Brandon. Hmm. That is surprising. I guess because I thought, like, that it was, like, spur of the moment. Like, your friends were hearing this for the first time, too. No, no. I was very obsessed with my friends. So I'm sure that I. I ran it by them. So you passed the friend test. Ha, ha, ha. Brandon grows quiet. It wasn't a prank. It wasn't pity. Allie planned to ask him. What's more, she wasn't going to take no for an answer. I do remember, like, you did say no. I remember you saying no, and I'm like, oh, yeah, give him a day. I'm going to make him go. He's going to go with me. But yeah, you were just surprised by the fact that I asked you? I mean, yeah, definitely. Allie pauses, trying to find the right words. You made me laugh a lot, and I remember that you were just, you know, fun to be around and goofy, and you smiled at me a lot. I remember that, you know, like, I liked being around you. And if I made a joke, you would laugh at it, you know, and feel like I was funny, which is a great quality. You got me a corsage. I remember that. I remember not expecting you to get me a corsage. I'm thinking that was really nice. I do remember that. Isn't that silly? That, like, I don't remember a lot, but I remember that. So, you know, I'm going to be a little blunt here, because. Sure. Was there anything else to it? Like, was there an element of something romantic? So, we probably flirted, right? But I don't know. I mean, friends. Friendship is really just the main feeling that I can recall. I'm not saying that there wasn't, you know. I mean, I don't know. You're a teenager. You're feeling all kinds of things. I'm sure there were moments where I was like, oh, is this a thing? You know, is this turning into this? Yeah. That, I think that I would have found that really hard to believe as a kid, you know. That would have gone. Against the narrative of school and what people thought of me that I had. I don't know. I guess, to some extent, I knew that we were. I want to be honest. I knew that some people were surprised by the fact that we were going together, right? I do remember one time when I told some dude in my physics class, I can't remember, that I was going with Brandon. And they're like, wait, what? And I was like, yeah. And they're like, that's weird. And I'm like. You're weird. While Brandon remembers himself as a misfit, Allie remembers someone who is different than a lot of the other guys in high school. Brandon made wry jokes. He was sweet and self-deprecating. She remembers things that Brandon doesn't. She says there was one time Brandon did a whole monologue about how he found it hard to drive because of his fear of hitting birds. In other words, Allie asked him to prom for the one reason Brandon never considered. She just wanted to go with him. Did you have a good time at prom? Because I really wanted that for you. I spent a lot of time thinking like, that's my role. I'm the date. Here I go, you know? Yeah. Allie grows thoughtful. I guess I didn't even think that because I mean, I talked you into it, right? So then here you are kind of not stuck, but like, yeah, feeling like you wanted to make it special for me because I was the one that was all about it. Yeah, I guess I never even thought about that. I just think, Brandon, you're just so much more thoughtful, you know, just thoughtful about the whole experience. And I do want to thank you because that's so nice that you were thinking it was your duty to try to make sure I had the prom I wanted to have. Yeah. I honestly didn't even expect to be thanked from you for anything. I feel like I have to thank you because there's. There's something really simple and superficial about this, but it felt really real that I finished high school as a person who went to prom. I got to go. I got to have a fun time and forget the misfit feelings I was having. That's awesome. That's so awesome to hear you say that. That's really nice. Yeah. My life started to really just, like, blossom and grow, like, from, like, the moment high school was over. And I guess I can't say for certain what that part of my life would have looked like had I not had the prom experience, but I can't say it was totally irrelevant. Was it out of that and kind of, like, into that period that you ended up meeting your wife, Megan? Yeah, it was, like, that phase of life when Meg and I met. Her dress is so cute. She looks beautiful. This is Megan, Brandon's wife, looking at a photo of Allie from prom night. She looks amazing. She looks great. After getting off the video call, Allie sent the group photo from prom. Megan studies it while seated beside Brandon. It's also, like, so cute to see you flanked by these, like, I mean, I'm sorry they're in high school, so I don't really feel like I should be calling them hot babes, but you know what I mean, like, from the high school perspective. You lucky, lucky man. But as Brandon looks at the photo. I imagine it isn't his date or the other kids that he's focused on, so much as he's focused on the big guy in the middle and all the baggage that guy was carrying. There's a lot of weird stuff about, like, my weight and growing up and, like, dieting and, like, my mom, like, putting me on a scale and it was like, uh, you're over this line, you know? You're unattractive. And what does it make you feel like, Megan, to hear that? It makes me feel very protective, for sure. I think if we don't, we rarely really get into squabbles, but if ever we do, what really disarms me is, like, thinking about that, like, little, like, young Brandon. I feel like that happened not even that long ago. Do you remember we were, like, standing at the kitchen and I started crying and I was just, like, I had been so resentful and mad at you for a minute and then I just, like, was imagining you being, like, a little kid and having other, like, adults in his life not really tend to, like, the difficulties of that as well as they are. Yeah. Yeah. I think about him just having to, like, navigate those insecurities alone. But Brandon no longer has to navigate them alone. A few weeks ago, before chaperoning the prom with Megan, Brandon went to the tailor. He wanted to wear his wedding suit and needed her to let it out. She was, like, down on her knees, like, looking at it, pulling the pants in different ways, and then said, Okay, go ahead and open the pants up so I can see how much we can let. And I don't know why, but I wasn't wearing underwear. I didn't wear underwear to the tailor. I guess I didn't think that she was going to be asking that. So, yeah, she asked me to open the pants and I was, like, right now and she was, like, yep, go ahead. And I just said, I can't do that right now. So, if you know what I mean. Wow. I know. I know. And I don't think, I'm honestly not sure if she knew what I meant, but she dropped it and said, Okay, I think we'll just let it out all the way and that'll probably be enough. It was awful. It was awful. Brandon was spiraling. So, as soon as he left, he sent Megan a text at school asking her to call him. And when she called me, I was fixing a flat. I got a flat tire on the way home. It was just, like, a shitty afternoon. So, I was fixing a flat and telling her what it was like at the tailor. And then we hung up and then she texted me later and just said, like, I love you and I love the way your body looks. And I don't think it's weird that you didn't wear underwear. I don't wear underwear either. It was just, like, you know what I mean? She was supportive. That fixed it. Almost immediately for me. Hmm. Well, I taught him to go commando, so I feel partially responsible. What did you make of Brandon's question that he's had through the years? Why did Allie invite him to the prom in the first place? It didn't have to be a mystery. It makes perfect sense to me. But she. Somebody who looks like Allie could like the person who she's standing next to. You. Brandon says the biggest difference between his two proms was that with Megan, he didn't spend the whole night wondering why the person by his side had chosen him. He's just happy she did. I was comfortable the whole time. How could you not be comfortable? I mean, you weren't wearing underpants. The ultimate comfort. Oh, God. Oh, my God. you now that the furniture's returning to its goodwill home now that the last month's rent is scheming with the damage deposit take this moment to decide brandon hey hello hi i can't believe it's been um over four years last time i spoke to you you were speaking to me from uh what did you call it your man cave your i didn't remember telling you but it's called the chill zone the chill zone that's right it's right there wait so you're not in the chill zone no i'm in the office okay because the chill zone is for chilling it's not for recording well it's changing its purpose now it's for the bedtime routine with the new baby well you really buried the lead on that one so you have a baby yeah we have a baby wow yeah it's so exciting she's growing and learning so fast she's noticing things does she like pulling on your mustache she hasn't found my mustache in that way yet but she's really into containers just putting containers in containers taking something out of a container putting in a different one and um she can do that for like an hour and i can just sit there and watch her and try not to help if she's trying to put something too big in too small container you know i'm just watching her yeah it's so exciting wonderful that's so that's so nice to hear well that's that's the headline are there have there been any other changes since we last spoke i actually listened to the brandon episode of heavyweight yesterday just to have it be fresh in my mind yeah and what was that like uh it's fun um i feel like when i was first hearing it i cringe and i cringed a lot less yesterday well why do you think that is time i think i mean i feel a lot different than i did before four years ago how in what ways about a year before robin was born meg and i started going to this um meeting it's like we'd get together with these people and do something called qigong it's just like breathing and moving it's kind of like tai chi but kind of exercisey and then there's a meditation portion and um there's this concept called no pretending we would be like are we pretending with ourselves in our minds do we pretend when we talk to other people and um i realized that i do pretend to other people thinking about how i want to come across and drawing awareness to that helped me to do it less were there certain things that you feel like were that you were pretending at i'm trying to think of a good way to explain that or uh oh you know one day i realized i was uh like if i'm walking up to uh the door of a gas station we're going into the gas station and there's a stranger walking in at the same time and it seems like we might arrive at more or less the same time i was fast to jump out of the way and i was like oh my god i'm gonna be like oh my god i'm gonna be like oh my god i'm gonna be like you know you first you first and i i don't do that sort of thing as much you feel less apologetic for for just being around existing yeah yeah less about finding a place where i can fit to disturb other people as little as possible and more now feeling like i am of i'm actually here i'm a i'm not just smoke you know i i exist here and i'm moving around and i can do and say what i want and other people will react to that and i'm not just a smoke you know i i exist here and i'm act however they will react and that doesn't mean i should have said or done something different yeah so i feel more um confident more uh i guess just in tune with what i actually think and what i'm actually feeling and uh i feel uh like a much different person than i did four years ago in a good way yeah do you think the brandon of today would have pursued that story i do yeah i do think so yeah yeah does the brandon of today wear underwear i've got a couple pairs for special occasions is this a special occasion no it's not it isn't no okay no uh you have a 20-year high school reunion coming up this is the year for my my 20th reunion yeah if it's happening are you gonna go i would love to go have you been in touch with ally no i have not but i wondered if i might see her at this reunion and you know i wanted to say before we go when i was listening to the episode yesterday um i felt grateful it brought me kind of an outside perspective on that period of my life which i i wouldn't have had without that or you know i don't think i would have reached out to ally on my own and um it was a good lesson to learn that despite what i was going through as a teenager that i was still me that's the big takeaway i had from listening to it you know when she said you were sweet and um you smiled at me and and you laughed at my jokes that's a good quality that's some of the things i remember her saying from when i listened but i don't know how that hit me at the time i can't remember but listening to it now i thought that sounds like me oh the real me was still there i was it was still coming out yeah um so thank you well thank you thank you for for saying that and for lending yourself to it so wholeheartedly uh will you say hi to to meg for me i will brandon it was really nice to see you thank you have a good day you too you too enjoy your baby i will i will thanks to everyone who originally put this episode together we'll be back with another update in two weeks time and if you want you can sign up for our free newsletter it's absolutely free and it's available at patreon.com heavyweight stevie yeah what do we have in store in the newsletter we got some recommendations things that we've liked and there's hyperlinks yes uh parenthetically i don't know that i've been hyperlinking properly in the newsletter like you can actually like hyperlink from a word right yeah but i put the full url i'm old school that's all right uh it's only recently that i've started pronouncing it url i used to just pronounce it as earl do you know what url stands for you really love our newsletter url our newsletter i'm speaking of the url for the newsletter is it's at patreon.com heavyweight if you love music and great artist interviews check out before the moment hosted by nile rogers this new series follows nile as he travels across the country talking with some of today's most fascinating artists about the moments that shape their lives and careers from hit makers like miguel to rising stars like alex warren nile explores the stories behind the careers the songs and the moments that changed everything because every musician remembers the point where everything changed and this podcast tells the stories that came before it listen to before the moment a lincoln original series on the iheart radio app youtube or wherever you get your podcasts malcolm gladwell here my new book the american way of killing investigates america's gun violence crisis why is the richest country in the world plagued by such lethal violence through a series of stories interviews and archival tape i confront one of today's most urgent moral dilemmas and examine why the u.s 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