2026 Emmys Instant Reactions: Is Apple Really the New HBO? What Happened to Netflix?

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Some cringy moments. Maybe don't do multiple musical numbers, but whatever. They got Taylor Swift to do a video, so the digital numbers will be good. It's kind of where we are on TV these days. And the winners, pretty interesting. Widows Bay, 14 wins, including best comedy. I predicted that one. Broke the record that was set last year by the studio, both from Apple TV. The Pit won best drama. But all those nominations for the actors kind of canceled each other out and only Noah Wiley won on the live show. And HBO Max got another big win for DTF St. Louis in the limited series category. Colbert won, as expected. The Traitors beat our guy Probst in Survivor in the reality competition category. And for some reason, Sally Field got another Emmy. Not quite sure what happened there. Everyone in town obsesses over these squabbles. Scorecards from Emmy night. Who won the most? So the final tally is Apple TV, 28. HBO, 21. Netflix, 16. NBC, Peacock, 15. Disney, all their labels, also 15. CBS, Paramount Plus, 11. And Prime Video, 10. A big night for Apple TV and its content executives. Eddie Q, Zach Van Amburg, and Jamie Ehrlich. Many people talking at the parties about that question of, is Apple the new HBO? We've heard that before. And it's just one of the narratives. So we're going to get into that today with Lucas Shaw, who was not at the Emmys, but he did watch, even the Taylor Swift part. So today it's the Emmys narratives, what's real, what's bogus, and what Craig and I ate at the parties. From the Ringer and Puck, I'm Matt Bellany, and this is The Town. Okay, we are here with Lucas Shaw from Bloomberg. Lucas, we really missed you last night at the Emmys. Very sad you weren't. You didn't. No, we did. You know why? Because I would have liked your food expertise at the parties. Like, I know the food at the HBO party was like hand-selected from some East Side restaurants that are very hot right now. And I had to have that explained to me. I just didn't know. It's okay. I'll be there. Instead, you just kept me up too late and made me drink too much on Friday before our previous podcast taping. It all evens out. Which went well, I think. Yeah, by the way, just a little food reviews. We didn't, Craig and I went to the Governor's Ball and went to the HBO Max party. So we did not go to Netflix or Disney or other parties. Craig, best thing you ate? On the way out, giving everybody Howlin' Ray's chicken and waffles was a really nice touch. I kind of thought I was done for the evening, and then at midnight, I was eating chicken nuggets on the way home. That was lovely. As well as Henry's Secret Ice Cream. They gave away pints of Henry's. Henry's Secret Ice Cream. Most expensive pint of ice cream in Los Angeles. Yeah, it's like $25 a pint. They had a station in the party, and they gave you a pint to go. It was delicious. I had it at the party. It was delicious. I took it home for my kid. I did not have any hot chicken because I realized that it would cause me problems all night. But the dumplings, they had like a dumpling station with, and I don't know the restaurant. I apologize. But it was like, apparently they have a Michelin star, and those were delicious inside. I'm going to go to the food. We're not talking about food today, though. We're talking about Emmys and the narratives, and the thing that annoys executives to no end, because we both know that there are a lot of reasons why shows win Emmys. And these days, when the voters like a show, they tend to just check the boxes, and everybody from the show wins. It happened last year with the studio in the pit, and this year it happened with Widow's Bay. Still, the narrative coming out of the Emmys is really, really good. Really, this whole Apple TV is the new HBO, which I know annoys the shit out of the HBO people. But what do you think about it? Well, it's undeniable that Apple is making shows that people in Hollywood love and that critics like, because Apple over the last two, three years has become one of the real contenders at the Emmys alongside HBO and alongside Netflix. And it sort of like got that, that buzz around it. I think one of the differences is, is I still feel like they don't, they've done it a few times, but they don't always have sort of like the cultural splash. Like, it's just hard to judge with some of these shows right now, right? Like, yes, I know a lot of people who have watched Widow's Bay and really like it. But then you look at the numbers, and like, nobody watches that show. And it, look. The least watched of all the nominees. Right, and HBO, you know, at the beginning of HBO, The Sopranos was not watched by everyone. It was a, it was definitely a coastal show, but it still had like a real audience to it. And I think that's the part that's still kind of missing for Apple, is it sort of like, it has become one of, if not the streaming service of choice for a sort of elite group of people. But it doesn't have the mass appeal cultural splash in the way that some of the big HBO shows do. Yeah, it seems what's happening in streaming is that, there's been an evolution. And whereas in the early days of streaming, these big platforms were sort of all chasing the same thing. We want the good shows. We want the prestige. We want to impress people. But now it seems like there is a stratification happening, just like in linear television, where CBS would make great shows over the years and would not get nominated. And they would have to settle for their shows just being high-ranked. Right, in the 80s and 90s, the broadcast network, I mean, for most, it dominated the Emmys. But by the 2000s, it was all premium cable. And yes, you'd have, comedy was still one area where broadcast comedies often won. You know, Modern Family dominated that category for a while. But certainly in drama, that just became okay. FX, AMC, HBO, Showtime basically traded places, winning the awards. And then that gave way to, HBO sort of stayed in that conversation. FX, depending on the year. And then the streaming services. And now we're seeing that. In the streaming services, where these three sort of dominant, not niche, but prestige-oriented streamers are getting the awards. And then you've got Paramount Plus that got one award on the show. Actually, they didn't even get it. The one award for CBS and Paramount went to Colbert last night. They had 11 total. Prime Video had zero last night. They got 10 total, if you count Creative Arts. That's because they're not making those shows. They're just not. And they're happy having Reacher. And they're happy having stuff. They like them. They campaign for them. But it's just all feeling like broadcast in the 2000s, 2010s. I have a question on the HBO front, since you're talking about it. Because I think when you say something like Apple is the new HBO, there's two company services you're mentioning there. There's the Apple part, and the implication is they now make the best, most premium, star-driven stuff on TV, which is something that we can all debate. Then there's the HBO side of it. And HBO's counter to this is always, we're still HBO. We make the best shows. Look, year after year, we get the most Emmy nominations. We either win the first or second most Emmys. But there is a school of thought that HBO has gone a little more mainstream, slightly less premium, right? You look, their big winner this year is The Pit, which is basically a broadcast TV show, but zhuzhed up a little bit as an HBO show. They've got a Harry Potter show coming. No, I've been harping on this for years. They do a lot of IP. They've got a Big Bang spinoff right now. They're doing lots of this library IP stuff. Lanterns. And do you think that that, because that's obviously a sound business decision, right? There is an audience for these shows, and HBO is executing them well. Do you think that it, but does that allow for this kind of Apple comparison because people don't see HBO as quite as prestige as they did, or is that BS? You know, it's an interesting question. And I have raised that with Casey Boyes, and he will always point to stuff like The Penguin, which is both. It is IP exploitation and prestige that wins Emmys. And HBO has been able to do that in a way that, like, say, Disney has kind of not, where they got a big splashy alien show on FX, but it doesn't win Emmys. And I do think that the priorities of HBO Max are somewhat at odds because once, They tried to make the best shows now they're trying to satisfy the corporate parent and produce shows based on existing properties and make the good shows and sometimes it crosses over a lot of times it doesn't and i think they're okay with that as long as they can keep that emmy number high and what we're seeing at least this year is their nomination number was great but if you get a show like widow's bay that goes on a heater or the studio last year you can see that hierarchy flip and they're going to have to settle for second place this year last time they settled for second place i believe was behind fx and the hbo line was let's see what happens let's see if they can follow it up and they were correct that fx did not immediately follow it up but apple has been on a different trajectory so i guess we'll see what they have next year and whether just year after year it's going to be it's now going to be apple versus hbo and we're not even talking about the business and we're not even talking about the business and we're not even talking about the business of these services because obviously that hbo strategy serves the business whereas the apple tv strategy we're still unclear what the business actually is for apple tv the business might just be that john turnus has a good time on emmy night and agrees to keep funding the hollywood experiment but making these shows and campaigning them is not cheap and i do think widow's bay is going to get a big bump out of this and maybe they can parlay that into turning this into a hit well it'd be like severance right severance was a very small show that yes popped huge for its second season and we'll see what happens with the studio but i bet when the studio returns the numbers will be much better than the first season because of the awards attention in part because of the awards attention maybe long drop yeah big drop off and still a very niche show but i know you you know you're biased because you're probably going to have you're going to be in four episodes of season two all right so we're going to be in four episodes of season two i am very biased on that one um the netflix question yeah are we prepared to say netflix had a bad year at the emmys 16 total wins yeah only three last night yeah one of it's it's worth showing in a little while right it's but but where does this go in the in the larger netflix narrative right now from like 2016 to 2020 or maybe let's say it's house of cards from 2013 to 2020 netflix was pretty dead set on becoming the top dog at the emmys year after year after year and i think it was in either 18 or 19 that netflix it was the one time netflix finally got more nominations than hbo and this was sort of hell freezing over the sign that um you know that the insane had taken over the asylum pick your crappy metaphor and their their priorities changed to your point about what these other services do netflix still wants to have that prestige but they're at they're more interested in having a service that a lot of people watch and so they want to have the prestige sprinkled in right they have the diplomat which gets a bunch of nominations and got a couple wins they have beef which gets a bunch of nominations would they like more you know the they want to have those top shows of their be getting as many nominations as the hbo and apple shows absolutely and some of that is just cyclical we've talked a lot this year about how this has sort of not been a great year for netflix now some of this traces back into until last year which was a good one but even last year their biggest shows you know stranger things and squid game have never been emmy magnets stranger things was well they both were but they didn't get those big wins right um and both shows i should we should say both shows have scored emmy noms in the past yeah they get nominated but it's not like the pit they're not the crown right or even the pit which is a you know a fairly conventional but well executed show that gets them you know most nominations wins best drama and and a show like yeah that's a that's just a huge overall win for hbo like that that is not easily replicable although i'm sure netflix will try with a bunch of procedural you know doctor hospital cop shows um but this larger narrative about netflix like should should they be worried that this push into lower value podcasts short form content trying to pump the engagement with this kind of low-hanging fruit that that is hurting or taking focus away from the quote-unquote quality shows why do we spend a bunch of time talking about it was a down year for netflix when they still got i think the second most nominations and third most wins of any network and as you recounted earlier you have all of these other companies whether it's disney nbc or netflix or whatever it is that you're talking about it's a down year for all of these other companies whether it's disney nbc or netflix or whatever it is that you're talking about universal paramount amazon that are never in the top three yeah but they don't play in that that schoolyard as much and netflix submits the most shows they have the most content they have a dedicated you know complete campaign army out there trying to win these awards that's why we hold them to a higher standard disney definitely plays in that game because that's like the whole reason that's the whole reason for fx to exist and i think that's the whole reason for fx to exist and i think that's the whole reason for fx to exist and i think that's the whole reason for fx to exist and i think that's the whole reason for fx to exist it's the whole in a lot of ways we're going to talk about their amazon i would argue is not that different from netflix in that they want it but it is not the primary focus and i'm sure taylor sheridan and paramount even if they're publicly dismissive would love to see yellowstone and all of the sheridan verse get not oh they do and they do campaign i mean taylor doesn't himself but all the actors do i mean there were landman events during the fyc season sure and they fx to exist and i think that's the whole reason for fx to exist and i think they were very pissed when he got shut out again but it just is what it is again the stratification those are considered like cbs shows now they're the equivalent of ncis and criminal minds were back in the day they're just not considered prestigious even though they got huge movie stars in them would you not consider some of the netflix shows to essentially be cbs shows yeah they are but netflix positions them in a way and campaigns them pretty hard to get them taken more seriously and sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't listen people complain that beef season two was just not very good i was surprised to get as many nominations as it did yeah exactly and certainly wasn't as watched as the first season so you know you this happens you get a couple stinkers or shows that don't live up to the promise and all of a sudden your emmy's campaign is like i'm sure fx thought that alien earth from no holly would be an emmy's show right it wasn't and it did fine on the service and that's the problem so let's go let's go to that narrative the disney narrative because if fx is the searchlight of television and they want prestige and awards and if they have hits as well that's good how excusable is it to not be a player at the emmy's this is two years in a row really zero on the primetime show for disney last night they got 15 total but the bear didn't do much and the ryan murphy show love story which back in the day that would have been an emmy's magnet this year it got a casting award at the creative arts why do you think it wasn't i just think that the shine is off ryan murphy he's done so much schlock that it's not considered prestigious necessarily anymore got it so it's sort of the same argument you were making with netflix where they've got all this other stuff and so because i because when we were talking about it i would also yeah show like that if the perception of netflix were slightly different i think maybe a show like the diplomat would win more and it's still one you know allison janey still win one because the television academy loves her yeah i know but and but you could do that you can cast your shows with people who win every time and sometimes it works i mean look what hacks did this year where they loaded up with guest stars and loaded up with you know supporting stuff and shot in paris and it still didn't win them the top emmy's hacks did not do as well as people thought it might but with fx i don't know if i'm john langrath there like yes he's got another season of shogun coming but fx can't just be the shogun network when it comes to awards well but we i mean we talked about this over the weekend with with matthew greenfield from searchlight i think furious will be a major player at the awards next year i agree i love that show yeah yes it's a really good show very topical they had emmy rossum on the show on the emmy's last night yeah i bet that i don't know if it's going to win because we have to see but there's long time to go between now and then it's a year away but i would imagine that that will be a show that is seen as a contender on emmy night but that's not fx that's straight hulu but it's i know it doesn't matter it's all kind of the same but disney does have separate fiefdoms producing these shows so there is there is supposed to be a stamp of quality that comes with the fx brand and if you looked last night like the biggest contender was probably paradise that's a hulu show right i think if you're if you're josh tomorrow and you are looking at fx you generally are going to give john landgraf kind of leeway on the ups and downs over a couple of years i don't think you're going to have a couple years where you're not contenders at the emmy's and say sorry you're not getting it done anymore especially if the show if you're making shows that are still popular and i think that's that's one certainly one of the love stories seem to do well uh some of the other you know i think alien earth did all right they're not also producing like a huge volume of shows right that and and that would be landgraf's argument Is that he's just doing a few shows a year, bespoke stuff, finds its audience for the most part, and the Emmys, it's a whim. Sometimes they connect, sometimes they don't. Right. But part of the narrative of FX has always been that they have the ability to break through in the awards race. And around town, when you're recruiting talent, it does matter, the ability to get awards. Yeah, it does. And we have seen, I mean, the arrival of Netflix, and to some extent, Amazon and Hulu, basically killed Showtime and Starz and AMC, right? HBO survived, and FX survived, right? Those were the sort of the two prestige outlets of the cable era that remain prestige outlets. But FX is definitely on shakier footing than HBO, because it is now a sub-brand, right? In a way, where HBO. Yeah. It's still in the title of the app, even if it's called HBO Max, or Max, like, you still have the HBO there. FX is, it's a tile, and that makes it a little bit weaker. Yeah. It's a tile, and that makes it a little bit weaker. The interesting thing is, FX bid on Widow's Bay. I was talking to people last night at the parties about the origin of Widow's Bay, and it goes against the narrative of Apple TV, which is another topic we should talk about, in that it was developed by Katie Dippold. She had this script in her closet for, like, 15 years. And packaged up, and they got Hiro Murai to do it as director, and they took it out. And FX was interested, but Apple bought it in the room, agreed to a series commitment, and there was no star attached, which is very unlike Apple. They agreed to make this show. It was sort of a leap of faith. They agreed to make this kind of unconventional show with an untested showrunner and Katie Dippold. They were very confident in Hiro Murai. Hiro Murai, who'd done Atlanta and a bunch of other shows. But they put Matthew Rhys in this show way later. It was a straight casting, which the knock on Apple is that they are star fuckers and won't do anything unless there is a massive star attached. They agreed to make this show without a star. Well, and they got the kind of, you know, they got the effusive thank you from Katie Dippold last night at the Emmys. That was the type of thing you normally hear for HBO, which is, you know, thank you for taking. Or FX or any of these networks. Thank you for taking a risk on this crazy idea. Yada, yada, yada. Yeah. And I think they knew her. Her husband or partner was the co-writer of that show. We crashed with Lee Eisenberg. Katie Dippold's also written movies. She's she's she's written. Yes. But she was on Parks and Rec like in, you know, 15 years ago. So she's been around. Yeah. But she's not been a showrunner of an Emmy winning show before. And I just thought it was interesting that Apple would be willing to go there when you hear so much. About how, you know, they've got to have a movie star in order to be even be interesting, interested in something. Yeah. Yeah. This is also less expensive than a lot of the shows. Like if you talk about what HBO is knock on Apple TV, they will often come back to, well, they're just throwing money at these shows. These shows are so wildly expensive. Their campaigns are so wildly expensive. But Widows Bay is like a five, six million dollar an episode show. Not that expensive. And most of the cast is. Not, you know, a level and they could probably get them for less money. So it's interesting that they were able, not just willing to do this, but that it turned into their breakout award show. It's interesting. Both of the big Apple Emmy shows this year were not star driven because Pluribus was also greenlit without a big star. I mean, obviously, you had a deal again. Yeah. Is the reason you do that show. And he wanted Ray Seahorn. And obviously she ended up winning last night. So that worked out. But it's not like they're saying, OK, we're in the Jon Hamm business or we're in the Seth Rogen business. Well, they're in that business, too. They are in that business. I know. It's just interesting. So, Lucas, does this change anything? Are the meetings today around town like we got to do X, Y, Z? It's funny because I was talking to David Zasloff, our good friend at the HBO party. And, you know, he was going on and on about our creators. We've got the best creatives in the crew. Do they go into the meeting this morning and say, where's our widow's bay? I doubt it. That's not how HBO works. I think it makes Apple's job even easier. You know, to your point, whether rightly or wrongly, they were known as the place to get paid. And they are slowly creating this reputation for themselves as a home for real quality. And so I think they can go out and, you know, I like to do this poll at the end of every year asking people, you know, like, if you could sell to any network, where would you go? And Apple has been kind of nipping at the heels of Netflix and HBO. And I'm really curious when I do it this year if it finally supplants either one of them as the top place. This is how they do it. This is exactly how. And I think it is a key moment for Apple because as much as they say we're on the same path, the new CEO of the company is fully supportive. I think showing up to the Emmys and being the number one winner is impressive if you are this guy. And Apple likes to be number one. They do. You know, exactly. And he's looking around that party and saying, holy shit, we've got huge movie stars here and we've got, you know, we're the talk of Hollywood and we make far fewer shows than all those other outlets like that. That's what that's all they want. And here's so here's an extra billion dollars to go. Exactly. Or just, you know, continue doing what you're doing, guys. We're a great quarter. Craig, anything from the show or parties that. Stuck out for you. I was surprised at how much fun Colbert seemed to be having. This is his victory laugh. There was no negativity in his speech. He could have gone after Paramount. He could have been political. He took the high road. It was just like having a good time. Yeah, he was dancing at the after party. Every time I see Colbert, he seems to be having a great time, which is fun to see. But he was he was dancing, having fun. I don't know. I thought the show in general was a lot better than last year's. I thought Mariska Hargitay was really good. Yeah, it's kind of getting slammed by critics. And I don't know what the broadcast. Felt like I know there was a lot of like crass product placement, but compared to Nate Bergazzi, who was basically just phoning it in the whole time, at least Mariska Hargitay like seemed to be trying a lot of those. A lot of those musical numbers were pretty hokey and cringy. They were, but like that stuff never bothers me. I think that's kind of like charming in a hokey way. I mean, last year had that that horrible bit of like the timer running and it would like reduce the amount of money that was being donated. I thought this one felt much more fun and lighter. Yeah, nice moments. Michael J. Fox was a good moment. And the Rob Reiner tribute by Jamie Lee Curtis and Dolly Parton thing. They got Noah Khan. I don't know. I don't know what people want out of these shows. They kind of are what they are. And they were ahead of ahead of schedule. When's the last time an award show ended early? And Mulaney, like Mulaney wins the night. John Mulaney put him anywhere and he will kill. Yes. And Matt, you were right. We were there, so we didn't know if they bleeped it out. But when he made the joke about going down on your wife, that was bleeped out. Oh, it was. It was. I figured. Even though no swear words. I guess. You cannot. You cannot say. You cannot. Why can't you talk about. Am I allowed to say the word cunnilingus on this podcast? I believe you are. You are. I think this is the first time that's ever been said. This might be the first time. He did not use that word, but I would assume so. He just talked about going down on his wife. All he said was going down on your wife. That's it. Yeah. I don't know. It's an off color joke. Yeah. People were like, we are way too sensitive in this country about sex. That is like a very positive relationship interaction between a man and a woman. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Lucas. You can slice someone's throat on television and it's fine. Yeah. You can show. You can. You can have shooting on TV, but God forbid you have sex. Okay. But you know what? That's what it is. Brendan Carr will come after you if you air that. So. I'm just telling you, this is one of my hobby horses and I'm going to bring it up anytime I can. Sex is a positive. Violence is a negative. We should embrace the former. You and the French. All right. You can live in France. Craig, which star that we saw last night is going to be most impressive to your mom? Oh, to my mom. To my mom. That's a great question. Anyone involved with Dancing with the Stars? So we saw Julianne and Derek Hough. That was. was big yeah that's a good one sally field sally field mom loves sally field and also kaylee cuoco mom is a big kaylee cuoco fan yeah most random george rr martin was there just like chilling on the couch at the hbo party david zaslav was very excited to show me that george rr martin was there yeah yeah there was a lot of good okay my guy tim robinson was there it was it was good chair company got no love unfortunately mark ruffalo was as i passed i only overheard about 10 seconds of this seemed to be either explaining or arguing to jason bateman about the warner brothers and paramount merger he seems to care very much of the party about telling everybody about that but that was based on my 10 seconds of overhearing this conversation craig how was your hand you got stabbed by an emmy at the hbo party yes i literally got stabbed by an emmy we were going down the stairs at the hbo party and somebody was coming up somebody holding an emmy i don't know who it was and the prong the prong on the emmy is much sharper than i than i thought and it stabbed me between my two fingers and i drew blood that's unbelievable you literally there's a metaphor there somewhere yes it's on the town instagram you can see my bloody hand you were impaled by a sharp emmy at the hbo party i know there's a lot of emmys in the books thank you lucas thanks man we are back with the call sheet craig we're back from toronto give me your assessment of your first toronto international film festival i had a great time i don't know if it was just because the weather in toronto is a lot better than the weather in park city but i found the festival to be extremely accessible the people were really nice you can stay right downtown it's the best right there's a lot of theaters you can kind of just walk everywhere despite the fact that you're in a huge city um i had a great time we went to the top of the cn tower yes like we had a nice lunch and the tallest building in north america yeah no i thought it was great i really did i i it's like a complete reversal from something like sundance which is like the you have to take the bus and you got to walk up the hill in the snow and it's hard to stay and find a hotel to stay at the parties all suck and they're in some basement yeah these are like nice cosmopolitan restaurants yes much much more accessible and commercial we saw actually a lot of movies some good some bad we don't have to talk them all but the interesting thing about toronto as we've talked about before is the people's choice award it is the top honor at toronto and it is by far the best indicator of a best picture nomination yeah i can give you some numbers on that 18 of the last 20 people's choice award winners have gotten a best picture nomination including last year with hamnet the year before was a weird mike flanagan movie that wasn't but the year before that was american fiction then the fabelmans like going on and on and on and the question this year is what is going to win the people's choice award and i have an opinion on this one would you like to offer yours first given we're basing our we were only there from thursday through monday and there are a lot of movies that we did not see and there are a lot of movies that have since premiered so this is an inexact science but we did talk to a lot of people there and we were at a few of the key screenings so we could judge the crowd and the enthusiasm and do you have a take on i do judging on the buzz at the festival and what people seem to be talking about the most maybe it maybe it was just because it was kind of the biggest surprise but to me clearly i play rocky was the most talked about movie of the weekend when we were there agreed and it's kind of shocking given peter farrelly i mean after green book which did the same thing green book premiered at toronto and got the audience award and went on to not only get nominated for best picture but to win despite all of the you know problematic nonsense around it and people didn't love it it won best picture and this movie this i play rocky movie i think is also going to get a best picture nomination and it's probably going to win the people's choice award it's funny when we were at i think i think they previewed this movie at cinema con did they not they played some clips yeah and i remember everybody kind of i don't want to say everybody laughed but everybody was skeptical like this almost looked like a tv movie a lifetime thing it does i know it feels that way and i worry when they start showing it on the academy portal and people see it in sort of hoity-toity screenings that some of the broader moments in it and the hokiness that's gonna really be exposed because the toronto crowds are just so warm and they laugh at everything and they were along for the ride on this movie from the beginning and sometimes that doesn't translate outside of the toronto film culture there like you if they debuted this movie at telluride i don't know if it would have been the same but they didn't that's the reason why they didn't you know a bunch of like billionaire nepo snobs at telluride probably wouldn't love this movie yeah i i thought this movie it just played way better than i i thought it would i think the casting was really impressive yeah the guy anthony ipolito who plays stallone it's about the creation of rocky if you don't know he's very very good and it's just heartwarming it's really funny and it just plays really well i the word of mouth i think is going to be really strong i agree the sleepers for me i loved wild horse nine the new martin mcdonough movie and they're playing that there and i and i think that that could have a shot it's a crowd pleaser a little different in tone but it's really funny i loved it i also thought that the debut the jesse eisenberg movie with julianne moore her performance is pretty amazing and it's a crowd-pleasing comedy as well paul giamatti's great in it i could see that being a dark horse as well um maybe one of the can movies like club kid we saw fjord and um i don't think that's that's a candidate for people's choice but i i think it will likely come down to i play rocky the debut and maybe wild horse nine all three of which could get best picture nominations totally i'm gonna make you make a call that's that's the point of the call sheet so what are you picking i'm picking i play rocky yeah just judging on like the standing ovation afterward and talking to people who are just so effusive afterward you know and amazon will screen it a lot it's hard though man it's really hard i wouldn't have predicted hamnet last year sure i mean they're everyone's crying at the end but you know i mean yeah it doesn't always have to be a comedy but the last five years it's hamnet life of chuck american fiction fableman's in belfast all right i'm gonna stick with i play rocky i kind of can't shop producer craig horlbeck our news jesse lopez and stephano 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