#2 Sandra Valle - From Mexico to Estonia

Welcome to the podcast found in Estonia, where we talk with foreigners who have made Estonia their home. In each episode it's going to be me, Tina, and Kaiser, my co-host, and we are going to talk with one foreigner who already lives in Estonia. This podcast aims to bring our listeners together, inspire more open-mindedness and just to share interesting stories and observations that many foreigners with their fresh eyes can offer. Among the podcast, we also plan to organize events and get together in real life. And the best way to never miss any information about that is to go to our website, which is found in estonia.e and become part of our community. By the way, if you join our email community in August, which is right now, which is our launch month, then together with Estonian Organic Frequence Company Hurum, we actually have a kiss for you. So go to our website and read more how to get it. [Music] And now we're going to talk with Sandra. The name does sound like an Estonian name, but she is actually from pretty far away. She's from Mexico, and she's been living in Estonia for 10 plus years now. In a minute, we're going to jump right into it. How she ended up in Estonia. What does Winter mean to her? What does she actually think about sauna and spa? We also talked about religion, university systems, food, like yellow, yellow and hearing gas, and there's one topic that's just resurfaced again and again and again. And it's the weather. So Sandra has a lot to say about the weather, and she also has few tips on how to survive winter here. And now let's just jump right into it, hearing how she describes a typical Estonian true her eyes, and then let the conversation unfold from there. Enjoy! [Music] It's my first impression. Very quiet, very focused, very noisy during summer days. What do you remember that? When I arrived in Estonia, it was autumn, like a Java, something like that. It was not the beginning of summer. And then I noticed the next year, and when it was summer, that in the sauna, everybody was changing completely and smiling and laughing. And it was like, "What happened?" This is not the same person. It's a new breed of Estonians arrived. Yeah, they mutate when it's summer times. They become more happy and smiling. But typically, I would say very reserved in their thoughts, in their emotions, and very careful and always kind of planning the future. This is my first, how I perceive it, because later on, I try to analyze why they are like that. And I think it's the winter place, a big roll in here, because you have to plan how your house is going to be. During winter times, it has to be warm, you have to have enough food, you have to plan everything. So I think Estonians are always looking forward on what is coming, while in Mexico we don't do that very often, because weather is really really good with us. We don't need to plan like, what are we going to eat tomorrow, or how the house is going to be warm in winter. Yeah, here if you go to a road trip or something, you have to pack for each weather. You have to be prepared for everything. That's true. That is something that I also will say that describes Estonians. They are always ready, even if they go to visit grandma for one day. They are like, "Oh, let's take the umbrella and maybe this weather jacket and the other weather jacket and the bed as well." And the rubber boots, what is it, training. And then the sandals in case that it's really warm, because the weather can go from, I don't know, 20 to, in the night, drop into. Yeah, but I guess that's more true during the summer, during the winter you always have to bring very good clothes. You just have to protect your neck, your ears. And don't smile too much. Thank you. You can have free, if it's minus degrees outside. That's the first time I hear somebody say that don't smile too much during winter. So I'm very smiley. I think that's one of my personality things, like I should really smile. So have you experienced it? I don't know when it was winter. I was smiley. I was like, "Oh my God, I feel like. Because this area has a lot of humidity and when it's minus, it can be very difficult." So now I understood why in winter time people don't want to be talking in the bus station. I'm making conversation. They want to keep the energy and keep the warm. While I was used to just talking in the bus station with someone next to me, "Hey, hi!" Speaking with stranger. Oh yeah, you never do that in a store. That's blasphemous. In here, someone will consider that you are out of some. Like, you're a weird coach. The net ticker. How would you say that? Exactly. You never speak with strangers in here. But typical stonians, yeah, I think they are really. Really strategic thinking in their minds and but very positive about the future all the time. And that's one of the things that the contrary reflects is always this positive thought. Because the country is developing all the time and it's something good to see. Which is really weird because I would have never thought that to describe a stonians is very positive thinking. Yeah, future forward for sure. But positive thinking that just goes against the Estonian grade. So just maybe so used. People always wanting more and wanting better. They are very clear. They are very clear. It's very difficult to satisfy the stonians in the sense that they are never happy. And I think when they are happy, they are saying they are not happy. They don't know what to do with the happy. Exactly. How to handle everything is completely fine and good. Most Estonian have some trouble expressing their emotions. Inside we feel all happy, I guess. I think so. I think that's what I started to understood. Because I would say that my perception at the very beginning is that stonians are really the first time I met them. Really grumpy. They are very serious. They don't talk with anybody. How can I make friends? And then I understood that they are actually thinking further and they are planning something. And in their mind, once everything falls into places, then they become happy. But at the same time, they are always looking like what can be better. And I think that's one of the things that this country has developed so fast and very nicely. So in the sense, positive, I mean they are always looking into how to improve things. That's nice. All right, so we got a little bit ahead in here as well. And we forgot to introduce you. So do you want to introduce yourself and start from saying what's your name, where you are from, and how did you end up in Estonia? Okay. This I can do. My name is Sandra. So I am from Mexico. [inaudible] I end up in Estonia obviously because of law. I don't think that there are many girls in Estonia that are here without any other reasons, because otherwise, it's very challenging and the culture is completely different. But I met my husband in Mexico back in 2003. Oh God, that was long time ago. 17 years ago? Wow. It feels like a long time ago and some days it feels like yesterday. It's difficult to describe. And then we leave there I think until 2006. So three years. Well, he was already speaking Spanish and when we met, of course, he was not speaking Spanish. So I taught him how to speak Spanish and it was really romantic. And then he worked in Mexico. We worked together there. We lived there in Monterey. And after some time he said, "You know, I missed the snow. I missed the changing season and I missed the black bread." And I was like, "What are you talking about? What is the snow?" Have you ever seen snow before? I will tell you a story later. I did and it was really. strange because the first time I saw it's now in Mexico was when Prit came to Mexico. Yeah, that's here. Yeah, Prit is so now we are Prit is my husband. Yeah, very stunning name which is very funny because in Mexico we have a glue that name is Prit and then all my Mexicans from because we don't know about Prit and Prit and double bowels are completely something from all other universities. So we call them Prit and like the glue and my friends say "oh you're sticking together!" And here is Prit and I then I understood this really common name in Estonia but yeah he went to Mexico and and then the winter it was Christmas and he said like with this weather temperature if it's dropped one degree it's gonna start to snow and we all were laughing like "come on we are in Mexico, in Mexico we don't have snow" and he said "you will see if this weather temperature drops one more degree and I was like "what is that degree?" How do you know that? Because we don't really care a lot about the weather in terms of oh is it 10 anyways it starts to snow that Christmas time and we all Mexican when crazy I think the next day the city government started to put the salt on the streets and I mean it was snowing just for one hour so that sounds like snow in Ireland it was nothing like they really snowed centimeters down and they didn't even close it and I took and that next day I mean I think it snowed for an entire night the next day it was still some snow in the floor so I went I took a lot of clothes and I took different pictures to pretend that I was like winter vacations I don't know, that was my first time I chose snow and it was the Britain in Mexico and then the funny thing is when I came to Stonia it was the first time that bridge says like in years that Estonia didn't have any snow during Christmas time so we said like "oh you brought snow to Mexico" and now we brought the green Christmas to Stonia but yeah we met there and after some time he wanted to come here to Stonia and for me it was just interesting to see like the culture and the change of seasons like I don't know what winter what is autumn and and all seems like a fairy tale like this picture so about the country the medieval castles and I thought I want to be the princess I want to go there and then he said then actually in Stonia when you get a maternity leave you can go up to like three years I was like are you kidding I can Mexico you get three months and that's it it's just like in US so I think that one of the reasons what I came was because of the good the children yeah I mean why not? you're planning that your body is well planned in the best way I ate something so I thought like why not I mean it's good opportunity to be at home with the kids so yeah so that's why I came to Stonia with him nice so how long have you been here already then? I think 2006 until now is it 14 years? almost 14 years almost 14 years come on wow that's a lot that's a lot yeah have you been back? yes we tried to go back at least every second year but we do this way that my mom and my family tried to come one year and then we go the next year but when we go we go like four a month so I want the kids to speak Spanish as well because at home we are really Estonia and environment with the school and the environment really really makes an effect like when you are in some place if they go to the school Estonia and the friends are standing of course they speak Estonia and so when I'm with them I try to speak as always Spanish but they're growing this they spend a lot of time with friends but we go to Mexico I try to recharge my batteries every time I go there it's more about the sunshine you mean? yes or is it about the people? I'm like oh my god emotions emotions again I can see from people's faces how they feel about me yes yeah I surprisingly about one of the things that I miss it the most when I came to Stonia like the emotions and the people talking but when I go back to Mexico right now it's just so much why is it speaking too much? I think it's also about like what you get used to like when you're already been used to this Estonia and environment where it's quiet and there's a lot of room for introspection and people don't like kind of fill the room with a lot of chatter and conversation then when you go to an environment like that it's very noisy and can be very overwhelming it is I think I didn't know I I thought at the beginning like why people in here they don't open up and they don't say like a lot when they're like on the bosses like I and now when I go back to Mexico it's like I can't think because everybody's stuck at the same time I just want to you know listen to myself a little bit and then they ask my family like are you angry? Is there something wrong right now? I'm like no I'm just thinking thinking and and then my husband's like oh you're becoming an Estonia very true yeah so what are typical Mexicans like then? hmm I think Mexicans are very diverse I mean we are really a big country so it's it's kind of difficult to describe what is a typical Mexican but I think we share the same values we care a lot about the family and friends and relatives the family is lo primero which means family goes always first I think that that value is something that united us and so I will say typical Mexican is someone who spent time with the mom with family with friends with yeah talking always about their plans and tomorrow and in a sense like party plans like what are we going to do tomorrow let's do this birthday party and we are really cheerful we are always making like plans for how to meet with each other let's go to the beach in summer let's make this you know a birthday for the grandma or wedding plans you notice the same kind of approach to family life here in Estonia as well learn really I was surprised to see that the people don't spend time with their relatives and with their families in here it's not common to say I'm gonna go and visit my mother for the weekend or everybody tries to stay away exactly yeah so that's the different but I think the moms here are also really independent like they like their space so it's in that sense it's very different and for me it was like when Prid was living in Mexico I asked every weekend please call your mom and he said like why there's nothing wrong why should I call her just tell her how are you doing in Mexico it's like no I will call her when I have something to say yeah that's typical when I live abroad then it's also like I noticed that my contact with my parents I keep it minimum because I'm like basically living local life I guess I don't feel the need to contact them all the time yeah so you don't need to do that checkup point yeah but do you do it right now or how often do I think I right now I have a really busy life with the kids and house and the dog and the work and I mean I'm in my 40's I oh I think it's the time I can't believe it it's the time of the life when the life gets really really busy so and we have technology right now I I text my mom I guess every day hey I'm gardening I'm here the kids here's the dog so I'm kind of checking up at least one or twice a week often for Estonian standards but but not the conversation I used to have like when I was in the university when I went out from home I was calling her almost like every day and spending hours on the phone because back then we didn't have any of the social media technology Facebook or whatever so I just call her and spend half an hour just talking about my day and yeah that's really nice that we find time to listen how is it in Mexico that when you when you leave home or when you go to the university do you actually still continue to live at home or do you go to the campus or like how independent are Mexican young people I guess that's a very interesting question because depends where you live I Mexico there's no many places where you can go to the university sadly we don't have universities everywhere so people are young students are pushed to move to big cities to continue with their studies I will say in Estonian it's similar because you don't have universities in in Hiyuma or islands yeah yeah not on the islands but you know in Estonia the distances are way Yes, it's really. Two hours on a bus once per week is way different than maybe having to fly. I don't know. Yeah, I took bus for ten to four hours. Jesus. So, that's long. Here would take a bus from Tallinn and then start driving. You would end up in Poland, like four countries later. This is surprising. Yeah, this is what I know. It's like in here you can cross a country. But to go back to your question, like the independency, I think most of the students in Mexico, they go to study when they become 18. They have to go to the university. But sometimes you go back home. And sometimes we do have this profile of people living with their mom until they have 30 or even 40 stay at home. So we are less independent in the sense. It's like I have seen in here a young custodian moving away from their families when they are really young, like 15, 16. Which that is not really normal in Mexico, I would say. When you think about the fact as well that in Mexico, families are very close-knit, so everybody's like kind of in everybody's business anyway. It's kind of hard to pull away from that, I think. And maybe you don't even want to because you're used to the fact that you are being supported and held by your family unless it's like the situation is really complicated. I would presume that people like their fact that somebody is taking care of them all the time. Yes, I mean, the independency is people are really different, but the society it is really supportive. We have really strong connection with the family and also the friends and neighbors. So it's difficult to become completely independent or even to try because sometimes family is also pulling you back in. Like don't go too far, you have to visit me and you've grown mom on how come you're gonna miss this birthday. But if you want to be really independent in Mexico, you have to fight a little bit with the culture. But again, it can depends on the people. So how old are your children already? My daughter is 11, oh my god. And my son is 9. Wow. So they go to school here, right? Yes. Yes. Do you want them to have an experience of living in Mexico as well? Or what is your take on that? What's your plan for future? Are you so astounding? I already have a plan. Because astounding question. So about the future. Do you have a plan? I think I'm not that astounding. But I have wishes. Of course, I wish the kids would go to Mexico and experience this school in Mexico. We went to three months last year. We spent three months with the kids in Mexico. Otherwise, it was for the different challenge because we went in April, May and June. And it was summer. And we couldn't go outside a lot because it was really, really warm. But of course, I wish I could have put them in some Mexican school and have more of Mexican friends. They could understand my route. But I mean, they're still small. I hope that we can go at least one month a year. So they can make friends. But they're really stony and kids. Do they speak Spanish? They do. They do speak Spanish. But I would say not the same Spanish that I speak. But we have one rule at home. If they want to watch cartoons, we have Netflix. I said, only in Spanish. If you want to do something, you have to watch it in Spanish. Of course, when I'm not looking, they change it to English. And then I have to be like a grumpy mother. Say, go back to Spanish. But they speak Spanish. And every night, they are not very small kids. But every night, we try to read some history in Spanish. So it's working progress, working progress. No, but I think it seems to be a very good approach because kids are like sponges when they're kids. I learned German from watching TV. So cartoons, so I would presume that they would do the same. And eventually, once they get an interest, then they want to go. And maybe you just have to leave them in Mexico for a month and go away. And then they have to learn to be independent. And if they want anything, they have to explain themselves. Spanish. My name is-- My name is Cacán for you. My Mexican side, a mom, will not allow me. No, really. I was in no stay with me. But I think you're right. I think at some point, they have to experience this country by themselves without me, maybe in the future. They love Mexico. They love the food. They love being with the family. They like it there. So why not, let's see? So if your children are watching cartoons in Spanish, how has your learning Estonian been to speak in Estonian and how did you learn it? Marragin, estichelo, guapa, palio, y muy du quimas, y naro, guica. Yeah, I understand. Everything I took Estonian lessons when I arrived in the trip. I took like three years. I really, really wanted to learn. And one of the things that helped me-- and I am sure that many of my Latin friends will not like what I'm going to say-- but I tried really hard to stay away from other Latin and Spanish speakers. It was really difficult because at the beginning, I just wanted to feel more comfortable and be where everywhere. I was speaking Spanish like I want to be with them. But then I had to be very hard on me and say, and if I want to learn the culture, I just have to be with Estonians and have Estonians friends. And I am really pushy with myself. So I was reading every day in a study and watching Estonians, which is funny, because they are Mexican soap operas translated in Estonians. So it was really easy for me to understand what they were talking about and then listening to the Estonians that was-- What's your favorite soap? What's your favorite Mexican soap translated in Estonians? I'm not very like what I was saying here. What I was-- it was funny for me. But everyone seems to know what is Rosa Salvajan. Yeah. Because when I grew up-- Come on. This was like our-- before you go to bed, kind of TV series. I don't think I know that. I know like-- You-- it's a cross. It's a cross. I know the one. I know Mexican. Got to do an egg roll and things like that. OK. OK, maybe you're younger than me, then that's why the reason. But I think it's for dinner. Yeah. Because I was watching Rosa Salvajan, liking the original language. And then I came here and then Estonians were like, roberto, no. I was like-- [LAUGHS] [SPEAKING SPANISH] Oh, man. Rosa Salvajan. So funny. But the language in Estonian is really hard. I'm still improving. Although I think I'm good in it, I-- writing it is something that is still a challenge for me. Because Estonians have so many different cases. And grammar is not very common. Like we have articles and pronouns. And then Estonians, you just put the cases. And the end of the word. So the word changes all the time. So that makes it more difficult. But yeah, I like the language. It's hard. I will say that before when I was living in Mexico, I didn't even know what was Estonian. I wanted to learn French because it's a romantic. But in Estonian, what I like right now is, every time we go back to Mexico, I feel like I can speak, like in a secret language, no one will understand. Yeah. That's what they most commonly said, excuse is as well, for learning Estonians. If you go to anywhere else in the world, everybody thinks that it's made up language. Yes. And when we were in Mexico with the kids last year, they spent three months. And then we were in the shop and supermarket. And I wanted to say something. So nobody will understand. And I was like, yeah, Mines is not to Canada. I say, yeah, yeah, yeah, Cortoni, palio. Yo, Xe, yo, Xe. I wanted some parking kind of Disneyland, but Mexico style. So I wanted to do going from because there are so many people just grab a place. And we were speaking in Estonian. And then Mexico really took it. And they came to me, what language are you talking? This is really interesting. Where are you from? So what did you say? I'm a converted Mexican into Estonian. Yes, it's Mexican. Estican. Yeah, that's one of the other things. So you went to university, right? What did you study in university? In Estonia, I went to Sonia University. Oh, what did you do? Oh, OK. I told them maybe back in Mexico. Back in Mexico, I finished my bachelor degree in international business. And when I came to Estonia, then I thought I mean, in Estonia, in the year of my university probably is something no one nobody knows and I also wanted to learn Estonia and have more friends so I finished my master degree in Talling Technica, Ulygol. Tall Technica now, I think. Tall Technica now. Yeah and they change every day. All right so I did my Master in Business Administration and I actually finished it when I was with the small my small daughter so it was a bit challenging but I yes I did that. Is there relations? Yeah congratulations. Thank you. Is there a big difference between Mexican universities and Estonia and universities now that you have an experience on board? I think some some things are different of course but but well it's yeah not not that much. I don't I can't think. University life is still the same. You have the study you have to oh well the only difference is of course you cannot pay someone here to give you a diploma. Well in Mexico maybe in some schools is possible. Oh like to bribe someone? Yes. Is it very corrupt in Mexico? Mexico I think it is it's part of the bureaucracy I think that has the lead of us to find some short ways if Mexico bureaucracy will be less and things will move maybe right now I mean I haven't been living in Mexico for long time maybe right now Mexicans are better but when I was in the university bureaucracy and paperwork was really hard like going into the university you needed to have like the receive of here and there and make a line from the morning to and if you know someone that knows someone that is friend of someone maybe you will get chance to go to the university it is it's not university it's not for everybody sometimes you have to wait your turn to get in so I think in that sense is it the same in Estonia that you have to gain your grant to go to the university now really actually now for like five years I think I might be wrong that it's free to study in universities for everybody so now like you don't really need to get the grant either like you get the grant when you have good grades then you get like a scholarship grant money supporting you but yeah but anyone can go here right well I don't know I guess it depends also in terms of like whether an Estonian citizen or if you're foreigner or then you probably have to apply into the you know the bachelor or master's programs and then you could do come for semester or maybe longer but back in 2004 when I went to the university basically if you had the final exams then anybody could enter to the university just there was the main difference that the country or the government every year like they expect the certain amount of field specialists you know to graduate so there are certain spots that are for free and then there's like extra spots where you might have to pay for a year to fee or you have to like buy or pay for them points I don't know how the pointing system happens around here but no everybody's free so I don't think it's the same for every university there's still like special universities yeah and private one yeah private ones or like open like even in the art academy where it's like you have to if you want to go to the open academy part which is not like essentially the university part is like open for everybody and you want to study then you still have to pay but yeah in general this don't you know education it's pretty cool I think the Sonia education is really good and I I love my experience as a student and I think the teachers were really knowledgeable of what they were teaching I just want to say like in Mexico a university is for everybody the thing is like we are so many that we have to sometimes wait like in terms of infrastructure capability of the university itself might not be that big that you can feel into all the people who want to call yeah Estonia University was nice and here good experience I actually have a weird question as well in relation to grownups going back to school in Mexico is that a thing over there or is it more like you know in Estonia re-educating yourself and going back to school even when you're 30 40 50 it doesn't really matter you have the chance and people often use that is it common in Mexico to do that as well or is it more like you learn something and then you stay on that field forever and ever and ever I personally love to see when people go back to university when they are on their 50 40s I did have a classmate and in my university woman she was 45 and she was there with us learning and she said like oh I want to finish university because I got married when I was very young it is not common you don't see that every day but there's always someone so it's you can see it how do you see it here do you see people going back to university well I personally haven't been to university twice and that was back when I was well I never graduated so it's been and then I went back to a regional training center so that's kind of like vocational studies that's when you are more like in the end you get like an associate degree or a diploma which essentially you learn for a certain job or so either graphic designer or headdress or cook or whatever educational school yeah vocational school basically and this kind of applied studies yeah there you see a lot like I had like coursemates that were like 55 62 one even and even my grandpa goes to like this they call it like senior university and he's like 94 so I think study never ends that's really surprising that's really really nice but you know he's a little bit like out of the ordinary in general I think he just wanted the title of being really old and in school wow that's so inspiring yeah so my experience has been that I studied in Eka which is the arts academy in telling and I feel like like arts and design is like one of those specialities or one of those areas where people are they study something else then they work and then they come back for their passion so there's always like almost in every specialty groups because groups are pretty small you can see at least one who is like on their second or third like round of university and then it's quite common like in my group there was as well somebody and he blended in really nicely so everybody got along and I was like enriching the group I feel like I think that was my experience as well that I having like people with different age groups actually gave so much different perspective especially when it comes to design like if you have a group of let's say 16 different people then you get 16 different viewpoints on one and the same exercise and the older you are the more different it is from the ones that are like just 20 year olds so there's like 30 40 degrees of either experience or just different culture background already in there that you build in and I think that was at least in my case that was the interesting part and which I found was really cool and the older you are the more motivated you are as well which makes it really nice to go to the university with people that actually want to be there rather than feel the need that they have to be there you know when you're 20 and out of school you're kind of like oh I have to but you don't you know but we're not really told that in the early beginning at least in Australia it's like you have to go to the university and you're like why do I have to go every third person has already a university degree so I think that in terms of education the entire world need to develop and learn because I'm with you I think that when you combine different ages in a group you can get so much more from different angles like when you have all teenagers or all the same age in the same room everyone is kind of the same but when you combine this I think the growth and education can be more dynamic and like good for everybody but yeah I mean education don't get me started yes I have kids I'm worried I would like to see some something some changes and I think with the corona times I saw a lot of changes but in terms of a institution and yeah let's talk about that maybe in another podcast we can switch topic so what about if we talk about Estonia what are your favorite places to see or visit or when you have friends coming over are there any certain things that you definitely want them to see or experience oh my god Estonia is very beautiful country I can't think in one place I think the city center it has a lot of history and it's one of the places that is really magical and you feel like inside like a movie a Harry Potter I don't know if you're working in the night with this cast and then if you go to the very old Apotheca you know the Draftec probably in the middle yes that's it's It's a very magical experience to be in the old town, but I like the forest. I think the Stonion Forest is really relaxing. When you get into the forest and you have the berries just there waiting for you to grab them, the forest gives you so much calmness and fresh air and the view. I think that's my view of the reason why I mean the Stonions they love forests, they love nature and when you are there then you feel like I can go very deep into myself and relax and think and the air is so clean. So I am fond of collecting mushrooms in Natham, like Uca Senet and Puravek. I have so much fun with the kids going into the forest. Well, in the summer I go into the beach, come into the city center, walk in around. And in winter I am still struggling with the winters. If someone comes to visit the Stonion during winter I will have a little bit of struggles kind of finding recommendations, but I will say winter is good to go into the spa. You have a lot of spa in the Stonion. It's a good recommendation as well. Yes, but it's not a lot of looking into outside the city, but I didn't know what was an spa because in Mexico when you go to the beach that's already an spa. Are the beaches of Mexico and beaches of Stonion different? Are they even different? Yeah, well in here the water is not salty. Oh, okay. That was the first thing I noticed when I came. Like, what are the waves? Yeah. There are waves. Have you been on the islands? You can definitely get waves. No, no, you get big waves there. Maybe when it's like a storm, but my husband is from Hima. We go to the Hima Bay of An. But the waves are like, oh, very nicely, very nicely. And calm like Stonion's second. But first time I came to Stonion I went to Pirita. Yeah. To Pirita Beach. And I was like, is this a lake? Why is it so big? Why the water is not salty? It's kind of not even like, it's kind of sweet. And in Mexico the water is really, really salty. So I tested it. This is not like the typical sea water. And I was expecting the waves like very biol and a whole coming into the stones and like kind of, you know, you can. Yeah, it's different. But in here you can find also the big, big waves. Not for surfing, I would say. But there are surfers as well. Like I've been to any of the, yeah, the wind surfers mostly. Not like the board surfing as it is like in Australia or somewhere else. There's this thing called in Hima as well, I think. Paradise Island. Paradise beach. So there are some places but you really have to know where to go to or the wind and, you know, the nature works together so that there are enough waves to walk down. Yes. Do you win, sir? No, I don't know how to win, sir. But I would like to try it one day. It looks really nice. I start into skateboarding. I want to experience one day winter in a proper way, like going to some. Winter vacation. I have been afraid of having winter vacation and enjoying it. But I want to push myself to enjoy the winter. And get rid of this thing that I can't do anything on winter just to go to spas. So I'm trying to learn how to use the skateboard so I can use a snowboard. Ah, okay, so you want to learn how to snowboard. Have you skied in a stony, cross-country skied? Yeah, so difficult. It looks really easy. No, and I don't want to try it again. You got it. That was really hard. Now you sound exactly like us when we're 12 and we are forced to do that in school. I don't want to try that. It's really hard, but I see a lot of personas they love and they enjoy. Well, it's kind of the same thing like going to the nature. It's like if you go and pick mushrooms or forage for like barriers, then during the winter time. Did you go to ski? Yeah, I know how to do the basic like with two hands, like push forward, but I can't do the cross the. Oh, I love that. I love that. That is the best thing. I can't do that. But I did like when I was small, like I don't I think like three or four. My mother already put me to skis and send me to a park to like. Yeah, like a slip there. And then few like four or five years ago, I went to Switzerland and it was my first time on actual skiing on a mountain and I was like, oh, I'm from Estonia. I've been skiing like forever. And then I went to the mountain and that didn't end well. That was a pain. Oh, God. I am so surprised to see the kids in the kindergarten. They are wearing these skis. They have lessons to learn how to ski. And in the school as well. They even have marathons if you notice. I know. They're trying to teach them. They're early on to run, to ski, to do all sorts of sports stuff. Yeah, I was surprised. I was surprised that my kids are skiing. Oh my God. Do you have any other like pocket list items or activities that you're discovered here or you're started to like or you would like to try to do? Let me think a little bit. I think there's always room for more. Oh, I think my biggest challenge is how can I make peace with the winter? I have to make peace with the winter. I used to love the winter the first time I came. It was so magical and pretty and beautiful and that was just you being in love. Exactly. Maybe. It was, but it was the winter. It was very beautiful. It looks nice. And the first year was like, oh, why people don't like winter? It's so beautiful. So now you understand. The second year was like this snow. I mean, it's not going away. It's like you have been here for a while. It's no go away. And third year is like again, it's no like I have to clean my car. And I have to cannot even go out. It's so much snow. It starts getting annoying after a little while. What about last winter? We didn't have almost any snow. Yes. And then I started to miss a snow again. Sounds like it's going to be a good time. Sounds exactly like a snow. I know that I'm telling you. I'm not 100% Mexican anymore. I don't know what happened. But I think that what we had last year, it was like autumn forever. You know what I mean? Yeah, that went really long. That was fun. For me, it was like being in Ireland for the last two years. This was like the perfect winter ever because I was afraid when I come back, it's going to be like minus 30 just for the sake of me coming back. So for me, that was like actually really nice autumn new weather. I didn't really mind it because it wasn't raining as much as it does in Ireland. But in Ireland, you have kind of similar weather all through the winter. And it rains and you have storms and you have everything else. So in that sense, it was quite nice. But happy to hear how Estonian perceive the winter. Okay, I'm not alone. I'm not alone. No, it's long. I was actually born on my mom still tells me. I was born on a winter when it was minus 35 degrees outside. The windows were covered with mattresses in the hospital. And I was born on a day like that. I'm like, "Yes, see, that's why I don't like winter anymore." I was born in such a cold that these days I can't really stand the cold. I like it when it's like minus three or really warm and you got this really nice snow. But when it gets slushy, it's bad when it gets minus 20 degrees, it's like, "How about you, Tina?" I was actually born on a winter as well and really cold day. And like first, I was. Winter girls. Yeah. And I was born at home. So the first thing they had to take me to the hospital through it outside. So I got cold exposure, I guess. But I think it had a good influence on me because I go winterswimming and I enjoy spending time outside. Not like every day all day. But like when it's minus 20, then I still go like outside and be like "Wink, walk, walk, walk, walk fast." "Don't stop." But I go winterswimming and I like going to sauna and like. Winterswim. Yeah. Oh yeah, that's your next level. That's one for the bucket list. Okay, let's put it in the bucket list. Yes. My kids born in February. They are winter kids. Oh my god, I didn't know that you can't put the babies to sleep outside in a stonia. How creepy is that? Like, I'm sorry. My mom, when I sent her like pictures like mom, the babies are sleeping outside, it's like minus 10 outside and they're sleeping like babies. They're sleeping so nicely and. That's a secret ingredient. They slept so well during winter outside. But the first time I was afraid like, "How can I put my baby to sleep outside?" It's a snow, it's minus degree. This is not human. What are you talking about? Estonia and cold. Yes. We won't ever do that in Mexico. One night you can teach everybody how they do the stuff in a stonia. But I guess in Mexico it would be too hot to put the baby to sleep outside anyway. Yes, exactly. No, they will. They. They do you take it? They do you take it? Yeah, they will start to sweat and probably time. Yeah, I like that. That's a little. Winter so scary. Yeah. Yeah. Do you have anything that you wish you would have known before moving? I'm sure Brit was telling you a lot about Estonia, but do you feel like were you prepared? So, he's typical Estonia, I mean he has changed a lot because we'd be married. But when I ask him, like, "Okay, let's go back to Estonia." It seems very interesting. I like that the maternity leave takes up to three years. So tell me more. And he said, "I'm going to tell you more." Mexico and Estonia, they are opposite. I'm like, "No, no, no, tell me more." But I told you already, "What? That they are opposite." No, but I mean, please honey, just go into detail. No, you will see. So he didn't want to share too much with me. So I didn't know anything. And then I thought, "That's good because I don't want to be biased. I don't want to arrive somewhere and think like I know everything already." So I came here thinking in Estonia and Mexico, they are opposite. So I'm going to find out how come they are opposite. And after leaving here for a year, I'm like, "Estonia and Mexico, they are opposite." It's true. Now I know what you mean. It's like, what do you mean with opposite? You know what is white? Yes, you know what is black? Yes, they are opposite, right? Yes. Estonia and Mexico. You know what is the night and what is the "yes" opposite? Estonia and Mexico. [laughter] Do you have any extreme examples of what you experience yourself? Like in here. I mean, even the electricity when I came here, nothing, no, no, my devices work. Let's start with the simple things. I brought my PC. It burnt out because it's so good. It's different. No, also the energy. Oh, yeah. It's serious. I went deep all the while in the America, I think, is 150 marks. Oh, yeah. I didn't know that, actually. Yeah, so you cannot put your devices that some electronics will burn in here because the electricity is just higher. And also the socket, of course. And the thing like Mexican, open and with strangers and speak a lot and are very emotional and here people are more calm. And like, let me think what I'm going to tell you first, then I will say something, maybe. So patience. Patience. And we are really reactive and more, yes, so that's different. And then the fact that in the summertime, it never is cold dark in here. It's always sunny. And in the winter, you never see this sun. We have almost, yeah, sun all the time and typical, sometimes it's different. But in the sense like the summer is very different. Weather wise, different. Foot wise. Here's very plain, very soft. Foot is very gentle with you. That makes spices. Not more, not a lot of, I mean. Now I have more Estonian taste. I put till in my sandwich. And I feel like, wow, I'm this flavor. Kaisa, you know you were the first to introduce to me with silver. Kilo, oil, I. Oh, yeah. Well, it was probably silver more than me because I'm shout out to Silvers, who is our food gourmet guy that introduces everybody to Estonian food. He's the kind of person that can make a sandwich, a plain tomato sandwich, look like it's a gourmet sandwich and introduce it the same way as well. I'm not actually surprised to know. I guess that he was the one. Who's the different in here? I mean, do you enjoy the plain raw fish? Yeah. Uh-huh. It's good. It probably wouldn't last in Mexico, so I think that's the Googlebot. No, I mean, the fish, the Googlebot. Of course. But in here, it's the first time I try raw fish, like Kilovoi-laid and head English. Oh my, I love head English when I came here. I think I ate all the raw fish. It's all Baltic airing. Yes, that's delicious. But in Mexico, we have different spices. Like, if you are not like, I need some water, then that means maybe the food, it was not that good. It was bland. It was plain food. So I learned how to, um, actually my health, it came better in Estonia because I used to eat a lot of spicy food in Mexico, so I had an in Spanish, it's called gastritis, which is this. Like, ulcers or something like that. A lot of acid, because I was, I said refoxed in. Yes, I was eating a lot of like lemon. We eat lemon, like everywhere we even have some, um, like Coca-Cola with lemon. I mean, we put coca-cola. And coca-cocuit lemon. It's horrible. It was a campaign back in the 90s when Coca-Cola, Pepsi actually. Can I say brand side? Sure. Yeah, sure. They introduced Pepsi with lemon for Mexico market. Because we put lemon everywhere, we put lemon in the beer, as you know, corona with lemon and salt. Mm-hmm. So in Estonia, you don't have these lemons. The green ones, I mean, you can't find them, but it's not very often. So I change also my style, how to it, and my gastritis, my acid, fluid, disappeared. So that's all this. So Estonia has had a healing effect on you. Oh, yes. I think as a person, I have this shift of paradigm, shift in my mind, how to see the world, and have grow in terms of, I'm more aware of things now, like changes and people, and also asking myself, is that true? Not because I have been done or used to it. I kind of like thinking more deeply, because you have to release your culture when you're really living in a different country than the reality changes. Like in here, Estonians, they are not religious, right? Not really. Not really. Like, it's really difficult to see Estonians in the church every Sunday, maybe old people. I was going to the church every Sunday and doing my prayers and being very religion, and then I met my husband who said, like, I don't believe in God, and I'm going to make you believe in God. And how is that going? No, I'm asking myself, yeah, I do believe in some force and love, but I don't know if it's the same religion that I was thinking. So I wouldn't say that I changed my religion, but I will say that I changed the way I perceive the religion of it, I guess then. Yeah, the definition. I will say right now, like, I complete to respect if you don't believe in Catholics or anything. But as long as you believe in something, even if it's yourself, then it's completely valid. Like, you have to believe in something. That's very true. I just read an article recently as well. I think it was about Yodipov and where they actually wrote specifically that it's sort of untrue to say that Estonians are not religious. We're not religious in the terms of being the theory in a Catholic, but there's still a certain form of like paganism or spiritualism in people. And even if they don't believe in like going to church and believing in God, they have their own inner God or universal spiritual or whatever external force. Yeah. The first God. Yeah, they're more like spiritual. We believe in something, some higher powers. Yeah, but we don't define it specifically. Exactly. And we should something, some of the things that I change in how do I perceive spirituality and religion because I thought, oh my God, you're going to hell because you are not even baptized and you are not going into the church and you don't know how to break up. And then I mean, I've been living here for a while. I feel like Estonians are really spiritual. Like when they go into the forest, how they respect the nature, how they respect the, how they interact with each other and the respect and the values and then my mind is like, wait, that doesn't mean that they are not the spiritual, they are really spiritual. So it's another way to perceive this universe. It's not wrong, it's just different. So that's something that I learned here. Do you go to the church here as well or not for long or? I haven't been in church for a long time because where I live, there is one church, but I mean, my kids are baptized by the way. So they were baptized in Estonians. This I had to have. For your mom or for yourself? For myself or my family. I'm not sure, but my kids are baptized and this is something that I just had to make sure that this is on my checklist. They are going to go to this. But I don't go to the church anymore, the same frequency like I used to be when I was in Mexico. But I do my praise. I am teaching my child how to pray like Father in Westro, which is how you say, holy Father. Yeah, some things I keep, some things are part of me. But in terms of going again and being so into the church not anymore, but I'm a good person. Well, nobody is saying it's just, I think it's interesting how being in a different country in a different environment changes you as a person in general. It's not just a cultural thing. It's not like you come here and you continue with the same traditions that you do. did back in Mexico, but instead, you know, it turns into this weird fusion type of thing where you keep a certain part of Mexico and then you mesh it together with something that is very Estonian and then I can't even imagine what your kids are going to grow up believing in or thinking like, you know, are they Estonian or Mexican? What do you think? Who do they consider themselves to be? I will say they are very Estonian, but because they how daily, and this is something I also wanted to happen, that I think having like, let's say, your own route is important, your own identity, knowing where you form and your kind of nationality, it's important. I think it's a value, it's part of being human being and I wanted the kids to have very mature who they come from and yeah, they are really Estonian and they speak Estonian and although I want them to understand who am I and where I'm from and understand my roots, I don't want them to feel that they are Mexican because they live in Estonia, so they have Estonian friends and if you ask them, they will say I'm Estonian and this is what I want. They have certainty in who they are and what they are from and then they have the spiciness of Mexican model in there. Yeah, you get to be the spicy one and when they bring their girlfriends and boyfriends, you get to be the nosy Mexican mountain. Tell me all about it. Do they actually go to Estonian school? Yeah, they are. Estonian school there, because Estonian kids, they do everything and they are very serious and reserved and they don't talk with the strangers but it depends. The magic thing here is that they can switch. When we are in Mexico, they switch. This kids, I don't recognize. They are very talkative, they want to try things, they want to open up, they want to ask question and then I like, "Oh." And like, "Well, mom, we are in Mexico. We understand you are like this and in here is okay." Yeah, well ahead, do that. That's a really nice example of how the environment shows you what's normal or you start to feel and act towards or together with the new normal around you. It's kind of mimicry or like being a chameleon that if you go and actually it might end up being a very beneficial trait for them because it makes them very adaptable when it comes to different countries and even if they don't end up in Estonia or Mexico or in some other country, then they might be more open-minded towards them. I would presume. I would know by that. I think the same way. If you would put this in terms of like palette of colors, they have from the black to white. Yes, they have all the shades, all the variety. So when they go into the live, they will have all the colors in there to paint whatever they want to do with their lives. So I hope that is a strength. Hope so. Any funny words in Estonian? Or that like, what do you have? Your favorite ones. Okay, because Estonian is always just talking with my husband yesterday that the other day my sister came to visit me and she said something like in Estonia and Ella and my husband, Ella doesn't mean anything. Ella means something. Ella doesn't mean anything. But it's the same thing. How come Ella and Ella? It's so different. It is. But it is, right? But if someone is in Spanish, she's listening to this right now or they were like, what are they talking about? Like, if you say Ella and Ella, that's a different word. So I had a lot of like funny moments. I took a taxi in Christina and I wanted to go to Nome and I said, take me to Nome. Who they? Nome. Yeah, Nome. You mean Nome? What did I say? No, you said Nome. But I. Okay. Whatever. Okay, so there's like very tiny nuances in there. The boas are my weakness here. Like, I can say something really funny. Like, when we are at home and we have like Estonia and grandma and the kids and we are speaking in Estonian and then I said like, do you know what I mean? They are trying to go bring it. That's funny. But funny words are, yeah. Yeah. What? Stalvo? Yeah, yeah. Am I saying? Yeah. Yeah. It's so. The edge of the ice. I still working on the. That is difficult. If you want to learn Estonia, you have to be very creative with your sound. Like, I'm a sinus struggling. But funny words, I would say, okay, I will come back later. I can't think. I'm sure there are. I know many like double meanings. But one day I was driving when I came to Estonia and there is one school and the name of the school is Peto. And you are very serious, right? Because in Spanish, Peto means like. Gases. So I took a picture and I was like, look, this is one school in here, the name is Peto. What? So that was really funny. How does your family or what does your family think about you living in Estonia? Do they enjoy coming here or are they more like, "Goo, scary." They are like, "Uhh, scary." But they are willing to come when it's summer, only when it's summer. I think it was three years ago, it was April and they thought, okay, it's warm enough. We can go to Estonia, it's a pretty good safe and she came with the sandals without any jacket. My sister came with her baby and baby was like not wearing any even socks. Oh my God. And then it was snowing in April. That year. And they were not ready at all. They came, I saw them in the airport, like, can you put your sweater or jacket or what do you have? No, nothing, Sandrateis. It's hot. April, let's go. No, no, you cannot. What's happening and the baby, can you put him? No, why? It's not summer here. No yet, not yet, not yet. They forgot to watch the weather forecast. We don't watch weather forecast, like why? And they forgot to bring clothes, so I asked my friends with small chas to borrow me this like Estonia and clothes or the baby. And so on, from Combekas? Yes. So we got a Combekas for the girl, she was like nine months old. Wearing nothing but just like a throat. And my mom, we found some clothes from a Brit mom and from my husband and my sister, I landed in my clothes as well and they were like, "Okay, now you're ready to go outside." But now, they ask, "Is it warm?" They learn. Yes. I can go, but is it already hot? Like, I can go outside without the jacket or without the boot? Yes, ma'am. Okay, I will see. So this week will be perfect for them. This week will be perfect. I love this. How are you enjoying the weather right now? It's like typical Estonia, it's like 30 degrees, it's a little bit too hot. I enjoy, like, I was on our countryside, like last week during Yani-Pav and I went swimming like every day so that was super nice. Just to wake up, hang outside the entire day and then go swimming. I enjoy it a lot. I'm surviving on two showers a day because being indoors is absolutely almost impossible. Going outside only on the evening. I like sunshine and I like being in the sun but 30 degrees is a little bit too much for me. Probably. I like swimming and I like doing the beach day once per year. My mom would be completely different, but I'm like, "Yeah." In that sense, I'm not even a summer kid, I'm not even a winter kid, I'm somewhere in between kids. I don't like extremes. I like it when it's somewhere in between. Nice, nice. So that when I'm okay. Yeah, so that I work indoors and I'm not sticking to the table, you know? Okay. I hate that. That's the fine, it's really, really well done. Yeah, it's good weather. But when I was studying back in my elementary school, the weather was really hot, like some 40 degrees outside. And I had to walk from school back home, maybe, I don't know, 5 kilometers with his heat. So I remember when I was in the school, I just went into the bathroom and I just dropped a bucket of water over my head. And you got to dry on your way home. Yes, steaming off. Yeah, yeah. I like a turkey sound. And I like it, you know. The theme is not all the time and then I bought a really agua de orchata, which is water that is made from rice, but it's really really cold. So I was just walking with head here waiting and walking back home and talking with friends and then, "Oh, when I arrived home, I was wet but not from the water that I dropped myself, but the sweat, I was sweating." Like, the weather, it's very different in here. Yes. But right now, even for me, I think my body is getting used to the sun and because it's hot right now. And I'm. I will bet Mexico is like, "How come this is perfect weather to go outside and to go to the beach?" But yeah. So now we have some weird questions for you, like shorter questions, but they all have something to do with weirdness, pretty much. So for example, what is the weirdest food that you ate here? I went to a restaurant and they were selling "Heatingos Yates". And you see, it's even weird for you, right? Hearing ice cream, yeah. I think the weirdest ice cream that I got was the one made of garlic. There was this garlic restaurant in Telling No Tone as well that was serving garlic ice cream. That was a little bit better. Oh, I would try both of them, but probably for once. Yeah. So ice cream from fish that was strange. But also, like, the first time I came this "Heatingos" was something and the "Kilovoi Lava" was like, "Woo, blow in my mind like a how come?" Kali, that's really delicious, but like the drink that is made from black bread, it's really tasty and it was something strange. I think Estonians have a lot of things with apple core, like the sour cream. Yeah. True. They put sour cream everywhere. It's the only way they put sour cream everywhere. But not many weird things, I would say. I think these things were weird enough. What about some weird traditions that you can't figure out? Sauna? Sauna, okay. What can't you not figure out about Sauna? You go to a dark room, you get sweaty and you beat yourself. What's not too bad? Jump into a nice lake. Exactly. Are you listening to yourself? So which part is the problem going into a dark room, getting sweaty or being naked? The part that is very broaded and social, I will be like, when I just came, like I was, you remember, very religious, very kind of like. It's a very proper girl. And then I remember we had a sauna event in the office. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. And going with your colleague to the sauna and seeing everyone in naked or even wearing a sauna. Well, only. That was for me like, "Hasukristov and Dito." Like, "Oh my God, I didn't go that day." I think I was not even, I just left. I was like, "Oh, so important." And like, "Oh my God." And then some friends invited us to their home and they had sauna. And then again, I was like, "Oh, let's go to the sauna." And then they see each other naked and the boys. And then they go, "Very natural with the natural clothes outside." And I was just closing my eyes and like, "Wow, what's happening?" So no sauna in Mexico. No, we don't have sauna in Mexico. So this tradition was something not common for me. Difficult to adapt. But right now I think that when it's winter and it's really cold, I make sauna at home. I still not just going into sauna with a lot of people at the same like Estonians will do it. Like a social event. Let's come all together here. Like, I'm not yet there. But if I go to a spa and I am together with other women in there, I don't feel any more like strange or uncomfortable at the beginning. Like, I was wearing my swimming pool in this past all the time. I feel like I cannot take it away in front of strangers. But right now it's more like, "Oh, it's just. why not? I need to wash myself." Because in Estonia, nudity is more considered to be like something very natural and normal. And probably also for religious reasons, because in the very old times, as far as, you know, the rituals were somewhere in the forest and you had crazy people running around naked in there. That's like all right for us. But when you think about like, religious in terms of like going to the church and everything like that, then that is very private. So maybe it's also the cultural background in there. The way how I always explain to foreigners and the son of culture is like, " Ain't nobody got time to look at you." They're too busy, like, breathing in and, you know, figuring out the heat. Yes, and that's true. And I think that's the part where it's people from other countries, also the religion background. Like in some religion, like exposing your body, it can be a sin. Yes, exactly. I mean, Catholic is a main religion in Mexico. It's not like a sin, but it's always like, if you're a nice girl, you are not even showing your knees, like you have to be very aware of your body. What are you exposing if you are wearing very short thing? You have to be careful how people will see you. And I think that that was my surprise. And now I'm with you. Like when you are there, you are actually not looking what everybody has. No, no, no, no, you're into your business there, in your business. And it is like it is. For a beginner, I know, just someone that just came, it can be like, "Who is going to be looking at me?" No worry. So anyways, I wish them to foreigners coming to see you. No worry is looking at you when you are in San Ana. That's nice. Yeah, that's perfect. It took me time. The dark room. You're sweating anyway. Like, "What's there to look?" Be natural. It's okay. That might be the perfect thing to end on. Do you have any other thing that you would like to mention for foreigners coming to Estonia or considering coming to Estonia to live here? Do you not live here? If you are considering coming to Estonia, try to come in summer. So you will love the weather. And then you can wait next year to have the same experience again. But if you come in winter, you can get tired really easily. And then you will not see the best part. So thank you, girls, for inviting me. It has been really nice. We're super happy that you spent time with us, Sandra. I am. Super happy. Thanks for coming. And spending time with us. That was really nice. Thank you, Tina and Kaisa. (laughs) Okay, we got it.