Speaker 1And I just thought everyone hated me, you know? And I was like the biggest piece of shit walking on God's green earth. So like after a three-day binge, the voices would tell me to go to the mental hospital. I didn't want to go, but I would go out of fear, right? And it's the most terrifying experience, getting on the bus, hearing these voices, checking in. And then once you check into the mental hospital, you can't leave until they let you out. And that's when the voices really attacked my head, you know? Just bringing up every single selfish moment in my life. That time I wasn't there for my son. That time I was a piece of shit to my family. That time I stole money from my ex-girlfriend. They would tell me that I'm the worst father in the world and you don't deserve to live. I was full flight from reality and I thought I was going to die, right?
Speaker 2Hi there. Welcome back or welcome to Recovering Out Loud podcast. The show where we get real about mental health and addiction. I'm so glad you're here. If you or someone you love is struggling with drugs or alcohol, please reach out for help. Send me a message. On all social media platforms at Recovering Out Loud pod or by email at Recovering Out Loud pod at gmail.com. You are no longer alone.
Speaker 1Well, yeah, you got three cameras, eh?
Speaker 2Yeah. I don't fuck around, man. I went all addict. I addict out with it. I got all the expensive shit. We are all or nothing people, right? I mean, at least I am. I don't know. I don't know about you, but I like to think I'm an all or nothing guy.
Speaker 1I love, I absolutely love what you do, man. Thanks, buddy.
Speaker 2I appreciate you.
Speaker 1Service, right? You're helping people that are scared to be out there. And talk about this stuff, right? I hope so.
Speaker 2Yeah. I mean, you, you've been on the, uh, the video adventure too. You like doing the videos and stuff like that. Um, what do you like about doing that?
Speaker 1So apparently people say like, I have a gift with, uh, making video, you know? So I try to put it into service, right? Because in the book, it tells us selfishness, self-centeredness that we think is the root of all our troubles, right? So it just shows like, what, like, let me ask you a question. What, what do you get out of? Seeing those videos.
Speaker 2Picture. I have a pictures are one thing. Okay. When I was growing up, I used to hate when my parents, my mom, especially would be like, let's take a family photo. Used to drive me nuts. I think I was embarrassed. I think there was a lot of shame about how I was viewed with other people. Like it was a lot of embarrassment there. I've come to realize today. There's so many photos in my life where I look back and I'm like, instantly the memory is just reignited in my brain. And I'm so grateful that I have all those photos. And so my answer to your question is videos do that times a thousand, right? Where, you know, I was watching that video you made of the retreat and that's how we met. And I'm happy that we met because you're a fucking good dude and I appreciate you. But that video, it just, it'll bring me back to that moment and it fully encapsulate encapsulates the, the entire memory of the whole weekend. Right. And, uh, I think videos, if words are, or if pictures are a thousand words and videos are a million, right. I'm sure that's a quote somewhere or something. Um, but yeah, man, it's like, it's important. And that's why I loved editing. I love, that's why I love, I did a recent one. I don't know if you saw it yet, but it was like a horror short of like what stimulants did to me, dude. When I was making that the other day, I'm not kidding you. I had like anxiety because it brought me back to all those, those moments, those hours I spent looking through the peep hole, thinking someone was coming to kill me, thinking people were outside, just the sheer terror of addiction and specifically psychosis. And I love horror films is one of my favorite genres. I love films. And so to make that was like, it was so fun for me. Right. But it also brought back a lot of, a lot of memories and it's good too, because I have to remember what it was like, because I don't ever want to go back there. You know,
Speaker 1step one is, um, remember the pain, right. The disease that centers in our mind. Um, so yeah, with the videos, I, I just, like I said, I put it into service and it shows that we can be happy without drugs and alcohol, right. And it gives, um, like for the still suffering, right. They could, they could see us being happy without drugs and alcohol and yeah, just, it's a, we program, you know, and I just want people to, to feel love wanted and needed, you know what I'm saying? So pretty much that's it, man. I've. I've been doing it for a long time, you know, and yeah, I really enjoy doing it. You know, it's all about love. Right. Yeah.
Speaker 2I think a lot of people need to see that fun side of recovery too, because my first thought when I came in was how am I, my life is over. Right. How am I going to live life? How am I going to not have a drink on my wedding day? All these bullshit stories that I played in my head, my disease, just keeping me trying to keep, keep, get me back out there. Right. And it still happens. They still come.
Speaker 1I did not believe in abstinence when I first got into the rooms, you know, and my brother-in-law is just like, just try it out. I'm like, I have to at least have alcohol. I'm only human. Right.
Speaker 2Everyone's doing it.
Speaker 1Yeah. And alcohol was always the solution for everything. Right. As long as, as long as I'm off the drugs, you know, and just doing alcohol would be okay. So he's like, just try it out. Try being abstinence for one year. Right. So that's how I came up with the name Bo Brady. So just as a joke, right? Like I didn't, I didn't believe in complete abstinence. Right. But this is what I didn't know about like the rooms, the program, you know, the, the unity, you know, all that stuff. Right. Yeah.
Speaker 2So can you take us through, talk about a little bit about your childhood and what it was like growing up in your home?
Speaker 1Um, looking back now, I always felt like I needed this program because I always felt restless, irritable and discontent, you know, my mom was always racing. I was always angry. Always uncomfortable in my own skin. You know, um, in school I felt like I, I was stupid, you know, I couldn't concentrate on anything. And the most important thing to me was my friends seeking validation and just trying to fit in. Um, yeah, so I was a very angry kid. You know, I was part of this basketball team, two of the things that I was good at was sports and instrumental. And then the coach kicked me off the team because of my bad attitude and he never brought me back on and that has made me resentful to adults. You know, as I was very disrespectful to the elders as a kid and my parents weren't always there for me, you know, so I always held that resentment towards them, you know, because they weren't there for me and the way I turned out, you know, so as a kid I did whatever the hell I wanted to do, you know, I was like the tornado roaring through people's lives, you know, uh, one of my first additions was to steal. So I'd steal it everywhere I went, the grocery store, the variety store, my friend's place, my family, and with that came lying, you know, I would hurt the people that love me the most and I was blocking the sunlight. The spirit way before I discovered drugs and alcohol, you know, so yeah, pretty much I, yeah, I was pushing on self will run right my whole life until I got into these rooms, right? I did not know how to live life and, um, yeah, so when I discovered drugs and alcohols, that's when I finally felt that sense of ease and comfort, you know, I felt comfortable, happy, confident, alive, you know, all these fears dropped and I was just the life of the party, you know, I would always wear these masks with everyone. Because if you truly knew who I was, in my head, you wouldn't like me. And if you didn't like me, I'd be in a pity party. What's the point of living, right?
Speaker 2Yeah. Always wanted to fit in, right? It's funny that there's a common thread between addicts and alcoholics that I always realized is that that need to fit in the people pleased to, to be a part of. And then that's exactly what recovery does, right? You come in and you're like, Hey man, have a seat. Welcome. Have a coffee. You know, but don't you like, I just fucking. I just fucking flipped my car on the highway, drinking and driving. Like, why would you like me? Why would, I'm a piece of shit. All these things are going through your mind when you come in and then people just love you where you're at. Right. And they listen to your stories and they're like, yeah, same. I did that. You know, have a seat. You're good, bro. You know, welcome. We want you to be here.
Speaker 1It's, it's, it's crazy how I'm living with this disease without any defense. We have no idea what the hell is wrong. We have no idea what the hell is wrong. We have no idea what the hell is wrong with us. You know what I'm saying? And for me, I thought I was different, that there was no one like me, man. You know, I was like terminally unique, you know, and it's like nothing ever worked. Right. And then I had to be pretty badly mangled before coming into these rooms. But then when you come into these rooms, you find out that there's so many people just like you with the same thoughts, the same feelings, you know, the restless, irritable and discontent, you know, and it doesn't work alone. We have to do this together. Right. Yeah.
Speaker 2I can't. We can. Yeah. That's one of my favorite, favorite lines. I love it.
Speaker 1There's a lot of people that come in that sort of say, I'm not as bad as these people. When I came in, I thought it was like the biggest piece of shit walking on God's green earth. Yeah. A lot to swear, right? Yeah. Cut, cut. Yeah, yeah. Start over. Yeah.
Speaker 2No, we, we like to, to keep things raw and authentic and I shouldn't say, well, authentic too, but uncut, raw, unfiltered because that's what addiction is, man. Like I didn't, I didn't start this podcast to have nice conversations. conversations about how great life was. Like, I want to talk about real shit, you know, what, what did you go through how did you get through it how do you get through shit today right yeah it's important for people to hear that that sobriety is beautiful and amazing and fucking incredible and i i wouldn't change it for the world but life still sucks sometimes dude like the shit still gets hard and i still have to navigate and i'm still dealing with financial shit that that i fucking racked up i still you know i get collection calls and stuff like that you know what i mean and it's like when will it end right but it's like just do the next right thing practice principles of the program give it back and things will work out i have to do i have to pay back things i have to do and show up i can't just say god take care of everything right but the outcome is not up to me i have to do the little things today and i think you live by that principle you know i just
Speaker 1in talking to you or try to at least do not be discouraged no one among us has made um maintain anything like perfect adherency spiritual principles we are not saints we are not saints the point is we are trying to grow you are trying to grow along spiritual lines but it's such a blessing to have the awareness of being itself right where before we didn't know what the fuck was going on right yeah um yeah life's gonna hit it says um in the big book if we don't enlarge our spiritual life we're not going to be able to handle certain trials and low spots you know i'm saying ahead yeah yeah but in the certain trials and low spots there's always blessings that come out of that you know i'm saying it's like we need all these these pains and sufferings to grow right so like instead of being like in a pity party about it try being thankful at that moment right this is all about practicing though right it's not simple but not easy like for me i'm coming up on three years in october nice and year two has been like super hard there were times where i just wanted to give up you know i'm saying because i wasn't i wasn't able to handle certain trials and low spots this is what happens when i take my will back right like i'm trouble comes right and disease centers in my mind it tells me that i could drink you know what i'm saying and this is what we're dealing with every single day right that's why we have
Speaker 2a daily reprieve what is what is taking your will back look like today what does that look like to you
Speaker 1it's when i stop doing the things i'm supposed to do right um because once i'm in my will like i i get resentful i'm uncomfortable in my own skin i'm full of fear you know i make up resentments towards people you know and this is what the my brain's like right it's mentally strangely deranged right um that like again the disease centers in my in my mind in my thinking right and i suffer from an illness which only a spiritual experience can conquer right um i can be very weak to this disease sometimes you know and be in that pity party and like we we have like two options we can either blot out the consciousness of our intolerable situation with anything that makes me feel good right drugs alcohol but if you're not doing drugs and alcohol we pick up other things right anything bro yeah social media food you know whatever man scrolling right that girl right uh whatever we focus on is pretty much our higher power right but deep down in every man woman child is a fundamental idea of god right so the problem is in me and the power is deep down within me and i have to search diligently within myself
Speaker 2every single day right what was the moment like i want to backtrack a bit um so uh was drinking your main thing was that like or were you everything i did pretty much everything
Speaker 1alcohol was always like the the thing that i did all the time yeah yeah like to me that was like the dissolution yeah but when i did alcohol it would always lead to like the other stuff right yeah cocaine ecstasy whatever i did it all i didn't do heroin but um what brought me to my
Speaker 2knees is crystal meth yeah can you walk us through that what did that look like and how did you ultimately seek help like what was the moment what was that like so i was full flight from reality
Speaker 1when i started meth you know i'm saying like i started hearing voices in my head psychosis and then i was like what the hell are you talking about and i'm like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i'm like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about and i was like what the hell are you talking about you know restless irritable in this content you know and i just thought everyone hated me you know and i was like the biggest piece of walking on god's green earth um so like after a three-day binge uh the voices would tell me go to the mental hospital i didn't want to go but i would go out of fear right and it's the most terrifying experience getting on the bus hearing these voices checking in and then once you check into the mental hospital you can't leave until they let you out right and that's what the voice just really attacked my head you know just bringing up every single selfish moment in my life that time i wasn't there for my son that time i was a piece of to my family that time i stole money from my ex-girlfriend they would tell me that i'm the worst father in the world and you don't deserve to live i was full flight from reality and i thought i was gonna die right um so the doctors would just tell me the voices are all in your head they would medicate me with olanzapine i'd sleep it off wake up and they would send me home and when i left that mental hospital all i felt was shame guilt and remorse you know and i had a firm resolution to never use and drink again and if you put me to a lie detector test i would pass with five colors because i actually believed it so i go home sleep for two days wake up and once i wake up i'm restless irritable and discontent and then the mind starts racing the mental blank spot right i think i could use and drink it'll be different this time and then once i put one in me it triggers the phenomenon of craving i have this allergy to body this abnormal reaction and then the binge and what happens after the i would get paranoid the voices were scared out of me and i would go back to the hospital so i repeated going to the mental hospital 50 times you know i said like it was just a cycle of insanity around and around and around with no solution right and this is what it is if we don't have like these meetings and and doing the steps and all that right it's just a cycle of insanity right i don't i didn't understand why i kept using when i didn't want to i didn't understand why it hurt the people that love me the most i didn't understand why i did the things i did you know i just thought i was the biggest piece of and i i didn't think i deserved to live you know and this is how cunning baffling and powerful this thing is we're dealing with right um yeah so i tried a lot of things right i went to the mental hospital like i said i went to the mental hospital like 15 times i went to rehab twice i tried moving to different places i did programs like kmh you know tried joining different religions nothing ever worked right and by the end of it i was living in my apartment my roommate moved out because of his by addiction i read i missed rent payment for like three months you know i was just so isolated you know and i was so disgusted with disgusted with myself you know i couldn't look at myself in the mirror i was mentally physically financially and spiritually broken you know and i would drink as much alcohol as i can and do as much of my drug choices i can to build up courage to kill myself you know what i'm saying i i didn't think there was any way out and i didn't ask for help because i didn't think anyone would ever help me you know what i'm saying i was delusional i was full flight from reality you know um yeah so one day my mom came over you know and she saw that the place was a mess uh and and i was just like intoxicated out of my mind and that's what she described this decided with my family that i go to rehab you know what i'm saying um so by the grace of god i got into these rooms and through you guys in the big book of alcoholics anonymous that's what i discovered that i suffer from an illness which only a spiritual experience can conquer right
Speaker 2what is a what does the spiritual experience mean to you
Speaker 1um working these spiritual principles and all your affairs right one addict working with another addict is vital to permanent recovery right um for me i didn't think this program could work for me right because i didn't think i was worth worthy of it right that's the delusion the liar that i believed in my head for so long but by doing the work right um it says the spiritual principles will solve your problems and when you're doing the steps you're working the spiritual principles in all your affairs right you're working courage you're working honesty right and by doing step four you know um and then doing step five admitting to god to myself and to another human being exactly nature of my wrongs um that's what i knew that this poem could work for me and that i have a chance to do better you know it says there's very little hope for your recovery unless you get entire psychic change and i i believe that's when i got it was a um on step five you know i'm saying um but what do i really have what i really have is a daily repeat contingent on the maintenance of my spiritual condition right i'm not going to be i can't rely on yesterday's spirituality i'm not going to be full off yesterday's food i'm not going to spill good off yesterday's shower right it's like every single day is a day i must carry the vision of god's will into all my activities because i'm dealing with an illness and if i don't i'm And I get into self, I get driven by a hundred forms of fear, self-deluding, self-seeking, self-biddy. And I can't differentiate the truth from the false. Or I'm blotting out the consciousness of my tolerable situation with anything that makes me feel good, right?
Speaker 2What's the hardest spiritual principle for you to work today?
Speaker 1Courage. Yeah, like fear, it always kicks in, you know what I'm saying? Like, I'm coming up on three years into this, right? I consider myself still a baby, you know, and just like to think about it, right? I was running on self-will pretty much my whole life until I got into these rooms like three years ago, right? And that disease that is in my mind, that always kicks in, right? And that's what holds me back from a lot of things, right? Yeah.
Speaker 2This sort of like movie that we project onto the world of it's going to be like this. Yeah, I'm having a really hard time lately. My thing has been like doing recovery shit that I don't necessarily want to do, but also just like life shit, you know, showing up. It's gotten easier because I've been praying about it, talking about it, opening up about it. I find that really helpful too. It's just like even talking with another, anybody, but another addict or alcoholic about what I'm struggling with. It takes the power away from it, right? But I have this thing where I'm like, oh, you know, I have to leave my comfortable apartment to go and do this thing, whatever. Meeting, whatever. Even just like dinner. Something that doesn't serve me, right? Something that I don't get immediate gratification, instant gratification out of. And it's like, I'll obsess about it all day. Like I have to do this thing later. Oh my God, I have to do it. I can't, you know, I don't want to do it, blah, blah, blah. And so I heard once, I heard a speaker once say that the only solution to doing something you don't feel like doing is doing it, is action. Straight up action. Just shut the fuck up. Like turn this off for a second and just get in the car and drive or walk to the bus or do whatever you have to do. And it goes away. That's not like, that's not the answer I want to hear. Right. But it's true. Like it's fucking true. It gets easier as you do it. Right. The more you do it. What does your shirt say? I've been wondering.
Speaker 1Get comfortable being uncomfortable. Oh, I love it. You know what I'm saying? I love it. This is what recovery is all about.
Speaker 2This too shall pass.
Speaker 1This is when I discovered recovery in 2020. Yeah.
Speaker 2That's a beautiful. You got that made. And I love that. Yeah. Yeah. That's sick.
Speaker 1But yeah, it's all about forcing ourselves to do the things we don't want to do. It's like when I don't want to go to a meeting, that's probably what I should go to a meeting. When I don't want to share, that's probably what I should share. Right. I listened to a lot of Goggins, David Goggins. Oh, I love that guy. Right. And he's like, cause I, we're all, the book says that I'm always looking for the sense of ease and comfort. Right. And that's how it's been my whole life. Right. If it was uncomfortable, I would turn the other way. Like every job I had, you know, there was like no growth. Right. I just get comfortable and, and stay like that. Right. And that's, this is what recovery is all about. Right. Forcing ourselves to do the things we don't want to do. Right. I don't always want to sponsor someone. I don't always want to go to a meeting, you know, and I don't always want to go to the gym. Right. But we force ourselves to do the things we're not supposed to do. And by doing that. That's how we get God's, God's grace. Right. Do a little bit of work and God does the rest. Right.
Speaker 2When life, life's you today, how do you get through it? How do you get through tough time? How do you get through the trials and low spots? Like in the moment?
Speaker 1I have to, I, I don't know how to live life. Right. I have a design for living, which is the big book. Right. And it tells me, um, when all else fails, one addict working with another addict will save the day, right. It's all about getting on itself. Right. And we have step four, we have step 10 to continue to take personal inventory and we have step 11, like nightly inventory. Right. And it tells us on page 62, that selfishness, self-centeredness that we think is the root of all the troubles. Right. And we get driven by this illness. Um, yeah, no. It's all about using, picking up the spiritual toolkit, right. Hit, hit a meeting, right. Uh, 10 step suggestion says when these things crop up at once, we go to God, right. That means fast, right. Then we discuss it with someone immediately, right. Fellowship. This is a, we program for a reason. And if we have to apologize, then we do it right away. Right. And then we turn ourselves into helping others. Right.
Speaker 2That was a, that's a big one for me. So I, when I relapsed after the seven and a half years, I didn't, I didn't go to anyone with, with my plan. Right. And I always stress this. I always try to nail home the calling another addict or alcoholic. I'm not, trust me, I'm flawed in it. Like I, I still, my phone is a thousand pounds some days. Right. Even when people are calling me in the program, I struggle to pick it up or outside of the program because I'm busy or I'm all this bullshit. Again, this, this story spinning in my head, I can't stress enough how important it is to like, whenever I have a grand idea. Based out of emotion, right. For me, it was, uh, at the time it was, um, I'm bored in recovery. My life is good, but it's not what I want it to be. Right. I'm not getting what I want. This was, you know, last year, I know it'll fix this. I haven't tried taking ADHD medication as prescribed, which is bullshit. I did try. And that's how I got back into the second rehab. And I remember, I remember vividly like having this plan in my head and it wasn't like a quick. I re it wasn't like a, this will fix this relapse. Boom. It was a, it was a process, right? The relapse always proceeds. They talk about it in the book too, that proceeds with a thought. There's always a, a thought there's always leading up to, right. We relapse with a thought before we relapse of the drink. And that was my thing. It was like, I'm going to fix this. I have, you know, I'm, I'm depressed. My D my dopamine is low. So this will fix it again, to your point, using external things to fix my insides. Right. And I never told anyone about it. I would tell people 90% of the truth. And I would. Keep that 10% back there. That took me out back on a way worse relapse. Right. It always gets worse, man. Always. So I, I, I think it's really important. Yeah.
Speaker 1Yeah. Disease centers in our mind, right. It starts off with a thought and then it becomes an obsession. Right. And, but the thing is, there's nothing we can do about the first thought, but we got to stop it. Right. The second side and go down to the solution, which is God or your higher power. Right. And everything. Everything around the triangles, meetings, service, prayer, fellowship, sponsoring honesty, right? All of these things are, are our solution is treatment to our illness. Right. But the big book says we're not going to be inspired at all times and we are going to make mistakes. Right. It says when we take a sincere position to trust in God's will, all sorts of remarkable things will follow. Right. It doesn't say we do this thing perfectly. It says we do things well. Right. And there's a lot of growth. And all these, um, certain trials and low spots. Right.
Speaker 2Can you think of one where, where there was a lot of growth where you, in the moment, maybe in the moment you thought it was the worst thing ever in the sky was falling and, uh, the outcome turned out to be better than, than it was. Can you, can you remember what?
Speaker 1Yeah. Um, okay. So my first year of sobriety, you know, I joined this group and, um, it's my first time in recovery. I found my tribe. I love this group. Right. And I did a lot of service for this group, you know, I, I did the clothing, I did the posters. I was so welcoming to the newcomers. I started my own gratitude meeting, you know, I love this group, but was I doing all that stuff in that group? That's what my head was telling me. Right. I just came from a dark place and into recovery and I wanted people to like me. Right. Um, so yeah, again, 62 second paragraph, selfishness, self-centeredness that we think is the root of all our troubles. Right. So I made decisions. It's based on self aroused character defects on my fellows and they kicked me out the group after my one year medallion. Oh, wow.
Speaker 2And I'm like, they kicked you out. Holy.
Speaker 1Yeah. Right. And I had the biggest resentment, right? I'm like, how can they do this to me? I did this so, so much stuff for them. Right. But this is a program of giving and wanting nothing in return. And when people harm us, the big book says we disregard the other person entirely. And we look towards ourselves and see where we went wrong, but I was at work at a program. Right. Recovery is unity, recovery and service. Right. I was doing unity and service and I wasn't doing the steps right. And what resentment is the number one offender that destroys us. Right. So I went back out, you know, for seven months. Right.
Speaker 2But on that resentment, on that resentment.
Speaker 1Yeah. Um, but today I'm grateful that I got kicked out of that group because of what it is today. Right. Um, I got back into the room. I got back into the rooms by the grace of God and, um, I, I did the steps right. And now I'm now it's all about living the steps, you know, and by working a program and connecting to a power greater than yourselves, you know, this and putting yourself into service. In return, you get beautiful, meaningful relationships and it just keep coming and coming. Right. Yeah. And I wouldn't have met all these people if I, I don't know if I was part of that group still. Right. Um, yeah. So the thing is, right, I, I would always blame them for what happened, right. i would never look at my part right and the sick man's prayer right this was our course we realized the people who wronged us were perhaps spiritually sick though we didn't like their symptoms and the way they disturbed us they like ourselves were sick too we asked god to help show us the same tolerance pity and patience that would cheerfully grant a sick friend when a person offends us we said to ourselves this is a sick person how can i be helpful to them god save me from being angry thy will be done so for so long that resentment in my head was like brewing right and i would just have like visions of like what would happen if i saw these people right i just felt so hated and rejected for getting kicked out right but god presented that moment at the right time and when i saw them i just gave them a big hug right and that's the program right there right that's the that's the psyche change you know you
Speaker 2yeah being able to love unconditionally right yeah what was that seven months like for you
Speaker 1that relapse and how did you get back in so that seven months was yeah i hung out with a bunch of people that i i've met in recovery right and you know the behavior is right it's a sketchy just every single day right um it just came to the point where i had no money left my family was gonna abandon me all my friends never already stopped talking to me you know and i had two options right plotting the consciousness of my tolerable situation with anything that makes me feel good right with drugs alcohol and i was about to like live on the streets or accept spiritual help right so yeah i had to be pretty badly mangled before getting into these
Speaker 2rooms right yeah yeah well i'm happy you got back in i'm happy you got back in i'm happy you got back in i mean i know for me coming back in was probably one of the hardest things i've done you know in my life um it just seemed like it seemed like such a big mountain to climb to get back in it was
Speaker 1like for me i didn't it was the scary thing for me was getting sober it's like i was like thinking about like the withdrawals and life without drugs and alcohol and all that stuff right but again that's our disease that centers in my mind all right wants to keep us sick i didn't think i honestly knew i had to get back in the rooms but i didn't think i could actually do it yeah right so the first thing i did was i went to the ca convention right i was four days clean and i went to the ca convention and i was trying to find like a god squad like fellowship right because i i didn't think i could stay sober without that group that i was part of i love that group right and i just didn't think recovery was ever possible to get back in you know i'm saying
Speaker 2yeah what's the biggest gift you've received in recovery like what what is getting sober and being sober and being of service what what is the greatest gift the greatest gift is the ability to
Speaker 1be of service and be helpful you know i couldn't be helpful to anyone i couldn't be helpful to myself and um but not only that right um helping others helps ourselves right our very lives depend on helping others right and that's the greatest gift you know um with my past you know i it's crazy it says in the big book our dark our dark past is the greatest possession we have right um and i i would just ignore my past put it on the carpet never want to think about my past right and now i'm here sharing my experience strength and hope you know and hopefully um it could help at least one person right
Speaker 2yeah so that's what we say right what's um what do you what do you hope that one person gets out of your story like what do you hope people get out of your when you share your story what do
Speaker 1you hope people get out of it i just want them to know that whatever you did in the past your past doesn't define you right we have a we're all dealing with this illness and if you're alive right now you have a chance to do better right um like i said our past becomes our greatest asset and we use that to help others and just want them to know that their love wanted and needed and to be honest like what would we do if we didn't have anyone to help right if we couldn't be of service and we couldn't work with another addict you know i'm saying because that's pretty much the solution
Speaker 2right yeah we'd be fucked i mean i always say this but i was a i was a taker my whole life in addiction take take take what can i get out of this situation conditional acceptance right yeah yeah i'll do that but i need something out of it right um and then i come in and i become a giver you know i still take a lot but my point with all that is like you can't have givers without takers you know what i mean like you need to have both sides right so any days that it feels like i'm taking a lot somebody's giving right so it's like i try to think like that too it's like you need to need both right you need to have both sides and that's why the newcomer is the most important person in any situation meeting whatever because i need to give away what was so freely given to me and then they can in turn do it to someone else right this beautiful cycle that this
Speaker 1sort of happens in recovery you know yeah there's a lot of like no that's okay you don't have to give me but at the same time that person that's giving you something is trying to work the spiritual principles of like being generous right being kindness right and sometimes you can't we can but like i wouldn't want to rob them from from from giving right and expecting nothing in return yeah right but i understand i was a taker my whole life too bro like i wouldn't i would give and expect something in return right and this is recovery is like my sponsor would say don't even expect to thank you you know what i'm saying yeah right it's
Speaker 2a lot easier to live that way too yeah it's a lot freeing expectations are nothing but premeditated you know if i'm always expecting something or looking at outcomes i'm going to be let down no matter what that person place thing situation is going to let me down because i'm not getting it the way i want right um so now you're working at a sober house now how did you get into that
Speaker 1and what's that like well that's a miracle to me that i'm a house manager at a sober living house to be honest i i i knew some of the guys for for from time but like coming into the this the sober living house is like a whole new world to me right like i've been all over like ca and aa but like coming into this is like a whole new world of like recovery um so i moved in right away and slowly i brought my stuff in and when i got there uh we had a meeting and the first first thing i said to the guys like they introduced me like house manager and i just said it's a blessing and an honor to be here you know and i'm here to help in any way i can you know what i'm saying um to me it's still a miracle that i that i i'm there it's such a blessing to be around all that all the time right um i'm supposed to be helpful to the guys but when you help someone it's helping you too right being around these these guys these newcomers all the time it's it's been really vital in my in me working my program right um yeah so i'm very grateful for that it's got to be tough though too
Speaker 2right because as we know as i know in sober living there's a lot of relapse that happens there's a lot of you know um there's a lot of addiction you know plain and simple right there's just a lot of addiction that happens and how do you deal with that and like how does it affect like how what does that look like how is that how does it affect your life how does it affect your life how does it
Speaker 1that how does that affect you well there's different all types of sobriety in there different ages different people that want it more people that are not serious about it right and to be honest i have to just really work spiritual principles in all my affairs right um if people are not serious about it there's nothing you can do about that right um they they have to come to want it right um but for me like it's i have to be spiritual fit condition because if i'm in self like i i get i'm dealing with i'm sick too right and it's nothing good comes out of being in self right i'm not useful or you know i'm useless
Speaker 2yeah have you had any relapses that you've had to deal with that were really tough like or anything
Speaker 1like that or well that one relapse when i went out with that resentment for getting kicked out of that group which became a blessing at the end um i had no intentions of going back out um but yeah i went back out seven months came back in you know what about the clients i mean
Speaker 2like the clients oh like dealing with relapse in the house that's got to be tough isn't it
Speaker 1yeah um oh clients in the house yeah um i mean you don't have to go into details but like i just
Speaker 2it must be tough to to see someone that you get a relationship with go back out and then you got to deal with it because i remember when i lived that um sober living i've been to to i've been a few times now it was tough to see someone go back out right and it's like you can't get dragged down with them you can't let it affect your sobriety you can't control it you can't can't cure it you didn't cause it right um but like it must be tough it's it all comes down to
Speaker 1like doing the work right if we're not working this program we're gonna we're gonna go back out um in my early recovery i i would get really like it would be really hard for me to see my friends go out you know um but now that i have more a little bit more time and i have a design for living you know it says in the big book um if they don't want it you know you have to you have to just let that don't waste your time trying to persuade them because we we may ruin a later opportunity for them right yeah a new bottom right yeah so what i the only way i can really help people that don't really want it is pray for them right yeah and nothing absolutely nothing happens in god's world by mistake right and everyone is going through whatever they're going through and they're going through a lot of things and they're going through a lot of to get to wherever wherever they're going to right wherever they need to go yeah i love that
Speaker 2yeah it's true um you talk a lot about faith and spirituality and that's been a real eye-opener for me too because human aid what does it say human aid will fail us right like no matter what could be the nicest person in the world they will let you down at some point and not intentionally it's just the way it is so i need a power greater than myself to rely on what is faith and spirituality god what does that look like to you today
Speaker 1well praise step 11 right seek through prayer and meditation it to improve our conscious contact with god right does it say maintain right and i i follow the book right like what we have is a daily reprieve upon awakening right think about the 24 hours ahead um throughout the day i always have to turn my will right my thinking and my life my actions over the care of god i love it just thank god right thinking in action i love that yeah when i'm agitated at work when i because i do landscaping too right um i have to turn my my will by thinking right and i i put gratitude gratitude into action and what does that look like doing a good job doing it to the best of my ability right because if i there are days where i'm just at work and i just want to get it over with you know and no it practices these spiritual principles in all our affairs right um i'll be honest i'm not always on top of my prayers you know and it's all about consistency right and being disciplined and just doing it like you hear like the old timers like you know like eric he's like he's consistent right but he's been around for a long time right and it says we we have to make use of their experience right yeah um what's the
Speaker 2what would you say is the best piece of advice you got in recovery either early recovery or now
Speaker 1the best piece of advice that i ever got in recovery
Speaker 2let me ask you that question i just immediately my brain goes to jay right um and alan always there's so much right there's so much but alan always says and he quotes jay when he says this is like you know if i don't know if there's anything that precedes it but he always says try a little harder and stay a little longer right and i love that it's so true it's like if if if you're going through a really rough time and you're having a hard time getting sober staying sober and you just can't figure it out try a little harder and stay a little longer right don't give up you know and i love that it's so true it's like even in recovery you know having seven and a half years all those tools that are still there i didn't lose all those tools i lost the time i didn't even lose the time i won't say that but it was really hard man it was really hard to come back in and tell my my group that i had one day like i started bawling my eyes i can vividly remember i was chairing a meeting at my home group and i had just gone out i had i had just accepted my relapse because it had been going on for a while but i didn't see this alcoholic addict thinking was telling me that i hadn't relapsed yet because i didn't drink and i i'm buying it on the dark web and taking all sorts of meth and shit like that it was really hard to again step one getting honest was really hard and i remember that you know they announced buddy had you know 30 days everyone claps 20 days goes around the room and it's coming to me and i see it coming to me and i'm just like holy fuck my sponsor recommended that i that i do that that i you know admit my relapse and i was so scared i just remember coming to me my name is anthony i'm an addict alcoholic and i have one day and i just started bawling my eyes out in front of all these men this room of men and i'll never forget it i had maybe six or seven people as that was happening get out of their fucking seat come over to me and just hug me and then my sponsor kind of you know he leaned in and he goes hey man do you want me to take over like and i'm like no i have to do this like it's good yeah i didn't get sober right after that because again we need to bang our head a few more times and do some more research and scrape our knee but there was a big seed planted that day and that was that i could be vulnerable in a room full of men in a room full of anyone in recovery it was a shift it was a shift and i'm gonna get accepted i'm gonna be okay and people are gonna love me where i'm at no one's gonna judge me and you fucking idiot you had eight how did you do that you know i mean people always ask me people that are working really good programs will always come up to me and be like hey like how did you relapse and i know that you're working a good program if you ask me that because you don't want to go back out and relapse and that's why i always share my experience about relapse and it's so important because if you have long-term sobriety even if you have short-term but if you have long-term sobriety and you think that you it'll never be a part of your story fucking give your head a shake right because it i wasn't expecting it i was on fucking cloud nine in recovery in seven and a half years met my wife life was amazing dude it was amazing and i never thought that relapse would be a part of my story i thought that i would be that that guy that you know went one time through and i'm happy it happened because to your point out of the pain came spiritual growth a lot of spiritual growth and a new connection with my my higher power and i realized that my higher power never went anywhere he was there the whole time watching me struggle i just didn't tap into him i didn't plug plug the i didn't put the plug in the jug right i have to do that today so that's probably the best there's so much
Speaker 1but yeah there's so much um you know page 417 acceptance is the key to all my problems i need not to concentrate what needs to be changing the world but what needs to be changing me i love that so much i love that so much i love that so much because every time i get pissed off or agitated you know that just shows me that i have to look inward and that shows me that i need to work on myself right um it's not that person it's the symptoms that we don't like right and there's another part of the big book um 116 it goes like this uh these experiences my line out says like fears harm resentments whatever you're going through may come to you or you may already had it several times should it happen again Heart in a different light. Maybe it will prove a blessing. Time after time, this apparent calamity has been a boon. It's lined out a gift, a blessing, for it led to the discovery of God. Right?
Speaker 2Love that.
Speaker 1So my best advice, I heard a speaker say this. His sponsor always told him to go to God, go to God, go to God, go to God, go to God, and then go to God. And then go to God, go to God, go to God, go to God, and then go to God. You know what I'm saying? Go to God for everything, man. That's the best piece of advice I ever got.
Speaker 2Because I can't do it on my own, right? Exactly. Let's end with this. You have a poem that you wanted to read. Is it a poem? Is that what it is?
Speaker 1Yeah. So I call this one, I, the Attic. Right?
Speaker 2You have it off the dome? Okay. Of course you do. I thought you were going to pull it out and read it. Let's hear it.
Speaker 1It's called I, the Attic, and I don't write, right? Maybe it's something I could do. You know, there's a lot of stuff that you discover being in sobriety. You know, that's why it's courage to change the things we can, right? We don't even know what we're capable of, right? Anyways, I read this poem to one of my friends, and he's like, where do you think that came from, right? And he's like, God, right? So this is before I did the steps, okay? This is when I first got back into the rooms. Okay? And it goes like this. Such a rollercoaster of emotions, some days being sober. Should I feel comfortable? I don't. Last year I felt suicidal. This year I might do something different, like talking to God more. I'm feeling frustrated. I need to quit the disturbance in my head. Demons in position like a sniper, unpatiently waiting for that slip to kill their prey. I see despair and hate, mentally locked behind bars of no fate. I dance with the devil, receiving nothing but hatred on another next level. Lowest of the lows, God, I've lost my soul. All alone, feeling nothing but exposed. It was me that made the pickup. It was me that made the drop-off. It was me that made this addiction an incurable disease. Lord, forgive me, higher power, God, please. Set me free, it's not a want, it's a need. I, the addict, it's a routine. It's been a bad habit, ever since 16. Losing my mind, nightmares in my dreams. Thinking of the days when I was a DOC servant, haunting me, watching me, being very observant. I was so selfish, so cold and rebellious, laughing at me like a clown in the circus. The sickness is fierce with me, my new purpose. They got me so close that they think I resurfaced. They love it right now I'm so shaky and nervous. I'm conquering this fear, proving that I'm not worthless. But I'm still confused. Was it really psychosis? I was at war in my head. Intentions of being dead. I couldn't look at my face and I'd seen that look of disgrace. It was me that wanted that sip. It was me that wanted that hit. It was me that wanted that drip. It was me that was a piece of. It was me that made this addiction an incurable disease. Lord, forgive me, higher power, God, please. I get triggered. And that's the reality? Regretting it? That would just be blasphemy. But sometimes I can't help it. It's something I have to deal with. That attic mind. Even in peaceful places, those demons still lurk. Feeding off you when you feel bad, broken, or hurt. I'll stand on my resilience no matter what they say. I was so close to death, that was the price I had to pay. So I raise my hands to the sky in remembrance of the Most High, whose powers I might, kind of compare or quantify. It is me that has to live with no regrets. It is me that has to ask God to remove all these character defects. It is me that has to fully surrender, do the work, and live the 12 steps. Thanks for letting me share. I love it.
Speaker 2I'm feeling like we should. We can drop that down and record it over there. I love that, man. Thanks so much for coming down, boy. I appreciate you, buddy.
Speaker 1Thanks, bro. Thanks for having me, man. I love what you do, man. Keep doing what you're doing. Thank you. It's helping, man. It's helping others, man.
Speaker 2I appreciate you, buddy. Thank you.
Speaker 1Like you said, it's not easy to reach out to people and stuff like that, right? Love you, bro.
Speaker 2You can do it.
Speaker 3Thanks for listening. Please help us grow the channel and like, share, and subscribe for more content. The discussions and stories shared on this podcast are for informational and motivational purposes only. This content is not a substitute for professional medical advice, addiction treatment, or therapy. If you or someone you know is struggling with addiction, please consult a licensed physician, addiction specialist, or mental health professional. You are no longer alone. you
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