#146 - Advice For 20 Year Olds

- I don't know Justin Bieber. I need you to be very clear that I don't know Justin Bieber. - This is Rory Kramer and all I need to say about them is they don't know who Justin Bieber is. - No, I know who he is. He means a lot to me. - Doesn't like it. - But I don't know him. His photographer's name is Rory Kramer. - Boy, I would never know that and man. - Oh, really? - Okay, I knew Bieber. I wouldn't be skateboarding with Bieber. - You skateboard? - 1,000. - Of course. - Jesus Christ. - He would do like longboarded. - You just keep jumping up the list of hot. - You do a cake flip? - Yeah. - Fuck ya, dude. - You should see me on a skateboard. - What's up? - It's crazy. - I wish I could draw. It's one of the many talents I don't have. - It's too bad you can only skateboard. - Are you guys gonna be honest with me? - Yes. - What are you talking about? - We're not just doing things. - The show is just like a real conversation. - I know, but we're like being filmed. Do you know what I mean? So there's a level of perception. - I don't even see the cameras. That's what's crazy. - No, Amanda. - Camera camera. - No, I can tell you. - Honestly, Amanda, she is not holding back. - Sometimes I drive home and I go, "Why did I say that?" - No, no, you don't hold back. It's you I'm trying to get to the core of. - I think I can be a little bit more careful with my words when the camera's on, but I'm gonna be honest. It's not a lie. - I need to work on being honest. - Really? - Yeah. - Wow. - You think when the cameras are on, you are. - Yes, I think I have a propensity. Amazing work. - What the hell? - You just bumped up even hotter. - The vocabularity. - You're at the top. - I have a propensity to perform. - Perform your- - I've performed my entire life, my entire- Also, yeah. Well, literally, if you think about gender, if you think about, I'm just like, "Oh, I have a propensity to perform." And I really don't wanna do that anymore. - Okay. - So I gotta slow my roll today. I gotta show up honestly. - And with that, let's begin. - Welcome to Smoshmouth. I'm Shane. - And I'm Amanda, and we have a very propensity. - Oh my God. - Joyful, wonderful guest. Their name is Rory Kramer, but do not get it twisted. They are not Justin Bieber's photographer, but if they were, they'd be skateboarding with Justin Bieber. - Yeah. - Beeps? Hey, Rory Kramer. Can we say beeps? - I love him more than anything. You know, on that, the Lost Cultures podcast, and they say what's the culture that made you say culture was for you? - It's Justin Bieber. - Yeah. - It's Bieber. - Has it been from the beginning? - Oh my God, yeah. I remember where I was. - Remember where I was when Bieber was born? - Yeah, well, I remember. I was like an early kid raw. Yeah, this is like YouTube channel. I was kid raw, and I was an early, I found him early, and I was like, I'm obsessed with this kid, his talent, his whatever. And then I would look him up on iTunes all the time, trying to find music that came out. This was so long ago. And then I remember I was in Chile, and we were skiing, and I went inside to use the computer, and I went to like the iTunes top 10, and one time was charting. And I went, oh my God, that's that kid. And then I like scaffolded my entire, I think I'm Justin Bieber. - So Rory, Rory is Justin Bieber. Also, Rory was born in Argentina. - Chile. - Chile. - I grew up born in Argentina. - I'm half and half. - Okay, so I got half right. - Yeah, that's right. - The other thing about Rory also is Rory is incredible. We love Rory, and Rory also directed Smosh Hospital, and also created and directed two episodes on Bitsity, that is coming out, I think next week. - They're on the felt board. - Oh my God. - Hey, so Selena's incredible, and does this felt board, and I didn't even look at it. Watch their episodes on Bitsity 612 and 710. - They're so funny, both Shane and I are in there, which we will touch on. But also, I just have to dive in a little bit more into your love for Bebes. - Okay. - Is this a type of thing where you would want to meet and hang out? You know some people don't want to meet their heroes? - Don't meet your heroes. I'm that way. - Yeah. - Same. - Have you met any heroes? - I could have, but I genuinely, if I see them, I'm like, nah. Like, I saw Conan O'Brien at a music festival a year ago. And I remember being like, whoa, I love Conan O'Brien. His comedy is so influential for me. I really, so much of what I've learned over the years, I try to model after him. But I was like, I don't want to say hi to him. Like, we'll let him be. - Was he like singing and, you know? - He was just walking around. Like, he wasn't, yeah, he was there. - That was the time to search him out. - Massive. - Oh, he's the tallest man. - Massive, he's taller than me. - But I think he's so funny. But I'm just like, I don't need to ice. I love, like, I love the work that people do. - Yeah. - I'm like, I don't know you and I don't want to be, I don't want to, I don't want to like mess up what I enjoy about the work. If I meet you and you're kind of an asshole. - Yeah. - You're having a bad day or whatever, I'm just like, I'm just gonna let you be. - You know, I met because I was weirdly bartending their party wherever I go. This is wild. Meryl Streep. - What? - And her daughters. I was bartending a party at her son's house. And it was just me. - Gracie Gummo. - Who's that? - Your daughter. You just made up a name. - Gracie Gummo. - Is her last name Gummo? - Gummo. - You know what? - Nailed it. - Honestly, you're probably right. But I cared so, so Meryl Streep, I will say, was incredible. - Really? - The epitome of grace. Just so wonderful, so welcoming and funny. She was just so relaxed and so, and she looked impeccable. So anyways, beeps. - Yeah, my ex-girlfriend looks a lot like Meryl Streep. - What? Are you serious? - Are you serious? - I only realized it. - I was watching. I was watching. What's that movie with Alec Baldwin? - No, no. - Oh, like it's complicated or it's complicated. Hey, stop copying me. This is very easy. - Nora Efron. It's complicated. And the whole time I was like, oh my god, she looks just like my ex-girlfriend. But I didn't realize it until we haven't been together for years. - Did you, did you, that make you want to go back with your ex? - It's complicated. - It's complicated. - It was just really, it was really jarring. 'Cause like they look, yeah, they look really similar. - You don't want to get into it. You just said that we were supposed to be vulnerable and real. - I'm being vulnerable. - Rory, she won't listen to this. - Okay, so Rory, you also struggled to be vulnerable and real. - No, no, I, well, I actually kinda do. - Which I actually don't think is true. Because every time I've hung out with you. - You're like the most, you feel like such an open book. - Yeah. - Like every conversation, we'll be hanging out at lunch in between like shooting insane sketches for Bit City. And we'll sit down for lunch and you'll just be like, so what's I conspiring you guys lately? - Yeah. - Like you'll just throw out like a really deep question. - Oh, that's, that's a safety blanket. - That's a safety blanket because guess what? They're not really talking about, they're still, they're like interviewing. - Oh, okay. - Oh, try to have a, you watch me and Angela, try to have a conversation and nothing gets talked about. - I have, I have. - We'll text each other and it'll be, I mean, she was texting me the other day. - You guys are playing pong. It's just like going back and forth. - No, it's not. - It's, imagine a tennis court. And instead of facing each other, we're facing a way and behind us are walls that we're hitting the ball into and it's flying over us and then hitting the other person's back. - Whoa. - That actually makes like, what do you guys actually accomplish when you text? - We, truly the other day she was, I was texting her and I was like, yeah, dude, I'm kind of mid-crash out and she goes, damn fam. And I go, I go. - Yep. (laughing) And I go, absolutely, for real, how are you doing? She goes, what did she say? - She said all in caps. - Well, actually a lot of the time. - Yeah, I know. - She, and then she said, she'll text me sometimes, something that's like, she'll say, you're a perfect human. I love you, never leave. And then she said, enjoy yoga. I said, thank you so much. Enjoy yoga. (laughing) And then she said, I just told you that I thought you were a perfect human and you responded to me with xyz, and then I said, oh, I need to thought out. And then I sent her a bunch of vulnerable like archival footage and pictures and videos. And I was like, this, we'll have to do for now. - You are so dumb. - You're so dumb, right? - You also, I will say, you take time to process things and respond with the right thing. - That's so nice to hear. - Yeah, you do. Because I'm very vulnerable with you. I, you'll be like, oh, you did great. And I like, get deep. And you're like, wow, thank you so much for writing that all out. And here's the thing, it's not with everybody, but with you, I feel very open and safe. - Oh, man, that's so, I feel so. Yeah. - That's such a privilege because I text it, Amanda, about I asked what the biggest difference between being in your 20s and your 30s are? - Yeah. - Because baby, I'm bumping up. - Honey. - I'm bumping up. - No, you're not. You're in your 20s. - I'm in my 20s. - Yeah, you're in your 20s. - But I'm like the oldest, I feel like the oldest person alive. - That's crazy. - I'm 29, just kind of overseeing all the 20 year olds moving through there. - There are people who are a hundred worried. (laughing) Okay, so you text in me. But then I'll turn 30 and then I'll be the youngest person to ever live. I'll be the youngest person you guys know. - You guys know. - 30 year old, yeah. - Okay, that is so true. - I'm 29 year old when you're 30, you're young. It's weird. - We can ask you guys a question about something. And then we're gonna come back to this. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - At what age do you start saying I'm dating a woman? Like how old is the woman? How old does the person have to be to be like, I'm dating this woman? - 60s. - That's what I'm just kidding. (laughing) - Do you know what I mean? Like if I came to you and I was like, oh, I'm dating this girl or this person. - Yeah, you are always saying girl. So I feel like when you say woman, it's you've decided that's where you're at. And woman to me, if you said I'm dating a woman, I picture her a little bit older. Of course, but what's the age? - Like 50s. - 50s. - Oh. - 50s. - This is where it gets interesting. - Okay, okay, okay, okay. - I think it's a little. - Yeah, it's a little. - 45 and up. 'Cause there's some 41 year old girls. - But like, I imagined if I came to you and I said, (laughing) I said, and Amanda, I'm dating a hell. - What the hell, hold on. That happens all the time. It happens. - It does, it does. - It's crazy. - It's like shame and chance for some reason my brain cannot, like I will interchange your names for some reason. - Bro, you better finish this thought. - I'm hanging on by it, right? (laughing) - People haven't saved me in chance of the same. - I can't see you, I say, "Oh, I'm dating a girl, you go, oh cool, it's like, oh she's 40, she's like, like if I can't do that, I was like, I'm dating this girl who's 40." - Okay. - So does that, but then I'm like, what if I'm 40 and she's 40? - And you said I'm dating this girl? I'd be like, - I'm dating this girl, right? - If you were dating a woman, to me, that means like, she's older, she's mature, she lives, she's divorced, she broke up with a man. - Interesting. - I almost see, I feel like she's already had a life with a man to compare it to when someone's talking about, like, "Oh, I'm dating a boy, like I'm dating this boy." Like, you know, I think it's just more of how someone carries a man. - A boy is different than a girl though, in my opinion. - And boys get, they graduate to guy, there's guy, - There's guy? - And then there's man. - There's three levels. - Oh, three of them is like, you're dating like a boy. - Hit the comments and let us know what they think. - I think, but there's a certain age, where do you think it's almost an insult to be called a boy or a girl? - Well, for sure. - Totally, right? - But then I say, I say, what if, what if, I date someone, let's say she's 34, but she has a child. And I'm saying I'm dating this girl. - Yeah, she's a woman. - Of course. See, that's that. - Motherhood. - Yeah, like at a certain age though, I'm just like, it's how someone carries her. - You're passing over, you're passing over a certain part of your life. - I don't think there's like a degree or an accomplishment you get that makes you a woman though. - Can I say a hot take here? - What's the 10? What was that? - 10 minutes. - 10 minutes. - For what? - That's your attend. - Don't worry, you're not directing me. - You're not directing, you can just relax. - I don't, we, - Mommy and daddy, we've got this. - Going back though, I think it's like, it's how someone carries themselves. Like, it's how like someone, it's a confidence thing. Like, there's no accomplishment. There's no job or family or anything you can have that's like, you're not a woman. It's just like, truly like, I think it's almost a decision. - I think it's a vibe, but what I want to say is a hot take is I don't get upset if you would call me a girl. I don't, that doesn't bother me. I think it's cute. When an obviously an older man says, okay, girls, I'm like, okay, bro. - You could almost argue like the true ultimate evolution of a person is to contain both multitudes. - And that would be, right? - Wow. - Because you don't want to lose, because some people like get older and they're like, well, I'm a man, I'm a woman. - Like a lady. - And they lose, they lose the like, the fun of like, no, you still want to keep that part of you. - Yes. - But it's adding the respect, like, it's having both, being able to be both. - Like if you said I'm dating a lady, I'd be like, ooh, a lady. - Let's go in treats on her purse. - She comes out of her hair. - She treats her in person. She has six white little dogs. - She has her gloves. - She takes it off. - I'm dating a lady. - She has worries in her purse. - I'm not against, yeah. - Yeah, yeah. - Well, what about they, Thames? - What about it? - I still think, what do you say? - To me it's just like, to me it's just like a fucking adult. - Like, just someone, like, very-- - I'm dating an adult. - I'm dating an adult. - I don't like. - I don't know, I don't know terminology. - I am dating an adult now. - There's just a like, a level of just like, people who I'm like, yeah, you're fucking grown up. - What do you say they then, what do you say? - Well, I have this conversation with men. - I'm dating a person. - You can fucking, they can laugh. - No, they are laugh. - She's like, holding it and shaking. - No, she's not. - No, that's just how Alexina laughs. It's very cute and sweet. - The laughing. - Alexina is a girl. - And a woman. - For sure. - She's not a lady. - Well, she can't be a lady. - Lady lady. - Okay, keep going, Jesus. - So, what about if they that, right? 'Cause this is, well, I'm on the cutting edge here, right, with all the things. - You are seriously on the cutting edge. It's crazy. - I'm on the cutting edge of they that. - So, would you say I'm dating someone? I'm dating a partner. - The person, but here's the thing that always happens. So, let's say someone's having a conversation, they're talking about, they're dating a non-binary person and they go, well, I'm dating this person. Girl, guys, no, they're, I'm dating someone. They're a person. They go, okay, then they're non-binary, which is also the most clinical term for something that means kind of, you want to have some bad-ass term. - Wait, what do people say when they're dating you? 'Cause you're they them. - Yes. - Do you consider yourself non-binary? - Period. - 'Cause you're they them. - Let's discuss this. I'm going into my book. So, yeah, what have you been saying? - I've had this conversation many times. People have dated because it comes up. They go, what do I tell my family? I say, you tell your family I'm your lover. - Okay. - Okay, that, that's assuming a lot. - Wait, go ahead and assume, babe. - Okay, you prefer lover nothing else. - I think it's whole areas. I think it's whole areas. - To go to like a friend's birthday party of like the person you're dating and for them to be like - My lover's coming in. My mate is coming in. - My mate, this is my lover. 'Cause partner, I'm sorry. No. - No, foul. - Whoa. - It's foul. - Part of it feels like you're like really buttoned up and you're in a business. - So it sounds like, yeah. It sounds like you negotiate. - Well, I guess relationships turn negotiation. That's beautiful and fair. - That aspect exists. But you're talking about like the kind of like fun. - Yeah. - Yeah, I think love is the light of my life. - I think light of my life sounds like you're, it's a funeral time. When they walk in a room, they were just, they lit up the room. - Yeah, lover is good though. 'Cause I do feel like that's like a, that's a grown-ass term. - Lover is really good. - I don't think that fits for boy or girl, right? Like it's like no. - You gotta, you gotta know a lot of shit. You gotta like love. - To me lover is you're like, you don't take life too seriously, but you really are super connected to this person. And you guys, you can talk about money and then have sex later. - There's a responsibility and a respectfulness. - You can talk about your budget and your finances and that debt. - And you can fucking fuck. - And then you can fuck later. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, hell yeah. - Wait so, but for real soon. - They, fist bump. - They. - They, that fist bump. (laughing) - I would actually like a subtitle, a subtitle that when you cut to us, just bumping us as they them, they them, they them, they them. - They them, fist bump. So they them have had a really good time on set. (laughing) - Yeah, but I really hit the comments. I'm sure a lot of they them, so listen to this. - I'm so interested in this too, because what if someone assumed that you would want partner, would that be a discussion with you? - Have this conversation. They go, I'm gonna introduce you to my family. It's my partner, I wanna say you're, no, you're not. - Okay, so you really are like now. - I go, I'm already, I'm already foreign to them, you're gonna make me your partner. This is, I wish there was a better term, and I might have to come up with one. - I kind of agree, I wish there was, 'cause this is totally different, but when I got married, I actually hated using the word husband. It made me feel like a different type of girl. 'Cause my husband said, it made me feel that way, which is very sad, 'cause that's such a societal thing, because he is my husband, he's my lover, he's my mate, he's my best friend, whatever, but it's like, I really didn't like using husband, so I say H, which is his name, but I'm like, what is that connotation with husband, because I married him, he is my husband. I think it's like, I don't know, we use these terms to describe our people, and I think some people use it in a way that I don't like, so I think that it's tainted it forever. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - And it is bespoke, right? Person to person like, because we're also different individually, but I get that. - You say what? - What about you? - I don't actually-- - You say Courtney. - Yeah, wife does feel weird. - I do want to be clear when other people use partner, I don't have judgements about it. - Sure, it's just about you. - It's about me, specifically. - And I think that's fair, and I think everybody's that way, it's just some degree, I think what we see in a society is like weird to put the pressure on like, this is the term, like that you have. - No, I don't know, I think it's same, where I like, it feels so sitcom-y. Like when I say my wife, I feel like I fucking, like, King of Queens over here. - My, my, my, my bullshit, my fucking wife. - My fucking wife. - My fucking wife. - No, it just doesn't, yeah. - My old lady. - I also think like, wanna know how to make a marriage last? - Yeah. - Shut up and do whatever she says. - Make your wife happy. - Though she says let a win, everyone. - I mean that. - Let a win. - Happy wife, happy wife. - Yeah, I don't agree with that. - I'm like, throw up. - I think all that shit is there. - Throw up. - Throw up. - I also think I, I don't know, I have to think about it more. It's just a feeling, like I'm just like, I just don't, just doesn't feel right. - Yeah, yeah. - Yeah, like I don't mind it. - Yeah, yeah. - I'll say it, like it's the legal term. - But here's what's weird. - I sometimes also think like, best friend almost feels like it ranks higher. - I agree. - I'm like, no, that's a higher accomplishment. - I completely, that's so beautiful. - I think because a lot of people get married and I don't know if they really enjoy hanging out with their wife. - The amount of husband who hate their wives, like our just, well, husbands who are incapable of being best friends with. - It's crazy. - Anyone who's not a man, like. - Oh, god, I gotta get out of the house. My wife is driving me crazy. - I actually think it's an institution and it's a label that doesn't have much, like, what does it mean? - So should we bring back the label in a better way? Because here's the deal. Sometimes age will say, oh, my wife, a man, first of all, he never calls me Amanda ever. Like never calls me by my full name unless, unless he's like, unless he's like upside. - I can't see for God in your name. - Oh, my God. - He's like, "Sherry." (laughing) - He doesn't know my name, Angela. - Oh, my God, he literally doesn't know my name. He keeps calling me Nikita. (laughing) He's like, "Nakita." But he never really calls me by my full name and when he does, I'm like, "Uh-oh." But sometimes he'll be like, "Oh, this is my wife, Amanda." And there's some nice pride about it that I'm like, "Oh, that?" - Also, yeah, you can't say my wife 'cause Borat ruined that. My wife. - My wife, you literally can't say my wife. - Is it really attractive when a guy brings up that thing, that when he says my wife has like a funny thing? - Do you think it's a track? - No. - Okay, yeah. - I was just asking you guys. - That's some straight stuff. Also, I hear straight people are pegging now. That's like a whole thing. - They love it. - That's all of them are talking about it. - I hear about it, they love it. - We made a joke like, Seven years ago, we wrote a sketch where I played a character that wanted to get pegged by a giant vampire. Wait, wasn't that me? You later played it in a like- I was, I was leading TV from Resident Evil and you wanted to get pegged. But it's become the joke that that's, that's because of that one. But I don't even think it's a joke, I think like literally, I think they're just curious and interested. I just, I go, oh please, yeah, please do it. Just do it, explore. Have a good time. Yeah, have a good time. Can I ask a vulnerable question? Yeah. I mean, I can't do it. Because I, you guys took that really well. It's less extreme, but I actually feel like it's a more hot topic of like, I feel like tons of straight couples use partner. Oh my god. Definitely. And that's something I didn't see until a couple years ago. And I, I don't know, I don't know. Do you think they do it so you ask? Do you think, I guess it's like, I'm curious and I'm very, it's one of those things where I'm like, I don't know, but is it straight, is it straight couples trying to be like over an ally? Yes. Or is it also to kind of like, or is it kind of to also some straight couples to be like, we're not, we're straight, but we're, so we're cool. Oh, you think they're like, yes, yes. But like we accept, we accept they, that we accept everything that's going on. So this is my partner. Do you think? Yeah. I've had my two cents. Oh, so we know what's going on in the ready girl. Royal Rumble. No, for me, I say partner because seeing boyfriend is childish. Yeah. Totally. I know another word to say that comes back to like the boy and the girl, like same girlfriend, same boyfriend. That's true. Because you don't have to be married to like, say partner or boyfriend or girl. That reminds me of how like, after court and I got married, I'm like, I know so many couples who aren't married, but I'm like, but they've been together for like 10 to 15 years. And I'm like, you guys are kind of more like, you're, you are, and then that's the married thing. That's the side of married thing. Like, married as, or more married. It's like, you don't need to get married to have a solid relationship. But I get that. You can be together with someone for 20 years and it's like, well, my boyfriend, but no. Well, and that totally makes sense as like an interim to like in between like, okay, boyfriend feels young, we're not married. So there has to be like something kind of in the middle partner partner, partner makes sense. I just want everybody to feel good. You know what my, you know what, my, I've had this thought lately is just that I'm like, oh, the English, like the, the English language is going through like evolution. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's really weird for people and language is what affects our reality, right? It's why like it language creates culture, it creates everything. So we're realizing our language is so limited in under like our understanding of things. It's why I wonder if it's why we see so many people just cannot comprehend so many realities of, of humans and especially when it comes to gender and stuff, they just cannot comprehend it. It's like, yes, because we don't have, we're coming up with the words to describe it. Yeah. And you have to trust it. The name change, like they don't, I think there are some people who make it like very intense when you mess up a new language and it's just like there's, they have been trained on this old language for whatever, 70 years. It, it takes a second for them to figure it out. So like, I think there needs to be given grace on both sides of that. Completely. Well, that, that is something that with gender in my own experience of it has been as long as somebody is trying or if somebody comes to you with like a true curiosity and they mess up, I'm like, oh, I'm here with you for as long as you need to figure this out. If somebody comes to me with any kind of debating tone or they, they don't want the way I shut off completely, like I just, you can recognize disrespect. What do you do? Do you, because it's not your job to educate them. So what do you do in that? It's so sad because it's such an opportunity when somebody comes to me with curiosity. And there are so many things I could talk to you guys about gender wise that is fascinating because it really is taking the, the matrix pill, like you, what, like transness is literally about. Yeah. Yeah. I heard of that recently that the matrix is about transness. Yeah. Yeah. Because both of the, the sisters who made it are. Oh, yeah. Yep, yep, yep. But they realized it after the fact that's so interesting. Fascinating. The experience of it is very similar to the matrix because you essentially die and respawn. Like that's how it feels. Like I feel like I've died and then reestablished all the terms of my life and had to, and what's interesting about gender versus sexuality, because when I came out as gay, that's a different thing. Because when you come out as gay, you kind of go, I'm gay and there's nothing you can do about it, gender is so much, in my experience, it's so much more vulnerable because you come forward and you're like, okay, so I'm going through all this gender shifting and I do need you to participate. And that is really normal. Right. Because when you're gay, you don't need everybody to participate. In fact, you don't really, you don't need their permission or anything. No. But when you are going through, no, I do have a question, did you always feel this way about your gender? A thousand percent. I have a video of myself at one and a half. I can send to you guys. I have this video of myself at one and a half and I, this little girl and my mom's best friends arms and I'm whispering in her ear and she goes, wait, what are you saying? What are you saying? You're a boy, you're a boy. I'm truly one and a half, like, toggling across the table. So my earliest memories. That is wild. Yeah. I remember, I took a psychology of gender class in college and they talked about studies where they're like, yeah, we were able to pinpoint and see it so early on. Yes. You're not like, there's no cultural influence to it. It's just kind of there from the beginning. But for a while, you just kind of just kept going. Well, my circumstances were, everybody has a different story, but my circumstances were, I was, I've always been androgynous my entire life. Like I don't know if I'm necessarily full boy. I like being in the middle. I feel a bit alien. I'm like, I identify with parts of both, but I don't fully identify with one or the other. And it kind of changes from day to day. But my experience was I was always really androgynous. Always with the boys. I was played sports, classic, classic. But in middle school, my dad died and that, and at the same time, people were kind of getting sorted into piles. Like it was a boys over here, girls over here, and I got sorted into the wrong pile. And to create safety for myself, I learned that status was very helpful in creating a sense of safety at a time when I didn't have safety. So I became really good at being a girl. I was a really good girl. You showed me a picture of you. I was awesome. Because here's what you can put it up here. Here's what's crazy about Rory. I mean, I don't know if Rory remembers this, but the first time I met Rory, did you remember me from when I worked as a bartender? Yeah, yeah. Years ago. You were like, "I was a girl then," so you probably wouldn't, and I was like, "Oh, my God." Well, I was a girl. You were a girl. That's the actor good. You were the Meryl Streep. I'm the Meryl Streep. A girl. Wow. And that's saying, I'll talk to her and tell her. I would say that. I would say that to her face. So you think you're good? I tried doing this for 25 years. Jeez. That's actually really good. I'm really good. Ever. Your dad died. You got sorted into the wrong pile, and then you were like, "I needed safety." Yeah. And the grief was so unbelievable, I was 11 when he died, and the grief was immeasurable. And I didn't have someone to process it with, so the only thing the adult side of myself knew to do was to seek safety through belonging. Yeah. And the way to do that, growing up in the United States, was their status. Yeah. I've had this incredible sense of homesickness my entire life. Mmm. My entire, like, just this feeling of homesickness, and only in the last couple of years figuring out gender, has it, like, alleviated. Wow. Yeah. Because if you think about it, and this is something, I do have questions for you guys about the difference between being in your 20s and your 30s, I think one of the things that surprises me the most about the experience moving through gender identity is the amount of grief that you experience. Because when I look at my 20s and I look at the mistakes that I made, or it was always really hard for me to connect with people, which is why I was telling you guys the beginning of this, like, I need to, like, just let you guys ask me questions and let it be because I'm so used to being, I can trick myself into thinking I'm connecting when really what I'm doing is controlling the narrative and controlling the conversation. To stay, to stay, stay, to move the dials, and it's not very interesting anymore to do that. But when I look at my 20s, it's really hard sometimes because there were so many moments where I really could have connected with certain people, and I wasn't able to, because I didn't know that I was lying. Yeah. Whoa. Yeah. I didn't know that I wasn't showing up, and it was this feeling of, like, something is missing, something is wrong, and I have no idea what it is. I couldn't figure it out in the therapy. I couldn't figure it out with my friends, because a lot of my friends even to this day, like, I have friends who are gender queer, but like, I was not, I did not have any trans people in my life. Yeah. Hardly. Friends with a lot of sensitive men. That's kind of my bag. Mmm. Like an army of sensitive men. Am I? An army of beavers. I'm sensitive. Of beavers. Of beavers. Just like because. Beavers. Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense. I'm still kind of dealing with that of just being like, oh, there are kind of some ghosts from my past where I really hope at some point we can have a conversation about it, because it was impossible. Even relationships. I'm like, why couldn't I. Oh. I couldn't. Because I wasn't, I wasn't, I'm like, in my body for the first time now. I think we underestimate the grieving process, and I don't just mean with your dad. with this grieving process of your whole body. the shift identity shift. You go through all of the stages and it's really scary to be very honest about and the only way that I can relate in the little spit is just postpartum of just this like, "Oh, I had my therapist be like, "Oh, everything you're describing, this like unbelievable anger that surges out, this deep sadness, this hopelessness, this weird, excited like you're on drugs joy, all at the same time, this deep understanding and then this massive confusion." Yeah. She was like, "Oh, yeah, you're grieving. That old part of yourself is gone, completely gone. And so I can't even imagine having it gone inside physically, but also you're at like another level of it being gone physically, too." Well, I remember when I got top surgery because I was, again, beautiful girl. So like, I benefited a lot. You were a beautiful girl. You still are, honey. I was a beautiful girl. Shane, stop denying that they were a beautiful girl. As the famous poet Justin Bieber said. Yes. Yes, but I was, I benefited a lot from being that way. Like the system for women, I was in the spot of like, I benefit the most from this. Yeah. And so to give it up, when I got top surgery, what you're living in the matrix? Yes, but I was like, the intersection of like actually figuring this out because I'm kind of on the other side of it now, but at the time when I was really in my head and really sorting through all these feelings, I remember being like, "Oh, yeah. Of course I want to get surgery, but that would be like hanging up my jersey." Yeah. Damn. Wow. Yeah. Because I'm like, "Oh, I can't. It's not a party trick anymore. Like I can't like suddenly just flip a switch and beat me." Yeah. You're drawing the brain. I'm changing my literal body so that like my, the invitation to go play on that side and kind of play in that way or perform in that way is completely out the window. Yeah. And you worked on that role for so long? I know. You're crushing it. Yeah, actually. You really are Meryl Streep, but beyond Meryl Streep. Yeah, except when you go to the arc light and they have like the cases of like, you know, famous costumes from roles instead of a beautiful dress, it's just my boobs. Your boobs are just up there. Your cast. There's a line waiting to see that. But that's a really interesting part. I mean, there's so many different parts. I mean, experience is insane. Yeah. And you're, it's interesting because yeah, you're like swimming upstream against society's pressures and stuff with it, you know. It is the greatest splash of cold water. Also, the ability to observe other people and see where their pain lives is like suddenly, it's like extra vision. Yeah. Oh, yeah. You see it. So you feel it. And that's what's so funny. I now I understand why you're a little bit worried to get into your thirties because when you texted me, what's the difference between twenties and thirties, man, did I send? I sent them. I wouldn't say it's a novel, but I sent. I really thought about it because I loved that question because I think your twenties are yes, like yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, I'm just doing everything. I'm going to try everything. And then your thirties are no and the nose are really sharp in the beginning. And then they're like a no thank you. And I feel like your thirties, you don't have the choice. You're faced with all the shadow selves, regardless. So like your twenties, it kind of like appears and you're like, what's this about? I don't know. I'll do it later. And then all that stuff that you want to deal with later, just it comes full surface in your thirties. You have no control over it. If you are on the path of wanting to, you know, figure yourself out, what would be an example of that? So I made that shit up just now. What did I just say? Actually, no, no, that's real idea what's going on. It's when people go, well, yeah, you always do this. And you're like, oh, oh, and you get so angry about it. And then like days later and you go, wait, do I always do that? Or was that person just rude? And then you go, oh my God, wait, I always do that. I always do that. Why did that make me so mad? Why do I always do that? Where does that come from? So it's like, you go down this journey. And to me, it feels like it's right in front of your face every morning of less like this, this is who you are. This is who you are. And some of it's great. I think that's starting to wash up on shore for me now. Like I, for some reason, overnight, I suddenly cannot tolerate doing things I don't want to do. Yes. I like cannot tolerate. My body will not be ready for your thirties. Yeah. But it's the thing that not everybody in their thirties or four or a fifties stops. Like some people go their whole life. If you're not like open to that, I mean, my God, look at our parents or that generation. Like I think maybe that's washing up on shore for them now. Yeah. I think for me, it was definitely a bit of, maybe it was like a child actor thing, of just like always like, oh, what is my career going to be? What is my life going to be? What am I working towards? And then suddenly you're in your thirties and you're like, oh, so this is my life. Like this is who I am. Yeah. There's no working towards. I mean, there always is working towards, but I'm like, oh, my life and who I am and that's today. And I doing what I can do today. And I'm enjoying my life today. Yeah. And you know, I've been thinking a lot about that I've built a whole career following the dreams of like a 14 year old. Beeps? Yeah. Like a traumatized 14 year old who was like, oh, it's going to save me. Hollywood. I mean, yeah. And then I'm like, oh, my God. I feel bad. Whatever you are doing really well, but that I know regardless of doing well, your career started when you were a kid. Yes. But also because I'm doing well, I'm being, which is very sweet of you to say, I am being faced with moments of like, oh my God, I thought this would solve everything. Oh. Sure. Oh boy. It's not. Sure. I feel that. I feel sober to what you're talking about specifically though about like, I just want to be happy. Yeah. I literally, I don't care about it. I'm like, oh, I, all of the rest of it can go. I just want to be happy and enjoy it. Yeah. But I'm so happy to be here. But then, but then you're in the present moment. And that's when you feel so happy. But that, that negative brain seeps in and goes, what are you doing? What, what, what are you going to do? What are you going to do? So to me, it's the battle of when you are present doing really what you want. That is, that is the big magic. That's the joy. Like, nature's colors are like, oh my God, look at that green plant. Look at that flower. But then I think it's battling that ego, that negative part of your brain. That literally is like, this is what you're going to do all day. Yeah. Yeah. And I saw this, I saw this Instagram thing that I was just like, oh my God. It was like, anyone else have a baby and just want to quit everything and just be with your baby 24/7? It's not realistic, but like, you do. Yeah. Like, the part of that is that you see, they see everything for the first time. So you get to go, yeah, look at those leaves in the wind. That's cool. Let's try to touch it. Whoa. And it's like this, it is very big picture, zoom out. Have you ever heard the song The Mother By Brandy Carlyle? Of course. I love that song. So much. The song makes me cry. It makes me cry. I'm not even. The mother. Up to that. It's awesome, but also Brandy Carlyle just did a do-out with her wife, really? Yeah. It's really good. The mother and you by Justin Bieber. I guess they call her wife. So there's that. Just going back to people calling each other partners. Oh, wife, yeah. It's fine. I get the partner thing. I wish Americans were more creative with their language. Like, the Italians have words for everything. What would you say were you're from Chile, Argentina, Esposa? Esposa. But my friend and I used to make up words because we felt this way. Like, we came up, we used to make up fake Italian. Sorry if this is insensitive to the Italians on the chat, but we used to make up fake them. So it's cool. Stop saying that. That's what's crazy. We're here. We're here. We're excited. That's awesome. But yeah, we used to make a fake Italian word. So one of the words that I remember we made up was like, you know when you're like cooking up with somebody and like, you're kind of staring into the ceiling. Like, you're so not there. Like, this is just like bad and I'm like not connected to this and I'm kind of just like breaking the fourth wall with some like fake audience or something. Oh, yeah, of course. Because the camera's always there. Always. You're like, well, the camera in my life. We used to call that presora. Pressora. They go, how was it? How was it with them? Pressora. Oh. That's way better than being like, I wanted to do that. What I just said. Yeah. Yeah. I'm like, it's awful. Pressora. Makes it a little bit easier to kind of get past. Pressora. I love that. The Italians watching this are like, that's a real word. That's a real word. And that's what it means. You know what I mean? Yeah. Actually correct. Yeah. Well. Yeah, it's really good to hear this that like you guys are two very grounded people in your 30s. We're both in our 30s. I mean, it's pretty cool. A lot of stuff continues. Like, it's not like, oh, I turned 30 and boy, you know, I was able to shrug off all these things. Like, it's still all there. You just start to like, I almost feel like in some ways like the difficulty on like my ego got cranked up like it's like, all right, we're continuing. It's like, oh, now we're going to hard mode. Yeah. And I'm like, okay, if I don't, if I don't clock my ego more, it gets harder and harder and harder. How do you mean? Things just because I'm like, oh, I'm older like I have more experience and I'm making this mistake. And I'm not doing slow and I haven't done this. Like, oh, wow. I've extra fucked up. Whoa. Whereas when you're 25, you're like, well, there's still time. I got time. Yeah. Well, you push everything inside. something stupid, and there's a comment that's like the shit - You're like, who cares? - It hits harder now that I'm an adult. - Yeah, yeah. - Now that I'm like 34. 'Cause I'm like, man, I had way more time to figure that shit out and I didn't. - 'Cause your fate, everything is right there in the forefront. All the stuff that you were like, yeah. - But it's, I mean, it's also a recognition of like, it's such a short amount of time. And then I'm like, oh, and every day I'm kind of a baby. Like every day you're figuring things out over and over again. Like there is no graduating where I'm like, I'm wise now. Like, yeah, you gain wisdom and stuff. I want to be wiser, but I'm always going to be naive. - See, but that's what's good. I think a lot of people go, I've figured it all out. I've decided, I've learned, I'm done. And then they get to our parents age, especially my mom. I feel like my mom's like, oh my God. - Yeah. - I don't have the best relationship with, you know, so and so and, oh, do you think it's 'cause of that? I'm like, yeah, it's 'cause of that. Like what? - So call me and be like, I did this thing. You'd be so proud. I said, I said, you can come over to my house and no one else would be there. It'll just be me and I'll just focus my time. And I was like, good for you. - My heart is racing 'cause that sounds really vulnerable. - It's so vulnerable. I think my mom, like, fills up space with every, she wants to make everybody happy. - Yeah. - Like, do you want to spend the weekend at my house, but then 1,000 random people are there. - Yeah, yeah, oh my God. - Mark's going to stop by. He has stuff for me. I don't know how long he'll stay. - He's bringing the ladder he borrowed like 10 years. - Yeah, good action. He's bringing the ladder he borrowed like 10 years ago. Ladda. - I think I have my 20s. I was too much of an adult. I actually don't think I, I think my 30s might need to be a little looser. - I recognize that. I look back, I was absolutely trying to, that's a very like child actor thing. - Like trying to get an adult so bad. That's why I think a lot of child actors like get so messed up later. 'Cause they were like, I was never a kid. My development is all messed up. I wanted so badly to be like the wisest, like most mature person when I was a kid. And I look back and I'm just like, God, the fuck was I? I was so cringy. But I'll like sometimes look back on early Smosh videos like from 2015 and stuff. And I'm just like, God, I like, who is this guy? - Yeah. - And I like look younger, but I feel like I come across older. I feel like more almost crumbuginy. - I feel totally the opposite. I feel like my 20s, I was very much like, I was just like, fuck boy, era. Always saying yes. I said yes to it. I was just like, everyone can f off. I am going to have the wildest time. I don't know. I don't know because I normally am a scared person. Is that so? Not now, no. Like as a kid, I was a scared person, but my mom always was like, no. - Get in the water. - What about that? You're, we're doing that. - Yeah. - You don't like that? We're doing that. And so I think it's trained me to go, well, of course I'm going to do the scary thing. I have to, and now it's so ingrained in me that I love doing the scary thing. I think that's why I love doing characters. And performing is because it like connects to that part of my brain, but my 20s was 100%. - That's so funny. - I just say. - I felt like I was walked up inside my head until like 28. Like I was like, oh, I don't know what life was. - What opened you up? You ever done drugs? - No. - No, he's never has. - Do you drink or do any drinks? - Do you drink weed or anything? - Yeah, but it's not like that helps. - But you've never done like a psychedelic. - No. - Okay. - I like not for like, not wanting, but I never felt safe enough. Problem was I felt so anxious and unsafe all the time that it was never in the zone to be like, oh, I feel safe to do that. - So interesting. - So it kind of didn't allow for it. - Would you ever? - Sure. - My God, I want to be there so bad. - Yeah. The problem, I think a big problem was because of how anxious I was all the time. People were like, oh, Shane's too straight ahead. She doesn't want to do that stuff. So I never, I was never in the space. - But that. - And then it like kind of created me. - That makes me so, 'cause I, I think in our 20s, so much of what we do is we give people social roles to follow, 'cause it helps us make sense of things. And so people point at you and they go, well, you're the straight and narrow. Or like, I guess that's what I am. - I guess and then we start to believe this idea of what we are when it's like, that's not necessarily who I want to be or who I am. - It was tough though, because at the same time, I was extra terrified to take any risks because not only was I just an anxious person, but I also had this career that I, given up high school and the college experience for. So to me, I was like, I gave up, in my head, what I told myself for so long was, I gave up my life to pursue this. And if I don't succeed at it, then I gave up my life, and I failed at this and I have nothing. And my life has been void. - So much pressure. - Oh yeah, I ruined myself with it. And now I've got, it was kind of once I got past, and then honestly, what freed up some of it was like, some of the Smosh experience, I'm like, this is the weirdest, I'm in Waco world, where none of this is the normal human experience. So it's like I hopped over from any sort of normal path into weird world. - I think that's why, I mean, I'm grateful to be at Smosh for a lot of reasons, but that's one of the main reasons I'm really grateful for. I'm having this reckoning recently where like, there's a path that you take, especially with directing and writing and acting, and like the kind of traditional industry path. And it's really lonely. And if you are one of the youngest people in the room, it's very alienating. - Yeah. - You have to be an adult also with directing at Soap Azar, because like I directed General Hospital for a long time. - Which is wild. - So yeah, I was 27 directing General Hospital. - I can't even. - Crazy. - But the reason I bring up my ages, because that show is the longest running TV show of all time. So the people who work on this show have been working on it for over 500 years. - Oh, there are five years. (laughing) - And they're phenomenal and amazing, but it's a really part of my job. Directing is a performance in a lot of ways too. And I've been changing my relationship to that a lot. - Where I have to go and convince these people, - These people that I love. - That I'm in charge. - Yes. - That what I say goes. And that is a really intense thing to assume responsibility for at an age like that. - Yeah. - Well, it doesn't give you any opportunity to like, because you are also silly. It doesn't give you any opportunity to like be silly because it'll lower your status. And status was like the first thing that you kind of experienced to feel safe. So you kept the status forever. I mean, when I first met you, I was like, - Hello. - Nice to meet you. - Really? - Yeah. - Woo. - And then, and then we started playing. And I was like, oh, we're silly. You're so curious. You're so interested. You're so like free and open. But like how you first present yourself is like, I will not be taken lightly. Like I'll be taken seriously in a good way. - That's it. No, no, I'm not surprised that that's the reason. - Yeah. - What's so, 'cause also a huge part of what I do is I'm a visitor almost always. Like I come to places, I, whether it's a TV show, or even larger projects, it's like that environment is only yours for five days, three months, however long it is. - How long were you on St. Dennis? - I integrated there. - That was such a funny show. - I love that show. I was there. I shadowed a couple episodes. So I was like around and I got to know people. And then I did my episode, my episode's only like two weeks. - Yeah. - The shoot's only two weeks. - Amazing. - Another instance though of like being a 20 something and yeah, it's just a very bizarre experience. And I'm really grateful for the directors who are older than me, or ahead of me who can give me advice on these things. - So what was it like when you came in a Smosh? Because-- - Heaven on Earth. - It's, we're, I mean, I wouldn't say we're all the same age, but we're kind of-- - It's a young place though. It's a weird place. - It is a young place. - It's clear we're like the people in charge of everything are in their 30s, right? And that's rare and any sort of entertain, 'cause you go to like studios and it's like, yeah, a bunch of 16-year-old, 70-year-olds. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Or even if that, like there's 30, some things later, 30s, or in their 40s and they all have kids who are like, they're like, hey, I gotta get out of here at five 'cause I gotta pick my kids up, they gotta basketball game. Where I'm like, oh, we're in different stages. - I have like, there's only two people here who have kids. - Yeah. - Yeah. - So like, it was really nice to come here. - This time last year, I remember sitting and thinking about what I wanted. And I said, I wanna be playing games more. I wanna be performing again 'cause my whole background is in comedy. Performing and just like in the mix with comedians again, 'cause I had taken such a break from that scene. - Yeah. - And I want to be doing like sketch. I was just like, I was like, this is, that is what I'm missing right now. - Whoa. - Wow. - That's literally it. Dan Leigh, he actually messaged me and was like, hey, would you ever wanna do stuff with Smosh? I was like, oh, I've heard of Smosh. And of course I knew you guys from being younger, but I didn't know the new version of Smosh. - Yeah. - And I knew tangentially kind of, 'cause of Angela and I have been friends for many years and I was just like, loved that she was famous now. I was just got such a kick out of it. I was like, oh my god, 'cause I don't wanna get people's Instagrams or anything and every once in a while, but like, go see what she was up to. And I'd be like, she's got like 300,000 dollars. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - She's like, and which is still a true for me with you guys, because I also only really know you guys, we've talked about this many times, but in the context of the studio or like when we go out, it's places that people aren't gonna bother you. I haven't been to like the airport with you guys. I haven't been in an environment where you guys would be getting stopped. So for me, I'm like, it's crazy to be that you guys are famous. - And each time I've gotten stopped by a TSA agent, it is the sweetest thing ever. They're like, I know I cannot bring out my phone right now. I know it is illegal, but I need a selfie with you now. - And if you have a knife, I will let you get past. Don't worry about it. - And let me tell you, I love my worst at the airport and I have no worries. - No worries. It's all chill. - All good. - Bring in whatever you want on. - It's all chill, Sarah Christ. Get on over there. - And I'm like, thanks. - By the way, we got some characters coming from this new bit city that are. - Oh, banger. - I think it's my favorite Amanda character. - Oh, wow. - That's what Angela said. - I mean, dude, you got, talk about a method. You got so into this character that we would cut and you wouldn't break character. - I wasn't there. - And that's gonna be weird when you watch it. You're like, you didn't break from this character. - I wasn't there. All I know is I've been really challenging myself to play against type characters like Bridget and Will you be mine was like a such and against type for me, but also still me and Dariya Rhea, really excellent name. - Yeah. - That was one of the hardest times I've last, this year was being in the writer's room and us being like, we wanna do a Mariah Carey character. Dariya, Dariya, someone goes, Dariya Rhea, well I think it was you, the Dariya. - I don't know if I came up with Dariya Rhea, but someone did, and it killed us. You locked into this role, and it is fascinating. And before we got on set, I look over, and you're scrolling through your phone on your notes, and then just you're scrolling past texts of tons of writing. - Oh yes. - And you're like, these are all my notes and writings on this character. And you've come up with a background. - Yes. - And I remember you turned to me and she go, you go every night, she has a snickers and. - And Bailey's. - And you go, what? I go, it's just something that I wanna keep in the back of my head. - That's just who she is. - I literally, I had so much fun researching this character, and for the whole weekend, I always write like a one sheet for myself on every character, but for her, it was so easy to come up with lore for her. It was just like, oh, of course. Oh, of course, she has, I don't wanna give anything away, but the Bailey's and Snickers thing, I was like, oh yeah, she would have, someone is so intense on camera, goes home and just unzips and it all lets out. - And she pours like a thick glass of Bailey's and has Snickers and she just sits there dead. - Did you say that's based on someone you know in real life? - Yes, my sister's old neighbor. (laughing) My sister's old neighbor in Quincy Mass. And here's the deal, this woman I swear to God, she lived by the door, so every time my sister would pull in, she'd go, "Ali, hey, Ali, and Ali, we go, "Oh, oh, oh, I'm on, I'm actually on the phone." It was never on the phone. It was just like, and she told her, she's like, "Yeah, I lost all this weight." She goes, "How'd she do?" She goes, "Well, I stopped my nightly snack, "Bailey's and Snickers." (laughing) My sister's like, "I stopped bringing a gallon of alcohol cream every night." - She dropped like 50 pounds. Let me tell you, people on the East cows. - And you know what, that's what your 30s is all about. - Yeah. - So I'm like, "Nice, like, what do I need? "What do I need?" - I got it, drop that thing of Bailey's. - What do you guys think your biggest pattern was in your 20s? - Jesus. - Hard turn. - Damn. Okay. Here we were having fun. (laughing) - Well, Dariya. - And we're having-- - What's you on that? - I will say that your character as well. - Oh my God. - Is that enough? - Yes, yours was like kind of a highlight just in that there was such a production around your character. - I always wanted to play someone so high maintenance that it needs like four people to get her up. - That's what was really really fun, but your character, I will say, really had me in stitches many, many times. - Chance plays like a Justin Bieber. Like a kid raw era Justin Bieber. - A kid era, like bowl cut Justin Bieber era type of sensation, and I play his dad. And I will say, I was trying really hard, I was trying really hard to like kind of like just be in it. And I was very inspired by some of the family vlog dads that I have met. And they're all very similar. And it's just like these dads who are super like amped. They're super like, yeah, they love selling their product, which is their kids. - Yes. - And it's just, I'm like. - You looked so, I was like, oh my God. - Oh, the wig was. - It's Shane, you, I mean, it fit you. Like I was like, oh my God, sorry, it looks like, hey, I'm gonna say this better. - Fuck. - I'm gonna say this better. The wig fit you so well, but I was like, this is him, it's this guy. And what I love so much is you smiled in such an aggressive way. - Yeah. - You weren't like mad, but your smile could like tear flesh. - Yes. - You know what I'm saying? - You were also performing kindness, right? Like they perform nice. - Yes. - But it was so funny by your characters, you would always be like in the background of a shot, just beaming all 32 teeth. - Yes. - You were just a bit. - So anyways, this comes out in a week from now, I think. - Yeah, I'm so excited for the bit cities. - It was a fever dream. - Did they tell you the callback that we put into the second episode? - So reveal it? - Maybe not. - I don't think we can reveal it. - So I'm playing another character, and I do great characters. - I do, I play like a middle schooler, member of the joke. - Yes. - Jason. - Yeah. - So I play a middle schooler named Amy. And man, she, she's just matured really fast. - Yeah. - She got her period when she was 10. You know what I'm saying? - Yeah, yeah. - And she just, you know. - She's just. - And she just. - That's a lot good, man. - Let me just tell you, she is the life of the party. - Hell yeah. - And there's a little Easter egg. - Okay. - And she puts out, that's connected to her character. - That's exciting. Yeah, the next couple episodes of Bitsy are. - Not the same episode. - They are a wild ride. - But Rory, you pitched these episodes, and I remember being in the writing room on the first pitch that you did, and we were all so jazzed because to me, it was like an nostalgic blanket, your pitches. It was just like, yes, yes. It was like that thing that you really want to do, and it's like, can we do this? - Yeah. - It was so much fun. - I don't want to do too much away, but yeah. - I think my pattern was wrapping my fears and excuses. - Oh, okay, we're back to the 20s. - The 20s pattern. - The things. - Yeah. - Fierze. - Wrapping your face. - Yeah, I would justify reasons why I didn't have to, like I shouldn't, and I would love to come with reasons like I can't do this because of this reason or something. - Okay, but now I feel like you're a little bit like, yeah, I'll do that. Yeah, sure, why not? So like if I offered you my rooms. - I just, I just, I don't know, I'll help them up. - That would be awful. - I'm not talking about stuff like that. I think that stuff has changed over the years. I think it's now like, I think it's a lot with like art and like creativity. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - We've talked about this a lot. - We've talked about this a ton. Creativity is a really tough one. Smosh has been nice for breaking me out 'cause like we just have to make so much stuff. - And it's helped so much, but now there's other spheres of like my, when I'm not doing things here, it's still, it's just, 'cause it's scary. - Yeah. - And there was a, you recommended a book that I read, Big Magic that I, that was really great. And there's a part that talks about perfectionism, and I've talked a lot about perfectionism, but she kind of bolded it down in a way I needed to hear, which is like, hey, perfectionism is just fear. Just afraid. - It is fear. - Yeah, and that's, I just need to kind of, - And it's the fear of magic. Like it's literally the fear of engaging with magic. - And I, I think it's also recognizing like, in American society, like the capitalist productivity bullshit that we're in is really like, it's recognized, like that's been a big thing in my thirties of recognizing how much I was influenced by, like seeing the, the manosphere has reached such a peak now that I'm grateful I'm in my thirties for when this is happening, but it's been around for so long, and I'm like, oh, I didn't realize how influenced I was by that of like, all of my achievements and everything must add up to this like identity. And I'm like, oh, and it doesn't mean anything. It's all bullshit. - Oh, yeah. - And I'm like, so you lose your ability to do things and create as a more out of body experience. - Yes. - But it's right now for everyone creating in what you do is all about building up into yourself, but that doesn't work. - It's a name, it's also the generation that we're a part of, like it's invasive. It's in our houses, capitalism, through creativity is, is constant. Like whether it's the desire I, I put out like a TikTok or an Instagram, I don't do a lot of content. Like that's not, I don't, it's just not like what I, I used to before, but then once it became like influencer specific or comedy turned into like less about it just being kind of fun because I made your friends laugh and more of something else. I really stopped and I put out a video that's like a behind the scenes of my episode at St. Dennis of just being like, this is how, if you've ever wondered how to direct an episode of TV, this is like how it's done. - Yeah. - And after that happened, 'cause the video did well and immediately people were like, what is the next thing you're gonna do? Like what's the next video you're gonna do? What, or even my own team was like, this is great. I was really, I had like agents reaching out about working together and I was like, this is so bizarre 'cause the work has always existed but you guys are seeing this and this is what you wanna push. But this isn't, the reason I did this video is because I wanted to be useful to people who might, wanna know how this is. Like when I think about the audience, I wanna think about what my intention is with their attention because I don't think that that happens enough. - Yes. - I mentioned something similar recently, I think on this podcast of like, when we're doing this, I'm like, I want to entertain you. - Yes. - I want this to be funny, but so many right now are just trying to hold your attention. - That's the difference. - And there's such a difference. - I can't. - You can feel it too, because the intention, that's why I really do love, cool, 60. - You do not need to focus on that. - You don't have to worry about it. - But you know what, you're just gonna, so it's fine. I was living in London and I was working on like a live show and I was working with this wonderful director and after I was doing like a stand-up set and I got off stage and he came up to me and he was like, gonna give me notes. And I love notes because it's fun, right? - Yeah. - Yeah, tear things apart and make it better. - That's part of why I love being here. Is that we are always talking about how things can be better for the audience's experience and what we're trying to say or talk about. But he said to me, "Okay, I have notes for you. I've got good and bad." I said, "Okay," he said, "The good is you're good at this and like you can hold the attention of an audience with relative ease, which is great." I said, "Oh, and I was like, what, 24?" I was like, "Okay, cool, and then he was like, but the bad news is you came in here on purpose, you set the bar low so that you would overachieve because you didn't prepare." And that's not your job. Your job is to think about why you have the audience's attention and for it to make it worth their time, because they came here and they deserve to have their time taken seriously. I love that style. I know, and he was like, "It's a very American problem." And I was like, "Okay." It actually is. Well, yeah, because then when I came back, so that changed my brain chemistry around everything where I was like, "No, you're right. I should be appreciating the audience's attention. I'm making this more about me." And he was like, "Your job as someone on the set list is to show up and show why you're on the set list. Your job is to kill." I love that. Change my life, change my life, and then I came back and when I started doing shows here again, I stopped because all I could see was people doing the same thing. Constantly. And I was like, "Why are you, I was getting upset because I was like, "I'm here. You have my attention. Please do something with it." "Do you use it? Or have intention behind what you're doing." I love that so much because I feel that when I'm on stage sometimes and you show up and some people are really giving it and some are not, and you're like, "Okay, well, even now as a performer, my time is being wasted because we have this time." Yeah. We get to do our dream and our gift and you're half-assing it because you're afraid. Why are you making the audience be like, "Isn't this crazy?" Yeah. Oh, my God. I said, "I wrote a whale. Crazy." With YouTube, it's really rampant. There's a lot of spectacle. There's a lot of shoveling tons of money into a thing, but what we really care about is thought and intention and honesty. And I can notice now when I'm watching a YouTube video and I'm just like, "You're just pumping this out for views. You know that you're going to get clicks on this whole people, but I'm like, you don't care about this video." No. And I think that's what I care about and I can tell when someone cares about the video they're making. Yeah. And that matters to me more than even if I like the videos for some reason. Fully. What is the point? I do understand that you're in your job and sometimes it does get stale or whatever, but I don't know. As an artist, I think it's up to us to say, "If this is getting stale, you have to make a shift. You have to challenge yourself because I hate doing something that feels robotic to me. And if it starts to feel it, it physically like hurts. I don't want to be around it, but it's why I struggle with so many mediums that are comedy." Yeah. Because I'm just like, "Well, what you're describing requires patience. Like what you're describing requires a certain amount of time to do." And uncomfortableness. Well, yeah, to be thoughtful takes time. Like, we were actually, I was talking to a producer and she was like, "Well, you know, directors are the new rock stars." And I said, "What do you mean?" She said, "Well, people aren't going to the movies to see. " It's so true. That's true. They're going to see the new Ryan Cookler movie or the New Yorker's movie, the New Greta Gerwig movie. And my theory is that because directing regardless, it doesn't matter. It takes two to three years to make a movie. You have to think about what you're saying because you have to plan it. You have to kill it. Or you think it's someone like, "Contra points." She takes 18 months to make a video. She drops a video. It has two million views in the first 24 hours because people are like, "I know you took the time and energy to think about what you were going to say." And I want to hear what you have to say because you appreciate her. Isn't that what art is? No, I mean, that's type of YouTube. I love like, there's a YouTuber named FD Signifier and there's like Jenny Nicholson. And a Howard is really great too. Yeah, like a people who are like, "Oh, you care." Like Drew Gooden dropped a video about ESPN just breaking it apart for 30 minutes. And I'm like, "Damn, dude, holy shit." Like he goes through the whole history of it. Yeah. And I'm like, "Yeah, that's awesome." But I'm like, "You care about this." I was like, "You made this not because you could have made something else and gotten way more views, but you care about this." And I understand for people breaking into any industry, I'm like, "Yeah, you have no choice but to resort to the attention grabbing." Of course, right. I think I was speaking to the people that once you get the attention, once you have your things set, now it's up to you to like, not just keep going with it. Because I look at the people who are like some of the top YouTubers, and I'm just like, "Dude, you're just making this place water down." Like, you know, and I really care about that. And I know that like, we make so many videos. I'm sure there's times where people would say like, "We do that." I don't know, but like, I think we really care about making stuff better. Well, I think that that is evident by the community that that Smosh has created. Like the die-hard nature of the people who love Smosh, I think it comes from the fact that like you guys are good people, you care about what you put, you think about what you say. You care about the things that you guys are making. The culture of the company is really fantastic. And when we're working on things like when we were working on BitCity, we cared more than anything that it was as funny as it could possibly be. Or same with Smosh Hospital. That it was as fun as it could also, mainly that. Like it was as fun. Yeah. Like when you and I were really breaking down Cowboy from Smosh Hospital. Yeah. I just loved that moment when it was just you and I and Rachel and you were like, "Okay, do this again. Do the monologue again." But like really think about, like really think about your love for, I don't want to spoil it, but you know, dinosaur. But really think about your love for your partner, rather than the jokes. And that to me is my favorite thing in the world, because I only want to watch art watching an artist go, "I'm really into this and I want to show you." And that's the kind of art that I want to watch. And it could be years and like, "Okay, random. Bjork is coming out with, you know, a new album and doing a tour." And I'm like, "Hell yeah, I will watch that even though I haven't watched Bjork in years." But it's like, "I want to watch someone go. I found this big magic and I want to show you all." And I think we're missing that because it doesn't always make money. People are starting for just, I think authenticity. I think we're so, we've been oversold so much shit. Yeah. That I think these movies like, like sinners and weapons just feel original in a way that people are just like, "Oh, this person, this I'm getting something a little bit real here." And I feel that with YouTube too. And I feel that with you as a director, I feel that you're like, "No, we didn't get that." I love that. I'd rather hear that of like, "Okay, we're not quite getting that." And you're like, "And I'm like, you're right." At this point, I'm like, or I'm tired or whatever. And I'm trying to get this line because, you know, we need to move on or whatever. I'm thinking about, and it's like, no. Like, just focus on the truth of the scene. Like, what is the truth of it? If all else fails, like, how do you respond truthfully in this moment? I love you as a director because you're so curious about what does this mean? How do we, how do we explore in with our minds? And how are we honest about like, what I'm feeling in this moment? Because it comes through and everything that you make, right? Like, you can feel when something feels watered down. Human beings are smarter, intuitive, on like a body level. Right. And I think that's what bothers me sometimes about, if I go to a show or something, and I can feel them winking at the audience when you're doing this for yourself, you're not like, or absurdity for absurdity, sake, without commitment. Oh my God. I really don't like it. But I love absurdity when someone is dedicated to the reality of the absurdity. Yeah. Love that. I mean, Tim Robinson is a great example of that. Like, he is so committed that it works. But the second I feel somebody feel they're too cool for it or that they are. They're like touching the absurdity. They're touching the character. They're not vulnerable. They're touching the comedy. I think because it's really scary. It's really scary to commit. Of course. And we're in a very critical time, like on the internet. We like love to critique, but we're scared to make. And so it's like, because by making stuff you run the risk of being cringy. Of being critiqued. Which is worse than death, apparently. Yeah. But yeah, it is scary. But I don't know. It's also freeing. Oh, but it is. So, like, truly make something. And you can make something. And like, we've had this experience. I've had this experience many times over the past 11 years of making something that is super successful. It's a ton of views, but I'm like, "I feel nothing from them." Yeah, yeah. And then making something that nobody watches, and you're just like, "Oh, that was the best." It was the best. It was the best. It was the best. It was the best. It was the best. I did a screening last week of a bunch of my work. Oh, yes. It was really fun. And one, the first thing I showed was a short, I made like a few years ago. I put all these up on YouTube now, because I think I'm going to start migrating over to you, too. I just can't with either platforms. But first short, was a short, I made for like $400. And the whole concept is it's like a tasty video and those top-down videos. But it's like what happens if the camera keeps rolling, and like, this woman's husband comes home. I love that. And we made it for $400 and probably five hours with a few friends. And it didn't get festival played and get whatever. But it is one of my favorite things I've ever made, because it's just pure. The whole thing. It's just like, we just kind of did this, because it was a fun idea. Totally. That's how that. When I watch it, I can see myself in it where I'm like, "Oh, it has that little magic." I wasn't trying to do it for anything. Yeah. It's like this short that was fun. That's my favorite, that's my favorite thing. That's literally why I do it. When you talk about it and you still get like, giddy about it, yeah. That's my favorite. Damn. Anyways. It's conversation over. I feel like. We have to get out of here. I'm sorry. I have to get. - Go read Reddit stories. - And I have to be in Reddit stories. - Wait, you're in it? - Yeah, I'm gonna be in this one. - Oh, fuck. - This one? This one you're watching before? - Who's in it? - He has Shane. I'm following you to the cat, brother. (laughing) - Brother, I can't wait, we're gonna walk over there. - Would you guys accept me if I just called everyone, brother? - I think sure. - Or Chica. - Well, Chica, I feel like dodging to do that. - No. (laughing) - Literally. - Here's the thing, I think you could do whatever, and he would be like, "It's not okay, but we can't stop her." (laughing) - There's nothing you could do about it. - Wow, wow, that's so wide. - Yeah. - You'd go to HR and they'd just be like, "Look." - And I go, "Brother, be two." - They'd be like, "Can you please stop?" We can't stop, it's up to you. - You said, "Please, brother, that sounds fun." - Okay, brother. - Okay, brother. - Roy, this has been incredible. - Yeah. - This has gone, can I be honest? This has gone exactly how I expected it to be. - Wait, really? - Yes. - In a good way? - Yes. - It's been the best few weeks. - I'm so excited, do you wanna plug anything right now? - Yeah. - I put a bunch of my shorts on YouTube. I'm really not online a lot, like that's just not my-- - Okay, but what is this short call that you just talked about? - I think on YouTube, it's just $400 short. But the actual short is called "A Holiday Casual Your Man will Love." - I love both of those times. - It is really fun. And there are other shorts up there too that I really care about. - And then-- - And also, check out Bit City. That's coming out in two episodes directed by Roy, Creative library, I'm so excited. We all worked really hard on them and-- - It's stuff. - So excited. - Yeah. - All right. - Okay. - Hey. - Hey, can I, am I doing this right? I've never done this before. - I've never done this before. - I literally just shoved my finger in there. - Bye, God. - Bye, guys. - Bye, guys. - All right, drop the act. Yeah, I can't-- - All right, you need to go. Those Bit City episodes are not gonna be good. - He's such a hunk. - I know. He's very hunky and like, he's embarrassed. He didn't like-- - Oh, my God. - How awesome.