#142 - Who Is The Sane One Here? w/ Anna Konkle

Hi, welcome to Smosh Mouth. I'm Shane. And I'm Amanda, and we have a really, really exciting guest with us today. It's Anna Konkle. She is the co-creator of Pen15, currently on the new season of Hacks, and we're talking about her memoir, The Sane One, which we all read, and I'm so excited to talk about it. Hi, Anna. Hi, thanks for having me. Of course. My mic in the right. Your mic is. We're still adjusting to these as well, so maybe mine's in the wrong place. No, it looks great. Scott, how's our mics? Yeah, he says they're great. Scott's like, it's chill, dude. Does a kickflip. Yeah, Scott's very cool. Hey, Scott. He's our sound guy. Hey. Talk later. Wow, you did Amanda's bit. Every time we do sound check, Amanda goes into this long rant, where it's like her calling Scott after so long. Yeah, we understand each other. We understand each other. I think we do. We really do. And maybe Scott, too. Yeah, maybe Scott. Anyways, how are you? I was going to say, I'm not just randomly touching my book. No, you should. I was going to say, like. Let's connect later. How am I? I'm good. I'm good. I'm happy to be here. You guys are so funny. We're so happy to have you. When we found out you were going to be coming on the show, I was literally so stoked. I didn't mention this before, but Pen15 truly is like one of my favorite shows. Really? Oh, thank you. Recent time. I was obsessed with that show. I still am. It's so funny. It's so good. And I related to so much of it. Really? I know it was about like. Pre-teen girls, but I was like, so much of the experiences. I was like, wow, this hits really hard for me. Thank you. That's so nice. I feel like it's now. I'm realizing on TikTok, which I'm not on, but I'm thinking about it. Me too. I think about it, too. And I'm not on it, either. Yeah, we think about it. We think about it. But a lot of teenagers or middle schoolers or whatever are coming up to me being like, I love you on TikTok. Whoa. Because, wait, your clips of Pen15 are on TikTok? They don't know it's a show. They don't know it's a TV show. They just see it on TikTok. And then they're like, you, you might have to cut this, but they're like, you're the one that called your mom a cunt. No, we can keep that in. And I'm like, oh, you're 12. Oh, my God. You know what I'm like, oh, but don't say that. Like, I'm going to get arrested. Oh, are you kidding me? 12-year-olds say crazy things. I did in real life call my mom that in high school. Did she? I was very angry at that point. I know it wasn't good. I'm not proud of it, though I'm talking about it publicly. I'm honestly surprised because I. I was so afraid. I once said F you to my mom and it was like thunder, like the grounds lifted. Yeah. No, we were in a huge fight and I said that from my bedroom. Like she was in the other room and I was like, you're a cunt. And I remember feeling like I couldn't get it out. Like right before I was like, you're not going to do this. And I was like, I'm doing it. And I said it and then everything went silent, which was actually the scariest thing. That could happen. And then it was just stampede, like a slow walk. And I was like, oh, no, you're like, mommy, mommy, mommy, no, mommy, no. And then she yelled at me. Okay. Yeah. It wasn't as bad as you'd think. Oh, yeah. It wasn't an opening for more. Okay. It was just like, can I be, I may be honest, maybe because the word cunt, I don't know. It like, I feel like for Boston, that was just how you guys talk to each other. That was just hello. I was just like, hey, what's up, mom? Which was? We're both from Massachusetts. We found out. Situate. And I'm from Easton. Everybody's from Massachusetts. Listen, everyone makes fun of me because all I do is talk about the East Coast. Oh, same. There's not enough rep. There's not enough rep about it. Yeah. Vermont. Where are you from? Yeah. Where are you from? Mostly Arizona. Oh, Arizona. Military family. So born in Florida, moved to Virginia, moved to Arizona. But. Military family. Phoenix. Okay, cool. I live in now. My address is. I'm just kidding. I lived there, too, for a while, too. I actually went to college in. Oh, really? That's where I started going to college before I then switched to online college to ASU online. Oh, ASU. Even though I was living out here. And a military. What kind of military? My dad was in the Air Force. He was a lieutenant colonel. Oh, wow. Yeah. And he was a pilot for. Southwest. Southwest. Amazing. Yeah. Does he fly Boeing? Or did he? He's retired now. I mean, whatever Southwest planes are. Wait. Okay. Boeing scares me. Boeing scares me, too. And also, then I just get killed again. But. Yeah. Boeing scares me. Me, too. For saying that. But I love Boeing. And your memoir is all about how Boeing is corrupt. But my first boyfriend in love was from Arizona. Okay. Greg. Rough. Greg changed his name and went to West Point. Whoa. Yeah. Okay. Intense love. Intense love from a hippie family, especially. Yeah. That it was like, oh, my dad's not going to like you. Oh, yeah. Of course. And maybe that's why we date them. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. For sure. For sure. Boundaries. Yeah. In the West Point zone. So your book. Like, give us just maybe like two log lines about it. Okay. The book that we read. Yeah. The book that I read. Tell me what it's about. I don't want to give it in my terms. No, no, no. Let's hear your log line. I'm just kidding. The same one. Your dad dies. Your dad dies. Yeah, he does die. Spoiler alert. Spoiler alert. Spoiler alert. It's kind of obvious in the beginning though, right? Or no? Okay. In the beginning, what was obvious to me is the estrangement. Yep. The haven't met my boyfriend that I've been with, that I share a place with. So that's an estrangement. Right, right. And there, I mean, I already knew before I read it that that was happening. Yeah. But to me, it was like, I really love that you gave us the present moment. Not, not fully the present moment, but like a scene in the future. And then we went backwards. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And for me, because we've been together for a long time. We talked about this earlier. Yeah. Is that all my memories are burned into my head because I have sisters. And all we do to process life is talk about what happened with mom or what happened with dad. And so for me, it was like I was locked in on the journey. I was like, oh, here we go. The complicated, complex relationship with your parent that you're estranged from. But I knew that there was going to be a coming together. But it wasn't clear to me. That actually is the perfect. You did it. You did it. Well, and I didn't mean I didn't mean to grill you. And then I'm sorry, but they love to be grilled. Wow. My mom would grill me all the time on math questions. Oh, math. So good. Like, yeah, good schooling. I wasn't good at that. OK. OK. Wow. Thank you for that. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, trying to do the log line is something that I'm not great at. Neither am I. No. I don't know why I put you in that position. No, no, no, no. I want to. I mean, I really want to talk about it. I feel like part, you know, part of being in my 30s. Was recognizing how much the relationship with my dad had been very transformational over and over and over in very dramatic ways. And so, you know, later in life, we were estranged for five years. But then back into my early childhood, he was like my best friend. Yeah. Cool dad. Angel. Angel. Like the thing giving like innocence to childhood of like my mom being freaky and my dad being like, let's go to the movies. Here's $20. Like just the safe part. Yeah. And then I think as you get older, it's normal to feel like. The pedestal, the parent falling off the pedestal. Oh, what a, the breaking of that is super, super painful. Yeah. And especially the parent that you were like, no, but that one's perfect. That one's great because we're all, we're, we're kind of like us versus mom. Right, guys. Right. Yeah. Oh, and then we get into the patriarchy and that's a whole nother, you're kind of taught to not like your mom versus your dad. It's what I'm going through as a parent also. Oh, anyway. So she's five. Oh, you have a daughter. We have. Yeah. Um, anyway, so yeah, I think like, and then. And then I was able by the end of his life, which we thought was going to be, he, he got a diagnosis. We thought it was going to be one to five years and it ended up being two months. And he wanted to go to Italy and he wanted to go to Italy and he didn't get to Italy, but we brought Italy to him in a sense. And I got to be his caregiver at the end. But I mean, as heavy as the spine and the trajectory of my relationship with my dad was, he's the funniest person I've ever met. My mom, you know, unintentionally also very, very funny. And it's really sifting through memories of my childhood of like, who was he? Was he that God-like figure that I remembered or not? And that continued to affect my identity. It's breaking the script. Yeah. It's like you're figuring yourself out by figuring out who your parents were to you. Yeah. I read this great book when I was like doing my breaking of my relationship with my mom because I was like, okay, I want this relationship. It's called. Forgiving Ourselves, Forgiving Our Parents. I don't know if you've ever heard of it. It was so good. And it's not about, it's not about like forgiving your parents, like going, I forgive you. Yeah. But it's like forgiving the memories of who you thought your parents were. You know, because I know your dad was like, oh, I read the, you know, I read the divorce scene and whoa, it was different from your eyes. And it was like, yeah, that's how, you know, relationships with your parents are. So it's like, I feel like most. People do start to go through this. I don't know if it happens in their thirties or twenties or sixties. Yeah. Of seeing your parent differently than the idealized version. And they're breaking the script of it. I feel like it's probably different for each person based on like circumstances, right? Like your dad passing away. It's like, it's a dark thing to think about, but it almost like gives you more permission to think about things maybe than people if they're not passed away, if they're still here. Like, um, cause I feel like I talked to everybody and everything. of everybody's journey is so different but everybody kind of goes through it no matter how ideal your relationship with your family is like it's an inevitable thing that people seem to go through i think you like have to go through it but then i don't know if you feel this way but i feel like our parents generation boomers they like never went through it with their parents but then but then when their parents get a little old they they like unpack it they unpack it but in a way that's like so yeah so tight totally whereas we're like i almost think there's i i almost disagree though that i feel like a lot of our parents aren't didn't unpack anything well i don't think a lot of them did maybe i'm speaking personally sure is my mom is definitely unpacking all the years and it she's holding on tight and her parents are her dad passed okay and but her mom is alive and she's her number one caretaker oh wow yeah wow and she also has six siblings now yeah how long has she been the caretaker years wow years but my vava is very like portuguese catholic goes to church very wants to be independent so which is complicated because she's like i can drive yeah yeah it's like no you actually shouldn't and can't you actually should be taking away your license forever but she's still driving oh she you did okay sometimes well sometimes my mom was like i picked her up and i let vava drive home and i'm like don't do that there's something about that i think is funny about death and interesting which is like i it's so much easier to forgive i find afterwards or there's like this softening to the edges of the things that hurt where you're like yeah that was hard but it doesn't sting the same way and i keep trying to even though my mom and i are actually in a really good place now but i keep there are times when i this is morbid where i'll try to apply and go like okay i was in such a bad place with my dad unfortunately we got things back together before he left but you know thinking back on the like there's a softening to the memories of him yeah can i apply that retroactively to my mom who's a lie oh yeah and go like maybe anna don't be such an asshole when she says something that and i can't the answer is you actually can't you can't you that and also yeah with yeah with my dad and like and and trying to prepare myself earlier for what it would feel like when he died i also was not possible it's until after i was like oh i would there's nothing i could do to prepare myself it it's just like a removal of a thread that no one asked exactly if they could take and then it's just out of you and gone is it is it that with when someone's alive you you have to have your boundaries whereas when they're not here you're there's no boundaries anymore right you're safe to like you're safe you're safe to think about however whereas like when your parents are alive and i see so much discussion about this online of people who are like should i cut my parents off yeah well it's like a thing now right of like no contact is a hashtag and and the problem is with so many people's parents it's like the line of like oh they are destructive for your life yeah it's such a tough line i know it's such a weird line to me because i know i'm different but like i personally i i couldn't imagine you know getting older and not making those types of amends for me personally okay like meaning like not getting things like not figuring it out i don't know if it's because like i'm obsessed with people and the relationships and and like studying relationships and the complexity and i don't know if that's having sisters and like processing a lot but like i couldn't imagine getting older and not finally saying the thing or or having them say the thing even if it is painful i know because i know reading in your book you and your dad had some like pretty raw exposed yeah painful conversations and part of me when i was reading it was like laughing because i was just like oh yeah like i i got a chill through me because i was just like yep you know that thing that you want to like expose to them and be like why did you do that that was weird that made me feel weird and that set up my relationships in a weird way mm-hmm but they don't it's not i know it feels like they're at least for me with this estrangement with my dad it was like kind of a slow burn of unsettling events you know after being super super close when i was young and then uh kind of holding his feet to the fire slowly of being like will you see a therapist will you like this thing made me uncomfortable like and he would get he was just in a different point in his life where or maybe he wasn't and he was the same the whole time i don't know but but he was pissed about it like every time and it i pushed the limit to a point where like i wasn't comfortable around him anymore and it was like an explosive you know goodbye i'm never gonna see you again instead of like hey i'm making this i wish that i had had the courage i think earlier to just say like i'm not comfortable with this relationship anymore in these terms so it wasn't so and then i was like i'm not comfortable with this relationship anymore and then and then the like tragedy and like the the death before he actually died um was knowing that he was still on earth and that i wasn't talking to him and feeling so guilty that like he would call me and i wouldn't pick up or whatever but i really had to like i couldn't hear myself and my own thoughts and my own needs while we were communicating because you can't change your upbringing in that like i saw him as the authority and i couldn't hear myself and my own authority figure period we all do we're right it's in our dna i saw him i needed like ultimate approval from him these things that actually some some aspects that aren't his fault do you know what i mean we're just embedded embedded and i had to like get comfortable with the idea of the ultimate disappointment for my own needs and the ultimate disappointing him was not fucking calling him back it killed me oh god yeah but he finally i was lucky in the sense that like i was willing to do it at a time when like we may have never come back together but it was the thing that ultimately led us back together was that he was i was able to hear myself i was able to show up differently i wasn't the same person as i was five years earlier that was like as reactive so i also ended up taking a lot more responsibility for myself and he did too that was the miracle and that's the part that wasn't guaranteed so that's the leap but i don't know it makes me sad online to see the it's such a fractured community of like the no contact of are you on the parent side or the kid side and i'm like i'm always kid side kind of person because i have a child inside me that's alive and well yeah but i also feel for everybody because most people are doing their best yeah and that's sad i think there's a few points in your book where like you with your dad you did such a good job of like really detailing out such a complicated relationship in such a like complicated person in your dad where like i i was reading the book and i it was weird where i was like okay i'm like preparing for this this episode and i'm like i don't know how i feel about your dad yeah and i was almost like i was like i don't know how you want me to feel about your dad where i was like oh i and i i was almost nervous to to talk to you about it because i was like oh i'm scared what if i have this opinion of your dad but i'm like but you wrote this and i'm just reading this and this is my take on it um no i love i like that's i intentionally am not telling and in pen 15 too which is like you know i don't want to tell people how to feel about something i really want to like hold up a mirror to what it was to me and i'm the problem with me is also i'm always questioning my you know point of view or reality it's actually yeah so anyway i i whatever you think and feel is i'm like honored you read it and have oh yeah absolutely um i i was stoked to read it and uh truly like started reading it and i was like oh my god and then i was like hooked on it like genuinely um what do you think about my dad by the end i mean i i go i think a lot of layered things about him now in addition to and also just to lay this groundwork which i should have said off the bat is like he had the darkest sense of humor yeah like like i on one of his last days on earth a nurse came in and was like um you know he's like coma e and that's a word right yeah i mean it like yeah yeah he can't like move his mouth very well and the nurse is like um are you hot and he goes i'd like to think so what i was like he's fucking funny you know so he thinks death is funny like he like so i think that's why i'm comfortable talking about it so much because like he's like life is funny oh yeah the highs and the lows are funny as it got to like the just like not taking it too seriously and uh it's hard like i wish i could hear his voice like saying so much of it but uh voice no i mean there was things that you address like um things that he he did right i don't know if i don't want to like i don't want to like spoil things for the books but there's like really uncomfortable things that are brought up yeah that you even bring up like hey and and i'm trying to think if maybe you say it early in the book or if later on you kind of surprise us the reader of like when you're recollecting like hey our relationship our whole life you you did this thing and it made me really uncomfortable and then but there's you have some very honest conversations with him and i think as i'm reading it i'm kind of like do i do i trust him Do I trust that he's saying, like, you're right, you're right, and I'm sorry. And I'm like, do I trust him? But that's almost like a thing, that's more of like a societal thing of how many stories we hear. I think if you ask the average person our age, 30s, 20s, like, do they think their parents could change? I think the average answer would be no, my parents are never going to change. And I think we've all, like, as a generation, so many of us are just like, no, our parents are this way. And we can say whatever we want to say our piece, but they're not going to change. I think, like, I feel like that's so much of the landscape, I think the political landscape, I think everything is just kind of like it's this wedge. And that's why I think you see so much of this cutoff idea, because it's just like, well, if they are hurting me, I do think there's something to be said. I think what you do. What you did was so important, which is like, hey, lay it all out. If you feel safe to do it, like, there's obviously levels to this shit, right? I think. And it took me four or five years of the estrangement of going to therapy and writing letter after letter with a therapist to him that I never sent of going, what is the letter that exists so that I feel better, so that I know I said the things that need to be seen, that I can sleep at night. And that he, if he blamed, because the first letter I wrote. I wrote wanted something from him was like, I'm saying these things and I'm sweetening this and that. So maybe he'll just apologize and and we can be better. But in the more holistic version of of being in a, you know, not being estranged anymore and feeling genuinely comfortable around him. It was a version of writing something where even if he blamed everything on me and said I was crazy, you still whatever, there was still something that I was gaining from the letter. And that's where my heart breaks a little bit, because. Because I'm so and but to loop back to what you're saying, but I'm so lucky that the letter back that he wrote, I feel like he was reflective. He didn't say you're crazy. Nope. Like he had in the past. He was like, oh, I made you uncomfortable in this way. So I did that. I didn't know that was wrong. I was I was shocked. What are you talking about? Yeah, I was shocked when I was reading. I was like, what? That's why, like I said, when I read that, I was like, I don't know if I. Yeah, I'm believing this, but I feel like in the next chapter, you're about to. And then, yeah, he proves that he doesn't actually. That's fair. I don't know. I like I also I love the way you wrote, because I was able to project my own feelings onto it. I was able to, like, read it through my childhood, my eyes also and like trying to relate. And it's funny because I had that initial feeling of like, OK, who is this guy? I want to talk to him. Yeah. OK, what's crazy is when you wrote the letter, I somehow knew. He was going to write back to you in this in this. I'm sorry. I blah, blah. And I don't know if it's because, like, my mom writes letters when she she's a very she cannot. She is not a let's talk it out person. My mom writes letters. I know it makes me emotional. I know. I almost just. But like the cool thing about the letter part. Sorry. New mom. I know, you know, but the cool thing about the like letter. Letters part is that you're able to really like, I think that they are really able to express themselves. And so when you wrote a letter and you did it multiple times with your therapist, you were able to actually present a letter that fulfilled, like replenished your well replenished like your cup so that you're able to be like, whatever happens, I'm I'm going to be OK. Yeah. And whatever your responses. And I think that honestly, that that was the right. Formula for that for your dad. And like, I don't know your dad, obviously, but I went through all the emotions with him. But there was something that was very connected to my family. And that like when you laid it out, I'm like, there's only one way that he could respond if he was if this relationship was ever going to make amends. Yeah. And it was that. And when he did that, I was like, they're going to make amends. It was so it was so impactful to me. Wow. Well, and who knows? And thank you for sharing that. Who knows if like it was, you know, after the coming back together after the estrangement, we did not have a lot of time together. Like I and I didn't know that he was going to, you know, get sick. And so we happened to make amends really soon before he found out. And so listen, he my dad and I say this in the book was best when he was taken care of. So the fact that I became. His caregiver. It was like the best version of him. Yeah. Who knows? I mean, you know, who knows if he had lived five years, would we have gotten another huge fight? Possibly in Italy. Would we? You would be in Italy. He really wanted to go to Italy. He never got to Italy. Spoiler. He wants to serve her. And you're like, Dad, give it one second. And he's like, don't tell me what to do. That's another weird thing when parents are like, don't tell me what to do. Like when you're in his place and you set up the oxygen. And he's like, why would you? And you're like, oh, he's throwing pillows. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Did you wash the strawberries in the vinegar, Anna? They last longer that way. I was like, we will leave your condo. Please stop speaking to me that way. Yeah. So I don't know. Like life is life is funny, but it is the way that it ended where we got to end in a really beautiful place. But it isn't. It also isn't a perfect. No. Oh, right. It's not. And it rarely is, I think. No. I think I do think this is very much an Internet thing. And we do a lot of shows where we talk about a lot of different types of situations and relationships. I think we want so badly to just be like to make black and white out of situations. Yes. And it would be so convenient to do that. And I think your book does a great job of exploring like how complicated everything is. And that kind of you're never going to feel like you're doing the right thing. No. Ultimately. No. It's always kind of just like, well, this is what I'm going to do. This is what I have to do. Right. And I'm saying there's something in your book that's kind of beautiful of like kind of the in-between of like the cutting people off and not of like you gave yourself some space and you're able to communicate to your dad in a place where you weren't beholden to him. You know, where you're like, OK, this is this is true to me. Yeah. And I'm saying this and I'm getting it off my chest. So I think there is almost like to people who are debating on what they want to do with their parents. Like it's it doesn't have to be forever. But it is OK to also be like, hey, like if I'm in a complicated relationship with my parent where I can't communicate honestly to them because they're this authority figure and they're looming over me to like if you need to take that time to then communicate. I think it's also like, what do you want from your parent? I felt like it was just like what you were exploring is like, what do you what do you hope to gain? Because they're not going to come to you and erase all the trauma from the past. Yeah. But. And our inner child wants that. We want a softening of memories. We want like a redo because it sucks to go to bed thinking about the memories. We're thinking about the conversation. You're like, oh, my God, those edges are so sharp. Like, I want a softness. But like, they're not. That's why when people say they're never going to change, I think it's more like they're not going to do that thing that you want them to do. Yeah. And you're changing because we're growing up. We're going from children to adult. And so our needs change. And I think the best parents, there's a flexibility, even if they're not going to, like, change deep into their core, they can still pretend. Right. Hey, come on. Just pretend for a little bit. Just don't say that at dinner to my boyfriend this time. You know what I mean? For sure. Even with your mom. Yeah. But my mom's like a rapid changer. So I was thinking about when you said that on the other end, we're like, she changed her name when she was 75 from Janet to Jana because the uh is more open. And it reflects me. And it's Anna on a killer. Your mom is your mom is definitely the funniest, was the funniest to me, but also the most terrifying at times. Yeah. That's her. The blanket, the prayer blanket, the church blanket. You know what I love? I thought my parents were going to, like, get back together. And that your dad was going to be like, your mom can come visit. Yeah. After not seeing her for 15 years, I thought, like, am I going to are they going to, like, kiss right before he dies? It's like a fucked up notebook. You're, like, holding the button. It's the most toxic. Yeah. Mom, my mom's the one kiss. There's like a kiss for five. One more. Mom, kiss, kiss, kiss. For those of you who read the book, that is the darkest joke. But that's what made me laugh the most because, like, our brains go there. Yeah. To, like, the darkest place. Because I swear that's what she wanted. Because there was this seeking drama from my mom. Oh, yeah. How can you feel the deepest of things in your life? And I must see my ex-husband's dying. Yeah. Close your eyes and tell him I love him. Yeah. You know. I'm a nurse. I can help. I can help. And, yeah. And then I was like, is this going to happen? Oh, my God. And then on one of the last days, he was, because I kept asking. He's like, no. Can mom come? No. Wow. Okay. That's the pin in that story. To be on your deathbed and say that is pretty intense. And to be like, get that blanket off me. He was like, I got the last. Because she divorced him. Yeah. He got the last lap. So I think he got the last, like, I'm divorcing you for life. I'll be honest. That's got to probably hit pretty hard. That's got to feel pretty good. He was like, I'm going into the other life feeling good, man. I'm like, there's a few things when you're, like, about to die, like, what probably feels so awesome? And getting that, like, last little bit. Yeah, she's like, ha, ha, ha. I got her. And her person left her. Like, that person. Then you're like, mom? Yeah. Oh, it's awful. But, like, but then again, it's funny. It's so funny that it's, like, the heaviest shit. You're good at capturing the funny of, like, really dark moments, which is very impressive. I don't know why I like funny and dark. I think when things aren't dark, I don't think they're funny. Is that weird? Like, tragedy and comedy are, like, right there. Wait, what do you mean by that? Wait, what did you say? I said I think when things aren't dark, they're not funny. I agree. Yeah. Like, there's, like, a darkness to even, like, even. I agree with that. I don't know if that's true across the board, but that's what I'm the most attracted to. Me too. Like, Strangers with Candy, The Comeback. Those are things that the characters are, like, so broken in different ways and so desperate. And pretending and posing to be fine. Yeah. Like, that's a darkness that I'm, like. Well, because that's. I can never. I want that. Yeah. It's absurdity of just, like, what the hell is anyone doing? Your dating show. Yes. The ride. Will you be mine? Like, that's all I want. Like, characters that are, like. It's so dark. Trying to be enough. It's, you know. Me scrunching my wig. I loved that wig because it looked like it was half scrunched, so I just kept scrunching it. Oh, so good. I mean, I keep adjusting my hair sitting right here. Well, that's why my hair's up. I'm like, if I just put this here. Trust me, it'll work. I do that, too. I'm just, like. But my favorite. I love dark comedy so much, too, because it's so honest. Yeah. It's the truth of it. If you're just like, oh, my God, me, too. Right. It's like. It's admissions. I want to say that. It's like, I don't. I know a lot of comedians feel this way, but I don't come home after a day of work. Yeah. You know, doing comedy and put on comedy. Right. I'm like, it better be dark as hell. Intervention. Power on. Yeah. Hoarders. Whoops. What about you? Hoarders? No. I love Hoarders. Hoarders is maybe. That gets. That's. That is the scariest. That is the scariest show of all time. But there's something so psychological and therapeutic about it towards the end because. That I'm not in it. That I'm not there. Well, they pile on all the clothes because they're hiding this shame, this sadness, this like, man, what is. This brain does not. We are freaky, freaky species. Oh, this brain doesn't go to sleep. We are freaky, freaky. Freaky, freaky. Can I ask a bit of a topic change? Yeah. But I was so fascinated. And this is the same with Pen15. You're so good at remembering dialogue from your life, like specific scenes. You have a three page scene between you and two other kids when you're like six, I think, where you guys have an argument over whether the cat, the stray cat that your family adopted actually belongs to you or not. Yeah. And it goes on for so long. And it's like line by line of like an agonizing argument between children. And I was like, I remember having these types of arguments. I don't remember. What was actually said. There's some moments that I, that there's just like a lot of, yeah, I can, it's auditory. Like I can kind of hear it, but there's plenty that are not like we were talking about this before. And like, if I lose my, I never can find my keys, my phone, but there's just like these moments of like, that was a defining moment for me of moving to Massachusetts and like leaving Vermont, which I loved as a kid. And my moving into my parents in this idyllic looking house and the cat had just like the neighborhood cat. Had just moved into our house and that was like a real comfort, you know, and there are these like two neighbor friends that could be my best friends. If I try really hard and like, what an amazing, I was always in fantasy. So like what an amazing life to have like these two friends in your garden, our cats running around. So for them to be like, that's actually the neighborhood cat. How dare you bring it into your home? Could you steal the cat? Like that. Yeah. That's just alive and well, unfortunately. And that's this brain. Like I remember a lot more than I wish that I did. You could just take it out. I feel like you're thinking with like your imagination fantasy. You're like, whoa, how beautiful the world could be. And then there are these people coming in and being like, no, Anna, that's not. And it's what everybody else's life looks like to me. Yes. Where I'm like, I'm just trying to reach the happiness that other people have. Yeah. Interesting. I think it's like a, like a, a breakthrough. A breaking of your own of script of, of just like this. Cause I also relate is like, I, I felt like I was literally in the secret garden. Like I was like, this garden is secret and magical and fairies are everywhere. And then my, my mom, like get inside now. And I was like, how dare her. How dare her. It's true. I lived in my head a lot. Yeah. Me too. Did you ever have feelings? I don't, I rarely have this anymore, but especially when I was a kid, especially when there was like intense moments, funny or otherwise. Of like a zoom out of being able to see yourself. Yes. Oh yeah. All the time. It's kind of that, that feeling of like. Like you're observing your own life like a movie. I wonder if you sat down and you like, just were like, put yourself there. If you could be like, and he said, you know, you're a dick. Oh yeah. And I said that, like, if you start in a granular way, I wonder if you could like. You could definitely. Extract it. If I could tap back in. Maybe. I feel like, I feel like. That's a no. I think, I think. I think it's shame. Like totally. If you could tell stories. I think, I think, I think you could go. I think how I go there is I tell. Definitely. Okay. Oh, a thousand percent. How often do you think about your childhood? All the time. I'm so jealous of people that don't. I think about it all the time. I like have thoughts, but like there are, there are, it almost scares me where I'm like, there's years, like big, like five, five year chunks of my life where I'm like, I don't know if I remember a single thing from that era. I want to get out. But I think it's maybe, maybe it's that I don't, maybe it's that I don't think about it enough. Right? I don't think about that enough. I want to get some hypnotherapy. I want to lock you to a chair. Yeah, what's going on? I'm a certified hypnotherapist. Really? And I have, I'm just kidding. I was so excited for a moment. Wait, Anna, look at my finger. I had a therapist try to do hypnotherapy and it didn't really work. Wait, my sister was a hypnotherapist for seven years. Did she like. And she stopped and then moved back to Vermont. Why'd she stop? She couldn't. Do it well? No. She actually didn't. She did it in front of me or by accident. She was like, huh? Past life regression? I was what? A buffalo? No, she. I want to do that. I did that. What were you? Whoa, whoa, whoa. You were a lady from Massachusetts. Mine was very legit. I was just a woman collecting oysters from Massachusetts. It was so weird. No, I was like. Oh, I'm so gullible. No. What kind of oysters? See, fantasy world. Fantasy. Me too. No, I was like, I did this past life regression with my sister. So at first with our hypno sessions, I was like, her voice. I was like, what are you doing with your voice? She's like, and you're blah, blah, blah. And then finally, after a few times, I really got there. And I was like, oh, this is fun. And my past life regression was actually pretty legit. I was like part of this community. I don't know what year it was. I have no idea. Were you like the queen of the community? But I, no, I was definitely not the queen. I was like the rejected. Oh. But I didn't want to be a part of the community. Yeah, I was. Your sister's like, in a past life, you were a huge fucking lady. You were a loser. My sister's like, you were covered in shit. Everyone hated you. You were a dirty, dirty idiot. You were not the pretty sister. You were actually kind of ugly, which is so interesting. We should unpack that later. But the main theme of it was, is that I wanted to leave this community and like explore. I was like, I loved my community, but I wanted to explore. And when I got back, they drowned me and killed me. No, that's not right. And my sister was like, I think. No, wrong. Not true. No, whatever my sister said was totally true. It's totally healthy to have your sister to your past, like, regression. But I also mean, it was societally wrong. Yeah. Not cool. Not cool to drown someone. Guys, to drown in a well is a really tough experience. In a well? Oh, yeah. Okay, I call bullshit because that's their drinking water. Yeah, well, they put me in there. Yeah, that's gross. Look at how the corpse put in the drinking water. They put a corpse and then the community couldn't drink. They're the idiots. Yeah, I should go back. And then they all died. Amanda, there's something sweet about that. You drowned in a well. You drowned in a past life. Yeah. I drowned as a child. And then we found each other in Smosh Mouth. What do you mean? Look at that. I drowned. I don't remember this. This might be triggering for mom. This is really sad. For mom. For you, mom. And I also interrupted you earlier when you said that your sister stopped for a certain reason. Hypnotherapy. Oh, no. She just stopped because she just couldn't do it anymore. She wanted to change. Okay. Everything. She was, like, so bored with your past lives. Shut up. Okay. No, but this story is crazy. Oh, no. I've told this story many times. No, it's. This is very funny. You're alive. You're here. I'm alive. I'm here, I think. Do you remember it? See this picture? No, I don't. How old were you? I was 18 months old. Oh, no. This was in Florida. We laugh about it. No, we love dark humor here. When I was 18 months old, my parents were on the other side of the house. I was behind a baby gate. I got past it because I'm fucking awesome. Bad at that track. Yeah. Did a front flip over it, probably. Front flip, of course. And I went out to our pool, and I was throwing rocks in the pool. Probably dropped it. I was dropping them in there. How do you know that part? Because there was rocks in the pool. Got it. He did a past life regression. They looked at it like, there's rocks in that pool. No, he did a past life regression with his mom. If you don't remember, how do you know that there are rocks in the pool? Apparently, they assessed that I must have been dropping rocks in the pool, fell in, and then they found me in the pool. I know, I know. I was gray. I wasn't breathing. Oh, my God. I just started throwing up. My dad jumped in. He was wearing his full, like, flight suit, Air Force flight suit. Jumped in the pool, got me out, and then my mom started doing CPR. and then when the ambulance came, And they took me, and they were like, you know, like, I was, she had just got me breathing again, I think, when they showed up. And then the funny thing, I've told this many times, and I think this is really funny, is that they were like, he's alive. We don't know if there's brain damage, and you're not going to really know until kindergarten. And I think back on my memories, and I'm like, man, that's so funny that every time I brought, like, a drawing or did anything, I was like, check this out. They're like, ha, ha, ha. They're like, ha, ha, is that a tree, or is that us? My dad was like, he was going to be in the Air Force. Now he's going to be a fucking actor or some shit. Rub, podcast, talking into. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, he's like, he's going to be a podcaster. He said that in 1995. Like, what the hell? Oh, no. No, so I drowned and was brought back to life in Florida, which is a very Florida thing to do. Oh, so this all happened in Florida, not Arizona. Florida. No, this is very Florida behavior. This is Florida behavior. Yeah. He's throwing rocks in a pool. You know. As a mom, hearing that story now is quite hard to hear. Oh, I think back on it. But then I remember, it's okay. He's fine, right? I think when I finally had nieces and nephews, and they were 18 months old, I think it hit me then. I'm just like, oh, my God. If I had to see one of them, like, not alive for a second, I'd be haunted. My heart is still beating hard. I know. I'm so happy you're here. Another funny thing. Another funny thing is, so my family, I was like, wow, that's like the most haunted. That's the most haunting moment of their life, probably, that I don't remember. But my brother and my dad, my nickname was Shane Bobber for so long, and I actually didn't know. And it wasn't until I was like 12 that I connected of like, oh, it's because I was bobbing up and down in the pool. No. That they called me Shane Bobber. Wait, wrong people. Your dad is funny. Is he funny? I don't know if it was my dad or my brother. They're both funny. Okay, so who's funny? Your brother. They're funny. I think your brothers, they're very funny. They're funny. I mean, that's fucked up. But that's funny. It's pretty funny. I don't know how much, how long after. It's really dark. Now we're talking. Now we're talking. Okay, now we're getting in there. Let me just remember that. Let's get to the page. In my memory. Let's play a drinking game where every time I stop at a page, I read it, and then we all take a shot. Don't cry. I'm sorry. Mom, don't cry. No, no, no. We're going to stop this game. Okay, come on. Don't bring out the depressing shit. Shane Bobber. Shane Bobber. Yeah. Wow. It's giving me a mental image. That's the problem. Do you read a book? No, me too. Do you read a book and you have the whole image in your head? Projecting it. And so then whenever a book has turned into a movie, you're like, uh-oh. Oh, yeah. That's not how I pictured him. Yeah, I don't like that. Then I was like, was this supposed to be in Gone Girl? That's not what's supposed to happen. But I've realized it's also why I could be a better speaker. Because. What? Let me finish. What? Let me finish. What? Speaking is happening. And that's a perfect point. Because I feel like I picture everything that's said. So I can write it down. It's nice to see it and then write it down. But when I'm talking, just hit the mic, I get overstimulated. Do you guys feel that? Yeah. You do? I picture everything like. Yes. Okay. Another in-joke here at Smosh is that I laugh at all my own jokes. I do too. I laugh at my jokes too. But it's because I just want to laugh all the time. No, he really laughs at my jokes. But here's the thing. People think that I think I'm funny. I don't think I'm funny. In fact, what frustrates me is when I'm saying a joke, I'm picturing this image in my head that's making me laugh. And I never deliver what I'm seeing in my head. Yes. But I'll be like, I'll say a joke, but I'm imagining someone else saying it in my head. I never knew that. And that makes me laugh. So like. Who's saying it? It'll just be. Me. Always. Is she the one being asked me first? It's just anybody like anybody else, right? But who? I'll just be picturing some imagery in my head as I'm saying it. I relate to that. It's kind of saying whenever I do an impression, the way I do impressions is I truly just, I'm barely seeing what's in front of me. I'm thinking of the person in my head and I'm just having them act it out. And it's almost like I'm. To me, that's so interesting. Wait, do you not see like a face? I see a face. Okay, okay. No, I like. Who's the person? Well, no, it'll be different every time. Okay, okay, okay. So I'll be saying a joke of like, oh, it's like as if this person was saying this. I don't know. It's hard to describe. Yeah, yeah. I relate to that. Yeah. But I'm imagining. I'm imagining someone else saying it usually. But it is a funny idea that all of your jokes are someone else, like one specific person in your head saying it. I didn't know that. Yeah. I'm usually trying to like relay. Like Santa, you know? It's always going to be Santa. You're like, it's always Santa. But Mrs. Claus gets one joke, one joke a year. Yeah. What's going on with Mrs. Claus? Why do I? What does she think is funny? I think about her a lot. We think about Mrs. Claus all the time. Do you guys? No. I think about her all the time. What about her? What? I just want to know what she's doing with her time for the rest of the year. She's relaxing. She's relaxing. She's probably the one building all the things and wrapping it. No, those are the elves. No, the elves. They're barely doing anything. I will not take elf slander on this podcast. Mrs. Claus is doing probably almost everything. She's doing the books. She's doing the budget. She's doing the financial budget. She's working with QuickBooks. Let's all be. She's managing all the elves. The elves show up late. They leave early. They're wasted. They love the water slide. They're always looking for. Yeah. Drinking rum. And she's wearing jeans most of the time. Yeah. She is wearing jeans. She's not wearing like velvet red. Yeah. She's wearing jeans. She's with it. She's with it. I don't know why I'm thinking about that. But talking about impressions. She wears thongs. Oh, she wears. And high thongs. Thongs that like reach the midway where when you see her in the thong, you're like. Low rise jeans. High thongs. Whoa. Very sexy. You know, like 80s thongs. Yes. Yeah. And they've been asking for human resources and they don't have it. But it's awkward because whenever she bends over, you see like this sort of thong. And they're not allowed to say anything about it. And the elves are like. Well, they can't. Mostly. They're not allowed to be offended. She chooses. Except for Howard who's turned on. But he's too young. Yeah. And it's awkward. And she's seeing Santa. He's way too young. And he's talked to Santa about it. He's like, how long are you and Mrs. Claus going to be together? And he's like, why are you asking me these questions, son? Brother. Son. Because all the elves are his sons. Yeah. They be fucking. Yeah. They all be fucking. That's the thing. And it's kind of weird because Santa and Mrs. Claus are humans. Santa and Mrs. Claus. Santa and Mrs. Claus. But their children are elves. Well, they have a genetic. It's a weird thing. Yeah. It's like when you put the genetics together. It's like recessive genes. It's like we're not elves, but our children are elves. Yeah. It's like when it's like two people with brown eyes have a child with blue eyes. It's like, how does that happen? And every birth is a litter. Yeah. We're turning Mrs. Claus into some sort of eldritch terror. There's some runts. That's the North Pole, guys, in case you needed to know. That's also in your book. So I love the chapter where you talk about the North Pole. The epilogue is actually about Mrs. Claus. It's a metaphor. And the thong is about being oppressed by the patriarchy and not realizing that you're just trying to please the patriarchy. You're just trying to please the patriarchy. Santa, whatever. And let me tell you, everyone looks good in an 80s thong. Really? Oh, yeah. I'm really trying not to do thongs anymore. You never did that in college? Larry the Cable Guy? Yeah, a little bit. Where you like pulled up your thong and you were like. Yeah, a little in the mirror. No? No. Or you're talking about just like out in life. No, no, no. Just like. That's a whole episode of Pen15. Out with a couple friends. Yeah, that's a pen. Yeah. Yeah. That's a thong episode. I know that. Yeah, honey. I know that. I'm winning the host award, right? Wait, wait, wait. No, hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Pen15. You better cook something up. Quick, Amanda. Bowl cut. Bowl cut. Oh, you got the whole. Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. Red station wagon. Was it red? We read your whole book, so Mrs. Claus. My dad's station wagon? Which station wagon? Yes, let's say ding, ding, ding, ding. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm sure there's a red station wagon in there. But I'm winning. No, you're winning. You're both winning. I'm winning at life. Okay. That's true. That I love that you therapized your life through Pen15. That's true. And I have to ask a question. Yeah. I know your dad had a response about reading it. Yes. But what was your mom's response? Because I know you wrote your parents. To reading this. No, Pen15. Oh, and Pen15. They were both pretty supportive. My mom would always go like, it's fine. I'll move out of the universe. Just move out of the universe. Kind of. Kind of as a joke. Of course. But then, for example, like, I did Jimmy Fallon one night. Hey, honey. Okay. I mean, that's not a big deal, but, and she accidentally, because, you know, all the conversations are mostly pre-planned, obviously, blah, blah, blah. What? Not here, guys. Let me just give you the end. This is all improvised. Jimmy Fallon is my Santa Claus, where I'm like, it's all real, right? I didn't really know until the first time. I was like, surprised. I know. I'm such an idiot. Sad. No. I'm saying I'm sad by that. Oh, yeah? I thought you were. See, I was sad, too. I mean, there is. I think they all do it a little differently, right? Every late night host does it a little differently. But Jimmy Fallon pre-plans it. Or Jimmy, sorry, not Jimmy Fallon. Jimmy Kimmel. Well, Jimmy Fallon, too. All of them. I'm really bad with names. Jimmy Fallon, I used to wait on when I waited tables. How was that? They loved a mimosa brunch. Oh, I've heard. Craft Bar, New York City. Oh, I've heard. Interesting. You mean that? Jimmy Kimmel. We started talking about my mom, and that was, it took a turn, and I talked about her changing her name, and I thought she was going to be really mad at me afterwards. She wasn't. She wasn't. She was like my friend Jimmy. Oh, see, she's probably loved that. She did. But with this book, you were saying that your mom was, read the whole book. Well, so I thought, yeah. So, yeah, she read it. I sent it to her a while ago before it was finished, finished, and was like, what? Because I want to give everybody a chance. to read it and be like, this is my memory, or this isn't fair, blah, blah, blah. like it's not the moments that she intended to let be public and she was so incredible while she was reading it honestly and she was like writing me apologies and just like and also explaining things that i included too of like i'm working i was working three jobs and i was like when your dad got fired i kept you know got whatever um and then you know a week or two before this was going to be final final i was like i think i'm going to change this one other thing someone's name and she was like i have no idea what you're talking about and i was like but you read you read it and she was like i scanned it oh oh but that's her that is who she honestly was validation that like who she is yep she's like i'm a vegetarian and you're like you're eating a steak and she's like just tuesday yeah i don't usually eat steaks and then she goes and she's like is that bacon i'll have a little bit of bacon and then she goes and she's like is that bacon i'll have a little bit of bacon and then she goes and she's like is that bacon i'll have a little that almost that almost like juxtaposed but fits in like you were talking about how like you live in like a fantasy or like whatever and then she's really living in a fantasy this is very she is the idea of herself in a way absolutely absolutely she's like i am this person and that's so many people's parents because the way people talk about their parents just like oh i am whatever i say i am is that just what happens to humans like will we all be like like are we like that now and we'll continue to be like that where it's like because there's things people say to me where wait that's how i am that does happen sometimes same a thought that i have a lot because i don't think about my childhood i'm having these other thoughts is uh we're gonna get in there don't worry about having a time machine and going back to seeing your parents when they're the same age as you to be like because then you can be like okay am i were you just like me are we how similar are we my mom's just a huge bully and then you go back and be like were you like you are now then but i'm just remembering differently to understand if they're a mirror of you or not now or if you can see them just all sorts of things right kind of everything when i was a teenager i thought about it a lot of just like i wonder what my parents were like when they were teenagers and would we have even liked each other if we were just that's very back to the future time thinking about sure he fall in love with his mom well his mom's kind of weird to him yeah yeah what i would really want is to go back in a bubble invisible bubble they can't see me but i just get back in a bubble invisible bubble they can't see me but they can't see me but they can't see me but especially when it's like you know when they're the age that they you were born yeah it's like what were you like oh i don't want to know i yeah i mean we have like video camera camera footage and i my mom was very much like she was in her power all the time did the power every time the camera went to her she was like what are you doing and i'm like that's kind of cute i hardly have any video that's cute it was really cute i hardly have any video of my parents like of of my parents of childhood videos there's not much oh i got a video camera and i kept filming them and i would zoom in on my mom what are you doing and i would zoom in on my dad he'd be like get that camera out of my face amanda like so i learned a lot and then i was like oh oh but they're they're they're kind of different yeah like my you know so i don't know if i'd want to see them at that age i guess i saw them there but they knew i was filming them so what would they be like if they didn't if they know i was there god but it is the thing because people think like oh am i going to become just like them like how much do we change over time and how much is generational yeah like how much is how what were baby boomers like when they were in their 30s yes and then how much do we become like that but i i definitely think a part of us is like them and that's what makes us frustrated about them sure yes all the time but well i also heard this i can't remember where can't remember what could have been a reality show i heard about a study that i meant to look up about mice that i want to say they were shown the color orange and then they were and then there was a loud sound and they would like jump or something like that i'm butchering this but it was like four generations of my and then they stopped doing it it was four generations of mice later when they saw the color i know i cried when i heard it yet i can't remember it exactly they saw the color orange and they there was still a reaction compared to other mice huh that is so we're fucked because of our great great great great great grandmother's issue we're so fucked i can't wait for you to do a past life regression one day yeah one day i also i'm dying to know what you were like in middle school and get into i do remember things i i have a character that i play um here in smosh called the chosen okay and he's just that he's just like this guy who thinks he's like an action hero guy right and i he is largely based on like in my head what like what i would think all the time was like you know just that i'm like deep down i'm like what if i'm actually super badass but i'm just like not at all were you popular like were you that badass action were you the funny kid were you like did you stay in your own corner was becoming a class clown when i was in i think i was in fourth or fifth grade when there was this kid who like would just interrupt class and say crazy shit and it would get a laugh sometimes and you were like i was like that's no i was like that's fucking awesome i was like i need to start doing that oh and i started like being like oh wow because i was when i was a little kid super dead quiet never spoke just kind of like in the corner and then like for some reason like i saw that and it was like okay like whoa attention what is that wow and uh because i was like the the youngest by a lot my brothers were eight and eleven so actually i felt kind of not in a bad way not if my mom watches this like like invisible in a way of just like yeah i'm just kind of like here while all while the world happens around me a little bit and you do things where it's like whoa like and i think i equated attention with like i'm real and then uh i'm a real boy like oh i'm a real i'm a real person like and uh it's kind of addictive and then um i was i was 12 when in fifth grade we did a uh classroom play and i had never done any theater any performing or any getting up in front of people at all and uh i just got hooked on it and i played willie wonka i was the only one who auditioned okay the only kid who auditioned you know honey you got it because of your talent yeah but i did it and it was like an immediate response from everybody including my parents of like oh my god like whoa you should do this this is amazing so it went from like zero to like a hundred of like zero to hero holy shit and then um so then within two years i was in auditioning for shit and going out to pilot season and stuff so it was like going out for pilot season oh yeah yeah yeah it happened he did that it happened quick oh my god that was my dream yeah and it was cool but then it was also this like oh childhood over there like i now this is my life wow this is my career and uh wow that's a very unique so that kind of also shifted because i didn't have then like the regular high school experience and it was just into what i'm still in now which is wild entertainment industry did you did you said that was your dream did you know early on that you wanted to like go to hollywood and i didn't think hollywood but i was like i loved i loved like doing community theater in my town i loved singing there was a lot of just like pretend in the mirror of like really adult situations crying like being like no edward i relate to that so hard like denver where are you i'll never find him go home in time what is what i remember being in the bathtub and the um the soap container there's like you know mold between the tiles and whatever and in my mind the soap container was like the intercom for my butler and there was always a break-in like because like really like oscar not like yes trying to be meryl streep like no nothing irony about it like how real could i cry how real could i how fast don't ever remember by the way my parents being like you good no me neither i don't think my parents ever they just must have heard a sobbing in the in the bathtub and they're like that's life so your butler did he come did the butler ever um did he ever save me he didn't really no of course no he tried you had to save yourself he was busy oh that's kind of i feel like the my version of this was every and this was going on for a long time maybe still sometimes yeah we're all we're all be in the shower and and like as i turn off the shower i'm like what if there was an intruder like in my house what would i have to do but what would you do i i well i envision in my head the badass version where i'm like so chosen like whip open the curtain and like fight and then i'm like no real version i don't know what the fuck i'm doing you you fall pull the whole curtain down over the curtain i piss and shit and spin no you hate your head what can you do if i'm doing that confuse your enemy so we're all doing bathroom play so we're all having a fun time we're all bathroom play thank you we're all doing bathroom no i think we all still imagine things we're like what if this scenario i don't know about you but sometimes i drive and listen to a song and i'm like i am at the end of an indie film and i am driving and this is my moment and the camera is right here and i'm just driving so sometimes i'll get full tears and they're not because of my life no they're because of your inner life my in the indie film this is the last shot where the camera being in the car as a kid and getting a fight with one of my parents in the car. and like tears streaming down my face and looking out the window and like the images are blurring and then looking at myself in the side mirror and I was just like staring at like the crowd. Do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do. Yeah, the music. And you were just like. And I'm like, I'm gorgeous. Yeah, you're like. And you turn around and you're like. And then you catch your parents' eye in the freaking mirror and you're like. Don't look at me. What? Mom, stop, stop. Nothing. Can we stop at McDonald's? No, I'm fine. Yeah, I'm fine. Leave me alone. What are you listening to? Nothing, just the same song on repeat because I have to get the music video right in my head. I'm thinking about math. Yeah, exactly. God. I relate to this so hard. You do? Yes. Everything, everything is that. And then, and then speaking of Boston, I would go in, like I was in some community theater and Maura Tai, who owned Tai Casting, she, after a performance, came up to me and my parents and was like, what? Would she be interested in coming into commercials? And I was like, absolutely she would. What time do you need me? Absolutely. And then my dad was like, and I am as well free to audition. He really wanted to. Yeah, did you guys have an audition in the book? Yeah. And in his, I remember in his 70s, I'm now in LA and he calls me and he's like, I was scouted for a commercial and they said I'd be perfect for Walmart. They said I have Walmart face. And you're like, dad, nothing more. He was like, they're asking for $8,000. I was like, he was like, cause you know, headshots are expensive. And I was like, run. No. No. But yeah, so I started going to audition for commercials, which I was like thrilled about. Of course. And like, it never worked out. Well, senior year, senior year, I got, I finally got an industrial, an anti-drug. Good, an anti-drug. That's a good one. That's really good. I remember the line was, are you stressed out? I don't believe you. Everyone gets stressed out. Were you the person in the commercial? In the commercial, like giving someone drugs? No, I was saying like, we don't do that. We don't do that. It was like dare, but for like adults kind of teens. It was like a cool teen website. It was like, I know you want to smoke. Cause we all get stressed out. We all get stressed out. But we can't. But don't do that. But don't do it. Right. Oh my God. I went to dare camp. Oh yeah. How much drugs did you do? Oh, it was run by police officers. And I was having the best time of my life. Wait, I'm not even kidding. Dare officer, officer Dom was our dancer. Dance DJ. Officer Dom. So he would, he would run. Jesus Christ. Officer Dom, he comes in, he's like. Oh, officer Dom was in the magic mic show. Yeah. And then he's like, eight ways to say no. He was arrested. He's in jail actually right now with his thong on. He is in prison. Yeah, that's fine. Wait. Okay. So I had a bunch of dare officers running this. I don't know what we did, but we, it was a normal camp. It was down the street from my house. No, it wasn't. I don't think it's a normal camp. It was a dare camp. And it was, we always had the briefcase conversation. Remember they opened the briefcase and it's all different drugs. Oh yeah, I do remember that. And we would act out scenes. We would act out scenes like if you got offered drugs. And it'd be like, and I was like, here is my fucking chance. I'd be like, I don't want drugs. We're going to play out this scene. I don't know what was wrong with me. My whole time. I mean, what's wrong with you is wrong with me, sister. I was just like. Because we're talking this. Can we take that again? Amanda, give us more. And I'm like, I don't want drugs right now. Yeah. But my favorite was, I was so into like Marilyn Monroe. Everyone wanted me to do Marilyn Monroe. Don't ask me why. Well, because you're excellent at it. In your drug scenes. Yeah. I would be like, Miss Happy Birthday. So I equated that. Whoa, wait. I was like, there's one character and that's her in the drug scenes. So I was like, I don't want that. So you were like sexy hot girl. Yeah. That doesn't want drugs. I was like 10. I was just like. God, this is a weird world, isn't it? I know. But my older sisters were there. And the dare officers were like, keep going. Yeah. Exactly. Take that again. And you don't want drugs. And you're Marilyn Monroe. Let's take that again. And the officers offering. Let's take it again. Let's do a little more improv. Take this wherever you want to take it. Yeah. Take it wherever you want. You're in Hollywood. This time you take the drugs. Let's play it out. This time, take a little bit of cocaine and see how far. Where are we going? See what it's like. Yeah. Okay. A helicopter. You're open to anything. Helicopter's coming in. Okay. Didn't it get proven that dare caused more people to do drugs? Yeah. That's why it doesn't exist. It doesn't exist anymore, right? More people did drugs. Does it exist? Man, I put my heart and soul into that company. Your performances were so good that people did drugs. They were so good. I'm sorry, Amanda. It's actually your fault that the drug wars got worse. You know what I think is hard is that every camp I went to, my older sisters were there. So they were just like, what are you doing? You're so lucky, though, because I would do that. I miss your older sisters being like, come on. And then you got cooler. You did get cooler. And for me, I didn't. And so I would do it. And I'd be like, that was awesome. And people would be like, we're going to sit over there. And I'd be like, okay, I'll meet up with you in a little bit. And it would take me months to realize what was happening. Yeah, Amanda, you have no idea what it's like. Your sisters really filter. I know. They filter you. They also, they tell you, they're like, don't ever date this person. But they also filter you. My brother's 11 years older. And he was like, put your sunscreen on. Yeah. Like, he was like an adult. Yeah. My brothers are 11 and 8 years older than me. So they were like out of the house by the time I was. And that's what you wrote. That you didn't have anyone to like bounce ideas off of. To be like, wait, am I crazy or is mom crazy? Well, and we didn't talk about that stuff at all until my late 20s. During the estrangement with my dad. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. Because then I realized that my brother hadn't spoken to him in 15 years. And was like. And then he became a parent. Well, a stepdad. Yeah. And then he was like, oh. Oh, my God. You really like took notes. Yeah. I dug in. Oh. Nobody. I dug in. So did Shane. I got a shout out. You were texting each other. Selena legitimately. Yeah. Fucking wrote a book report. She wrote notes on your. If you want that actually. Yeah. Do you need this? I would love to see it. And if you have any ideas for me more succinctly talking about the book, I would. Absolutely take it. Wait. I know we talked before you came on the pod. Yeah. You're killing it. I know you said like it was hard for you to talk about the book. But like. That's so sweet. You're killing it. I think. No. Maybe it's because you're talking to other actors. No. Hey. You're killing it. Hey. You're killing it. Now put that back. I'm done. No. No. Hey. Hey. You know how hard it was to put these on? Oh. Sorry. I'm so. No. How dare. Oh my God. The last part I regret. No. That's the throwing it. I'm. I'm so. Wait. You have no idea. We fuck shit up. You do. What do you do? Oh my God. Oh. We do insane. What if I just knock that down? We do. You do? Ah. The last one we recorded, we were drinking wine. Fully drinking wine. Can we do that next time? Yes. You want to come back and we'll drink wine? That's our new bit. You know what I've been wanting? We drink wine every episode. Do you really? That's so fun. No. We did it for one. It's 8 a.m. I wish. It's so early. You guys start this so early. Why not a little later? Well, we're filming a ton of other stuff after this. You got fucking shit to do. We're filming four podcast episodes today. Your teams better appreciate you because you guys are fucking working and I'm going to guess. You're killing it. That they don't have to do much. Oh. Yeah. Again, Selena did a lot here. Let me point out how much Selena did. You're really busy and you're just doing it. You're doing everything yourself. But also, I don't know. You just kind of get used to the flow of it. But also, we're coming in. We're improvising. We're being personality. Whereas when you were going through the stuff with your dad, you were writing a show. You were going in. Yeah. That was hard. Were you filming also? We were filming and it was when my dad got sick. It was the end of the writer's room for Pen15. We were in pre-production and we had insisted, it's our fault, on show running everything. Wow. And so, we really didn't have a break because we're going from editing to promoting it. Yeah, but how fun. Jimmy Fallon, Jimmy Kimmel, whoever. Jimmy. Whatever. Jimmy was there. Jimmy's. And then going into the writer's room, not enough time. No one has enough time. And then we're like about to go into, yeah, we're going into pre-production. And then he told me that he was sick and we had mended things at that point a little bit. And then ended up going to see him in Florida that weekend. And then it was. Yeah. Yeah. And then Cockroach City. How crazy is that? I mean, living in L.A., sorry to say, but half the places in L.A. are covered in cockroaches. I mean. And I was just like, who knew that cockroach eggs looked like small, perfect little beads. And there was a lamp of my dad's. He was OCD clean. He was at the hospital. He stayed overnight. And Alex and I, after just getting off the plane and ending up at the hospital, Alex is my partner, got home. And he sees these two little, I see two beads on a lamp, the edge of this white lamp. And I was like, that is a weird place for two beads. And I was like, are those beads? And Alex was like, yeah, they're beads. Why are you saying, why are they beads? And we both started to panic. And we realized, yeah, they were cockroach eggs. That freaked, that freaked me out. It's freaky. You got rid of the eggs. The cockroaches did not hatch. We put the, yeah, we put the compost disposal. You really, I'm like so honored. I, oh yeah, I went in deep. I've not had many cockroaches. Actually, sorry, I'm lying. I've had multiple cockroach experiences. Okay, so you suppress, you suppress things. And I was 13, there were cockroaches all over my body. Oh my God, I remember you playing catch all your life. And my dad said, stop, get the cockroaches, you bastard. No, I forgot. You have a time out. You will be with those cockroaches. I was going to say, here, living in LA, for all that I've lived here, I've not had many cockroach experiences. But I've had two. Two distinct ones. What were they? When I was living in a house in East Hollywood, this old, like 100-year-old house. Oh, of course. That's where they live. roommates and there was a cockroach they party there i i was in the back like attached to the garage house so i would see cockroaches all the time just on the driveway in between my sliding glass from my bedroom to the the house and so i would just see cockroaches and i'm just like all right hope they don't come into my room and then there was one time where there was one um in the bathroom and i think i saw it go down the drain and i was like and i was like all right it's down there so i can't i don't know what to do about that and then my roommate my roommate i hear my i hear my roommate and maybe it's my fault for not doing something about it but i was like what do i do it's gone um and then my roommate i heard her later was like was like oh my god it's like come out of the drain no no and i was like oh shit no no sorry i should have told you that he's there um and then uh dude years later this is a few years ago do you kill it did she kill it i think she killed it you just put it back down the drain she's like go back go go back go back to shane after that years later uh i'm living with my my now wife uh courtney and we were she's also on the channel yeah okay we're together for a long time it's crazy we have to split the whole thing you didn't do it like a televised marriage no you could still do it okay you are so reality show and i love it like bachelorette vibes or bachelor yeah you could no we didn't tell you we didn't tell anybody until they actually didn't tell anybody and we posted on april the fans had no idea it's our proud did you know yeah no we didn't know yes i did we lived on a fifth-story apartment and uh never had bugs no bugs ever and we have two cats and just never saw bugs and then one day i see our cat kind of like oh no no doing some stuff and i was like what is she looking at and i go over we had a cardboard box filled with records next to a record player and i i look over and massive cockroach i don't know what's going on i don't know what's going on i don't know what's going on i am just chilling there you hate them and i was like them i hate them without seeing any bugs and then all of a sudden there's a big old cockroach in there okay you said this and now you just said this what is happening it's like it was like this big no yo this sorry cockroaches are huge this big that means it's a hundred years old and it's been in your house no since the 70s they can squeeze down to like the size of 60 years old i'm so grossed out why did i bring this out like turtles they live in the house they live in the house they live in the house they live in the house no so of course now it starts i it starts crawling around really fast and our cats aren't taking care of business like they should they're just kind of like hitting it i i'm proud of this because i don't like to kill things i grab our vacuum our dyson what the hell high technology this is so much worse i suck it up into it and i see it inside the canister crawling around and it's going like no it's going where am i it's six it's like what i take it to our trash chute no i gave this thing a great life because i open up our trash chute i like how open it up and it flies and i watch it fly down to another person's no to the trash and i was like i said where's the trash chute going it goes down to the dumpster it's home what is this the 50s this is so cool the trash chute goes down to the dumpster i've never had a trash go directly to a dumpster is this real where do you think trash chutes go what do you what about a laundry chute this isn't no no i leave i leave my apartment to the hallway of the apartment complex where there's a trash chute room this is shocking open up a thing and you like open it and i open up the the vacuum and it flies down into a dumpster down in the parking garage and i sent it to cockroach heaven no which is a dumpster that's a woman's home she said you can put the chute in my apartment well and then the cockroach just landed she went oh hello little friend and now they're having tea together that's so that doesn't gross you out but me talking about the cockroach earlier grosses you out yes because you said this and then you said this maybe that's real and one's a fantasy okay the fantasy cockroach has a top hat i can handle that anyways well speaking of actually can i just tell another cockroach story yeah please hey thank you um so the night before we found the beads so this is part of alex's horror of seeing the beads he had just come and alex is from malibu so i was a little bit whoa what the hell is happening here and he surfs away that's how i felt brother very he's not like you know but like he grew up in malibu around like yeah like i'm like have you seen cockroaches he's like no dolphins yes yeah cockroaches yes what's it what's a cock a cock i only know nobu that's all i know i know nobu your partner is rafael from the teenage mutant ninja turtles and surfers and that's all i know bro babes cockroaches i know about cocks that's your partner that's no that's determined it's a good snapshot so yeah he from malibu he was like cocks and stuff and and so i was like okay so you're coming down outside of tampa it's a little it's rough around the edges yeah there we go and and we were so first we saw a couple really baby tiny cockroaches in the tub yeah yeah yeah yeah sorry but you have to hear this no i do and then at night we turned the light off and he had his computer on in bed oh and we heard something fall no and it fell and he said he turned we we turned it was and then it was like looking at him like wally yeah like it was just it was just like he was like he turned and he was like it's kind of cute they're kind of they're kind of cute are you kidding yeah but then he told me a story of his friend in college and then i'll wrap up the cockroach stuff sleeping with his mouth open what are you saying that's all i'll tell you what are you saying what are you saying his mouth while he was sleeping and that sucks but but luckily he'll swallow he'll swallow seven spiders throughout the year and they'll take care of it i'm gonna tape my mouth shut tonight i know it's really scary i'm gonna be like full tape around my mouth and just that's how i'm gonna sleep tonight and then when and then when the cockroach lands on you can't scream and he just goes top hat on yeah he has his top hat on and that's how i can handle it and he has a cane that means he's old he's not doing super well but he likes to have you can handle that you let him do a little dance yeah you have the most stereotypical like phobia because it's this and rats oh you don't like rats and i rats i have zero problem with what about ratatouille she said she had a hard time watching it i don't want to see a rat near food why would i want a rat cooking my food i don't care yeah no it's a problem he's so sweet yeah he's about mice fine cute hamsters i had a hamster me too guinea pigs okay did your hamster ever get loose and go through the walls of your house absolutely oh my god chucky twinkle okay chewed through the plastic yes got out was lost for three weeks and i was like twinkle and he was through the house the whole time and when he decided to come out my older sister and her cool ass friend they were in like dying their hair phase like listening to like metal and they were out by the toaster and freaking twinkle comes out scurries on her bare ass foot oh okay i thought you were gonna say it got toasted no no oh no hamsters have a way of dying in crazy ways well no like mine no i'm so sorry he just got sick and that was fine oh yeah no it was fine and i was like oh my god twinkle and the friend was mortified oh my because it was just on it was just on her but they're cute my hamster got out well many many times but this time um i woke up to my mom screaming downstairs crying and screaming no no no and and then i just remember going halfway down the stairs going mom i can't believe this isn't in the book and um i'm like and she was trying to get the hamster away from my cat oh which she did she didn't wait it's really sad wait and she went to sleep crying and i remember that's going to sleep going like it's okay mommy oh you're taking care of her tough yeah that was really sad wait chucky the cat got chucky yeah mo mohammed midnight tweet conkle got got chucky yeah as they do yeah it wasn't not as they do that's so sad that's why i was like oh it was toasted yeah right of course i was like whoa it just it just had a party on my uh sister's friend and i was like oh weird like oh that's oh that's really hard you're watching to letting my hamster crawl up my sleeve uh-huh you ever do that uh-huh oh yeah my mom was like any memories of that no i never never had hamsters and and i'll be at the pet store sometimes and i'll look at the hamsters and guinea pigs i'm like so sweet i'm like you can't i can't i do not want to see my cats become the demons that i know they are yeah like that they're sweet well they sound a little soft with the with the cockroach sometimes the bugs they've disappointed me we had a praying mantis once and and i it was in our bathroom it was a big old praying mantis wait they're lucky yeah they're lucky but i was like it's what are you gonna do about it men the women women praying mantis kill the men yes and so you're like get rid of it i literally throw my cat in the bathroom shut the door i'm like take care of business and then i open it up to seeing the the praying mantis was on a hairspray bottle my cat was on trading jabs. Like, truly trading jabs at one another. They were having fun. They were just having fun. They were communicating. Yeah. Your cat was like, don't use me. Wow. I also love this idea of like you don't like to kill things. I don't. I do whatever I can. But then there's like a beautiful praying mantis. Well, yes, it's a beautiful praying mantis. Right? Yeah. But when you were like, go. Go, get it. That thing was huge, and it was in our bathroom. I was like, I have to like. But do we not feel like they're like the Karate Kid vibes? I love praying mantis. I feel like praying mantises are like. When I see them outside, I love them, but that thing actually did scare me because I at one point opened up the bathroom, and it was on one of the light bulbs. Smoking a cigarette. Yeah, smoking a cig. Shane, talk about your childhood. They'll look at you. Most bugs don't look at you, but that thing literally, it like, I open up, I see its silhouette, and I see it just go like this. And I was like, you're freaky as hell. I got to do something about this. See, if I saw that, I would have been like, oh my God, it's a sign. What is going on in the universe that I need to listen to? Oh, but cockroaches. This is a sacred sign. But cockroaches can't bring you signs? They don't bring me signs. They bring me hell. Cockroaches can bring you signs? No. Cockroaches are like. Cockroaches live for 60 years. They're like in the mummy when they open the book, and it's like, do not read from the book. That's what a cockroach feels like. When the locusts come, and the devil. Have you watched The Mummy recently? Completely different. Completely different bugs. One of my favorite movies. Anyways, do you think Brandon Fraser's hot? Yeah. Okay. Anyways. I like Anna. Do you? I do. Okay, but. At times, no. Growing up. Growing up hot. Yeah. Are you kidding me? Hot, hot, hot. I love him now. I was on and off of him. I was on and off of him, so to speak. Okay. Oh, nice. Cute. You're talking about this like it's dare. Wish I chose a different sentence. Yeah. On and off. No, we know. I got it. Yeah. Yeah. Mentally. Mentally. Mentally. You were on and off of Brandon Fraser. Totally. I got it. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. No, we got it. That's really all. Yeah. Good, good, good. Good, good. I would have loved to have been on for a while, and then there was an off point, and I was like, I'm off. You know? And then I came back on. Came back on. Okay, so we have another segment that we're going to do. Oh, I was going to read. Oh, yeah. Selena wrote down some questions, and I feel like. To end the pod, although I feel like I could talk to you for days. We have five minutes, so pick a few. Okay. Oh, well. Right. Okay, so since you shared some. I feel like we talked about. Should we read one? Someone said, I clicked on the wrong contact on Google chat and sent a cutesy message intended for my then girlfriend to a former high school classmate who I was not close with. And had not spoken to in several years. After realizing my mistake, I quickly blocked him and haven't spoken to him since. Ooh. This reminds me of Reddit. They wrote it like Reddit. That's amazing. That's like a Wednesday for me. Yeah. Someone said, I peed myself at my high school grad night in Six Flags. My friend is really scared of roller coasters, so we rode a kiddie ride, and when we were on it, she was screaming since she thought there would be a big drop, LOL. I was laughing really hard that I peed, and then we got off the ride. My friend was laughing at me and took a pic of my wet pants and made it her lock screen. My friends will never. My friends will never let me live it down. I don't think those are friends. Okay. Okay. Also a Wednesday. This is actually reminding me of one moment that I had that was so embarrassing. I hated it. It was like sixth grade. I was like coming into myself, like getting taller, like getting some boobs. So I was feeling a little bit like insecure, and I'll never forget this. We were all in class. This is awful. Our chairs are like, we pushed our chairs lined up. We're watching the teacher, and I'm in the front row, and my legs were really long as they are right now. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. This is not a cute story. So I don't know why I decided it would be so fun to see if this foot could go around this foot and hook on the other side. Like this? Yeah, exactly. Okay. But it like wasn't happening for me. So I was bending over and trying to hook this one around this foot. I was like full. Did people know what you were doing? No. Or this was just a private moment where you were like, this would be cute. I was front row, so people were probably watching me. This could be an episode of Penn. Yeah. Just that. No, exactly. This is why I watch Penn, and I was like, exactly. So they're doing the whole thing. Students are like watching the teacher, and I'm just like bent over, just fully trying to put this foot behind this foot, and I'm like fully bent over, and I'm just like doing that, and then I did the loudest fart. You unlocked something. Oh. And it wasn't like, uh-oh, it's coming. I should probably, I hope it's silent. It was there. When it scares you, bop! And this is what I did. This is what's awful, and this is something that I have to really look at personally about myself, is I go immediately, I go into survival mode, and I just go. That is quintessential middle school. Yep. And I turn around, I go, who did that? You have to gaslight everybody around you. And you find the one who possibly, the boy in your class who looks the stinkiest, who probably isn't, and he's actually the sweetest, and he definitely didn't fart, but I still straight up went. You just go. I pointed right to him. Of course you did. And I wish I could find him to this day and apologize. I won't say his name. Did you convince a lot of people? Everybody thought it was him. No way. And he looked at me like, I didn't fart. I did not. And he knew that I was lying to cover up my- You crucible-ed him. You know what? I don't know. You think he knew? I bet he didn't know. You know why I can say that with confidence? Right. Because I was the blame to fart person. Yeah. Wow. So in a way, we could move forward. So in a way, I did it to you. Well, in a way, and we could do some processing to move forward on both our ends. Ouch. Yeah. My friend Corey did that to me at a Girl Scout camp. It was silent, and we were doing luminaire, and she farted. But you can't make that face when you did it. That must have been so hard. So you fought for your life. I'm sure you receive it, and you pass it on. Yeah. Kind of like the ring. Yeah. Yeah. You later do the fart. Well, you know what? To that boy, you know, I'm very sorry. Because even though you looked the most stinkiest, you were the sweetest person. And you probably weren't even stinky. No. The stinkiest, sweetest end up being the best adults. The best person. It's me who's the nightmare. And I have to face that. But it sounds like I faced it with you. Yeah. And I faced it with you. And now you have a podcast. And a lot of other great shit going on. And this means the Miss. Wow. Just. We've all. We've all been this person. And done this to someone. We've all done it in one way or another. Man. Am I right? I would have been so much cooler if I never. He probably can't remember. Oh, he can't remember anything. Okay. I have a mission now. I'm going to like dig into Shane's memories and see what I find. Love this. Next up on our podcast episode. I've told. I have told childhood memories on this show. I have. Gotta be more. We're out of time, so I can't tell mine. It was such an absolute honor. I felt like. This was incredible. I feel my whole life. Same. Yeah. Do you want to hang out? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I do. You remind me of a friend also that you'd really like. Who's stinky. You know what? And I'll take it. I'll take it. We're going to pass it on. I'm the stinky one now. I'm stinky. And I'm Amanda. And I'm proud of it. And I'm stinky too. I'm Anna. Yeah. And I'm not stinky. But I'm glad to be here with you guys. One day we'll. You'll find out what a stinkiness is. Yeah. You'll know what it is. It's real life. We're touching the truth here. And let's just do this to go out. It's so easy. I just shit the couch. You shit yourself really hard. And I'm like. We don't even promote the book after that. We're just like done. Get out of here. We do a slam cut at it. Just like boom. For the smell. The Sane One. Okay guys. Anna Konkle. Your book The Sane One. It comes out tomorrow. Oh it comes out May 5th. May 5th. Oh tomorrow. This is airing May 4th. Media. Savvy. No honey. You're good. Tomorrow guys. And your audio book that you recorded. Yeah. Your own voice. I watched clips of you on your Instagram. It sounded amazing. Thank you. That also comes out tomorrow as well. Maybe. Tomorrow. Yeah. May 5th. Okay. May 5th. So get the Sane One book or audio. It is amazing. So good. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Thanks for being here. Thank you for joining us. This was awesome. This was awesome. Thank you. Okay. Bye. Thank you.