135 | Triathlete Lynn Rogers: Beyond the Finish Line

[Music] Forward is the only direction that you're given, it's the only option you have. So, focusing on this recovery, this learning how to transfer into my wheelchair, and learning how to go to the bathroom from a wheelchair, and learning all of those things that we do one by one by one. Welcome to the Injured Athletes Club, a podcast, the show that helps athletes cope with sports injuries and bounce back stronger. I'm Mental Skills Coach Carrie Jackson. We are sorry you're here, but we're glad you're with us. And I'm journalist Cindy Cosma. Our guest to speak is Triathlete, scientist, author, and public speaker Lynn Rogers. But before we get into the interview, we want to share a key resource with you. In this episode, you'll hear Lynn talk about a couple of key phrases and powerful words that really have helped her shift her mindset. And you'll hear Coach Carrie talk a little bit about how to make up your own athlete affirmations. And if you want a little bit of extra support for that, you can go to our Buy Me a Coffee page, and that is at BuyMeACoffee.com/rebound. When you go there, there's a free download for you of athlete affirmations. And these are just powerful things that can help you navigate your injury and recovery. And they'll give you a starting point. Some of them may speak to you right away. But as we talk about in this episode, they may also give you a jumping off point for creating statements and phrases and mantras that are really powerful for you. So again, that's at BuyMeACoffee.com/rebound. We also want to give a very big thank you to our exclusive sponsor for this season, A Leather Movement. They're the creators of the Leather System, an innovative way to reduce your body weight while exercising on a treadmill. Thank you, Leather, for your support. Man, this was such a powerful, incredible story. I loved talking to Lynn, and she was like at such a joy to talk to you in the first place. And I really liked the mantra. So we're not going to give that away because it was so powerful and I'm totally stealing it for myself. It was so good. It was so, so good. And I really, you know, one of the things that stood out to me, you'll hear too, just her, the way she approaches, she's trying a new, you'll hear all the details in just a minute. But she's trying something new with her treatment plan and her take on that of taking a risk of trying something new and her approach with that just really, really stood out to me. So I really appreciated her being so open and sharing her journey with us. Yeah, yeah, I agree. And just to give you a little bit of background on Lynn Rogers, too, she's an Iron Man triathlete and a scientist with a PhD in biomedical engineering. She used to be the director of the Neuroplasticity Laboratory at the Shirley Ryan Ability Lab. But as you hear her talk about, she had to stop working there when she was diagnosed not long after she was diagnosed with chronic inflammatory demyelinating polyneuropathy, which will refer to a lot as CIDP in the episode. And that happened in 2017. Since then, she's really become such a passionate mentor activist and speaker all while continuing to strive for athletic endeavors. And you'll hear her talk about, too, why she does that? And that's something that I've known Lynn for a while, and I've always found that so powerful about her story, why she does keep training and what it means to her to continue to try to do hard things. And in fact, why she feels like she's really fortunate that if she did have to get sick, that it happened when it did when she was about to compete in an Iron Man. Lynn is also an ambassador for the athletic brewing company, and she starred in a recent documentary produced by athletic brewing inches to miles, which we again do talk a lot about in the show, and it is absolutely a must watch. We will link to that. It's you can watch it on YouTube, we'll link to it in the show notes. And we know that after you listen to this interview, you are going to want to check it out, because Lynn's story is incredible, and as she mentions, there are two other athlete stories highlighted in the documentary, too. So with all that, let's get to our interview with Lynn. Lynn, welcome and thank you so much for joining us on the Injured Athletes Club. Thank you, it's great to be here. We always say here at the Injured Athletes Club, we're sorry you're here, but we're glad you're with us. There we go. We know that injury and illness can be a roller coaster with lots of ups and downs along the way. So Lynn, how are you doing today? I'm doing okay. I will be honest. That's nice, right? That's what we want to do. That's right. I'm actually like four weeks into a new adventure. We're trying a new treatment for the disease that I have in neuromuscular disease. It's not immune disease. And so trying something new is always an interesting way to go. You're looking, you're hyper vigilant, and I know that I'm being hyper vigilant, looking for signs. In my case, the signs would be that it's not working. And that can be with it with, as you said before, it's all disease, all illness, all injury recovery has a roller coaster to it, right? So it is absolutely true in the neuromuscular disease that I have that the symptoms aren't the same every day. And so when you're being vigilant and trying to see if something's working, you can be just oh so very aware of the things that might be telling you that it's going the wrong way, right? And then you have to ask yourself, like, would I even really notice this? You know, I was on my regular schedule with everything else. And so that is the roller coaster I'm on. And I feel like I have a little bit of enhancement of some of the sensory problems that I have. I have numbness. I have tingling in my fingers and my feet. And that is that to my mind, right? Today is a little bit more than usual. And so it has me on like, "Hi, Lard!" Which I'm trying to just ignore. And so what I do, and we'll probably get into different strategies and things, being then I have the science background, I have this ridiculous spreadsheet that when I am working with a new medication or when I'm doing something different and we want to figure out as this working or not, I track my symptoms and I give them a number. I use that like zero to 10 scale. That I was very introduced to, very strongly introduced to and had to use every single day multiple times a day in the hospital where you just give things and if it's pain, it's like 10 is whatever your 10 is, right? It's the bit, it's the worst pain you can imagine is how I think of it. And zero is nothing at all. And so I try to just, what are all the things that I experience? I give them numbers, zero to 10, and then I try to just leave it alone. And every day is going to be up and down. Like the thing is not to stress about, oh my God, is it a four, is it a five? How in the world do I define it? You just kind of give it what you give it and then look at it from a big perspective, right? Two weeks or a four week. Because like looking at it one day to the next and saying, like, "Oh, I went from a three to four!" Which is kind of where I am, can just drive you crazy, right? So I know this intellectually, right? Seven of seven. But it doesn't change that worry in the back of your head. And for me, you know, things not working and we've gone down this road multiple times, means of can mean paralysis, can mean some very serious issues. And so yeah, I get a little like, "So that's the world's longest answer." And she, "How am I doing today?" Oh man, there's so much crossover too between your experience and being an injured athlete with like being so hyper aware of any sensation in your body that makes so much sense when you're trying a new regimen where you're like, "Oh my God, what does that mean? I feel this, what does that mean? Does that mean it's not working?" Where like to your point before it might have been like, not even a blip on your screen. It's just, it's really hard to tune that out. And I love the data that you to like, because so many people they, you know, might feel like, "Oh, it's so tedious. I don't want to take the time to do that." But then when you have it and you're able to reflect back on it, man is that powerful to have. And that reminder too that like, you know what, every day is different and how I feel today isn't necessarily how I'll feel tomorrow. Like to have the science to back it up or like to back up your feelings. Yeah. And the more, the more you do it, what I have found is that if I do it diligently and I have not been doing this every single day for seven years. No. But across that time, what I learned is when we're trying to figure out these different things, you know, how is this dose of medication? How is this frequency of treatment? How is this particular treatment that we're trying? It's so subjective that it can be difficult. And I've also found situations where, "Dumters, you want to convince them. You need to convince them. You have to be an advocate for yourself." And they don't always believe you. That sounds terrible. And I'm sorry to the doctors who may be listening, but it's, it can be difficult to convince. And when I walk in with my data and my graphs, now here's like rarely have they loved seeing that rarely are they thanking me. I've been told before that, you know, I cannot look at myself objectively. And so that's what their job is. But I have always asked her that lecture had them come back to me and be like, okay, I see what you're saying. you know, like they don't necessarily acknowledge, hey, I took the time to look at this and actually. But I have always gotten the sense that it broke through somewhere, right? And if nothing else, it's just, it helps to remind me of what I want to talk about and what I need to do, what I need to accomplish in that visit. So it's like, you know, and I've seen, I've seen my therapist do it. You know, we had a really early on problem where one of my therapists stepped in and was the voice that said, she's going downhill fast. And this is not normal. And she walked in there with her data, you know, we went through one last set of everything and she logged it all down and I was back in an ambulance on my way back to a Q-hospital and finally trying then the treatment that we would discover were actually worked. And in my disease, time is nerve damage, you know. And so I, if we had waited another week, another two, I don't know how much more permanent nerve damage would have happened. She said, well, and she actually won't work for that when it was looked at later. They were like, yeah, this was you stepped up for your patient big time. And I am, I am infinitely grateful to her for that. And it comes down to data, it comes down to being able to point to something and say, no, wait, look at this. And sometimes it's hard for us to tell has this been going down, you know, you're assessing your subjective relative to your most recent experience. Exactly. Yeah. Not being like, compare this to where your pain was four weeks ago on Thursday. But when I do this, and once you have the spread sheet set up, like it takes me less than five minutes a day, you know, and it's easier to do when I have been doing it regularly, I'm more in tune with what am I calling it to? What am I calling a for? It only matters when I call it. I'm not doing it. You know, this isn't research. I don't have to have right. It's certainly valid. And it's for me. And so it is helpful. Like when I try to do it every couple weeks or just check in, I actually find it takes me longer. And it's probably more error prone in terms of like what is a three mean when I add subjectivity, doing it more can be better. Yeah. Yeah. I love that too. Like I think that's an important message for people to get that like it doesn't, this isn't necessarily forever, but it's to figure out what's going on right now in this moment in time. And it's valuable to have. Yeah. Yeah. When I when I feel like something's changing, you know, and I'll so I'll jump in there. It can be really helpful to know what steady state is, you know, what that normal looks like. But if you don't have it, it's okay. You know, you jump in there when you think something is wrong, start paying a little closer attention and then give it a little time. You know, if it's obviously, if you're there's a phone sticking out, there are situations where you do not use this sort of subtle thing. You don't need to give this one time. Yeah. But there are other things where we're trying to figure out, you know, it can be a hard question. Is this getting worse? Yeah. Oh no. What does that mean? You know, what how do I define worse? How can I break it down and can I give each one of those things, you know, a number from zero to 10? That's my that's just my way of doing it. There's a million out there, I'm sure. But yeah, yeah, it's just one way of trying to tackle and then not have it be front of mind. And that's the biggest thing for me in these sorts of moments is to not just be focusing all day long, am I getting worse? Am I getting worse? Am I getting worse? I did my assessment. I'll look at it again at the end of the day. I usually do like morning evening and all adjust numbers if I think that like yeah, actually it was more than I thought it was. And then put it away. Put it away. Says the girl that probably texted 12 people today. Exactly. None of this is like you must do it perfectly every time and it will work 100% all the time. So well, we do want to hear the backstory of course behind the disease. But I actually want to go back a little bit earlier before that first and talk some about your experience with injuries too because like as we've mentioned in the introduction, you are and Iron Woman, you completed Iron Man, like I'm sorry, you completed Iron Man Wisconsin about 10 years ago now. And I think you might have had an injury during that race. So I know you're a little about being an injured athlete. That's right. Exactly. Yes. Yes. Yeah, that was a wild day, you know. And yeah, it was 20, 2014. So 10 years ago, oh, happy anniversary to me. And I was in great fitness, you know, it was a really great Iron Man build. It was a crazy time of life of course as it is for everyone, you know, it is for everyone full stop, right? But though working full time in the full load and everything else and then I'd done marathons for a long time. So I caught the bug that way of the like what's next? And so that had seen like I remember watching either whether I saw it live with my dad or was flashback to later, but like wild world wide world of sports. Oh, it's the boss crawling right across the line in 79 or whatever that was. Like that was a thing. I was like this is this is amazing. This is a big cool thing. I was aware of it, you know, and then it becomes more in your life. And your marathon or friend start to do triathlon and start to do Iron Man. And so I got pulled in there. I'd been a cyclist for a long time. I'd use cycling to get around everywhere since I'd lived in Madison. So I had that in my back pocket and just had to, you know, figure out the swimming and the not drowning. I knew how to swim, but I'd never done it in any kind of competitive or, you know, any other way. So it was just getting that all together. But yeah, so go into Madison. Super fit, most fit I have ever been in my life. I had also I picked up CrossFit just two years before. And so that combination, you know, I learned that I wasn't getting old. When I started CrossFit, it turns out everything hurt because I was weak, you know, I thought it was the knees were hurting and the whatever. Oh, what was me 36, you know, I'm going to have to put this running thing aside. And it turned out, you know, what when you focus on the strength and really do it that it made me both faster and more resilient. So I was in this really great space. Go in was the last year that there was a mass start in in triathlon in in Ironman. So I had in Madison. So I was in that like massive washing machine of craziness that you imagine. And had a great swim. It was a beautiful day, you know, swim went wonderful, come out of the water. And Madison, we do the transition inside a conference center that's right there on the water. And I was running out and then you are, you know, 8 million times, you can't touch your bike until you have your helmet on, you know, you actually have a decent distance to get from where you changed where you're going to your bike. And so I had everything sunglasses helmet, shoes were in my hand. I think I don't think I had put them on yet. But I come out of the building and you go from dark shadow directly into sunlight. And there was a step. And I turned my foot and shacked it under, coming out of there. And in that moment, I have sprained 100 million ankles. I have broken both ankles multiple times. I have gymnastics background and really bad angles. And so in the moment, I was like, oh my god, okay, I sprayed my ankle, no big deal, no big deal. Keep moving, you know. And ran up and, you know, got my bike, put my shoes on. And I remember thinking like I strapped my shoe really tight and saw it like don't touch it. I didn't because it's like you want to, you want to keep that swelling in, right? Something's going to be happening here. Go. And I've done this enough with ankles, but I know that if you keep, depends on the level of the injury, right? Once again, bone sticking out, whatever, different story. But in my life, if I keep on that ankle, I can manage and get through it. The moment I stop and put it up and get off of it, it blows up like crazy. And then when I try to get on it again, now I'm in all sorts of trouble. So in my mind, it was just like, you can just, you've done this a million times, just go. It got interesting in that there's also a layer to that race where I only got 12 or 13 miles into the bike and my rear derailleur snapped. So I have on one hand, it would end up finding out later. It was a broken and dislocated fifth matatarsal. So the bone in the foot of your little toe, basically snapped and was jaked out of out of proportion. And then now I've got two gears, right? I can go back and forth between my front derailleur in those two gears and Madison is not flat. So I did all this training. I had to learn that course. I got up there a million times and it's technical in the sense that you have to shift all the time and whatever. And now I can't. But I actually had a good bike. I think in a weird way, it kept me like when I would have wanted to just, you know, I couldn't go into those gears that were so hard. So it's like I can only kind of spin because I ended up getting myself into a place where I can at least be useful and not in my very hardest gear. Thank God to get up hills. But then on flats or anything else, like I couldn't push it too hard. And in a weird way with that foot, I think like I was trying not to put weight on the outside in my foot, which is actually good form and cycling, right? Right? Right on your on the ball of your foot. So I think it kind of helped me and not helped me, but it was interesting. And it was it was problem solving the whole way through the bike, which I think also just kept it moving forward. So I got off, you know, I finished, I finished that bike in a time that I was very impressed with. myself with and was well within the time that I had hoped to be and I'm like this is amazing. Like when I came by my friends the last time they're like oh my god you're killing it and I'm like yelling to my partner Tony, I'm like I think I'm broke that one. You know? I want to jump you to your side for the redding. Yeah. So you know. Yeah. So yeah, you know I got to see too and I took a moment and took a look at it and I actually asked that one of the medics to take a look because I didn't want to do something stupid, you know? I didn't want to give myself a situation where now I'm never going to be able to run again or whatever. Of course. But there's only so much they can do and they can't give you anything and whatever but at the very least he was able to be we both were just like well no bones sticking out, you know? Can't you put your weight on it and what he said to me was just you know how many Iron Man is this for you? And I said trying to be one and he looked at the clock and it was like I had a solid ridiculous amount of time. Yeah. Well you have whatever it was seven hours eight hours whatever I had left to get through this marathon course if you can. You know if you want to give it a try that's the only thing I can tell you. You know is is go with which you think you can do and give it a try. So I did and I just kind of discovered that walking and jogging kind of all felt the same. It all just kind of hurt but there was a level of hurt where it just hurt you know at that level it didn't feel like it was getting exponentially worse. And so yeah we just took it bit by bit and and got through it and it was a ball. It was a ridiculous day. It was a really fun crazy ass day. Oh my goodness. Man you just never know. That was not what. And I'm guessing you're glad. Now that you did that right. Oh my god. I'm so I'm so glad. I'm so glad. Like I mean I truly had those one of the best days of my life. I had a great time. I had a great time out there. And I know that part of it was being intentional. I have done a number of marathons. I've done a number of marathons up to that point and I remember at one point doing Chicago that was my I did it every year for a really long time and got out there and just it's one of those that I think we've all had where for whatever reason you don't know why but it's just bad from the start. You just feel bad from the start and I was in an awful mood about it. Like I was the biggest whiny baby the entire time on that course. But I remember like in the finishing and in the days afterwards saying to myself like what are you doing you know your family took this time to come out here and they took their entire day to be standing here and cheering you on and whatever and like if you're just going to be miserable what is the point of putting everyone through that and I'm so grateful for that experience because it made me from that point forward be like how can we make you can choose can you choose you know to make it different to make it a different experience and so from those marathons forward before I ever got to that crazy Iron Man that went sideways up setting out and backwards. I had I didn't my head that that if you're going to do this if everyone's going to come out if you're going to spend all this time in this training and spend all this time in this day then whatever happens enjoy the day whatever happens it can't just be about I was so fixated on a time or an experience or whatever and that that saved my day that very because I had that front of mine a whole time and I can remember being on the the the run course at one point there was a girl next to me and she was all like closed over and she was in tears and she's walking and she had some stomach cramps and I have no idea how bad those stomach cramps were relative to the pain in my foot or who knows but I just remember thinking and seeing her eyes down and everything else and I was thinking you're missing your race but you're missing it you're you're so focused on what's happening inside of you and I know it's awful and hard right now but it's making it so that you're missing the rest of this crazy experience and my way of like pulling myself into that was to talk to talk to volunteers and thank them and thank people on the side of the road because then they're you know they're so bored like they're they're they're they're excited for anything to pull them in and and and that kind of brought me up and out and not just focused you know down and forward in whatever it's a selfish thing sometimes to to thank the volunteers because it gives you joy back and that was my way to pull it out of it but that girl was that reminder of like you can you can choose one way or the other of how how you're gonna do it it's not easy necessarily and I'm not I'm not saying this to pat myself on the back but that was a huge revelation for me that I think has served me so so so well in such a variety of challenges it absolutely you know saved my day I think yeah in listen yeah I find that really resonates with athletes that I work with sometimes too well one thing about you know endurance sports and especially Iron Man is like people put so much pressure on themselves on that day right because there's so much that goes into getting yourself there so it's not like basketball or soccer where you're like oh that was a shitty game and I'll try again next weekend like doesn't work the same right so the nature of the sport and because of that like there's so much pressure that ends up getting put on on like people just put so much pressure on themselves for that specific day versus kind of like stepping back and looking at the whole picture and like seeing the fact that you got there healthy is a miracle in and of itself in like worthy of celebrating and oh my god that's so much right like and the things that sticky is exactly what you went through where I say you're you know that like that athlete mindset like you're committed you're driven you're committed you're doing this like I can see that like you're an athlete and you're gonna do this you're no matter what so do you want to do it and be miserable or do you want to do it and find joy and that idea that there's a choice there yeah you'll barring you know it's that's not an easy thing to do there it takes some mental training in mindset shifting but like the idea that there is a choice there is such a revelation for some people I think it's free when I realized it like I and I had to I had to play with a little right the next map I went out it wasn't like I was like I'm going to choose exactly yes it's like I had in my mind that I said to myself you know I'm not going to be demi downer I'm not gonna be and just saying that's myself meant that I was trying to think of the fit you know looking at the whatever and then and it brought it to mind for me it made it real and then it was like oh I can choose you know I can just I can just choose what I fix it on here I can choose whether I'm so disappointed in the pace that I'm running that I'm miserable or if I am you know enjoying what I'm running by or laughing at the fact that it's snowing as opposed to you know being miserable that whatever like you do have a choice it doesn't feel like it's sometimes right but but you absolutely do and that was like wow that was huge that was huge because even if ABCD goals go out the window if one of my goals and now it will always be to enjoy the day that one I can control regardless of what happens and you know there may be there may be times and moments and things that you're not going to feel that joy every moment all the way across you know yeah mentioned interest to miles and anybody who has the opportunity to see that I am not experiencing joy the entire time but but I do have joy when I think of the full experience you know and it came back to that by the end of the day there can be disappointment and joy at the same time right you can you can fail and succeed simultaneously if you look at the full the full range of what that day gives gives you and gets you yeah absolutely well so Ironman one completed broke your foot best day of your life right now I know you were training for another one in Whistler when things really started to change so can you kind of take us back there and walk us through the series of events that led to your diagnosis sure sure yeah so I had where you know training for decided friends had thrown it out there that they were looking at Ironman Ironman Canada which was which was Whistler at that point it's kind of shifted around but Whistler's place always wanted to go and I had learned by that point that what I loved about Ironman was the process of getting to the day and it's awful don't get me wrong like the training is hard but in the middle of training for Ironman Madison I had I had done all of this biking myself on my own because I prioritized his marathoner being out there with the girls that I had always run like I wanted that company in support not fully registering that I was going to be on the bike for so much longer that I was going to be running and so I realized that I wanted company on both and I was miserable by myself and found them so I found the people to cycle with that I found and we had all these crazy experiences and yes there were you know horrible in the moment training days but there are also stories that we look back on later and now people that I have literally traveled the world with that I connected with because I wanted to find people to bike with right and so So that was very clear to me that saying you Yes, to the adventure is like the full range. And I wanted to be like, "Hey, yes, these two particular people that we like to train together and whatever, I'm like, yeah, I'm totally down." So we had done this together, we done training together and whatever. And it was like 10 days before race day. And my fingers went up. I couldn't feel, I felt like I was wearing surgical gloves when I was washing my hands, which was like, what? And it was both hands, which seemed crazy to me. And then the next day, my feet went numb and the day after that, my tongue went numb. And I had studied rehabilitation from stroke for 20 years and brain injury and all of these things. And so truly, it was the going into my tongue and my tongue is in my head and my head and my brain. And oh my God, what is happening? That then sent me to a doctor, sent me and eventually to the ER. A million tests, nothing was wrong. We couldn't find anything wrong. Back and forth multiple times over the course of, whatever, five or six days that were left before I was supposed to take off, down to even a spinal tap. And nobody could figure out what was wrong. And my hands, it was getting a little worse, but not like rapidly, so different every single day that we could tell. And the doctors couldn't tell. There was nothing in there testing really that was showing up. So after multiple back and forth into the hospital, I was told there was nothing neurologically wrong with me and I flew to Whistler. We had friends were coming, my parents were coming, my sister was coming, we had two condos worth of people that were all traveling. And so it was like, well, nobody could figure out, like I did my due diligence. I tried out what's wrong and everybody tells me I'm fine. So maybe I'm fine. I knew I wasn't fine. But or maybe this will go away as fast as it came. I had nothing to go with. It very much did not. And even by the night before, that now I'm getting just worse and worse. And I'm getting weaker. And it's harder to coordinate things and I've got horrible, horrible, horrible back pain that was keeping me up all night long. Every night was absolutely miserable. I found that heat helped. And so I was just crawling in and out of a hot shower, hot bath forever. And by the time we got to what was supposed to be race day, like I could barely walk, I had barely kind of crawl myself in and out of the bathtub in order to be able to not fall when doing it. It was bad. And so we saw a doctor the morning, I went and shared the friends on that were there, but by the end of their race, I couldn't get up from the ground by myself. Two friends had to help me get up to get myself up. So it was bad. And by that point then, in seeing a doctor out there, they were like, oh, this is no good. And they're worried about what's called Guillain-Barré syndrome, which is an acute one-time thing where basically your immune system becomes confused. And it thinks that the coding, the insulation, you can think of it as like the plastic on the wire of your headphone wire, that gets attacked by your own immune system. It thinks it's an invader. It just gets confused. And it can do unbelievably horrible damage and lots of it. And it can do it really, really fast. And so they were like, OK, you have to get to Vancouver to fly home. When you get there, which is a few hour drive from Whistler, it's like, if you can still breeze, get on the plane and go home. If you can't breathe, go to the hospital. And that's kind of where we were at. Thankfully, I could breeze. I couldn't really walk. I was in a wheelchair through the airport and everything else by that point. But yeah, we had intended to be a 10-day trip. And we bumped our trip up and got a red eye and arrived in Chicago at like five in the morning. Took a cab to Northwestern. Again, to go back to the ER again. And that was like the last couple walking steps I would do on my own. I would end up being paralyzed from the chest down as it turned out. It was kind of the worst that I got. And that next four months was an adventure. For me, what would happen is that we would find eventually. So I had what I explained. I had the therapist that stepped in. There was one set of-- it's called IVIG. There's one set of drugs that we try or treat but they just tried for everybody. But there's not a good understanding of how fast should it work, what should work look like? Guillain-Bray and the CIDP, which I'll explain in a second, are two kind of amorphous. We've looked at all the tests for everything else. And this is what's left. So given the way you're looking, this is what we think you have. And so they thought I had Guillain-Bray syndrome. And I was-- went through a huge hospital, was sent to rehab at the Shirley Ryan Ability Lab, which I were working at the time. Yeah, I was a patient on my own floor. Like my lab was right there. My coworkers were right there. Which amazingly, they gave me the choice. They said, you know, that's a lot. If you would rather be somewhere else, if you would rather be there under an alias, you can. I am someone that it's like, I liked the comfort of my people. And I think it helps that you like the people you work with, right? If you don't-- You make it different choices. But yeah, for me, there was a point of comfort to going to be there. But I was getting worse instead of holding steady and starting to get better, which is what you should eventually start to see in Guillain-Bray. And so that therapist stepped in. I was in ambulance to go to blocks back to Northwestern. And they tried a different treatment, which is called plasma exchange. It's basically a plasma transplant. So you get a transplant of the liquid portion of your blood. They suck your blood out. They split it out. They put the cells. And they put those back into you with a synthetic plasma. And they throw your plasma away. And what's in the plasma are the antibodies and things that are thought to be attacking you. And that worked for me. But it would only work for about two weeks at a time. And then I would go back to paralysis. And that happens over three or four months. And by that point, that's the only point at which that they can say, oh, actually, this isn't Guillain-Bray syndrome. This is chronic. This is not going to go away. This is not going to just happen once. Obviously, it didn't just happen once. Or it's not going to-- your system's not going to be like, oh, now I got it. For God, whoops, sorry. That's an invader. That's not an invader. I don't need to worry about it. My system has retained the memory of that insulation as an invader. And so we have to treat me constantly, because those antibodies that attack me, those things that attack me, are being produced by my system all the time. And so that difference, that disease is called chronic inflammatory, demilinating polyneoropathy or CIDP. And from that point forward, I was managing men a chronic illness. Athletes, we know you're always looking for new ways to get back to training and to prevent the next injury. We want to introduce you to a great new tool from our sponsor for this season, Lever Movement. The Lever system is an innovative way to reduce your body weight while exercising on a treadmill, which means less impact on your joints. This is perfect for coming back from an injury, or if you're healthy now, to push your limits without fear holding you back. Whether you're returning to running, looking to increase your running volume or wanting to add some serious speed work to your routine, Lever has got to you covered. And what's even better? The Lever system is incredibly portable. It sets up on your home treadmill or at your local gym in under two minutes. Yes, you heard that right. Less than two minutes and you are ready to go. You may have seen elite athletes like Eilish Macolgan and Kara Goucher using it. And now we've got an exclusive deal for you here at the Injured Athletes Club. Use the discount code TIC20 to get 20% off your purchase. Trust me, your joints, Achilles, and sore muscles will thank you and so will your future self. Check out Lever today and take your training to the next level. Also give them a follow on Instagram at Lever Movement and learn more about their products and their connection to the running community. What should I eat to fuel my healing and recovery process? How can I work my way through our mess of a medical system? And what's the best way to ward off re-injury, especially as I age? We know these are the questions on your mind because you ask them every day in the Injured Athletes Club Facebook support group. And that's why we've put together webinars with panels of top-notch experts to answer them. Seriously, we are so lucky that so many physicians, physical therapists, coaches, dietitians, sports psychologists, and more have joined us to speak directly to your concerns. We've hosted webinars on nutrition, navigating the medical system, the aging athlete, and my favorite title is the last one we did. Why do I keep getting injured? If you missed any of these live, don't worry, we have a special deal for you on the recordings. You can go to our Bionea Coffee page at bioneacoffee.com/rebound and don't worry, we'll link to that in the show notes. There, you'll be able to get any single webinar recording for $10, or you can buy all four for $25. That's about six hours of top-notch educational content, especially for you, the injured athlete, at one low price. And best of all, when you download them, you're supporting our work for injured athletes so we can keep doing this show and more webinars in the future. Remember, that's bioneacoffee.com/rebound or you can get there by heading to our website indredathliesclub.com and clicking on the More Resources tab. What was your emotional response like when you did realize that no, this is chronic, this isn't just something that I'm going to get through and then there's another side to it? Honestly, part of it by that point, and I think many patients might be able to relate to this. Part of it is release, and that sounds bizarre. But when you go through stretches of, there's nothing wrong, there's nothing wrong. We don't know what's wrong with you. To have something definitive, even if it isn't, even if what you would rather be is fine, you know you're not fine. You know that the one treatment and then you're good is not working. Part of that in that was relief. We have a thing, we have a name, and I had a doctor who was like, "Okay, now we have a plan, and we're going to see how it works." Most of my feeling with it was honestly kind of release. I didn't know what was ahead, no one does, but I felt confident in the fact that, and I was lucky. I respond really strongly and really quickly to the treatment that works for me. So we were seeing as long as we did the treatment and didn't consistently, instead of just trying to do it once and then that'll be good forever. In those 14 days after I would get treatment and before I'd start to tank again, I was seeing really good recovery very quickly, which is not a guarantee to anyone that goes through this disease. And so I was in a place when they put that label on it of CIDP that it was kind of like, "I'm getting good response. Like we're doing well, we're achieving recovery, and now maybe we'll be able to achieve it consistently instead of the terror of going back to paralysis over and over and over again." So for me at that point, it was mostly positive because I felt like I was confident in the plan and what we were doing at that point was working. I know there was something that you mentioned in Inches to Miles too that you have this kind of incredible mantra of acceptance. This is what we're doing now. It's what we're doing. I'd love to hear more about how and when that came to you, what it means to you and how it's helped you. God, and I wish so much because I would love to be able to help someone else find that spot. I wish I had a better understanding of how and why that was in my head, right? But I remember so clearly of the moment, and it was early on when I was still paralyzed, I think, which also had a ton of pain and a lot of awfulness associated with it. And my father said to me, "I don't even know what's going through your head. I can't even imagine." That is going on. What I realized in that moment was the phrase, "This is what we're doing now," was what's in my head. I think it was just an attempt to switch gears because I'd been so focused on Iron Man and that goal that had been hanging there of that. We are going through tons of work at that point. We were moving into a new building. We had just been given a multi-million dollar grant. We had earned a multi-million dollar grant to do some really exciting study in my field. We were just this poor postdoc that we had just hired and then I was like, "Gone." Well, I wasn't really. I was down the hall. But she's like, "What am I supposed to do?" Oh, God. All of this stuff was happening. I knew I had to switch. I couldn't worry about my grant anymore. Not in that moment. I had to have faith that my co-workers were going to handle it and we were going to figure it out. The NIH was going to have to give us an extension or whatever was going to have to happen. I knew I had to switch from being like, "I'm trying to be the strongest runner, cyclist, swimmer, strength, crossfitter. That's not the goal. Let it go." For whatever reason, it was encapsulated in that phrase of, "This is what we're doing now." It helped me be focused on forward as well. Yeah. It's such a. I couldn't get stuck in the "Why did this happen to me?" Yes. "Why did I do? Why did this happen?" It's like, "I get going down that road, but you spend a lot of energy and a lot of everything else and you end up exactly where you were before. You don't get to go back." It doesn't matter, really. Forward is the only direction that you're given. It's the only option you have. It's like focusing on this recovery, this learning how to transfer into my wheelchair and learning how to go to the bathroom from a wheelchair and learning all of those things that we do one by one by one by one. I love that. It's such a powerful statement of acceptance that helps you move forward. It reminds me a lot, actually, of the phrase that we use in rebound. It's now your sport, which came to me in a very specific moment of getting injured, whereas it's just like, "Okay, this is what we're doing now." Exactly. That's so powerful that that came to you. I love to. The other thing that's powerful about your phrase, both of them, which I think is interesting and worth mentioning for everybody listening when you're thinking about creating your own mantra or how you coach yourself through a moment or how you talk to yourself with yours and mine, they're both using what's called psychological distancing. Instead of saying, "I can get through this," it's using it in a way where it creates some separation. It would be different if you said, "This is what I'm doing now. I can do this." This is what we're doing now creates a little bit of that separation. When you think about your own, you can play with those different. Those ones that just come to you, the ones that are personally meaningful are the ones that have the most power. It hit me in the gut for sure. It was just like, boom, that yes, this is it. This is, yeah, it's been helpful as a reset over and over and over again. And I believe it will be the title of your book, eventually. Yes, we will. Absolutely. Absolutely. I will fight for that to the death. Yes, we will. You think? Well, the book keeps getting longer. That's one of the crazy things about chronic illness. And I think that that was, it was an acceptance point for me as well because I am, I love, I do love the stories of the comebacks. And whether it's an injury come back, whether it's an illness come back, but the reality of chronic is that like, it's not like when you leave someone, when they reach a point that you can just believe and accept and they're just, they're going to be there now. They got there. They were covered fully. And so that's how they're going to be there forward, right? Like with chronic and particularly, you know, it's a chronic progressive illness that we're fighting constantly, the downward spiral that that for a lot of people will happen eventually. You're not that peak that if you, if you end it at the moment of success, it's not done there. What another, another phrase that has become really important to me is a, as a quote from Winston Churchill. And he says, and I know there's more to it than this, but the, the piece of it that is always stuck with me is that success isn't final and failure isn't fatal. And those two things is I think are so powerful and, and you know, the failure isn't fatal. We all have moments of needing that one and that reminder. But I think the other one for chronic illness is also super important, right? Success is not it. You don't just, it's, you're not done. Like you don't finish the race. Now your life is always going to be happy from here or your life is not over, right? You're, there's always something else. There's always something else. So that success isn't final. There's, there's something else coming. And so with chronic illness, it's also that you have to keep managing it and you have to keep dealing with it. And there may yet be more recoveries and more times that you have to dip down and come back up and nobody loves it. But that's just, that's just it. That's what it is. And you can save yourself from some, some like disappointment of, oh my God, we're doing this again. When you dip, if you have that in mind of like, this is a long road, this is a long road and recovery rehab, it's going to be a forever thing. It's going to be a constant process. Finding ways to have that not be discouraging or have that not be like such a weight is important. And finding ways to love the activities that keep you doing things actively, I think is huge. At least it is for me. Community makes that so that when I look at, oh Lord, I'm going to need to keep pushing on the bike, on the run, on the in CrossFit and everything to be able to keep myself as strong as I can so that when the dips happen, I don't go as low. That's my goal to be as functional as I can so that these things that are going to happen. This is what's going on right now while we're trying this new drug. And the only way we'll know this new drug doesn't work for me is if I get worse. It's a fact. There's no blood test. There's no nothing that can happen. It's just going to be that I start sliding back towards paralysis. And so then I will have to dig myself back out of that. It's worth it to me to try this new drug for a variety of reasons of what it offers, but I have to be accepting. of like the only the only answer isn't going to be that it's going to work and it's going to do great. And my doctor likes to think that way because he's optimistic and wonderful. And that's great. But I have now lived through multiple tries of different drugs and different treatments that did not work and the slide back down. And so if that slide is going to just destroy you mentally, if the idea of pulling yourself back up and what it takes to do so doesn't have some kind of joy in it. Yeah. You're going to be in big trouble. And I'm not saying I love watching my paces get slower and slower or watching myself have to use crutches again and whatever. Of course I don't. But I have people around me to get to go do things with and to connect with whether it's virtually, whether it's whatever, you know, if enough, I can't keep up with them on the run or I, you know, we do virtual rides together, whatever it might be, those things are meaningful to me. The community that lives together are meaningful to me. And so that can make it worth it and make it much easier to swallow. At least for me, at least for me, that's what I do. That's how I keep it going. And being active and being an athlete is important to me, even if the definition of that has changed and shifted across the way. And actually starting CrossFit before I ever got sick was huge to that because it was, it was interesting. Like you referred everyone as athletes. You know, the coaches use that terminology. And at first, it took me a second, you know, I'm kind of like, you know, I'm not a confessional athlete. I'm not a whatever. I think running marathon is for years. And I kind of braced at that word. But it helped me be in that space of like, yeah, if you're doing this stuff, you're an athlete. And that is true. If doing a single burpee is the hardest thing you can do, which I remember distinctly being in the hospital and having that be the case, getting up off the floor was almost impossible. And one one that I realized that falling down and getting back up again is a burpee. And I was going to have to deal with that. So the rest of my life, I was so pissed off. I was like, I'm like, I hate burpees. You're like, but I hate burpees. Yeah. I have to be able to do this variation to get out of this goddamn hospital. Like, yeah, great, wonderful. But it is. It's just that's it all the way down to that. You are an athlete. That's meaningful to me. And I know it gives tremendous value and keeps me from being so close to that paralysis point when things go bad. Well, it's such, you know, I know sometimes people ask, what are you training for? And sometimes the answer is like life, right? That's right. Your story is such, I mean, such a testament to that. Like all of the things that you have been able to do that you do that you can do. I mean, it's so important. It's not just about like that day. It's it's yeah, I don't have a good trip. I'm not so happy. But the luckiest thing in my life was the fact that I was 10 days out from Ironman when that happened because I could have ended up I would end up and I would end up with four months later, half the lung capacity that I that I had on the first days that I was in the hospital. And I was laying doing nothing the whole time. So if you imagine and and that half lung capacity at my worst was still in the normal range. I was never at a point, you know, I was being tested constantly because Giammarine in particular like you can end up the muscles that control your breathing are also being damaged. Like it's a bad situation. And I had everything going on with my autonomic nervous system where my blood pressure was out of control with swing wildly. I would pass out and then it would be high. And my my heart rate was all over the place. We knew that those basic systems were being impacted. But I never had to be on a ventilator. I never lost my ability to breathe. I never lost completely my ability to swallow. We had to adjust things for a little while. But I am a huge believer in that being as I was as fit at that moment as I was going to be all year, you know, and I needed that to get through. Yeah. Through and to be able to get up and moving, you know, I think again so quickly. And so that was a shift for me. And that was helpful when we, you know, we hit COVID, right? And you have so many people I would hear it over and over again. Like I my race is wasted. My training is wasted because my race was canceled. My this was canceled. And I just want to just scream, no, you know, if you get COVID, you're going to be real happy. What you're starting with is the body that you are, you know, it's, but it's hard, it's hard to be, you know, connected in with that in the moment. That's a tough thing for people to know and shift with. But if you don't with it, it is. It's like, yeah, whole different mindset on why you're doing what you're doing. I wanted to ask to a little bit, you know, we've talked to some other people who have chronic conditions about their relationship to hope. And I'm curious about yours, you know, you started at the beginning talking a little bit about the new treatment and like, is it going to work? Is it not? And some of how you manage the day to day of that. But, you know, and in the documentary again, you talk about how how often you're the small percentage of people for whom something doesn't work, but that you also hold out hope that, or you maintain the belief that you could be the percentage of people for which something goes right, for whom something goes right. And that, that sounds like hope to me. But I'm curious how you relate to that, what it means to you and like, what, what is your like take on having hope? Well, I think I've been very, I know I've been very lucky. And so because I do have a very strong response to treatment and I am as long as I am continuing to work and put the work in, I can maintain and get to, you know, a strength that allows me to do things that a lot of people with CIDP think out or out of reach, you know, and they may very well be. And I don't want to argue, you know, anybody else's experience, the idea of being able to run is, is out of reach or people think it is for so many people with CIDP. And again, that might be because they're not responding as strongly to treatment and they're not getting the boost that I am. And that's where the luck comes in. And so seeing that range of what people are experiencing is that reminder of hope, you know, because even though I'm in the small percentage of people for whom kind of the easiest to access treatment doesn't work. And we have found that many, many of the, I shouldn't say many, many, there sounds like there's a million options. There are not, you know, there's probably five or six things that people use. And thus far, two of them have worked for me. That can make you a little shaky on the hope side. You know, I feel like I'm more pragmatic now in terms of going into like I am in this moment of trying something new. It's not that I'm not hopeful. It's that I'm very aware that it may not work for me. And I try to also keep in mind that it's definitely going to work for someone, you know, for someone else. And I think there's that research piece that comes in, right? Like working with so many different people. That was an interesting one to shift from where in research, because statistics, because publishing is necessary when you're looking at it as the job and not just the goal that really truly is important and you're very aware of wanting and needing to help people. I don't want to make this sound like we're just worried about our jobs, but the reality is it is our job. And so you have to succeed in order to be able to keep it and continue to help people. So you are thinking about, you know, does this work? Can I show statistically that this group that I worked with? And so you're always, you're often looking at the group mean, right? Is that mean? Is that average of what I see in this group of people better than they were before? Am I showing that there's an improvement? And what I'm reminded of as an individual patient is the range goes into that average. In that it works in general, there are some people for whom it works really well. And there are some people for whom it doesn't work at all. And the average is great. It's good to know, but it's not going to be the end definition of whether it works for you or not, right? And I have, so I've tried a few things that are swinging for the fences that have really good response rates, 70, 80% of people doing very well and not needing additional treatment after five years, huge goals that are amazing. And I have ended up being in that 20 or 30%. Again, and again, for whom it doesn't work, you know, and the reminder of just because it didn't work for me, it doesn't mean it doesn't work for everyone. I see the successes around. So I'm excited about that and that is hopeful. And then because I know that people are continuing to work on these problems, there are always going to be additional possibilities coming. I can't help but I'm a researcher. I actually believe science. I think we have things like facts that are known and true. I think those evolve in terms of we know things better than we did before. Someone's not lying to you or something changes. It's that something changes, right? No more now. And so I have, I find that hopeful, right? I've seen the process. And I'm looking at it and living at it at a time. The drug I'm trying is the first drug by a new method. mechanism for CIP in 30 years. So it's the first thing to attack it from a different angle in 30 years. And we're not a disease that anyone is working on specifically for us, right? Like it's a lot of times it was this works in MS. So let's see it's right here. - Yeah. - And there's a lot of immodal immune diseases that are somewhat similar. My kidney aegravice, there's a number of things. And so what we're finding, the big we, the royal we have science that I still lump myself into, is that if you, depending on where you are, in like the chain of the mechanism of what's gone wrong with the system, you might have something that works from multiple different ways that it's functioning in the end if you're able to treat it early enough in like the cascade of crap that goes wrong. And those are starting to show benefit. And I know that there is yet another one or two drugs that are working on yet another mechanism that are in the process and not yet FDA approved and for very good reason in some cases, 'cause you have to work it out and you don't want there to be more risks than there are rewards and all that good stuff. But all of that gives me hope. All of that is the piece of the hope that even if this thing that I'm trying right now doesn't work, one, we have a treatment that I can go back to that has worked up till this point. There are weird things that happen in some of these chronic illnesses where things that used to work don't anymore and that's always been my fear with my one plasma-free cessation to work really well. Not even just because it's very invasive, I have to go to this one hospital to get it. And that makes things really crazy in the United States. But the other side is it's possible that it won't always work. And I started this at 42 and I don't consider that to be an old lady. So I intend to be around for quite a while and I would rather have a backup option or save it as the backup option for some else that work to work as well. So there's nervousness and there's you could, you could look at it and say, okay, yeah, I spent $52,000 on a stem cell transplant that I relapsed within a couple of months. Like that, it's maybe can be hard to hold on to hope with that. But I went back to my plasma-free cessation. And I got out of the hole that that dug me into and we keep moving forward. And there are people that are working on it and are excited to do research and are wanting to find solutions. And I believe in them. So that gives me hope. And so I will continue to do what I do, which is advocacy. And in our country that's talking to people in our government and reminding them of where we need research dollars, what different things in Medicare packages and whatnot, making sure that home treatment with something like IVIG, which doesn't work for me, but works for a lot of people, making sure that's covered under Medicare. Those are all things that we've got an advocacy group, the GBSCIDP International Foundation, that does a lot with that. And I'm working with them because I feel like I can speak the language of the science that's going on as well as be the patient experience. I've been doing that with the drug company that makes the drug that I'm currently trying. They talk to patients about how is this actually working, what's actually going on, what do you need, what's wrong, what should be fixing? And I so appreciate that they want the input. And some of what the FDA requires is to have patient input. Like I don't think that's not something that people know. There are good things in regulations sometimes. And when you've added the necessity for patient input, you are adding potential real impact into people's lives. You want the patient and the scientists to be working together. And so those things are very hopeful as well, right? 'Cause I see what they're working on, as well as talking to Congressman and Congresswoman on the Hill and having their interest and seeing them push things forward, even though slow, slow process. But having someone's ears a way to move it forward. So that's hopeful as well. - Well, that really sounds to me exactly what you described in terms of shifting your mindset during your race. It's like you're thanking the volunteers, you're talking to other people in the race, you're keeping your focus on the things that are positive and the things that you can control and the things that are gonna make a difference. And that not only helps everyone, it helps you too. So I don't think it's selfish at all. I think it's, you mentioned earlier, like that being selfish, but it's like, you know, it's such a, to realize that that can be like a win-win-win for everyone. And, you know, not that it makes everything suddenly, wonderfully okay. But that just helps you make that shift to, - Totally. - To what can, to finding those bits of joy. - Right, you can. - Right, absolutely. Absolutely. I found myself, and I'm not, again, I don't wanna plant myself on the back, but I think it can be helpful. You know, I've been an advocate in a couple of different spaces that are specifically for treatments that ended up not working for me. But I still think it's important to be part of, and it's still, and it's part of what gives you hope, is when you see the other people for whom it does work, you know, and it's like, okay, yes, this was expensive and time and whatever, and it didn't work, but it's still a good thing out there, and it's still doing good and being part of that. And then knowing that offering that other side of what can happen, but you, I didn't die from it. It just didn't work, you know? That can be a help to someone that's trying to weigh out, should I even give this a shot or not, right? You need to know what does that other side look like? And that's something I've been working with, with the company that I advocate for. It's like, you can't just tell us, what are the good things that happened from getting it, yes, list the risk, but make it a little bit more real and understandable, because people are facing that in real time. You know, what does look like on both sides? What does not work look like, as well as what does working look like? What does the risk profile really look like in the day to day? You know, if I'm going to have some wicked, horrible migraine every day all day long, if I'm taking this drug, is that actually better than fixing my weakness or whatever you're making trade-offs in everything in those input, I think, are important. Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Oh my gosh, Lynn, I know we could talk to you for hours more, but I hope that everyone will go out and see "Inchistomiles." It's such an incredible film. And it's not just my story. I want to plug, because there are a couple other stories that are in there that might be a little more relatable and are amazing in their own right, that, you know, I'm so proud of those guys for what they've gone through and what they've done. It's a very cool thing, and it was an amazing thing to be part of. It was weird, but very. Yeah, what was it like to have people in your face for those very emotional moments and then to watch it? Yes, yes, yes. It was, you know, it was hard, and there were definitely. There are moments that are on film that I had to make myself put on film because the way things worked in particular while we were racing. So it followed us when we were training for it and then racing Iron Man Lake Placet. And it was a very cool collaboration with Iron Man. And, you know, they have their own content makers, right, that they work with to be able to show things from the race later and all that stuff. And so it's not like you can just, hey, we're making this documentary, so we're going to follow this athlete around the whole time, like not possible. So they've got people on motorcycles with cameras, whatever, they were kind of going through whatever, and they worked with them, and they agreed to be part of and follow us. So we did not each have like a cameraman on us the entire race. They would just like come rolling by, right, every now and again and talk to us, and then they would need to move on to capture the next thing. And the first time that I was having a really hard time and needed to stop, what went through my head in the moment was, I'll just keep pushing while the guys are here. I'll smile and I'm not, right? And then they're going to roll on on their motorcycle, and then I'm going to pull my bike over to the side and have a moment. And I had to be like, is that what you want to put into the world, right? Like, I'm not going to make up a meeting to stop in this Iron Man. Right. But if it needs to happen and you were about to do it now, and the motorcycle is here, what benefit is it going to be to anyone? If you're trying to tell the true story of this experience, if you put on the fake smile and let them roll on the road. So that first one of needing to stop was kind of like making that conscious moment. They would later find me on the side of the road having a really hard time. And it was, it was rough. It was, it was rough. And because who wants, what feels like their worst moments on film, right? It's still like, I've been in multiple settings of needing to sit with people to watch that movie and everything else. And it's part of me that would like that to be a different ending every time. My pulling for myself and whatever. It's, it was hard. It was, it was hard. They were wonderful, incredible, empathetic, fabulous humans. And that definitely helped. But I just had to keep telling myself to just let it be whatever it is in this moment. And yes, I was trying so. hard because who doesn't want the success to be the thing that's captured on film, but when it wasn't going that direction, it's always been important to me to put forth the reality of chronic illness. And that includes the downs and the ups. And so, yeah, that was my reminder to myself of this is real. Yes, it's happening. It's right. Right? So, good or bad or hard or not, maybe it's better. That's how it is. It was a ride. And that may be a little bit of a spoiler, but I will say too, I just watched it again, and I was still rooting for you and crying and everything. So it's no less compelling for knowing that there's some particular sort of ending, even if you don't know how it's going to happen. Right. But what I know you have future goals to what's the next big thing you have in mind? So, aesthetically, the next big thing, talk about the people put the big thing out there and you're like, yes, because it creates the experience that you get to have in life. So clearly, the people I am crazy and I'm surrounded by crazy, were very particular kind of crazy. My good friend, Victoria, who we have done a few different races together now over the last few years and she found Monster Tribe. So Monster Tribe is in Scotland. You start at Loch Ness and do a 5K swim and then the whole thing goes over seven days. So you've got 1,000 kilometers of cycling over five days and then it ends with a 50K run that that lands you in London. So we're going for a week across. Amazing. Amazing. And you know, generally in England, Scotland, England, my British friends are like, oh my god, will you get it right? I don't know, I'm not the definition of whatever. Terrified and excited. Like there's part of me that I don't want to see needs, but maybe it does like the little bit of like the thing that really hard to reach goal, right? As opposed to the things that I've achieved already. But it's also just, I'm so aware of like, who are the crazy people we're going to get to meet? Who are the friends that are going to now be along the way? What are the stories that Victoria and I are going to be telling for the rest of our lives about whatever this seven days holds? And it's so exciting to me from the accomplishing the thing and it has this little tiny piece which is the, there isn't, it's really not a race. There isn't a time goal. There isn't a, I have to get to here by whatever or I cannot continue to go. And with everything that's happened, that's been a little bit of the problem for me lately is getting my stuff into the 17 hours of Iron Man and I'm still trying. But that's the big one on the calendar for next year is to do this big crazy thing. And at first, you know, our coach was just like, well, you know, doing an Iron Man would be a good, good trading day for that. And I was like, that's hilarious. It's true. But no, you know, I may try to take that fitness. And then see if I can translate it to the one day Iron Man in next season. But I'm going to kind of let that show itself. We'll see what happens with that. But Monster tries the big one. Amazing, amazing, well, then where can people find you online and keep up with all of these big audacious, wonderful goals? Thank you. Yeah, you can find me in a few different places. So I have a website. You can find me. It's my name, Lynn Rogers. You can find it as Squarespace website. And if you guys linked to that, that would be great. You can find me on Instagram and on Blue Sky in particular. And on Facebook, Facebook, I'm under my name. Instagram is Lynn PhD with CIDP. And that's both Blue Sky and an Instagram. And I try to give a little bit of what I'm doing every day or, you know, throughout and not every day kind of kind of person. But just to show the ups and downs and just show the fight and the, you know, to give, there's a little community of us that have CIDP that kind of found each other that are active. And Instagram is kind of where we've landed. And so there's a lifter, there's a dancer, there's a runner, there's like, it's very, very cool to then have us all kind of cheering each other on and to have that, that world that they know what you're going through. And so many people, so many people do. But it reminds you of the value that that provides. I've been very, I've been humbled again and again by people reaching out after seeing this movie or whatever that happens to come along and saying, you know, thank you for putting this forward. And it's, it's, it's been a motivation to me or it helps keep me going. That's why I do it. I think I said it somewhere in the movie, but I feel it where it's like, yes, I have been the one and a million chance of things going wrong or the 20% that it doesn't work over and over and over again. Why can't we create a one and a million thing goes things go right? You know, why can't we make the thing that only a fraction of people do include those of us that are struggling and dealing with multiple things along the way? We can, we can flip that just like we can choose our attitude. We can flip that script a little bit. It isn't easy to do, but, but we can. And hopefully that helps give each other a hand up of, because I have always, like I said, I've always looked to these inspirational, you know, I have read Chrissy Wellington's book before every single marathon I have done because I love her story and her writing and her, you know, coming in and coming into the sport at 30 and, you know, there wasn't a big comeback, but there was a very different thing that went on, which she was a very different professional and whatever. I love those stories. And so if I can beat that story to someone else, that's crazy. That's wild. Well, and we are so grateful to you for sharing a little piece of your story with us today. Thank you so, so much. I know our listeners are going to get so much out of this and really relate to so much of what you've gone through. So thank you, thank you, Lynn. Really grateful. Oh, my God. Absolutely. And keep fighting. Like we don't know out there. I know you're going through like day after day. It's hard. There's a million ways to stay connected with the people that you're used to being connected with, even if you aren't able to run with them, like you normally do, even if you weren't able to bike with them, we normally do text each other, do whatever. There's a million ways to connect. You can do it. It's hard. And you can do it. You've got this. Thanks again to Lynn for joining us into our sponsor, Leather Movement, for making the show possible. Thanks also to Jeremy Nessel for editing this and every single episode of the show. And of course, we are so grateful to you, our listeners and club members. As we mentioned at the top, there are all kinds of resources for you at bimicoffee.com/rebound. That PDF of athlete affirmations that we talked about, there are also all kinds of webinar videos and other resources there. So definitely a place to head if you're looking for support. Another place to head if you're looking for support is our Facebook support group, also called the Injured Athletes Club. And when you go and join, you're going to find a group of people who just have the same mindset as you do and they just get it. And it continually is one of my favorite places on social media. One of the few, I think, generally positive places on social media, even though people are talking about really difficult things, there's always someone there to give you a high five, to answer your questions, to give you the support that you need when you need it. And we talk all the time about how important that is. So you can find a link, you can search for that just in Facebook, Injured Athletes Club, or you can find a link to it on our website, Injuredathletesclub.com where there's also links to our book and so many other resources too. Thanks so much and we'll see you there.