10/19/26: Farmers Shocked By ICE Raids, France Erupts In Protest

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Lisa, tell them about our new show. We have a new podcast. It's called Don't Lie To Me. I'm Lexi Juanio, we're two best friends, 22 years apart, but so close at heart. And I'm Lisa de Julio, the old one, which means we have wildly different references, occasionally different opinions, and at this point in my food days, I've lived it all. Now in my 30s, being the founder of new shoes, good taste is my business. Listen on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If anyone wanted to commit a murder, up here would be the greatest place in the world to hide the body. But no, no, find it. He acted friendly. He talked friendly. He sounded friendly. They won't knew that I did the scary boogie stuff, and this is maybe she'll find out where this girl is. I saw a bomb back in their bow. 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So the economic fallout from the combination of the tariffs and now most critically from the Iran war. I'm curious to have led to a massive breakup in the Trump coalition and put some red states in play that no one would have ever expected. Least of all, Roger Marshall, who is the current senator of Kansas, he definitely did not expect to have anything approaching a competitive election this time around. And yet if you look at the polling averages, it is basically 50/50, whether it's going to be him or the Democrat Adam Hamilton, who ultimately prevails. CNN went on the road to talk to Roger Marshall and talk to voters in the state about their concerns. This did not go very well for Senator Marshall. Let's go ahead and take a look at this. I don't think I've ever voted for a Democrat senator. You haven't. This will be the first time. First time. Do you think that given the impact that's having on few prices, that it's time for the president to end the war with Iran? You know, I think what you should be talking about is my opponent, that he's a child sex predator protector, that he's about to deny it. Absolutely happened. Are you worried that Hamilton could actually win this race? Well, he could, because we have a bad reputation in this state of electing liberal governors. So there you have Manuraju asking Roger Marshall about the Iran war and he won't give a single word response. He's just immediately, "Uh, what you should be asking is about my opponent blah, blah, blah." So clearly he knows this is a catastrophic issue for him. And something I saw people pointing out is like, you know, a guy like Roger Marshall, first of all clearly lazy, like not raising money, showing up late to his events. There's a lot of complaints from Republicans who are trying to help him out that this guy doesn't want to be campaigning and is very lackluster in his efforts here on the ground. Adam Hamilton is hitting the ground running and he is everywhere and he's, you know, doing everything he can in the state. So you have that leasingness. But also, if you're a Susan Collins and you know you're going to have a tough election, well, your turn takes some votes. But show you've got some distance from Trump. Show you're kind of independent. Show that you're not just going to get on board with the most idiotic and unpopular things that Trump is pushing you to do. A guy like Roger Marshall on the other hand, you know, he's voting for the January 6th Lush fund. He's voting for the Iran war and relentlessly supporting the Iran war. He's voting against releasing the Epstein files, you know, every disastrously unpopular thing that Donald Trump did. He is on board with and he is on record taking votes to support. So that's part of he's a terrible candidate. He's lazy and he's taken a bunch of these disastrous votes that have put him completely crosswise with his own base where they can look any support of the tariffs, too, by the way, which, you know, in Kansas with the farmers are devastatingly unpopular. So that's part of what has created this vulnerability here is that he has not tried to protect himself. He's not tried to push back on Trump whatsoever. So people are going, okay, would you care more about this man in DC than you do about our livelihoods here in Kansas? The bigger problem for a lot of these machine states is that these people just don't run very many competitive elections. And so I'll give you the, Marshall, Marshall is an interesting guy. I'll be honest, you know, he is one of those people who is like tied at the hip to Trump, but he's done some good stuff. And we actually even covered it here on the credit card, but he's one of the, he's actually one of the only people in the Senate who's been willing to take on the corrupt credit card industry. And as I understand it, the credit cards are going all in for Adam Hamilton. I mean, look, I'm not saying it's all that relevant. I'm just trying to tell you the way that most of these machine politicians work is they tie themselves with the hip with Trump. They become interesting on like side projects. This is what safe seat senators do. People like Van Holland. You know, that's why he gets, Van Holland is in a machine Democrat state, which is why he gets to care at all about foreign policy. I'm trying to think California, you know, these types of sinecures, but when all of a sudden you're in a competitive race, you don't really know what to do because 90% of competitive or 99% of competitive races in machine states is R on R. So it's like they end up fighting intra partisan battles. You're protecting your right flank. Exactly. So that's why the reason Marshall's taking these votes on 2020 and on Jan 6 is he doesn't need some Trump op start to come and cause him shit in a primary sometime around. Same on immigration, same on any of this, but then that plays different whenever it comes to an actual competitive election. And yeah, I mean, from what I've seen the guy look, he's only been an office in 2017 on he did genuinely have an actual competitive primary, but that was again a Republican intra competitive primary back in 2017. And now all of a sudden, he actually is in a fight for his life, he didn't realize it was going to care about his Medicare billing practices or any of this stuff, right? This is all like you get to do it and you're in a Republican state, whatever, you know, it's like what's a few dollars between friends, but that's not how it works. And so, you know, and I would also say he's not even particularly good, the credit card thing, he's not even talking about it whenever he's there talking about price gouging and others. Even on war prior to Trump too, he was actually not bad on some of these things on you. I've been honestly mystified at the race that the guy has run. He's basically just going all in, the Adam Hamilton thing, I tried to follow it. I don't fully guess something about somebody in his church, you know, was being protected like there was a scandal, it was something to be scandal. That he was a Christian camp, he was affiliated with, I don't know all the details, but they're going, they're leaning hard into that. And it's, they're trying to rebut, you were referencing these billing practices from Roger Marshall, who is a doctor. And he's had some of his former patients come out and record campaign ads that are just brutal, where they're, you know, he was coming after them for these minimal charges that they had racked up. And obviously healthcare being a major sore spot for people around the country. But in Kansas and rural areas in particular, the one big beautiful bill closed a bunch of rural hospitals, cut Medicaid. So this is very sensitive area. And then also he charges some of the highest rates on any sort of delinquent payments. So they've really, I think that has really damaged him. I think those ads have been really devastating. But, you know, the fundamentals here are Kansas has been screwed like Kansas is in a dire economic state directly because of Trump policies. So let's go ahead and take a listen to this farmer who was interviewed here by ABC talking about, you know, how he's disenchanted with Trump in spite of the fact that he voted for the man three times. Let's listen to that. The farmer Steve Bowlin voted for Trump in 2016, 2020 and 2024. Now he's struggling with high prices for diesel and fertilizer and uncertain who he'll vote for for Senate. How much of a factor for you would be who Donald Trump has endorsed? None. Why is that? I don't care who he endorses. Again, I want somebody that is talking for the American. Someone who is talking for the American farmer, don't care who Trump endorses, you know, Trump is really going out there trying to energize his base and pretend that I'm on the ballot. That was the point of this RNC mini convention that they did down in Texas. And according to the leaked audio from Ken Paxson anyway, and also according to the polls, that convention actually was devastating for them. And it caused their polls to erode even further. Why? Because you're putting the focus on this man who is devastatingly unpopular and he's saying, pretend I'm on the ballot. People are saying, okay, bet. I'm going to vote against you then because that's the way I'm feeling right now in this economy. Now the farmers, they're very conservative, by and large, not to, you know, paint the entire forest. community with a broad brushier, but by and large, very conservative, are they going to come out and drive straight out across? No. Are they just not going to come out? That seems like a big possibility, especially if you think about it, you know, guy like this probably lives in a rural area, probably has to drive a good ways away to get to his local polling station. Is he going to bother? Let's say he got to bother. Is there going to be anybody on the ballot that he feels like, okay, this person is going to be really responsive to what I'm looking at? I would say that for many, that will be a doubtful calculation. I completely agree, you know, on the farmer piece, I was telling you before the show. Look, I think being mad at Trump for doing things he said he wasn't going to do is fair, but it's really hard for me whenever you get mad at Trump for saying he's going to do things he did. Like, for example, tariffs. It's like a come on, man. Like the tariff was literally part of the campaign. Yeah. And you're upset about that. Now, I get it. Diesel has pushed things over the edge, but the extra tariffs in particular, look, this is not, this is separate from what I'm talking about on Canada, or even Mexico to a limited regard. The tariffs on China, specifically the tariffs on soybeans and other things are going to be sold to China were literally done in the first time, done second term around. They hurt you then. You decided that it was okay. Again, I decided it was okay, too. But, you know, I'm not a farmer. And now people are upset about that. So I'm like, okay, that's number one, that's just where I get annoyed. I got one more for you on that front. If you put the last element, D5 up on the screen here from this from this block. So this New York Times across farm country economic discontent strains Republican coalition. And they talk about a lot of the things we're talking about here. They interview people blah, blah, blah. They also, they talk about the pushback to the immigration agenda. So let me, let me read you this. And July, the political action committee of the Kansas Livestock Association declined in door Senator Roger Marshall, the incumbent Republican despite having backed him in 2020. Officials pointed to tariffs, which Marshall supported in the president's comments about beef prices being too high is having frustrated Kansas ranchers. Then in late September, the group's members began to complain of something unusual, inconvenient, and expensive appointments they'd made to have their cattle slaughtered were suddenly being canceled. The cancellations was stretched on for days and complicated delicate timing of processing cattle were a direct effect of high profile. Immigration enforcement activity said Matt Deargarten, the chief executive of the Livestock Association, the raids prompted where pushback all the administration from ranchers in Kansas, Texas, and Oklahoma. You have all these people living in limbo or fear of ice. And the feedlots are wondering if anybody is going to come to work said Sam but drum a feedlot consultant. It's just a bad situation all the way around. So I don't know if you remember, but Marshall actually put out a statement expressing concern about some of the immigration raids in Southern Kansas, I think it was at the time. And now you see why? Because this was impacting farmers and ranchers in the state. And so now suddenly, you saw the mass deportation now signs. And so you don't put two and two together that your industry, I mean, literally if you're in the farming industry, you don't know that your industry is dependent on undocumented labor. Like how stupid are you? I'm saying I have no sympathy for you. Like literally zero. What part of it did you not get? Like we said, we were coming after and deporting all illegal immigrants. Did you think that you were somehow except from that? Like they all seem to have thought like we should have done in Florida or the Venezuelans. Oh, it won't be about us. It'll be about those other bad immigrants. No, this is what makes me mad too. Like this is actually what we should have more of, by the way, is that it's actually disgusting that illegal labor is the only reason the US meat industry or farming can, you know, to the extent that there's been problems with our current immigration enforcement. So we don't go after big business or any of these other people who like if you're a liberal, you should be mad. All these people are being exploited at basically as slaves. And then no American is being paid. This is all literally under the table. Yes, I understand it. Be full. Be more expensive. I mean, if you roll the tape, I said that. I said, yeah, shit's going to get more expensive. So be it. That means we have to live in a better more order cohesive society. I'm fine with it. And yet, yeah, that looked not to rant too much, but it's people like this or down in, in, we covered the South Texas thing where this lady goes, my brother was deported and I supported, I'm sorry. I'm sorry, ma'am. What part did you not get your brothers here illegally? Did you think it was going to be an exemption? Like what, what, what part of it was mass deportation not clear around you're here illegally? They got to go. I just, I, I truly have no sympathy for these people at all on that front. And you know, I get it shot and fro, et cetera, and all of that, but I don't know. I just, I have a lot of difficulty in terms of compassion for, like I said, when things were explicitly, explicitly announced, written, you know, said, like these, what, what the consequences will be? What exactly did you, were you listening to? Like what were you reading? They all have a year. We interviewed a candidate on the Friday show, who was very impressive. I'd spoken to her before Nicole Lockland. She's running for this district in Florida against Mario Diaz Ballard. And it's a 75% 75% Latino district and a lot of Venezuelans in the district. And she was basically, I don't want to put words on me. You guys can go watch the interview to see her specific language, but basically like, yeah, previously Venezuelans, Cubans, Nicaraguan, they were treated differently by the immigration system. And they thought they would, that that would persist. And now you've had, you know, temporary protected status taken from Venezuelans, and there's a shock. And so her district is the one identified by the New York Times and some other analyses as shifting the furthest away from Republicans. This is a district Trump won by like 18 points that now, I mean, it would be a long shot still for her, but she's got a shot at it because of that shift. And so yeah, I mean, I just, I feel the same thing. Like, I don't know what, I don't know why you thought you were special. I don't know why you thought, Mr. Farmer, that your particular business interests would be protected. Like, I don't know what gave you that impression because you could make an argument about the Iran War. There was a lot of double speak out of both sides of the amount, et cetera. There was total and complete clarity about the immigration agenda. No doubt about it. Don't lie to me, I'm Lexi Juanu, we're two best friends, 22 years apart, but so close at heart. And I'm Lisa Julio, the old one, which means we have wildly different references, occasionally different opinions. And at this point in my 50s, I've lived it all. I'm not going to get any worse than fighting. That is wild. I learned that about you today. And I've always got something to say. If men were just honest about this, there would be so much more peace in the world. We're going to talk about dating, relationships, beauty, getting older, and a little wiser. We're best friends, but we don't always agree. Because you told us how accommodating you are. Obviously, I would do what I think I could do to fight the fight, but there's only so much fight I can fight. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Lie. Listen on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts, I don't really care. You broke me. You do not deserve happiness. I'm Andrea Gunning. On this season of Betrayal, we meet Carl Bryant. Carl thought he was living a normal drama free life until the messages started. You will have hell to pay. For nine months, someone infiltrated every aspect of Carl's life, threatening to ruin him. Cyberstalking, swatting, extortion, impersonation, and then the text threats escalated. Someone's not going to make it out of this alive. It's playing out in real life, not just on the phone. Every piece of evidence pointed to one man. But every piece of evidence was a lie. He was not going to stop unless we stopped him. Listen to Betrayal Season 6 on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. But someone will find it. He acted friendly. He talked friendly. He sounded friendly. They all knew that I did the scary boogie stuff and this is maybe she'll find out where this girl is. I saw her violent. Backhanded a bow. And that's exactly what made us all think he had something to do with it. The clock is ticking down and the woods are calling. There are a lot of demons in Putnam County, but I've met the devil and he's real. I'm Paul Solitarov and this is Season 2 of the Devil's Quarry. Listen to the Devil's Quarry Season 2 on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to hear the Devil's Quarry Season 2 had free with exclusive content, subscribe to Love A For Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. Speaking of the Iran War, I do want to get to this piece because this probably more than anything else is driving the midterm results right now. Put D3 up on the screen. The Wall Street Journal and crunch the numbers about just how much. the war in Iran just so far has caused the average American family. We're talking about $2,000 out of the pockets of every American family so far. And by the way, Brent crude is up well over $100 now. I'm sure gas prices are going to be rising commensurately. We previously showed you that chart that tracked Trump's approval rating and gas prices and they are directly inversely correlated. So the more gas prices go up, the more Trump's approval rating goes down. So this is about the worst possible landscape he could be facing going into the midterm elections. And then this is reflected in the polling data put D4 up on the screen. You've got just a devastating landscape here. 29% only saying the US is on the right track. 71% say it's the wrong track. 82% say that their finances are the same or worse than a year ago. 82% only 18% say that they are better off under Trump. 67% say the price of gas has caused them issues. Majorities have changed what groceries they're buying and are cutting back on entertainment so that shows you it is cutting to the bone. People are having to alter their lifestyles, swap out what sort of protein they're buying at the grocery store and things like that at the advice of a number of administration officials and other Republicans. Trump's approval stands at 34% on issue by issue. His approval on cost of living is 27% on the Iran War 29%. On AI, 33% on border and immigration where he is comparatively stronger still underwater at 43%. So but the most probably devastating number here is 82% saying I'm worse off or I'm the same or I'm worse off than I was a year ago and it ties directly into the decisions that Donald Trump has made. Yes and this is where inflation was inflation and immigration and only two reasons the man is president. Right? You disagreed with me. That's my that's my basic. I think inflation and immigration. Those are the two number one issues. It's very hard to say like which exactly was more impactful. I think that for turnout it was immigration in terms of getting Republicans to come for swing voters it was inflation. How can you argue that you are better off financially when you look because remember you know one of the other things that was really on Trump's side was this general idea of blowing up the system because mortgages when Biden left office were I mean what six percent it was a five something like that percent inflation had gone up food prices had gone up dramatically. I mean things were horrible like it was really bad and especially with gas prices. Well now as a result of the Iran war it's exacerbated that by tenfold so the gas price is now I don't even know what's it's a yeah we said 430 sorry I meant the mortgage rate I believe it's like 7.2 or 7.3% I mean that's that's insane that that's bonkers and then you add on credit card interest balance health care premium I think mine went up to cheers as well for again it's coming yes it's November is open enrollment's gone up my deductible is $18,000 is my deductible right I mean that why do I even have insurance like paying for the private if I didn't have a kid I wouldn't have it I can tell you that right now and so you add all of that together and you're like oh my god I mean how is anybody like even how is anybody how do people living on yeah it's like if you don't make a hundred thousand dollars today which is not even the median income so that means like 60% of families are below that level I actually just don't get it like you can't even eat McDonald's every day or something and it's so sad there's not even an expectation in America anymore that you should be able to live off of like a minimum wage or just above minimum wage salary it's just like no one even believes that that that's kind of always been fake whenever it comes to minimum wage and I think that's fine is that's well it's nobody's like it's supposed to be minimum for a reason right like that's supposed to be the bottom quarter yeah but I mean we have it's still seven dollars and 25 cents they hadn't been increased in decades and so you know if you had the same minimum wage that you had back like saying the 70s it'd be something around I think the number was like $25 an hour I mean it and you've had the housing health care education costs have gone up way far and beyond what other inflation is so these just like basic building blocks so you used to be able to work a like normal service sector job and live now you can't live like there is no expectations people just assume that you're not going to be able to make it on that sort of a salary but but yeah I mean it's not surprising then that when you engage in an unpopular war of choice that dramatically increases one of the primary inputs primary costs that people deal with every single day and see in their face every single day that there's going to be a political backlash and so you know I'm we'll probably talk about this with Logan tomorrow and talk about maybe the polls are off it's still certainly possible but the reason I believe that there is a relatively large scale reckoning more so than what we saw even in 2018 coming is just because it's not even because of polls it's because of these fundamental facts right the gas prices the war the tariffs to by the way which have specifically hurt some of Trump's core constituencies and then you layer on that the corruption the fact that he's obsessed with this ballroom that he's so obviously enriching himself and his family and is more concerned about that than he is about anything that's going on for you and your family you know a certain point there is that there is a breaking point there pun intended well no I was just looking at the I've talked earlier about that focus group and corruption was one of the number one responses by Republicans yeah as to why things are where they are yeah I mean yeah it's like I look the American public you know I have my problems marijuana being chief among them and gambling but I look at it and I just what I always wonder is like the information environment like what's getting through and what's not because don't forget you know the Fox News bubble is still real and Jesse Waters like if you watch that every single day you don't really know anything about corruption like you don't really know that is just linking shrinking literally because of the way that actuarial tables work amount of our population but it is still a heavy voting demographic the question is whether the general like how they're living in society prices and all that is making them start to question the other stuff that they see on the screen yeah that's where I still I'm just I'm like I don't know you know I still somebody sent me a tweet which is a rundown of the Jesse Watershow it's like an alternative reality yeah like oh there did you seem defending his son I did see that well Jesse is a shitster so like he's not gonna fall hey repeatedly now he's like I'm not gonna fall for this what did he say he's like look Trump has said much worse so whatever I forget what that was about yeah exactly you was like oh we called someone a pig like I said worse yeah yeah I said worse yeah yeah you're welcome on the show anytime man you know let us know with we promise that Ryan we're not punching the face yeah okay we'll do it remote just for yeah yeah right distance okay let's get to the next one Lisa we should tell them about our new show oh my god Lexi we have a new podcast it's called don't lie to me I'm Lexi you want to wear two best friends 22 years apart but so close at heart and I'm Lisa Julio the old one which means we have wildly different references occasionally different opinions and at this point in my 50s I've lived it all I'm not gonna get in here fighting that is wild I learned that about you today now in my 30s being the founder of new shoes good taste is my business and I've always got something to say if men were just honest about this there would be so much more peace in the world we're gonna talk about dating relationships beauty getting older and a little wiser we're best friends but we don't always agree because you told us how accommodating you are obviously I would do what I think I could do to fight the fight but there's only so much fight I can fight don't lie to me don't lie to me don't lie to me don't lie to me don't lie to me don't lie to me liar listen on the iheart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts I don't really care you broke me you do not deserve happiness I'm Andrea Gunning on this season of betrayal we meet Carl Bryant Carl thought he was living a normal drama-free life until the messages started you will have hell to pay for nine months someone infiltrated every aspect of Carl's life threatening to ruin him cyber stalking swatting extortion impersonation and then the text threats escalated someone's not going to make it out of this alive it's playing out in real life not just on the phone every piece of evidence pointed to one man but every piece of evidence was a lie he was not going to stop unless we stopped him listen to betrayal season six on the iheart radio app apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts if anyone wanted to commit a murder up here would be the greatest place in the world to hide the body but no one will find it he acted friendly he talked friendly he sounded friendly they won't knew that I did to scary boogie stuff and this is maybe she'll find out where this girl is I saw him by the backhand and a bow and that's exactly what made us all thank you He had something to do with it. And to hear The Devil's Quarry Season 2 add free with exclusive content, subscribe to Lava For Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. We're very excited now to be joined by Cole Stangler. He is the host of the "What Do We Want" podcast. He's also a former intern for Ryan Grimm. So with that, that might be more of an important title there. Cole, he is based in Marseille, France. Cole, it's good to see you, man. Thank you for joining us. Yeah, thanks for having me. So Cole, we obviously were here in the United States. We can only see what's in our social media feeds or in the news. We can put some up of this up here on the screen. We saw some widespread violence and looting take the streets of Paris as well as some other major cities in France. All of this appeared to be after a widespread student-led protest movement that broke out initially. As I understand it, the student-led protest movement then morphed broadly into bigger protests around the cost of living affordability and especially the price of gasoline. And then from that point forward, it then morphed into criminal and thug elements, effectively taking to the streets straight up engaging in violence and looting. And last night, I know we also saw several areas of the city that were on fire including residential buildings that were being burglarized. Obviously, this is set off a political earthquake in France. We're curious, Cole, for you to give us some of the history. As to why is this happening now? What is the broader societal impact on everything that you've seen? We're telling us before you actually attended some of those initial protests. So how did this start and then how did we get here? Yeah, so, you know, I think we have to go back. We can go back, you know, far away as a way. But let's start off at least in mid September, which is when the student protest movement started. So basically a movement led by high school students talking about the dilapidated conditions of their buildings, talking about staff shortages, criticizing the decline in investment in public education. Criticizing the admissions platform for university, forgetting into universities. So a very clear list of demands. There's the student unions that represent high school students have made those demands very clear. And we've seen really several days of protest, big protests that were that were attended by supporters of the movement. We've also seen a lot of blockades outside high schools. And so this movement really started in mid September. And I think high school students have been waiting for the government to make a concession. The movement itself is broadly popular that's reflected in the polls. And what happened on Saturday, October 17th was this was still was the biggest day of protest yet related to this movement. High school student unions back the protests. So did major labor unions inference. And so did the remnants of the yellow vest movement, which some of your viewers and listeners may recall the yellow vest movement started in late 2018, really related to the cost of living. And located really in kind of peripheral parts of France, just on the outskirts of urban areas. What we call the petty urban parts of France. The yellow vest, known also for the very confrontational kinds of protests. So that was what October 17th was about. It was student union protests in favor of the movement, but also supported by the yellow vest and a kind of broader. A broader frustration about the cost of living. Now, you know, as a journalist, I've gone to many of these protests and talk to students. They very clear about their demands. What happened on the 17th was different because, like you said, these peaceful demonstrations and they were very peaceful. I was at the one in Marseille, where I would say punctuated by. In the early morning in Marseille, we had very aggressive individuals. We had a group of people who were particularly hooded, you know, not showing their faces, engaging in basically violent attacks against the police. And then afterwards, and I would say simultaneously, afterwards, the big march, we had essentially looting. I think that's basically the word that that's, I think that describes what we saw. We said the same thing in Paris. And so right now, the story has shifted from being one about this very broadly popular protest movement on Saturday with over 800,000 people, according to unions. The focus has now shifted to this question of the violence. How did the government allow this to happen? I think a lot of French people are wondering that today, really, in fact, I think across the political spectrum. So, French President Emanuel Macron issued a new response yesterday. Let's take a listen to a little bit of that. When we saw the images, we all thought what was in their heads? How can French people do this to France? Why would the town hall of Li Bourge be born down the off tourist office? Why would the town hall in Marseille be invaded or the prefecture in Bordeaux? How can we have got there? There is nothing that justifies this. Nothing that explains it. Nothing that excuses it. We are all feeling anger and shame tonight. To see the cities, the streets of our cities, run fact like this is unbearable. So cool. How much did Macron's actions and governance spark this crisis to begin with and then what do you make of his response thus far? Yeah, I think the government has bears an immense amount of responsibility for this crisis. We could just look at the student movement I talked about where the students have been making very precise demands asking for the French government because we have a very centralized country where unlike the United States, it's really up to the national government to make investments in public education to decide whether it's going to exceed some of these protests demands. So, you know, we go back a week or two ago, the government very easily could have calmed down the situation by saying we're going to announce an investment plan in the dilapidated buildings. We are going to hire X number of teachers to help fill the staff shortages. We're going to increase the salaries for teachers, which, by the way, are below the average in the era of European Union. They're below the average and the OECD below 2,000 euros a month for people starting their careers. And the government has neglected to listen to these demands. And the reality is, if we take a further step back, this frustration, I think that the people have, it goes well beyond as the student protests movement. There's a sense that in France, when you have these big demonstrations and that, to some extent, is a part of French political culture, there's a sense that at the end of the day, you would expect the government to make at least some type of concession that's sort of part of French political history and French political culture. You get enough people out in the streets and at some point the government will cave, at least at some point. And that's not what's happened. We can go back to the pension reform process that we saw on 2023 over the attempt to hike the retirement eligibility age. Huge protest movement, extremely popular. The government did not budge. So, I think what we're seeing today is this strategy of the government. They are unwilling to make concessions, even modest concessions to protesters. And that's fueling a lot of unrest. And, of course, that doesn't excuse the violence that we saw. I think a lot of people are wondering who exactly was responsible for these scenes. There's a lot of questions about that. But for a lot of French people, there's this frustration that we have a government that is not willing to make the slightest concession. You would think just to kind of tone down the temperature and have some more stability. But they've been unwilling to do that. Yeah, Cole, to push you a little bit here. Is it really fair to say that any of this violence has anything to do with these? Let's say even legitimate demands of the student protesters and others. You know, there's been a lot of speculation about immigration, also about anarchy, like a literal anarchist, like organized anarchists inside of France. Obviously, I'm not in France. I could be juxtaposed. I could be projecting my own American domestic political concerns. But, you know, looking at violence or protest movements, you know, in the United States, it doesn't seem to me that if they announce anything about school reform tomorrow, that looting, you know, Louis Vuitton or some store like that would end. Am I wrong and correct? Like, I'm happy for you to challenge me. No, I mean, I think the first thing is just because it is a point that we heard Donald Trump make this point and others kind of in the far right political orbit made this point about immigration. I think it is just important to emphasize that that is, I think, a really fringe position in France. It doesn't really reflect the reality, too. Saying this is about immigration, I think, is not really, you know, I think grappling with the issue in a serious way. We have, you know, cities that have-- It's plain why, right? So the scenes that are coming out, you know, by and large, what most people are looking at are people from the poor, suburban areas, children of immigrants, in particular, the people who are engaged in writing and looting, although it's entirely fair, there are many images of white people doing it, you know, too. So I just-- I think, you know, to fully explain to our audience, like, why do you think that's not a fair critique? Because I think if we look at the conditions at which people are living in, For instance, I'll give you just a concrete example here, of being, you know, I live in Marseille, which is a city that is a long, long history of immigration that did not start recently. It's been, you know, Marseille is a port of the Mediterranean waves of immigration. It's also a city that has suffered from disinvestment, from de-industrialization. And so, you know, in addition to those mass marches, you had 14, 15-year-old kids. I saw kids, you know, literally fighting over a PlayStation that they have looted from a store. I don't understand the link between immigration here. We're talking about people that have grown up in France, who are French citizens, who are living in difficult conditions. That's not excusing the violence, of course. Not excusing looting, but it's just, I think, putting things in their context. I don't understand the link between trying to tie someone's identity of their parents or grandparents who may have immigrated to France, you know, multiple decades ago to the conditions they're living in today and to the decision to take part in looting. And I think, you know, there's also that separate question of, and it's hard to talk about this because we need to, I think, be careful and wait for the investigations to run their course. But who exactly are the kind of ultra-left, you know, types of people that might be engaged in a sort of violence? We don't have a good sense of those people either. It's why I think it's important to be careful to not, you know, to not to jump to conclusions. I think it's, again, worth stating that the overwhelming majority of French people, I think, were shocked by the violence. And also by, you know, an important point if you don't mind me just saying is that the strategy of the police here, which has come under scrutiny, I think is another really important point here. We had both-- - Can you elaborate on that? - Yeah, sure. So at the beginning of the movement, you know, I think we can say this is a part of failure of the French policing strategy. The interior minister himself said that they were errors. He offered his resignation, which was not accepted. But if we go back to the beginning of the protests movement, so from late September to last week, before the October 17th, we had around 8,000 arrests. 8,000 people were detained, brought into police custody. 85% of whom are minors. So very aggressive policing strategy. That's more than the entire yellow vest movement. At the same time as we have that aggressive policing strategy against peaceful protesters, largely peaceful protesters, we saw the police being unable to basically protect businesses from looting, and that's been the critique of the mayor of Marseille, where I am. He said, how is it possible that buildings were not being protected? So at some point, there's a deep failure of the policing strategy. They spent so much energy on breaking up peaceful protests, when it came to actually preparing for looting, they were not there. So I think it's also a breakdown in the French policing that I think is on display for everyone to see. - Interesting. There's not just protests in France right now, although those have been the most explosive. There's protests in Italy. There's protests in Albania. There's protests in Portugal. I was actually just in Spain, where there have been huge protests over housing, in particular, that caused the president there to announce a snap election. So you do look at this. And while the flavor of it all is very different nation to nation, it just causes me to question how much of it is really about the combination of the Ukraine war and now specifically the Iran war and the way that has spiked prices and really put a lot of pressure on people truly around the world, but certainly across Europe. - Yeah, so I don't want to speak too much about countries that I'm not unless familiar with, but I think you're right that there are some commonalities between some of these protests moments. We can look at the underlying economic conditions in France under Macron for the last 10 years. We have this issue of basic broad wage stagnation so the French talk a lot about purchasing power, which is basically a way of getting at this concept of the cost of living. We've had public services that have not faced radical deep austerity. I think that that be an exaggeration, but have stagnated, have not kept up with people's demands. And then when you add in the problems with inflation, the problems with the Iran war launched by the United States and Israel, that certainly adds to these pressures. So I think all these causes are also part of it. In some of those we see in other countries as well. So yeah, I think it's absolutely fair to say that the Iranian war is part of the problem here. Michael himself mentioned it in his speech he's talked about it before. - Yeah, cool. I was listening to Janis Verifakis this morning and his analysis for our Greek finance minister. And his view, and he's a militial supporter, his view is effectively that this isn't really Macron's fault. That there are some fundamental economic dynamics that make the French budget and the French economy fundamentally unsustainable as long as they are part of the euro. And neighboring Germany, this is gonna lead to capital outflow and budget deficits. What do you think of that view? That there's an underlying structural issue here that no matter what Macron did within the current system, it wouldn't really solve the fundamental issues here without a kind of radical rethink of the economic system. - Yeah, I mean, I'd love to see that interview and maybe talk to Janis Verifakis myself, but yeah, I mean, I think, you know, look, I mean, in France, there are very clear political decisions that I think most of the French political class and most of the French population understands that haven't been taken by Macron. We can go kind of look at his record. For example, today, you know, if Macron wanted to, he could announce the government wanted to. They could announce more investment in public education. The public spending in education is dropped from over 7.6 GDP in 1997 to 6.8% today. So if you have a drop in spending on public education, the government could also decide if they wanted to impose higher taxes on the ultra rich to maybe buttress, France's spending or France's budget problems, which are very real, shouldn't neglect them. There's the famous proposal from Gabriette Izoukman, the French economist. I know it spends a lot of time in the United States as well. He's called for a wealth tax targeting the top 2%, sorry, the, even the smaller portions, excuse me, of the French ultra rich to having them contribute more. But the French government is unwilling to make those kinds of, you know, to make those kinds of concessions. So, and there's also a deeper democratic problem that's one point I'll add that maybe Janis Verifakis probably didn't mention, which is we had this deeper democratic crisis in France and without sort of suggesting that there aren't structural economic problems. I think it's important to recognize just from the French perspective, there's a deeper democratic problem here, which is that Macron was elected twice basically because a majority of people were opposed to the far right, winning, he did not have a big pop of a mandate, and he has refused to make concessions on many of his, his proposal. I'll give you just one final example really quickly. After the legislative elections that we saw in 2024, so Macron called snap elections used his power on the French Constitution to dissolve the national assembly. You had elections, you had a left-wing coalition that won a plurality of seats, not a majority, but a plurality, and instead of nominating a prime minister from the camp that won the most seats in the national assembly, Macron said, I'm going to prefer to have a center right, right-wing prime minister that I'm going to name. And I think that this is, again, it's part of this, just democratic frustration. So yeah, we can talk about the broader economic issues, but there's also a sense of this government has been unwilling to adjust its strategy in face of a popular men on issue after issue. - Last thing for you, Cole, we just had this piece published by The New York Times. The headline is, France's far right ceases the moment as rioting stuns the country. The National Rally already ahead in the polls presented itself as the party best place to restore law and order. So I had seen a lot of takes in the US. They said, oh, this is how you get Le Pen elected. I'm like, well, she's been leading in the polls already. So it probably is only more helpful to her candidacy. Why don't you talk through her chances in the upcoming election six months from now? What's been her message throughout this? And what are the broader structural reasons as to why she was already popular going into this? - Yeah, I mean, it's a huge issue. And you're right, she was completely great. She was already popular before this crisis. And it's a huge conversation that it's hard to do in just a few minutes, but I think there's a lot of factors. I mean, let's talk for one, and she's done a good job, I think, of they call it demonization. So trying to tone down, I think the more radical rhetoric of her father, Jean-Marie Le Pen, who's a Holocaust denyer, convicted in French court as such. Le Pen is surrounded by far right radicals, including Jordan Bardella, who was found recently to, according to MediaPath French investigative outlet, to be making anti-Semitic comments on the internet. But regardless of the reality, it's been a good job of changing the image of the party, of making over the image, adjusting the rhetoric publicly. You know, that's helped. Part of it has been their obsession with the questions of right security. They have security and an immigration. They're far right nativist, which is that, you know, when there are complex social and economic problems, they do what President Trump does and basically link these complex social problems to immigration. It's a very simplified, you know, nativist way of thinking about politics, but that's what they do. They do it very well. I, you know, part of it also has been the government. And the Makonis camp, I think legitimizing a lot of their talking points. There was an instance on immigration. Makon's own party has passed quite aggressive legislation cracking out on immigration, including a bill that actually was cracking out on birthright citizenship in France. It was partially blocked by the French constitutional court, but nevertheless after that bill, Malhein the Penn said there was an ideological victory for her party. So you have Makonis that have been legitimizing these points. Another huge point, if you're in France, is the role of the media. We have a very aggressive conservative media landscape that is really, I think, flourished in the last several years. Thanks in large parts of Barcelona, Budaille, who is a ultra conservative billionaire, who's bought up major media networks. We have Senus Network in France, which is basically the Fox News equivalent. He's bought up radio stations, newspapers. Media discourse has shifted. The Makonis have adopted the talking points. From my perspective, it's also, I think, a failure of the left to offer a compelling alternative. Some of this might sound familiar to people in the United States. The left in France has struggled on one level all night, but I think almost more importantly to just offer a clear and coherent counter-narrative to this. And they've been struggling a lot on the polls, and that's why that's what we see in those polls. A lot could happen between now and the elections, but you're right, for now, it looks like Marine Le Pen is the favorite at this point as we're talking in October, 2026. Well, the new podcast is What Do We Want? You said it's in English and French, and Cole, we really appreciate you taking the time to break some of these issues down for us this morning. Thanks, Cole. Thanks so much for having me. Thanks for having me with you a bit more, but it's okay. We appreciate your time, brother. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, guys, so much for watching. We appreciate it. We're about to do the AMA. Lisa, tell them a better new show. I'm Lexi Juanio, where two best friends, 22 years apart, but so close at heart. And I'm Lisa Giulio, the old one, which means we have wildly different references, occasionally different opinions, and at this point in my footies, I've lived it all. Now, in my 30s, being the founder of New Shoes, good taste is my business. Listen on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If anyone wanted to commit a murder, up here would be the greatest place in the world to hide the body, but no, no, find it. He acted friendly. He talked friendly. He sounded friendly. I saw a bomb, a backhandler, a bow. Listen to the devil's quarry season two in the Bone Valley feed on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On Radio 831, a romance podcast, join us. Sanjana Baskar and Tyler McCall, as we host our own Monster Romance Extravaganza, were joined by the villain edit author Rosie Dannan and sent in object romance expert Gracie Delgado to explore with these unexpected love stories, can reveal about desire, fantasy, and what we actually want. Listen to Radio 831, a romance podcast, on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an I Heart Podcast. Guaranteed Human.