Emma Grede on Unapologetic Ambition

[MUSIC PLAYING] When you are pioneering anything or introducing new ideas to the culture, you get criticized. You do? Yeah. Did you hear about that? I didn't find the one. I found someone I respected, and we made it the one. In a sort of longing kind of view of love, people understand each other as if by magic. Nothing in itself is addictive, on the one hand. On the other hand, everything could be addictive. If there's an emptiness in that person that needs to be filled. I now know that nobody changes until they change their energy. And when you change your energy, you change your life. I'm Gwyneth Poundrow. This is the GOOP podcast, bringing together thought leaders, culture changers, creatives, founders and CEOs, scientists, doctors, healers and seekers, here to start conversations. Because simply asking questions and listening has the power to change the way we see the world. Here we go. This week on the GOOP podcast, I'm sitting down with my girl, Krush, the insanely brilliant, very beautiful, and endlessly inspiring Emma Greed. She is a mom of four. She's a powerhouse investor. And she is the force behind some of the most iconic brands shaping culture today. Skims, good American and off season, just to name a few. Emma has helped build and scale companies that have redefined fashion, inclusivity, and what it means to lead with purpose. We talk about where she learned to lead with conviction and compassion, how she cultivates gratitude, daily, and her honest thoughts on balance. She makes building empires look effortless, but it's her clarity, humor, and heart that reveal what it really takes. I'm so happy to have you. I'm so happy to be here. On the GOOP podcast, thank you so much. You know you're like my girl, Krush, girl boss. Get out of it. You know you are coming from here. You know you are. You have said it, and I'm happy you say it here live, because people don't believe it. It's really true. I really am in awe of you and what you've been able to build, and it's such an amazing for me, like inspirational model of a woman, a mother, a business woman. So I'm just thrilled that you're here, and I get to ask you all about it. I love that. It's just so, that's just so, high, high praise and date. So I'd love to start with kind of what you do to sort of set the scene, like currently, what companies are you either running or chief creative in, give us the lay of the land. I know it's really funny. I get asked that so much, and I always feel, you know, people think I do so many different things, and I feel like I do like three things over and over and over again, which is quite interesting. But by way of background, so I am the founder of Good American, which is where I still play the role as the CEO eight years in, which I love, one of my favorite roles. I am the co-founder alongside my husband Yens Greed and Kim Kardashian of Schemes. But there I play the role of the chief product officer, which is honestly, like if you could say, like Emma, what's your dream role? Like, what are you the best at? What do you really love doing? That's it, like chief product officer, across the, you know, design and planning, a merchandising production, that's my comfort zone. That's where I excel, and I love. I have a couple of other businesses that I have co-founded, one called Offseason, which is like all the rage. I am so excited about that company, because I'm so excited about women's sports. And I always feel like you can't make things successful. But you know, like when what's happening in the culture kind of collides with what you're doing, you know, you're really onto something. So I feel like, you know, the stars aligned and the timing was beautiful around that business. It's a luxury sports match company that I did in partnership with this incredible woman, Christine Hughes-Check and the NFL. So super excited about that. Then I'm an investor of course. I have a pretty big investment portfolio, which is fun. And a shark tanker. A shark tanker. Three seasons in shark tanking over here. And Dragon's Denny, which is the British version of it. And I'm a mom, you know, I have four kids. So that is about as much time as any one person has. But I do think it's important because in my life, you know, I have obsessions, like I'm a person that gets like really into things. And I think what I do is the same thing over and over again. I'm a merchant at heart. I have a pretty good idea for what women want and how they want to feel. And I'm obsessed with pleasing customers. And so what I do is focus my energies around what could that be? And so I feel like for the last eight years, the fixation has been on making people look and feel their best. And doing that in a way that is like surprising and can delight people. You are a problem. I'm going to fix that problem and then getting shit to people quickly. Like it's not that deep, you know, it's not that difficult. And so I feel like there is this idea of like, oh my God, she's doing everything. No, I do a couple of things really, really well. And then, you know, I hire amazing people to work around me and do all the shit. And I'm not so good at it. Well, so will you tell me a little about the founding story of Skims? Because it's such an incredible company and so successful and so massive and so global. And I was so inspired and psyched for you guys when I saw the Nike thing. But of course, like any company, it started with an idea and a first set of products. So will you tell me a little bit about like the origin story of that company? Absolutely. Well, I think the first thing to say is it's, I always feel like a little bit of a cheat when I tell the origin story because it was Kim's idea. You know, that's, I've been in business with the family for a few years at that point when we launch Skims. I have a company with good American and Chloe and I have a cleaning company with Chris. Oh, yeah. Those are a great far sustained. We'll be caught. Lovely. You didn't even mention that business. I didn't. You know, there's too many, there's too many things to mention. But, you know, I have a great relationship there and one that's based on trust and a mutual understanding of what each brings to the table. And so Kim, who had wanted to start this company for a very long time that was originally really orientated around shapewear and underwear, we decided to partner on that. And I feel really lucky because what I do is help bring a vision to life. And I'm pretty good at that. And I think that Kim is the best at the best kind of treble a list creative director. I mean, she does many things well. Right. But what she's very clear is this is her vision. This is what she wanted to do. And so all I had to do was make the stuff, you know, and I've figured out a way to organize myself to bring in the best possible people and to create products that people will really love. So when you're working with someone who's so clear about what it is that they're trying to create, the job of the chief product officer becomes really simple. Then it's about making sure the range is, you know, a range that's going to work for a lot of women. That's the merchandising piece. Then you've got to plan it. That's the piece that's really saying, okay, how much of this a week in a buyer turns out quite a lot. And then, you know, you've got this innovation piece because what Kim does, you know, she's a challenging creative director. She comes to the party and she's like, I want to make one-legged shape for her. And you're like, okay, well, there's no benchmark for that, right? I can't go alone. Let's see what everybody else does in the one-legged shaped ware department. That's not possible because if one leg is coming out of something, you've got like a little slit in your gown or whatever it is. But, you know, that's what Kim's all about. She is creating solutions for herself and therefore, you know, who else might need that. And so my job is really to make sure that we can make that, we can make it really well, we can make it fit, we can make it fit an enormous, you know, group of women and that we can price it correctly and get it out in the market and deliver it on time. That's incredible. I mean, it's really like when you think about, you know, starting with one piece of shape ware and I'm sure you guys were testing out fabrics and shapes and sewing things and now to think about like the juggernaut that it is now. I mean, what is that like to be a founder and have such quick, massive success? Because some business are like a more slow growing thing, right? And then that business is just like stunning how big it is. You're right. And I think that the precursor with good American was really important because when you make product in such a large size intensive way, you really need to understand how it works at all ends of the size spectrum. So for me, when I'm going out and looking for people to work in the company, it's not like any other clothing business where you're trying to, you know, service eight or nine sizes. We make 19 sizes in a range. And so you really need to have people that have done that that have lived in both plus size land and what we call Missy in fashion and can understand the technical specifications of doing all of that really, really well. Right. Because I imagine it's not just sizing up right now. No, no, there's a totally different patterns. And often in our garments, we have two or three different patterns for like one single garment. So the complexity gets ever higher, the cost gets ever higher. So you've really got to understand what you're solving for. And I know that it seems like everything happened very quickly and overnight. But there's a lot of planning that goes into these businesses and part of my job as a merchant and as a planner and doing the role of chief product officer is to be a bit of a gambler. Like my job is to go, you know what? I think that everyone's going to die for that one legged thing or not, right? I feel like this is just here as a flash in the pan and it's going to, you know, create scarcity and it's going to be a moment in press, but it's not a deep seller. And so what I do really well is take the bets. You know, it's like my, I have to go like, where do we think this actually lands? And what is the, what is the life cycle of this product and, and how do we, how do we keep this thing in stock, which you could say I've done to very in degrees of success quite honestly, because it was crazy in the beginning, but, um, but that's my job really to, to have a sense of how trends are happening and how you connect trends. And it's interesting because I sit across so many businesses, you start to, all of these things become a muscle, right? So I'm good American. Let's take denim, for example, denim trends last for 10 years, but as you see, you know, it's like as people are wearing skinny and then graduating into straight and then the, you know, the, the fits become more baggy. My job is to connect that and say, well, if the fit is becoming more baggy and that's where the trend is at, what's going to happen on the top? Well, the top's going to end up as a baby tea. And so should I be selling hundreds of thousands of units of baby teas over here? And so really my, my role is to connect what's happening in trend and to make those decisions hopefully ahead or right on time with the current. And how far ahead are you sort of trend forecasting? Oh my goodness. I mean, too far ahead if you ask me. Yeah, because, you know, the typical calendar is around a year, depending on the fabrication and the classification of the, like the category that you're working in, but it's, it's pretty far out. So you've got to be, even begin to understand like what a trend will be a year out, well, you want to make the trends, you know, and I feel like that's what we've done really well. Like we create, you know, there was no market for certain products like how are you going to predict a nipple bra like you can't, you know, it didn't, it wasn't there before. And so you got to create the trends and be ahead of it. So talk to me about your appetite for inventory risk when you're like taking my appetite and my board's appetite, it's a little bit different. I think I'm a natural born risk taker. That's part of my personality and that's what makes me good because I'm not so careful. And also I just try not to, you know, I have this thing that I'm really good at listening to myself. And so while I can take stock of what's happening around me, I'm pretty good at going away from the noise and going like, what do I think about this? Because there's so much opinion out there, right? Like, and I'm pretty good at also calling people up and getting opinion. But the first thing I do is I go, what do I think? What is my instinct? What is my gut telling me? And what do I believe to be true? And then I make decisions based on that. So that's like always my starting point. And I think that I'm pretty good at feeling things out without too much, you know, distraction. So like, so it takes something risky now we're on the nipple bras are example. So that's a totally novel idea, right? Like a lot of people want to cover their nipple through their shirt. And so now the idea is so no, let's free the nipple, let's let's make a nipple bra. So how do you know or how do you get comfortable? I don't know what the depth like, I can't even imagine for scams. It was deep. What's it? It was deep. How many units did you buy of the nipple bra? Possibly tell you my trade secrets. No, but you know, we're talking like we're making. We're making a lot. We're making like serious like thousands and thousands and tens and thousands of sometimes hundreds of thousands, you know, when you put again, you know, nine different shades and things together. So we're making an enormous amount of units. But really it's about for us really understanding where, like where is the appetite for something like that? And how are you creating appetite for it? You know, because at the end of the day, again, it's about linking purchases. So if you're making a nipple bra, what am I really trying to sell here? I'm trying to sell baby teeth. I'm trying to make you bra and a baby team put the thing together and have a look. So, you know, again, it's always about these connections of what you're doing and then creating the appetite for it. And so I think that, you know, over and over again, if I think about good American, when we started, the always fits genes, this was actually an initiative that was done around B-Corp, right? We, we, we buy a lot of fabrics by virtue of making lots of pairs of genes. They'll also be an element of waste. And if you make 19 sizes, how do you limit the waste? And so we were like, well, how do we make less sizes, but still cover the full spectrum of the size range? And so always fits is like this fabric with a hundred percent stretchability. And instead of making the 19 sizes, we make it in four sizes that fits everyone. So the same thing that fits you, that fits me, can fit your friend, who's a size 10 and can fit your friend, who's a size 8, for example. And you know, it's just one of these things where when you innovate and you really think about like what's going to, what's going to change the game, you start to get into these like really interesting positions where again, you're in uncharted territory and you have to use all of that gut instinct to figure something out because it's not being done before. So all of the experience around me, you could have worked at wherever for 25 years, but you can't tell me how that thing's going to perform. So then it becomes about something else like, what is the need? How do I feel about this? And what is my instinct telling me? It's really brave in a way, you know, to rethink like how things have been done, rethink the fabrics. I mean, even just like limiting the size run to like a one size fits all, but basically four sizes. Yes. So I thought it was interesting when you were talking about the kind of 10 year good American sort of paving the way for how you approach the merchandise at skims, right? Because it sounded like there were a lot of lessons there in terms of fit and fabrics. And I mean, it seems like a secret weapon that you are able to carry the knowledge from one of these businesses like and cross pollinate them across, but are they quite segregated in terms of operating teams and ideas and data like, are you sharing them across good American and safely and no, no, no, our businesses are all completely separate and completely stand alone. So different teams, different offices, different investor base, I guess the common denominator becomes like sometimes Yens and myself, like because we're in the businesses. But we play very, very different roles. And we purposefully keep the companies very separate because they all do very different things. But when I think about what it is that I do, like my entire life, my entire career has always been about leverage, you know, it's like I started my career in a place where, you know, I didn't have any particular skill. I was just someone who loved fashion and would come with like such enthusiasm that people would be like, well, she's a, you know, she's a goal of a lot of energy. She'll do anything to like be in the room. And that's that was the truth. But I parlay that into that enthusiasm and that kind of like love and passion for fashion into people noticing me into clients then saying, yeah, you can come and work on this job. And when I first started the agency, those clients remembered me. And so they would take my call. And then those calls turned into business and those, you know, businesses turned into clients. And when I decided to start good American, you know, I know any VCs, I don't know anyone with any money or an investor, I went to clients, you know, I was like, hey, don't you invest in businesses? You want to invest in my next thing? So I feel like I've just been the queen of leveraging wherever I am into the next thing. And so that's a constant theme in my life that I just like, take whatever I've got. And I springboard it to the next thing amazing. And when you thought of the idea for good American, did you take that to your partner? Or was it a co-founded thing? Or how did that start? No, I had the idea and it really came from this, you know, I spent the first 10 years of my career like at the intersection of fashion and entertainment. So I would get really famous people like you and perhaps call them off and be like, hey, do you want to be in like a fragrance campaign for this brand? And more often than not, they'd say yes. And so, you know, that was really when my business was, it was in this like brand partnership land. And I would put, you know, speak to agents and managers and publicists, they would give me their talent. And I'd represent the brand and I'd do a deal. And I'm just, you know, like a contract negotiator broke up for one of the better words. And, you know, I did that for a very, very long time. And honestly, I got, I got bored and I got disheartened and I was like, what am I doing? I'm creating all of this value for people constantly. And all I would see is like my consultancy check and then they would take all the credit and you'd be like, onto the next one. So it was just kind of this like soul destroying job. And, and I think it kind of came to this time when talent started doing equity partnerships with brands. And so I was, you know, as I was the go-to girl, like you need a Hollywood star to be in this fragrance campaign. I need a Hollywood star to be the front of my startup. So I started doing those things and I was like, wow, we're going to give, like, Ashton Kutcher. 10% of it. It's a fucking thing. And I get like, you know, 25 cents, I was like so mad about it. And I was like, I know what I'll do. I'll start one of these things myself. And it was that naive. Oh, smart. But then I was like, okay, so, you know, you've got to take the things that you know. I understand intrinsically how to market something. I understand, you know, the power of celebrity talent to accelerate an idea. But I knew that product was king. You have to make an amazing product. And at that time, the internet could start a frame. And that brand just went like, and I remember when they came to us, they, you know, at the time, the internet, like pitch Natalie and I on some holiday. And Natalie at that point, you know, was like Mrs. Netaporte, you know, she was like the coolest, most amazing fashion thing. So if you picture a fashion idea, and they were like, we're going to start this company and we're going to sell blue jeans and we were like, wow, wow, great idea, guys, let us know how that one goes. And of course, it was amazing. Yeah. But in my head, I'd seen this company, this like very simple idea that just like blew up and it was about really great, really simple fitting jeans. And I was like, I'm going to do really great, really simple, best fitting jeans, but for all women in all sizes. And so the idea was kind of there. And it was formed off the basis of this success that they'd had. And I was like, I'm just going to do it based off the knowledge that I have been on hundreds of campaigns where, you know, companies were put forward this idea of like diversity. And yet, you know, I knew that these girls couldn't even do their jeans up. You know, they'd be cut down the back. So I was like, I'm just going to make jeans that fit everyone. And the more people they fit, the more you're going to sell, the more money you're going to make. And I would like to say there was like some big insight, but it wasn't. It was like, this is what I know. This is what I understand. This is what I think I can potentially do. That's amazing. Can you talk to me a little bit about going back just a little bit further? So you were raised in London. Single mom. Single mom. Delta step four girls. Right. And that's so nice. You repeated the four. I did repeat the four, although I have to say, you know, I sent on the family group chat because when you were talking about springboarding from one thing to the next, it's like, you really have this incredible it factor. Like you are so magnetic. You're so brilliant. You're so articulate. And I think having that it factor, of course, is like key when you're, especially when you're in a relationship business and you're an agency work and a connector and all of those things. But there's also this incredible grit and perseverance and because, I mean, I can't imagine it's been easy at every turn, like running all these businesses and starting all these businesses, right? And you just like get up and you do it. And you have really strong leadership values, which I also want to get into in a minute. But what happened at home, like how, how were you raised in order to be this person? Are your sisters as industrious as you are as well? They're industrious. You know, it's so interesting because when you're a mom and you know this, you reflect so much when you're upbringing, the good, the bad and the ugly. And I had a wonderful family. You know, I come from a proper East London family where the family was everything. And when, you know, my mom had three kids under the age of five by the time she was 28. So that's a, I could never do that. The first thing to say, it was a pressure cooker, my dad left when we were all really young and my mom was in a situation where she was, you know, I feel like we were all kind of forged in fire, right? There was, it was tough. We didn't have any money. She just had to leave and go and work. And I always laugh like our family dynamic is like she's the dad, I'm the mom and we had three kids together. Are you the first? I'm the first, I'm the eldest and I love my sisters. They are amazing. Like we talk every single day, but it was definitely difficult. And I think my mom had a lot of pressure on her and she did what was, you know, her best. She did what she could. And I think we were coming up in a time where it wasn't like about working on yourself and figuring out your demons, it was like just get through the day, right? Get through the day, feed these kids, keep the lights on. And she did what she knew how to do, which was to just graft. What she did was gave all of us like a real sense of self. She really taught me that, you know, I do say this all the time because it's one of the most fundamental parts of my upbringing. She was like, Emma, you are not better than anybody else, but nor is anyone better than you. So when I got into, you know, what it was that I wanted you to do when I started going out on the world and figuring that out, I really believed that. I was like, nobody's better than me, my mom told me that, that must be absolutely true. And so it gave me this foundation to think that I could do anything. She was like, so long as you work really hard and you put everything in and you're yourself. And that was the thing that was always playing to me like, don't change, I'm good enough. And so I just was raised with this idea of like, I'm totally good, I don't need to change anything about myself. I am a smart girl and I've got lots of skills and I'm just going to work my ass off. And so that was what was, that was what was in me. And did your dad play a role or did he really, no, not at all. He was out. I didn't meet my dad until much later in my life. And he is a part of my life now, but he wasn't a part of my childhood. And you know, there's so many things, I honestly don't think I had daddy issues. You know, I'm so lucky, I've never had about boyfriend, I have such a good, I just, that wasn't thankful of my sister, they'll tell you that and other time. But I had very, I think I had a very high idea of myself and I've got a good radar. So I just was really lucky. I found like a lot of different boyfriends, but one up to the other, if the other was really good. A nice, nice people. Always like just really nice men around me and I'm married incredibly well. I've just made those good decisions, you know. So you don't think that it caused you, I'm sure it caused some kind of trauma, but probably not. Yeah, I had other trauma, you know, I, I don't think that the father thing was so traumatic for me. I think that being the eldest and being a carer for kids when you are very young does a lot of things to a people, right, to a person. And you know, I know that I have, you know, that, that in a child part of me, that's hard to access. I'm not good player. I'm not good at being like, you know, it's just, that's just not me. I've always been a serious girl. That's just who I am. I find it very difficult to be playful and silly and, and that side of me is difficult to access because it's not what I know. When you say that it feels like, you know, that requires like a vulnerability and I think if you're doing and you're protecting your sisters and you're in doing mode and you have to have control of the house because you're sort of in charge of everybody. It must be hard to let go of that control. A hundred percent. And I am, you know, someone who has wanted very purposefully to feel and put forward the idea that I was in control because I never wanted to let my mom down. Like we were not going to be those people in East London that looked like what was going on, was going on. My mom was like, you better, you better, you better pull your shit together and be, you know, like be those people and so I, yeah, it just was never an option for me. It was never an option to fall apart. It was just like, pull it together. There's a lot of people that have gone it much worse than you and figure out. Right. And yet there is that part. I certainly have this where because I can relate to a lot of what you're saying. Like there is that soft part that does sometimes need to come out right and to like be tended to as well. And that's what I think is so interesting about like being a first-born daughter, you know, like parlaying it into life's work and, you know, I have so many of the same like strains running through. Like I have a couple of friends who were in that position of sort of having to raise their siblings and it made them, I would say like have some trepidation around having their own kids and like kind of going back to, did you have that at all or definitely I never wanted kids. Like I, if you'd have asked me when I was 20, up until the point I met Jens and honestly, even when I met him, like I remember when he proposed to me, I was so excited until he started talking to me about marriage. I was like, well, I really just wanted to get engaged. I don't know about this whole marriage plumber, you know, and at the time his brother was getting married the year later and I was like, God, I can like, let's not, you know, like reign on their parade. Let's do it the year after. And so I managed to like push this wedding off and it wasn't about the wedding. It was like, what comes out? Am I going to have to have kids and start a family and do that whole thing? Like I'm so not there. And then like, honestly, it was, I don't know what happened to me. I got married and I was like, oh, no, baby, like immediately I was like, let's just get off a birth control and go for this that start life and buy a house. And I don't know what happened to me because I'd never envisaged that very traditional setup in my life. I didn't want that to happen to me. And all of a sudden it just came out of nowhere. So it was just, I don't know, I'm waiting for the right guy. I think to something happens in marriage where I feel like you're creating like a special, this entity between the couple and it's like, you kind of bear fruit to this bubble that encapsulates you and then, you know, so to me, it makes total sense. So true. So true. A baby would come next. So how old were you when you had your first one? 31. I was 31 when I had. You were. It was a great time because I felt like, and this is not unimportant for my career. I, you know, I've always worked. I was, I dropped out of school. So I, you know, I was like an early starter in what plays high school. I dropped out of high school. So I was, you know, I went to, in England, we call it college, but it was like, I dropped out of the London College Fashion. I was like, 16 going on 17 and, you know, I just needed money. I'd left home and I, I couldn't make ends meet. I couldn't get the train fairs together. And so I decided, like, that wasn't for me and that I'd go straight into work experience and I'd done a work experience where I learned a lot and I was like, I'm just going to stay on that train. So I would work four days a week in a store and then the other three days a week, I would do my work experience. And for me, that was such an important part of my, of my life because I just, I was learning so much in that time and I was building. I think that those years were just really key to me to, to build up what it was that I needed to do and get away from where I was from. Right. I mean, I imagine it must be so gratifying to, I don't know, like, it's, it's like the American dream. You moved here. You know, you've had all this incredible success and like, are there ever moments where you think back to like this young girl in East London and think like, like your house then compared to now? Every day. Are you just like every day? You know, it's so funny. There's this brilliant skit, like, I'm obsessed with comedy and Chris Rock used to say, you know, like, he keeps a bag packed in his own house, like because he's expecting someone to knock on the door and be like, get out of here. This is not your life. And that's how I feel. You know, it's like, I wake up every day and I have this beautiful pitch ceiling in my bedroom. And I'm like, this is insane. I'm like, is this that imagine that you're ceiling in your bedroom? You know, I genuinely feel like that because I am a person who, you know, I stop to smell the rosy. It's like quite literally. I'll walk past a flower and I'll be like, imagine that flower is there and it can smell so good and looks so beautiful. And I do feel grateful all the time. It doesn't, I don't feel far away from that little guy in Plasto. It's still like very, very close. And do you cultivate that gratitude or is it just innate? No, I cultivate it. I, you know, I'm like that over generation. When I used to come home, Oprah was on the TV and she was going on about the gratitude journal. I was like, what do I have to be grateful for? You've seen this house I live in. It's awful. But I learned from a young age and it just became a practice. And I really, you know, before I understood the connections between, you know, how that literally changes your neural pathways, I knew that writing a diary and writing things down was a way of me, like just seropizing, right? It was just this way of me being able not to be like everything else that was around me, which was angry and bitter and blaming. And I understood that the more I could get down on paper, the more I could get out of myself, the better I would be. And I feel like that just became a practice for me from about the age of 17. And I don't know that I haven't kept a diary since I was 17. You still do it. You still do now. I say, carry my journal every single day and I'll write anything that I can in it. And I really, I really love it. Like it's very helpful to me. I mean, it's brilliant because I don't, I think it like moves stuff out of yourself. Yes. Like onto a page. Yes. I used to and then someone read my diary and then I just stopped and I never did it again. Someone read your diary. Close to you or just like close to me. Oh. I know. I know. Yeah, that's not nice. I mean, I'm, if anyone reads my diary, don't tell me. I know. Like just don't know. And then I was like, oh man, what if I pick it back up and then like, you know, the tabloids, like I kept picturing you. Yeah. That's what I would be worried about. Like someone scrummaging through your trash. Do you do it? I mean, I'm never going to write a diary. It is actually so revealing. I recently, like, after the fires in LA, I digitized all of my photos and I found a bunch of old diaries and like, the stuff I would write, I'm like, no one can enter the sea. They can never go anywhere. It's unbelievable. Yeah. I mean, that's kind of the beautiful thing, though, is because you can go back in time and see kind of where you were and how you thought about the world and I still have a couple. But I, I stopped doing it ages ago. I don't. Maybe I'll pick it back up. Maybe you'll pick it back up. I know. I feel like it's good for you. I agree. I think I should. But every time I do, I get really self-conscious. You do. Yeah. It is something that makes you self-conscious, but I feel like for me in the, in the best way. Because if I feel like I've got three days where I'm writing about the same thing, I'm like, Emma, you need to move off of that. You know, I, I love, um, Diane von Fustenberg. She's a dear friend of mine and she says, you know, Emma, the most important relationship you'll ever have is the relationship you have with yourself. And it is right. She's so right. And that for me, like, is the, the most honest relationship because I can talk myself out of anything in my head. And I'm like, oh, I'm a Libra, so I'll be like, and I feel like that is the, you know, it's like, it's the record. It's there. It's in black and white. And I'm like, I still thinking about this three days, like, like, don't come back to this book. I'm right in there. Like tomorrow, like deal with it. So it's like this little record that pushes me over the edge. That's interesting. So whenever you open it, do sort of go back over, I don't really. And that was what was so hard reading these, like, I mean, they were like 17 and 19-year-old diaries. Mine with the big bubble right. And I was like, did I? Right like that. Wrong with me. But, you know, I don't, I just, I know if it's, it's almost like, like, I know it's there. Like, there's something that's like, it's speaking to me and saying, you're still procrastinating on that thing. Like, move on. Yeah. Move on. No, that's, I think that's fair enough. I think that's, that is kind of like being a best friend to yourself in a way, right? Like coaching yourself. Yeah. Okay. I want to talk to you about your leadership style. I saw you. Was it on social or something? You were talking about where we're giving an interview about making everybody go back into the office. Oh, that was a beat. That was so good. That was so good. Here we go. It was the kind of ones, what are you doing to me? I know. That was not a popular opinion. Oh, really? Well, let's, let's be honest. But it was brilliant. It was kind of 50/50 and I knew it when I put it out there, but I do think it's really, first of all, I'm, I feel like we need to be able to have difficult conversations, right? And we need to be able to have conversations where we disagree with one another. I've never, since coming to America, I don't understand like, you know, some of my friends will be like, I'm not friends with him. They're a public and I'm like, you're not friends with him or a public and that's so random. Like, I love the Republicans. What are you talking about? So it just makes no sense to me. So to me, the beauty of social is this ability to get information, share information to hear what people are thinking. And I put that out there because it's a position that I hold strongly. I need people in the office, but not just that. I feel like we've lost like, that workers become like somehow this villain to a certain group of people. It's like, do you know what happened to me at work? The best things, like the single best things I met, all of my best friends that I go on on a girlship with every single year, I met them at work. My husband, I met him at work. I kissed him in the elevator for the first time, you know, it's like, you know what HR was back then, you know, it was just a different time. But not only that, it's like the biggest successes, the biggest failures, the biggest learnings that I have. They all happened in those workplaces, the best nights out that I ever had. They happened after like a random Wednesday in the office when you like, maybe one a bit of business. And so this idea that somehow work is only a drag, it's only a negative, it's only taking away from you. I'm like, on what planet people, and I'll get it, we don't all do work that is really fulfilling. But guess what? Work is not even just about the work, it's about the people, it's about the relationships, it's about the like stuff that happens in the kitchen. So I just, what I was trying to say is that like, can we just have a different way of looking at things? And by the way, yes, I do need you in the office. I need you there to do the work. Guess what? Because I'm paying you to be there for four days. If you'd have said to me at 19 years of age, you know what Emma, we are going to pay you for five days a week and you just need to come in for four. I would have been like, sign me up. Are you crazy? Like, you mean I could go to that Pilates class, be a bit late, check in on the thing, because we know what everyone does. And that's cool. Because the way that we work now is very, very different. The expectation is different. I don't, my expectation is that nobody misses anything that's deeply important to them. But it's like, we have this contract, I'm going to pay you, you're going to do a job and in return, there's an element of freedom, there's an element of trust between us and I expect a result. Yeah. And that's that. Yeah. I don't know. And look, it's something that I wrestle with here. Did you see Jamie Dimon? He had a great, uh oh, the head of Stevie Morgan, amazing rant about it too. Or he was just furious that he would be on a Zoom and he could see like people on their phone and in the zoom and they're all people off on the Zoom. Yeah. The camera. Yeah. It's hard. I mean, I think in California, we still are the least back to the office work culture of all the states. Yeah. No, in my office. I know. And, you know, I don't want to sit on Zoom. That's not the type of work that I do. If I wanted to have that type of job, quite frankly, I wouldn't work in the apparel business. Yeah. I'm an in person, in real life, in real time, I don't want to even send emails. So do you care? You know, I still go to people's desks. I'm like, we're like, Lord, is she, is she in real life coming to you? I'm like, don't worry. It's not a bad thing. I just want to have a chat. And I don't want to send 25 emails. And is it all teams you expect in, like even accountants, data science, everything? Yes. Service, all the things that, like everyone wants to outsource, no, it's, you know, because here's the thing. Again, I go back to this idea of a contract. We're at a time right now where, you know, we are talking about AI, taking so many jobs off the table, right? Like, I honestly could walk into the office and perhaps like reduce the workforce by 200 people tomorrow. I'm not doing that because I don't understand where, like, we haven't caught up with ourselves, right? It's like, yes, AI is going to create a lot of jobs. So right now, the people that would be losing their roles are not walking into these AI-ify jobs right now. Right. So my viewpoint is that I'm going to keep people in work. And my expectation is that you will show up. Yeah. It's not that revolutionary. I don't think it is. To be honest, no. It's not. I don't think it is. It's not popular. It's not popular in California, but I think this is the way the world is moving. Yeah. The unemployment rate is at an all time low. So if you don't like it, I always say to people like, this is my expectation. Right. There's lots of places where you can come in two days a week or you can take the Monday and Friday off. That's totally cool. You should go there. Right. I'm not holding a gun to anyone's head. Right. But then you see, like, the results that your companies are having and it's like a tough consumer market these days, you know, and there's so much competition and you guys are just crushing it. So what I do is fast, you know, I saw Sam Altman did a really good quote two couple of days ago and he said, I'm yet to make it meet a successful person that moves slow. Like me too. Come fast. It's totally true. That's why I don't send a lot of emails. That's why I don't like sitting on zooms. That's why I don't do one hour meetings because I need to go quick, quick, quick and you hire people around you that they understand your short hand and they can take your ideas and sort of execute quickly. Yeah. Like I hire real experts because, you know, at the end of the day, I'm a bit of a generalist, right? I do like a few things kind of well. But when I think about what it is that I'm uniquely good at, I'm very good at focusing, right? I know how to focus on what matters. I know how to get better at the things that matter. And I'm very good at tuning out everybody else's opinion. And on those three things, that's what I do. So those are the important things. I don't do lots and lots and lots and lots of things. I do very, very few things well. And what about, as an example, the skims marketing and like knowing to pull in, you know, whatever is like the culturally relevant thing in the second, like, how do you think of that? No. I wish I could say, you know, it's so funny. I get so much credit out there and it's really, really funny. I think this comes back to, you know, hiring incredible people, but I think that some like between Yens and Kim, I'm lucky enough to be on that group chat. I'm like, wow, that's such a good idea. It really, it's the two of them. They're amazing. They're like obsessed with popular culture and they're just in it. And again, it's quick, right? If you're going to hire the two girls from White Lotus, like you need them in that moment, just as the, you know, finale's coming up and we're all obsessed and we've been very, very good at that. But then, you know, I think the discipline comes from making those things habits, right? You expect that from skims and having that type of cultural relevance never happens by accident. It happens because it's a muscle and we practice it. And I think like anything that you practice, like, I am like a default happy girl. I wake up. I'm like a seven, you know, it's like, that's who I am. But it's like, I've practiced being that way because I don't enjoy the other side of my personality on the other side of the Libra. I can go down, down. And so it's something that I try to do. I have a habit of doing things that I know keep me well and make me happy. And it's the same thing in businesses. You have to create the culture for something to become a habit within that business. And we happen to be pretty good at that. That's so brilliant and so smart. Yeah. I think it's funny that idea of sort of, like, operationalizing instinct or ideas. That's really, really resonant. And you can do that. You can operationalize excellence, like being obsessed with something, right? We were obsessed with our customer. We've operationalized innovation. We've said, if that's the most important thing, having like the fabric, the thing, these moments that people go like, ah, they lose their minds over. Like how do you make sure that those come in? They're not accidents. You have to work on them. You have to create the conditions for them to happen. You have to create the space in people's workloads for those things to become part of the fabric of what you do. And so I think that that is that's part of our, it's part of our culture. Hmm. Can we, can I ask you about offseason for a minute? Yes. Please. So it looks so good. It's like the product. I'm really proud of the product. I have to tell you. I mean, I haven't seen it in person, but I'll send you on. Oh my God. Oh, my God. Forty-girl. J.V. I'm like, you are now. Okay. I'll put it on. You put it on. But it looks really high quality. Mm-hmm. So is it a much different price point? It is. It's a really different price point from everything that's out there. And you know, the, the whole kind of like sports merch market, it's a bunch of horrible stuff. Like, if I sent you something from like, I don't know, wherever people get this stuff, you would be like, ah, no, thank you. You wouldn't put it on and feel good. There's no fit. There's no fabrication. There's nothing that feels remotely like luxurious or premium. And so what we wanted to do was really create a premium experience, something like a puffer jacket that you would want to wear, a top that you would put on with a pair of jeans and feel cute. And now we're seeing sports being so much more part of everyday life that it just felt like the time was right and the culture was right and women's sports is in the right place. And um, I am the person who is really the one saying, okay, like, how do you make an amazing puffer? Like, what should a puffer do? Should you keep your warm? It should look really cool. It should sit just right. If it's oversized, it needs to be that. And so it's about obsessing over every little detail. And then of course, we've been lucky enough to be in partnership with the NFL. So we're making for these like, you know, incredible teams with these amazing legacies and finding the little thing that makes that jacket and that team, you know, those fans like really sit up and stand out. And how did you get them to partner with you? You know, it was, uh, I have to say, Christine Yuschek, who's my partner. She is the wife of Kyle Yuschek, who's a player on the 49ers. I'm learning a lot. Let me tell you. I thought football was soccer up until, you know, a few months ago, I'm like being corrected every day. So she had been creating outfits for herself every single game, like literally taught herself to sew on, on YouTube. You're kidding. No, she sent me like 25 DMs. I cannot tell you. And at some point, you know, you don't get the DMs of people you don't follow. Yeah. And I didn't know who Christine was. She has a lot of followers. Super popular girl. But I think, I don't know, maybe like nine or 10 people were in touch with me saying, do you know, Christine Yuschek, you have to speak to this girl? And I was like, he's this chick, like, I, no idea. I took a call with her and I fell in love. You know, and she just reminded me of like a 27 year old me. She was like, I'm going to do this company and it's going to be successful. And she had a brilliant idea. And I thought, wow, there's a huge gap in the market. I know how to make incredible products. You understand, you know, this business, the NFL. And we're in a time where people, they want to feel nostalgic. They want to go back to this familiarity. And you know, football is about as American as it gets. It's about as family orientated as it gets. And so I'm, you know, the NFL are an amazing organisation and we've got to let someone from the NFL. Yeah, absolutely. Go back to your old partner. So go back to the old Emma licensing ever and be like, let's do a deal, guys. They'd already established like the beginnings of a partnership. And so it was one of those ones where we had to go and say, hey, we're starting a brand. And I was really lucky. I know Michael Rubin, who started fanatics. And so, you know, he's got the whole sports licensing business locked up. And I was like, hey, Michael, want a partner? He's like, what are you talking about? I was like, no, seriously. Do you want a partner? And Michael is like the best of the best of the best as it turns out, you know, like a solid person. You know, I think I had one meeting with Michael. I think six months later, what he'd said in that meeting was exactly what we ended up doing. He was like, we'll do this. We'll do this. Thank you. That's incredible. It's most pretty impressive. It's amazing. Yeah. Yeah. Sometimes it is about like the right person, right? Getting to the right person. Yeah, that. I was wondering if you had like certain tenants that you live by in terms of, you know, because I, I feel so underwater with just Goop and Mike is already went to college. Like you have kids in the house. You know, I feel like I have no time and, you know, Goop obviously has like a bunch of different verticals. Of course. You know, those each require attention and now there's food and all this other stuff. But like, is there something that you are very clear about? Like in terms of how you approach leading teams, how you, how you get the best out of people. Like do you have certain rules or certain practices or certain, like, you know, quotes or yeah. Like what are your leadership values? How would you articulate them? I think I'm pretty clear in my philosophies. And I would like to say that, you know, I have, I've learned a lot along the way, but I also think that when you, you know, I'm 42, it wasn't that long ago that I was someone's employee. And so I took a lot from that time of knowing how you didn't want to feel. And I think when you get down to the crux of it, what do people really want? They want agency over their lives, right? They want to, for the most part, people want to come to work. They want to do a great job. They really do. They want to feel good about what it is that they do and what they're part of. And they want to feel that they're part of a bigger picture, that what they do adds to the whole thing. And as a leader, I think it's my job to articulate what the possibilities are for you to feel great about what it is that you do. So having a mission, having a purpose, having a vision that is something that is so clearly articulated that every single person, doesn't matter if you work on the front desk or wherever you're in the C-suite and the executive leadership team, you know exactly what we're here to do. Not making denim, right? We're here to make women feel great about themselves. And then there are all of these different ways that you can add to that mission. And then you've got to get out of people's way, you know, I have so many different jobs, I have four children, I don't have time to micromanage, like I really don't. And so people that can work well with me are the ones that take an enormous amount of accountability, but I would also get out of their way because I've already told you, like, here's the vision and here's the goal. And I only care about winning, like literally, like I learned very early on in my career, this idea of like, what is an enterprise mentality? We are all here, we're not a family. That's not what we are. We're not here to be mates and we might be mates, but that's not what we're here for. The purpose of the reason that we're all here is to drive this thing forward. Now, can you make money from it? Yes, I hope so. Can I make money from it? Like, we better. Can our shareholders make money? Absolutely. If we're all on the same page about that, then we can all go forward, but I kind of don't make any mistakes about trying to pretend about why we're here. I'm very, very, very clear. Like, no one is ever like, I wonder what Emma's thinking, so I've already told you. Right. Like, I'm not waiting for that feedback moment for the assessment, or where's the sit down. I'm like, come over here, like this thing just didn't work for me. So my thing is to give feedback like that in the moment. Oh, yeah. Like, immediately. It looks like I can't keep it in. That's more of me and who I am. But I think the people appreciate that because they want to know where they stand. Nobody wants to go home being like, did I say the wrong thing? Did I make a misstep? I'm like, yeah, you made a misstep. And here's how you could do it better next time. And by the way, there was this thing that I did before. And these are the steps that I took to make it better. So I'm very literal about what it is that I need and what my expectations are. But I think that that helps set everybody up for success. And then it is really about this craziness that I have about hiring because there's nothing I love more that's surrounding myself with brilliant people. And I think that in the beginning of an entrepreneurial journey, you can get a little bit worried about, is this person going to show me up? Are they so much better than me? And I learned really early on. I was like, the better the people are around me, the better I look, you know? I'm 100%. And so I've really made it part of my mission to just get amazing people. What are your hiring rules? You know, the first thing is I see a lot of people. So I will meet people even when I'm not hiring, just purely speculative. You're out. You're in the market. Like, I'm taking a meeting. If you're a good person and I've heard great things about you, I'm just going to take that meeting. I also, I kissed a lot of frogs, you know, I had listened and I asked a lot of questions because I'm not just trying to figure out, are you right for me? I'm like, how do you do it? How do you do it over there? How did you do it in the company before? How did that work? What the pitfalls? So I am like, again, I'm always in learning mode and I'm trying to figure out like, what is the best way that that role works outside of where I am so that I could potentially bring that in? I also hire for attitude over experience. So I don't care if you've done it for 25 years, I haven't done it for 25 years and I'm great at it. So I'm like, give me the person that has the flexible mentality because if you come to mean, you're like, this is the way it should be done. I'm like, no, thank you. Yeah, yeah. You know, I'm like, are you flexible? Are you that type of person that can see a new thing and run? Like, are you a team player? Are you somebody that can, again, sometimes you need real specialists, but more often than not, I need people that understand how every part of the business works. And they can be really, really deep in their vertical, but that they have enough foresight that they understand a little bit about what everybody's doing. You know, management speak, they call it a T shape leader, but it's like, that's what I'm looking for. I need you to have enough understanding that you can see the patterns that you can understand the story. You can put that all together and then run within him. So good. That's what I need. No, don't then. I don't know. For much. No, it's no, I think it really is everything. And it's something that I've learned slowly in a long way. It's just, it's everything. And you said it exactly like people that give you leverage. You know, people who are smarter and better and it's so critical. Okay. But working with your husband, how are you like in a piano with someone and then like want to make out with her? So funny. You know, I, the funny thing about Yens is that again, we do very different things. There's, there's no overlap. When we got this new office, we just got this beautiful new office building and we were going to have like, I saw it of one another, like from one glass office to another, and I was like, somebody build a wall, I can't see this bitch the whole day. I'm not, I am not looking for that. You know, and we laugh because we go to work sometimes in two cars and we're like in convoy but we're set for it because we're on the phone. We had, you know, I used to work for Yens. He was my first investor, him and Eric. And I think that what I had was a way of working with him before we had our marriage and our relationship together. And he's Swedish. So he has a very good way of separating everything, you know, like he's just very black and white, you know, I'm like, just not like, you know, I'm emotional and I'm like, all the things all the time. And he's like, I'm a pull yourself together. I feel like some of the hardest things I've learned come from him, you know, he's really very straightforward and honest and I'll ask him a question and he'll tell me the actual truth. And I'm like, don't do that. I needed you to like, you know, soften that up and be really all sweet and lovely and he's like, oh, I'm so sorry, I'm like, now like read the room, you know, but I think ultimately we we don't do what each other do and he has a lot of respect for my ambition. And when we moved here, it was because of me, you know, he was like, you have a moment in time, this company's going crazy, good American. And I think that we should go to LA and I was like, really, like, we're going to live there with the actors and the actresses and like, you know, and he was like, yeah, we'll be great. The sun shines and it's beautiful. Now you couldn't take me back to England if you, yeah, it's your job. It's hard to go back after it's, I mean, you've done it, you've done it that the other way around. And it's like, you ain't going back to highgate. You don't go back to those gray mornings. You know, that's tough. The score run in February, it's hard, as opposed to this beautiful sunshine and a, you know, dry through drop off, like, no, it's pretty, I know it's, okay, good. Tell me about the 15% pledge and how it started. It's so incredible. Thank you. 15% pledge is an incredible economic justice organisation that was started as a nonprofit. It was started with my dear friend, Aurora James, I'm the chairwoman of the pledge, which is one of my proudest accomplishments. And we work with brands and retailers all over the country to have them redirect 15% of their annual spend towards black owned businesses. And you know, when the pledge was started just after the murder of George Floyd and it was, you know, really directly an initiative that was there because so many business owners and so many leaders were thinking, what is it that I can do? And how have I ignored this for so long and how can we create a more equitable playing field. And at the end of it, you know, I look at it now. The pledge has been unbelievably successful. We've created a $16 billion pipeline for black owned businesses. So much opportunity. So many incredible brands from Sephora to Macy's to Nordstrom to Ulta, they've all taken the pledge and they're doing incredible work. And for clarity, it's not, you know, you're not putting your hand up and pledging. You are in a contractual commitment to work towards greater equity for these businesses on the shelves. But I think what's been really interesting is to see how that's really enhanced the customer journey because if you're somebody like me and you always want to make things great for customers and I think look, supporting small businesses, small American businesses is an idea everyone can get behind. It's like, it's always a good idea. But when you think about it through the customer lens, what do you get when you walk into Sephora? Well, more people can shop there, more people can find great products there. And if you make a great hair conditioner and you're just so happen to be a black founder, well, guess what? You can use that hair conditioner. I can use that anyone can. So it's about creating better choice for the customer and then bringing more customers into your business. So it's something that I love. It's something that is a nonprofit and does really great work and helps so many of these founders to really create stability within their own businesses and their own brands. But more than that, it's been amazing for these retailers that have got behind it. So in this moment where we see so much reversal of DE and I policies, you know, I look at this and I say, wow, how incredible were those brands that, quite frankly, when they could reverse and they could decide, you know what, nobody's looking right now. And it will be a great moment to come back on our commitment that they're still doing the work. Isn't just a testament to them being great brands. They know it's a great business proposition. Of course. It's just that simple. Nobody would say doing it if it wasn't commercially viable. So brands are sticking with it. Oh, they're all sticking with it, which is really great. So Sephora is, to me, they are, they're done such an incredible job, but Nordstrom, Macy's, Bloomingdale's, they're all completely sticking with it. Also beauty. These are just like, you know, companies that do the work, they're amazing at what they do. And, you know, they're doing, they're doing amazing business. Yeah, but also Emma, it's like you're able to seed, you know, you're going to create generational wealth for black founders, the way you've done it for yourself. Yes. You know, it's such a beautiful thing to do and it does make the brands better. It does make it better for the consumer. It makes things more diverse and more interesting and opens the aperture and it's, I think it's amazing. No, me too. And kind of nice for me is to see, you know, you have to think about, you know, and I'm sure you give a lot and nonprofit is a really interesting world. This is so tangible, right? When you put a brand on the shelf of Nordstrom or Sephora, that has an immediate impact. Those founders are able to stay in business, they're able to put their kids into good school, they're able to hire more people, they're able to have impact in their community. And you don't need to wait five years for that to happen. It's immediate. And so what I love is seeing businesses that we started with at the pledge and they, you know, had a couple million dollars of sales or maybe not even. And now they're, you know, doing their series B, they're like, you know, they're proper companies that have surpassed those initial few POs that came from pledge takers. And now they're in big box retail. And for me, I'm like, that's the part that I look and I'm like, that's amazing. Like, I remember that girl when she applied for the Achievement Award and we gave a 200, you know, 200 grand grant and now look at her. But those things you can't, they stay with you. And for me, that's the bit that I'm, I just, I can't get over. I'll never get over it. I'm sure. Tell me about this new podcast that you're working on. I'm very excited. So I, well, you know, it kind of comes down to this thing of, I never actually wanted to start my own business. It's not like I grew up thinking, I'm going to start my own company and become an entrepreneur and make a load of money and, you know, do more and more and more companies. For me, work was something that, you know, you did to pay your bills. And for most of the people that I knew was like quite unenjoyable, right? You didn't really love what you do. You just did a job to pay the bills. And what I understood, as I've started to have more success is that everyone asked me the same questions. They're like, how did you do it? How did you do it with no education? How did you go from being like this corporate chick to running your own companies? And in fact, how do you just like ask for a pay rise and be really confident how you are? And I know that I have great access, you know, if I call you and say, hey, go in it. Would you be on my podcast? You go, yeah. And I was like, really? You will? Thank you. That's so cute. But, you know, it's like, I have a lot of access and I know a lot of people. And I think that information is so key. You know, it's like the type of things that I've been told and the learnings that I have and what I've seen, that's enabled me to be really successful. And so I was really thinking about this idea of, how do you scale mentorship? Like how do I create this way of spreading information and taking what I've learned, taking the people I know and making that more accessible to more people? And you know, I love to chat. So I was like, let's do a podcast. It will be amazing. You get the right people on and you explore their journeys and we talk about, you know, the things in the most honest and open way. And I also know because female founders specifically all face very, very similar problems and I'm sick of toxic positivity. I'm allergic to it. I'm like, no, you can't just close your eyes and manifest it, babe, and it's all going to work out. It doesn't work like that. You know, you've got to come to work. You've got to do some stuff and some of it is really, really difficult. And this idea that I always get told off for like talking about money. I'm like, really? Like, do you know what happens when you don't speak about money when you elegantly avoid the subject of money? The money has a way of elegantly avoiding you. You know, it really does. The money goes, it's current and it goes like somewhere else. And so I want to talk about those things and I don't think it's in elegant and I don't think that we have to be like men and talk about it in that way. We can be like women, but we can still speak about these things that somehow seem to evade us. You know, it's like, I want more women to have big positions of power. I want more women to start companies and I want more women to like come into a lot of money so that they can make the decisions and the choices and do all the things that I get to do. So that's why I thought I just got this lovely card. It's called a spire with emigrate because I feel like we're all aspiring to something, right? Like, everybody wants to build the life of their dreams and everybody wants to do great stuff. And so I'm going to speak to people that I aspire to and that, you know, can share some good stuff. Okay. We're going to end with the rapid fire. These are cute. A rapid fire. Okay. First thing you do when you wake up, say thank you for the ceiling. Oh. Last thing you do before a bed, kissy ends good night. So sweet. One thing always in your makeup bag, eyebrow pencil, always, I didn't think you were going to say that. Oh, see only thing I care about. A favorite place to unwind. In the front of my house on the beach in Malibu. Oh. Yeah, it's the best thing ever. It's the best thing I've ever done. Oh, my life. And thankfully, yes. Oh, my goodness. Favorite meal in Los Angeles? Oh, I love anajáctáé. Oh, that's good. It's just so delicious. And I cannot do one dish. I need all the dishes. I'm like a 14 dish order, I just for two. That's insure enough. Yes. It's so good. It's so delicious. Favorite meal in London. Oh, scots. Scots. Yes. Oh, fish. Yes. I love a good old fish restaurant. Delicious. You have 48 hours off. Travel time is not included. Where are you going? Paris with no shadow of a doubt. Mm. I love it. What's your favorite restaurant in Paris? Oh. You know, like, I like the memories. Like, I want to go to like cafe floor and like sit there and just like, you know, for like be how I was when I was like 25, smoking or something. Oh, those were the days. Those were the days. The first campaign you've ever worked on. Would it be Queeneth Poucher for Hugo Balls back in the day? Thanks for that job, though. That's all right. You're welcome. Thank you very much. It was good for back with us, definitely. The most arresting campaign that wasn't yours, like, it could be anything. It could be, you know, oh, do you know what I liked? I thought that Pete Davidson, Reformation one, I was like, oh, I should have thought about that. Oh, I miss that. It was like, I don't know. It was like a boyfriend sitting outside a fitting room, but I was like, that was small. Like, it was a Valentine's Day thing and I was like, good costing you, Reformation girls. Damn it. They're great. Which shark would you most want to partner with? Mark Cuban. Oh, dear. Mark Cuban. Mark Cuban. Love me, some Mark Cuban. He's a nice guy. He's the nicest man. When you meet with a founder, is there an immediate turn off? Yes, someone who says to me, the market size is $15 billion, oh, I'm like, oh, come on. Tell me how you're going to get a customer. Don't tell me the size of the market, they're like, floss, like, please, no. And what about the biggest founder turn on just the energy? I want someone who is nuts about what they do, you know? Like, if you can tell me about all the competition, like, I am obsessed with you. I'm like, yes. And I don't care what it is, what the category is. Like, I'm invested in these girls who have nipple covers. And there is not a thing that they don't know about undergarments, nipple covers. They're amazing. They're, I mean, they did $120 million last year. Wow. I think. Do you have, do you, Kate? Do you? Yes. I'll just show you. I'll just show you. I'll just show you. I'll just show you. I'll just show you. I'll just show you. I'll just show you. I'll just show you. And who's your favorite of your kids? Oh. I was going to have one as well. Everyone has a favorite kid. Don't lie. Really? Of course. I have two. And I have a boy and a girl. I was the other favorite boy and a favorite girl. Yeah. No, no. I mean, look. Yeah. I mean, I'm not going to say it because I'm traumatized. Yeah. But yeah. Yeah. But is there something that being a mother has taught you that is surprising? That's a lovely question. I don't think I understood how maternal I am. You know, I always thought that I was just going to have these kids and I'm going to roll with me. I'm like an extremely maternal as a person. Yeah. That's so sweet. See, you're the dream. Now, you know why my girlfriend is so sweet. I do. I'm so lovely. Emma is one of those where people who leads a vision and generosity in equal measure. She's not just building brands. She's creating space for others to rise with her. She reminds us that it's possible to build boldly while staying grounded in what matters, proving that a little grit and gratitude go a long way in creating something extraordinary. Thanks for listening. See you next week.